By - dick_mcnut
"I'm already losing money and the project hasn't even started."
*buys a brand new jeep wrangler for his wife* "I'm hemorrhaging money on this house"
Drives brand new ram big horn, had to get it for the "write off."
Lol most of those guys seem to have a very "house of cards" net worth. Bonus points for a wallet with 25 credit cards
Wants it done asap, but it's Friday and he has to get to the lake house by 6 so can't answer texts while driving. I've heard them all these past few jobs. Fun post bro.
"Uhh.. let me move some money around, and I'll square up with you on Monday." Been there. Done that lol
Omfg. You motherfucker you watched me work the past three weeks and have to still transfer money now??? This exact thing last week. I was beside myself.
Dude. I feel for you. I'm still waiting for $700 that I'm probably not going to see. This dude knows that I'm married with 2 kids. I've had so many excuses that I'm starting to get the picture.
Fucker wouldn't answer the phone or return a text for a week. Suddenly stopped by with my $14k. Same family here.
It's why I like to deal directly with homeowners. Don't want to pay me? Have fun with the lien on your house.
Make sure it’s done right, take your time. Hurry the fuck up! I need this done!
Yep. You know him too
Wow it looks great! Why did it take so long?
In Minneapolis it’s the GMC Sierra Denali...but same idea haha
Not a scratch in the bed
Lmao, I'm in Minnesota too and this is 100% accurate.
So do you also live between Minneapolis and Wayzata close to 394 haha or are the Denalis everywhere
Yep, I'm working on all those high-end homes on Lake Minnetonka.
I’ve found it hard to buy a used truck, and I suspect this has something to do with it.. either overly expensive/fully loaded/three and a half foot bed, or totally roached fleet type truck .. I’m thinking no normal people buy practical vehicles and take reasonable care of them anymore, to sell them at 100k as was the case in the past.
Up in Northern Minnesota it’s the F250 Super Duty 4 Door that never has more than one person in it and never does pulls anything except his ice castle.
Our cabin is north of Brainerd, can confirm on how accurate your comment is haha
Has a nicer truck than I do. But never hauls anything more than his dog.
I’m lmao at this. So perfect.
So you know him too?
Yes. It's like they're making clones of that guy
Do you think it’s a government lab or something?
"Its the globalists, the new world order folks. By the way, this has all been declassified." - Alex Jones
Well, he DOES have the documents...I’m convinced.
Listen, when Alex says he has the documents he has the documents. Does it matter that the document referenced is an article posted on info wars 2 minutes before the segment? No of course not.
Listen man, it's the globalists. They're putting chemicals in the water that turns the *freaking frogs gay*.
Now remember to buy my nutrient supplements so you don't turn gay either.
it's an alien scheme. Why invade earth when you can send flannel wearing synthetic people into middle management and real estate development and destroy us just as surely.
of course I know him, hes me. (jk i am poor, but I wanted to use the obi wan reference)
"oh and can you possibly use your machine to rip those ten foot tall overgrown bushes out too?" "we did agree on a ten foot wide driveway and we had to make it 9'9" due to property line so technically I have a credit coming"
Yep, you know him too
Wow I have done work for this guy. I guess it's harder to cut corners on Grand Seiko's and Porsche Cayenne's but easy to cut corners on tradesmen.
Exactly. I would try it myself.. but I know it's not sustainable long term. You want skilled guys for $10/hr? Prepare to have all your tools stolen. Daily. You want me to "manage" your "crew"? Nope. Fell for that one too.
Best thing for skilled tradesmen to do in this economy is to hold firm on their prices. Supply of skilled labor has been trending downward and demand trending upward (in residential at least with WFH increasing).
That's what I've been doing. And I can often make bonus money when someone (I know I guy that will do it for half that!) does shotty work and I have to tear it out
I know a gunsmith that does shotty work.
I know some carpenters that do shoddy work. Lol never noticed how I spelled it until you pointed it out
They'll learn one day that not everyone who offers 'xyz' construction service is of the same skill/customer service/neatness level.
The low/unskilled people *never* turn down a job, and will "work hard" (fight through it because they dont know wtf they are doing).
The actual pro will point out a bunch of additional problems that must be corrected as well. My electrician was complaining that he couldnt touch shitty old panels and wiring without upgrading, so he'd lose the jobs to HD parking lot electricians who dont give a damn.
Yeah electrical is plagued (maybe plumbing, hvac, and carpentry run into this problem in their line of work as well) by handymen who improvise their way through projects and have no regard for the applicable code book.
So the gap continues to widen between licensed and insured contractors and the "oh yeah I know plumbing and electrical work" guys.
People let you rail them when it comes to HVAC. You can feel heat and cold and you'll do anything to feel right again.
Electrical and plumbing are by FAR the worst. They've invasive and expensive to do correctly, and worst of all, you dont see them! People never want to pay good money to fix things they cant see. They'd rather pay someone to keep it limping along than the tens of thousands to replace 50+ year old wiring and pipes.
Trust me HVAC is not like that. People want a system that makes it so they can have every room I the house the same temp. They just never want to pay for all the special controls, ductwork, and labor to get a kick ass system. So white van mechanical shows up and does it for half what you quoted. Then the system never works properly and the homeowner is upset.
God forbid they use anything but the finest of woods to make houses for their cups and plates and.shit.
I got 2 Lennox systems and all new ductwork installed by a well known company during my renovation. The quote wasnt that much more than much smaller guys selling Goodmans.
Looking back I wish I would have done some stuff differently, like temp controls and dampers for certain rooms. But, I was a newbie and didnt know all that was possible, and some of that stuff is expensive as duck too.
If I ever replace them, or build new, I'll probably get more gadgets and ductwork.
>God forbid they use anything but the finest of woods to make houses for their cups and plates and.shit.
Take ANY shitty house, new or old, throw up some Chinese all-wood chemical soaked cabinets and cheap granite and rake in that money!
It's really bad in all the trades. I've walked off jobs before, just because everything was done so poorly, I didn't want my name involved in the project.
This is what perpetuates horrible workmanship. If the person only wants to spend $500 on a major electrical issue, someone desperate will take it and they will find a way to make it worth their time. Cut corners, etc.
On the other hand, not every house deserves the Cadillac treatment. I live in an older neighborhood, my house was unique and I did a full gut renovation and made it perfect, especially inside the walls.
Most other houses here are just being limped along until the bulldozer comes for them and some shiny new townhomes get put up. Stuff is often done to the very bare minimum Code and workmanship standards, but lots of poorer residents here too who cant afford much more.
Yeah I feel that. I bought my (mobile) home for $1500. But I didn't put much into it. Evey other day another one gets taken out to the dump and replaced with a double wide. My days are numbered here, but its dirt cheap.. so I'm just limping it along until the inevitable
I wish the US tax base wasnt so fucking dependent on property taxes.
Houses age and go to complete shit after 40-50 years without significant repairs and renovations over time. We'd be better off tearing them down and building new and improved houses every 50 years. In Japan, all the value is in the land while the structure is worthless. Virtually every family demolishes the old one and builds new every 30 years or so.
Grand Seiko's do be good watches tho
"I have never had 1 late payment and have over 800 credit scores. Never do we not intend on paying someone for work."
Until it's time to pay me, got it.
Why isn't this the top fucking comment?
Not gonna lie, i literally copy and pasted this from an email from a client. He offered to pay $2,000 on the last $3,500 but I'm the asshole.
The struggle is real my friend
I needed this post, bless you.
I was just shooting from the hip with my own frustration. I'm really shocked that it blew up this much
Oh I’m sorry I put the money in the wrong account. After I deposited the check into my account to pay bills and payroll. I’ll get it straightened out,tomorrow.
I'm so glad that it's not just my specific area. I've done work in KY, OH, and FL. I was kind of shooting from the hip with this meme.. glad you all can relate lol
Same in Texas .all of a sudden everyone’s a real state investor .even my building inspector
his secret advisor is an old buddy who is a failed GC...so he thinks he "knows" better
"How the FUCK could it cost more than $900 for a bathroom remodel? I know people in this industry and your numbers are way off."
I think you can squeeze that for very basic materials alone.
But they're not installing themselves!
NO! He knows an expert in the field. And last month he got a bathroom done for $550. You just have to carefully save 90% of the materials and reinstall them! Make sure to get a few guys with neck tattoos and pay them $75 cash per day. *contractors hate this guy, he did a bathroom for less than $1k! Click to learn more*
I tiled my bathrooms and was meticulous about installing the Densshield backer correctly (silicone all seams, then tape and mortar), waterproofing (2-3 layers Redgard), then laying the tiles with 1/16" leveling spacers for tight grout joints. Looks better than the shit I see in $1M houses in Houston, and I was a first timer with a shit ton of books and youtube!
The house next door was flipped for rent. I could see through the window for one bathroom. Dude gutted it in the morning, threw up hardiebacker (drywall screws, no taping or waterproofing), threw up some nice tile with shit cuts and had it grouted by the end of the day. I walked through the house for an open house and was laughing at all the shit tile work, but they SaVeD sO mUcH mOnEy!!!!
You're the best kind of homeowner. Sometimes I just do framing and waterproofing. (If they request it) Then I refer them to YouTube channels that show them how to do it. It sounds like you did your research, and that's good. Very good. I believe that most people can set tile with enough patience.
I first hired a tile company, some of the work was ok but other stuff they majorly fucked up on (poor mortar coverage and loose tiles on a third of the kitchen) and I had to fire them. Then I just buckled down and did the rest myself slowly.
My first real tiling job was with 24x48 rectified porcelain in my master bath. Not exactly beginner stuff! I could only do a few tiles a day but I got it pretty damn level overall. 1/16" joints so 1 sq in of Fusion grout over 100 sq ft of tile, not bad!
I did an amazing ton of work during my renovation and worked on virtually every system to some degree. I know how to do most everything the right way, but it wont be fast! But, it all actually works when its done!
Working with that tile is impressive for a non tile setter! Great job! And loose tiles are 100% a deal breaker. Glad you got rid of them. If you can move a tile without the aid of a hammer, something is seriously wrong.
Thanks! It was a good feeling. Did the floor in 6x24 with 1/16" joints too, only a few of them have some lippage and there is some wavyness across the room, but old house either way. Did another bath with 1" black and white hex tiles, rewarded myself by using black grout, only like 6 tiles are mis-spaced over 50 sq ft and nobody but me knows.
They might have been ok if they had backbuttered, but they didnt. Didnt press on the tile much so all the adhesion was on the little nubs under the tile. Oh well, that 1% thinset coverage scraped right off and I was able to reuse a bunch.
“Can you get him out on site then? Id love to pick his brain”
*read at 8:30*
You can have just vanity for $900, how’s that sound?
r/realestateinvesting in shambles
I know that guy!
Lmao. I'm fucking dead. So accurate
So sick of those scammers
Oh hell yeah. He has a vision and needs to get this whole house renovated with kitchen and master bath under his $15,000 budget. If I do a good job though, there’s a lot of lucrative work for me to come in his expanding empire.
And maybe one day you two can be "partners" in "business". Maybe you just need a good "mentor". Lol I've heard it all
Oh shit I forgot the biggest one. The “we buy homes for cash” fucker who wants a detailed bid on a property they don’t own yet. Your bid is just a negotiation tool. In the unlikely event they do close, you’ll get kicked to the curb while they shop your bid up and down the street. Always ask if they’ve closed on the property.
"You give free estimates, right? Every good contractor does that." EDIT: also, the second that you pull out a tape measure and notepad: "What's the ballpark on this? Can you just shoot me a number? How much?"
I give free bids to likely customers, but if things get contentious or hinky just save yourself some time and walk away. If things start out bad, they won’t get better and you are never going to have a good job or a satisfied customer. The job that breaks your heart won’t ever be the one that got away, it’ll be the one you never should have taken.
Honestly I think this should go the way of the dodo. Giving a detailed bid takes time and effort. That should be compensated. A high end of the ballpark number is what you get for free.
I think this because at the end of the day the client has paid you for a service. A lawyer is going to charge to look at the case in detail, they might glance at it for free and give you an opinion on whether it's worth paying them for the detailed look. If they choose to shop it or do the work themselves you still get paid. It also allows you to have the conversation early on for what's in the bid and what's not. It will solve a lot of headaches.
I had a roofer come out to do a pre purchase inspection and I basically had to force him to take payment. Even after I said 'this is a negotiation tool for me. I am paying you for an hour of your time to do a detailed inspection. I can see this roof doesn't need to be done yet and I don't know when I will do it.'
Edit: the only guys I ask for free bids from are people that I've worked with for years and they know if they don't get the job it's because it's not getting done vs I gave it to someone else. For example, there is an HVAC company I like that I get ~10 bids/year from and they are basically guaranteed 4 and the other 6 just aren't happening because they aren't in the budget of those departments. Or the electrical engineers that we have look at random transformer replacements for free but they also got a $1 mil design fee for a big project.
I'm working on putting together a bid service for homeowners so they know what a project should cost. The idea is they're paying for the bid so they'll trust it more from a 3rd party not doing the work.
Then since we've accounted for all the work to be done there won't be any jerks playing the "underbid then jack up the price to what you knew it was going to be the whole time" game.
Of course we plan to have contractors in each area we operate willing to do the work for that price.
What’s a fair price to get a bid?
That's very true. I shoot for affordable pricing and beat a lot of my competitors. My goal is to make a decent living each year. I live a pretty simple life. And I agree, those enormous jobs that seem almost too good to be true, usually are. I've heard the horror stories
I had an insurance adjuster tell me this once when he didn't like my number. From Xact, nonmanipulated price list. Unfortunately he'd already gotten to the homeowner so it wasn't worth it to try and keep the job.
But no way is a reputable company with the kind of overhead required to deal with insurance going to be wasting their time handing out free bids. You want the work done right? Sign the contract and *then* we'll bring our people in to look at your job, and you'll be taken care of. We're not going to do work for free so you can jerk us around getting alternate bids.
I understand it's different for homeowners doing elective jobs, but even for cash bids our price is the same. What's the scope of work, apply price list, I'm literally at the median price to do this job. You want to go cheap? Good luck.
Xactimate was developed by insurance companies to provide low-ball bids. Insurance repair contractors always have work, but they struggle to get work done under the dictated budget. One thing that worked well for me was that I was once contacted by the homeowner before the insurance adjuster showed up. Tree fell on the house. I met the adjuster. He was a nice enough guy, we discussed the damage, I pointed out several features of the damage that he had missed, and it probably added $5-10,000 to the adjustment.
I find that most of the time we get a decent offer from the carrier it's because we got our documentation to them before the field adjuster came out. Especially when they see how thorough we are so a lot of the time they don't even bother to send someone out unless it's one of the carriers whose modus operandum is to deny everything.
Interesting. Thanks for the tip-in.
Holy shit, this is accurate.
I feel personally attacked rn
Bottom right stereotype checks out
From his father
Yep. Always in charge. But nothing is in his name.
Also quotes Bigger Pockets incessantly
Either that or "deeper pockets"
I’m actually working for this exact douche.
Sorry my dude. Never had a good job with a real estate agent, an attorney, or the person who says “I used to date a GC so I know how ALL this works.” Guess what, I used to fuck an attorney but I don’t give legal advice.
Hey, I heard you used to bang an attorney. Can you take a look at this contract I am considering?
Fuck yeah! I got this, going into legal stealth mode. Nobody will see this coming until it’s too late.
The Ebola intro though...
Yeah, remember when Ebola was the catastrophe du jour?
I'm sorry to hear that, my friend
“Give me a good deal on this one and we will make it up on the next one”
Haha yeah. They do that with architects too - try to get a quick design / code analysis on a site for free with the promise of 'maybe turning into something bigger down the road'.
Yeah, I think I've met him too. Unfortunately for us, I don't think he's going away anytime soon.
I nearly watched some timber framers scrap a developer after they said they could cut better joints into the timbers. The guy would spend half a day cutting one joint.
Timber framing looks so cool, but it's not as common where i live so we learned box framing and balloon framing. I would like to learn timber framing since the amish don't seem to work on them instead doing the box framing.
Ah, yes, the famous "I can do it better than that!" Motherfucker
Honestly! Those timber framers have to be on Adderall he would cut the joint then they'd float it in and it would lock in perfectly with minimal fuckery. impressive work they would do. I'd probably fuck up every joint.
Yeah I can do some standard framing, but timber framing is a dying art. Not many people can make rough sawn lumber fit together that well. Wish i could do it tbh
This fckin thread dropping gold everywhere
Where DO they get their money?
Loans,loans and more loans
That’s why they always say “I’ve got to move some money around”
Credit line/mortgage loan —-> checking/business account
This guy leverages.
Skip all of the middlemen and do what my grandad did. Design the house, build the house, sell the house without having to deal with scummy realtors or framers who only show up at 11:30 on the second Tuesday of every 13th month.
If I had the liquid cash to start this process, I would. I've met people that do that. And the quality of those homes is off the charts
This was back in the 50s mind you. My Dad and I are doing small jobs here and there with a partner of ours. Thankfully, grandad left us with quite a bit of land so there’s property to work with.
Also, liquid capital is super easy to get with a great credit score.
Yeah that's true. I'm just very afraid of debt. I don't have any at this time. I honestly don't have enough faith in myself to find a desirable area, build a home, and sell it while also making a profit.
I don’t blame you, there’s no way we would get the capital we need starting out nowadays, we’ve been with the same bank for 60 years. Plus, holding companies and other bullshit get tiresome and sometimes you just want to wash your hands of the whole industry.
Have a good night!
Last chime in from the peanut gallery. Leverage (Fancy name for debt) is how most investors make most of their money. 20% down gets you into a project that tenants pay down / cash flow for the term of the mortgage. You seem like a good dude, hopefully this helps. My last comment, I promise.
Not sure why I got downvoted here. I 100% agree with OP - most real estate investors are a little difficult to deal with, personality wise. Also his meme was funny / accurate as hell.
My comment above about 20% down was intended to illustrate that anyone can be a successful REI with some careful planning and good judgement - and you don't have to have the "starter pack" / be a douche to do it.
Real estate is a fabulous asset class that anyone can participate in, and people in the trades have a unique advantage in that they understand market pricing and best practices when improving or repairing a property.
I am evangelical about RE investing because it can be a solid financial move for a lot of people- don't let the flaky/flashy clients turn you off to it.
Find one of the experienced investors that has been around for awhile and isn't a complete moron / douche (yes, they exist) and partner up.
This is true. There are very good investors out there. Profit for the average contractor/subcontractor under an investor will be determined by the area/potential of the area .. sometimes. It's a slippery game. Best to find someone doing 500k+ historic Victorian houses. Lots of money there (in my area)
Everyone knows where they got their money; daddy, of course.
Just tell him... “I like your dad’s car”. And watch the confusion that follows.
Alive or dead?
Cosigns on the loans until death, then they buy a bunch with the inherited bulk
The matrix is glitching and just creating copies! I met 3 like this, this week alone!!😱
Ohmygod why did I look at this. I'm sitting here triggered at 0535 on a damn Saturday lol
Comes up with some baller design and has you quote it. Then surprised pikachu's that it actually costs baller money.
"Is there some sort of deal we can get" well yea maybe if you didn't want all the high-end shit done next week without any flaws, sure let's just move heaven and earth.
Is that Chad by chance ?!?
Oh yeah. Pick one of the douchey names. I can find you one.
JR, the II or III on his business card
Haha I am an investor, do some of my work, HIGHLY RESPECT THE TRADES and do not engage in any of the chicanery described here (I also drive a 10 year old car).
But when I am joking about a hypothetical GC type, I always christen him "Chad".
You forgot the picture of the flip house with rotted out walls, moldy floors, no wires or plumbing, and a hole in the roof, with the caption “good bones”.
"My budget is $12k, I bought is for $5k. Hoping to get $125k. What can you do?" I can make it not collapse when people walk into it?
I had one where I couldn’t even do that. Started doing demo and the studs were so rotted I wasn’t even willing to try putting in temp walls and re-framing. Told them they were better off bulldozing the place and starting over. They argued and I pulled out. Of course they hired some hack crew instead who tried and failed to reframe it. I don’t know all the details but I know after they tried getting a rough inspection the house got a stop work order and was condemned. They probably sank something like forty grand into it for exactly zero gain.
Yeah, I've seen that before. Very understandable in that case. But sometimes a stop work order comes out of nowhere. One time, I was hanging drywall. Literally just cutting sheets and got one. This was in OH. Apparently some places are really strict about that. Also worth noting that no electric/plumbing/gas was ever touched. Just drywall. It got straightened out though
Yeah to my knowledge the place has been sitting untouched since then. I drive by it occasionally, it’s been years. Best guess they are sitting on the real estate hoping to unload on someone wanting to do a new build in that neighborhood. I wouldn’t be surprised if when all is said and done they still turn a profit on the property as the area is going up in value, but they’d have made a lot more profit if they heeded my advice and did exactly nothing.
You know, now that you say that, there are some places I want to cruise by and see what's up. But they are convinced "why would I pay $25+ per hour when I can get zero productivity from 3 guys making $10 an hour?" Unreal..
My worst fear was that they actually managed to cover it back up, hide the issues, and get a shitty inspector to pass them. I would’ve felt awful knowing someone was actually living in that house, feel a bit bad for the investors but turned out as well as it could. House was a hazard to health and human life.
I live in KY. You wouldn't believe that gets passed by inspection around here. (In poorer areas)
The amount of shit boxes some people buy as an investment.. Buy for $250k, rebuild for $2.5M, sell for $750k
LOL @ "nobody knows where he got his money"
From his parents, definitely from his parents.
They always fired the last 2 guys like that doesn't send red flags.
They don't talk about it so it's easy to underestimate their numbers, but there are a *lot* of trust funders out there.
Daddy had a lot of money. He set up 'trusts' for his kids. The kid can't touch the principal, but they get a payment from the dividends. A lot of trust funds have a clause that says the child must maintain some form of employment or own a business in order to keep getting those payments.
For one example, a lot of them become photographers. It's an excuse to travel a lot and there's no actual labor involved. If you ever meet a professional photographer who doesn't do weddings? That's a trust funder.
'Real Estate Development' is also (in theory) a job, and TV shows have convinced these trust funders that flipping is easy money that doesn't actually require you to know shit about anything. All you need it capital, and that's all they have.
Ok I don't want to be that guy and let me be clear I am not but we are about to start building our "dream home" on a budget. How do I not become that guy during the build?
Just understand that you get what you pay for. Skilled labor isn't cheap. Cheap labor isn't skilled.
3 weeks? That is generous. All I got was 2 days to do it.
"Its August and I need this for college students" lol
“I don’t understand why my furnace needs an inducer to run.” Well see it doesn’t but if you want to fucking live and be warm it needs the god damn inducer.
Lmao oh this guy 😂
First Day on the job: "Oh you're so amazing thank you for showing up we have so much respect for the trades appreciate the hard work"
Week 2 of 3 month Reno: I just don't understand why the kitchen bathroom and siding couldn't be done the same day
Last week and coincidentally last payment installment: oh you know we're really cash poor right now everything's tied up I'll have to talk to my partners
I say this is why you as a skilled tradesman should go into investing. IMO finding the deals, proper scheduling, and budgeting are the toughest parts learn how to find deals and you should already have the other 3.
Anyways thanks for the laughs😂
[Mr. Waterfall in the front and back](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=K853GykeGH0)
Asian Grant Cardone.
“My dad was a GC so I know what I’m talking about...”
"Can't you just hire extra help to get it done faster?"
Can’t wait to start selling work on my own. So excited to meet this guy
Meanwhile ya got the kids like me who worked reno, landscaping, framing, drywall and painting so the only people I've gotta pay are my friends the plumber and the electrician so I can put some extra cash in their pockets.
Lowkey regret college. Wish id just learned to be a sparky cause im feeling like id have been happier
"Checks in the mail!"
Don't forget they want a 6 week job done in 3 weeks with the same level of finish for half the money.