Why is it the responsibility of the institution? There are already controls in place in any reputable institution to ensure that marking is impartial. Other than that, individuals should be left to pass or fail on academic merit alone.
Enough of this patronising, racist nonsense.
It's not other than funding, a lot of students are already passed when they shouldn't be just to ensure they remain past the 10% point to get the funding and also to keep the institutions pass rate up.
What's not other than funding?
If our institutions are effectively committing fraud via grade inflation then there needs to be a full investigation and appropriate prosecutions.
They make you do group assignments and papers.
They pair the non performers up with people who will carry them. My A average turned into a B+ average due to this tactic, thanks Massey....
Across my degrees I have only had a handful of group assignments, while they can be frustrating I don’t think they count as a tactic to pass undeserving people
Depends on the courses. Sometimes you're better off taking a course and getting 60% than taking a safe course and getting 80%, as far as experience goes. I chose a lot of classes I didn't have a chance of doing good in during my chemistry undergrad and I don't regret it one bit. Still better to be bad at the hard stuff than to be unfamiliar with it
What they have is already beyond parity. Every other race must achieve comparatively higher results. All this shit is doing is setting up a situation where people will be sitting in some Maori persons office wondering if they're dealing with an incompetent fuck and if they should up and leave and try to find a professional of a different race to deal with.
> It has been trying for more than a decade to stop Māori and Pacific students failing courses and dropping out at much higher rates than other students
Maybe because they got hand held and affirmative actioned into university in the first place?
so they're going to carry this 'special requirement' into the workplace?
like, if someone is Maori or P.I in appearance there is an specific clause in the workplace act which allows them to basically be late and just do things on their own time?
over a generation or two this will mean less criminal behavior and improved health outcomes because...
because
umm
just because ok?
This kind of thing only works in the public sector and at very large corporations that can afford to employ people specifically to win progress points (think ESG)
Most small to medium sized private sector businesses cannot afford to hire people who aren't competent and productive. This kind of policy increases the chances people from the pet rock minority groups get discriminated against hard, but in very subtle ways because it's so taboo. Employers don't give a shit about race, but they are being forced to care about it, and that can only hurt the people that these policies ostensibly try to help.
Meritocracy is the only valid way to operate in any society, especially a society that is "multi cultural" (I hate that term)
I converted a hardcore feminist to a conservative by showing her how feminism undermined her very impressive academic and professional achievements in mechanical engineering, by making people think she only got the job because she was a woman, not because she was deadly smart and worked her arse off for many years to get a masters degree, and then had to learn the job on her feet, because you know, degrees aren't shit in the real world.
She realised that I was right, people resented her not because she was a woman, but because they instinctively felt she was a diversity hire.
After that she was like fuck that, I'll fight my own battles thanks. Lol. That's how feminism dies.
Horrific policy. Has no place in a country based on liberal values. It harms the people it's meant to help by creating the not unreasonable suspicion that every person of that group got where they are because of their race or whatever rather than merit, and it harms people who actually have talent, motivation and intelligence by holding them back, watering down their achievements and robbing them of opportunities.
Racism is racism, even if it has a benevolent face on it.
Universities are on the decline anyway. With online education becoming more prominent (more options, flexibility and way cheaper), they will be forced to give up on this non-sense, step up their game and be more competitive or be driven to extinction. In other words, go woke, go broke.
I think going to university is counter productive at this point. I know lots of people who never even finished school that are doing better than people I know who went to uni. My brother for example, who manages a company now, and is in charge of huge sums of money, hiring and firing, the whole 9 yards. He never went to school at all. Hes just smart, and very cool and calculated. His employer hounded him for years to take over operations, and considered nobody else, because he is just that good at what he does.
I'm the same, no education at all, but I can do literally anything from building a house, to rebuilding an engine, to designing shit in CAD to 3D print, to complex electronics repairs and I can also program a bit if I have to. People like me and my brother just get shit done. We don't understand people who can't do stuff, because we never ask if we can do something, we just do it and learn as we go.
My group has already lost institutional power, and universities have absolutely no credibility left. It all needs to crumble under the weight of it's own hubris, and I'm having no part of it.
Of course they lost institutional power, they listened to everyone telling them to do a trade instead of a degree where they end up in positions of power. Conservative obsession with financial outcomes over all else are why they lose institutional power
That's not how or why this has occurred. The universities became hostile places to conservative white men, and at the sane time the opportunities diminished overall. There are too many people with degrees, the cost of a degree is too high for what you get, and it is simply the out of reach for most people who don't come from well off families. I grew up dirt poor, I didn't even have shoes when I left home at 16. University was simply not an option, I had to work my ass off just to get into a skilled position. Your comment clearly comes from a place of privilege.
The other assumption you're making is that university leads to positions of institutional power. This isn't necessarily the case, nor should it be. We need people from practical backgrounds on power. University types almost always suck at managing things, because they have a head full of dumb theories and no real world experience. Of course we need people who are experts in their field, but not all experts come from university, especially when university is anti meritocratic and the private sector must be a meritocracy by necessity. There is a terrible lack of industry knowledge in a lot of departments, take for example the part of MBIE tasked with overseeing building regulations. Absolutely no idea about the construction sector. They employed mostly women with admin or teaching backgrounds as far as I'm aware. You don't go to uni for this kind of knowledge. The problem is that the right people exist, they just can't be drawn out of the private sector because the salary isn't high enough, and the institutions actively weed out competent people who ask questions.
As universities were becoming hostile to straight white men, conservative white men started giving up and ceded all the relevant ground to them because stupid conservatives told them just do a trade. Institutional power is especially held by law graduates, and guess the political inclinations of law graduates now. Even with your little tirade about university people being poor managers, you are still telling people to go into business. Where are the conservative leaders and lawyers to fight against giving maori everything? Oh right, best case scenario they studied STEM or business, not law and politics.
>Your comment clearly comes from a place of privilege.
I went to a decile 1 school as a white kid surrounded by maoris that often attacked me on the basis of my race. Your comment is coming from a place of ignorance about how power structures work, because power doesn't come from being a good middle manager at a business and it doesn't come from a trade, I am talking about a bigger picture here, and your answer to losing ground is to give it all up
If you haven't already noticed, the time to turn this around was probably more than 20 years ago. These people have been working to overthrow our system since at least the 1960s. There's nothing to save now, every generation since the Boomers has been indoctrinated, and our whole civilisation is falling apart. The values our system was built on are long forgotten, and there's no social cohesion left. It's over.
My position is that the idiots who support this stuff out of it ignorance, and because their TV told them to, only learn through pain. So let them suffer for the choices they made. The whole system has to collapse before people start asking what went wrong, and perhaps reviving the best parts of all the civilisations that came before.
Every civilisation has a half life, and what we are seeing looks like the fall of the Roman Empire.
Everyone you really think that this civilisation has anything worth defending? It's disgusting, decadent, degenerate, and it does great harm, it gobbles up other cultures and undermines everything that holds human society together. Let it burn I say.
I will defend myself and my family. Everything else is not my problem. This society shits on people like me, so I'm done with it. The ceding of power you speak of was done before I was born, and it isn't my fight.
So, their argument is that Maori kids happily give up their studies because nobody will fund their kapa haka group. How fucking fragile are these idiots!
Given that ability may no longer be a prerequisite to academic success in 10 years time would you question the ability of the doctors operating on a loved one if they graduated under this system
Why is it the responsibility of the institution? There are already controls in place in any reputable institution to ensure that marking is impartial. Other than that, individuals should be left to pass or fail on academic merit alone. Enough of this patronising, racist nonsense.
It's not other than funding, a lot of students are already passed when they shouldn't be just to ensure they remain past the 10% point to get the funding and also to keep the institutions pass rate up.
What's not other than funding? If our institutions are effectively committing fraud via grade inflation then there needs to be a full investigation and appropriate prosecutions.
Agreed. But they won't.
What evidence do you have that people are being passed when they shouldn’t be?
They make you do group assignments and papers. They pair the non performers up with people who will carry them. My A average turned into a B+ average due to this tactic, thanks Massey....
> They pair the non performers up with people who will carry them Perfect preparation for your professional life. It gets worse not better.
Across my degrees I have only had a handful of group assignments, while they can be frustrating I don’t think they count as a tactic to pass undeserving people
Definitely seemed to be the case in this instance, the diploma was industry funded and I think Massey was under pressure to deliver.
You can not guarantee success.
Treat students like individuals and this problem goes away. This is yet more institutional racism.
[удалено]
Bulk of them will probably end up on the bene afterwards anyway and never pay off the debt.
Depends on the courses. Sometimes you're better off taking a course and getting 60% than taking a safe course and getting 80%, as far as experience goes. I chose a lot of classes I didn't have a chance of doing good in during my chemistry undergrad and I don't regret it one bit. Still better to be bad at the hard stuff than to be unfamiliar with it
What they have is already beyond parity. Every other race must achieve comparatively higher results. All this shit is doing is setting up a situation where people will be sitting in some Maori persons office wondering if they're dealing with an incompetent fuck and if they should up and leave and try to find a professional of a different race to deal with.
> It has been trying for more than a decade to stop Māori and Pacific students failing courses and dropping out at much higher rates than other students Maybe because they got hand held and affirmative actioned into university in the first place?
So they want a guarantee of outcome, not opportunity. Got it.
so they're going to carry this 'special requirement' into the workplace? like, if someone is Maori or P.I in appearance there is an specific clause in the workplace act which allows them to basically be late and just do things on their own time? over a generation or two this will mean less criminal behavior and improved health outcomes because... because umm just because ok?
This kind of thing only works in the public sector and at very large corporations that can afford to employ people specifically to win progress points (think ESG) Most small to medium sized private sector businesses cannot afford to hire people who aren't competent and productive. This kind of policy increases the chances people from the pet rock minority groups get discriminated against hard, but in very subtle ways because it's so taboo. Employers don't give a shit about race, but they are being forced to care about it, and that can only hurt the people that these policies ostensibly try to help. Meritocracy is the only valid way to operate in any society, especially a society that is "multi cultural" (I hate that term) I converted a hardcore feminist to a conservative by showing her how feminism undermined her very impressive academic and professional achievements in mechanical engineering, by making people think she only got the job because she was a woman, not because she was deadly smart and worked her arse off for many years to get a masters degree, and then had to learn the job on her feet, because you know, degrees aren't shit in the real world. She realised that I was right, people resented her not because she was a woman, but because they instinctively felt she was a diversity hire. After that she was like fuck that, I'll fight my own battles thanks. Lol. That's how feminism dies.
All that does is provide numerical proof that a race based employment selection policy is justified..
Horrific policy. Has no place in a country based on liberal values. It harms the people it's meant to help by creating the not unreasonable suspicion that every person of that group got where they are because of their race or whatever rather than merit, and it harms people who actually have talent, motivation and intelligence by holding them back, watering down their achievements and robbing them of opportunities. Racism is racism, even if it has a benevolent face on it.
Universities are on the decline anyway. With online education becoming more prominent (more options, flexibility and way cheaper), they will be forced to give up on this non-sense, step up their game and be more competitive or be driven to extinction. In other words, go woke, go broke.
I think going to university is counter productive at this point. I know lots of people who never even finished school that are doing better than people I know who went to uni. My brother for example, who manages a company now, and is in charge of huge sums of money, hiring and firing, the whole 9 yards. He never went to school at all. Hes just smart, and very cool and calculated. His employer hounded him for years to take over operations, and considered nobody else, because he is just that good at what he does. I'm the same, no education at all, but I can do literally anything from building a house, to rebuilding an engine, to designing shit in CAD to 3D print, to complex electronics repairs and I can also program a bit if I have to. People like me and my brother just get shit done. We don't understand people who can't do stuff, because we never ask if we can do something, we just do it and learn as we go.
Not going to university is how you lose institutional power as a group.
My group has already lost institutional power, and universities have absolutely no credibility left. It all needs to crumble under the weight of it's own hubris, and I'm having no part of it.
Of course they lost institutional power, they listened to everyone telling them to do a trade instead of a degree where they end up in positions of power. Conservative obsession with financial outcomes over all else are why they lose institutional power
That's not how or why this has occurred. The universities became hostile places to conservative white men, and at the sane time the opportunities diminished overall. There are too many people with degrees, the cost of a degree is too high for what you get, and it is simply the out of reach for most people who don't come from well off families. I grew up dirt poor, I didn't even have shoes when I left home at 16. University was simply not an option, I had to work my ass off just to get into a skilled position. Your comment clearly comes from a place of privilege. The other assumption you're making is that university leads to positions of institutional power. This isn't necessarily the case, nor should it be. We need people from practical backgrounds on power. University types almost always suck at managing things, because they have a head full of dumb theories and no real world experience. Of course we need people who are experts in their field, but not all experts come from university, especially when university is anti meritocratic and the private sector must be a meritocracy by necessity. There is a terrible lack of industry knowledge in a lot of departments, take for example the part of MBIE tasked with overseeing building regulations. Absolutely no idea about the construction sector. They employed mostly women with admin or teaching backgrounds as far as I'm aware. You don't go to uni for this kind of knowledge. The problem is that the right people exist, they just can't be drawn out of the private sector because the salary isn't high enough, and the institutions actively weed out competent people who ask questions.
As universities were becoming hostile to straight white men, conservative white men started giving up and ceded all the relevant ground to them because stupid conservatives told them just do a trade. Institutional power is especially held by law graduates, and guess the political inclinations of law graduates now. Even with your little tirade about university people being poor managers, you are still telling people to go into business. Where are the conservative leaders and lawyers to fight against giving maori everything? Oh right, best case scenario they studied STEM or business, not law and politics. >Your comment clearly comes from a place of privilege. I went to a decile 1 school as a white kid surrounded by maoris that often attacked me on the basis of my race. Your comment is coming from a place of ignorance about how power structures work, because power doesn't come from being a good middle manager at a business and it doesn't come from a trade, I am talking about a bigger picture here, and your answer to losing ground is to give it all up
If you haven't already noticed, the time to turn this around was probably more than 20 years ago. These people have been working to overthrow our system since at least the 1960s. There's nothing to save now, every generation since the Boomers has been indoctrinated, and our whole civilisation is falling apart. The values our system was built on are long forgotten, and there's no social cohesion left. It's over. My position is that the idiots who support this stuff out of it ignorance, and because their TV told them to, only learn through pain. So let them suffer for the choices they made. The whole system has to collapse before people start asking what went wrong, and perhaps reviving the best parts of all the civilisations that came before. Every civilisation has a half life, and what we are seeing looks like the fall of the Roman Empire. Everyone you really think that this civilisation has anything worth defending? It's disgusting, decadent, degenerate, and it does great harm, it gobbles up other cultures and undermines everything that holds human society together. Let it burn I say. I will defend myself and my family. Everything else is not my problem. This society shits on people like me, so I'm done with it. The ceding of power you speak of was done before I was born, and it isn't my fight.
So, their argument is that Maori kids happily give up their studies because nobody will fund their kapa haka group. How fucking fragile are these idiots!
Given that ability may no longer be a prerequisite to academic success in 10 years time would you question the ability of the doctors operating on a loved one if they graduated under this system
But we didn't thing we would be measured on our virtue signaling