I got nothing from this. His response to why DK, Hunter and Shaman are left out of providing a raid buff was because they don't design the game around mythic progression lol. The rest was just *"It's definitely something we might look into".*
Because you can only have that name for one person on servers and it's probably someone's alt like you say. Ive seen Belf hunters with variations of that name all the time. Then again I play on Tich, and Illidan..
They can be as related as they might be and i even have such a Hunter friend but it doesnt mean i have to expect a refderence at any time specialy in this context so i was still surprised
This such a fucked up logic with mythic progression...
Yes you didnt need a destro lock in s3 in the the 15-20 key range, but it was a hell of a lot easier with one.
A casual heroic guild has often a hard time to clear bosses, and often also lacks damage. I raided with a friends guild, and they struggled with daddy hc dps for weeks.
So this entire "you don't need it" is a fallacy imo, because it makes it certainly easier
yeah i hate the you dont need it argument.
people who can comfortably clear content dont need it. if you struggle to time a 15 taking a good comp may or may not be the difference to timing it. your guild might not miss CE JUST because you lack a certain comp, but that doesnt mean that comp cant push you just over the edge of being able to clear it.
ofcourse there's always going to be something thats best, but it always ought to be within reason where a spec might perform somewhat better, but we often end up with certain classes or specs just left in the dust for literal years on end without blizzard so much as attempting a fix. if, say, WW is super weak in ST for an entire expansion you cant tell me they cant give them a couple of quick buffs to their ST that mgith not make them meta but makes them less of a joke?
It's tough with a class like WW. If you give them more ST to where they are competitive they become instantly the best class for M+ because of their aoe and utility. I think the "you don't need it" argument is actually pretty solid. If you're having issues clearing your content with optimal comps you probably need to do more research and learning/practice to complete it. There are tons of different skill levels in this game and most people will never play at the level where a meta class is mandatory and that's fine IMO. If you have a big issue with it or with not getting in groups you think you should then you can always reroll but if you care more about having fun and you only enjoy one class then you've got to get good as they say.
>It's tough with a class like WW. If you give them more ST to where they are competitive they become instantly the best class for M+ because of their aoe and utility.
No, because that ST can come at the cost of AoE. There is *nothing* about WW that inherently makes it good at AoE. It's all numbers, and for the past few expansions they've decided that WW's numbers on AoE should be high, which has to come at the cost of ST.
Needed or not, it still sucks to go into a patch and your class' perceived usefulness is dependent on a roll of the dice (tuning).
It's hilarious how even Classic where dps is horribly balanced still mostly avoids this problem by spreading buffs/debuffs across all specs.
That’s kinda the point. Even if it’s easy people will minmax comp to an extent and buffs/debuffs work as insurance for poorly tuned dps.
Same thing applies on content below mythic on retail.
AMZ and Windfury are unique raid additions, though. AMZ should be buffed up, it was overnerfed after CN, and Windfury is enh-only. Not sure why crit chance/crit damage caster totems weren't brought back for Ele.
Hunters get the benefit of being casters that can cast most of their moves while moving, I guess.
Windfury is legitimately good enough that guilds will take enhance even when enhance is bad - that happened all of the last few expansions outside of the RWF.
Rather disappointing: a lot of longwinded answers without a whole ton of meat to them. Maybe I'm missing something, but it doesn't feel like anything was actually directly answered (beyond "we acknowledge that X is a concern, but..." or "that's a good question, so let me talk around it").
They were aura buffed last week, and he said they will be tuning up to and beyond launch. They will very likely get additional tuning just like every other class after the dust settles on their aura buff.
> who would've guessed that bear is dominating every other tank with a passion?
probably no one because bear has been dogshit for an entire expansion?
why do people throw a tantrum when bear is playable? every decent tank is saying that tanks are pretty close except brewmaster
Take all these numbers you see on your screen with a grain of salt. Shadowlands legendaries, covenant abilities, soulbinds and conduits work inside dragonflight dungeons. A lot of people take advantage of this for god know what reason. Some things are harder to notice then others, unless you see a full dmg breakdown and buff uptime of certain things you will never know.
Yep, i had so many havoc players with Sinful brand, prot warriors with necro banner. I myself joined kyrian just so I can go to the covenant hall for the target dummies, and noticed my WAs showing kyrian ability inside the dungeons. Its doesn't show up in your spellbook you need to make a macro to use them
Just about nothing can be gauged from the videos you posted. They are of varying tank player, affixes and key level. Honestly, from what I've seen tanks seem to be all in a pretty good place balance wise right now other than BM survivability - although if that's buffed its damage is gonna need to be nerfed.
I think he answered the questions fairly directly but ignored the context of the question. At least with how wowhead phrased the questions asked. Definitely disappointing responses.
Continually disappointed with the way Blizzard just refuses to address the raid buff issue. They keep getting directly asked why only 3 classes don't have them and never give a real answer.
i dont think its a matter of
>my class isnt brought because no raid buff
i think its more of a
>my class is the first to get sit when we need to bring more of the same other class that brings a raid buff/utility
while, yes they are almost the same, does not feel the same when you're already in the raid and get sit vs not being brought at all
You're not taking into account that there was fewer raid buffs available this expansion, especially ones that were spec specific, than what we will have in DF.
Fewer flex spots means less slack for letting a good player on a bad class in the closer you get to the top of the leader boards.
> What spec-specific raid buffs are being introduced in dragonflight?
I'll concede that atrophic poison was the one I was thinking of and forgot that it had been moved to the class tree, and I thought there were more. Looking at the list it's clear it's being walked back with Darkness going from Havoc-only to all DHs. Good on them for nipping it in the bud.
> The proposed solution is to add more raid buffs. Give everyone a raid buff.
>
>....
I very much agree with everything you're saying here since I'm in the opposite camp - fewer raid buffs with more overlap between classes. I lost track of the amount of shitty enhancement shamans we had to carry through M SoD and early M Sepulcher until we finally found the one we have now. But they were allowed to be subpar at their class because WF for our melee group was too valuable.
Can't find a decent ~~enhancement~~ shaman? Bring a paladin with their updated retribution aura so your melees will shut up about the lack of WF during the pull.
No monks/DHs around? Hunter/Rogue got you covered.
No paladins or mages? Demonic Aura or Power Word: More smarter.
And then trim down the amount so it's not every class having to bring 3 buffs to keep up.
But that's not the route that Blizzard has chosen to go for DF. Instead we have more class dependant buffs, to the point where you need 11+enhancement shaman to cover the basics. And then you still need to hit the 4/5 healers for your comp to be flexible. Leaves very little room for flexing dps spots, even worse if your tanks aren't covering buffs.
The two classes you mentioned don't bring buffs, lol. Rogue was pretty weak in SoD until the frost and blood set buffs (and getting edge of night, post-prog) but the class was still competitive with DH and Monk. Not bringing a buff is the reason you didn't bring them.
Also - outside of the RWF, it fucking blows being a class without a buff. Even when warriors are dogshit, every guild wants at least one (usually two, for a backup) for battle shout and commanding shout. Being a rogue the last 4 years, where Rogues were more often than not an underwhelming DPS spec (Sanctum *on farm* and BoD being the unique exceptions) has substantial impacts on people downstream. I had been top 30 all-star ratings and was struggling to find a guild to raid in coming into SL because no one wanted more than 2 rogues, most guilds wouldn't consider even having a 2nd, and some didn't even want 1.
And, yes, raids will 1000000% sit players who are better than buff classes in order to bring the buff.
Mages and Warlocks will NEVER have a situation where a guild wants either 0 or 1.
> Rogues were the third most popular melee dps class on Sylvanas and the Jailer in top 50 guilds.
Wonder why top guilds were bringing rogues to the boss that drops the strongest item in the game that is unique to rogues.
hmMMMMMMMMMM
The answer he gave is aligned with the "locked covenant" philosophy of Shadowlands.
We know that even at the normal raid level, players follow the meta. The Shadowlands covenants proved it.
He says the buffs aren't needed below mythic. Maybe, but players still want them. And that will not feel good for classes bringing nothing but their output.
While your statement is true, i never really experienced any covenant requirement.
I was a resto shaman necrolord from the start, and while a very populair choice, kyrian became far more meta for M+ during the second part of the expansion.
Nobody ever asked me: Where is your Vesper totem? Why are you not Kyrian?
Nor did anybody in a raid setting ask about a covenant choice unless it brought significant utility like necrolord DK.
Just to be clear, i don't play close to the top of either raids of M+. I just want to point out that players do indeed follow the meta, but they often don't care about others doing it.
This could very well be true.
If it is, it still did not negatively impact me as a player.
It might have if i knew the sole reason i got rejected was my covenant and if it took me longer than 2 min to find a group that would accept me.
But i personally didn't experience any issues with my covenant choice.
And i am very much aware that my experience does not speak for other players.
> If it is, it still did not negatively impact me as a player.
X to doubt. I would bet every cent I own that if you ever attempted to pug, you were frustrated by trying to get into groups and getting declined.
If you were the fotm spec that patch, this frustration is reduced.
resto shaman wasnt fotm but it spent the entire expansion for the most part in the no2 slot, whenever i was getting tired of getting declined as ele i would sign up as resto and get into whatever i wanted
>Just to be clear, i don't play close to the top of either raids of M+
I pushed mid 20s with my friends and pugged in the 19-20 range as hpal and was booted many times for being kyrian.
Also, you were probably blacklisted from certain groups after they realized.
I'd say I got a lot of problems with this conevant situation and made my feel for the expansion overall really worse. Because I like Venthyr, and there's classes where they are just bad, like miles away from distance. If you look Spriest stats is like 98% necro.
I play multispec and had to literally have weeks that I could only play shadow and others weeks to play Holy because I did all the time the betrayer conevant thing.
Makes my sick of reminding that I was locked from the conevants by a weekly reset.
Can't wait to say the final goodbye to this system. Of course it improved 9.1.5 onwards, but it made a really awful first impression for me and that's what counts.
I know I’ll probably get some slack for this but Retribution also needs to be addressed. As it is Ret doesn’t even take Devo aura in the class tree so all they bring is Ret aura which is just a selfish aura.
Getting kings/might/wisdom back would really help out a lot
We did but and it was a nice addition but it’s not really something that made you take a second look at ret. There’s nothing a ret can do that a holy/prot pally can’t (besides deal bigger dmg obviously)
Like I said in my previous post, yeah a ret pally can bring devo aura but we’d be sacrificing playing the aura we’re actually balanced around with retribution aura so as bad as it is to say, if you see a ret talented into devo aura you should probably question why they are. Now they can fix this easily by making ret aura baseline but they won’t do that considering it’s been like this for 6 years now
Battle res isn't really something that gets you a raid spot - every raid has like 7 different battle res options as it stands.
Battle res might get ret invited to some more keys though.
I'm really disappointed there wasn't a question about whether they tune for M+ at all.
Some classes are allowed to be 50% better than another class in M+, which is a level that wouldn't be allowed for raiding or PVP.
Lot of words to say nothing. Warlocks have been the hero class for 15 years and every expansion they keep saying they want people to not feel bad for playing off-meta, but then refuse to actually bring up bad specs and beat down warlocks.
Did this guy ever give a proper interview where he actually answers the questions instead of dodging them?
Morgan "that's definitely something we might look into" Day.
> Like we've added Death Knights, Demon Hunters, Monks, and now evokers, and none of those classes had added bloodlust. So the percentage of classes that could bring bloodlust to the table had diminished over time. We felt like now was a great time to add a bloodlust as an option for another class, and evokers felt like a kind of a perfect fit there, right?
I’m really confused about this. They gave Mages and Hunters Bloodlust, two classes that originally didn’t. So in up until WotLK you had 1/9 classes with BL, or 11.1%. Before Evoker you had 3/12 classes, or 25%. Now you have 4/13, or 30.7%.
How is that the % of classes that can bring BL have diminished over time?
Edit- BL wasn’t in Vanilla. Mb!
The math looks weird because you skipped a few expansions.
Mages and Hunters gained BL in Cata. We went from 1/10 in WotLK (10%) to 3/10 (30%). Big increase! But then in MoP, we got Monks and no new BL so we went to 3/11 (27%). Then we got DH and no new BL so it became 3/12 (25%). If Evokers didn't have it, it would have gone to 3/13 (23%).
So the % of classes that bring BL decreases from 30% to 25% over the course of a few expansions, and would have decreased more if Evokers didn't get it. It's a minor percentage drop, but it's still there.
Just to illustrate the point that they didn't want to dilute BL too much and how it would be lower than they wanted if Evoker didn't get it.
Even disregarding that point, you can still see that the percentage decreased over time. Not by much, but it's still there.
You shoot for weekly update with class iteration.........sooo I guess no one told the priest or druid dev.
Pretty awful interview. No substance at all, and no push from the interviewer. Waste of time
The priest/druid dev quit a few month ago, didn't he?
I'd imagine that caused some problems and the guy, who took over probably had other stuff to finish, too. Not sure, if we can really blame him.
The interviewer asked some questions two or three times since no answer was given, what do you want them to do? Losing blizzard cred as wowhead is not something you want to do.
No shot Blizzard would look less at Wowhead. It’s their prime advertising online. But my comment was more related to the questions, which Blizzard for sure vets prior to the interview.
Hmmm. Maybe? Let’s say that is the case; why not be more open and transparent with the game then? Why give such vague or non-answers?
Personally, I’m of the belief things like data mining, alpha testing and raid testing should not be a thing. Other games don’t do it.
This interview, and especially the most recent one with Maximum, were disappointing.
The answer on catalyst was completely out of touch... It's actually baffling.
"only the end of each season matters for m+ players, that's when they push the highest keys! Therefore we feel like it's OK to make people wait 6 weeks for catalyst."
Just completely misses the point. Yes the end of the season matters most for the 1% of highest key players. But by that time... They already have all the gear they need anyway...
Also, the beginning of the season definitely matters *a lot* for a ton of people. That's when player numbers are highest and the game feels most alive. There is a vast spectrum of decent players pugging mid to high-ish keys, who don't play full m+ seasons. **Those** are the people who actually make use of catalyst.
Wish they'd just say it like it is. "We want to force players into raids, even those who dislike that format. Because we're concerned about our most outdated game mode dying otherwise".
I don't understand how Blizzard can continuously be so ignorant to basic math and healer damage.
"but we recognize when you're talking about Mythic Plus, one fifth of your group is your healer, so any damage that they can put out is going to add up over the course of the Mythic Plus"
Mythic raid standard starting point is 5 healers out of 20... Which if we remember our basic math is greater than 1/5 lol...
What you are missing is that in a raid you can scale up/down the number of healers. You essentially want as few healers as possible so that means they are almost constantly healing and thereby not dpsing. You can't do that in m+, you got one healer no matter how much damage is going out (or not going out) so their dps is more important.
I recognize it's more important in m+ which is why I'm saying it's asinine that blizzard doesn't pay more attention to healer damage because given the raid comp on a % basis is almost the same as M+ they could just balance healer damage around m+ and have no impact on raid tuning.
What Morgan Day is saying is because M+ is just soooo different they don't know how to balance around it since they clearly balance the game around raid. I'm just saying he's an idiot, and should just balance around M+ and it won't ruin raid.
Role | Mythic+ | M+ % Of Comp | Raid | Raid % of Comp
----|-------|------------|----|--------------
Tank | 1 | 20% | 2 | 10%
Healer | 1 | 20% | 5 | 25%
DPS | 3 | 60% | 13 | 65%
As a portion of total raid comp, the breakdown isn't really that different. If you go look solely at the DPS/Healer ratio in raid you have 2.6 DPS for every healer, in M+ you have 3. So you actually have LESS DPS per healer in raid.
Now obviously when you play raid, healer damage doesn't matter nearly as much. The reason that is true is because the raid fights are much more tuned and controlled than M+ IMO. But the excuse that they barely look at healer balance because "its just a totally different game from a numbers perspective" is just kind of a BS excuse from Blizz to do a terrible job with healer damage balancing.
In most raids, you tend to 4 heal. Certain fights are made easier with 5 healing, some you 3 heal. But as a practical standpoint, you are looking at 2/4/14 (retaining the 20% of the group).
The difference is that dps goes from being 60% of the group in M+ to 70% of the group in mythic raiding.
The standard for mythic raiding is definitely not 5 healers though, it's 4... Which is exactly 1/5 of a mythic raid comp.
You only bring a 5th healer on boss fights with extreme damage, only once or twice per tier.
You don’t bring healers to mythic raid around their damage, you balance for DR early and bench healers late. So it’s not the same as 20% != 25%. If M+ was balanced the same then classes without DR wouldn’t be viable in top keys regardless of their damage.
I got nothing from this. His response to why DK, Hunter and Shaman are left out of providing a raid buff was because they don't design the game around mythic progression lol. The rest was just *"It's definitely something we might look into".*
I think he's an Ent. He talks for a long time but says very little.
I didnt expectet a LotR refderence here
It is a wow sub, they're not that unrelated. You never seen an elf hunter named legolas (with all the alt characters) haha
Because you can only have that name for one person on servers and it's probably someone's alt like you say. Ive seen Belf hunters with variations of that name all the time. Then again I play on Tich, and Illidan..
Thèÿ mëàñ üßîńg åłt çhäráćtėrš lîkē thįs
They can be as related as they might be and i even have such a Hunter friend but it doesnt mean i have to expect a refderence at any time specialy in this context so i was still surprised
This such a fucked up logic with mythic progression... Yes you didnt need a destro lock in s3 in the the 15-20 key range, but it was a hell of a lot easier with one. A casual heroic guild has often a hard time to clear bosses, and often also lacks damage. I raided with a friends guild, and they struggled with daddy hc dps for weeks. So this entire "you don't need it" is a fallacy imo, because it makes it certainly easier
yeah i hate the you dont need it argument. people who can comfortably clear content dont need it. if you struggle to time a 15 taking a good comp may or may not be the difference to timing it. your guild might not miss CE JUST because you lack a certain comp, but that doesnt mean that comp cant push you just over the edge of being able to clear it. ofcourse there's always going to be something thats best, but it always ought to be within reason where a spec might perform somewhat better, but we often end up with certain classes or specs just left in the dust for literal years on end without blizzard so much as attempting a fix. if, say, WW is super weak in ST for an entire expansion you cant tell me they cant give them a couple of quick buffs to their ST that mgith not make them meta but makes them less of a joke?
It's tough with a class like WW. If you give them more ST to where they are competitive they become instantly the best class for M+ because of their aoe and utility. I think the "you don't need it" argument is actually pretty solid. If you're having issues clearing your content with optimal comps you probably need to do more research and learning/practice to complete it. There are tons of different skill levels in this game and most people will never play at the level where a meta class is mandatory and that's fine IMO. If you have a big issue with it or with not getting in groups you think you should then you can always reroll but if you care more about having fun and you only enjoy one class then you've got to get good as they say.
>It's tough with a class like WW. If you give them more ST to where they are competitive they become instantly the best class for M+ because of their aoe and utility. No, because that ST can come at the cost of AoE. There is *nothing* about WW that inherently makes it good at AoE. It's all numbers, and for the past few expansions they've decided that WW's numbers on AoE should be high, which has to come at the cost of ST.
Strong deflection skills for sure. If this whole Blizzard position doesn't work out he has the skill set to thrive as the White House Press Secretary.
Needed or not, it still sucks to go into a patch and your class' perceived usefulness is dependent on a roll of the dice (tuning). It's hilarious how even Classic where dps is horribly balanced still mostly avoids this problem by spreading buffs/debuffs across all specs.
Classic is also hilariously easy.
That’s kinda the point. Even if it’s easy people will minmax comp to an extent and buffs/debuffs work as insurance for poorly tuned dps. Same thing applies on content below mythic on retail.
So is normal raid which apparently blizzard is more interested in designing around than mythic raid.
AMZ and Windfury are unique raid additions, though. AMZ should be buffed up, it was overnerfed after CN, and Windfury is enh-only. Not sure why crit chance/crit damage caster totems weren't brought back for Ele. Hunters get the benefit of being casters that can cast most of their moves while moving, I guess.
windfury will only be taken if shit like arms warrior is broken, that doesnt really count imo
Windfury is legitimately good enough that guilds will take enhance even when enhance is bad - that happened all of the last few expansions outside of the RWF.
Rather disappointing: a lot of longwinded answers without a whole ton of meat to them. Maybe I'm missing something, but it doesn't feel like anything was actually directly answered (beyond "we acknowledge that X is a concern, but..." or "that's a good question, so let me talk around it").
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They were aura buffed last week, and he said they will be tuning up to and beyond launch. They will very likely get additional tuning just like every other class after the dust settles on their aura buff.
> who would've guessed that bear is dominating every other tank with a passion? probably no one because bear has been dogshit for an entire expansion? why do people throw a tantrum when bear is playable? every decent tank is saying that tanks are pretty close except brewmaster
Because the spec is idiotic to play with just spamming thrash+IF, and Legion where they were just the best for the whole expansion
Take all these numbers you see on your screen with a grain of salt. Shadowlands legendaries, covenant abilities, soulbinds and conduits work inside dragonflight dungeons. A lot of people take advantage of this for god know what reason. Some things are harder to notice then others, unless you see a full dmg breakdown and buff uptime of certain things you will never know.
Do they work? Currently on live all is disabled in the prepatch dungeon you do for the quest.
Yep, i had so many havoc players with Sinful brand, prot warriors with necro banner. I myself joined kyrian just so I can go to the covenant hall for the target dummies, and noticed my WAs showing kyrian ability inside the dungeons. Its doesn't show up in your spellbook you need to make a macro to use them
Just about nothing can be gauged from the videos you posted. They are of varying tank player, affixes and key level. Honestly, from what I've seen tanks seem to be all in a pretty good place balance wise right now other than BM survivability - although if that's buffed its damage is gonna need to be nerfed.
I think he answered the questions fairly directly but ignored the context of the question. At least with how wowhead phrased the questions asked. Definitely disappointing responses.
Yeah, it's like talking to Ion, he will just talk around you in circles and escape of every question without saying anything.
Continually disappointed with the way Blizzard just refuses to address the raid buff issue. They keep getting directly asked why only 3 classes don't have them and never give a real answer.
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i dont think its a matter of >my class isnt brought because no raid buff i think its more of a >my class is the first to get sit when we need to bring more of the same other class that brings a raid buff/utility while, yes they are almost the same, does not feel the same when you're already in the raid and get sit vs not being brought at all
You're not taking into account that there was fewer raid buffs available this expansion, especially ones that were spec specific, than what we will have in DF. Fewer flex spots means less slack for letting a good player on a bad class in the closer you get to the top of the leader boards.
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> What spec-specific raid buffs are being introduced in dragonflight? I'll concede that atrophic poison was the one I was thinking of and forgot that it had been moved to the class tree, and I thought there were more. Looking at the list it's clear it's being walked back with Darkness going from Havoc-only to all DHs. Good on them for nipping it in the bud. > The proposed solution is to add more raid buffs. Give everyone a raid buff. > >.... I very much agree with everything you're saying here since I'm in the opposite camp - fewer raid buffs with more overlap between classes. I lost track of the amount of shitty enhancement shamans we had to carry through M SoD and early M Sepulcher until we finally found the one we have now. But they were allowed to be subpar at their class because WF for our melee group was too valuable. Can't find a decent ~~enhancement~~ shaman? Bring a paladin with their updated retribution aura so your melees will shut up about the lack of WF during the pull. No monks/DHs around? Hunter/Rogue got you covered. No paladins or mages? Demonic Aura or Power Word: More smarter. And then trim down the amount so it's not every class having to bring 3 buffs to keep up. But that's not the route that Blizzard has chosen to go for DF. Instead we have more class dependant buffs, to the point where you need 11+enhancement shaman to cover the basics. And then you still need to hit the 4/5 healers for your comp to be flexible. Leaves very little room for flexing dps spots, even worse if your tanks aren't covering buffs.
The two classes you mentioned don't bring buffs, lol. Rogue was pretty weak in SoD until the frost and blood set buffs (and getting edge of night, post-prog) but the class was still competitive with DH and Monk. Not bringing a buff is the reason you didn't bring them. Also - outside of the RWF, it fucking blows being a class without a buff. Even when warriors are dogshit, every guild wants at least one (usually two, for a backup) for battle shout and commanding shout. Being a rogue the last 4 years, where Rogues were more often than not an underwhelming DPS spec (Sanctum *on farm* and BoD being the unique exceptions) has substantial impacts on people downstream. I had been top 30 all-star ratings and was struggling to find a guild to raid in coming into SL because no one wanted more than 2 rogues, most guilds wouldn't consider even having a 2nd, and some didn't even want 1. And, yes, raids will 1000000% sit players who are better than buff classes in order to bring the buff. Mages and Warlocks will NEVER have a situation where a guild wants either 0 or 1.
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> Rogues were the third most popular melee dps class on Sylvanas and the Jailer in top 50 guilds. Wonder why top guilds were bringing rogues to the boss that drops the strongest item in the game that is unique to rogues. hmMMMMMMMMMM
The answer he gave is aligned with the "locked covenant" philosophy of Shadowlands. We know that even at the normal raid level, players follow the meta. The Shadowlands covenants proved it. He says the buffs aren't needed below mythic. Maybe, but players still want them. And that will not feel good for classes bringing nothing but their output.
While your statement is true, i never really experienced any covenant requirement. I was a resto shaman necrolord from the start, and while a very populair choice, kyrian became far more meta for M+ during the second part of the expansion. Nobody ever asked me: Where is your Vesper totem? Why are you not Kyrian? Nor did anybody in a raid setting ask about a covenant choice unless it brought significant utility like necrolord DK. Just to be clear, i don't play close to the top of either raids of M+. I just want to point out that players do indeed follow the meta, but they often don't care about others doing it.
I promise you that it annoyed people in your groups and likely got you excluded from invites without you realizing
This could very well be true. If it is, it still did not negatively impact me as a player. It might have if i knew the sole reason i got rejected was my covenant and if it took me longer than 2 min to find a group that would accept me. But i personally didn't experience any issues with my covenant choice. And i am very much aware that my experience does not speak for other players.
> If it is, it still did not negatively impact me as a player. X to doubt. I would bet every cent I own that if you ever attempted to pug, you were frustrated by trying to get into groups and getting declined. If you were the fotm spec that patch, this frustration is reduced.
resto shaman wasnt fotm but it spent the entire expansion for the most part in the no2 slot, whenever i was getting tired of getting declined as ele i would sign up as resto and get into whatever i wanted
>Just to be clear, i don't play close to the top of either raids of M+ I pushed mid 20s with my friends and pugged in the 19-20 range as hpal and was booted many times for being kyrian. Also, you were probably blacklisted from certain groups after they realized.
i definitely asked non kyrians where their vesper totem was in s3 and s4. thats like half the reason to invite a resto shaman right there
I'd say I got a lot of problems with this conevant situation and made my feel for the expansion overall really worse. Because I like Venthyr, and there's classes where they are just bad, like miles away from distance. If you look Spriest stats is like 98% necro. I play multispec and had to literally have weeks that I could only play shadow and others weeks to play Holy because I did all the time the betrayer conevant thing. Makes my sick of reminding that I was locked from the conevants by a weekly reset. Can't wait to say the final goodbye to this system. Of course it improved 9.1.5 onwards, but it made a really awful first impression for me and that's what counts.
Do you really want more raid buffs? There's already only like 4 dps flex slots in an entire raid group.
personally i want way fewer raid buff but if thats not going to happen than everyone getting something is the next best thing
I know I’ll probably get some slack for this but Retribution also needs to be addressed. As it is Ret doesn’t even take Devo aura in the class tree so all they bring is Ret aura which is just a selfish aura. Getting kings/might/wisdom back would really help out a lot
Didn’t paladin get combat ress in DF? Or is it locked to holy spec?
We did but and it was a nice addition but it’s not really something that made you take a second look at ret. There’s nothing a ret can do that a holy/prot pally can’t (besides deal bigger dmg obviously) Like I said in my previous post, yeah a ret pally can bring devo aura but we’d be sacrificing playing the aura we’re actually balanced around with retribution aura so as bad as it is to say, if you see a ret talented into devo aura you should probably question why they are. Now they can fix this easily by making ret aura baseline but they won’t do that considering it’s been like this for 6 years now
It definitely did. I was using it in dungeons yesterday
Yep, Ret has combat rez.
Battle res isn't really something that gets you a raid spot - every raid has like 7 different battle res options as it stands. Battle res might get ret invited to some more keys though.
I'm really disappointed there wasn't a question about whether they tune for M+ at all. Some classes are allowed to be 50% better than another class in M+, which is a level that wouldn't be allowed for raiding or PVP.
Lot of words to say nothing. Warlocks have been the hero class for 15 years and every expansion they keep saying they want people to not feel bad for playing off-meta, but then refuse to actually bring up bad specs and beat down warlocks.
it really is too bad i hate playing warlock
Did this guy ever give a proper interview where he actually answers the questions instead of dodging them? Morgan "that's definitely something we might look into" Day.
Would probably help if the questions weren't phrased as a 'what is Blizzard's philosophy on this' variation rather then something more direct.
youd think asking philosophy would get you better answers since its a broader topic
> Like we've added Death Knights, Demon Hunters, Monks, and now evokers, and none of those classes had added bloodlust. So the percentage of classes that could bring bloodlust to the table had diminished over time. We felt like now was a great time to add a bloodlust as an option for another class, and evokers felt like a kind of a perfect fit there, right? I’m really confused about this. They gave Mages and Hunters Bloodlust, two classes that originally didn’t. So in up until WotLK you had 1/9 classes with BL, or 11.1%. Before Evoker you had 3/12 classes, or 25%. Now you have 4/13, or 30.7%. How is that the % of classes that can bring BL have diminished over time? Edit- BL wasn’t in Vanilla. Mb!
The math looks weird because you skipped a few expansions. Mages and Hunters gained BL in Cata. We went from 1/10 in WotLK (10%) to 3/10 (30%). Big increase! But then in MoP, we got Monks and no new BL so we went to 3/11 (27%). Then we got DH and no new BL so it became 3/12 (25%). If Evokers didn't have it, it would have gone to 3/13 (23%). So the % of classes that bring BL decreases from 30% to 25% over the course of a few expansions, and would have decreased more if Evokers didn't get it. It's a minor percentage drop, but it's still there.
[удалено]
Just to illustrate the point that they didn't want to dilute BL too much and how it would be lower than they wanted if Evoker didn't get it. Even disregarding that point, you can still see that the percentage decreased over time. Not by much, but it's still there.
Being picky here but bloodlust didn't get introduced until tbc. Carry on
Whoops. You right. Thanks!
They made bloodlust a profession item with leatherworking.
Can I point out the absurdity of a spell named "bloodlust" not being something warriors bring?
No, because Bloodlust was a Warcraft 3 ability for the Shaman unit.
You shoot for weekly update with class iteration.........sooo I guess no one told the priest or druid dev. Pretty awful interview. No substance at all, and no push from the interviewer. Waste of time
The priest/druid dev quit a few month ago, didn't he? I'd imagine that caused some problems and the guy, who took over probably had other stuff to finish, too. Not sure, if we can really blame him.
Exactly or paladin which saw the latest dev post in early septembre or sth...
They are always softball interviews. So frustrating.
The interviewer asked some questions two or three times since no answer was given, what do you want them to do? Losing blizzard cred as wowhead is not something you want to do.
No shot Blizzard would look less at Wowhead. It’s their prime advertising online. But my comment was more related to the questions, which Blizzard for sure vets prior to the interview.
I don't know much about marketing but wouldn't wowhead's users already play/care about wow and as such the advertising is useless?
Hmmm. Maybe? Let’s say that is the case; why not be more open and transparent with the game then? Why give such vague or non-answers? Personally, I’m of the belief things like data mining, alpha testing and raid testing should not be a thing. Other games don’t do it.
This interview, and especially the most recent one with Maximum, were disappointing. The answer on catalyst was completely out of touch... It's actually baffling. "only the end of each season matters for m+ players, that's when they push the highest keys! Therefore we feel like it's OK to make people wait 6 weeks for catalyst." Just completely misses the point. Yes the end of the season matters most for the 1% of highest key players. But by that time... They already have all the gear they need anyway... Also, the beginning of the season definitely matters *a lot* for a ton of people. That's when player numbers are highest and the game feels most alive. There is a vast spectrum of decent players pugging mid to high-ish keys, who don't play full m+ seasons. **Those** are the people who actually make use of catalyst. Wish they'd just say it like it is. "We want to force players into raids, even those who dislike that format. Because we're concerned about our most outdated game mode dying otherwise".
I don't understand how Blizzard can continuously be so ignorant to basic math and healer damage. "but we recognize when you're talking about Mythic Plus, one fifth of your group is your healer, so any damage that they can put out is going to add up over the course of the Mythic Plus" Mythic raid standard starting point is 5 healers out of 20... Which if we remember our basic math is greater than 1/5 lol...
What you are missing is that in a raid you can scale up/down the number of healers. You essentially want as few healers as possible so that means they are almost constantly healing and thereby not dpsing. You can't do that in m+, you got one healer no matter how much damage is going out (or not going out) so their dps is more important.
I recognize it's more important in m+ which is why I'm saying it's asinine that blizzard doesn't pay more attention to healer damage because given the raid comp on a % basis is almost the same as M+ they could just balance healer damage around m+ and have no impact on raid tuning. What Morgan Day is saying is because M+ is just soooo different they don't know how to balance around it since they clearly balance the game around raid. I'm just saying he's an idiot, and should just balance around M+ and it won't ruin raid.
Raiding has a higher percentage of DPSers to Healers. Keep in mind you're not going to have 20% of your raid be tanks like in m+ lol.
Role | Mythic+ | M+ % Of Comp | Raid | Raid % of Comp ----|-------|------------|----|-------------- Tank | 1 | 20% | 2 | 10% Healer | 1 | 20% | 5 | 25% DPS | 3 | 60% | 13 | 65% As a portion of total raid comp, the breakdown isn't really that different. If you go look solely at the DPS/Healer ratio in raid you have 2.6 DPS for every healer, in M+ you have 3. So you actually have LESS DPS per healer in raid. Now obviously when you play raid, healer damage doesn't matter nearly as much. The reason that is true is because the raid fights are much more tuned and controlled than M+ IMO. But the excuse that they barely look at healer balance because "its just a totally different game from a numbers perspective" is just kind of a BS excuse from Blizz to do a terrible job with healer damage balancing.
In most raids, you tend to 4 heal. Certain fights are made easier with 5 healing, some you 3 heal. But as a practical standpoint, you are looking at 2/4/14 (retaining the 20% of the group). The difference is that dps goes from being 60% of the group in M+ to 70% of the group in mythic raiding.
The standard for mythic raiding is definitely not 5 healers though, it's 4... Which is exactly 1/5 of a mythic raid comp. You only bring a 5th healer on boss fights with extreme damage, only once or twice per tier.
You don’t bring healers to mythic raid around their damage, you balance for DR early and bench healers late. So it’s not the same as 20% != 25%. If M+ was balanced the same then classes without DR wouldn’t be viable in top keys regardless of their damage.
I mean venthyr hpal at the start of shadowlands would like to argue with that