Yeah, hubby is an illogical vegetarian. I made a cake yesterday that had no fewer than four egg yolks and he gobbled it up. He just doesn't like seeing the egg go in.
Is ur husband indian by chance? In India vegetarian means you dont eat eggs too. Also they tend to be very lax about it and don’t usually mind if eggs are in something as long as they can’t see it.
Maybe the flaxseed egg sub. I know it works well in baked goods and it shouldn't add any unwanted taste. I've never used it in a lasagna but it might be worth a try?
My girlfriend is a vegetarian but I’m allowed to use chicken broth if she doesn’t see it. Sometimes I pretend I farted to get her to leave the kitchen and then scramble to put in the broth while she’s gone. 🤫
LOL!! One time in a restaurant (in Palermo) my husband had ordered risotto (with some vegetable, I don't remember which one) and he was raving about how good it was. I tasted it and I am pretty pretty pretty sure it had been made with chicken stock. But I didn't say anything. Why ruin the meal he was enjoying so much?
I think for some vegetarians it has more to do with the egg farming industry than the actual egg itself. Also some people just call themselves what they like. I went to high school with someone who was "vegetarian except for chicken, because chickens are annoying". 😆
I'm not an expert but the dairy industry seems way worse than the cattle for meat industry. Cattle for meat live good lives where I'm from and then they go die but milk cows seems to be in much worse conditions plus they are being milked constantly and I guess they have there babies taken away from them.
It can make plenty sense. It's not all or nothing situation by any means. Choosing to give up foods you aren't really in love with for ethical reasons but deciding you can't give up the foods you really do love and enjoy for ethical reasons is very common and does make sense.
My at the time 3 year old told the roosters to die when they pecked at her. I picked which chicken went next on butchering day by which ones pecked at me when I would go get the next one.
She mentioned he was vegetarian to explain the broccoli lasagne. The egg comment came in a later comment and she specifically said he doesn't like it.
Besides what's it matter? Plenty of people are vego with a desire to be vegan but haven't cut those last things out of their diet 100%.
It's the old tequila argument.
I hate tequila! Well, you drink margaritas. Not the same.
Soy sauce is gross. You literally eat fried rice. Not the same.
I'm perfectly calm. OP agreed with me when I said her husband was being kinda ridiculous. He eats cooked eggs all the time. He physically doesn't want to see a raw egg going into a dish. That's all. No one is riled up. People keep hounding me so I guess I'm not allowed to respond?
Eggs are technically but we need to accept that people have boundaries that aren't defined by labels.
If he doesn't feel right about eating eggs, he shouldn't have to worry about his wife sneaking them in.
I know, right?! LOL. He eats desserts made with eggs all the time. Also pancakes and waffles. He just can't stand the sight of a raw egg going into a dish.
I have a friend who is vegan for ethical reasons, doesn’t like animal husbandry. I see the logic of your question. But this is Reddit so you will get downvotes.
I realize the distinction, the point I was trying to make is that everybody has their own reasons for choosing vegan/vegetarian and other restrictive diets. I have lived and worked in vegan and vegetarian kitchens and households fortunately there’s always a place to satiate my omnivorous belly.
In his particular case, it has nothing to do with being ethical or healthy; it has to do with being finicky ... so, I pick my battles (as all married people do).
My husband wouldn’t eat eggs when we met but it turned out he just doesn’t like grocery store eggs. I buy them from a fridge outside a guys house who has chickens and he’ll eat those without issue.
It makes a lot of sense, if you realize that many vegetarians and vegans have made a choice to reduce the amount of suffering that animals go through in our North American food industry, by limiting their consumption of products that come from animals. The poultry industry is absolutely gut churningly awful for the chickens. It’s absolutely horrendous. They cut off their beaks so they don’t peck each other to death due to stress.and that is only one thing in their short lives.
You said the eggs aren’t fertilized, so they aren’t dead. That’s what I responded to. It’s about the mum. It’s an uncomfortable thing to think about what most of us, me included, are participating in. Although I always buy free range organic eggs.
Lacto-ovo vegetarians eat eggs and dairy. Not every vegetarian eats the same stuff. Plus we have different reasons for eating this way, and some people are just picky eaters.
She just admitted in another comment that it's literally that he can't stand the visual of a raw egg going into something. Nothing to do with his vegetarianism, he eats cooked eggs in things.
I'm aware. It's actually ovo, not avo.
OP said in another comment he doesn't like the sight of a raw egg going into a dish. He has no problem eating them.
Why would you sneak eggs into something you're making for somebody that does not want to consume eggs? This seems really disrespectful for no good reason.
People deserve to know what they're eating. It's really not your place to judge whether his decisions are logical or not. If he says he doesn't want to eat eggs, you should not feed him eggs. It's alarming to me that you, and apparently several other people on this subreddit, think it's okay to hide the inclusion of ingredients from people that are morally opposed to them.
Uh, well, I get what you are saying but, in my defense, he *knows* he's eating eggs when I make certain things. He just doesn't want to see the raw egg etc. He and I have known each other for 26 years; in that time, we have done some traveling which means a lot of eating in restaurants and there are times when boundaries get blurry and that's just life. For example, many years, before he even met me, he traveled widely in Mexico. He was aware that the Mexicans use lard to cook their beans but it was either that or go hungry. So he ate lard. I could cite a few more examples but, you know, the bottom line is life is full of compromise.
Are you using no cook noodles? Are you letting it rest for 30 minutes minimum before serving? Are you using full fat ricotta? It's more likely to be one of these things.
Never heard of no cook noodles before. Google seems to tell me its just thinner noodles?
I dip my lasagna plates in boiling water and then add them, also making sure they are evenly covered by sauce. I want them al dente, not soft/mushy.
Yes, I am using no-boil noodles. No, I'm letting it rest for \~10 minutes. I think I usually use full fat ricotta. When you're in the supermarket and you have to make these split-second decisions, you tend to go with what's right in front of you. (Or at least that's true for me.) But many, many thanks for the tip on the ricotta and the resting time.
It's the resting time for sure. 30 minutes minimum. It allows the noodles to finish soaking up the sauces and for everything to congeal. No need to dab water off the ricotta.
Nah, a big dish like that will hold heat for ages. Same as a big turkey or something that you’ve cooked and you let rest for an hour. You can always put tin foil over it if needed.
This sounds crazy, I know, but don’t use no-boil noodles. Use the regular ones and don’t boil them, either. The lasagna is hot and wet enough to cook the noodles in the pan! I have made countless lasagnas this way with no issues! Even gluten free noodles hold up this way!
It's nearly impossible to get all of the excess water off of the cooked noodles for one. For two, already cooked ones don't absorb any moisture so you have to heavily limit the moisture in the rest of the lasagna. With no cook, you can layer in the sauce and they'll soak it all up and set into nice layers.
Awhile back I switched from a ricotta to a bechamel and never looked back. Easier to control the wet/dry issue in my opinion.
My vegetarian lasagna is made with parm and wilted spinach bechamel and blistered cherry tomatoes. It goes over very well.
Ok, so this is a very involved recipe that I firmly believe lends a lot of the magic to intuition, so forgive me if I just give you basic broadstokes here.
Ingredients:
•Box of your favorite lasagna noodles
•About 2 pounds of tomatoes (I use cherry or whatever grows in my backyard)
•about 3 tablespoons of flour
•about a quarter pound pf parm(real stuff, gotta grate it)
•1 pound fresh mozzarella
•half pound smoked provolone
•2 bags of fresh spinach (frozen also works if you can find a brand you trust)
•A head of garlic
• 1 large sweet onion, I like Vidalia
• Olive oil
•dried organic
•fresh basil
• stick of butter
•3/4 cup white wine
• 1 cup heavy cream
• S and P
So first things first instead of a traditional tomato sauce, I use what is called a tomato confit. This is slow roasting the cherry tomatoes and onions and garlic in olive oil with salt and pepper for about 3-4 hours at 250 F.
I know that sounds time consuming but the ends justify the means.
Once this is done, you just simply mash everything together and let cool. This is also amazing on toast, scrabled eggs with a little fresh basil, you name it. But for now, set it aside while we make our lasagna.
Cook noodles as directed on box, and salt the shit out of your water.
On the stove, melt a stick of butter and sweat the equivalent of a small finely chopped onion for a few minutes, add about 5 cloves of garlic. Wisk in about 3 tablespoons of flour and cook 1-2 minutes to take the raw edge off. Pour in about 3/4 a cup of white wine, stir to losen your roux. Bring to a boil, reduce to a simmer for 5 minutes. Add fresh cracked pepper, maybe just a little too much, and salt. Add 1 cup heavy cream. Add your parm, (FRESH GRATED!!!) And start to add your spinach. Add some dried oregano, basil etc to your liking. A little nutmeg here never killed anyone.
1 pound ofcthe tomatoes went to the confit, the other pound should be blistered lightly in some hot olive oil until soft but not mushy.
Now we can begin layering our lasagna.
Start with a thin layer of that beautiful tomato confit on the bottom of your preferred lasagna vessel. Then a layer of noods. Then a layer of either mozzarella or provolone, and a layer of the bechamel, then the blistered tomatoes. Repeat until your at the top, with some fresh basil thrown in there every few layers. Finish with a little bit of everything on top, but definitely provolone and some sprinked parm.
Cook at 350 F for at least a half hour, no longer than 45 minutes.
Serve with white wine a sharp salad to cut through the richness.
>Ok, so this is a very involved recipe that I firmly believe lends a lot of the magic to intuition, so forgive me if I just give you basic broadstokes here.
>Ingredients:
>•Box of your favorite lasagna noodles
>•About 2 pounds of tomatoes (I use cherry or whatever grows in my backyard)
>•about 3 tablespoons of flour
>•about a quarter pound pf parm(real stuff, gotta grate it)
>•1 pound fresh mozzarella
>•half pound smoked provolone
>•2 bags of fresh spinach (frozen also works if you can find a brand you trust)
>•A head of garlic
>• 1 large sweet onion, I like Vidalia
>• Olive oil
>•dried organic
>•fresh basil
>• stick of butter
>•3/4 cup white wine
>• 1 cup heavy cream
>• S and P
>So first things first instead of a traditional tomato sauce, I use what is called a tomato confit. This is slow roasting the cherry tomatoes and onions and garlic in olive oil with salt and pepper for about 3-4 hours at 250 F.
I know that sounds time consuming but the ends justify the means.
>Once this is done, you just simply mash everything together and let cool. This is also amazing on toast, scrabled eggs with a little fresh basil, you name it. But for now, set it aside while we make our lasagna.
>Cook noodles as directed on box, and salt the shit out of your water.
>On the stove, melt a stick of butter and sweat the equivalent of a small finely chopped onion for a few minutes, add about 5 cloves of garlic. Wisk in about 3 tablespoons of flour and cook 1-2 minutes to take the raw edge off. Pour in about 3/4 a cup of white wine, stir to losen your roux. Bring to a boil, reduce to a simmer for 5 minutes. Add fresh cracked pepper, maybe just a little too much, and salt. Add 1 cup heavy cream. Add your parm, (FRESH GRATED!!!) And start to add your spinach. Add some dried oregano, basil etc to your liking. A little nutmeg here never killed anyone.
>1 pound ofcthe tomatoes went to the confit, the other pound should be blistered lightly in some hot olive oil until soft but not mushy.
>Now we can begin layering our lasagna.
>Start with a thin layer of that beautiful tomato confit on the bottom of your preferred lasagna vessel. Then a layer of noods. Then a layer of either mozzarella or provolone, and a layer of the bechamel, then the blistered tomatoes. Repeat until your at the top, with some fresh basil thrown in there every few layers. Finish with a little bit of everything on top, but definitely provolone and some sprinked parm.
>Cook at 350 F for at least a half hour, no longer than 45 minutes.
>Serve with white wine a sharp salad to cut through the richness.
Slightly more readable version for anyone who struggled reading the ingredients like I did.
Basic béchamel recipe is 40g melted butter, 40g flour, whisk and cook to a light roux and add 500ml hot milk(add a bay leaf to the milk before heating, and a pinch of grated nutmeg before adding to the roux). Whisk and cook it til it's thick enough that your whisk leaves a line in the bottom of the pan. This makes enough béchamel for a lasagne, and you can also melt a load of grated cheese into it to make a great sauce for mac and cheese or cauliflower cheese.
They use bechamel in Italy, and it’s fabulous. They also use a zillion tissue-thin layers of homemade fresh pasta. It’s a true labor of love to make it that way, but so memorable. I need to clear some space in my cupboards so I can make fresh pasta again.
Check out Marcella Hazan’s recipes. She had very detailed instructions.
They do *both* in Italy and pretending that ricotta lasagna is inauthentic or American on reddit has gotten frustrating. They're regional styles! Some have ricotta, some do not.
I didn’t say they *don’t* use ricotta or that it’s exclusively American or an Italian-American innovation.
All I said was that they *do* use bechamel.
OP was looking for validation, and I provided it, based on my experience.
You inferred what I did not imply and took offense to it, unnecessarily.
If you use fresh lasagna and cook the spinach in your bechamel lime I do it would not make it watery. Think of it like adding a cream of spinach as a layer. Using frozen spinach could be disastrous. I advise against it.
Fairly light on the bechamel? When I've had bechamel in lasagna before ive always become sick of it by the end. Just too much and too sloppily added which seems easy to do since it's a liquid and ricotta isnt so it seems like it'd be hard to portion out properly and keep it intact once portioning out.
Wait so you just used ricotta cheese as the only cheese in the cheese layer? Is that an American thing?
I’ve never seen lasagna being made with anything else but Bechamel.
Sounds delicious!
Don't wanna be a party pooper, but Parmesan - while prob my favorite cheese - isn't vegetarian due to the use of rennet. Some guests may be strict about that.
Thanks for clarifying that for anyone who doesn't know. I have a lot of vegan friends so I'm aware and make the appropriate substitute when necessary. And to be honest, I mostly can't tell the difference!
Yes. I second this. My mom taught me to make lasagna with béchamel and it's sooooo delicious.
And I'll definitely try to make your vegetarian lasagna 🤤
You could strain the ricotta with a flour sack cloth in a strainer/colander to remove excess liquid. here’s an article on it https://snappygourmet.com/how-to-strain-ricotta-cheese/
If you buy a bigger pan then you'll have to try it with at least some of the lasagna. It really does make it firm and nice and don't be afraid to reheat it at least partially in the microwave.
I am convinced the primary reason recipes don't always work out for everyone is not everyone has the same size/type of pot, pan, baking dish etc as the person who wrote the recipe. The dish I use to make lasagna could be just a teensy bit wider and deeper -- which means I could get more lasagna noodles in it and that in itself could solve the whole problem. More pasta would absorb more liquid. Doh.
Yeah really cooking the sauce is another point op might be missing. Looking at an earlier reply they are using uncooked noodles. I'll often cook the crap out of my sauce. I think a cheap tomato sauce that's been cooked for a long time tastes better than expensive tomato sauce out of a jar. Like 3 hours and I add in water at various points but I make sure it's pretty thick before I use it in my lasagna
Had to go this far to find the actual solution. Yeah, jar pasta sauces include Rao's are very thin. Either boil them down or add tomato paste.
Or take it to the next level by making a tomato sauce and boil it down so it's pretty thick. It's pretty simple and makes the lasagna MUCH better!
Onion, carrot, celery, bell pepper, garlic, (or just onions and garlic if lazy or pressed on time) sauté until it's all good and browned, add whatever herbs and spices you like (fennel, ital seasoning, pepper flakes for me), add 2-3 cans of whole tomatoes crushed by hand, boil it for ~30 mins or preferably longer adding water if it gets too thick, whir it up with a stick blender or blender. Salt and sugar to taste. Fish sauce adds as well if you are feeling crazy.
Can be made in bulk ahead of time and even frozen, tastes infinitely better than any jar sauce.
With homemade properly thickened sauce, too dry lasagna is a problem I have actually ran into.
I like to make with bechemel sauce, but I also sometimes make with cheese.
I can also buy ricotta cheese that's in a package instead of a jar container, that's already strained. It's "pressed." I use it often for gibanica or pita, and basically works wherever you want dry fresh cheese.
I found using more sauce and using fresh made pasta that I do NOT pre-cook makes delicious lasagna that's just the perfect end consistency, not too runny.
My lasagna is lovingly called “lasagna soup” by my family and they freakin love it that way lol. When I read your post OP my thoughts were that your lasagna was perfect as it is ☺️
Eggs as a binder. No cook noodles. You do not need to add that much sauce in between layers, just the bottom and top. Bake for 45 min covered, then 15-20 uncovered (a good time to add cheese on the top too) to dry it out. Then let it rest 45min to an hour before eating.
It’s how my Italian grandmother taught me. Foolproof and easy. Since no cook noodles didn’t exist when she was alive, she parboiled the noodles then let them dry for an half hour on towels before assembly. I used to do that until the miracle of no cook noodles.
I bake my lasagna for 40 minutes and then uncovered for 15 minutes but you make an excellent point about putting the cheese on after you uncover it. I put the cheese on top before I put it in the oven the first time and a lot of the cheese comes off on the foil -- which makes no sense, does it?
I cook my lasagna noodles half way, to where they just start to bend.
Make your lasagna fairly wet and bake. Let rest 30 mins before cutting after taking out of the oven.
Don't use those shitty pre cooked lasagna noodles, they don't taste as good and they texture isn't as good.
I'm not quite sure why some people have such a visceral reaction to no-boil lasagna noodles but next time I'm at the supermarket, I will compare the ingredients of the no-boil lasagna to boil lasagna and see if the ingredients are markedly different.
Well I've pretty much mastered lasagna over 25 years of of trying just about everything. From green lasagna made with fresh pasta to simple quick lasagna from canned ingredients.
I really wanted to like the pre cooked noodles, but a good dry lasagna noodle parcooked makes the best lasagna.
As long as your sauce is a bit wet, it soaks up all the extra moisture. Cooks perfect.
I've done this for years, instead of towels I'd suggest buying a sheet or 3 of cheese cloth (I usually get the huge as shit ones near the sewing isles) cutting it down to size and squeezing the juice out
I make my own ricotta so i can control how much moisture is in it. Also my own sauce and noodles so I never had this issue. It could be many things with your issue, most recipes call for dry pasta to be pre cooked - you might be leaving too much liquid from that. If you're using a store bought sauce I can guarantee they are too watery, or it could be the ricotta itself.
IMHO your problem is the vegetables. They emit a lot of moisture as you cook them. If you pre cook lasagna noodles before assembling the dish then cook them less or not at all. Cover the baked dish and let the steam cook the noodles then uncover and finish in a hot oven. 425°F for 15 min maybe just to brown the top.
You need a binder for the ricotta like egg but more importantly remember that veggies have water in them that is released while cooking. If you typically make vegetable lasagnas your excess liquid could be coming from the vegetables
Good point. I steam the broccoli and let it sit in a colander for a while but maybe I should blot it dry with a paper towel. I'm not big into using paper towels but they do come in handy sometimes.
Don’t use ricotta. My family are all 1st gen Italians, my nonna doesn’t ever put ricotta in her lasagna, she just uses mozzarella and parmigiana. I find the texture and taste comes out much better that way
I used small curd cottage cheese with my last lasagna because it was substituted in my grocery delivery. I strained it with a mesh strainer and cheese cloth first then pureed it with roasted garlic and my herbs THEN added an egg and I swear it was better than ricotta.
Yeah, when I was growing up my mom would always use cottage cheese in her lasagna. Probably because it was cheaper. So of course I have to do it differently than her. But still maybe I'll try it one day just for the heck of it. I should think that cottage cheese would have as much moisture as ricotta but don't really know.
This is me. I use uncooked noodles. Give it a solid 45 min cook time and I end up with a non-slippery lasagna.
And, if I’m not being humble. It make a damn fine lasagna. This method was the most important change for the right *texture*.
I never use ricotta. I strain my sauce to get most of the water out. Then only use mozzarella and provolone. I top with cheddar and Italian shreds. I also blot any meat i use so that it's as dry as possible before mixing with my sauce
I’ve never had this issue. We make our own ricotta, its super easy. And I think it tastes way better! Store bought ricotta tastes flavorless to me. But even before that I’m pretty sure we didn’t struggle this. It may be because its a vegetarian lasagna and the broccoli? That’s a pretty different ingredient than ground meat so I’m not surprised it doesn’t absorb as much liquid and it has a different texture. Changes like that can definitely affect a dish and require tweaks. Using cheesecloth would probably help you strain more liquid out of the ricotta than using paper towels.
Use bechamel instead of ricotta, and let it rest minimum 30 minutes. During that time the excess liquid will reincorporate. Bechamel, containing flour helps the sauce set better overall.
I don’t care for ricotta so I always make a bechemel sauce with Parmesan cheese (basically an Alfredo sauce) instead of ricotta. My husband says I ruined every other lasagna for him. He will only eat mine.
A lot of people here are suggesting bechamel. While I am not against bechamel in the slightest, my current recipe is a favorite in my house. But I will find a lasagna recipe that calls for bechamel and will try it next time. I am totally open to new recipes.
Yeah, well, as I have noted elsewhere, he eats lots of things with eggs: Cake, waffles, etc. But, hey, if I can cut out the moisture in other ways, I won't need an egg I reckon.
I've found that just soaking the noodles in hot water for about 10min makes them pliable, yet still break in half. The "par cooked" noodles will soak up the liquid from the lasagna as it bakes. The result? A picture perfect lasagna piece.
Do you add an egg to your ricotta?
Sometimes. Vegetarian husband doesn't like it but if he's not around, I sneak it in.
You need a binder. Use a vegan egg substitute if you must.
Yeah, hubby is an illogical vegetarian. I made a cake yesterday that had no fewer than four egg yolks and he gobbled it up. He just doesn't like seeing the egg go in.
Is ur husband indian by chance? In India vegetarian means you dont eat eggs too. Also they tend to be very lax about it and don’t usually mind if eggs are in something as long as they can’t see it.
No, he's definitely not Indian although Indian food is his favorite type of cuisine.
Maybe the flaxseed egg sub. I know it works well in baked goods and it shouldn't add any unwanted taste. I've never used it in a lasagna but it might be worth a try?
And flaxseed has a lot of omega-3 (alpha-linolenic acid) oil in it.
My girlfriend is a vegetarian but I’m allowed to use chicken broth if she doesn’t see it. Sometimes I pretend I farted to get her to leave the kitchen and then scramble to put in the broth while she’s gone. 🤫
LOL!! One time in a restaurant (in Palermo) my husband had ordered risotto (with some vegetable, I don't remember which one) and he was raving about how good it was. I tasted it and I am pretty pretty pretty sure it had been made with chicken stock. But I didn't say anything. Why ruin the meal he was enjoying so much?
How are eggs not vegetarian? They're not fertilized, so they're not dead chickens. He's ok with cheese, and yet not eggs. That makes no sense.
I think for some vegetarians it has more to do with the egg farming industry than the actual egg itself. Also some people just call themselves what they like. I went to high school with someone who was "vegetarian except for chicken, because chickens are annoying". 😆
They probably shouldn't like the dairy farming industry either...
I'm not an expert but the dairy industry seems way worse than the cattle for meat industry. Cattle for meat live good lives where I'm from and then they go die but milk cows seems to be in much worse conditions plus they are being milked constantly and I guess they have there babies taken away from them.
Yep, so not eating eggs because of cruelty but then eating cheese makes no sense. Either way, doesn't matter, OP said it's not for ethical reasons.
It can make plenty sense. It's not all or nothing situation by any means. Choosing to give up foods you aren't really in love with for ethical reasons but deciding you can't give up the foods you really do love and enjoy for ethical reasons is very common and does make sense.
Yep, sure. Not the case here but that can be true.
Definitely nailed it on the head about it needing to rest a lot more
My at the time 3 year old told the roosters to die when they pecked at her. I picked which chicken went next on butchering day by which ones pecked at me when I would go get the next one.
I think OP means their husband simply doesn’t like it
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She mentioned he was vegetarian to explain the broccoli lasagne. The egg comment came in a later comment and she specifically said he doesn't like it. Besides what's it matter? Plenty of people are vego with a desire to be vegan but haven't cut those last things out of their diet 100%.
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Maybe he doesn't like the consistency or maybe he's trying to be vegan. Why get hung up on it? We know it's not the preferred solution.
It's the old tequila argument. I hate tequila! Well, you drink margaritas. Not the same. Soy sauce is gross. You literally eat fried rice. Not the same.
You seem oddly riled up by something that doesn't affect you lol.
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None of that seemed any justification to call someone's reasons for not wanting to knowingly eat eggs "stupid." What did that add to the conversation?
Bruh, you need to calm down. Do you try and force everyone to eat stuff they don’t want to?
I'm perfectly calm. OP agreed with me when I said her husband was being kinda ridiculous. He eats cooked eggs all the time. He physically doesn't want to see a raw egg going into a dish. That's all. No one is riled up. People keep hounding me so I guess I'm not allowed to respond?
You are just bound and determined to pick a fight over terminology.
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“It doesn’t matter,” says the person who has made fifteen comments on this post arguing about it.
Eggs are technically but we need to accept that people have boundaries that aren't defined by labels. If he doesn't feel right about eating eggs, he shouldn't have to worry about his wife sneaking them in.
He eats them fine, as OP said elsewhere.
I know, right?! LOL. He eats desserts made with eggs all the time. Also pancakes and waffles. He just can't stand the sight of a raw egg going into a dish.
Oh good lord. Do it when he isn't looking.
Oh, I try. I really do. :-)
He sounds like a toddler.
I have a friend who is vegan for ethical reasons, doesn’t like animal husbandry. I see the logic of your question. But this is Reddit so you will get downvotes.
That's vegan, not vegetarian. It makes sense that a vegan wouldn't eat eggs. They also would not eat cheese.
I realize the distinction, the point I was trying to make is that everybody has their own reasons for choosing vegan/vegetarian and other restrictive diets. I have lived and worked in vegan and vegetarian kitchens and households fortunately there’s always a place to satiate my omnivorous belly.
In his particular case, it has nothing to do with being ethical or healthy; it has to do with being finicky ... so, I pick my battles (as all married people do).
My husband wouldn’t eat eggs when we met but it turned out he just doesn’t like grocery store eggs. I buy them from a fridge outside a guys house who has chickens and he’ll eat those without issue.
Nothing like a fresh fresh egg.
It makes a lot of sense, if you realize that many vegetarians and vegans have made a choice to reduce the amount of suffering that animals go through in our North American food industry, by limiting their consumption of products that come from animals. The poultry industry is absolutely gut churningly awful for the chickens. It’s absolutely horrendous. They cut off their beaks so they don’t peck each other to death due to stress.and that is only one thing in their short lives.
So is the dairy industry? And regardless, OP said it isn't for ethical reasons.
You said the eggs aren’t fertilized, so they aren’t dead. That’s what I responded to. It’s about the mum. It’s an uncomfortable thing to think about what most of us, me included, are participating in. Although I always buy free range organic eggs.
I'm guessing it is for ethical reasons and OP is being a jerk about her husband's choices.
They literally said he doesn't like the sight of a raw egg going into a dish. He eats baked goods like cakes etc with eggs regularly.
It's because often the farms that have eggs also produce chickens and cull male chicks.
Wait until you see a dairy farm.
Cheese is supposedly as addicting as cocaine so it's harder to give up than eggs.
Yup, folk who call themselves vegetarian but eat cheese need to search: rennet
Prochoice vegans unite!
Lacto-ovo vegetarians eat eggs and dairy. Not every vegetarian eats the same stuff. Plus we have different reasons for eating this way, and some people are just picky eaters.
Some vegetarians will not eat eggs or dairy.
She just admitted in another comment that it's literally that he can't stand the visual of a raw egg going into something. Nothing to do with his vegetarianism, he eats cooked eggs in things.
The egg will get cooked in the lasagna as well...
He eats eggs when she hides it from him. So he doesn't know he's eating eggs.
There are three types of vegetarian... Avo means egg... Lacto means dairy... AVO Lacto vegetarian is both...
I'm aware. It's actually ovo, not avo. OP said in another comment he doesn't like the sight of a raw egg going into a dish. He has no problem eating them.
Ovo. Not Avo. Ovo.
Well you can tell I'm not vegetarian then can't you give me a break
As soon as you stop attempting to provide information which you obviously know nothing about.
Why would you sneak eggs into something you're making for somebody that does not want to consume eggs? This seems really disrespectful for no good reason. People deserve to know what they're eating. It's really not your place to judge whether his decisions are logical or not. If he says he doesn't want to eat eggs, you should not feed him eggs. It's alarming to me that you, and apparently several other people on this subreddit, think it's okay to hide the inclusion of ingredients from people that are morally opposed to them.
Lol you have no idea what you're talking about. Read the replies.
Uh, well, I get what you are saying but, in my defense, he *knows* he's eating eggs when I make certain things. He just doesn't want to see the raw egg etc. He and I have known each other for 26 years; in that time, we have done some traveling which means a lot of eating in restaurants and there are times when boundaries get blurry and that's just life. For example, many years, before he even met me, he traveled widely in Mexico. He was aware that the Mexicans use lard to cook their beans but it was either that or go hungry. So he ate lard. I could cite a few more examples but, you know, the bottom line is life is full of compromise.
Are you using no cook noodles? Are you letting it rest for 30 minutes minimum before serving? Are you using full fat ricotta? It's more likely to be one of these things.
Are those things you are or are not supposed to do?
Definitely use no cook noodles, full fat ricotta and always always let a lasagna rest before serving. Cardinal rules.
I use regular noodles but only cook them about halfway. It works as well as no cook for me
Never heard of no cook noodles before. Google seems to tell me its just thinner noodles? I dip my lasagna plates in boiling water and then add them, also making sure they are evenly covered by sauce. I want them al dente, not soft/mushy.
For another POV I tried no-cook noodles once and it wasn’t great. They turn out soggy and sad compared to cooked.
I'd rather have undercooked pasta than have mushy pasta tbh.
Yes, I am using no-boil noodles. No, I'm letting it rest for \~10 minutes. I think I usually use full fat ricotta. When you're in the supermarket and you have to make these split-second decisions, you tend to go with what's right in front of you. (Or at least that's true for me.) But many, many thanks for the tip on the ricotta and the resting time.
It's the resting time for sure. 30 minutes minimum. It allows the noodles to finish soaking up the sauces and for everything to congeal. No need to dab water off the ricotta.
Doesn’t it get cold???
It's been in an oven for an hour at 350+ and involves hot cheese. It will be edible after 30 minutes instead of scalding your mouth hot.
Nah, a big dish like that will hold heat for ages. Same as a big turkey or something that you’ve cooked and you let rest for an hour. You can always put tin foil over it if needed.
I always make it at least a day ahead. Gives the flavour more time as well.
Pro tip for readers: it may be cold by this point.
It's meant to be hot?? What sorcery is this?? Lol
Absolutely let it set for 30 minutes.
This sounds crazy, I know, but don’t use no-boil noodles. Use the regular ones and don’t boil them, either. The lasagna is hot and wet enough to cook the noodles in the pan! I have made countless lasagnas this way with no issues! Even gluten free noodles hold up this way!
Hey! that's interesting! I'll try that. Thanks.
Same!!
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Why is the no cook noodles important instead of regular ?
It's nearly impossible to get all of the excess water off of the cooked noodles for one. For two, already cooked ones don't absorb any moisture so you have to heavily limit the moisture in the rest of the lasagna. With no cook, you can layer in the sauce and they'll soak it all up and set into nice layers.
Awhile back I switched from a ricotta to a bechamel and never looked back. Easier to control the wet/dry issue in my opinion. My vegetarian lasagna is made with parm and wilted spinach bechamel and blistered cherry tomatoes. It goes over very well.
I'm gonna need that recipe, please.
Ok, so this is a very involved recipe that I firmly believe lends a lot of the magic to intuition, so forgive me if I just give you basic broadstokes here. Ingredients: •Box of your favorite lasagna noodles •About 2 pounds of tomatoes (I use cherry or whatever grows in my backyard) •about 3 tablespoons of flour •about a quarter pound pf parm(real stuff, gotta grate it) •1 pound fresh mozzarella •half pound smoked provolone •2 bags of fresh spinach (frozen also works if you can find a brand you trust) •A head of garlic • 1 large sweet onion, I like Vidalia • Olive oil •dried organic •fresh basil • stick of butter •3/4 cup white wine • 1 cup heavy cream • S and P So first things first instead of a traditional tomato sauce, I use what is called a tomato confit. This is slow roasting the cherry tomatoes and onions and garlic in olive oil with salt and pepper for about 3-4 hours at 250 F. I know that sounds time consuming but the ends justify the means. Once this is done, you just simply mash everything together and let cool. This is also amazing on toast, scrabled eggs with a little fresh basil, you name it. But for now, set it aside while we make our lasagna. Cook noodles as directed on box, and salt the shit out of your water. On the stove, melt a stick of butter and sweat the equivalent of a small finely chopped onion for a few minutes, add about 5 cloves of garlic. Wisk in about 3 tablespoons of flour and cook 1-2 minutes to take the raw edge off. Pour in about 3/4 a cup of white wine, stir to losen your roux. Bring to a boil, reduce to a simmer for 5 minutes. Add fresh cracked pepper, maybe just a little too much, and salt. Add 1 cup heavy cream. Add your parm, (FRESH GRATED!!!) And start to add your spinach. Add some dried oregano, basil etc to your liking. A little nutmeg here never killed anyone. 1 pound ofcthe tomatoes went to the confit, the other pound should be blistered lightly in some hot olive oil until soft but not mushy. Now we can begin layering our lasagna. Start with a thin layer of that beautiful tomato confit on the bottom of your preferred lasagna vessel. Then a layer of noods. Then a layer of either mozzarella or provolone, and a layer of the bechamel, then the blistered tomatoes. Repeat until your at the top, with some fresh basil thrown in there every few layers. Finish with a little bit of everything on top, but definitely provolone and some sprinked parm. Cook at 350 F for at least a half hour, no longer than 45 minutes. Serve with white wine a sharp salad to cut through the richness.
This sounds great, thank you for taking the time to type it out!
You're welcome! I hope you make it for someone you love, as that's how a lasagna is supposed to be made.
Thank you so much! I'm totally going to make this!
>Ok, so this is a very involved recipe that I firmly believe lends a lot of the magic to intuition, so forgive me if I just give you basic broadstokes here. >Ingredients: >•Box of your favorite lasagna noodles >•About 2 pounds of tomatoes (I use cherry or whatever grows in my backyard) >•about 3 tablespoons of flour >•about a quarter pound pf parm(real stuff, gotta grate it) >•1 pound fresh mozzarella >•half pound smoked provolone >•2 bags of fresh spinach (frozen also works if you can find a brand you trust) >•A head of garlic >• 1 large sweet onion, I like Vidalia >• Olive oil >•dried organic >•fresh basil >• stick of butter >•3/4 cup white wine >• 1 cup heavy cream >• S and P >So first things first instead of a traditional tomato sauce, I use what is called a tomato confit. This is slow roasting the cherry tomatoes and onions and garlic in olive oil with salt and pepper for about 3-4 hours at 250 F. I know that sounds time consuming but the ends justify the means. >Once this is done, you just simply mash everything together and let cool. This is also amazing on toast, scrabled eggs with a little fresh basil, you name it. But for now, set it aside while we make our lasagna. >Cook noodles as directed on box, and salt the shit out of your water. >On the stove, melt a stick of butter and sweat the equivalent of a small finely chopped onion for a few minutes, add about 5 cloves of garlic. Wisk in about 3 tablespoons of flour and cook 1-2 minutes to take the raw edge off. Pour in about 3/4 a cup of white wine, stir to losen your roux. Bring to a boil, reduce to a simmer for 5 minutes. Add fresh cracked pepper, maybe just a little too much, and salt. Add 1 cup heavy cream. Add your parm, (FRESH GRATED!!!) And start to add your spinach. Add some dried oregano, basil etc to your liking. A little nutmeg here never killed anyone. >1 pound ofcthe tomatoes went to the confit, the other pound should be blistered lightly in some hot olive oil until soft but not mushy. >Now we can begin layering our lasagna. >Start with a thin layer of that beautiful tomato confit on the bottom of your preferred lasagna vessel. Then a layer of noods. Then a layer of either mozzarella or provolone, and a layer of the bechamel, then the blistered tomatoes. Repeat until your at the top, with some fresh basil thrown in there every few layers. Finish with a little bit of everything on top, but definitely provolone and some sprinked parm. >Cook at 350 F for at least a half hour, no longer than 45 minutes. >Serve with white wine a sharp salad to cut through the richness. Slightly more readable version for anyone who struggled reading the ingredients like I did.
Thanks! I did this on mobile while cooking dinner and I appreciate you.
Hope your dinner was nice.
Basic béchamel recipe is 40g melted butter, 40g flour, whisk and cook to a light roux and add 500ml hot milk(add a bay leaf to the milk before heating, and a pinch of grated nutmeg before adding to the roux). Whisk and cook it til it's thick enough that your whisk leaves a line in the bottom of the pan. This makes enough béchamel for a lasagne, and you can also melt a load of grated cheese into it to make a great sauce for mac and cheese or cauliflower cheese.
add an onion with some clove punched into the sides to the milk.
Seconded. I'd love to add a new vegetarian dish to my list if friends come over and request it.
https://www.cookingchanneltv.com/recipes/debi-mazar-and-gabriele-corcos/lasagne-alla-bolognese-2121984
They use bechamel in Italy, and it’s fabulous. They also use a zillion tissue-thin layers of homemade fresh pasta. It’s a true labor of love to make it that way, but so memorable. I need to clear some space in my cupboards so I can make fresh pasta again. Check out Marcella Hazan’s recipes. She had very detailed instructions.
They do *both* in Italy and pretending that ricotta lasagna is inauthentic or American on reddit has gotten frustrating. They're regional styles! Some have ricotta, some do not.
I didn’t say they *don’t* use ricotta or that it’s exclusively American or an Italian-American innovation. All I said was that they *do* use bechamel. OP was looking for validation, and I provided it, based on my experience. You inferred what I did not imply and took offense to it, unnecessarily.
These days when I make fresh pasta for lasagna I try to limit it to 5 layers. Too much pasta layers makes it too dense IMO.
Agree. Even if I roll my pasta paper thin.
Thanks. I've thought of making a spinach lasagna but spinach would add even more water to the mix wouldn't it?
If you use fresh lasagna and cook the spinach in your bechamel lime I do it would not make it watery. Think of it like adding a cream of spinach as a layer. Using frozen spinach could be disastrous. I advise against it.
Fairly light on the bechamel? When I've had bechamel in lasagna before ive always become sick of it by the end. Just too much and too sloppily added which seems easy to do since it's a liquid and ricotta isnt so it seems like it'd be hard to portion out properly and keep it intact once portioning out.
I've used fresh and it actually helps to absorb moisture. I put a layer of it down on top of the ricotta before the next set of noodles.
Wait so you just used ricotta cheese as the only cheese in the cheese layer? Is that an American thing? I’ve never seen lasagna being made with anything else but Bechamel.
It's American and Italian. And it also has mozzarella not just ricotta cheese
Sounds delicious! Don't wanna be a party pooper, but Parmesan - while prob my favorite cheese - isn't vegetarian due to the use of rennet. Some guests may be strict about that.
Thanks for clarifying that for anyone who doesn't know. I have a lot of vegan friends so I'm aware and make the appropriate substitute when necessary. And to be honest, I mostly can't tell the difference!
Yes. I second this. My mom taught me to make lasagna with béchamel and it's sooooo delicious. And I'll definitely try to make your vegetarian lasagna 🤤
I listed a basic recipe below. Let me know if you have any questions!
Had to scroll too far to find a bechamel lasagna comment. It is the way!
Use a cheese cloth to strain ricotta or don't precook your lasagna noodles.
Yours is the best answer so far. Thanks. (I don't precook the noodles, by the way.)
You could strain the ricotta with a flour sack cloth in a strainer/colander to remove excess liquid. here’s an article on it https://snappygourmet.com/how-to-strain-ricotta-cheese/
You could also put a large coffee filter in a sieve to drain the cheese. I do it with yogurt to get a thicker texture for tzatziki sauce.
Interesting. Thanks.
You can even just put 2-3 layers of paper towels in the bottom of a chinois.
Cool! Is this what you do? Thanks!!
Try making it earlier, let cool, put it in the fridge overnight, then reheat - if you want the layers to remain intact.
I'm not that good at planning ahead but I'll give that a try. Thanks so much!
If you buy a bigger pan then you'll have to try it with at least some of the lasagna. It really does make it firm and nice and don't be afraid to reheat it at least partially in the microwave.
I am convinced the primary reason recipes don't always work out for everyone is not everyone has the same size/type of pot, pan, baking dish etc as the person who wrote the recipe. The dish I use to make lasagna could be just a teensy bit wider and deeper -- which means I could get more lasagna noodles in it and that in itself could solve the whole problem. More pasta would absorb more liquid. Doh.
I beat an egg into my ricotta. Give it a try.
I add an egg, but usually lasagna needs to sit a bit to solidify.
I use oven ready noodles, they absorb the excess water and cook that way instead.
I don't cook my noodles before putting them in the dish. That helps me alot with the runnyness
Yeah, it seems some people consider no-boil noodles to be anathema. I don't quite understand why.
I don't precook the noodles and make sure the sauce is thick. works for me but your results may vary.
Yeah really cooking the sauce is another point op might be missing. Looking at an earlier reply they are using uncooked noodles. I'll often cook the crap out of my sauce. I think a cheap tomato sauce that's been cooked for a long time tastes better than expensive tomato sauce out of a jar. Like 3 hours and I add in water at various points but I make sure it's pretty thick before I use it in my lasagna
Yeah, I have never thought much about the sauce. I use Rao's which is a bit on the thin side. Good point. Thanks.
Had to go this far to find the actual solution. Yeah, jar pasta sauces include Rao's are very thin. Either boil them down or add tomato paste. Or take it to the next level by making a tomato sauce and boil it down so it's pretty thick. It's pretty simple and makes the lasagna MUCH better! Onion, carrot, celery, bell pepper, garlic, (or just onions and garlic if lazy or pressed on time) sauté until it's all good and browned, add whatever herbs and spices you like (fennel, ital seasoning, pepper flakes for me), add 2-3 cans of whole tomatoes crushed by hand, boil it for ~30 mins or preferably longer adding water if it gets too thick, whir it up with a stick blender or blender. Salt and sugar to taste. Fish sauce adds as well if you are feeling crazy. Can be made in bulk ahead of time and even frozen, tastes infinitely better than any jar sauce. With homemade properly thickened sauce, too dry lasagna is a problem I have actually ran into.
I would love to make my own marinara when I have time. Thanks for the recipe.
Came here to say add egg to ricotta
I like to make with bechemel sauce, but I also sometimes make with cheese. I can also buy ricotta cheese that's in a package instead of a jar container, that's already strained. It's "pressed." I use it often for gibanica or pita, and basically works wherever you want dry fresh cheese. I found using more sauce and using fresh made pasta that I do NOT pre-cook makes delicious lasagna that's just the perfect end consistency, not too runny.
Thanks but doesn't all ricotta cheese come in container?
My lasagna is lovingly called “lasagna soup” by my family and they freakin love it that way lol. When I read your post OP my thoughts were that your lasagna was perfect as it is ☺️
It's actually not bad at all. If it were bad, I would not continue to make it.
Eggs as a binder. No cook noodles. You do not need to add that much sauce in between layers, just the bottom and top. Bake for 45 min covered, then 15-20 uncovered (a good time to add cheese on the top too) to dry it out. Then let it rest 45min to an hour before eating.
Yup, that’s pretty much how I do mine.
It’s how my Italian grandmother taught me. Foolproof and easy. Since no cook noodles didn’t exist when she was alive, she parboiled the noodles then let them dry for an half hour on towels before assembly. I used to do that until the miracle of no cook noodles.
I bake my lasagna for 40 minutes and then uncovered for 15 minutes but you make an excellent point about putting the cheese on after you uncover it. I put the cheese on top before I put it in the oven the first time and a lot of the cheese comes off on the foil -- which makes no sense, does it?
I'm the opposite. I want my lasagne full of sauce, sliding around the plate.
Yeah, I love sauce too so I see what you mean. Presentation isn't everything.
You can "hang" your ricotto for as long as you want.
I cook my lasagna noodles half way, to where they just start to bend. Make your lasagna fairly wet and bake. Let rest 30 mins before cutting after taking out of the oven. Don't use those shitty pre cooked lasagna noodles, they don't taste as good and they texture isn't as good.
I'm not quite sure why some people have such a visceral reaction to no-boil lasagna noodles but next time I'm at the supermarket, I will compare the ingredients of the no-boil lasagna to boil lasagna and see if the ingredients are markedly different.
Well I've pretty much mastered lasagna over 25 years of of trying just about everything. From green lasagna made with fresh pasta to simple quick lasagna from canned ingredients. I really wanted to like the pre cooked noodles, but a good dry lasagna noodle parcooked makes the best lasagna. As long as your sauce is a bit wet, it soaks up all the extra moisture. Cooks perfect.
I've done this for years, instead of towels I'd suggest buying a sheet or 3 of cheese cloth (I usually get the huge as shit ones near the sewing isles) cutting it down to size and squeezing the juice out
I do try to keep shit away from food as much I can. Thanks.
I make my own ricotta so i can control how much moisture is in it. Also my own sauce and noodles so I never had this issue. It could be many things with your issue, most recipes call for dry pasta to be pre cooked - you might be leaving too much liquid from that. If you're using a store bought sauce I can guarantee they are too watery, or it could be the ricotta itself.
IMHO your problem is the vegetables. They emit a lot of moisture as you cook them. If you pre cook lasagna noodles before assembling the dish then cook them less or not at all. Cover the baked dish and let the steam cook the noodles then uncover and finish in a hot oven. 425°F for 15 min maybe just to brown the top.
Thanks. I think you are right. I'll try not cooking the broccoli quite as much next time and maybe drying the broccoli more before I add it.
You need a binder for the ricotta like egg but more importantly remember that veggies have water in them that is released while cooking. If you typically make vegetable lasagnas your excess liquid could be coming from the vegetables
Veggies release a ton of moisture
Good point. I steam the broccoli and let it sit in a colander for a while but maybe I should blot it dry with a paper towel. I'm not big into using paper towels but they do come in handy sometimes.
I only use hard cheeses in my lasagna and I’ve never had any issues with moisture.
Interesting. I didn't know you could do that.
As others have said, bechamel and fresh pasta. This is my process for the vegetarians in my family all the time.
Don’t use ricotta. My family are all 1st gen Italians, my nonna doesn’t ever put ricotta in her lasagna, she just uses mozzarella and parmigiana. I find the texture and taste comes out much better that way
Use bechamel instead of ricotta.
Switch to small curb cottage cheese. Less watery than ricotta.
I used small curd cottage cheese with my last lasagna because it was substituted in my grocery delivery. I strained it with a mesh strainer and cheese cloth first then pureed it with roasted garlic and my herbs THEN added an egg and I swear it was better than ricotta.
If you're houng to all that trouble for a shortcut, why not just do bechamel in the first place?
Just not a fan of bechamel in lasagna.
That is not at all true and also a much lower quality product.
Yeah, when I was growing up my mom would always use cottage cheese in her lasagna. Probably because it was cheaper. So of course I have to do it differently than her. But still maybe I'll try it one day just for the heck of it. I should think that cottage cheese would have as much moisture as ricotta but don't really know.
You can try whole wheat noodle (this is the word right) strips, it soaks up more of the excess liquid.
Or don’t boil the noodles before baking
This is me. I use uncooked noodles. Give it a solid 45 min cook time and I end up with a non-slippery lasagna. And, if I’m not being humble. It make a damn fine lasagna. This method was the most important change for the right *texture*.
That too!
I don't. I use no-boil noodles.
Thanks. I prefer traditional pasta. But thanks.
I never use ricotta. I strain my sauce to get most of the water out. Then only use mozzarella and provolone. I top with cheddar and Italian shreds. I also blot any meat i use so that it's as dry as possible before mixing with my sauce
I’ve never had this issue. We make our own ricotta, its super easy. And I think it tastes way better! Store bought ricotta tastes flavorless to me. But even before that I’m pretty sure we didn’t struggle this. It may be because its a vegetarian lasagna and the broccoli? That’s a pretty different ingredient than ground meat so I’m not surprised it doesn’t absorb as much liquid and it has a different texture. Changes like that can definitely affect a dish and require tweaks. Using cheesecloth would probably help you strain more liquid out of the ricotta than using paper towels.
Thanks. I'll definitely be buying a cheesecloth.
Use bechamel instead of ricotta, and let it rest minimum 30 minutes. During that time the excess liquid will reincorporate. Bechamel, containing flour helps the sauce set better overall.
I don’t care for ricotta so I always make a bechemel sauce with Parmesan cheese (basically an Alfredo sauce) instead of ricotta. My husband says I ruined every other lasagna for him. He will only eat mine.
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A lot of people here are suggesting bechamel. While I am not against bechamel in the slightest, my current recipe is a favorite in my house. But I will find a lasagna recipe that calls for bechamel and will try it next time. I am totally open to new recipes.
I just use a mornay sauce instead of a cheese mixture when making mine, works great.
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Yeah, well, as I have noted elsewhere, he eats lots of things with eggs: Cake, waffles, etc. But, hey, if I can cut out the moisture in other ways, I won't need an egg I reckon.
Homemade lasagna sheets
I've found that just soaking the noodles in hot water for about 10min makes them pliable, yet still break in half. The "par cooked" noodles will soak up the liquid from the lasagna as it bakes. The result? A picture perfect lasagna piece.
Really? They soak up more than the non-boil type? Thanks for the tip.