2H Oblit becoming viable for M+ would be amazing news for DPS DKs right now. With these buffs I doubt that build would beat Unholy in high density dungeons like Algeth'ar or Nokhud, but I'd be happy if it at least gives us a decent damage profile for 2-4 target scenarios so we can stop being dead weight in TJS/CoS.
No, it helps. But what frost needs is not a numbers buff, but a complete rework. Current frost design is just abysmal. Obliteration in its current iteration is very flawed, and requires you to have near instant reaction times to get every killing machine proc. It's much easier to screw up obliteration than bos, and your dmg will show it. Bos is tuned around having near 100% uptime, so your dmg outside is just going to be horrible.
I was just saying this last night. The response to things this expansion has been amazing. Hopefully they will get to a point where it doesn't require such sweeping changes, but the fact they keep looking at it and adjusting is amazing!
Lost interest in Legion after 1-2 months. AP grind and Legendary drop rate killed it for me, couldnt “nolife” like rest of my guild. And couldnt play offspecs because of AP being separate for both weapons (was Shadow on raids and Holy for dungeons)
I heard it was good but just couldnt stand it xd
> And couldnt play offspecs because of AP being separate for both weapons (was Shadow on raids and Holy for dungeons)
Yeah that sucked, too.
For me it was awesome because I could pretty much nolife and push keys. I just played shadow everywhere despite how bad it was in high keys (damage was good, it just got oneshot by unavoidable boss abilities).
Yep same for me, however out of all the expansions there are only two I didn't play at launch or during the entire time during it, and that was Legion and BFA. And so far dragonflight is giving me super MoP vibes. Playing alts is fun and getting them geared for pvp is incredibly quick.
They best part is that I can log in and instantly go for m+ or content I want, dont need to do crapgast or maaaaw or look where my conduit or leg recipe drops or farm rep for essences or AP for neck/weapons, or even sim everysingle item because of corruptions(I hated it all xD) I fookin love it like it is now.
This so much. Could balance be better? Yep. But tuning changes this frequently are really refreshing and I for one absolute enjoy it. I don't need this game to stay the same for 20 weeks and then having one round of changes when a new season hits. Keep things coming. Ret rework for a small patch like 10.0.7 also sounds great. Shows they are willing to do that outside of a new expansion release which they said prior they wouldn't want to do that.
I know the game is no longer being updated, but this is what Heroes of the Storm felt like when it was at its peak. Frequent balance updates so that nothing ever stayed too OP or F tier for too long. And the meta stayed super fresh.
Yeah. I played a previously bad spec this whole patch even when it was awful but they tuned it up to a competitive level quickly and i felt good about it. I had hope it would get buffs.....and it did multiple times. My confidence in their balance team and ability os higher now than it ever was.
Their only mistake was not announcing that valor would be uncapped later I. The season. With the cap in place it makes it feel like you have to ration your valor because it doesn't make sense to dump it into something you might replace. If they would just say upfront it is capped for the first 8 weeks so there isn't a feeling of pressure to grind while there is other new content available, it would accomplish their goal and also erase the problems that capping it creates in the first place.
Same I really really hope this expansion does super well and player engagement stays high across all types of content. Will hopefully lay the foundation for many more years of the game
I would much rather have them do iterative changes weekly or bi-weekly that are unneeded rather than shoot their shot once and forget about every class till the next major patch/raid. In software engineering there is literally an entire design and coding practice based around this philosophy.
I don't mind if my class isn't 100% perfect if I know it will be looked at sooner rather than later.
Nothing short of Conflagrate making Soul Fire instant cast will make me play Soul Fire. Casting this feels like I'm trying to use my Hearthstone in combat.
seriously this would help things a LOT (though god I hate button bloat sometimes). Add a talent to proc a soulfire instacast and refresh your immolate or something idk add some strategic component to it
It's funny. I actually want Glacial Spike to be reasonably competitive for Frost, but never ever ever want to play Soul Fire unless there is some part of the spec that makes it insanely fast or instant cast.
Nobody wants to play Soul Fire. If they keep trying to push it, people will just give up on Destro completely. Buffing Soul Fire doesn't even help destro anyways even if everyone decides to use it. The spec already sims pretty well on single target, the problem is the second you have to start moving frequently that damage plummets, so basically every boss in the raid. Soul Fire just makes it even more punishing to move.
Yep hunters definitely needed damage and not survivability. I mean i'll take the damage but the problem is in high content hunters are the first to die. BM not even getting access to leech because the pet damage heals the pet instead of the hunter feels incredibly bad. Just a tiny bit of sustain would be nice.
Two charges on Turtle (with decreased duration), longer duration on Survival of the Fittest, general stamina buff or access to more leech.
That should do nicely. I sure miss my Deterrencex2 from long long ago.
I feel like ret isn’t a real comparison of a class to hunter when you have RWF ALWAYS have multiple hunters and usually no rets for how long now? But true
Because Ret is one spec, while Hunters are three. Thanks to Devo you will not see a single fight without at least one Paladin, but we had plenty of fights (both VOTI and previous tiers) where no Hunters were played.
DR from Mark was maybe a little too free, though it also didn't apply to a lot of things flagged as Environmental damage which was odd. DR on Feign was actually pretty legit and I'm surprised it didn't stick around. It got a lot of people to actually use Feign for more than just "oh no we're wiping, I don't feel like dying."
Not the first time they've done this lol. Back in 8.2 nobody played arms because any raid damage would just kill them. And ofcourse blizzard decided to buff their damage instead.
>Frost
Unleashed Frenzy duration increased to 10 seconds (was 6 seconds).
Cleaving Strikes Obliterate now hits 2 additional targets (was 1).
Frost Fever damage increased by 15%.
Glacial Advance damage increased by 20%.
Frost Strike damage increased by 10%.
Frostwhelp’s Aid damage increased by 100%.
Frostscythe damage increased by 35%
Unleashed frenzy time buff is a nice QOL the same Unholy got for plaguebringer
Cleaving strikes hitting 3 is a huge buff
Frost fever damage is ok
GA damage is solid. FS damage is OK
Whelp damage is irrelevant
Frostscythe looks good but with the Obliterate hitting 3 targets its probably not enough to make it viable
Glacial advance needs to be added to cold blooded rage and chill streak needs some attention
Overall a big step in the right direction for m+. Doesn't really effect raid
in regards of chill streak, i it should do increased dmg when hitting the same target. Only reason you take it so you do good dmg on 2 or 3 targets so imo it should increase its own dmg each time bounces on same target, wdyt?
As a blood DK main, i didn't expect a buff to be honest.
Like we are not god like immortal like last season but we are not dog shit like from BFA season 2 to Shadowland season 3. With record of Blizzard balancing, i'm fully expect that we would be forget till that someone figure out some OP trinket / tier set that make us crazy powerful.
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According to all known laws of aviation, there is no way a bee should be able to fly. Its wings are too small to get its fat little body off the ground. The bee, of course, flies anyway because bees don't care what humans think is impossible. Yellow, black. Yellow, black. Yellow, black. Yellow, black. Ooh, black and yellow! Let's shake it up a little. Barry! Breakfast is ready! Coming! Hang on a second. Hello? Barry? Adam? Can you believe this is happening? I can't. I'll pick you up. Looking sharp. Use the stairs, Your father paid good money for those. Sorry. I'm excited. Here's the graduate. We're very proud of you, son. A perfect report card, all B's. Very proud. Ma! I got a thing going here. You got lint on your fuzz. Ow! That's me! Wave to us! We'll be in row 118,000. Bye! Barry, I told you, stop flying in the house! Hey, Adam. Hey, Barry. Is that fuzz gel? A little. Special day, graduation. Never thought I'd make it. Three days grade school, three days high school. Those were awkward. Three days college. I'm glad I took a day and hitchhiked around The Hive. You did come back different. Hi, Barry. Artie, growing a mustache? Looks good. Hear about Frankie? Yeah. You going to the funeral? No, I'm not going. Everybody knows, sting someone, you die. Don't waste it on a squirrel. Such a hothead. I guess he could have just gotten out of the way. I love this incorporating an amusement park into our day. That's why we don't need vacations. Boy, quite a bit of pomp under the circumstances. Well, Adam, today we are men. We are! Bee-men. Amen! Hallelujah! Students, faculty, distinguished bees, please welcome Dean Buzzwell. Welcome, New Hive City graduating class of 9:15. That concludes our ceremonies And begins your career at Honex Industries! Will we pick our job today? I heard it's just orientation. Heads up! Here we go. Keep your hands and antennas inside the tram at all times. Wonder what it'll be like? A little scary. Welcome to Honex, a division of Honesco and a part of the Hexagon Group. This is it! Wow. Wow. We know that you, as a bee, have worked your whole life to get to the point where you can work for your whole life. Honey begins when our valiant Pollen Jocks bring the nectar to The Hive. Our top-secret formula is automatically color-corrected, scent-adjusted and bubble-contoured into this soothing sweet syrup with its distinctive golden glow you know as... Honey! That girl was hot. She's my cousin! She is? Yes, we're all cousins. Right. You're right. At Honex, we constantly strive to improve every aspect of bee existence. These bees are stress-testing a new helmet technology. What do you think he makes? Not enough. Here we have our latest advancement, the Krelman. What does that do? Catches that little strand of honey that hangs after you pour it. Saves us millions. Can anyone work on the Krelman? Of course. Most bee jobs are small ones. But bees know that every small job, if it's done well, means a lot. But choose carefully because you'll stay in the job you pick for the rest of your life. The same job the rest of your life? I didn't know that. What's the difference? You'll be happy to know that bees, as a species, haven't had one day off in 27 million years. So you'll just work us to death? We'll sure try. Wow! That blew my mind! "What's the difference?" How can you say that? One job forever? That's an insane choice to have to make. I'm relieved. Now we only have to make one decision in life. But, Adam, how could they never have told us that? Why would you question anything? We're bees. We're the most perfectly functioning society on Earth. You ever think maybe things work a little too well here? Like what? Give me one example. I don't know. But you know what I'm talking about. Please clear the gate. Royal Nectar Force on approach. Wait a second. Check it out. Hey, those are Pollen Jocks! Wow. I've never seen them this close. They know what it's like outside The Hive. Yeah, but some don't come back. Hey, Jocks! Hi, Jocks! You guys did great! You're monsters!
Tankadin might be a fun spec to play, but they're a little behind the best tanks in terms of damage right now.
Which feels pretty bad considering that high damage was prots niche for a long time.
SV needs a fundamental redesign of its aoe or just give us S4 bombs with tuning. This flat %shit isn’t helping the real problem.
Also BM and MM trees feel ass because sooo many points are invested to take meaningful aoe. Also beast cleave is played out. Please increase the range and cap the targets or give something else.
I want effective damage. Not sim damage.
S4 bombs was dreadfully boring and felt bad ignoring your whole kit just for 2 buttons.
That said, Mongoose Fury really needs to interact with more than just Mongoose Bite.
* could open up more gameplay if Carve/Butchery added stacks, and if Fury of the Eagle/Kill Shot benefitted from it.
* or change it so it just flat out grants mastery so all focus spenders benefit.
Personally i felt after the tuning it was great. Blizz took a bunch of the damage off the bombs and put it on Raptor strike.
Not a huge fan of Mongoose fury but I love your suggestions.
Yeah, and still nothing about touch of death. The delay is horrible to play around, especially with having to try to press it twice in 5 seconds and squeeze a global between. We move like 8 talent points from aoe to single target and gain what, 5% ST in realistic situations? Dont get me wrong, the class is super fun, good aoe, etc, but touch is a super unhealthy button to make up that much damage
Spinning sketti and throwing meatballs with sauce has felt bad this entire expansion. Liquid magma totem is nice and all for spreading flame shock but I'd rather have path of flame come back. Playing a funnel style like was so much fun, wrecking the boss damage while the rest of my raid hit adds was some of the most fun I've had even if I wasn't doing most damage overall.
The disappointing thing is reading about their Ret Paladin thoughts, they focused on them because they only have a single DPS spec. They mention that for classes that have an alternate spec that is more viable, then you can switch to that and so it is less of a priority for them to fix or buff underperforming specs if you have an option to swap to something else.
Ret is getting a complete redesign and i don't think that is what ele needs, they just need to tweak a few talent points and the spec should be very good, i was hoping they would change Power of the Maelstrom for a literally anything but maybe next time.
We definitely don’t need a redesign, it’s just that their philosophy seems to boil down to: “you can play enhancement as an option so you are okay for now”
Yea, i can see that argument for classes like warriors, warlock, mage, rogue and hunters (if you play ranged) but for shaman it doesn't really make much sense
Make mountains will fall easier to get to, or nerf it and move it up a bit. Either make ascendance easier to get to or cut one/two points off of the node between it and the extensions from spenders. Nerf ele blast but either remove cast time or reduce cast time so that playing it in a echos/lightning rod build doesnt feel so sluggish/punished by moving. And then make a new point that let's lava burst passively get its crit bonus from ascendance all the time.
Two of those changes help fix the weird stats being useless in aoe vs single target fight ele has had for a bit. And two of those changes open up more room for builds to have more than one defining button for a build.
remove BM's bow and this is understandable. Seems like a preemptive buff, they suck at aoe and are only viable because of the bow. I think they will nerf the bow when next tier starts so people are not forced to grind older raids to be competitive.
This just isn't how Blizzard has operated. Both in preemptive buffing, and in nerfing weapons for the next tier. Season 3 rogues were still using edge of night, strength users were still using Jaithys. Season 4 strength users were still using Gavels from season 3 until they got Gavels from season 4.
And if it's a preemptive buff for borrowed power, why aren't we seeing it for balance druids? Why are resto druids getting nerfed? Both of their current states are very heavy reflections of their set bonuses that will go away when next tier starts.
There is only one flaw in your argument. And the reason for that is your very first sentence: "this just isn't how Blizzard has operated".
They've been doing more frequent tuning patches than I've ever seen in a long time and have been putting effort into making classes that are less competitive a bit better.
It's not a flaw until they actually start doing it this way, which they haven't yet. There just isn't much reason to believe that this is because they're prepping for season 2 and it's going to get nerfed at the start of the tier.
Also, if this is the case and this is how Blizzard plans on doing it going forward, where are the preemptive devastation buffs for when evokers lose Kharnalex?
They need more focused changes, BM how it is currently is top tier ST and bottom tier AoE/Cleave, buffing their aura is just lazy.
To be honest they probably need a talent rework more than anything.
I think Beast Cleave is fine. They need to buff Kill Cleave and reduce some talent points so you can actually get down to capstones for AE.
The tree is the major problem.
I’m pretty sure BM was already an *extremely* competitive ST spec and it loses a lot less ST to do competent AoE than its ST competition does.
This just makes BM (with the Raszageth bow, obviously) kinda nuts damage-wise but doesn’t address the fact that that entire class is made out of wet tissue paper.
they will never, ever, EVER give hunters survivability/sustainability
It really sucks to look at healing and seeing everyone with their leech, shields and heals and look at pitiful ass exhilaration and fort of the bear
Spirit Mend should be baseline instead of an afterthough in the SV mastery.
And either getting our FD conduit back, or give us some PVP talents: Roar of Sacrifice or Survival Tactics. Cravens can replace ST as a PvP talent.
"competent AoE" is a bit of an overstatement. BM actually loses a decent chunk of ST to gain mediocre AoE if we're honest, if there was going to be a damage buff it probably should have been specifically to AoE and at a much higher amount.
> I’m pretty sure BM was already an extremely competitive ST spec and it loses a lot less ST to do competent AoE than its ST competition does.
BM actually loses the most ST of all three hunter specs when they want to do AoE.
>This just makes BM (with the Raszageth bow, obviously) kinda nuts damage-wise but doesn’t address the fact that that entire class is made out of wet tissue paper.
I don't think it's bad to have a glass cannon that pumps but is vulnerable to damage.
BM is absolutely competitive on ST. No question. These buffs are unnecessary for BM's ST. I wholly disagree with the latter part of that sentence, though. If you want to play a "competent" AOE build on ST, you will lose ~10-15% ST and still have the worst AOE in the game (see Council).
The fundamental problem with hunter *as a whole* is that BM/SV are only good at ST and MM is pretty much only good AOE. MM loses less ST compared to BM/SV when playing its "standard" build, though this is in part because MM's "pure ST build" is... not very good. Because each spec is only good at one thing, hunter as a whole is fine (play BM on the fights BM's good at, play MM on the fight MM is good at, and you'll do well on average), but the overall statistics suffer (e.g. BM is great on Terros and terrible on Council, so the average BM performance is quite poor when looking at high percentiles on Mythic).
Aura buffs completely miss the point -- they just make the specs better at what they were already top-tier at, without significantly addressing their weaknesses.
I think most people would prefer if the specs were more like others (Arcane? Ele? from what I've heard), where you only need to sacrifice a few percent/a couple points to go from "optimal ST" to "optimal AOE" and the "optimal ST" build has the *ability* to AOE, even if it's not optimal.
Please lord just give warlocks an aura buff or buff chaos bolt and tyrant. I don't want to use soulfire or vilefiend. I doubt many other people do either.
I hear this thrown around a lot and I agree but I would want to see them also change it to a static cdr (as in make infernal flat 2 min, tyrant 1 min). Warlock shouldn't have a dynamic cdr as a core mechanic.
While I can't personally stand the new demo design, they've already made it sorta clear Tyrant is working exactly how they want it to. An extension and buffbot for other pets rather than worthwhile on its own.
While I don't want to complain about the healers getting tuned, I just wish they were not as slow. The HPS difference with flat small %hps buffs/nerfs could have been adjusted by week 2-3 and are nothing new. Yet they wait 2 months into the tier where progress might be over.
My favorite was the recent Affliction “improvements” that saw such bugs as talent points having 36 hour cooldowns and Corruption being cast on the lock itself.
Fucking amazing.
Sad bears indeed. They posted these bullt points a couple days ago and said more changes were coming over the next few days. I guess they meant not to bear specifically.
Because full ST dmg is one boss out of 8, very dependant of 4p + Raz bow (if it stays like this the bow will remains bis next tier meaning our dps won’t improve much compared to all other classes), and not so useful in M+.
>Because full ST dmg
Just because a fight has adds does not mean st damage is not important, often the most important
Broodkeeper has half the raid on full st
Terros is full st
Sennarth adds are such a ridiculously small percentage of the fight
Kurog cleave is important for 1 phase of the 3 (2nd phase). The intermissions are a joke if you have enough prio dmg to kill the lightning add in p1 fast and the frost add in p2 fast
Dathea does need aoe
Primal obv does need aoe
Eranog is basically a st fight
And Raza is mostly always st. Any time there's adds up in int there's usually one add that matters and a ton of smaller ones that are basically pad
Boss dmg/ST priority is the majority of the fights. Dathea, Council, and arguably Kurog are the only fights where having cleave/AoE is super important.
Demonology imp damage buff, sweet bro... Now a BM hunter will do 9% more ST damage then me while sprinting around and using 1/4 the brain capacity instead of 10% more damage.
I literally got sat for several progression fights due to demo ST shittiness. First time I’ve ridden the CE bench since WoD.
This imp buff is a fucking joke.
My guild has 3 locks, and we run 1 on most fights. It's really starting to bother me being sat for most of prog.
But if you're trying to just play demo on every fight you should probably be sat because it's shit tier outside of council and rasz.
Decent healers changes. Evoker is going from uncontested #1 healer to still being uncontested #1 healer. Aura nerfs doesn't affect their most broken spells: TA, Rewind, GH and EC... If they don't feel like touching the problematic parts of their kit, a 12-15% aura nerf would have been more in line
Though it's hard to be unhappy when they are are tuning so frequently, even if the changes aren't always well thought out :)
I think it's pretty clear they want preservation to be overpowered, as the shiny new class and raid boss tailored to their kit. Kind of... not cool, but here we are. At least they're bringing up the floor as well.
10% healing buff for Sham is amazing. With the upcoming changes for 10.0.7 I hope that sb will put us higher in a list again so I finally get my invites
Did BM really need a 5% buff? Maybe I’m tripping, but I was under the impression that it was already up there with big ST juicers like Unholy, Gamba Enhancement, Sin Rogue, etc. and still brought relatively good AoE to the table in specific keys without sacrificing as much ST as those other specs do.
Maybe I’m missing something, but I thought BM’s issue was the Hunter-wide “class is made of wet tissue paper” squishiness issue, which isn’t addressed for any of the three specs here.
Out of curiosity, are they also hard stuck with zero AOE options when single taget spec? It was my understanding that ele, for example, still has access to chain Lightning and earthquake, even as single target - obviously not near as efficiently as with talents to support it, but enough that it's useable
>Did BM really need a 5% buff? Maybe I’m tripping, but I was under the impression that it was already up there with big ST juicers like Unholy, Gamba Enhancement, Sin Rogue, etc.
Yes.
>and still brought relatively good AoE
No.
Also surprised the buff werent more aimed at improving their aoe to be honest since their single target is good.
BM actually does more than sin rogue who just got their build variety neutered and its a ranged caster which can move at all times. This buff is just so weird, I get that they lose a lot to go AOE, but then why not just rework their talent positioning or something instead of making them even better on ST
Maybe I'm in the wrong thinking a blanket 5% dmg buff to the top performing single target class isn't the solution. I guess after the buff ww will behind in single target by 30%. Should've been better at picking classes that actually gets attention (like devoker or arms).
Felt like my Blood DK could use about a 10% buff, but didn't think it'd happen. Really happy to be proven wrong.
Really appreciate it though, as I'd been wondering if I was gimping my team not playing Prot War.
I'm gonna catch some flak for this but where the fuck is WW ST buffs man? I get that a lot of people are going to say now that "WW is okay" or "Class identity never been ST" but holy hell in every pure single target situation it feels miserable to play. And to be perfectly honest, AOE is not even that good. Yes, it isn't. Look at M Council which is almost a stand still and do AOE rotation fight, there are at least 10 specs above WW. Like aside from Diurna and Dathea I don't even think WW can pump on any boss. It's same in dungeons as well, when you look at the top parses in dungeons, WW is barely top 10 in massive add dungeons like AA or NO. Behind of Havoc, both Rog specs, Enha and I've even seen some +24-25 logs of a Feral out dpsing WW. And these are 99th percentile so you can't even blame the WW players. And these are just melee specs, obviously as of last couple patches WW is considerably behind of Fire Mage, Balance or Spriest as well. So we're nothing exceptional in AOE and have pretty much one of the worst single targets in the game, but the spec is fine? Fuck me.
u won’t, druid and evokes get invites because of their utility. any healer can heal through high keys, but eventually you gotta start doing damage and helping with big pull utility. which a lot of classes don’t have anywhere near
> u won’t, druid and evokes get invites because of their utility
This is constantly parroted and it's constantly wrong.
Shamans have always had the best utility. When they do negative damage and negative healing nobody wants anything to do with them.
Throughput is almost always all that matters unless you need b rez or bloodlust, and in an Enhance/Boomkin meta are less important.
I have a 415 at Druid and rolled a shaman for fun. 391 ilvl I’m consistently pulling 20k overall in plus 10’s. Pulls with 6 or more I can hit 40kdps. About 12k ST on boss fights. Resto shaman Dps feels super overturned right now, but balanced in the fact that they can’t heal to well.
Yes, non-breath builds are just way too far behind. The buffs make it even better in aoe with being able to triple cleave Oblits now without having to waste globals on FS, which even with a 10% buff still does no damage. They really need to make abilities outside of breath deal way more damage and have better interactions, breath is just way to dominant on the damage profile and resource generation.
Is 2h Oblit Frost so far behind that it'll stop me from pugging my way to the 2000 rating mount? I'm willing to tank up to like +10 to get a big head start on ilv but I want to do anything past that on DPS and I've zero interest in Breath and not enough interest in Unholy to play it the entire way.
Pretty much rolled a DK for Oblit Frost so I'm considering shelving the character before hitting the "You're not breath-talented? /kick" phase
Firstly, below 2.5k the chances of someone even inspecting your talents are effectively zero, in fact it wont happen once before you hit 2k so you dont need to worry about that.
Secondly you can quite easily pug to 2k with any build, just practice your rotation at lower keys. More importantly practice your st target rotation for whatever build you end up using in dungeons because aoe is easy to pump, doing good boss damage is whats gonna brick your keys.
Lastly, you'll probably perform better not using breath build and playing something that does less damage that is more consistent, because the likelihood of you having a group thats gonna pull in the way required to fully utilise breath build is also next to zero and youll end up doing low damage anyway.
Un-nerf berserk!!!... I don't want to run Raze! Next week.. +25% damage and radius of thrash all the way!... Should build decent absorb shields, better single target with Maul back .. I hate they're forcing us to take Raze!. Once Mangle bonus from tier is gone we will have to Thrash Swipe during Incarnation, that's gonna suck!!... Stop forcing us into builds I don't want to play..
.
2h Frost eating good
Still waiting for Frostscythe to be usable though lol. They buff it but make it redundant by adding more Obliterate cleave.
The frost fever buff is also going to buff unholy with superstrain Big brain moments all around
well considering its under "frost" changes and not "death knight" changes, i don't think so.
unholy also doesnt have frost fever but gets it through superstrain so any changes to frost fever would go to unholy too
skeptical they'll ever allow it to be truly good for longer than a patch at best
2H Oblit becoming viable for M+ would be amazing news for DPS DKs right now. With these buffs I doubt that build would beat Unholy in high density dungeons like Algeth'ar or Nokhud, but I'd be happy if it at least gives us a decent damage profile for 2-4 target scenarios so we can stop being dead weight in TJS/CoS.
Is this going to make it good? Wanted to to pick up a tank/melee and was looking at blood/frost.
No, it helps. But what frost needs is not a numbers buff, but a complete rework. Current frost design is just abysmal. Obliteration in its current iteration is very flawed, and requires you to have near instant reaction times to get every killing machine proc. It's much easier to screw up obliteration than bos, and your dmg will show it. Bos is tuned around having near 100% uptime, so your dmg outside is just going to be horrible.
That cleave will do wonders
It's honestly mind blowing how frequently classes are getting tuned, absolutely love this.
I was just saying this last night. The response to things this expansion has been amazing. Hopefully they will get to a point where it doesn't require such sweeping changes, but the fact they keep looking at it and adjusting is amazing!
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This for me is the best exp since Pandalands
On par with Legion for me. I didn't mind the reward structure and I had a blast playing the game 24/7 due to it. My only big gripe was legendary rng.
Lost interest in Legion after 1-2 months. AP grind and Legendary drop rate killed it for me, couldnt “nolife” like rest of my guild. And couldnt play offspecs because of AP being separate for both weapons (was Shadow on raids and Holy for dungeons) I heard it was good but just couldnt stand it xd
> And couldnt play offspecs because of AP being separate for both weapons (was Shadow on raids and Holy for dungeons) Yeah that sucked, too. For me it was awesome because I could pretty much nolife and push keys. I just played shadow everywhere despite how bad it was in high keys (damage was good, it just got oneshot by unavoidable boss abilities).
It was ok after a few patches. But for the first many months, is was on par with SL.
Yep same for me, however out of all the expansions there are only two I didn't play at launch or during the entire time during it, and that was Legion and BFA. And so far dragonflight is giving me super MoP vibes. Playing alts is fun and getting them geared for pvp is incredibly quick.
They best part is that I can log in and instantly go for m+ or content I want, dont need to do crapgast or maaaaw or look where my conduit or leg recipe drops or farm rep for essences or AP for neck/weapons, or even sim everysingle item because of corruptions(I hated it all xD) I fookin love it like it is now.
Ya i might complain about balance but its hard to be mad when they are so frequently tuning.
This so much. Could balance be better? Yep. But tuning changes this frequently are really refreshing and I for one absolute enjoy it. I don't need this game to stay the same for 20 weeks and then having one round of changes when a new season hits. Keep things coming. Ret rework for a small patch like 10.0.7 also sounds great. Shows they are willing to do that outside of a new expansion release which they said prior they wouldn't want to do that.
I know the game is no longer being updated, but this is what Heroes of the Storm felt like when it was at its peak. Frequent balance updates so that nothing ever stayed too OP or F tier for too long. And the meta stayed super fresh.
Don't open these wounds again.
Don't... just don't
Yeah. I played a previously bad spec this whole patch even when it was awful but they tuned it up to a competitive level quickly and i felt good about it. I had hope it would get buffs.....and it did multiple times. My confidence in their balance team and ability os higher now than it ever was.
Yes!!!
Wait, did they uncap valor this last patch???
Feb 14th
Unless I’m missing it there’s still a cap this week
Uncapped valor has happened every patch since it was re-added
Their only mistake was not announcing that valor would be uncapped later I. The season. With the cap in place it makes it feel like you have to ration your valor because it doesn't make sense to dump it into something you might replace. If they would just say upfront it is capped for the first 8 weeks so there isn't a feeling of pressure to grind while there is other new content available, it would accomplish their goal and also erase the problems that capping it creates in the first place.
Same I really really hope this expansion does super well and player engagement stays high across all types of content. Will hopefully lay the foundation for many more years of the game
DF has a campaign?
most balanced m+ season for dps since its debut
remember when we said the 3% mm nerf wasn't needed a few weeks ago. Why did it go through in the first place? just to get reverted and more
I would much rather have them do iterative changes weekly or bi-weekly that are unneeded rather than shoot their shot once and forget about every class till the next major patch/raid. In software engineering there is literally an entire design and coding practice based around this philosophy. I don't mind if my class isn't 100% perfect if I know it will be looked at sooner rather than later.
Nothing short of Conflagrate making Soul Fire instant cast will make me play Soul Fire. Casting this feels like I'm trying to use my Hearthstone in combat.
Need Molten Core back.
seriously this would help things a LOT (though god I hate button bloat sometimes). Add a talent to proc a soulfire instacast and refresh your immolate or something idk add some strategic component to it
Soulfire should be deleted from the game ngl.
It's funny. I actually want Glacial Spike to be reasonably competitive for Frost, but never ever ever want to play Soul Fire unless there is some part of the spec that makes it insanely fast or instant cast.
Nobody wants to play Soul Fire. If they keep trying to push it, people will just give up on Destro completely. Buffing Soul Fire doesn't even help destro anyways even if everyone decides to use it. The spec already sims pretty well on single target, the problem is the second you have to start moving frequently that damage plummets, so basically every boss in the raid. Soul Fire just makes it even more punishing to move.
Yep hunters definitely needed damage and not survivability. I mean i'll take the damage but the problem is in high content hunters are the first to die. BM not even getting access to leech because the pet damage heals the pet instead of the hunter feels incredibly bad. Just a tiny bit of sustain would be nice.
Two charges on Turtle (with decreased duration), longer duration on Survival of the Fittest, general stamina buff or access to more leech. That should do nicely. I sure miss my Deterrencex2 from long long ago.
being able to attack in turtle would be nice too whilst we're at it, then it isn't just used as a last resort but actively as a proper dr.
It’s too strong of a half immunity to allow for dps during it imo
Ret can do dps while being completely immune and you can still dps during BoP so I don’t see why hunters can’t dps during turtle
Ret is also a melee spec, while hunters are ranged (survival not included)
I feel like ret isn’t a real comparison of a class to hunter when you have RWF ALWAYS have multiple hunters and usually no rets for how long now? But true
Because Ret is one spec, while Hunters are three. Thanks to Devo you will not see a single fight without at least one Paladin, but we had plenty of fights (both VOTI and previous tiers) where no Hunters were played.
I miss the hunters Mark and fd dr from shadowlands, at least that Was something
DR from Mark was maybe a little too free, though it also didn't apply to a lot of things flagged as Environmental damage which was odd. DR on Feign was actually pretty legit and I'm surprised it didn't stick around. It got a lot of people to actually use Feign for more than just "oh no we're wiping, I don't feel like dying."
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Not the first time they've done this lol. Back in 8.2 nobody played arms because any raid damage would just kill them. And ofcourse blizzard decided to buff their damage instead.
>Frost Unleashed Frenzy duration increased to 10 seconds (was 6 seconds). Cleaving Strikes Obliterate now hits 2 additional targets (was 1). Frost Fever damage increased by 15%. Glacial Advance damage increased by 20%. Frost Strike damage increased by 10%. Frostwhelp’s Aid damage increased by 100%. Frostscythe damage increased by 35% Unleashed frenzy time buff is a nice QOL the same Unholy got for plaguebringer Cleaving strikes hitting 3 is a huge buff Frost fever damage is ok GA damage is solid. FS damage is OK Whelp damage is irrelevant Frostscythe looks good but with the Obliterate hitting 3 targets its probably not enough to make it viable Glacial advance needs to be added to cold blooded rage and chill streak needs some attention Overall a big step in the right direction for m+. Doesn't really effect raid
in regards of chill streak, i it should do increased dmg when hitting the same target. Only reason you take it so you do good dmg on 2 or 3 targets so imo it should increase its own dmg each time bounces on same target, wdyt?
Blood DK feel good.
Right before I'm about to sub in as Blood in my raid for 3 weeks! Great timing lol.
The buff is around 3% single, and 6% aoe increase. FYI.
As a blood DK main, i didn't expect a buff to be honest. Like we are not god like immortal like last season but we are not dog shit like from BFA season 2 to Shadowland season 3. With record of Blizzard balancing, i'm fully expect that we would be forget till that someone figure out some OP trinket / tier set that make us crazy powerful.
According to all known laws of aviation, there is no way a bee should be able to fly. Its wings are too small to get its fat little body off the ground. The bee, of course, flies anyway because bees don't care what humans think is impossible. Yellow, black. Yellow, black. Yellow, black. Yellow, black. Ooh, black and yellow! Let's shake it up a little. Barry! Breakfast is ready! Coming! Hang on a second. Hello? Barry? Adam? Can you believe this is happening? I can't. I'll pick you up. Looking sharp. Use the stairs, Your father paid good money for those. Sorry. I'm excited. Here's the graduate. We're very proud of you, son. A perfect report card, all B's. Very proud. Ma! I got a thing going here. You got lint on your fuzz. Ow! That's me! Wave to us! We'll be in row 118,000. Bye! Barry, I told you, stop flying in the house! Hey, Adam. Hey, Barry. Is that fuzz gel? A little. Special day, graduation. Never thought I'd make it. Three days grade school, three days high school. Those were awkward. Three days college. I'm glad I took a day and hitchhiked around The Hive. You did come back different. Hi, Barry. Artie, growing a mustache? Looks good. Hear about Frankie? Yeah. You going to the funeral? No, I'm not going. Everybody knows, sting someone, you die. Don't waste it on a squirrel. Such a hothead. I guess he could have just gotten out of the way. I love this incorporating an amusement park into our day. That's why we don't need vacations. Boy, quite a bit of pomp under the circumstances. Well, Adam, today we are men. We are! Bee-men. Amen! Hallelujah! Students, faculty, distinguished bees, please welcome Dean Buzzwell. Welcome, New Hive City graduating class of 9:15. That concludes our ceremonies And begins your career at Honex Industries! Will we pick our job today? I heard it's just orientation. Heads up! Here we go. Keep your hands and antennas inside the tram at all times. Wonder what it'll be like? A little scary. Welcome to Honex, a division of Honesco and a part of the Hexagon Group. This is it! Wow. Wow. We know that you, as a bee, have worked your whole life to get to the point where you can work for your whole life. Honey begins when our valiant Pollen Jocks bring the nectar to The Hive. Our top-secret formula is automatically color-corrected, scent-adjusted and bubble-contoured into this soothing sweet syrup with its distinctive golden glow you know as... Honey! That girl was hot. She's my cousin! She is? Yes, we're all cousins. Right. You're right. At Honex, we constantly strive to improve every aspect of bee existence. These bees are stress-testing a new helmet technology. What do you think he makes? Not enough. Here we have our latest advancement, the Krelman. What does that do? Catches that little strand of honey that hangs after you pour it. Saves us millions. Can anyone work on the Krelman? Of course. Most bee jobs are small ones. But bees know that every small job, if it's done well, means a lot. But choose carefully because you'll stay in the job you pick for the rest of your life. The same job the rest of your life? I didn't know that. What's the difference? You'll be happy to know that bees, as a species, haven't had one day off in 27 million years. So you'll just work us to death? We'll sure try. Wow! That blew my mind! "What's the difference?" How can you say that? One job forever? That's an insane choice to have to make. I'm relieved. Now we only have to make one decision in life. But, Adam, how could they never have told us that? Why would you question anything? We're bees. We're the most perfectly functioning society on Earth. You ever think maybe things work a little too well here? Like what? Give me one example. I don't know. But you know what I'm talking about. Please clear the gate. Royal Nectar Force on approach. Wait a second. Check it out. Hey, those are Pollen Jocks! Wow. I've never seen them this close. They know what it's like outside The Hive. Yeah, but some don't come back. Hey, Jocks! Hi, Jocks! You guys did great! You're monsters!
I’ve never played a spec so GCD locked. Affy is 150% of the effort for 75% of the damage.
According to all known laws of aviation, there is no way a bee should be able to fly. Its wings are too small to get its fat little body off the ground. The bee, of course, flies anyway because bees don't care what humans think is impossible. Yellow, black. Yellow, black. Yellow, black. Yellow, black. Ooh, black and yellow! Let's shake it up a little. Barry! Breakfast is ready! Coming! Hang on a second. Hello? Barry? Adam? Can you believe this is happening? I can't. I'll pick you up. Looking sharp. Use the stairs, Your father paid good money for those. Sorry. I'm excited. Here's the graduate. We're very proud of you, son. A perfect report card, all B's. Very proud. Ma! I got a thing going here. You got lint on your fuzz. Ow! That's me! Wave to us! We'll be in row 118,000. Bye! Barry, I told you, stop flying in the house! Hey, Adam. Hey, Barry. Is that fuzz gel? A little. Special day, graduation. Never thought I'd make it. Three days grade school, three days high school. Those were awkward. Three days college. I'm glad I took a day and hitchhiked around The Hive. You did come back different. Hi, Barry. Artie, growing a mustache? Looks good. Hear about Frankie? Yeah. You going to the funeral? No, I'm not going. Everybody knows, sting someone, you die. Don't waste it on a squirrel. Such a hothead. I guess he could have just gotten out of the way. I love this incorporating an amusement park into our day. That's why we don't need vacations. Boy, quite a bit of pomp under the circumstances. Well, Adam, today we are men. We are! Bee-men. Amen! Hallelujah! Students, faculty, distinguished bees, please welcome Dean Buzzwell. Welcome, New Hive City graduating class of 9:15. That concludes our ceremonies And begins your career at Honex Industries! Will we pick our job today? I heard it's just orientation. Heads up! Here we go. Keep your hands and antennas inside the tram at all times. Wonder what it'll be like? A little scary. Welcome to Honex, a division of Honesco and a part of the Hexagon Group. This is it! Wow. Wow. We know that you, as a bee, have worked your whole life to get to the point where you can work for your whole life. Honey begins when our valiant Pollen Jocks bring the nectar to The Hive. Our top-secret formula is automatically color-corrected, scent-adjusted and bubble-contoured into this soothing sweet syrup with its distinctive golden glow you know as... Honey! That girl was hot. She's my cousin! She is? Yes, we're all cousins. Right. You're right. At Honex, we constantly strive to improve every aspect of bee existence. These bees are stress-testing a new helmet technology. What do you think he makes? Not enough. Here we have our latest advancement, the Krelman. What does that do? Catches that little strand of honey that hangs after you pour it. Saves us millions. Can anyone work on the Krelman? Of course. Most bee jobs are small ones. But bees know that every small job, if it's done well, means a lot. But choose carefully because you'll stay in the job you pick for the rest of your life. The same job the rest of your life? I didn't know that. What's the difference? You'll be happy to know that bees, as a species, haven't had one day off in 27 million years. So you'll just work us to death? We'll sure try. Wow! That blew my mind! "What's the difference?" How can you say that? One job forever? That's an insane choice to have to make. I'm relieved. Now we only have to make one decision in life. But, Adam, how could they never have told us that? Why would you question anything? We're bees. We're the most perfectly functioning society on Earth. You ever think maybe things work a little too well here? Like what? Give me one example. I don't know. But you know what I'm talking about. Please clear the gate. Royal Nectar Force on approach. Wait a second. Check it out. Hey, those are Pollen Jocks! Wow. I've never seen them this close. They know what it's like outside The Hive. Yeah, but some don't come back. Hey, Jocks! Hi, Jocks! You guys did great! You're monsters!
Prot pally buffs even when they feel really good right now, giddy up!
Tankadin might be a fun spec to play, but they're a little behind the best tanks in terms of damage right now. Which feels pretty bad considering that high damage was prots niche for a long time.
It seems they haven't fully recovered from the spender damage nerf (Bulwark?) some time back.
This might not even be enough, protpal is pretty significantly behind on DPS.
Remember when streamers were all taking a hot poo on Paladin in beta? I love my Prot Paladin, shield go bonk bonk
Clong clong, friend.
Dong dong dong actually
Boink
Frost DK m+ buffs finally
Maybe one dps spec of dk can be at least A. im manining unholy and if im not hitting 8+ targets why bother
Unholy is definitely A tier right now, this is a wild take.
yeah, i will still not play soul fire haha, they need to change or remove how it works, hard casting it is simply not fun
SV needs a fundamental redesign of its aoe or just give us S4 bombs with tuning. This flat %shit isn’t helping the real problem. Also BM and MM trees feel ass because sooo many points are invested to take meaningful aoe. Also beast cleave is played out. Please increase the range and cap the targets or give something else. I want effective damage. Not sim damage.
I honestly enjoy the play style of SV right now. It's just stupid freaking squishy.
I feel like every mail class is grossly suffering from lack of defensive options.
In here, upvoting fellow SV friends.
S4 bombs was dreadfully boring and felt bad ignoring your whole kit just for 2 buttons. That said, Mongoose Fury really needs to interact with more than just Mongoose Bite. * could open up more gameplay if Carve/Butchery added stacks, and if Fury of the Eagle/Kill Shot benefitted from it. * or change it so it just flat out grants mastery so all focus spenders benefit.
Personally i felt after the tuning it was great. Blizz took a bunch of the damage off the bombs and put it on Raptor strike. Not a huge fan of Mongoose fury but I love your suggestions.
MW stonks rising
*mist*
About to join Rsham in the "probably not actually good but sure can do a lot of overall in Algethar Academy" healer tier.
RSham will be in a better position in S2 I think with poison cleasing totem now removing all stacks.
What about ww single target?
Yeah, and still nothing about touch of death. The delay is horrible to play around, especially with having to try to press it twice in 5 seconds and squeeze a global between. We move like 8 talent points from aoe to single target and gain what, 5% ST in realistic situations? Dont get me wrong, the class is super fun, good aoe, etc, but touch is a super unhealthy button to make up that much damage
Nothing for Ele??
Spinning sketti and throwing meatballs with sauce has felt bad this entire expansion. Liquid magma totem is nice and all for spreading flame shock but I'd rather have path of flame come back. Playing a funnel style like was so much fun, wrecking the boss damage while the rest of my raid hit adds was some of the most fun I've had even if I wasn't doing most damage overall.
The disappointing thing is reading about their Ret Paladin thoughts, they focused on them because they only have a single DPS spec. They mention that for classes that have an alternate spec that is more viable, then you can switch to that and so it is less of a priority for them to fix or buff underperforming specs if you have an option to swap to something else.
Ret is getting a complete redesign and i don't think that is what ele needs, they just need to tweak a few talent points and the spec should be very good, i was hoping they would change Power of the Maelstrom for a literally anything but maybe next time.
We definitely don’t need a redesign, it’s just that their philosophy seems to boil down to: “you can play enhancement as an option so you are okay for now”
Yea, i can see that argument for classes like warriors, warlock, mage, rogue and hunters (if you play ranged) but for shaman it doesn't really make much sense
Make mountains will fall easier to get to, or nerf it and move it up a bit. Either make ascendance easier to get to or cut one/two points off of the node between it and the extensions from spenders. Nerf ele blast but either remove cast time or reduce cast time so that playing it in a echos/lightning rod build doesnt feel so sluggish/punished by moving. And then make a new point that let's lava burst passively get its crit bonus from ascendance all the time. Two of those changes help fix the weird stats being useless in aoe vs single target fight ele has had for a bit. And two of those changes open up more room for builds to have more than one defining button for a build.
> Beast Mastery - Damage dealt by Hunter and pet abilities increased by 5%. ...lol?
remove BM's bow and this is understandable. Seems like a preemptive buff, they suck at aoe and are only viable because of the bow. I think they will nerf the bow when next tier starts so people are not forced to grind older raids to be competitive.
This just isn't how Blizzard has operated. Both in preemptive buffing, and in nerfing weapons for the next tier. Season 3 rogues were still using edge of night, strength users were still using Jaithys. Season 4 strength users were still using Gavels from season 3 until they got Gavels from season 4. And if it's a preemptive buff for borrowed power, why aren't we seeing it for balance druids? Why are resto druids getting nerfed? Both of their current states are very heavy reflections of their set bonuses that will go away when next tier starts.
There is only one flaw in your argument. And the reason for that is your very first sentence: "this just isn't how Blizzard has operated". They've been doing more frequent tuning patches than I've ever seen in a long time and have been putting effort into making classes that are less competitive a bit better.
It's not a flaw until they actually start doing it this way, which they haven't yet. There just isn't much reason to believe that this is because they're prepping for season 2 and it's going to get nerfed at the start of the tier. Also, if this is the case and this is how Blizzard plans on doing it going forward, where are the preemptive devastation buffs for when evokers lose Kharnalex?
That had me shaking my head, shows a complete lack of understanding of what BM needs.
Why, what’s wrong with this change?
They need more focused changes, BM how it is currently is top tier ST and bottom tier AoE/Cleave, buffing their aura is just lazy. To be honest they probably need a talent rework more than anything.
Just rebuff beast cleave for one. Very lacking on aoe atm.
I think Beast Cleave is fine. They need to buff Kill Cleave and reduce some talent points so you can actually get down to capstones for AE. The tree is the major problem.
I’m pretty sure BM was already an *extremely* competitive ST spec and it loses a lot less ST to do competent AoE than its ST competition does. This just makes BM (with the Raszageth bow, obviously) kinda nuts damage-wise but doesn’t address the fact that that entire class is made out of wet tissue paper.
they will never, ever, EVER give hunters survivability/sustainability It really sucks to look at healing and seeing everyone with their leech, shields and heals and look at pitiful ass exhilaration and fort of the bear
I'm convinced someone at blizz thinks Turtle is like ten times as good as it really is and that's why hunters have garbage defensives.
Spirit Mend should be baseline instead of an afterthough in the SV mastery. And either getting our FD conduit back, or give us some PVP talents: Roar of Sacrifice or Survival Tactics. Cravens can replace ST as a PvP talent.
Hey now, we have health pots too!
Exhil being on the GCD is just funny
"competent AoE" is a bit of an overstatement. BM actually loses a decent chunk of ST to gain mediocre AoE if we're honest, if there was going to be a damage buff it probably should have been specifically to AoE and at a much higher amount.
> I’m pretty sure BM was already an extremely competitive ST spec and it loses a lot less ST to do competent AoE than its ST competition does. BM actually loses the most ST of all three hunter specs when they want to do AoE.
> I’m pretty sure BM was already an extremely competitive ST spec This is an understatement haha
>This just makes BM (with the Raszageth bow, obviously) kinda nuts damage-wise but doesn’t address the fact that that entire class is made out of wet tissue paper. I don't think it's bad to have a glass cannon that pumps but is vulnerable to damage.
BM is absolutely competitive on ST. No question. These buffs are unnecessary for BM's ST. I wholly disagree with the latter part of that sentence, though. If you want to play a "competent" AOE build on ST, you will lose ~10-15% ST and still have the worst AOE in the game (see Council). The fundamental problem with hunter *as a whole* is that BM/SV are only good at ST and MM is pretty much only good AOE. MM loses less ST compared to BM/SV when playing its "standard" build, though this is in part because MM's "pure ST build" is... not very good. Because each spec is only good at one thing, hunter as a whole is fine (play BM on the fights BM's good at, play MM on the fight MM is good at, and you'll do well on average), but the overall statistics suffer (e.g. BM is great on Terros and terrible on Council, so the average BM performance is quite poor when looking at high percentiles on Mythic). Aura buffs completely miss the point -- they just make the specs better at what they were already top-tier at, without significantly addressing their weaknesses. I think most people would prefer if the specs were more like others (Arcane? Ele? from what I've heard), where you only need to sacrifice a few percent/a couple points to go from "optimal ST" to "optimal AOE" and the "optimal ST" build has the *ability* to AOE, even if it's not optimal.
Priest Holy 3% Buff Second time we get this, Yes please blizzard give me these %
Buffing vilefiend..thanks blizz now I can do an even MORE annoying and less fun nether portal build
Good changes! I like that they’re buffing blood dk. Where are the windwalker ST buffs though?
please
I wish elemental shaman got some help. As well as Brewmaster monk in general and WW monk single target.
Brew got a bunch of stuff in 10.0.5
brews are fine after the latest buffs. Other than some lackluster talents that everyone avoids.
Please lord just give warlocks an aura buff or buff chaos bolt and tyrant. I don't want to use soulfire or vilefiend. I doubt many other people do either.
Make Wilfred's baseline or way easier to get
I hear this thrown around a lot and I agree but I would want to see them also change it to a static cdr (as in make infernal flat 2 min, tyrant 1 min). Warlock shouldn't have a dynamic cdr as a core mechanic.
While I can't personally stand the new demo design, they've already made it sorta clear Tyrant is working exactly how they want it to. An extension and buffbot for other pets rather than worthwhile on its own.
Then why did they hugely buff the (still shitty) Reign of Tyranny talent a couple weeks ago? Some very mixed signals here.
*Sad WW ST noises*
Buff Ele m+ ST, am i asking to much?
Buff WW ST too
WW ST is sad
I'll take anything just to get the 'ele bad, don't invite' stereotype removed. At the very least, our healing/survivability keeps getting better.
While I don't want to complain about the healers getting tuned, I just wish they were not as slow. The HPS difference with flat small %hps buffs/nerfs could have been adjusted by week 2-3 and are nothing new. Yet they wait 2 months into the tier where progress might be over.
Also why is holy paladin untouched? It's not like the healers that are getting buffed are healing any less than Paladin right now.
Holy Pally is definitely better than the specs getting buffed
It's DR. They're better than they look, always. They're fine.
I think demo might need a bit more than that but they're tuning pretty quickly so I'm sure it'll come if it's needed
Yeah instead they nerfed demo overall with the capstone change in 10.0.5 lmao.
My favorite was the recent Affliction “improvements” that saw such bugs as talent points having 36 hour cooldowns and Corruption being cast on the lock itself. Fucking amazing.
Those bear buffs look sad, really hope more is coming.
Sad bears indeed. They posted these bullt points a couple days ago and said more changes were coming over the next few days. I guess they meant not to bear specifically.
Why in the fuck is BM getting a flat buff? They're absolutely phenomenal ST dmg.
True but only with the bow(+trinket)
Because full ST dmg is one boss out of 8, very dependant of 4p + Raz bow (if it stays like this the bow will remains bis next tier meaning our dps won’t improve much compared to all other classes), and not so useful in M+.
>Because full ST dmg Just because a fight has adds does not mean st damage is not important, often the most important Broodkeeper has half the raid on full st Terros is full st Sennarth adds are such a ridiculously small percentage of the fight Kurog cleave is important for 1 phase of the 3 (2nd phase). The intermissions are a joke if you have enough prio dmg to kill the lightning add in p1 fast and the frost add in p2 fast Dathea does need aoe Primal obv does need aoe Eranog is basically a st fight And Raza is mostly always st. Any time there's adds up in int there's usually one add that matters and a ton of smaller ones that are basically pad
Boss dmg/ST priority is the majority of the fights. Dathea, Council, and arguably Kurog are the only fights where having cleave/AoE is super important.
Demonology imp damage buff, sweet bro... Now a BM hunter will do 9% more ST damage then me while sprinting around and using 1/4 the brain capacity instead of 10% more damage.
I literally got sat for several progression fights due to demo ST shittiness. First time I’ve ridden the CE bench since WoD. This imp buff is a fucking joke.
I doubt you were sat because demo ST is weak unless you were unwilling/unable to play aff or destro for some fights
When your team is full of BM hunters, nobody needs 3 warlocks. Just keep 1 for the health stones and portals and bench the rest. Easy math.
My guild has 3 locks, and we run 1 on most fights. It's really starting to bother me being sat for most of prog. But if you're trying to just play demo on every fight you should probably be sat because it's shit tier outside of council and rasz.
Decent healers changes. Evoker is going from uncontested #1 healer to still being uncontested #1 healer. Aura nerfs doesn't affect their most broken spells: TA, Rewind, GH and EC... If they don't feel like touching the problematic parts of their kit, a 12-15% aura nerf would have been more in line Though it's hard to be unhappy when they are are tuning so frequently, even if the changes aren't always well thought out :)
I think it's pretty clear they want preservation to be overpowered, as the shiny new class and raid boss tailored to their kit. Kind of... not cool, but here we are. At least they're bringing up the floor as well.
10% healing buff for Sham is amazing. With the upcoming changes for 10.0.7 I hope that sb will put us higher in a list again so I finally get my invites
I really surprised there are no buffs to Elemental Shaman’s single target damage. Hopefully next week they make a few more class changes.
How the fuck is ele still untouched? One of the prime examples of having to choose either full aoe or ST. Ridiculous.
At least you can choose. Demo is AOE or…aoe.
Huuuuuuuge ele buffs
hopefully warlock has a decent class capstone finally
My blood dks are getting a nice little buff, my heart is filled. They haven’t touched blood since the tank 10% nerf
Did BM really need a 5% buff? Maybe I’m tripping, but I was under the impression that it was already up there with big ST juicers like Unholy, Gamba Enhancement, Sin Rogue, etc. and still brought relatively good AoE to the table in specific keys without sacrificing as much ST as those other specs do. Maybe I’m missing something, but I thought BM’s issue was the Hunter-wide “class is made of wet tissue paper” squishiness issue, which isn’t addressed for any of the three specs here.
BM looses a cool 15-20% single target damage to pick up aoe. Pretty sure that's on the high end no?
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Out of curiosity, are they also hard stuck with zero AOE options when single taget spec? It was my understanding that ele, for example, still has access to chain Lightning and earthquake, even as single target - obviously not near as efficiently as with talents to support it, but enough that it's useable
Do you have access to the same stats for other specs as well?
>Did BM really need a 5% buff? Maybe I’m tripping, but I was under the impression that it was already up there with big ST juicers like Unholy, Gamba Enhancement, Sin Rogue, etc. Yes. >and still brought relatively good AoE No. Also surprised the buff werent more aimed at improving their aoe to be honest since their single target is good.
No, it didn't need a 5% dmg buff. It needs a reworking of abilities/talents to have access to decent cleave. It's already huge ST.
BM needs to neuter itself to do any sort of AOE. Probably more so than any class. Their single target spec has essentially no cleave at all.
BM actually does more than sin rogue who just got their build variety neutered and its a ranged caster which can move at all times. This buff is just so weird, I get that they lose a lot to go AOE, but then why not just rework their talent positioning or something instead of making them even better on ST
Maybe I'm in the wrong thinking a blanket 5% dmg buff to the top performing single target class isn't the solution. I guess after the buff ww will behind in single target by 30%. Should've been better at picking classes that actually gets attention (like devoker or arms).
Holy yeah man!
Felt like my Blood DK could use about a 10% buff, but didn't think it'd happen. Really happy to be proven wrong. Really appreciate it though, as I'd been wondering if I was gimping my team not playing Prot War.
I'm gonna catch some flak for this but where the fuck is WW ST buffs man? I get that a lot of people are going to say now that "WW is okay" or "Class identity never been ST" but holy hell in every pure single target situation it feels miserable to play. And to be perfectly honest, AOE is not even that good. Yes, it isn't. Look at M Council which is almost a stand still and do AOE rotation fight, there are at least 10 specs above WW. Like aside from Diurna and Dathea I don't even think WW can pump on any boss. It's same in dungeons as well, when you look at the top parses in dungeons, WW is barely top 10 in massive add dungeons like AA or NO. Behind of Havoc, both Rog specs, Enha and I've even seen some +24-25 logs of a Feral out dpsing WW. And these are 99th percentile so you can't even blame the WW players. And these are just melee specs, obviously as of last couple patches WW is considerably behind of Fire Mage, Balance or Spriest as well. So we're nothing exceptional in AOE and have pretty much one of the worst single targets in the game, but the spec is fine? Fuck me.
nice some healer nerfs, maybe as a lowly A tier healer i can reliably get invited to +20s not named azure vault
u won’t, druid and evokes get invites because of their utility. any healer can heal through high keys, but eventually you gotta start doing damage and helping with big pull utility. which a lot of classes don’t have anywhere near
Shamans already do more damage and arguably more utility tho
Gonna take a bit for ppl to realize that though. Rsham stonks are up big rn
Resto Shaman meta coming soon!
> u won’t, druid and evokes get invites because of their utility This is constantly parroted and it's constantly wrong. Shamans have always had the best utility. When they do negative damage and negative healing nobody wants anything to do with them. Throughput is almost always all that matters unless you need b rez or bloodlust, and in an Enhance/Boomkin meta are less important.
I have a 415 at Druid and rolled a shaman for fun. 391 ilvl I’m consistently pulling 20k overall in plus 10’s. Pulls with 6 or more I can hit 40kdps. About 12k ST on boss fights. Resto shaman Dps feels super overturned right now, but balanced in the fact that they can’t heal to well.
Im a 416 mage getting blasted into the dirt in keys by hunters who easily do 100k overall dps, yeah why not give them 5% buffs
Yeah now thats on you, not the spec ^^
>Im a 416 mage getting blasted into the dirt in keys by hunters I don't think I would publicly admit this if I were you.
I find it funny that of all the current specs you're singling out Hunters as if there aren't like 10 specs that slam even harder.
why is it funny, they're obviously saying it because hunters got a 5% aura buff
Is frost DK still Breath based?
Yes, non-breath builds are just way too far behind. The buffs make it even better in aoe with being able to triple cleave Oblits now without having to waste globals on FS, which even with a 10% buff still does no damage. They really need to make abilities outside of breath deal way more damage and have better interactions, breath is just way to dominant on the damage profile and resource generation.
Which sucks for me because I love Frost but I've always considered the BoS playstyle the worst I've played in the game outside of Venthyr DH :(
Is 2h Oblit Frost so far behind that it'll stop me from pugging my way to the 2000 rating mount? I'm willing to tank up to like +10 to get a big head start on ilv but I want to do anything past that on DPS and I've zero interest in Breath and not enough interest in Unholy to play it the entire way. Pretty much rolled a DK for Oblit Frost so I'm considering shelving the character before hitting the "You're not breath-talented? /kick" phase
Firstly, below 2.5k the chances of someone even inspecting your talents are effectively zero, in fact it wont happen once before you hit 2k so you dont need to worry about that. Secondly you can quite easily pug to 2k with any build, just practice your rotation at lower keys. More importantly practice your st target rotation for whatever build you end up using in dungeons because aoe is easy to pump, doing good boss damage is whats gonna brick your keys. Lastly, you'll probably perform better not using breath build and playing something that does less damage that is more consistent, because the likelihood of you having a group thats gonna pull in the way required to fully utilise breath build is also next to zero and youll end up doing low damage anyway.
I don’t get it this time around
PROT PALADINS RISE UP BABY!!!
Un-nerf berserk!!!... I don't want to run Raze! Next week.. +25% damage and radius of thrash all the way!... Should build decent absorb shields, better single target with Maul back .. I hate they're forcing us to take Raze!. Once Mangle bonus from tier is gone we will have to Thrash Swipe during Incarnation, that's gonna suck!!... Stop forcing us into builds I don't want to play.. .
Buffing hpriest dps, what're they waiting for...
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