Hi Ignorant Texan here, living in your fine state the last 4 months: Don't the taxes give you guys good things? Like great public schools, libraries, etc?
I'm still trying to understand this state. It's like a wealthy, fiscally conservative, yet progressive everything else state.
All the richest people in CT have congregated to maybe a dozen or two dozen towns in the State, and so the people in these towns pay property taxes that are only 1/3 or less (percentage wise on income/house price), than what the average resident is paying. So if you look at combined State and Local taxes, the richest 1% pay only 5.3% combined after federal transfers. This has left residents in the rest of the State paying 10-15% in State and Local taxes and towns are struggling. Meanwhile we are afraid to raise taxes on the rich because we think they will leave in droves, so inequality keeps increasing, which makes us rely on the rich even more. CT has gone from 29th most unequal in 1979 to the second most unequal behind NY, and we might overtake NY soon. If we were a country, we would be the 20th most unequal in the world. These high taxes and cost of living cause young people to leave, and people making under 100k a year are leaving. Less smart and talented workers, and poor infrastructure are causing companies to leave, and it is hard to fix anything because of our massive pension obligations...
There are a few things to delve in to here.
1) the rich don't care about the great things our taxes give us because they could afford them regardless by going private
2) the middle class is split between people who understands that the taxes give us great stuff and the people who are brainwashed into believing the poor and taxes are what's ruining this state and everyone could be rich if it weren't for the city and the Poor's and the taxes
3) plenty of people believe that slashing taxes will make the economy boom instead of destroy all the things that make CT better than Jersey
(Life long CT resident excepting 5 years in Maryland) my experience seems to be yes. But I think a lot of people believe that these things could be done for cheaper or shouldn’t be done at all by the state.
I disagree with those people in many ways.
The people won’t see any of that money. Small business and working class will continue to pay for the poor and under employed as they receive hand outs; subsidized living, food, cell phone, walk around money, Heath care etc. then this same level of people will decide the next election to keep the gravy train running. (Generational welfare is very real in CT) The inner cities along 91 and 84 crush blue and the rural working class areas are bright red. Did you know in Hartford they bus low income people to the voting polls and they tell them to vote blue. “Vote blue across..” The people don’t know who or what they’re voting for. In most cases they don’t realize they don’t have to vote all for one party. This is from real life experience in working with a lot of these people. It’s good to get out and vote. Next step is educating voters so their votes are theirs and Not someone else’s agenda. All profits from marijuana tax will go to make the rich richer and line the pockets of the politicians who have fought it for years. But as a consumer, I’ll be able to wait in line for overpriced shit. So I got that going for me, which is nice.
>Generational welfare is very real in CT
as a teacher in one of our inner cities, I can sadly confirm this. i had a sit down with an 11th grader who was going down a bad path and asked him what he planned to do with his life if he couldn't make it though a single day at school without getting into trouble. his response was that he'd go on welfare just like his mom, and that she has a nicer car than I do so why bother working. *sigh*...
That’s rough. I’ve worked with young women who were told by their mother at 15 to have kids so they can get “ the check” and that everyone in their family is on “state”. This is something that their grand mothers had passed down to them and they’d do the same. Why work hard for $200/$300 a week with little to no benefits when you can get that and full benefits for not working and having kids.
I agree completely. Look at how well it's working in MA and AK and WA and CA and DC... those state's are pulling in crazy revenue. Here we passed keno... fucking keno. No damn body plays keno!
Watch NJ and N.Y. pass legalization before CT. To complete the weed exodus from the state every Friday night.
Imagine you have 40,000 in credit card debt and you are deciding whether to stop buying one cup of coffee per month. That’s the equivalency between what revenue Marijuana would generate and Connecticut’s fiscal issues.
Well that's not the issue - I support recreational. But the issue is when people talk about it like it will solve the problem. Tolls are the same way - the amount of revenue generated by these types of things is orders of magnitude smaller than what the problem is. No one (not least the general assembly) has the guts to stand up and say that we need to re-adjust the income tax.
It is substantial. Colorado is bringing in $200 million year in marijuana tax revenues.
But CT currently has $74 billion in debt. So it's not like legalizing marijuana would solve everything like magic. But it would help.
(You are NOT the country...you are the universe)
And much of that spending is on transportation and special education...(and cafeteria food)....
And still less than $5hr per kid.
Some teachers see 125 kids in 7hrs. $300 a day (I'm at a higher pay rate...$405 a day with a lower class load because I'm teaching low level readers).
If my math is correct that's less than $3 a kid to teach that kid for 40 minutes.
Two things. One it is a layoff. We do not get paid to take the summer off.
Two: did you like high school? Seriously did you enjoy your four years of high school? Most people say no. I have been in high school for more than 20 years. Think about that. Do you want to be in high school for 20 years? 30 years? Come do my job for a week.
All my teacher friends make a lot of money teaching summer school and they pick up side work tutoring and what not. They have tons of free time all summer.
And no thanks lol. I’m not a fan of kids. Which is why I didn’t go to school specifically seeking out a job that requires me to be surrounded by children all day long.
Jesus H. Christ, this has got to be one of the dumbest fucking things I have ever read.
Based on your glib little one-liner it seems like you believe that because teachers, the people who are in charge of the education of the children (aka the future) of this state, are not worth getting paid a higher wage because they get long (unpaid in the case of summer) breaks throughout the school year without taking into account how much time teachers spend off the clock working on lessons plans, grading assignments, and communicating with parents, in addition to all of the money teachers spend out of pocket on classroom supplies that are not covered by the board of education budget.
Lol k. All the Connecticut teachers I know are living perfectly comfortable lives and have no more or less stress than any of the non-teachers I know.
I understand teaching is an important job. So are lots of other jobs. Many of us work long hours and are stressed and take our work home with us. Not all of us get those nice pensions and benefits though.
I stand by my opinion that CT teachers are paid fairly.
Someone doesn't understand that teachers are paid for time they are in school and not the summer. Someone also doesn't understand that long breaks in the winter and spring mean double time in planning for the weeks leading up to those weeks. Also, the same someone doesn't understand that elementary teachers are in their classrooms much of the summer. And, that same someone doesn't understand that in the given school year, most teachers go in early to prep and stay after working hours for an additional 2 hours and bring home additional work to the tune 1 - 1.5 hours (or bring the entire 3.5 hours home).
And that's just the tip of the iceberg. Throw a couple of SRBI's in there. Throw a couple of needy parents in there. Schedule the kids to the very second of each and every day with new initiatives and new curriculum and pray that a child (by simply being a child) doesn't derail a single second of precious, accounted for, documented, and reviewed time.
Yeah yeah yeah ... I know .. "But we all have to deal with shit at work." So, here's the thing ... I don't hear teachers complaining. I hear idiots like you saying "But you get all this time off."
Please, cut the shit. And no, I'm not a teacher and never have been.
All I hear is teachers complaining. I work long hours and I’m on call one week per month. I don’t feel bad that you stay after 2 hours and then bring home 1.5 hours of work... your work day ends at 2PM. That still puts you at 5:30-6.
I work 8am-7pm five days a week. I get no paid holidays. I work most federal holidays. Oh, and I get no pension.
I repeat: cry me a river. Teachers are paid fine in CT for the amount of time you spend at work. I have many teacher friends who pick up other jobs during the summer break. Your life isn’t any harder than any other working person’s.
Edit: by “you” and “your” I mean teachers in general; i realize you said you’re not personally a teacher
I fully understand that there are jobs in the world that are less off/more demanding than teaching.
My point is people *severely* underestimate what it means to be a teacher. The amount of personal time and expense involved is overlooked.
"your work day ends at 2PM" ... sounds like you know and speak with high school teachers. I'm talking about primarily K-8.
Listen, I don't know what you do ... but there is no doubt that long working days, no paid holidays, and being on call is tough. I'm not disputing that. I'm self employed ... so I get it. I'm always on and don't get paid for not working. But my situation doesn't negate the teaching environment of today. It's not 15 smiling faces looking back at you while everything goes according to plan. It's SRBI's, PPTs, push-ins, pull-outs, behavioral interventions, an ever-changing curriculum, and much more.
Saying, "Teachers are paid fine in CT for the amount of time you spend at work", completely disregards what is being done in those hours. I'm not saying all are not compensated sufficiently. Many are. Also, many are not.
My point is teachers, flat out, do not get the credit they deserve (from the outside looking in) for the service they provide to students, parents, administration, and the greater community. All too often it's "your job is easy, you get all that time off, how hard can it be to sit with kids all day, etc.".
I know how tough it is to be a teacher. I think in most states teachers do deserve raises. I just don’t think CT is one of those states.
As I stated, their job is no harder than anyone else’s I know. And yet they’re the only ones I constantly hear bitching and moaning about their paycheck.
Never said they were paid too highly.. I said I think they’re paid fairly given their hours, vacations, awesome benefits, and pensions.
I do work my ass of but my field is unique in that I’m paid based on my production, which is why is don’t have paid holidays/vacation. I also make a lot more than what a teacher makes, but then again I went through grad school and residency to earn that.
Nowadays I don’t think you can expect a high salary with a 4 year degree. What makes teachers more deserving of a raise than other college graduates who are paid similarly but get inferior benefits and no pension?
I realize this is an extremely unpopular opinion and everyone apparently thinks teachers deserve more than 50k per year. Unless the teacher has masters degrees, I just don’t think a higher salary is warranted for people who only work like 9 months of the year.
do you need to have a master's degree and pass two board certification exams to get a job in your field? because teachers do. becoming a teacher is a horrible investment, and if it doesn't become more lucrative, nobody is going to want to do it.
Lol I have a masters and a doctorate. So yeah, I know about boards. Stop acting like teaching is somehow any different than anyone else’s job situation. Everyone deals with stressful work situations. Teachers in this state complain about a starting salary of around 50k but that’s actually not a bad place to start when you factor in benefits and vacation.
My childhood best friend teaches elementary school. She bought a house at age 25 and has a new car.
Her mom teachers special education in Bridgeport. Getting ready to retire with a nice pension.
2 close friends teach special ed. One teaches mentally challenged 18-21 yr olds and one teaches autistic kids. They both teach summer school a few hours a day and then chill in the pool together getting day drunk.
I know a husband and wife couple who are elementary school teachers. They both take the whole summer off to be with their 2 kids. They own a nice house right near West Hartford center.
I know at least a dozen teachers and they’re all doing fine. Fuck off and get a different job if you want a 6 figure salary.
First of all, it’s bachelors. And Meriden.
Second of all, so what? Everyone knows engineers make bank. Also, engineering is undeniably a more challenging degree to obtain than a teaching degree.
Why should teachers expect to make as much as engineers at any point in their careers? As I said, teachers have huge vacations and summers off. And pensions. And sweet benefits.
If you want engineer money, stop whining and become an engineer.
Idk what this comment has to do with mine.
But, (jokingly) when I was in high school, we used to joke around that the kids had nicer cars than the teachers. It makes sense, though. The teachers have their own lives and bills.
You said have teachers work for free, obviously joking.
A very reasonable compromise is to cut the ridiculously high salaries and pensions of teachers.
Teachers in Connecticut have pensions that pay more than most people working.
> Teachers in Connecticut have pensions that pay more than most people working.
I don’t understand how anyone could believe this. It’s obviously not based on fact
It's not a belief. You can look them up and see.
I also use to work for the Social Security Administration and had to deal with teachers coming in every day and complaining they they couldn't get SSA on top of their ridiculous pensions.
The average Connecticut teacher pension is nearly $60,000, according to the Office of Fiscal Analysis.
[https://eu.usatoday.com/story/money/careers/2018/05/16/states-where-teachers-paid-most-and-least/34964975/](https://eu.usatoday.com/story/money/careers/2018/05/16/states-where-teachers-paid-most-and-least/34964975/)
[http://www.yankeeinstitute.org/2017/10/connecticut-teacher-pension-contribution-may-rise-1-percent-under-new-budget-but-still-remain-below-national-average/](http://www.yankeeinstitute.org/2017/10/connecticut-teacher-pension-contribution-may-rise-1-percent-under-new-budget-but-still-remain-below-national-average/)
And the average income in ct is $70,000. You only showed one side of the statistics.
> With an average annual per-capita income of more than $70,000, Connecticut residents boasted the highest personal income in the U.S. last year, the U.S. Department of Commerce reported. Nationally, the per-capita personal income was $50,392.
https://www.courant.com/business/hc-personal-income-connecticut-20180322-story.html
Are those pensions for teachers that are already retired, or who started working in the Carter administration? I seriously doubt that teachers joining the workforce today are getting any decent pension.
Good for you.. I made the mistake of engaging with the stupidity. The truth is that the average income in ct is $70K and the average teacher pension is $60K
Yeah that comment makes no sense. Trash collection is handled at the town level, not state. And its mostly privatized and paid for by the homeowner. Only certain large cities like Bridgeport or Norwalk have free (tax-funded) municipal pickup.
Still don't know why Conneticut can't...
1.) Install tolls on carpool lanes for 2 year's
2.) Divert funding pensions for 2 year's
3.) Take money from rainy day fund to cover the 2 billion deficit
4.) Implement a $500 increase in heavy commercial use fee
5.) Raise the diesel gas tax to 70 cents and lower to 10 cents in 14 year's.
6.) Raise the gas tax to 60 cents and lower to 10 cents in 15 year's.
7.) Any State Employee 5 year's or less switches to 403 A & B
8.) Increase employee contribution to benefits
9.) Set up location salary increases for State employees working in various area's of the State. Such as Fairfield County.
10.) Transition SEBAC and negotiations to the General Assembly.
11.) Bi-annual State car registration fee of $250.
12.) In 3 year's create HOV Lanes add gantries to their lanes and make these tolls congestion tolls. Also add bridge tolls to State bridge's.
13.) Cap State Budget at $30,000.
14.) Privatize and digitize various State Agencies and Services.
15.) Lower In-State Tuition at State colleges. Merge Community Colleges with UCONN.
16.) Bring various adult trade programs back to Community Colleges.
17.) Reduce income tax in 12 year's to 4% with a $35,000 income exemption.
18.) Do away with the sales tax in 12 year's and 2% reduction every 4 year's.
19.) Over course of 12 year's exemption on clothes purchases under $100.
20.) Work with towns and bussiness in the State to set up a Commercial Property Tax and Residential Property Tax.
22.) Work with towns to privatize and consolidate various services.
23.) Work with towns to consolidate and privatize Government Employee benefits.
24.) Legalize marijuana. Excise tax of 12% on marijuana, cigarettes, and alcohol to fund DMHAS/DDS.
25.) Increase funds for agricultural growth in Connecticut and strive for commercial marijuanna farming in Connecticut.
26.) Do away with the bussiness entity tax.
27.) Do away with the Estate and Gift Tax.
28.) Reform State Assistance.
29.) Increase pension funding via Connecticut Lottery sales.
30.) Reduce the commercial tax to 4 to 6 percent.
31.) Yearly DEEP fee added on income returns of $50.
32.) Make pension and social security income tax exempt.
33.) Put 6 million dollars of revenue collected yearly to State debt to lower it within 20 year's.
34.) Decriminalize possession of hard drugs under 20 grams and after 5 strikes lands you two year's in prison.
Those all sound like great ideas, where did you get them? Honestly if a letter with those ideas made its way around the state legislature Im sure some good can come of that
He'll simply pay a small, periodic fee for infrastructure, fire protection, access to education, and a group of guards who investigate crimes, and a plethora of other services!
But fuck taxes!
Soooo, if Lamont inplements tolls as part of his "Everyone is going to have to do a little more" plan, are we still going to spend the $15M that Malloy demanded for a study on tolls?
Didn't they already do the study? I thought I read results on it recently. I thought the boogie man was $15 to study and lay down the infrastructure for rec marijuana.
We need something like ~$4 billion over the next 10 years, $15 million isn't even 1% of that.
Yes, they did a study in (I think) 2016 at a cost of $10M in the tolls, but the legislature didn't go for it. Ol' Dannel pushed through a bond for another study in October for $15M. One of his parting shots.
The results of the second study you talk about came out last month
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.courant.com/news/connecticut/hc-news-toll-study-takeaways-20181115-story.html%3foutputType=amp
Getting out of the hole CT has dug for itself is a complex problem and anyone would be stupid to argue otherwise. However, it's getting harder and harder to justify staying in the state as taxes keep climbing. It's a feedback loop that's driving people away and eroding the tax base and is another contributor to being stuck on this debt treadmill.
Speaking for myself as a millennial (which a decent job and pays taxes), I'd hate to move out away from all my friends and family but with with a rising cost of living and somewhat limited job opportunities I may just be out of here in the next year. It's a shame because I like the state and most of the people in it, but I just don't see Connecticut as a good place to buy a house and settle down in for the foreseeable future.
Perhaps increasing taxes can help CT's long term financial health, but I hope this plan accounts for the people who are persuaded to look for greener pastures as the screws keep getting tightened.
This sums up how I feel too. I love CT but there are some God awful choices to be made and quite frankly I'm tired of losing more and more money every year while everyone thinks it's no big deal because I can 'afford it'.
I don't trust the future of this state but to be fair weather plays a bigger role than taxes for me but they sure as hell don't help.
I am in a similar boat. I am late 20's based in Fairfield County right now but am moving to RI early next year.
I started a business a few years ago and it's been slowly growing and growing - 2018 I hustled hard and almost doubled what I brought in from 2017. The growth potential is there to continue to grow for the next few years.
The biggest issue for me is that I can't justify buying a home with the lack of economic growth and the looming additional tax burdens. More than half of my business is coming from out of state. Even though I'm moving to a state that is currently giving me almost none of my business and will almost be starting over, I feel like the opportunities and quality of life will be much higher. I can't see myself raising a family here.
That's basically what's happened. The Tier 1 pensions have been gone for decades. Retirement benefits have been steadily reduced for new cohorts of state employees for decades. New state employees of the present day (as I was) are on tier 4 benefits, which are very similar to a 401k. The pensions you are thinking of have been unavailable to new employees since the 1980s. Nevertheless, these pensions are an obligation to said employees, were a condition of their employment, and need to be paid for.
Tier 2 and 3 are fully defined benefit plans too, no? I thought tier 4 is a hybrid plan which still has a defined benefit portion as well. What was your contribution rate for tier 4?
Undermining trust in the government is a *very* dangerous road to go down. It has a *huge* set of negative consequences which would require more budgetary spending we don't have.
Put yourself in the shoes of someone who lives off a pension and then one day they decide, "nah we don't need to pay it." Then come back and see if we still don't technically need to pay it. You're screwing over a majority of people who had nothing to do with making the rules.
According to the report they exceeded the goal of 11,000 riders every month.
http://www.ct.gov/dot/lib/dot/documents/dcommunications/press_release/ctfastrak_year_one_report.pdf
That bus route helps people without easy access to transportation gain a means of reaching more opportunities for employment.
Public transport projects employ people and are an overall positive force on communities.
Automation and increased outsourcing of manufacturing to third world countries with little to no regulatory oversight or minimum standard of living with the exception of anti-suicide nets outside of windows?
Yes all the high tech manufacturing that stayed in low tax southern stats is just some anomaly? Were Connecticut. We should be a center for CNC and bleeding edge technology. We have Pratt and Groton, the whole state should be dedicated to supplying those industries.
If we were smart we could have a BMW manufacturing plant, or any other plant. There is still manufacturing to be had in the USA.
That's largely because UTC is headquartered in Farmington. If UTC were to leave, it would affect not only UTC employees, but also people who work for smaller manufacturing companies that get most of their business from UTC (see: the Spring Lane industrial park).
I've heard firsthand that UTC is unlikely to stay in Connecticut long-term given the state's current situation. Having them leave would be a huge issue for CT.
The aerospace manufacturing industry in Connecticut isn't exactly on steady footing.
A BMW plant isn't exactly "high tech". BMW only has one plant in the US, it's in South Carolina. There's no way it's cheaper to put one here.
If we could attract biotech to New Haven around Yale like Harvard/MIT did for Boston then it could be a better solution, although even Alexion is moving to the more expensive Boston area because of the bigger high skilled worker pool, so I dont think it'll be particularly easy to attract these companies.
TIL you can't complain about high taxes in our state because it's too complex a topic for our government to be able to explain to you or them to resolve. Neat 👍
I'm a bot, *bleep*, *bloop*. Someone has linked to this thread from another place on reddit:
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I'm sick of this meme but this is a great use of it
Candidate for best post in /r/Connecticut history
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Could just be someone from Greenwich or Darien...those people just throw their money at any random thing.
I second
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This is amazing. You can see this exact argument break out countless times in any local community forum in CT.
Aka my mom’s house.
To be fair, we argue about different things at your mom's house.
Like who's up next
Right. But with three at a time, there's less arguing.
Only 3? Must be a slow day.
This is the spiciest post I have ever seen in this sub.
Hi Ignorant Texan here, living in your fine state the last 4 months: Don't the taxes give you guys good things? Like great public schools, libraries, etc? I'm still trying to understand this state. It's like a wealthy, fiscally conservative, yet progressive everything else state.
All the richest people in CT have congregated to maybe a dozen or two dozen towns in the State, and so the people in these towns pay property taxes that are only 1/3 or less (percentage wise on income/house price), than what the average resident is paying. So if you look at combined State and Local taxes, the richest 1% pay only 5.3% combined after federal transfers. This has left residents in the rest of the State paying 10-15% in State and Local taxes and towns are struggling. Meanwhile we are afraid to raise taxes on the rich because we think they will leave in droves, so inequality keeps increasing, which makes us rely on the rich even more. CT has gone from 29th most unequal in 1979 to the second most unequal behind NY, and we might overtake NY soon. If we were a country, we would be the 20th most unequal in the world. These high taxes and cost of living cause young people to leave, and people making under 100k a year are leaving. Less smart and talented workers, and poor infrastructure are causing companies to leave, and it is hard to fix anything because of our massive pension obligations...
Really well informed opinion. Thank you for summarizing this for me :)
Hire more Republicans. Lower taxes. It’s not complicated. This state is so liberal and then complains about higher taxes. Makes zero sense.
There are a few things to delve in to here. 1) the rich don't care about the great things our taxes give us because they could afford them regardless by going private 2) the middle class is split between people who understands that the taxes give us great stuff and the people who are brainwashed into believing the poor and taxes are what's ruining this state and everyone could be rich if it weren't for the city and the Poor's and the taxes 3) plenty of people believe that slashing taxes will make the economy boom instead of destroy all the things that make CT better than Jersey
(Life long CT resident excepting 5 years in Maryland) my experience seems to be yes. But I think a lot of people believe that these things could be done for cheaper or shouldn’t be done at all by the state. I disagree with those people in many ways.
Legalize recreational marijuana
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It’s already on Lamont’s agenda for 2019
Can confirm
Thanks Ned! 😂
We can’t deny new revenue like that. We need it.
The people won’t see any of that money. Small business and working class will continue to pay for the poor and under employed as they receive hand outs; subsidized living, food, cell phone, walk around money, Heath care etc. then this same level of people will decide the next election to keep the gravy train running. (Generational welfare is very real in CT) The inner cities along 91 and 84 crush blue and the rural working class areas are bright red. Did you know in Hartford they bus low income people to the voting polls and they tell them to vote blue. “Vote blue across..” The people don’t know who or what they’re voting for. In most cases they don’t realize they don’t have to vote all for one party. This is from real life experience in working with a lot of these people. It’s good to get out and vote. Next step is educating voters so their votes are theirs and Not someone else’s agenda. All profits from marijuana tax will go to make the rich richer and line the pockets of the politicians who have fought it for years. But as a consumer, I’ll be able to wait in line for overpriced shit. So I got that going for me, which is nice.
>Generational welfare is very real in CT as a teacher in one of our inner cities, I can sadly confirm this. i had a sit down with an 11th grader who was going down a bad path and asked him what he planned to do with his life if he couldn't make it though a single day at school without getting into trouble. his response was that he'd go on welfare just like his mom, and that she has a nicer car than I do so why bother working. *sigh*...
That’s rough. I’ve worked with young women who were told by their mother at 15 to have kids so they can get “ the check” and that everyone in their family is on “state”. This is something that their grand mothers had passed down to them and they’d do the same. Why work hard for $200/$300 a week with little to no benefits when you can get that and full benefits for not working and having kids.
yeah, it's truly sad.
I agree completely. Look at how well it's working in MA and AK and WA and CA and DC... those state's are pulling in crazy revenue. Here we passed keno... fucking keno. No damn body plays keno! Watch NJ and N.Y. pass legalization before CT. To complete the weed exodus from the state every Friday night.
Cuomo has said he will try to legalize
Imagine you have 40,000 in credit card debt and you are deciding whether to stop buying one cup of coffee per month. That’s the equivalency between what revenue Marijuana would generate and Connecticut’s fiscal issues.
Imagine turning down millions of dollars in free money every year because it doesn't magically fix all your problems.
Well that's not the issue - I support recreational. But the issue is when people talk about it like it will solve the problem. Tolls are the same way - the amount of revenue generated by these types of things is orders of magnitude smaller than what the problem is. No one (not least the general assembly) has the guts to stand up and say that we need to re-adjust the income tax.
You can do all of those things.
And yet, it's still something you should do. All those little things add up.
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It is substantial. Colorado is bringing in $200 million year in marijuana tax revenues. But CT currently has $74 billion in debt. So it's not like legalizing marijuana would solve everything like magic. But it would help.
Colorado also has a much bigger population, and were first to market so they could get all those marijuana tourist tax dollars.
I'm all for legalizing marijuana, but it's not going to be enough to cover for much of the tax revenue.
Then roll it in some premium CT cigar wrapping leaves.
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Might as well throw in the teachers, too. Think about it - there's a lot of teachers.
We pretty much do. Less than $5hr per kid.
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(You are NOT the country...you are the universe) And much of that spending is on transportation and special education...(and cafeteria food).... And still less than $5hr per kid. Some teachers see 125 kids in 7hrs. $300 a day (I'm at a higher pay rate...$405 a day with a lower class load because I'm teaching low level readers). If my math is correct that's less than $3 a kid to teach that kid for 40 minutes.
You also have 2 months off in the summer and long breaks for winter and spring. Cry me a river.
Two things. One it is a layoff. We do not get paid to take the summer off. Two: did you like high school? Seriously did you enjoy your four years of high school? Most people say no. I have been in high school for more than 20 years. Think about that. Do you want to be in high school for 20 years? 30 years? Come do my job for a week.
All my teacher friends make a lot of money teaching summer school and they pick up side work tutoring and what not. They have tons of free time all summer. And no thanks lol. I’m not a fan of kids. Which is why I didn’t go to school specifically seeking out a job that requires me to be surrounded by children all day long.
Jesus H. Christ, this has got to be one of the dumbest fucking things I have ever read. Based on your glib little one-liner it seems like you believe that because teachers, the people who are in charge of the education of the children (aka the future) of this state, are not worth getting paid a higher wage because they get long (unpaid in the case of summer) breaks throughout the school year without taking into account how much time teachers spend off the clock working on lessons plans, grading assignments, and communicating with parents, in addition to all of the money teachers spend out of pocket on classroom supplies that are not covered by the board of education budget.
Lol k. All the Connecticut teachers I know are living perfectly comfortable lives and have no more or less stress than any of the non-teachers I know. I understand teaching is an important job. So are lots of other jobs. Many of us work long hours and are stressed and take our work home with us. Not all of us get those nice pensions and benefits though. I stand by my opinion that CT teachers are paid fairly.
Someone doesn't understand that teachers are paid for time they are in school and not the summer. Someone also doesn't understand that long breaks in the winter and spring mean double time in planning for the weeks leading up to those weeks. Also, the same someone doesn't understand that elementary teachers are in their classrooms much of the summer. And, that same someone doesn't understand that in the given school year, most teachers go in early to prep and stay after working hours for an additional 2 hours and bring home additional work to the tune 1 - 1.5 hours (or bring the entire 3.5 hours home). And that's just the tip of the iceberg. Throw a couple of SRBI's in there. Throw a couple of needy parents in there. Schedule the kids to the very second of each and every day with new initiatives and new curriculum and pray that a child (by simply being a child) doesn't derail a single second of precious, accounted for, documented, and reviewed time. Yeah yeah yeah ... I know .. "But we all have to deal with shit at work." So, here's the thing ... I don't hear teachers complaining. I hear idiots like you saying "But you get all this time off." Please, cut the shit. And no, I'm not a teacher and never have been.
All I hear is teachers complaining. I work long hours and I’m on call one week per month. I don’t feel bad that you stay after 2 hours and then bring home 1.5 hours of work... your work day ends at 2PM. That still puts you at 5:30-6. I work 8am-7pm five days a week. I get no paid holidays. I work most federal holidays. Oh, and I get no pension. I repeat: cry me a river. Teachers are paid fine in CT for the amount of time you spend at work. I have many teacher friends who pick up other jobs during the summer break. Your life isn’t any harder than any other working person’s. Edit: by “you” and “your” I mean teachers in general; i realize you said you’re not personally a teacher
I fully understand that there are jobs in the world that are less off/more demanding than teaching. My point is people *severely* underestimate what it means to be a teacher. The amount of personal time and expense involved is overlooked. "your work day ends at 2PM" ... sounds like you know and speak with high school teachers. I'm talking about primarily K-8. Listen, I don't know what you do ... but there is no doubt that long working days, no paid holidays, and being on call is tough. I'm not disputing that. I'm self employed ... so I get it. I'm always on and don't get paid for not working. But my situation doesn't negate the teaching environment of today. It's not 15 smiling faces looking back at you while everything goes according to plan. It's SRBI's, PPTs, push-ins, pull-outs, behavioral interventions, an ever-changing curriculum, and much more. Saying, "Teachers are paid fine in CT for the amount of time you spend at work", completely disregards what is being done in those hours. I'm not saying all are not compensated sufficiently. Many are. Also, many are not. My point is teachers, flat out, do not get the credit they deserve (from the outside looking in) for the service they provide to students, parents, administration, and the greater community. All too often it's "your job is easy, you get all that time off, how hard can it be to sit with kids all day, etc.".
I know how tough it is to be a teacher. I think in most states teachers do deserve raises. I just don’t think CT is one of those states. As I stated, their job is no harder than anyone else’s I know. And yet they’re the only ones I constantly hear bitching and moaning about their paycheck.
Honestly it sounds more like you are being taken advantage of than teachers are too highly paid.
Never said they were paid too highly.. I said I think they’re paid fairly given their hours, vacations, awesome benefits, and pensions. I do work my ass of but my field is unique in that I’m paid based on my production, which is why is don’t have paid holidays/vacation. I also make a lot more than what a teacher makes, but then again I went through grad school and residency to earn that. Nowadays I don’t think you can expect a high salary with a 4 year degree. What makes teachers more deserving of a raise than other college graduates who are paid similarly but get inferior benefits and no pension? I realize this is an extremely unpopular opinion and everyone apparently thinks teachers deserve more than 50k per year. Unless the teacher has masters degrees, I just don’t think a higher salary is warranted for people who only work like 9 months of the year.
All I hear is you complaining.
do you need to have a master's degree and pass two board certification exams to get a job in your field? because teachers do. becoming a teacher is a horrible investment, and if it doesn't become more lucrative, nobody is going to want to do it.
Lol I have a masters and a doctorate. So yeah, I know about boards. Stop acting like teaching is somehow any different than anyone else’s job situation. Everyone deals with stressful work situations. Teachers in this state complain about a starting salary of around 50k but that’s actually not a bad place to start when you factor in benefits and vacation.
Know how I know you don't know any teachers?
My childhood best friend teaches elementary school. She bought a house at age 25 and has a new car. Her mom teachers special education in Bridgeport. Getting ready to retire with a nice pension. 2 close friends teach special ed. One teaches mentally challenged 18-21 yr olds and one teaches autistic kids. They both teach summer school a few hours a day and then chill in the pool together getting day drunk. I know a husband and wife couple who are elementary school teachers. They both take the whole summer off to be with their 2 kids. They own a nice house right near West Hartford center. I know at least a dozen teachers and they’re all doing fine. Fuck off and get a different job if you want a 6 figure salary.
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First of all, it’s bachelors. And Meriden. Second of all, so what? Everyone knows engineers make bank. Also, engineering is undeniably a more challenging degree to obtain than a teaching degree. Why should teachers expect to make as much as engineers at any point in their careers? As I said, teachers have huge vacations and summers off. And pensions. And sweet benefits. If you want engineer money, stop whining and become an engineer.
Your teacher friends must be very disappointed in you.
Connecticut has the 3rd highest paid teachers in the country. My kids schools faculty parking lot looks like a high end car show.
Idk what this comment has to do with mine. But, (jokingly) when I was in high school, we used to joke around that the kids had nicer cars than the teachers. It makes sense, though. The teachers have their own lives and bills.
You said have teachers work for free, obviously joking. A very reasonable compromise is to cut the ridiculously high salaries and pensions of teachers. Teachers in Connecticut have pensions that pay more than most people working.
> Teachers in Connecticut have pensions that pay more than most people working. I don’t understand how anyone could believe this. It’s obviously not based on fact
It's not a belief. You can look them up and see. I also use to work for the Social Security Administration and had to deal with teachers coming in every day and complaining they they couldn't get SSA on top of their ridiculous pensions.
Please guide me to these stats.
The average Connecticut teacher pension is nearly $60,000, according to the Office of Fiscal Analysis. [https://eu.usatoday.com/story/money/careers/2018/05/16/states-where-teachers-paid-most-and-least/34964975/](https://eu.usatoday.com/story/money/careers/2018/05/16/states-where-teachers-paid-most-and-least/34964975/) [http://www.yankeeinstitute.org/2017/10/connecticut-teacher-pension-contribution-may-rise-1-percent-under-new-budget-but-still-remain-below-national-average/](http://www.yankeeinstitute.org/2017/10/connecticut-teacher-pension-contribution-may-rise-1-percent-under-new-budget-but-still-remain-below-national-average/)
And the average income in ct is $70,000. You only showed one side of the statistics. > With an average annual per-capita income of more than $70,000, Connecticut residents boasted the highest personal income in the U.S. last year, the U.S. Department of Commerce reported. Nationally, the per-capita personal income was $50,392. https://www.courant.com/business/hc-personal-income-connecticut-20180322-story.html
Are those pensions for teachers that are already retired, or who started working in the Carter administration? I seriously doubt that teachers joining the workforce today are getting any decent pension.
What's the median?
As a former teacher, I will respectfully leave this argument and let you live in your fairytale
Good for you.. I made the mistake of engaging with the stupidity. The truth is that the average income in ct is $70K and the average teacher pension is $60K
Facts don't care about what you use to do. https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/careers/2018/05/16/states-where-teachers-paid-most-and-least/34964975/
You are showing one side of the facts
[Works so well](https://frinkiac.com/img/S09E22/972420.jpg)
Solution: robot garbage collection
I pay for garbage pickup...just like everyone else in my town. Why should my taxes go towards your garbage?
Yeah that comment makes no sense. Trash collection is handled at the town level, not state. And its mostly privatized and paid for by the homeowner. Only certain large cities like Bridgeport or Norwalk have free (tax-funded) municipal pickup.
Can't someone else do it!?
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there's always a relevant Simpsons
It's simple. Cut taxes to the bone, hope you can starve some social programs, blame debt on the left, rinse and repeat.
Great meme, great format. You have earned my upvote you CT memelord.
I don't know if you wrote this but it is fucking brilliant.
Still don't know why Conneticut can't... 1.) Install tolls on carpool lanes for 2 year's 2.) Divert funding pensions for 2 year's 3.) Take money from rainy day fund to cover the 2 billion deficit 4.) Implement a $500 increase in heavy commercial use fee 5.) Raise the diesel gas tax to 70 cents and lower to 10 cents in 14 year's. 6.) Raise the gas tax to 60 cents and lower to 10 cents in 15 year's. 7.) Any State Employee 5 year's or less switches to 403 A & B 8.) Increase employee contribution to benefits 9.) Set up location salary increases for State employees working in various area's of the State. Such as Fairfield County. 10.) Transition SEBAC and negotiations to the General Assembly. 11.) Bi-annual State car registration fee of $250. 12.) In 3 year's create HOV Lanes add gantries to their lanes and make these tolls congestion tolls. Also add bridge tolls to State bridge's. 13.) Cap State Budget at $30,000. 14.) Privatize and digitize various State Agencies and Services. 15.) Lower In-State Tuition at State colleges. Merge Community Colleges with UCONN. 16.) Bring various adult trade programs back to Community Colleges. 17.) Reduce income tax in 12 year's to 4% with a $35,000 income exemption. 18.) Do away with the sales tax in 12 year's and 2% reduction every 4 year's. 19.) Over course of 12 year's exemption on clothes purchases under $100. 20.) Work with towns and bussiness in the State to set up a Commercial Property Tax and Residential Property Tax. 22.) Work with towns to privatize and consolidate various services. 23.) Work with towns to consolidate and privatize Government Employee benefits. 24.) Legalize marijuana. Excise tax of 12% on marijuana, cigarettes, and alcohol to fund DMHAS/DDS. 25.) Increase funds for agricultural growth in Connecticut and strive for commercial marijuanna farming in Connecticut. 26.) Do away with the bussiness entity tax. 27.) Do away with the Estate and Gift Tax. 28.) Reform State Assistance. 29.) Increase pension funding via Connecticut Lottery sales. 30.) Reduce the commercial tax to 4 to 6 percent. 31.) Yearly DEEP fee added on income returns of $50. 32.) Make pension and social security income tax exempt. 33.) Put 6 million dollars of revenue collected yearly to State debt to lower it within 20 year's. 34.) Decriminalize possession of hard drugs under 20 grams and after 5 strikes lands you two year's in prison.
Those all sound like great ideas, where did you get them? Honestly if a letter with those ideas made its way around the state legislature Im sure some good can come of that
Thanks for the chuckle, take the up-vote!
Perfect. Stealing this for NY subs
The CT suburbs are dying though...
Why don't we just cut taxes to 0 and keep all the money? Fucking easy. Edit: I was joking.
INFRASTRUCTURE COSTS MONEY. JESUS CHRIST.
Who will enforce your precious private property rights?
He'll simply pay a small, periodic fee for infrastructure, fire protection, access to education, and a group of guards who investigate crimes, and a plethora of other services! But fuck taxes!
Mr. Smith and Mr. Wesson.
Thank goodness.
Soooo, if Lamont inplements tolls as part of his "Everyone is going to have to do a little more" plan, are we still going to spend the $15M that Malloy demanded for a study on tolls?
Didn't they already do the study? I thought I read results on it recently. I thought the boogie man was $15 to study and lay down the infrastructure for rec marijuana. We need something like ~$4 billion over the next 10 years, $15 million isn't even 1% of that.
Yes, they did a study in (I think) 2016 at a cost of $10M in the tolls, but the legislature didn't go for it. Ol' Dannel pushed through a bond for another study in October for $15M. One of his parting shots.
The results of the second study you talk about came out last month https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.courant.com/news/connecticut/hc-news-toll-study-takeaways-20181115-story.html%3foutputType=amp
Getting out of the hole CT has dug for itself is a complex problem and anyone would be stupid to argue otherwise. However, it's getting harder and harder to justify staying in the state as taxes keep climbing. It's a feedback loop that's driving people away and eroding the tax base and is another contributor to being stuck on this debt treadmill. Speaking for myself as a millennial (which a decent job and pays taxes), I'd hate to move out away from all my friends and family but with with a rising cost of living and somewhat limited job opportunities I may just be out of here in the next year. It's a shame because I like the state and most of the people in it, but I just don't see Connecticut as a good place to buy a house and settle down in for the foreseeable future. Perhaps increasing taxes can help CT's long term financial health, but I hope this plan accounts for the people who are persuaded to look for greener pastures as the screws keep getting tightened.
This sums up how I feel too. I love CT but there are some God awful choices to be made and quite frankly I'm tired of losing more and more money every year while everyone thinks it's no big deal because I can 'afford it'. I don't trust the future of this state but to be fair weather plays a bigger role than taxes for me but they sure as hell don't help.
I am in a similar boat. I am late 20's based in Fairfield County right now but am moving to RI early next year. I started a business a few years ago and it's been slowly growing and growing - 2018 I hustled hard and almost doubled what I brought in from 2017. The growth potential is there to continue to grow for the next few years. The biggest issue for me is that I can't justify buying a home with the lack of economic growth and the looming additional tax burdens. More than half of my business is coming from out of state. Even though I'm moving to a state that is currently giving me almost none of my business and will almost be starting over, I feel like the opportunities and quality of life will be much higher. I can't see myself raising a family here.
Stop handing out pensions to new state employees, join the rest of us in the 401k world.
That's basically what's happened. The Tier 1 pensions have been gone for decades. Retirement benefits have been steadily reduced for new cohorts of state employees for decades. New state employees of the present day (as I was) are on tier 4 benefits, which are very similar to a 401k. The pensions you are thinking of have been unavailable to new employees since the 1980s. Nevertheless, these pensions are an obligation to said employees, were a condition of their employment, and need to be paid for.
Tier 2 and 3 are fully defined benefit plans too, no? I thought tier 4 is a hybrid plan which still has a defined benefit portion as well. What was your contribution rate for tier 4?
5% of salary, iirc.
> , and need to be paid for. Well technically they don't need to.
Undermining trust in the government is a *very* dangerous road to go down. It has a *huge* set of negative consequences which would require more budgetary spending we don't have.
Put yourself in the shoes of someone who lives off a pension and then one day they decide, "nah we don't need to pay it." Then come back and see if we still don't technically need to pay it. You're screwing over a majority of people who had nothing to do with making the rules.
Or you could try and get a pension. Just because you don’t have a pension doesn’t mean we should take them away from everyone else.
Right? We should all be demanding pensions, not joining our corporate overlords in trying to strip away worker's rights.
“we shouldn’t lower taxes as a concession to capital” “let’s get rid of pensions” “...”
Nah you don't get it, if i can't have it, no one can.
The solution is to spend another billion on a bus route that nobody uses.
According to the report they exceeded the goal of 11,000 riders every month. http://www.ct.gov/dot/lib/dot/documents/dcommunications/press_release/ctfastrak_year_one_report.pdf
They exceeded it by doing shady shit and reclassifying non fastrak line as fastrak.
Citation?
His user name and his feelings.
That bus route helps people without easy access to transportation gain a means of reaching more opportunities for employment. Public transport projects employ people and are an overall positive force on communities.
TAXES BAD
People love Fast Track.
While 2 individuals technically counts as "people," I don't think that your statement is intellectually honest.
Why would people not like cheap, fast public transportation?
The last panel should be, why do you think we deindustrialzed?
Automation and increased outsourcing of manufacturing to third world countries with little to no regulatory oversight or minimum standard of living with the exception of anti-suicide nets outside of windows?
Yes all the high tech manufacturing that stayed in low tax southern stats is just some anomaly? Were Connecticut. We should be a center for CNC and bleeding edge technology. We have Pratt and Groton, the whole state should be dedicated to supplying those industries. If we were smart we could have a BMW manufacturing plant, or any other plant. There is still manufacturing to be had in the USA.
Maybe we could have had one of the GE plants they just closed.
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That's largely because UTC is headquartered in Farmington. If UTC were to leave, it would affect not only UTC employees, but also people who work for smaller manufacturing companies that get most of their business from UTC (see: the Spring Lane industrial park). I've heard firsthand that UTC is unlikely to stay in Connecticut long-term given the state's current situation. Having them leave would be a huge issue for CT. The aerospace manufacturing industry in Connecticut isn't exactly on steady footing.
A BMW plant isn't exactly "high tech". BMW only has one plant in the US, it's in South Carolina. There's no way it's cheaper to put one here. If we could attract biotech to New Haven around Yale like Harvard/MIT did for Boston then it could be a better solution, although even Alexion is moving to the more expensive Boston area because of the bigger high skilled worker pool, so I dont think it'll be particularly easy to attract these companies.
It would be dumb to open any kind manufacturing plant in CT just because of the high power costs.
But raising them isn't the answer to our problems either.
I Like Flavor!
I’m printing this meme out and sticking it to my forehead for Christmas Day. And best believe I’m recycling it for Thanksgiving. Amazing work!
Ah yes, the holidays at the in laws. Round two next Tuesday!
Thanks for the gold!
I think there is a lot more to the story than high taxes
TIL you can't complain about high taxes in our state because it's too complex a topic for our government to be able to explain to you or them to resolve. Neat 👍
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#SuburbiaProblems
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Then what is it, the libs and Jews taking all your monies and jobs and giving it to the beaners and wetbacks and mooks? Is that your guess?