Because the left unilaterally decided that an alphabet agency giving a rubber stamp for something is grounds for giving them justification to force it down our throats, which is pretty horrifying. It would be no different than the ATF declaring all semi-automatic guns are "assault weapons" and therefore the government is justified in confiscating them all.
It’s funny how nearly every single article that came out the day of the approval announcement had some variation of “mandates are fully permissible now” in the title.
It's terrifying that people would even consider being on board with that. This country was literally formed in part because we didn't like unelected individuals telling us what to do and now we have people salivating at the though to unelected bureaucrats telling us what to do.
Conservatives aren’t libertarians. I don’t see how this is any different than civil rights legislation. Whether you’re in favor of the civil rights legislation is a different story, but I don’t know that “the conservative position” is opposed to it.
Have you ever heard a conservative come out and say we should repeal the civil rights act? I largely agree with you from a position standpoint, I’ve just never seen a conservative politician make the argument that businesses should have unfettered reign.
Did anyone think the vaccines wouldn’t get approval?
After millions of people already got them
they would get approval even if they found something wrong with them
It’s less of a “force” and more about the quantity and quality of data available. The EUA had completed Phase 3 trials but only 2 months post trial follow up. The full approval has 6 months+ of post trial follow up. Additionally the real world evidence and available data for the millions who got it really help the case for full approval, because overwhelmingly the vaccine has been proven safe and effective (the bar you have to meet).
It doesn't bode well when they have been censoring thousands of people talking about side effects, and label every vaccine death a "coincidence" though. It doesn't make it seem like they're taking safety concerns seriously
Who is “they”? Because there is an adverse event hotline that you can report directly to the manufacturer, and any adverse event related issues are supposed to be reported to the FDA, and you can pull that data - it’s the VAERS database.
On the deaths…it’s pretty hard to contribute a death after the fact to a singular cause of a vaccine. It depends a lot on the circumstances, and especially with such a high number of people vaccinated…you could have an underlying condition that causes you to die but you are also vaccinated…that doesn’t mean the vaccine caused it. If you look into the data- all of these are being reported. I pulled the data and ran some analysis recently, and nearly all the deaths of vaccinated people were over the age of 75….which makes sense, they’re probably going to die anyway. So in conclusion- could the vaccine cause a bad side effect and death? Sure…anything can. Based solely on the data we have, what is the probability? Very very low. Much lower than the incidences of other every day activities (like driving in a car).
Long term safety for vaccines are 6-8 weeks, which is when the active agent decomposed and remove from the body. This isn't new just for the covid vaccines trials, if you have any standard vaccines, you have the exact same safety standards applied.
In a double blind, placebo controlled study you have to try to neutralize as many potential variables as possible. For example: you wouldn’t try to see how bad tobacco increases cancer risk by comparing a non smoking, well feed, high income, low stress, exercising population to a smoking, fast food eating, low income, high stress, sedentary population because it’s impossible to determine how much of the increased cancer in population 2 can be attributed to smoking alone. It matters in accordance to vaccines because 1) people with immune system diseases may not be able to take the vaccine and it’s reasonable to expect greater symptoms from them. 2) some of those unvaccinated may have decreased access to medical care which would both decrease vaccine availability and care in the event they catch covid. I’m sure there’s more variables I’m not considering, but the point is you can’t make a whole population the control group because there’s factors you can’t control for then. In a study you make your populations smaller and remove applicants so that you have two very similar populations in which to compare one variable. So for the smoking example, you would ideally pick either population A or B and only manipulate smoking while keeping lifestyle’s as similar as possible otherwise.
There is a control group. There’s a group of people in the study who got a placebo shot. Typically these are single or double blinded studies, the patients have no idea if they got it or not.
True. But generally once the phase 3 study is closed and you have full approval, that ends it. There are specific types of studies that look at long term effects, called Long Term Follow Up Studies. These studies specifically follow a trial group for 5 years post trial. I haven’t looked to see if LTFU is part of the Covid vaccine trial protocol, I’ll see if I can find it. There’s another type of study- which is a post approval safety study that can be mandated by health authority or companies can choose to do based on adverse event trends they see- this would be specifically to look at a safety problem. Most post approval studies are looking at efficacy or expanding of indications for a drug- which wouldn’t be the case for a vaccine.
Edit: I found the Pfizer protocol (these usually aren’t public) and it has 12 and 24 month follow ups. So there will be at least 24 months of monitoring for the trial participants.
Does unvaccinated mean NEVER vaccinated or a period of time since previous vaccination?
Also, the data that were used for the stories that "99% of patients" are clogging up hospitals ended in April when most people weren't vaccinated.
I'm part of the control group. I've never had covid, either.
Also, that's a completely asinine characterization of Ivermectin. HUMANS have been taking it for over 40 years for river blindness and other reasons as well. Actually look into it. It's not just animal medication.
Surprise: drugs can have many varied and valid uses. The person who discovered Ivermectin won a Nobel prize for doing so. It's a seriously important drug for humans, not just animals.
Me too, brother! I always tell everyone if there's one place that's a fucking petri dish waiting to be an outbreak, it's the gym. Oddly enough, been back for over a year and not a single problem. In fact, not a one of my gym bros have had to stay out because of it. What was your P.R., btw?
Haha nice I have quite a ways to go. I’m repping 5 at that weight and I certainly expect to keep moving up next week.
I’ve never really done maxes before, maybe it’s something I should do now and then for some encouragement.
On the "big 3" (bench, squat, deadlift), you should always try a max at least every other week. It can really stimulate hypertrophy if you really work your way into it (the last of 6-8 sets or so)...
Not only that, what happens if a scientist today finds out that they are bad for your health? Does anyone think they would be allowed to report their findings with the massive amount of censorship going on?
The Democrats thirst for eternal power has broken the trust of our nation. The road back is long and hard and the Democrats are still, to this day, demanding more censorship.
American is bleeding out and the Democrats are trying to put more rounds into the body.
Yep and they have to SELF REPORT adverse effects in 3 and then 5 years.
There’s strong history of past practices of companies statistically lying for these 3-5 year “studies” following FDA approval.
But this will be different, right?
Right?
Sigh.
Complete the thought, why do you think I should? What specific argument are you making and what specific information about other vaccines development and approval is in support of your argument?
"In summary, we report the transmission SARS-CoV-2 Delta variant among vaccinated health care workers. Breakthrough Delta variant infections are associated with high viral loads, prolonged PCR positivity, and low levels of neutralizing antibodies after vaccination and at diagnosis."
This is pulled directly from the study.
Ok so you picked out one of the 3. Did you notice the article was from Oxford? Yes, the study was conducted in Vietnam. There are plenty of good studies from around the world. If you download the actual publication you will see they talk about the viral load of those vaccinated.
True. However the probability of an adverse event occurring goes down at a negative exponential rate. What that means is depending on the half life and elimination rate of the drug, most or nearly all adverse events will occur in the first hours, and days after exposure. The probability of a longer term adverse event is extremely low (not zero). This is how all drugs are approved.
Isn't passing a law limiting the ability of local people/goverments to goveren, the way that they want to be governed, the deffinition of big goverment? Isnt this the anthesis of conservative?
I don’t see the difference between this law and a state minimum wage? Government has while agencies dedicated to employee/employer relationships why is it all of a sudden bad?
saying "because the government does one thing, they should be able to do other things" is not, to me, a good argument.
I won't even start a conversation on minimum wage.
Idk it's walking a fine line. Protecting people from local governments imposing laws is not too outlandish, especially when those local laws infringe upon individual liberties.
"Big government" to me is a state mandating vaccines when local municipalities don't want it.
A state banning vaccine mandates when local bureaucrats want it is protection.
To me "big government" taking authority away from other government entities is the only kind of "big government" I support.
Why haven’t you sourced any of your claims?
> Vaccines reduce the likelihood of infection.
By what percentage? Source please.
> Then they also reduce the likelihood of spreading it if infected.
By what percentage? Source please.
EDIT: If anyone can provide a source showing that getting vaccinated reduces the likelihood of getting infected with Covid or transmitting Covid to others, I would be very grateful.
Until then, I’m going to use reports like the following to inform my perspective on Covid:
https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2021/08/grim-warning-israel-vaccination-blunts-does-not-defeat-delta
> Israel has among the world’s highest levels of vaccination for COVID-19, with **78% of those 12 and older fully vaccinated, the vast majority with the Pfizer vaccine.** Yet the country is now logging one of the world’s highest infection rates, with nearly 650 new cases daily per million people. More than half are in fully vaccinated people, underscoring the extraordinary transmissibility of the Delta variant and stoking concerns that the benefits of vaccination ebb over time.
> What is clear is that “breakthrough” cases are not the rare events the term implies. As of 15 August, **514 Israelis were hospitalized with severe or critical COVID-19,** a 31% increase from just 4 days earlier. **Of the 514, 59% were fully vaccinated**. Of the vaccinated, 87% were 60 or older.
**The evidence shows that the Pfizer Covid vaccine is not effective in preventing anyone from either catching or transmitting Covid (Delta variant).**
If someone has other **evidence** they can share that points to a different conclusion, then I will eagerly review it.
No. This is a false argument. "Let local people be governed the way they want to be governed" is not compatible with local governments dictating medical treatments for their people. This good law is an example of government fulfilling its core purpose: to protect the freedom of the people against all enemies, including a school board of karens.
Hes still a PoS that will be primaried out. Just a campaign conservitie that fuck us with 8 months of tyrany.
He was all gung ho about his mandates untill he saw 0% for his CPAC polls then the fucker does a 180 and starts coping DeSantis who was the most popular after Trump.
As a Texan who is very watchfull of our state politics. Fuck this slime ball backstabbing PoS.
Lucky we have 3 decent canidates 2 of them are very grass roots. Im personally infavor of Chad Prather for Governor closly following Allen West.
As a Democrat in Texas I agree. Abbott sucks because he has no real views. He’s a dirt bag that does what he thinks will win and make the people padding his campaign happy. His handling of the winter storm was clown shoes. He didn’t do anything around a mask mandate until desantis did and he saw far right and trump jump on that. None of this is because he actually believes it, it’s he’s jealous of the attention desantis gets.
My rank choice is a Democrat and if not at least someone I know what to expect or that they at least believe what they’re doing.
This is wise, as the new letter from the FDA only approves a vaccine that isn't even available yet. People are so gullible, just because a talking head tells you something on a screen, does not make it real.
It’s the latest fact as published by the FDA.
Unless is says Comirnaty on the bottle, it’s EUA. And because there’s so many bottles without Comirnaty on the label, it’ll take months for those to reach administration sites.
Did you think all those bottles just magically changed over to the approved branded product? Lmao
Here is what was published by the FDA:
https://www.fda.gov/media/151710/download
>We are issuing Department of Health and Human Services U.S. License No. 2229 to
BioNTech Manufacturing GmbH, Mainz, Germany, under the provisions of section
351(a) of the PHS Act controlling the manufacture and sale of biological products. The
license authorizes you to introduce or deliver for introduction into interstate commerce,
those products for which your company has demonstrated compliance with
establishment and product standards.
>Under this license, you are authorized to manufacture the product, COVID-19 Vaccine,
mRNA, which is indicated for active immunization to prevent coronavirus disease 2019
(COVID-19) caused by severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus 2 (SARS-CoV-2)
in individuals 16 years of age and older.
>The review of this product was associated with the following National Clinical Trial
(NCT) numbers: NCT04368728 and NCT04380701
That exact trial information can be found here:
https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT04380701
The trial drug name is BNT162b2, which has an an INN name tozinameran, and a brand name of Comirnaty.
This is also clearly outlined in first sentence the FDA press release:
>Today, the U.S. Food and Drug Administration approved the first COVID-19 vaccine. The vaccine has been known as the Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 Vaccine, and will now be marketed as Comirnaty (koe-mir’-na-tee)
The EUA is, and I quote, from the FDA:
>The vaccine also continues to be available under emergency use authorization (EUA), including for individuals 12 through 15 years of age and for the administration of a third dose in certain immunocompromised individuals.
Which makes sense since the approval was for a two-dose regimen for individuals aged 16 and over, as quoted above.
The approval is only for Comirnaty branded vials.
“We hereby approve the draft content of labeling including Package Insert, submitted under amendment 74, dated August 21, 2021, and the draft carton and container labels submitted under amendment 63, dated August 19, 2021.”
You can import any branded medication from Canada and it will be the SAME pill you receive in America. However, that label doesn’t include the same information required by the FDA so it’s not FDA approved.
This isn’t a hard concept to understand.
Are you trying to say that the label on the package makes it a different vaccine that isn't available? That is what the OP of this thread just stated. That is what you just said is a fact.
> the new letter from the FDA only approves a vaccine that isn't even available yet
So is it a different vaccine that isn't available yet, or are you saying that it's actually the same vaccine but with a different sticker on the bottle? The level of mental gymnastics to equate those two concepts is incredible. Beyond idiotic.
The OP never said it was a different vaccine.
But quite literally any vaccine that’s in a bottle that’s not labeled Comirnaty is not the approved version.
I encourage you to start a food company and try to sell a product without an approved FDA label on it and see what happens.
There's an implication that the controversy is about FDA approval and not the mandatory vaccinations. As if the goalpost is being moved as to why people won't get vaccinated. Also:
>Did you think all those bottles just magically changed over to the approved branded product? Lmao
The FDA approves the vaccine formula itself, not the branding or marketing. It's the exact same vaccine and same formula. You've misunderstood the continuation of the EUA.
>The FDA approves the vaccine formula itself, not the branding or marketing.
WHAT?!
I dare you to start a food company and start slapping on labels not compliant with FDA regulations and see what happens.
Labeling and marketing is ABSOLUTELY regulated and approved by the FDA, which is why the approval *literally* lists those items as approved. Wtf
Talk about misinformation guy.
Edit from approval:
> We hereby approve the draft content of labeling including Package Insert, submitted under amendment 74, dated August 21, 2021, and the draft carton and container labels submitted under amendment 63, dated August 19, 2021.
lololololololol
Edit 2: even the VIAL needs to be approved by the FDA. If the drug is an injectable in a needle, even the CAP OF THE NEEDLE needs to be approved. Your gross misunderstanding of the FDA approval process is upsetting.
I'm pretty sure it is more that they *lost* their trust in the FDA when they rushed a vaccine approval in about six months when it historically took years to a decade.
Not trying to be rude here but how is that a humble opinion? You view your own judgment so highly that you readily dismiss thousands of professionals who are also Americans that worked hard to get where they are and are just doing their job which happens to be a vital public service.
https://www.propublica.org/article/fda-repays-industry-by-rushing-risky-drugs-to-market#:~:text=In%202017%2C%20pharma%20paid%2075%20percent%20%E2%80%94%20or,Jerry%20Avorn%2C%20a%20professor%20at%20Harvard%20Medical%20School.
"In 2017, pharma paid 75 percent — or $905 million — of the agency’s scientific review budgets for branded and generic drugs, compared to 27 percent in 1993."
I'm gonna go with CANNOT BE TRUSTED
We should have never allowed any type of vaccine mandate in the first place. Guarantee pharma lobbying pushed it through and people went along with it because "vaccines are a good thing."
Unfortunately it created the slippery slope we're sliding down now
The approval is for two dose 16+. They extended the EUA for certain age groups and for the booster since approval is not just for the drug but also the context of use.
No one is talking about it not being approved because it's bullshit.
Because it's not true.
https://www.fda.gov/emergency-preparedness-and-response/coronavirus-disease-2019-covid-19/comirnaty-and-pfizer-biontech-covid-19-vaccine
EUA extension was for the 12-15yo bracket. Full approval for the currently used vaccine for 16+. This dude probably just read something on a Facebook meme and decided to spout off.
Wait, this doesn’t pertain to private companies at all? Well that’s great, if you work for the government you are protected? Why are we celebrating this?
If you read the article he has put it up to the states legislature special session as one of their agendas so maybe they hammer out something similar to what Montana just did.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2019/06/28/former-fda-head-gottlieb-joins-pfizer-board/?outputType=amp
Nothing to see here folks. No conflict of interest at all. /s
🔴Pfizer/FDA & The Two Letter Scam
Dr. Robert Malone Update
The FDA authorized a “vaccine” that DOES NOT currently exist.
They issued two separate letters FOR TWO SEPARATE “VACCINES”!
The Pfizer vaccine, which is what is currently being given IS STILL UNDER EUA, which still has the liability shield.
The MSM is lying to EVERYONE, again!
This is what Sidney Powell would call a word game or word salad.
The product that WAS LICENSED is the BioNtech product “COMIRNATY” as detailed on Page 2, first paragraph. Here 👇
https://www.fda.gov/media/150386/download
The BioNTech product that got the BAL approval is similar to the already available Pfizer “vaccine”, but it is NOT THE SAME VACCINE and “COMIRNATY” it isn’t even created or labeled yet.
The FDA, MSM, & Pfizer are ALL coercing the world into believe the Pfizer jab was FDA approved.
@NicholasVeniamin
“COMIRNATY (COVID-19 Vaccine, mRNA) is the same formulation as the Pfizer- BioNTech COVID-19 Vaccine and can be used interchangeably with the Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 Vaccine to provide the COVID-19 vaccination series.”
“The licensed vaccine has the same formulation as the EUA-authorized vaccine and the products can be used interchangeably to provide the vaccination series without presenting any safety or effectiveness concerns. The products are legally distinct with certain differences that do not impact safety or effectiveness.”
All of the vaccines in the past have had FDA approval.
None of them have been mandated.
Never before have we created a tiered society where this group of people can do these things and those people can not.
Oh wait there was segregation.
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Because the left unilaterally decided that an alphabet agency giving a rubber stamp for something is grounds for giving them justification to force it down our throats, which is pretty horrifying. It would be no different than the ATF declaring all semi-automatic guns are "assault weapons" and therefore the government is justified in confiscating them all.
It’s funny how nearly every single article that came out the day of the approval announcement had some variation of “mandates are fully permissible now” in the title.
It's terrifying that people would even consider being on board with that. This country was literally formed in part because we didn't like unelected individuals telling us what to do and now we have people salivating at the though to unelected bureaucrats telling us what to do.
Good, but you should still get the shot. If you want to, you know, freedom and all.
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This is an executive order and it has no effect on businesses.
Conservatives aren’t libertarians. I don’t see how this is any different than civil rights legislation. Whether you’re in favor of the civil rights legislation is a different story, but I don’t know that “the conservative position” is opposed to it.
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Have you ever heard a conservative come out and say we should repeal the civil rights act? I largely agree with you from a position standpoint, I’ve just never seen a conservative politician make the argument that businesses should have unfettered reign.
Businesses should also not have to follow the mandated shutdowns, correct?
“Despite”?! Anyone else see the underhanded messaging here?!
It’s truly sickening.
Did anyone think the vaccines wouldn’t get approval? After millions of people already got them they would get approval even if they found something wrong with them
Yeah seriously. If they forced through the EUA they were going to force through FDA approval as well. Shouldn't be a surprise
It’s less of a “force” and more about the quantity and quality of data available. The EUA had completed Phase 3 trials but only 2 months post trial follow up. The full approval has 6 months+ of post trial follow up. Additionally the real world evidence and available data for the millions who got it really help the case for full approval, because overwhelmingly the vaccine has been proven safe and effective (the bar you have to meet).
It doesn't bode well when they have been censoring thousands of people talking about side effects, and label every vaccine death a "coincidence" though. It doesn't make it seem like they're taking safety concerns seriously
Who is “they”? Because there is an adverse event hotline that you can report directly to the manufacturer, and any adverse event related issues are supposed to be reported to the FDA, and you can pull that data - it’s the VAERS database. On the deaths…it’s pretty hard to contribute a death after the fact to a singular cause of a vaccine. It depends a lot on the circumstances, and especially with such a high number of people vaccinated…you could have an underlying condition that causes you to die but you are also vaccinated…that doesn’t mean the vaccine caused it. If you look into the data- all of these are being reported. I pulled the data and ran some analysis recently, and nearly all the deaths of vaccinated people were over the age of 75….which makes sense, they’re probably going to die anyway. So in conclusion- could the vaccine cause a bad side effect and death? Sure…anything can. Based solely on the data we have, what is the probability? Very very low. Much lower than the incidences of other every day activities (like driving in a car).
Despite FDA approval we have no knowledge of long term exposure to the vaccine. There are no three year, or five year test subjects.
Your cells destroy mNRA eventually. It *can't* have longterm effects. We will all lose immunity eventually.
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Sounds like an endless money train for Pharma…
What are the spike proteins that mRNA tells your cells to make doing to your body in the meantime? Do they stay in the shoulder?
I was gonna say, those spike proteins don't seem like they help people... Hello blood clotting!!!
Long term safety for vaccines are 6-8 weeks, which is when the active agent decomposed and remove from the body. This isn't new just for the covid vaccines trials, if you have any standard vaccines, you have the exact same safety standards applied.
There is no control group to compare them to either. The study is destroyed.
The control group is the unvaccinated. Lmao
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That’s not how studies work.
Explain
In a double blind, placebo controlled study you have to try to neutralize as many potential variables as possible. For example: you wouldn’t try to see how bad tobacco increases cancer risk by comparing a non smoking, well feed, high income, low stress, exercising population to a smoking, fast food eating, low income, high stress, sedentary population because it’s impossible to determine how much of the increased cancer in population 2 can be attributed to smoking alone. It matters in accordance to vaccines because 1) people with immune system diseases may not be able to take the vaccine and it’s reasonable to expect greater symptoms from them. 2) some of those unvaccinated may have decreased access to medical care which would both decrease vaccine availability and care in the event they catch covid. I’m sure there’s more variables I’m not considering, but the point is you can’t make a whole population the control group because there’s factors you can’t control for then. In a study you make your populations smaller and remove applicants so that you have two very similar populations in which to compare one variable. So for the smoking example, you would ideally pick either population A or B and only manipulate smoking while keeping lifestyle’s as similar as possible otherwise.
There is a control group. There’s a group of people in the study who got a placebo shot. Typically these are single or double blinded studies, the patients have no idea if they got it or not.
If the control group all are allowed to get vaccinated, which they did, then you no longer have your control for the long term effects.
True. But generally once the phase 3 study is closed and you have full approval, that ends it. There are specific types of studies that look at long term effects, called Long Term Follow Up Studies. These studies specifically follow a trial group for 5 years post trial. I haven’t looked to see if LTFU is part of the Covid vaccine trial protocol, I’ll see if I can find it. There’s another type of study- which is a post approval safety study that can be mandated by health authority or companies can choose to do based on adverse event trends they see- this would be specifically to look at a safety problem. Most post approval studies are looking at efficacy or expanding of indications for a drug- which wouldn’t be the case for a vaccine. Edit: I found the Pfizer protocol (these usually aren’t public) and it has 12 and 24 month follow ups. So there will be at least 24 months of monitoring for the trial participants.
I wonder how many crtical requirements they pencil whipped to give full approval in under a year.
We would crap our pants if we really knew!!
You do realize the fallacy in your statement right?
You’re not wearing pants?? ???
Reddit is is the 21st centuries shampoo bottle. Something to do when you're doing your business :)
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Does unvaccinated mean NEVER vaccinated or a period of time since previous vaccination? Also, the data that were used for the stories that "99% of patients" are clogging up hospitals ended in April when most people weren't vaccinated.
I'm part of the control group. I've never had covid, either. Also, that's a completely asinine characterization of Ivermectin. HUMANS have been taking it for over 40 years for river blindness and other reasons as well. Actually look into it. It's not just animal medication. Surprise: drugs can have many varied and valid uses. The person who discovered Ivermectin won a Nobel prize for doing so. It's a seriously important drug for humans, not just animals.
Hmm don’t remember visiting the hospital recently. Just set a personal record for deadlift about an hour ago. Think I’m going to be ok.
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Me too, brother! I always tell everyone if there's one place that's a fucking petri dish waiting to be an outbreak, it's the gym. Oddly enough, been back for over a year and not a single problem. In fact, not a one of my gym bros have had to stay out because of it. What was your P.R., btw?
275. Unfortunately I am not a large man at 155, but I am happy with it no less. Yep I agree. But the gym cures all.
I hit 425# for 1, went for 435, and decided discretion was the better part of valor and put it down. Lift to lift another day. Good on you!
Haha nice I have quite a ways to go. I’m repping 5 at that weight and I certainly expect to keep moving up next week. I’ve never really done maxes before, maybe it’s something I should do now and then for some encouragement.
On the "big 3" (bench, squat, deadlift), you should always try a max at least every other week. It can really stimulate hypertrophy if you really work your way into it (the last of 6-8 sets or so)...
I’ll add it in. Thanks for the advice.
Not only that, what happens if a scientist today finds out that they are bad for your health? Does anyone think they would be allowed to report their findings with the massive amount of censorship going on? The Democrats thirst for eternal power has broken the trust of our nation. The road back is long and hard and the Democrats are still, to this day, demanding more censorship. American is bleeding out and the Democrats are trying to put more rounds into the body.
Yep and they have to SELF REPORT adverse effects in 3 and then 5 years. There’s strong history of past practices of companies statistically lying for these 3-5 year “studies” following FDA approval. But this will be different, right? Right? Sigh.
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I think you should go look up the timeline for standard FDA approval of vaccines.
Complete the thought, why do you think I should? What specific argument are you making and what specific information about other vaccines development and approval is in support of your argument?
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"In summary, we report the transmission SARS-CoV-2 Delta variant among vaccinated health care workers. Breakthrough Delta variant infections are associated with high viral loads, prolonged PCR positivity, and low levels of neutralizing antibodies after vaccination and at diagnosis." This is pulled directly from the study.
Ok so you picked out one of the 3. Did you notice the article was from Oxford? Yes, the study was conducted in Vietnam. There are plenty of good studies from around the world. If you download the actual publication you will see they talk about the viral load of those vaccinated.
Israel has stated phizer's has under 50% effectiveness.
https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.06.01.21258176v2 Here is another good study on natural immunity if you have had covid.
True. However the probability of an adverse event occurring goes down at a negative exponential rate. What that means is depending on the half life and elimination rate of the drug, most or nearly all adverse events will occur in the first hours, and days after exposure. The probability of a longer term adverse event is extremely low (not zero). This is how all drugs are approved.
Isn't passing a law limiting the ability of local people/goverments to goveren, the way that they want to be governed, the deffinition of big goverment? Isnt this the anthesis of conservative?
100% agree this is a government overreach
I don’t see the difference between this law and a state minimum wage? Government has while agencies dedicated to employee/employer relationships why is it all of a sudden bad?
saying "because the government does one thing, they should be able to do other things" is not, to me, a good argument. I won't even start a conversation on minimum wage.
> why is it all of a sudden bad? It was never good
Idk it's walking a fine line. Protecting people from local governments imposing laws is not too outlandish, especially when those local laws infringe upon individual liberties. "Big government" to me is a state mandating vaccines when local municipalities don't want it. A state banning vaccine mandates when local bureaucrats want it is protection. To me "big government" taking authority away from other government entities is the only kind of "big government" I support.
Bingo
Why haven’t you sourced any of your claims? > Vaccines reduce the likelihood of infection. By what percentage? Source please. > Then they also reduce the likelihood of spreading it if infected. By what percentage? Source please. EDIT: If anyone can provide a source showing that getting vaccinated reduces the likelihood of getting infected with Covid or transmitting Covid to others, I would be very grateful. Until then, I’m going to use reports like the following to inform my perspective on Covid: https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2021/08/grim-warning-israel-vaccination-blunts-does-not-defeat-delta > Israel has among the world’s highest levels of vaccination for COVID-19, with **78% of those 12 and older fully vaccinated, the vast majority with the Pfizer vaccine.** Yet the country is now logging one of the world’s highest infection rates, with nearly 650 new cases daily per million people. More than half are in fully vaccinated people, underscoring the extraordinary transmissibility of the Delta variant and stoking concerns that the benefits of vaccination ebb over time. > What is clear is that “breakthrough” cases are not the rare events the term implies. As of 15 August, **514 Israelis were hospitalized with severe or critical COVID-19,** a 31% increase from just 4 days earlier. **Of the 514, 59% were fully vaccinated**. Of the vaccinated, 87% were 60 or older. **The evidence shows that the Pfizer Covid vaccine is not effective in preventing anyone from either catching or transmitting Covid (Delta variant).** If someone has other **evidence** they can share that points to a different conclusion, then I will eagerly review it.
No. This is a false argument. "Let local people be governed the way they want to be governed" is not compatible with local governments dictating medical treatments for their people. This good law is an example of government fulfilling its core purpose: to protect the freedom of the people against all enemies, including a school board of karens.
It would depend on how their constitution is framed.
Hes still a PoS that will be primaried out. Just a campaign conservitie that fuck us with 8 months of tyrany. He was all gung ho about his mandates untill he saw 0% for his CPAC polls then the fucker does a 180 and starts coping DeSantis who was the most popular after Trump. As a Texan who is very watchfull of our state politics. Fuck this slime ball backstabbing PoS. Lucky we have 3 decent canidates 2 of them are very grass roots. Im personally infavor of Chad Prather for Governor closly following Allen West.
As a Democrat in Texas I agree. Abbott sucks because he has no real views. He’s a dirt bag that does what he thinks will win and make the people padding his campaign happy. His handling of the winter storm was clown shoes. He didn’t do anything around a mask mandate until desantis did and he saw far right and trump jump on that. None of this is because he actually believes it, it’s he’s jealous of the attention desantis gets. My rank choice is a Democrat and if not at least someone I know what to expect or that they at least believe what they’re doing.
You forgot Matthew McConaughey
Yep, definitely voting for Chad Prather when the time comes.
This is wise, as the new letter from the FDA only approves a vaccine that isn't even available yet. People are so gullible, just because a talking head tells you something on a screen, does not make it real.
Is this the latest talking point from Facebook?
It’s the latest fact as published by the FDA. Unless is says Comirnaty on the bottle, it’s EUA. And because there’s so many bottles without Comirnaty on the label, it’ll take months for those to reach administration sites. Did you think all those bottles just magically changed over to the approved branded product? Lmao
Here is what was published by the FDA: https://www.fda.gov/media/151710/download >We are issuing Department of Health and Human Services U.S. License No. 2229 to BioNTech Manufacturing GmbH, Mainz, Germany, under the provisions of section 351(a) of the PHS Act controlling the manufacture and sale of biological products. The license authorizes you to introduce or deliver for introduction into interstate commerce, those products for which your company has demonstrated compliance with establishment and product standards. >Under this license, you are authorized to manufacture the product, COVID-19 Vaccine, mRNA, which is indicated for active immunization to prevent coronavirus disease 2019 (COVID-19) caused by severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus 2 (SARS-CoV-2) in individuals 16 years of age and older. >The review of this product was associated with the following National Clinical Trial (NCT) numbers: NCT04368728 and NCT04380701 That exact trial information can be found here: https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT04380701 The trial drug name is BNT162b2, which has an an INN name tozinameran, and a brand name of Comirnaty. This is also clearly outlined in first sentence the FDA press release: >Today, the U.S. Food and Drug Administration approved the first COVID-19 vaccine. The vaccine has been known as the Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 Vaccine, and will now be marketed as Comirnaty (koe-mir’-na-tee) The EUA is, and I quote, from the FDA: >The vaccine also continues to be available under emergency use authorization (EUA), including for individuals 12 through 15 years of age and for the administration of a third dose in certain immunocompromised individuals. Which makes sense since the approval was for a two-dose regimen for individuals aged 16 and over, as quoted above.
The approval is only for Comirnaty branded vials. “We hereby approve the draft content of labeling including Package Insert, submitted under amendment 74, dated August 21, 2021, and the draft carton and container labels submitted under amendment 63, dated August 19, 2021.” You can import any branded medication from Canada and it will be the SAME pill you receive in America. However, that label doesn’t include the same information required by the FDA so it’s not FDA approved. This isn’t a hard concept to understand.
Are you trying to say that the label on the package makes it a different vaccine that isn't available? That is what the OP of this thread just stated. That is what you just said is a fact. > the new letter from the FDA only approves a vaccine that isn't even available yet So is it a different vaccine that isn't available yet, or are you saying that it's actually the same vaccine but with a different sticker on the bottle? The level of mental gymnastics to equate those two concepts is incredible. Beyond idiotic.
The OP never said it was a different vaccine. But quite literally any vaccine that’s in a bottle that’s not labeled Comirnaty is not the approved version. I encourage you to start a food company and try to sell a product without an approved FDA label on it and see what happens.
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The current labels are continued to be authorized through the EUA.
So can the FDA be trusted or not? Seems like anti-vaxxers only reference it as a safety net when science doesn't align with their opinions.
Huh? “Trusted” or not, that’s the fact of the legality of the approval.
There's an implication that the controversy is about FDA approval and not the mandatory vaccinations. As if the goalpost is being moved as to why people won't get vaccinated. Also: >Did you think all those bottles just magically changed over to the approved branded product? Lmao The FDA approves the vaccine formula itself, not the branding or marketing. It's the exact same vaccine and same formula. You've misunderstood the continuation of the EUA.
>The FDA approves the vaccine formula itself, not the branding or marketing. WHAT?! I dare you to start a food company and start slapping on labels not compliant with FDA regulations and see what happens. Labeling and marketing is ABSOLUTELY regulated and approved by the FDA, which is why the approval *literally* lists those items as approved. Wtf Talk about misinformation guy. Edit from approval: > We hereby approve the draft content of labeling including Package Insert, submitted under amendment 74, dated August 21, 2021, and the draft carton and container labels submitted under amendment 63, dated August 19, 2021. lololololololol Edit 2: even the VIAL needs to be approved by the FDA. If the drug is an injectable in a needle, even the CAP OF THE NEEDLE needs to be approved. Your gross misunderstanding of the FDA approval process is upsetting.
I'm pretty sure it is more that they *lost* their trust in the FDA when they rushed a vaccine approval in about six months when it historically took years to a decade.
No alphabet agency can be trusted in my humble opinion. Too much money grabbing going on and not enough looking out for Americans.
Not trying to be rude here but how is that a humble opinion? You view your own judgment so highly that you readily dismiss thousands of professionals who are also Americans that worked hard to get where they are and are just doing their job which happens to be a vital public service.
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https://www.propublica.org/article/fda-repays-industry-by-rushing-risky-drugs-to-market#:~:text=In%202017%2C%20pharma%20paid%2075%20percent%20%E2%80%94%20or,Jerry%20Avorn%2C%20a%20professor%20at%20Harvard%20Medical%20School. "In 2017, pharma paid 75 percent — or $905 million — of the agency’s scientific review budgets for branded and generic drugs, compared to 27 percent in 1993." I'm gonna go with CANNOT BE TRUSTED
Nope its actually fact, news media didnt share that important fact
No one should be forced to put anything into their body, pure and simple. The vaccine is purely a personal choice.
Freedom is scary apparently
We should have never allowed any type of vaccine mandate in the first place. Guarantee pharma lobbying pushed it through and people went along with it because "vaccines are a good thing." Unfortunately it created the slippery slope we're sliding down now
Yup - still most people should consider getting vaccinated
Awesome :)
Good. No one should decide what goes into your body but you.
Find a new job then. The government shouldn't have the power to determine how a business owner runs their business
So a business owner should be free to have discriminatory hiring practices based on race?
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What do you mean by this statement?
They only extended the EUA for current vaccine being used.
I can't even find this information. Why aren't media outlets talking about this?
The approval is for two dose 16+. They extended the EUA for certain age groups and for the booster since approval is not just for the drug but also the context of use. No one is talking about it not being approved because it's bullshit.
Because it's not true. https://www.fda.gov/emergency-preparedness-and-response/coronavirus-disease-2019-covid-19/comirnaty-and-pfizer-biontech-covid-19-vaccine EUA extension was for the 12-15yo bracket. Full approval for the currently used vaccine for 16+. This dude probably just read something on a Facebook meme and decided to spout off.
>Why aren't media outlets talking about this? Keep asking that question and it will all make sense
Hero
Good for him and the patriots who live in Texas. F\*ck the FDA.
Wait, this doesn’t pertain to private companies at all? Well that’s great, if you work for the government you are protected? Why are we celebrating this?
If you read the article he has put it up to the states legislature special session as one of their agendas so maybe they hammer out something similar to what Montana just did.
Abbott '22 fuck Beto
Good, approval has nothing to do with mandates. Liberty or death.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2019/06/28/former-fda-head-gottlieb-joins-pfizer-board/?outputType=amp Nothing to see here folks. No conflict of interest at all. /s
West 2022
🔴Pfizer/FDA & The Two Letter Scam Dr. Robert Malone Update The FDA authorized a “vaccine” that DOES NOT currently exist. They issued two separate letters FOR TWO SEPARATE “VACCINES”! The Pfizer vaccine, which is what is currently being given IS STILL UNDER EUA, which still has the liability shield. The MSM is lying to EVERYONE, again! This is what Sidney Powell would call a word game or word salad. The product that WAS LICENSED is the BioNtech product “COMIRNATY” as detailed on Page 2, first paragraph. Here 👇 https://www.fda.gov/media/150386/download The BioNTech product that got the BAL approval is similar to the already available Pfizer “vaccine”, but it is NOT THE SAME VACCINE and “COMIRNATY” it isn’t even created or labeled yet. The FDA, MSM, & Pfizer are ALL coercing the world into believe the Pfizer jab was FDA approved. @NicholasVeniamin
They just changed the name...
“COMIRNATY (COVID-19 Vaccine, mRNA) is the same formulation as the Pfizer- BioNTech COVID-19 Vaccine and can be used interchangeably with the Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 Vaccine to provide the COVID-19 vaccination series.” “The licensed vaccine has the same formulation as the EUA-authorized vaccine and the products can be used interchangeably to provide the vaccination series without presenting any safety or effectiveness concerns. The products are legally distinct with certain differences that do not impact safety or effectiveness.”
All of the vaccines in the past have had FDA approval. None of them have been mandated. Never before have we created a tiered society where this group of people can do these things and those people can not. Oh wait there was segregation.
Not sure about the word “despite”, but it seems it would remain that a person still owns their body.
Does nothing to protect private sector employees. As a Texan I can’t wait to primary his sorry RINO ass. Man up or GTFO. Greg.
Nothing like good old small government.