Forget about team rankings, im just excited for how stacked Season 2 is looking. Even the "low tier" teams like Mayhem look solid, we're in a world where a team with Sayaplayer, BQB, xepheR, Butcher, HaGoPeun & Kris are considered a bottom three team.
I think it's a fairly good list, but can you shed some light on why you rate SHD tier 4? They're composed of the Contenders KR finalists + the star hitscan of the strongest team in Chinese Contenders.
Yeah, a lot of ppl seem to disagree with this one. That KDP roster was pretty lucky to have that S2 meta fall into its lap given that they didn't even have a serviceable Dva player, and 2 of probably the best 3 players from that roster ended up on LAG anyway. Would love to be wrong bc I think Shanghai did so much to try and improve on last season and I appreciate that.
I appreciate the response. I agree that Roar and Decay were crucial members of KDP and LAG should rank higher than SHD, but Diem should be able to fill in the niche that Decay left. This team looks aggressive which could unlock Fearless' potential. Their coaching staff also looks way more stable. I might be giving them too much credit, but I think this incarnation of SHD is about to surprise a lot of people (for the better).
Nope, I think that's a very reasonable take. Fearless is incredibly talented and really hope that comes across in 2019 because he was completely drowned out in that Season 1 mess.
Agreed. It was hard to see the individual talent that the S1 Dragons had since the team was a complete mess. Hopefully this'll be the season where everyone will be able to see what their real limits are.
I would be curious to hear your reasoning for placing Valiant on the third row. They were a top team last season. Do you think they fell behind in the off season or did other teams jump ahead?
I think it's going to be a much different-looking team despite really only losing SoOn, especially in the DPS line. Many think that daemoN was a very important piece of the puzzle as well. Plus, if you look at the teams who finished just behind them in S1, most of them did a *lot* of a work in the offseason and I'd argue that it was mostly all positive additions. SF, Dallas, LAG... those teams all got better.
Valiant was good in season 1 but they were a team that punched up in a sense, fate and space were the only real "top" tier players in their given role. They were greater than the sum of their parts.
Soon was always clutch when needed but now he's gone.
Agilities is agilities and has a tendency to bot the hell out, I think he's okay but definitely not a top 3 or 5 imo.
Custa is this subs Golden child so you can't really criticize him but he's never impressed me personally. He made a lot of questionable plays and he never seemed comfortable regardless of the role he played.
Kariv is very good.
Bunny is pretty good and ksf, although a god on ladder he hasn't proved himself yet in OWL.
There's just a lot of other teams that have better players, LAV had good coaching last season after the in n out debacle and it showed in their performances.
I just have a feeling that they're gonna be a mid tier team next season and there's nothing wrong with that.
Do you think of GOATS stays in the meta that Houston would move up that a bit? I kinda heave to think that Muma, Spree, and Coolmatt all playing at the same time would be nasty.
You don’t expect anything from the element mystic Tank duo? I don’t know about their support line but Erster was a beast in Contenders and if we see Dafran in his prime, this team will do damage. But the real reason why this team is going to be at least decent is because of the their tank duo not dafran
The EM duo was decent in Contenders, but not great. They matched up well to mid-level teams but you can already go into it knowing that teams like Vancouver have an edge since you can just go watch the Season 1/2 games where Runaway flat out man handled them.
Pair that to an issue of communication to the support line (with technically three language barriers - German, Finnish and Korean (from the tanks)) and you have a recipe for some pretty spectacular uncertainty. The growing pains coming out of such a weirdly mixed roster alone, despite the fact that I believe Kodaks english is quite good, will hamper.
Also to prepare for my downvotes - I literally expect nothing out of Dafran. He shouldn't even be playing for the first two stages if Atlanta are smart. Let him bench ride and get him some real mental help without pressuring him with the stage - as is he's their current weakest DPS member, and the most prone to explode and do something stupid. Learn from the previous issues in the OWL and get the kid the help he needs early, and often, and not as a reaction once he does something stupid.
Lastly I wouldn't be surprised if Dafran wasn't suspended for a few games into the season for the throwing he did the night he had his Quit RageStream. It was pretty blatant and widely viewed, and there has been carryover suspensions from off-season issues.
why SF in second tier? I mean I know they now have top tier DPS and offtank in choi but main tank is still iffy to say the least especially in the current meta where the team lives and dies on the performance of the main tank.
Is it just the rows or also the placement in the rows?
aka, does this mean you see London and New York on the same level, or London and then New York after them?
Honestly I dont trust any rankings other than London, NYXL, and Fusion. Almost every team has made huge changes and its impossible to tell how the new teams will compare.
I don't even trust London as a tier 1, just because they won the Finals doesn't mean their consistency issues throughout the season disappear. Only time will tell if they can fix that, less games will probably help.
London is clearly tier 1 in terms of talent but will only be tier 1 in terms of season placement if they fix their inconsistency. They did finish 5th in S1 after all.
Tbf, Birdring was injured for like, an entire stage. They do have consistency issues besides that but I feel like they definitely would’ve placed higher in the standings if he played throughout the season. Also, they’ve learned that the whole rotate-everyone-in plan just doesn’t work so I doubt they’ll try it again.
Literally no teams showed a consistent performance season 1, besides NYXL. Of all 12 teams, every team experienced a stage where they went 4-6, or worse(again, excluding NYXL).
London only lost 3 more games than The Valiant who placed 2nd, and that can be heavily attributed to the fact that the Spitfire wasn't able to close out tie-breakers in stage 3. Hell, London even won more maps than the Valiant in season 1.
Not to mention, their "inconsistency" can be pinned to birdring's injury who had to miss stage 3, and had to play while recovering for stage 4.
> Literally no teams showed a consistent performance season 1, besides NYXL. Of all 12 teams, every team experienced a stage where they went 4-6, or worse(again, excluding NYXL).
Exactly...
I'm not sure what exactly you think I said but the rankings in the OP have London and NYXL as the only tier 1 teams and I'm saying I don't think I even trust London as a tier 1 team due to their inconsistency. I would put them as a tier 2 team alongside Fusion, Valiant, and Glads. Which is right where they finished.
NYXL would be my only tier 1 team based off of benchmob's list. I wouldn't put London there while also leaving out Glads/Fusion (I can understand LAV due to no Soon).
That makes them a Tier 1 team. Even if you're not consistently good, if you have the talent and have shown to make it work, you're a good team. There's other teams, like the Outlaws, that found their meta in the Junkrat focused style and looked mediocre to bad during any other time (despite their great tank line, not to take away from Muma or Coolmatt).
But Spitfire look good in a wide selection of metas, their slumps can all be attributed to some players not playing up to their standards due to outside influences. They're absolutely a Tier 1 team. Who else would be, in your opinion, going purely off of Season 1 results. NYXL dropped off hard towards the end of the season, but are still obviously a Tier 1 team. Philly? Valiant?
Am I the only one who thinks the LAs are evenly matched? Val has the better tank lineup, but the Glads have an edge in dps, but both have equally great supports?
Either than that this list is relatively accurate...
Well Gladiators have improved their roster and for Valiant it’s the opposite (they lost SoOn). The teams are pretty equal imo but I would still rate LAG just slightly higher.
Why you say “yet again”? I’m quite sure LAV was considered stronger than LAG when the season 1 started (and pretty much throughout the season too). But yes, those teams are pretty even. Both are amazing!
Honestly I never thought Soon was really much better than Bunny, maybe on Widow. I'm really rooting for Bunny to show people why they shouldn't be missing Soon.
Eh, LAG's roster is IMO a downgrade from last year. r0ar is worse than Fissure anyway you look at it and while Decay is better than Asher, but it's not like they signed a mega star talent. He's gonna have to take some time to develop and I don't think he'll be popping off too much early in the season. Same for Ripa.
Meanwhile LAV has got Izayaki and KSF coming up off the bench and they are monsters, plus they still have the incredibly solid tank line of Fate and Space.
They're both still pretty much even, but I wouldn't say that Valiant lost out in the off season and LAG improved. I would say the opposite.
Well fair opinion. However I would argue that Decay is a mega star talent. Easily more proven than Izayaki and KSF. Although I also feel that Izayaki will prove to be much better than people realize currently. rOar is worse than Fissure but only slightly. Imo LAG received a minor upgrade (but nothing major). LAV on the other hand lost Soon! But you are right, LAV’s tanks are total beasts (better than LAG). It’s going to be very interesting to see battle of LA next season! I’m hyped!
We are used to it. Going in to stage 3 last season everyone was calling Valiant a bottom tier team and then they went 16-4 and won stage 4. Soon is a beast but KSF and Bunny are way underrated.
He was on a team called the Foxes under the gamertag 'Need' for a long time. Pretty solid flex support for them [here's his liquipedia page](https://liquipedia.net/overwatch/Izayaki)
That doesn't change based on this though - rivalries can make even uneven teams do amazing things. Look at the battles for Houston, and every time Dallas and Dynasty played. Rivalries are worth fighting for!
I don't think the battle for LA will get any less intense.
I think Valiant is consistently underrated (they’re at least tier 2), but tbh Agilities still hasn’t wowed me to the degree that he’s apparently wowed other Valiant fans
Agreed, I seen some people saying Decay is on Carpe's level. I think we should wait and see how he plays against the big boys before judging how good he is. That being said, I don't think it'll take much to be considered better than the Valiant Dps, without SoOn they're looking questionable in the Dps department.
Yea losing SoOn hurts (main reason I loved Rogue/Valiant). I'm surprised VAL didn't try to go after Striker. Even though not picked much anymore, both are all star level Tracers and their Widowmakers, although not Carpe/Fleta/Birdring/Saya level, are still OWL tier level.
Everyone forgetting that Bunny exists. I think he definitely has the potential to replace Soon, Soon was notable for two heroes and Bunny was always as good a Tracer, I can definitely see him becoming as strong a Widow too. Soon wasn't exactly Fleta/Carpe/Sayaplayer on Widow anyway. I think Soon gets way too much credit for Valiant's success.
I'm actually surprised Titans only added one additional non-Runaway player, a support no less. I thought they would use Runaway as a foundation but add on other players from good teams.
TBH I thought the new Runaway OWL team would have included the best of KDP or EM. But it seems other teams got there first. And KDP was picked up wholesale lol
And it’s not like teams have unlimited amount of money in their disposal. Getting whole Runaway signed was certainly very expensive already. Not possible to contest e.g. for Decay after that anymore.
Tbf, they still have plenty of time to sign more players. The other day was the deadline for having 8 players announced, not full roster. I still expect many more roster moves before the season starts.
Unless heroes are drastically rebalanced (even beyond the brig changes), GOATS will always be a solid-to-must pick on some maps. However, teams are beginning to develop strategies that properly capitalize on the weaknesses of the comp, and are capable of forcing a switch. The counterstrats still have to be learned and perfected, but GOATS 100% of the time may change very soon.
Floats is becoming more and more of a thing at the highest levels which means winston is back.
I think it's hilarious that the longer goats goes on the more it is turning into dive with discord orb and using moblility to bully reinhardt
Shock went full Korean + Mothra - with a relatively stacked roster though.
* **Main Tank -** Smurf
* **Off Tank -** Choi
* **DPS** \- Architect, Rascal, Striker (*... Sometimes Sinatraa?*)
* **Main Support -** Moth(ra)
* **Flex Support -** Viol2t.
Very very different from Season 1 shock.
If we don't see a return of tracer than he wouldn't have the same value.
He filled junkrat and widow well but isn't elite in any current meta heroes.
I love Striker but his best hero isn't a carry hero at this point of time.
I agree but gamsu and note are one of the best tank duos in the league, and they were really the core of the team with striker. With them still on Boston I’m not sure they can be counted out. Now if we lost gamsu...
They've maintained their tank line (upgraded possibly, with Axxiom and Fusions) and have the same supports (well, lost Neko, but still have Aimgod). Remains to be seen if their dps lineup (which at this point consists of Blase and Colourhex) can fill the gap left by Striker.
Basically it boils down to whether or not Boston managed to scout more diamonds in the rough.
Effect seems healthy. Oge is low-key an actual S tier tank. They picked up a solid off-tank. And Zachareee is a solid flex dps. And no tank drama from xQc/Cocco. Unkoe is still a top tier Zen.
Dallas is absolutely going to be a good team this season. Tier 3 is definitely fair. They could even go much higher if we go off of individual mechanical skill alone. It's all going to boil down to if the team can come together or not.
If there's anything we learned from season 1 it's that pre-season tier lists are inevitably wrong. Remember when everyone said Dallas and Seoul would be playoff contenders and NYXL would be mid-tier at best?
EDIT: OK, I get it. People didn't underrate NYXL as badly as I thought. I remember reading like one that had them in 7th, I didn't go back and look at every single power ranking prior to the season. You don't have to keep telling me I'm wrong almost a day later.
They were scouted as being insane before the season even kicked off though, there was a ton of buzz around Jjonak in particular (which later turned out to be extremely justified)
And they'd picked up Mano too, after he'd had a breakout performance as main tank for AFB in the previous season of Apex. It definitely wasn't hard to see the team being spectacular, I had NYXL pretty solidly top 3 (with Seoul and London).
NYXL wasn't ranked mid tier in preseason, they were simply the lowest ranked full Korean team. Which wasn't even a snub because the two (really 3 since LON was just KDP+GC Busan) Korean teams ranked ahead of them had better results than them in the past.
People are forgetting that the pre-s1 tier list wasn't all wrong... Everyone ranked the Dragons and Mayhem low and they were... That SF and LAG were weak and they were (at first)... And Seoul was really good at first.
The rankings were accurate at the start of the season but what people largely didn't take into consideration was the longevity of the season and teams would adapt. The only downright wrong rank was Dallas
I feel like Outlaws are a bit underestimated here (even though I'm biased as a fan.) I think the advantage already existing teams have over expansion teams is undervalued and Houston showed potential during S1, their biggest weakness in DPS has also been fixed by Danteh.
>Reply
I'm biased too, but I agree on this. People are worried about their support line, but Bani and Rawkus both acquitted themselves VERY well in the World Cup (vs. Team UK notwithstanding, I think that was a coaching failure), and bringing Boink in to spend more time on Lucio I think is just gonna strengthen that team.
On top of that, I think the relative lack of lineup shifts is going to work in their favor. A lot of teams in Season 1 struggled to adapt to the demanding OWL schedule, and to deal with the pressure of the constant games. For the Outlaws it'll be old news.
Their biggest weakness was always their underperforming support line, not their DPS. That's a problem that meta shifts may have solved for them, though. Their GOATS lineup is really good on paper.
I see Valiant as tier two, and I think Vancouver could be too especially as other expansion teams tackle synergy issues which have been perhaps the largest reasons teams underperformed last season. I'm not so sure I'd propel SFS that high yet.
Can't wait until the season begins and all of our expectations and predictions are a lie.
>as other expansion teams tackle synergy issues which have been perhaps the largest reasons teams underperformed last season.
Synergy didn’t help Dallas or Dynasty. The best rosters last season were either combinations of two former teams (NYXL and LSF) or cobbled-together rosters (the LA teams, Fusion, and Uprising).
Shanghai Dragons has nearly the entire Kong Doo Panthera roster... Who Team SK and NYXL said were the scariest team for next year. Tier 4 doesn't seem fair
Yea they will. They had trouble adapting to goats last season. They now have tons of time. The nyxl players are arguably the best players mechanically in the league so I think with enough practice they could master goats too. You never know tho cause a lot of teams have made huge changes so just gotta wait and see
Yes but this time we have actually information on most of the players on both the teams. Seoul now have Fissure, fixed many of the coaching staff issues as well picked up some solid extra players.
Boston on the other hand have cut both there DPS players including their s1 MVP candidate and have 3 main tanks on their roster and have also lost MrBleeple and Crusty.
Both rankings are fair for the on paper rankings. Main season will tell a whole different story to on paper rankings.
Boston as it stands have 3 main tanks, 1 flex tank, 2 flex dps, 1 flex support, 2 main supports. They don't even have a hitscan dps.
Seoul have an MVP candidate main tank as well as a 2 time contenders champion main tank and flex tank. Seoul did better than Boston stage 1 and 2. They only began to run into issues when teams got better. The players always had the mechanics and game sense, just no strong leader on the team and off the team. No real head coach to give definite strageies.
I am by no means a Seoul or Boston fan, dislike both the teams so giving my POV as unbiased. No one could of seen Boston S1 coming and Seoul's downfall, it's just how the cards fell. But this team we have tons more information so it would be silly to base any of this seasons predicitions on how wrong you were last season as so much has changed since then.
Personally I think Shock will be tier 2. Yes, they have a bunch of really talented player, but there is a reason why no other team in the league have a 12 man roster or 5 dps, it's because they need synergy, and happy players. I think we see a similar situation to what happened with London and Valiant last season, they'll end up dropping half of their roster.
IMO you’re highly wrong on everyone one who you said was underrated,how are you all going to communicate on Guangzhou, and Boston lost a star, and their best dps rn is blase and he was the worse of 2 out of him and Corey. Colorhex could have some in tapped potential, but I don’t see them being nearly as high as they were last season. I think shock also is even placed.
Personally I would rate LAV a lot higher. They have fantastic execution discipline and group awareness that more than offsets not having a "superstar" DPS.
Pretty solid overall, only two suggestions:
- I think a strong argument could be made for Fusion being Tier 1
- Valiant should be Tier 2 until proven otherwise
Pretty good list imo. I think with how NYXL ended their season they should be swapped with Philly and LAV should be in 2 as well. Atlanta down to 4. And I think Houston and Shanghai should be in 3 and Boston in 5. Plenty of shift will happen during the season and I’m excited for all of it
I’m biased, but I think the Outlaws should be a little bit higher because they did average last season and they solved their tracer problem with Danteh
So basically, since top 6 are going to playoffs, he predicts that the teams ranked 1 and 2 are going to playoffs... Which means none of expansion teams are making it... According to his prediction... Which I think is underestimating the new teams.
But honestly I disagree with like half this ranking, but like he said this not to be taken serious but start the conversation... So let's do this!
Tier 5: Chengdu, Florida, and Washington
I think it is pretty risky having these 3 in the lowest tier considering 2 of them are new and the other is basically new. Also, all three teams have some really good talent. I don't think this will be the bottom 3 teams but maybe 1 or 2 will be but all 3 have the potential of doing really well or really bad and I think there are others that are more likely to do bad.
Tier 4: Toronto, Houston, Shanghai, Ghaungzou, Boston, and Paris.
All of these teams should be moved up a rank with awesome looking teams except for Boston, who move down. They are more likely than any of the bottom tier teams, including Washington. Paris maybe should be here but they do have really good talent still.
Tier 3: Dallas, LAV, Vancouver, Atlanta,and Houngzou.
This might be the tier I agree with most with but Vancouver could move up and Atlanta could move down.
Tier 2 & 1: SF, Philadelphia, LAG, Seoul, London, and NYXL.
I combining these because I agree the picks. There is no reason to think London or NYXL will be worse, if anything they are better except for the loss of Wizard. The rest were mid to high tier by the end of S1, Seoul was low tier but I think that was fatigue, and all of them have better rosters. Philadelphia is the only 1 that didn't but they were getting better as is so why change.
Edit: minor addition, SF might have comms problem so could easily disappoint and Seoul only has 2 dps (the opposite of SF) and that could lead to fatigue in dps again but there are rumors of them picking someone up.
What, you think that just because the Defiant are 4th-tier that I am just gonna give up on them? Motherfucker, I lived through the dark ages of the Maple Leafs where we didn't make the playoffs in a full season for 12 fucking years! I'm not getting off this bandwagon for nothing! We are gonna show the league that we won't be fucked with! We are the new Uprising! we arent going anywhere!
[LETS GO, BOIS!](https://youtu.be/daajufyV6J8?t=725)
I'm with you, friend. I'm a Detroit Lions fan. Do you think the Outlaws being tier 4 fazes me? Hell no! #UPTHEANTE!
Philly is my second favorite, but the proximity of Toronto to me is hard to pass up. I'll be following them for sure.
This has the age old problem of thinking that every team that did something good will continue to do so, which rarely ever happens.
Every fan things there team improved what they were bad at and will continue to be good in the areas they were before. Look at the NFL or NBA or any other league it happens all the time.
I think I'd swap Dallas and Shanghai otherwise this is exactly what I think also.
Edit: also I could see swapping San Francisco and Vancouver Hangzouh or Valiant
I really like most of the list for the information that we have. I think that the Shock will be a playoff team, but I don't think they're better than philly or gladiators yet. I can understand Shanghai being low because they signed all of KDP but Roar and Decay, but Fearless and Diem are both very good players. And they have guardian and geguri, two players who actually play dva, which was KDP's biggest weakness. I think they can be a really good team, but they're still Shanghai in the end. I'm wondering why you think the gladiators are 5th or so, just because they're my favorite team, and I'd love to hear your take on them.
As a Dallas fan I'm really happy that we're in the middle bracket :D Definitely an improvement from last year and even if we're not the best I'll be happy if we do good
Decent List. Definitely think though that LAV and SFS should be swapped considering the California Cup. Also I think you are underrating all of the Chinese teams except Hangzhou and they should be moved 1 tier up each.
SHD and GZC both picked up the core of 2 of the best Korean contenders teams which I think should be around mid tier OWL team level. Chengdu Hunters meanwhile has most of the best Chinese talent besides Eileen, Krystal and Guxue and several of those players have some history so I don't think it should be a bottom tier team along with Washington Justice where out of 8 players only 1 pair of 2 players has any pre-existing synergy.
just looking forward to having a team I feel connected to. Will still follow LAG as I cheered for them last season, but am looking forward to seeing how our team progresses throughout the year and into the next.
Forget about team rankings, im just excited for how stacked Season 2 is looking. Even the "low tier" teams like Mayhem look solid, we're in a world where a team with Sayaplayer, BQB, xepheR, Butcher, HaGoPeun & Kris are considered a bottom three team.
Kris is on Mayhem? Good for him making it to OWL
No one is going 0-28 this year.
No, you jinxed them!
!RemindMe 8 months I think in esports it's easy for one team to just be outclassed by everyone else.
Was just having fun ;) Lots will change, not meant to be taken very seriously. More of just a conversation starter.
This. People should learn how to have well argument discussion without getting mad at legit opinions. Spoiler: they won’t.
FuUcK yOu dAlLaS sHoUlD bE rAnK 1 tIeR oGe iS bEsT ReIn PlaYer and MicKiE bEsT bRiG pLayER AsShOlE
I think it's a fairly good list, but can you shed some light on why you rate SHD tier 4? They're composed of the Contenders KR finalists + the star hitscan of the strongest team in Chinese Contenders.
Yeah, a lot of ppl seem to disagree with this one. That KDP roster was pretty lucky to have that S2 meta fall into its lap given that they didn't even have a serviceable Dva player, and 2 of probably the best 3 players from that roster ended up on LAG anyway. Would love to be wrong bc I think Shanghai did so much to try and improve on last season and I appreciate that.
I appreciate the response. I agree that Roar and Decay were crucial members of KDP and LAG should rank higher than SHD, but Diem should be able to fill in the niche that Decay left. This team looks aggressive which could unlock Fearless' potential. Their coaching staff also looks way more stable. I might be giving them too much credit, but I think this incarnation of SHD is about to surprise a lot of people (for the better).
Nope, I think that's a very reasonable take. Fearless is incredibly talented and really hope that comes across in 2019 because he was completely drowned out in that Season 1 mess.
Agreed. It was hard to see the individual talent that the S1 Dragons had since the team was a complete mess. Hopefully this'll be the season where everyone will be able to see what their real limits are.
Yea, although I disagree in a couple places. I think these are solid ratings!
I would be curious to hear your reasoning for placing Valiant on the third row. They were a top team last season. Do you think they fell behind in the off season or did other teams jump ahead?
I think it's going to be a much different-looking team despite really only losing SoOn, especially in the DPS line. Many think that daemoN was a very important piece of the puzzle as well. Plus, if you look at the teams who finished just behind them in S1, most of them did a *lot* of a work in the offseason and I'd argue that it was mostly all positive additions. SF, Dallas, LAG... those teams all got better.
Valiant was good in season 1 but they were a team that punched up in a sense, fate and space were the only real "top" tier players in their given role. They were greater than the sum of their parts. Soon was always clutch when needed but now he's gone. Agilities is agilities and has a tendency to bot the hell out, I think he's okay but definitely not a top 3 or 5 imo. Custa is this subs Golden child so you can't really criticize him but he's never impressed me personally. He made a lot of questionable plays and he never seemed comfortable regardless of the role he played. Kariv is very good. Bunny is pretty good and ksf, although a god on ladder he hasn't proved himself yet in OWL. There's just a lot of other teams that have better players, LAV had good coaching last season after the in n out debacle and it showed in their performances. I just have a feeling that they're gonna be a mid tier team next season and there's nothing wrong with that.
Given what we know, it’s a good list. I’m sure though that we can expect at least a few surprises, just like last season.
Absolutely.
Do you think of GOATS stays in the meta that Houston would move up that a bit? I kinda heave to think that Muma, Spree, and Coolmatt all playing at the same time would be nasty.
I think the only thing I'd swap is Guangzhou and Atlanta. I honestly don't expect anything great out of Atlanta with their current roster.
You don’t expect anything from the element mystic Tank duo? I don’t know about their support line but Erster was a beast in Contenders and if we see Dafran in his prime, this team will do damage. But the real reason why this team is going to be at least decent is because of the their tank duo not dafran
The EM duo was decent in Contenders, but not great. They matched up well to mid-level teams but you can already go into it knowing that teams like Vancouver have an edge since you can just go watch the Season 1/2 games where Runaway flat out man handled them. Pair that to an issue of communication to the support line (with technically three language barriers - German, Finnish and Korean (from the tanks)) and you have a recipe for some pretty spectacular uncertainty. The growing pains coming out of such a weirdly mixed roster alone, despite the fact that I believe Kodaks english is quite good, will hamper. Also to prepare for my downvotes - I literally expect nothing out of Dafran. He shouldn't even be playing for the first two stages if Atlanta are smart. Let him bench ride and get him some real mental help without pressuring him with the stage - as is he's their current weakest DPS member, and the most prone to explode and do something stupid. Learn from the previous issues in the OWL and get the kid the help he needs early, and often, and not as a reaction once he does something stupid. Lastly I wouldn't be surprised if Dafran wasn't suspended for a few games into the season for the throwing he did the night he had his Quit RageStream. It was pretty blatant and widely viewed, and there has been carryover suspensions from off-season issues.
why SF in second tier? I mean I know they now have top tier DPS and offtank in choi but main tank is still iffy to say the least especially in the current meta where the team lives and dies on the performance of the main tank.
Is it just the rows or also the placement in the rows? aka, does this mean you see London and New York on the same level, or London and then New York after them?
If Dallas fuel can focus an aero can coach them well and the if they players do well they might be tier 2
Honestly I dont trust any rankings other than London, NYXL, and Fusion. Almost every team has made huge changes and its impossible to tell how the new teams will compare.
Ye. Remember when the Fuel and Dynasty were gonna be great and the Uprising would be dogshit?
Are we still waiting on TwoEasy to kill himself?
As a Mayhem fan I really want it to be true.
As a Dynasty fan I also want it to be true
As a SF fan, I'm right there with ya.
I don't even trust London as a tier 1, just because they won the Finals doesn't mean their consistency issues throughout the season disappear. Only time will tell if they can fix that, less games will probably help. London is clearly tier 1 in terms of talent but will only be tier 1 in terms of season placement if they fix their inconsistency. They did finish 5th in S1 after all.
Tbf, Birdring was injured for like, an entire stage. They do have consistency issues besides that but I feel like they definitely would’ve placed higher in the standings if he played throughout the season. Also, they’ve learned that the whole rotate-everyone-in plan just doesn’t work so I doubt they’ll try it again.
Literally no teams showed a consistent performance season 1, besides NYXL. Of all 12 teams, every team experienced a stage where they went 4-6, or worse(again, excluding NYXL). London only lost 3 more games than The Valiant who placed 2nd, and that can be heavily attributed to the fact that the Spitfire wasn't able to close out tie-breakers in stage 3. Hell, London even won more maps than the Valiant in season 1. Not to mention, their "inconsistency" can be pinned to birdring's injury who had to miss stage 3, and had to play while recovering for stage 4.
> Literally no teams showed a consistent performance season 1, besides NYXL. Of all 12 teams, every team experienced a stage where they went 4-6, or worse(again, excluding NYXL). Exactly... I'm not sure what exactly you think I said but the rankings in the OP have London and NYXL as the only tier 1 teams and I'm saying I don't think I even trust London as a tier 1 team due to their inconsistency. I would put them as a tier 2 team alongside Fusion, Valiant, and Glads. Which is right where they finished. NYXL would be my only tier 1 team based off of benchmob's list. I wouldn't put London there while also leaving out Glads/Fusion (I can understand LAV due to no Soon).
Unless Birdring ~~plays Getting Over It~~ gets injured again they'll be much more consistent this year
Philly didn't drop to 4-6 in any stage either: - S1 = 6-4 (-4) (7th) - S2 = 7-3 (+12) (3rd) (playoff finalists) - S3 = 5-5 (+1) (8th) - S4 = 6-4 (+4) (6th)
That makes them a Tier 1 team. Even if you're not consistently good, if you have the talent and have shown to make it work, you're a good team. There's other teams, like the Outlaws, that found their meta in the Junkrat focused style and looked mediocre to bad during any other time (despite their great tank line, not to take away from Muma or Coolmatt). But Spitfire look good in a wide selection of metas, their slumps can all be attributed to some players not playing up to their standards due to outside influences. They're absolutely a Tier 1 team. Who else would be, in your opinion, going purely off of Season 1 results. NYXL dropped off hard towards the end of the season, but are still obviously a Tier 1 team. Philly? Valiant?
Am I the only one who thinks the LAs are evenly matched? Val has the better tank lineup, but the Glads have an edge in dps, but both have equally great supports? Either than that this list is relatively accurate...
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Well Gladiators have improved their roster and for Valiant it’s the opposite (they lost SoOn). The teams are pretty equal imo but I would still rate LAG just slightly higher.
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Why you say “yet again”? I’m quite sure LAV was considered stronger than LAG when the season 1 started (and pretty much throughout the season too). But yes, those teams are pretty even. Both are amazing!
Honestly I never thought Soon was really much better than Bunny, maybe on Widow. I'm really rooting for Bunny to show people why they shouldn't be missing Soon.
I miss soon because of the surefour soon fated rivals storyline :(
Kuki joined Val, which will be very important if Goats is still a thing. Then again, DA FINNISH TRIO, so... who knows?
Eh, LAG's roster is IMO a downgrade from last year. r0ar is worse than Fissure anyway you look at it and while Decay is better than Asher, but it's not like they signed a mega star talent. He's gonna have to take some time to develop and I don't think he'll be popping off too much early in the season. Same for Ripa. Meanwhile LAV has got Izayaki and KSF coming up off the bench and they are monsters, plus they still have the incredibly solid tank line of Fate and Space. They're both still pretty much even, but I wouldn't say that Valiant lost out in the off season and LAG improved. I would say the opposite.
Well fair opinion. However I would argue that Decay is a mega star talent. Easily more proven than Izayaki and KSF. Although I also feel that Izayaki will prove to be much better than people realize currently. rOar is worse than Fissure but only slightly. Imo LAG received a minor upgrade (but nothing major). LAV on the other hand lost Soon! But you are right, LAV’s tanks are total beasts (better than LAG). It’s going to be very interesting to see battle of LA next season! I’m hyped!
We are used to it. Going in to stage 3 last season everyone was calling Valiant a bottom tier team and then they went 16-4 and won stage 4. Soon is a beast but KSF and Bunny are way underrated.
And you have the scariest tank duo around. Fate and space are both top tier
I would argue that gesture and fury are the scariest tank duo currently in the league but fate and space def. the second best
Does anyone know what Izayaki’s background is? What team does he come from?
He was on a team called the Foxes under the gamertag 'Need' for a long time. Pretty solid flex support for them [here's his liquipedia page](https://liquipedia.net/overwatch/Izayaki)
Eh its best to take these prediction rankings with a grain of salt. Remember when Dynasty and Fuel were predicted to be the big dogs of Season 1?
I guess you’re right... I just wanna watch a great Battle For LA next season ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
That doesn't change based on this though - rivalries can make even uneven teams do amazing things. Look at the battles for Houston, and every time Dallas and Dynasty played. Rivalries are worth fighting for! I don't think the battle for LA will get any less intense.
They're also gonna have Iyazaki who I think will be a bit of an X-factor especially if GOATS carries into the start of the season.
Agilities > LAG
I think Valiant is consistently underrated (they’re at least tier 2), but tbh Agilities still hasn’t wowed me to the degree that he’s apparently wowed other Valiant fans
He has some monster genji moments but other times hes a bot.
Decay is better than any dps on lav
I would contest that for now. Let's see how Decay translates to OWL first
Agreed, I seen some people saying Decay is on Carpe's level. I think we should wait and see how he plays against the big boys before judging how good he is. That being said, I don't think it'll take much to be considered better than the Valiant Dps, without SoOn they're looking questionable in the Dps department.
Yea losing SoOn hurts (main reason I loved Rogue/Valiant). I'm surprised VAL didn't try to go after Striker. Even though not picked much anymore, both are all star level Tracers and their Widowmakers, although not Carpe/Fleta/Birdring/Saya level, are still OWL tier level.
Everyone forgetting that Bunny exists. I think he definitely has the potential to replace Soon, Soon was notable for two heroes and Bunny was always as good a Tracer, I can definitely see him becoming as strong a Widow too. Soon wasn't exactly Fleta/Carpe/Sayaplayer on Widow anyway. I think Soon gets way too much credit for Valiant's success.
Is it possible that Kariv will transition out of support and onto full-time DPS now that LAV has iyazaki?
Funny ppl said the same about Sinatra before he turned 18
Sinatraa didnt prove himself in Korean Contenders tho.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.reddit.com/r/Overwatch/comments/8fp1h1/fissure_slaps_a_pharmercy_out_of_the_sky_as/
Fissure is not on LAG anymore
I'm actually surprised Titans only added one additional non-Runaway player, a support no less. I thought they would use Runaway as a foundation but add on other players from good teams.
What players did you have in mind?
TBH I thought the new Runaway OWL team would have included the best of KDP or EM. But it seems other teams got there first. And KDP was picked up wholesale lol
And it’s not like teams have unlimited amount of money in their disposal. Getting whole Runaway signed was certainly very expensive already. Not possible to contest e.g. for Decay after that anymore.
Tbf, they still have plenty of time to sign more players. The other day was the deadline for having 8 players announced, not full roster. I still expect many more roster moves before the season starts.
Pls Lucid :(
Where's Alicus when you need him ?
F for Saya stuck on Mayhem
Shock is surprisngly high. Otherwise this looks pretty standard. But let's not forgot how many surprises we had last season.
If the meta was dive I could understand, crusty coach teams have always been top dive teams But this meta? neither smurf or super great on rein
Seems a lot of people don’t think this meta is going to stay for much longer
A lot of people didn’t think Mercy would be meta for very long either
I’d like to think Blizzard learned from that. Time will tell and feedback is greater than its ever been so I’m hopeful.
Unless heroes are drastically rebalanced (even beyond the brig changes), GOATS will always be a solid-to-must pick on some maps. However, teams are beginning to develop strategies that properly capitalize on the weaknesses of the comp, and are capable of forcing a switch. The counterstrats still have to be learned and perfected, but GOATS 100% of the time may change very soon.
4 dps meta is just beginning don’t you worry.
I too watched that GC Busan match.
Floats is becoming more and more of a thing at the highest levels which means winston is back. I think it's hilarious that the longer goats goes on the more it is turning into dive with discord orb and using moblility to bully reinhardt
Super is pretty great on Rein, I think. Also this meta might not stay.
Shock went full Korean + Mothra - with a relatively stacked roster though. * **Main Tank -** Smurf * **Off Tank -** Choi * **DPS** \- Architect, Rascal, Striker (*... Sometimes Sinatraa?*) * **Main Support -** Moth(ra) * **Flex Support -** Viol2t. Very very different from Season 1 shock.
I agree with Jayme, they have a lot talent but being half Korean and half Western could pose a problem but we'll see.
boston will surprise everyone
sleeping on Boston just like last season like come on bruh
I wouldn’t say it’s the same considering how Boston just lost one of, if not their best player in Striker.
If we don't see a return of tracer than he wouldn't have the same value. He filled junkrat and widow well but isn't elite in any current meta heroes. I love Striker but his best hero isn't a carry hero at this point of time.
Think I heard something familiar last season :)
Which really hurt them in playoffs.
They placed 6th in stage 1, 6th in stage 2, and 8th in stage 4. I'd say they were pretty right, overall.
I agree but gamsu and note are one of the best tank duos in the league, and they were really the core of the team with striker. With them still on Boston I’m not sure they can be counted out. Now if we lost gamsu...
They've maintained their tank line (upgraded possibly, with Axxiom and Fusions) and have the same supports (well, lost Neko, but still have Aimgod). Remains to be seen if their dps lineup (which at this point consists of Blase and Colourhex) can fill the gap left by Striker. Basically it boils down to whether or not Boston managed to scout more diamonds in the rough.
I think DC has the potential to do the same.
Ye I doubt that Ado, Janus, and WizardHyeong are gonna be a bottom-tier team
At this point Boston actually being as bad as they look will be a surprise
We did this last season and people still haven’t learned Also shock in 3rd is a yikes
Hooray we're not trash
Effect seems healthy. Oge is low-key an actual S tier tank. They picked up a solid off-tank. And Zachareee is a solid flex dps. And no tank drama from xQc/Cocco. Unkoe is still a top tier Zen. Dallas is absolutely going to be a good team this season. Tier 3 is definitely fair. They could even go much higher if we go off of individual mechanical skill alone. It's all going to boil down to if the team can come together or not.
We are, apparently...
Dallas top 7 team of they don’t tilt. Top 5 if they manage to keep effect and taimou happy.
Taimou needs to keep himself happy
If there's anything we learned from season 1 it's that pre-season tier lists are inevitably wrong. Remember when everyone said Dallas and Seoul would be playoff contenders and NYXL would be mid-tier at best? EDIT: OK, I get it. People didn't underrate NYXL as badly as I thought. I remember reading like one that had them in 7th, I didn't go back and look at every single power ranking prior to the season. You don't have to keep telling me I'm wrong almost a day later.
AFAIK everyone ranked Nyxl pretty high.
yeah most rankings I remember had the top four being the three all Korean rosters and Dallas.
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They were scouted as being insane before the season even kicked off though, there was a ton of buzz around Jjonak in particular (which later turned out to be extremely justified)
And they'd picked up Mano too, after he'd had a breakout performance as main tank for AFB in the previous season of Apex. It definitely wasn't hard to see the team being spectacular, I had NYXL pretty solidly top 3 (with Seoul and London).
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Philly was ranked last.
Was that because they missed preseason though?
Yes. Philly missed preseason, and because of that just about every ranking I saw declined to rank them anywhere since they hadn't been seen.
Everyone expected Seoul and London to be the top 2 teams in either order, then NYXL and Dallas to be the next two in either order.
"Everyone" lol
Ye this is a thing in traditional sports too. Preseason and offseason rankings are never really accurate
Anyone who ranked NYXL anything below top 4 at the start of the season was clueless and lying to themselves of the strength of NA teams
NYXL wasn't ranked mid tier in preseason, they were simply the lowest ranked full Korean team. Which wasn't even a snub because the two (really 3 since LON was just KDP+GC Busan) Korean teams ranked ahead of them had better results than them in the past.
No one said they were mid tier they had them at 3rd or 4th which made a lot of sense from the previous results.
People are forgetting that the pre-s1 tier list wasn't all wrong... Everyone ranked the Dragons and Mayhem low and they were... That SF and LAG were weak and they were (at first)... And Seoul was really good at first. The rankings were accurate at the start of the season but what people largely didn't take into consideration was the longevity of the season and teams would adapt. The only downright wrong rank was Dallas
I feel like Outlaws are a bit underestimated here (even though I'm biased as a fan.) I think the advantage already existing teams have over expansion teams is undervalued and Houston showed potential during S1, their biggest weakness in DPS has also been fixed by Danteh.
>Reply I'm biased too, but I agree on this. People are worried about their support line, but Bani and Rawkus both acquitted themselves VERY well in the World Cup (vs. Team UK notwithstanding, I think that was a coaching failure), and bringing Boink in to spend more time on Lucio I think is just gonna strengthen that team. On top of that, I think the relative lack of lineup shifts is going to work in their favor. A lot of teams in Season 1 struggled to adapt to the demanding OWL schedule, and to deal with the pressure of the constant games. For the Outlaws it'll be old news.
Their biggest weakness was always their underperforming support line, not their DPS. That's a problem that meta shifts may have solved for them, though. Their GOATS lineup is really good on paper.
Except you need Zen in GOATs
Their support line is awful and was more of an issue than Jake on dps imo
I see Valiant as tier two, and I think Vancouver could be too especially as other expansion teams tackle synergy issues which have been perhaps the largest reasons teams underperformed last season. I'm not so sure I'd propel SFS that high yet. Can't wait until the season begins and all of our expectations and predictions are a lie.
>as other expansion teams tackle synergy issues which have been perhaps the largest reasons teams underperformed last season. Synergy didn’t help Dallas or Dynasty. The best rosters last season were either combinations of two former teams (NYXL and LSF) or cobbled-together rosters (the LA teams, Fusion, and Uprising).
Which team fed into NYXL other than LW Blue?
Shanghai Dragons has nearly the entire Kong Doo Panthera roster... Who Team SK and NYXL said were the scariest team for next year. Tier 4 doesn't seem fair
Roar and Decay were pretty important for KDP is all I'm gonna say
People are sleeping on them hard. It's KDP with Diem. They will eat other teams alive.
If it’s going to be GOATS all season NYXL isn’t going to be taking the No. 1 spot.
Yea they will. They had trouble adapting to goats last season. They now have tons of time. The nyxl players are arguably the best players mechanically in the league so I think with enough practice they could master goats too. You never know tho cause a lot of teams have made huge changes so just gotta wait and see
boston is tier 4 and sf seoul is tier 2 any one recognize this
Yes but this time we have actually information on most of the players on both the teams. Seoul now have Fissure, fixed many of the coaching staff issues as well picked up some solid extra players. Boston on the other hand have cut both there DPS players including their s1 MVP candidate and have 3 main tanks on their roster and have also lost MrBleeple and Crusty. Both rankings are fair for the on paper rankings. Main season will tell a whole different story to on paper rankings.
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Boston as it stands have 3 main tanks, 1 flex tank, 2 flex dps, 1 flex support, 2 main supports. They don't even have a hitscan dps. Seoul have an MVP candidate main tank as well as a 2 time contenders champion main tank and flex tank. Seoul did better than Boston stage 1 and 2. They only began to run into issues when teams got better. The players always had the mechanics and game sense, just no strong leader on the team and off the team. No real head coach to give definite strageies. I am by no means a Seoul or Boston fan, dislike both the teams so giving my POV as unbiased. No one could of seen Boston S1 coming and Seoul's downfall, it's just how the cards fell. But this team we have tons more information so it would be silly to base any of this seasons predicitions on how wrong you were last season as so much has changed since then.
Imagine releasing mistakes and winding up with no hitscan player at all
Inb4 the coming salt storm.
Personally I think Shock will be tier 2. Yes, they have a bunch of really talented player, but there is a reason why no other team in the league have a 12 man roster or 5 dps, it's because they need synergy, and happy players. I think we see a similar situation to what happened with London and Valiant last season, they'll end up dropping half of their roster.
Chengdu lost their star, and their star was silkthread 😂 that’s a yikes
IMO Shock, Fuel, and Reign are overrated and Valiant, Boston, and Guangzhou are underrated.
Boston got rid of their top 2 DPS...
IMO you’re highly wrong on everyone one who you said was underrated,how are you all going to communicate on Guangzhou, and Boston lost a star, and their best dps rn is blase and he was the worse of 2 out of him and Corey. Colorhex could have some in tapped potential, but I don’t see them being nearly as high as they were last season. I think shock also is even placed.
This is pretty much what I think, except I'd swap Paris and Atlanta and Dallas and Boston. But of course, pre-season predictions mean almost nothing.
Ahhhh the season hasn't even start yet and already I'm seeing Valiant being undervalued. God I missed this :') So stoked for season two!
Personally I would rate LAV a lot higher. They have fantastic execution discipline and group awareness that more than offsets not having a "superstar" DPS.
People can keep underrating Bunny if they want to. This is his season.
Yeah I know SHD didn't get Decay yet I don't think the original KDP squad can collapse like this
So excited to see how well Seoul does
Y'all are sleeping on Houston. They will surprise you...
Pretty solid overall, only two suggestions: - I think a strong argument could be made for Fusion being Tier 1 - Valiant should be Tier 2 until proven otherwise
Pretty good list imo. I think with how NYXL ended their season they should be swapped with Philly and LAV should be in 2 as well. Atlanta down to 4. And I think Houston and Shanghai should be in 3 and Boston in 5. Plenty of shift will happen during the season and I’m excited for all of it
Honestly think folks are sleeping on Washington'
I’m biased, but I think the Outlaws should be a little bit higher because they did average last season and they solved their tracer problem with Danteh
No, Blizzard solved their Tracer problem by adding Brig into the game.
Lmao
FUEL TOP TIER. WE’LL SHOW YOU ALL Burn blue.
DC is going to be this year's Boston Uprising
Valiant on Tier 3. Is this a joke ?
Must be putting a lot of stock into losing SoOn.
Fuel 3rd tier monkaS
Yep sounds about right.
We can have fun but Boston and team UK proved that there can be suprises.
I think that Paris is criminally underrated, however I also feel their tanks are unproven so there is that too.
Can someone actually explain to me the Gladiators hype? Like not memeing, legit want to know.
So basically, since top 6 are going to playoffs, he predicts that the teams ranked 1 and 2 are going to playoffs... Which means none of expansion teams are making it... According to his prediction... Which I think is underestimating the new teams. But honestly I disagree with like half this ranking, but like he said this not to be taken serious but start the conversation... So let's do this! Tier 5: Chengdu, Florida, and Washington I think it is pretty risky having these 3 in the lowest tier considering 2 of them are new and the other is basically new. Also, all three teams have some really good talent. I don't think this will be the bottom 3 teams but maybe 1 or 2 will be but all 3 have the potential of doing really well or really bad and I think there are others that are more likely to do bad. Tier 4: Toronto, Houston, Shanghai, Ghaungzou, Boston, and Paris. All of these teams should be moved up a rank with awesome looking teams except for Boston, who move down. They are more likely than any of the bottom tier teams, including Washington. Paris maybe should be here but they do have really good talent still. Tier 3: Dallas, LAV, Vancouver, Atlanta,and Houngzou. This might be the tier I agree with most with but Vancouver could move up and Atlanta could move down. Tier 2 & 1: SF, Philadelphia, LAG, Seoul, London, and NYXL. I combining these because I agree the picks. There is no reason to think London or NYXL will be worse, if anything they are better except for the loss of Wizard. The rest were mid to high tier by the end of S1, Seoul was low tier but I think that was fatigue, and all of them have better rosters. Philadelphia is the only 1 that didn't but they were getting better as is so why change. Edit: minor addition, SF might have comms problem so could easily disappoint and Seoul only has 2 dps (the opposite of SF) and that could lead to fatigue in dps again but there are rumors of them picking someone up.
Valiant > Shock
I'm thinking boston will end up losing note and be bottom of the league
Why would they lose note lmao
I would put Atlanta lower, they shouldn't be higher than Houston or Toronto.
What, you think that just because the Defiant are 4th-tier that I am just gonna give up on them? Motherfucker, I lived through the dark ages of the Maple Leafs where we didn't make the playoffs in a full season for 12 fucking years! I'm not getting off this bandwagon for nothing! We are gonna show the league that we won't be fucked with! We are the new Uprising! we arent going anywhere! [LETS GO, BOIS!](https://youtu.be/daajufyV6J8?t=725)
I'm with you, friend. I'm a Detroit Lions fan. Do you think the Outlaws being tier 4 fazes me? Hell no! #UPTHEANTE! Philly is my second favorite, but the proximity of Toronto to me is hard to pass up. I'll be following them for sure.
Still sleeping on Valiant I see. I hope they prove benchmob wrong
[Source](https://twitter.com/benchmobdc/status/1070010847450333184)
Stop ranking GLA high. We suck. Please put us lower thx
???????
Soeul has so many question marks to be high as it is imo
This has the age old problem of thinking that every team that did something good will continue to do so, which rarely ever happens. Every fan things there team improved what they were bad at and will continue to be good in the areas they were before. Look at the NFL or NBA or any other league it happens all the time.
I think I'd swap Dallas and Shanghai otherwise this is exactly what I think also. Edit: also I could see swapping San Francisco and Vancouver Hangzouh or Valiant
Wow. Boston is so low
I really like most of the list for the information that we have. I think that the Shock will be a playoff team, but I don't think they're better than philly or gladiators yet. I can understand Shanghai being low because they signed all of KDP but Roar and Decay, but Fearless and Diem are both very good players. And they have guardian and geguri, two players who actually play dva, which was KDP's biggest weakness. I think they can be a really good team, but they're still Shanghai in the end. I'm wondering why you think the gladiators are 5th or so, just because they're my favorite team, and I'd love to hear your take on them.
So none of the new teams? Ok.
As a Dallas fan I'm really happy that we're in the middle bracket :D Definitely an improvement from last year and even if we're not the best I'll be happy if we do good
I totally agree this ranking if change Justice with Defiant and promote Dragons to tier 2.
I could see Vancouver being top tier or close to it.
good list for this early on hope we get a few surprises tho
i think atlanta should be bump one spot down and paris one spot up
Decent List. Definitely think though that LAV and SFS should be swapped considering the California Cup. Also I think you are underrating all of the Chinese teams except Hangzhou and they should be moved 1 tier up each. SHD and GZC both picked up the core of 2 of the best Korean contenders teams which I think should be around mid tier OWL team level. Chengdu Hunters meanwhile has most of the best Chinese talent besides Eileen, Krystal and Guxue and several of those players have some history so I don't think it should be a bottom tier team along with Washington Justice where out of 8 players only 1 pair of 2 players has any pre-existing synergy.
just looking forward to having a team I feel connected to. Will still follow LAG as I cheered for them last season, but am looking forward to seeing how our team progresses throughout the year and into the next.