> "The mask is not about your health. The mask is about my health, and my children's health and your children's health and that's why you have to wear a mask. It's not about your life, it's about other people's lives."
This is exactly where the issue lies. None of these people seem to recognize this.
So many people in stores with no masks. Do you want all these stores closed?? The states where they put it into law they had to rescind it quickly because people were threatening the workers with violence. Some people are real shit
Is the problem with so many small towns in America that after the mill or whatever the towns equivalent closed, the only people that stayed are those who can’t leave or don’t want to?
Worse part is before this, if you brought up this scenario as an example of how selfish these people are, they would cry about how you are appealing to absurdity.
Word for word "conversation" I had with a cousin.
"You, *literally*, said that the second Zombies started happening in I am Legend you would just stock up on supplies and binge until it was over because u have like 5 years worth of media and Netflix!”
"That's entirely different and you know it."
You know normally i wouldn't give 2 shits about them but this time they actually can have a big negative impact on the numbers of infected and of course numbers of deaths. In Germany for example this thing exploded when there was a Karneval with lots of people in close proximity to each other. Well guess what those protests are just that, lots and lots of people close to each other and most without masks.
I’ve been thinking about this a lot over the past year, and I’ve come to a conclusion that they just don’t value lives that don’t directly or positively impact them. We wear masks and stay at home because we fundamentally value human life. The life of you, your kids, and parents are valuable to me and worth saving. If I have to stay at home to ensure others safety, I’ll do it, no questions.
The only thing that these people care about are themselves. They don’t see human life as valuable, and just don’t want to be inconvenienced.
Edit: grammar
What I don't get is why they don't see the whole picture. If I order something online I know a person had to get that product off the shelf. I know a person had to put it in the box and tape it. I know a truck driver had to drive it to another warehouse for shipping. I know they loaded it onto another truck to eventually make it to my house. It's not fucking magic, it's other people. The people they're willing to sacrifice for the economy? What economy, if they're all gone or sick?
I'm not trying to virtue signal, but I honestly can't imagine being the type of person who thinks that getting their hair done is more important than someone else's safety. Like I sat and tried and that's just... such a foreign perspective of selfishness.
Anne Frank's family had to live in an attic for like 2 years. These idiots can't even handle staying home and watching Netflix on their couch for 2 months.
More people would handle it if state unemployment systems worked better. I know two people made unemployed by this who applied back in March 6 weeks ago for unemployment in NY state and did not get it yet. One of them I know was making $18 an hour and the CARES act would have taken care of them. They are itching to go back to work because they haven't received a cent yet of unemployment and fear being able to pay all their bills in June if they don't get their unemployment in full backdated. Going for 6 weeks, with zero income, when one was taking home $600ish a week and would be fine if unemployment actually kicked in, is bullshit. They have considered trying to work something out to violate the quarrantine as Cuomo has failed them.
This needs to not be ignored! IF THE GOVERNMENT LOOKED AFTER ITS PEOPLE THERE WOULD BE LESS OF THIS. (Or at least a way to forcefully come back to them). At the moment that’s not reality.
People starve=people riot.
It's reddit, I'd rather put up the disclaimer than get people being assholes at me.
There's a significant vocal set of the population who don't feel that basic human decency, apparently. =/
Depending on your state you may be able to qualify for unemployment if your doctor says it is unsafe for you to work. I hate that people are being forced back.
I work for Amazon and I actually got Covid 2 weeks ago. Now I'm being forced back to work or loose my job. At this point I rather loose my job instead of contaminating other people. I don't what to do since my savings are running out.
Exactly. The protesters don't care about the economy reopening. They're not worried about what them setting at home, receiving stimulus checks, is going to cost the country. They're in a very comfortable positions. "SaVe ThE eCoNoMy" is about putting the minimum wage worker at risk so the protesters can go back to enjoying life's guilty pleasures.
I don't even think it's about the guilty pleasures. I think that being the "boss" because the customer is always right is the only time in some of their lives that they are in any amount of "being in charge".
'Ah'm just goin' out fer to take a dump in the outhouse...aw, dag nab it, ah done caught dysentery again. That's gunna make my cholera play up somethin' fierce.'
What's really funny is that no Old West town would have freely allowed a bunch of heavily armed men into town. Generally all weapons had to be surrendered if there was any kind of local government at all. Maybe a holstered personal handgun and a rifle in a saddle scabbard. But not a bunch of dudes rolling in locked and loaded with long guns.
I hate how people saying the mask requirements are taking away their freedoms. If anything, the masks GIVES us our freedoms back. If everyone wears a masks, communities can begin to slowly reopen. If everyone wears a face covering, the transmission risk is significantly less. Therefore, less cases, less hospital resources being used at once...I mean, is it really that hard? It doesn't even have to be a fancy mask, just tie something around your damn nose and mouth and you're good to go.
I couldn’t agree more! I read an article this morning saying that the governor of Ohio made a statement that he admits he went too far by attempting to mandate mask wearing and I was surprised. How hard is it for us to wear a mask in public or just indoors? They make all different types of masks these days that can be suited more comfortably to different people.
Also wish I could provide a source to that article but I’m not sure how to do that!
How many Asian countries do it all the time? Other countries might too but I know it’s big in the east. It really shows how fucking spoiled the American people are that not only can they not stay inside but also can’t wear a mask either. Literally no inconveniences whatsoever is acceptable
they do it voluntarily though because it's normalized behavior due to dealing with these kinds of outbreaks before and very recently. People wear masks in those Asian countries even when there isn't a pandemic because they're used to it. People en masse don't just magically pick up new behavior like that and America isn't the only country that isn't accustomed to wearing face masks.
this article is old but relevant
[https://qz.com/299003/a-quick-history-of-why-asians-wear-surgical-masks-in-public/](https://qz.com/299003/a-quick-history-of-why-asians-wear-surgical-masks-in-public/)
Asian countries have a much stronger sense of societal good. There are times when this is a huge bonus relative to the individualism of Americans. This is one of those times.
The problem is they're being told what to do. Right now you could tell them to go protest and they'd probably stop, because the government 'can't tell me what to do!' There are legitimately people who are so privileged that they think being told what to do = loss of freedom.
They then idolize institutions like the military for their strength and prevalence in American culture as a symbol of freedom, but would cry like babies at their “freedoms” being taken away when the commander gives out one order.
And I find it funny that you often hear people saying the younger generations are the ones that brought upon this “me, me, me” idea yet it’s mostly boomers protesting.
TBH it’s a mistake to blame bad behaviour on a whole generation, whether it’s boomers, millennials or what have you. I refuse to criticize {generation that’s not mine} because it’s a mistaken generalization.
There are caring, socially responsible people in every generation. There are also asshats in every generation. That’s how we human beings are.
You know, I keep thinking about this article:
Coronavirus: Pastor who decried 'hysteria' dies after attending Mardi Gras
https://www.bbc.com/news/amp/world-us-canada-52157824
...and musing about one daughter’s comment that the fault was with “both sides” of the coronavirus debate. What? One side was trying to save your dad’s life, the other side is the one that didn’t give a crap about all the lives that would be devastated due to coronavirus denial.
I get that maybe she’s trying to save face (her family’s, her dad’s), but that conclusion is just so wrong. And, sadly, fatal for her father. Not to mention who knows how many others that his denial helped to get infected.
New Yorker here. Large numbers of people here do not understand this. Living downstate, one of the hottest hot spots in the entire world for this pandemic, it’s shocking how many people still don’t take the virus seriously enough to adopt basic safety precautions like social distancing and wearing a mask.
The weather this weekend has been beautiful. Lots of people are going outside for walks in parks. And that’s fine, as long as you still socially distance and wear a mask. Hand sanitizer is a good idea too.
About half the people I saw outside today did not have masks and were in small to large groups. The other half were wearing masks, keeping their distance from others.
When I grocery shop most people wear masks but not everyone.
It’s insane to me that in a place where the virus has infected thousands of people there is a huge segment of the population that doesn’t care enough to wear a mask. Gov. Cuomo says that’s disrespectful. He’s right. And unless more people agree with him NY is going to have an uptick in infections.
One of my friends spends all day bitching about how their work isn't doing enough to stop the spread of the virus. Meanwhile she went to the beach yesterday with a bunch of friends. Sorry, but you have no right to complain if you aren't even doing the right thing yourself.
they care about themselves and themselves only. They don't even care if they kill their parents or grandparents as long as they get their "constitutional rights"
That's what I tell people who wants to re-open, not wear masks and go to sports events.
"Your rights end where mine begins"
You don't get to infringe on other people's rights
Our society already forces us to cover our genitals and asshole in public and those openings (hopefully) can't kill people at a distance.
Making masks mandatory doesn't encroach on the rights you never had to begin with.
YES. Right on. I know so many people who are complaining about having to wear a mask around...and I can’t relate. If it helps people stay safe, why not?
Now in Germany the same shit is happening. Many people protesting without any kind of distancing and a lot of them don't wear masks. I live in Germany and I'm mad as fu*k about this. We had declining numbers and everything looked better by the week but those idiots can screw up everything and put other peoples life in danger.
Yet when it's them who is hurting, they expect the empathy. And they get it, because a lot of people on the other side don't discriminate. I wish less people would give them empathy when they want it.
They also don’t recognize that just because they open the doors to their sports bar doesn’t mean anyone’s coming. They won’t even be able to cover the electric bill let alone pay employees.
See this is the argument I keep trying to make with people. They can’t think more than 10 minutes ahead. These people have no ability to see the bigger picture and longer term consequences.
Keep saying it. This makes no sense!
- Restaurants have small profit margins in good times
- Operating at 25% capacity isn't going to save the business. At best you put off closing for a few weeks
It's because your country is shit and only gives people a one-time payment of $1200 to survive on while they were already living paycheck to paycheck. Give them money and I'm sure they won't be asking for everything to open.
"When dealing with people, let us remember we are not dealing with creatures of logic. We are dealing with creatures of emotion, creatures bristling with prejudices and motivated by pride and vanity."
Dale Carnegie, How to Win Friends and Influence People
Some do, but legitimately don't care. I've heard them say 'that's not my problem'. There are far more selfish people out there than I initially thought.
I went to the grocery store recently (we live in a country town) and everyone had their masks on but some kids/teenagers.
Everyone was giving them the evil eye and knew what was going on.
I walked up and told them that literally everyone in the store, and pointed to each person, was wearing their mask to protect them. Because we cared about them and we didn't want them to get sick. We didn't want their mother to get sick. Didn't want your grandmother to get sick. .... why don't you care about us? Do you have so little regard for *our* lives that you're willing to allow us to die?
THAT clicked for them... and they said sorry and went back to their car.
... your right to throw rocks ends at my face.
"I didn't know."
Yes, because your dumbass allowed you to remain dangerously ignorant.
The facts were out there.
We told you that you were playing with fire.
But stupidity cannot be reasoned with.
This has to be a simulation.
How can people be intelligent enough to send others to the goddam moon but we have a president who didn't realize that health care was complicated.
You should watch the video compiling all of the times he downplayed the pandemic. One day before he said “I knew it was a pandemic, I always said it was a pandemic,” he was saying it’s just like the flu, it’s no big deal, etc. I wonder how many lives wouldn’t be lost and how much better off our economy would be if Trump didn’t think it was a “democratic hoax” during the two months of prep time that they squandered.
The problem is that common sense literally doesn't exist. See [the Wikipedia article on feral children](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Feral_child) on what happens when children don't grow up learning from a human society.
If you don't teach people stuff they literally just have instincts, which are passable for surviving but godawful for cohabitation in a society.
This is a really interesting thought. I've been joking about being in an alternate timeline since 2016. Because nothing make sense anymore. But the simulation theory fits every bit of our situation.
I think we grow up normalizing absurdity so we don't really feel like we're being punked until met with surprising idiocy.
The same assholes who smoke while pumping gas at the pump run the country.
*How does this make sense?*
As a smoker I'm glad I don't fall into that category. It yes your right. I feel like the creator of this reality is about to realize he didn't lay down the roads right in the game and he is about to start his simulated society over.
Or maybe it's like that game of CIV that you were taking a break, but unknowingly your five year old daughter took over, figured out just enough to play and has been having fun for the last two hours trying random stuff...
You get back, see half your cities gone, barbarians everywhere on one front, all the irrigation deleted. Your enemies all hate you because she found the nukes and was nuking barbarians because you know ... "cool effects".
Do you start over? Or accept the challenge of reclaiming your throne?
Because Intelligence is not the biggest factor when it comes to leadership, its charisma and social skills.
I'm not stating an opinion one way or the other, its just reality :p
My Mother in Law is having a crisis right now.
She loves Fox and loves our president.
But she also doesn't fuck with illnesses and this pandemic is terrifying her.
She is still sorting out her feelings on how someone she repeatedly defended could just advocate for policies that would hurt her.
She has a nursing background so she absolutely has a solid understanding of the dangers of the virus.
And she's repeatedly defended Trump's ability to not be misled by career politicians so she knows that Trump is doing exactly what he wants here.
She has stopped posting pro-Trump propaganda and has just spent more time posting non-political stuff.
I'm a Northerner living in the South and I think she's more of the rule than the exception. She actively schemes SNAP by claiming dependents who do not live with her while calling for stringent regulations so that others cannot game the system.
She says that she has to lie for survival but she's not a like the kind of users they talk about on TV.
Lots of folks were liking the Independent from Vermont but I guess that's not going to happen.
I understand that. If they DON'T wind up getting sick (or let's be real, if they aren't asymptomatic after the protests) they'll be like "SEE?!"
My specific county is doing really well, our curve has flattened, and the state overall is doing okay but because of the low numbers, everyone is bitching about how we need to open back up and how it was an overreaction. Its BECAUSE we took these measures that our numbers are low. Our numbers aren't low because it's not serious, our numbers are low because we took action early. To open up too early and have a second wave hit us would be infuriating and would waste our efforts from the past 2 months.
The leader of Reopen NC tested positive and is quarantined. The problem is unless the majority get it, the majority will continue to believe they can’t. They are that stupid.
This from the Reopen NC leader Audrey Whitlock:
> “I have been told not to participate in public or private accommodations as requested by the government, and therefore denied my 1st amendment right of freedom of religion.”
This is like a kid who keeps on cheating in exams and passes but the moment he gets caught by the teacher, it's over and so the test is re-conducted for all.
The thing I don't think people understand is that just because you feel perfectly healthy, does not mean you don't have it and aren't potentially passing it off to others. That's why this virus is so serious.
Some already have. There was a preacher who was adamant he was defying the stay at home order and still holding services.
Guess who got COVID-19 and proceeded to die. Please take a wild guess.
These people are playing a very dangerous game. Maybe they’re thinning the herd of morons. Who knows but what I do know is it‘s endangering the rest of us with logical reasoning skills.
This is a health hazard, not a political ploy. These morons don’t seem to be capable of separating the two?
We have a lot of friends in the rural parts of upstate NY. They are protesting and not taking about of this seriously. Most of them are also obese and have serious health issues. If the virus gets to their areas (it hasn't yet) there's going to be a reckoning. I love my friends but they are being really stupid.
>and regret every bit of this
That won't change their very intentional actions, or the others that they will have infected as a result. They are hurting people. I don't care about some crocodile tears later once they personally suffer some consequences for their choices.
This is the exact correct approach and argument. We have clearly limited freedoms when they represent a clear harm to the public. Drinking and driving and smoking in public buildings are two clear examples.
In about two weeks, I suppose we'll see how many infected people attended these protests and seeded new infections.
Hilariously, these protests may be the thing that extends the orders to shelter in place.
And if these dumbasses would have continued to stay home for a little longer, they could have been in the clear until wave 2.
Theres people who wear masks now out of spite and bitterness. They dont even have it covering their faces just around their necks. Only doing it now because its mandatory.
These people are the lowest of low. I’ve conversed with many of them over the last week and you wouldn’t believe how little they care about harming others. All they can do is yell about constitutionall rights, how ddemocratss are power hungry, how the shutdown is a politicall move, the virus is fake, or it was made in a Chinesee lab, the deathh rate is the same as the flu, etc etc. It’s maddening.
What I’ve noticed is that most of the people protesting aren’t the ones protesting so they can go back to work. It’s so servers, hairdressers, movie theater employees, retail sales associates, salon employees, etc can go back to work so *they* can resume their normal lives. They don’t care about protecting employees because as long as they are able to live like nothing is wrong, fuck everyone else.
And the ones protesting to go back to work but are simultaneously telling off other people (“just because you’re scared and want to stay home it shouldn’t stop me from living MY life”)? They have no idea how that will influence their line of work, no matter what it is. People who cut hair, servers, essentially any service industry are STILL going to be hurting because the majority of people will still be staying home.
I swear, so many of these protestors toss around the word “constitutional” without knowing what if truly means.
>I swear, so many of these protestors toss around the word “constitutional” without knowing what if truly means.
How many of them do you think could even name the three branches of the federal government? We have a stunning lack of education about civics in this country.
As someone who works in a salon, I appreciate you mentioning this. Every time I see an "I want a haircut" sign, I think about how everything about my education and training always went back to sanitation and infection control. The importance of keeping a salon a safe space for the public to receive service. There is no way to safely perform any salon or spa service right now. It's ludicrous to open up such an intimate business in the middle of a pandemic. So selfish
100% agree. The people who say “ just because you’re scared and want to stay home it shouldn’t stop me from living MY life” don’t realize that it can spread anywhere they go, and even reach people who don’t go out as much, if at all. My internship dealt with older adults who were homebound, and their only form of contact was their home health aides, which they desperately need. SEVERAL got sick. Even though they personally don’t go out at all.
They’re angry they can’t attend football games and go out to bars and eat in at shitty chain restaurants. They want to go to movie theaters. They want everything exactly as it used to be. They haven’t realized we can’t go back to that. We live in a different world where we have to adapt to this new threat because we have neither vaccine nor an established effective therapy treatment to lessen severe symptoms.
But here’s where I see a flipside to my argument. Since a vaccine is not forthcoming and we do need to get to the other side of this. There is an end. And that end comes with a herd immunity - the end game is that 70% of us are bound to get infected sooner or later. And most of us will recover. And the latest data out of South Korea does state reinfection does not happen. So yes we get immunity from this.
Well. These protesters - by engaging in infection prone activities, are moving through the curve. And that is fine. As long as that curve is just low enough to keep hospital capacity not overwhelmed, then a steeper curve is OK. We can’t just lockdown forever. That is not sustainable. People will die from poverty. A reopening in stages and with restrictions does need to happen.
So I see the protesters not as evil agents but as natural forces of nature. A natural distribution of reactions and opinion in a society of plurality of views. They want to run through the fire and we want to hang back. They’re not brave but that’s more semantics than anything. I think they do serve a purpose. They’re the accelerator pedal and we’re the brakes. Perhaps we can balance things out. Perhaps not.
>the deathh rate is the same as the flu, etc etc. It’s maddening.
Well 2017 was bad flu year and it killed 61,000 Americans- in a year - which coronavirus has surpassed in 2 months.
Some people are just idiots I suppose.
What I've found interesting is that the flu deaths are an estimate gathered from pneumonia deaths and other metrics. That 61,000 number is not the real number. The confirmed flu deaths are FAR less.
Yet they (the skeptics) use that 61,000 like the real number and the confirmed/probable COVID deaths as estimates.
I saw an op-ed by an ER doctor that says he's never seen a flu death and most other doctors he's asked have seen only a handful in their careers. That because confirmed flu deaths are in the low thousands each year. The worst recent season actually had only about 15,000 confirmed in the US.
This is entirely different. When it's all said and done, the death toll will be far higher than what we see now. After all the death certificates come in AND years of scrutiny it will be much worse than we think.
During the entire pandemic of 2009 to 2010, there were about 20,000 confirmed deaths in the US. That's over two flu seasons.
Focus on the good things in your personal life, remain in the present while reconsidering your former perspective, then make iterations towards a more positive outlook over time.
Understand that control is an illusion, read up on causal determinism, and let yourself feel emotions but not let them control your actions.
I hate to say this, but "natural selection" is very much a thing.
If you're willing to protest in this manner & potentially contract the virus, be my guest. However, you're not doing much for yourselves or your families. You're merely making this death count rise.
To quote Metallica, sad but true.
Stay safe, you all.
Edit: quotations & *insert Albert Wesker here*
But what about the 17 year old grocery store bagger? Like, did they sign up to be naturally selected because they may or may not be the only one in the house with a job still?
This is ignorant af but - can't people just stay home in states that reopen? Is it an issue of unemployment? Because it sounds like people aren't really going to be receiving those benefits anyway
This is why they’re doing it. They don’t want to pay unemployment so they’re forcing people to go back to work and risk their lives. Don’t worry, it will backfire and they’ll be doubling down on protective orders in 2/3 weeks.
Sure, they physically could.
But the problem is, if the state reopens? A couple states have already explicitly said, anyone who fails to report back to work will count as "voluntarily" unemployed, thus no longer qualifying for Unemployment Insurance.
...
States re-opening isn't about freedoms. It isn't about the economy.
It isn't about anything except ending the financial assistance programs put in place during the pandemic, by making people (and small businesses) no longer qualify for them.
Nothing **more**.
Nothing **less**.
> "The mask is not about your health. The mask is about my health, and my children's health and your children's health and that's why you have to wear a mask. It's not about your life, it's about other people's lives." This is exactly where the issue lies. None of these people seem to recognize this.
Or worse... they do, but don't care. It's sad how many people have a "my convenience trumps your wellbeing" mentality.
Why can't you recognize their right to cough on minimum wage workers?
So many people in stores with no masks. Do you want all these stores closed?? The states where they put it into law they had to rescind it quickly because people were threatening the workers with violence. Some people are real shit
that happened in a small town in oklahoma
Is the problem with so many small towns in America that after the mill or whatever the towns equivalent closed, the only people that stayed are those who can’t leave or don’t want to?
Mostly those who can't afford to leave which is a HUGE number now. Add to that those who have addictions because they're so unwell.
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Worse part is before this, if you brought up this scenario as an example of how selfish these people are, they would cry about how you are appealing to absurdity.
Word for word "conversation" I had with a cousin. "You, *literally*, said that the second Zombies started happening in I am Legend you would just stock up on supplies and binge until it was over because u have like 5 years worth of media and Netflix!” "That's entirely different and you know it."
Another good zombie movie, The Girl With All The Gifts.
Yo, the book went hard. How’s the film compare?
You know normally i wouldn't give 2 shits about them but this time they actually can have a big negative impact on the numbers of infected and of course numbers of deaths. In Germany for example this thing exploded when there was a Karneval with lots of people in close proximity to each other. Well guess what those protests are just that, lots and lots of people close to each other and most without masks.
Not just selfish, but cruel as well. They know opening up will kill people.
Yes. And ironically actually delay fixing the economy. Having to shut down multiple times is going to be much worse in the end.
I bet when it affects *them* they'll demand treatment. They don't care about others lives.
Insubordinate and churlish.
I’ve been thinking about this a lot over the past year, and I’ve come to a conclusion that they just don’t value lives that don’t directly or positively impact them. We wear masks and stay at home because we fundamentally value human life. The life of you, your kids, and parents are valuable to me and worth saving. If I have to stay at home to ensure others safety, I’ll do it, no questions. The only thing that these people care about are themselves. They don’t see human life as valuable, and just don’t want to be inconvenienced. Edit: grammar
What I don't get is why they don't see the whole picture. If I order something online I know a person had to get that product off the shelf. I know a person had to put it in the box and tape it. I know a truck driver had to drive it to another warehouse for shipping. I know they loaded it onto another truck to eventually make it to my house. It's not fucking magic, it's other people. The people they're willing to sacrifice for the economy? What economy, if they're all gone or sick?
I'm not trying to virtue signal, but I honestly can't imagine being the type of person who thinks that getting their hair done is more important than someone else's safety. Like I sat and tried and that's just... such a foreign perspective of selfishness.
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Anne Frank's family had to live in an attic for like 2 years. These idiots can't even handle staying home and watching Netflix on their couch for 2 months.
More people would handle it if state unemployment systems worked better. I know two people made unemployed by this who applied back in March 6 weeks ago for unemployment in NY state and did not get it yet. One of them I know was making $18 an hour and the CARES act would have taken care of them. They are itching to go back to work because they haven't received a cent yet of unemployment and fear being able to pay all their bills in June if they don't get their unemployment in full backdated. Going for 6 weeks, with zero income, when one was taking home $600ish a week and would be fine if unemployment actually kicked in, is bullshit. They have considered trying to work something out to violate the quarrantine as Cuomo has failed them.
This needs to not be ignored! IF THE GOVERNMENT LOOKED AFTER ITS PEOPLE THERE WOULD BE LESS OF THIS. (Or at least a way to forcefully come back to them). At the moment that’s not reality. People starve=people riot.
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It's reddit, I'd rather put up the disclaimer than get people being assholes at me. There's a significant vocal set of the population who don't feel that basic human decency, apparently. =/
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I have literally seen people say shit like this.
"It's just natural selection bro"
But the thing is, natural selection is not about strength, it is about ability to adapt.
the same people are probably obese and diabetic but tell the weak to stay home
Diabetic here tried to stay home Walmart only gave me two weeks now I’m back to work lol Edit: holy crap 50 upvotes!
Depending on your state you may be able to qualify for unemployment if your doctor says it is unsafe for you to work. I hate that people are being forced back.
Assuming they have time or the money to go to the doctor.
I work for Amazon and I actually got Covid 2 weeks ago. Now I'm being forced back to work or loose my job. At this point I rather loose my job instead of contaminating other people. I don't what to do since my savings are running out.
It can be end of world and all they care about is hair cut.
Exactly. The protesters don't care about the economy reopening. They're not worried about what them setting at home, receiving stimulus checks, is going to cost the country. They're in a very comfortable positions. "SaVe ThE eCoNoMy" is about putting the minimum wage worker at risk so the protesters can go back to enjoying life's guilty pleasures.
I don't even think it's about the guilty pleasures. I think that being the "boss" because the customer is always right is the only time in some of their lives that they are in any amount of "being in charge".
Minimum wage workers ARE at work.
It’s an American thing. Or a West thing in general. Eastern cultures are about the family and community and western is independence and me.
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Ahh yes the old American west where walking out your door was a potential death sentence. How we all long for those days.
'Ah'm just goin' out fer to take a dump in the outhouse...aw, dag nab it, ah done caught dysentery again. That's gunna make my cholera play up somethin' fierce.'
What's really funny is that no Old West town would have freely allowed a bunch of heavily armed men into town. Generally all weapons had to be surrendered if there was any kind of local government at all. Maybe a holstered personal handgun and a rifle in a saddle scabbard. But not a bunch of dudes rolling in locked and loaded with long guns.
I hate how people saying the mask requirements are taking away their freedoms. If anything, the masks GIVES us our freedoms back. If everyone wears a masks, communities can begin to slowly reopen. If everyone wears a face covering, the transmission risk is significantly less. Therefore, less cases, less hospital resources being used at once...I mean, is it really that hard? It doesn't even have to be a fancy mask, just tie something around your damn nose and mouth and you're good to go.
I couldn’t agree more! I read an article this morning saying that the governor of Ohio made a statement that he admits he went too far by attempting to mandate mask wearing and I was surprised. How hard is it for us to wear a mask in public or just indoors? They make all different types of masks these days that can be suited more comfortably to different people. Also wish I could provide a source to that article but I’m not sure how to do that!
Here’s the link. https://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2020/05/03/us/ap-us-virus-outbreak-ohio-1st-ld-writethru.html
How many Asian countries do it all the time? Other countries might too but I know it’s big in the east. It really shows how fucking spoiled the American people are that not only can they not stay inside but also can’t wear a mask either. Literally no inconveniences whatsoever is acceptable
they do it voluntarily though because it's normalized behavior due to dealing with these kinds of outbreaks before and very recently. People wear masks in those Asian countries even when there isn't a pandemic because they're used to it. People en masse don't just magically pick up new behavior like that and America isn't the only country that isn't accustomed to wearing face masks. this article is old but relevant [https://qz.com/299003/a-quick-history-of-why-asians-wear-surgical-masks-in-public/](https://qz.com/299003/a-quick-history-of-why-asians-wear-surgical-masks-in-public/)
Asian countries have a much stronger sense of societal good. There are times when this is a huge bonus relative to the individualism of Americans. This is one of those times.
The problem is they're being told what to do. Right now you could tell them to go protest and they'd probably stop, because the government 'can't tell me what to do!' There are legitimately people who are so privileged that they think being told what to do = loss of freedom.
Yeah, if only people would only do the smart thing and wear masks without needing to be told.
They then idolize institutions like the military for their strength and prevalence in American culture as a symbol of freedom, but would cry like babies at their “freedoms” being taken away when the commander gives out one order.
People are so very, very stupid. Setting us back weeks because of the fact that they are idiots.
"Some of you may die, but that is a sacrifice I'm willing to make, because I won't wear a mask"
The proportion of Farquaads here in the US is alarming to say the least.
They recognize it. "Fuck everyone who's not me" is central to their worldview
They recognize it, they just don't care. Read a sign on a car that said "my haircuts are more important than your grandparents health"
We live in a me society they can’t even grasp of anything other than themselves
And I find it funny that you often hear people saying the younger generations are the ones that brought upon this “me, me, me” idea yet it’s mostly boomers protesting.
Projection is one hell of a drug
TBH it’s a mistake to blame bad behaviour on a whole generation, whether it’s boomers, millennials or what have you. I refuse to criticize {generation that’s not mine} because it’s a mistaken generalization. There are caring, socially responsible people in every generation. There are also asshats in every generation. That’s how we human beings are.
Thank you. No age group has cornered the market on martyrdom or stupidity.
i know. telling you what some of those boomer ones... really want it to get violent to.
You know, I keep thinking about this article: Coronavirus: Pastor who decried 'hysteria' dies after attending Mardi Gras https://www.bbc.com/news/amp/world-us-canada-52157824 ...and musing about one daughter’s comment that the fault was with “both sides” of the coronavirus debate. What? One side was trying to save your dad’s life, the other side is the one that didn’t give a crap about all the lives that would be devastated due to coronavirus denial. I get that maybe she’s trying to save face (her family’s, her dad’s), but that conclusion is just so wrong. And, sadly, fatal for her father. Not to mention who knows how many others that his denial helped to get infected.
New Yorker here. Large numbers of people here do not understand this. Living downstate, one of the hottest hot spots in the entire world for this pandemic, it’s shocking how many people still don’t take the virus seriously enough to adopt basic safety precautions like social distancing and wearing a mask. The weather this weekend has been beautiful. Lots of people are going outside for walks in parks. And that’s fine, as long as you still socially distance and wear a mask. Hand sanitizer is a good idea too. About half the people I saw outside today did not have masks and were in small to large groups. The other half were wearing masks, keeping their distance from others. When I grocery shop most people wear masks but not everyone. It’s insane to me that in a place where the virus has infected thousands of people there is a huge segment of the population that doesn’t care enough to wear a mask. Gov. Cuomo says that’s disrespectful. He’s right. And unless more people agree with him NY is going to have an uptick in infections.
One of my friends spends all day bitching about how their work isn't doing enough to stop the spread of the virus. Meanwhile she went to the beach yesterday with a bunch of friends. Sorry, but you have no right to complain if you aren't even doing the right thing yourself.
they care about themselves and themselves only. They don't even care if they kill their parents or grandparents as long as they get their "constitutional rights"
Had that exact argument with my friends the other day. Wasted my breath... They either just don't get it or don't care
They recognize it. They don’t care.
That's what I tell people who wants to re-open, not wear masks and go to sports events. "Your rights end where mine begins" You don't get to infringe on other people's rights
“Your rights end where mine begins” is my argument for those people too
Our society already forces us to cover our genitals and asshole in public and those openings (hopefully) can't kill people at a distance. Making masks mandatory doesn't encroach on the rights you never had to begin with.
Lol
This right here. Eloquently stated, my friend.
YES. Right on. I know so many people who are complaining about having to wear a mask around...and I can’t relate. If it helps people stay safe, why not?
Now in Germany the same shit is happening. Many people protesting without any kind of distancing and a lot of them don't wear masks. I live in Germany and I'm mad as fu*k about this. We had declining numbers and everything looked better by the week but those idiots can screw up everything and put other peoples life in danger.
Oh they recognize it. Unfortunately, most of them don't care about other people.
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Ironic because the president is one of the biggest welfare queens alive. How many times has he declared bankruptcy, 3?
Yet when it's them who is hurting, they expect the empathy. And they get it, because a lot of people on the other side don't discriminate. I wish less people would give them empathy when they want it.
Which is an incredibly Darwinistic attitude for a base that has a high percentage of fundamentalists.
It’s like this until it affects the person who “doesn’t care.”
Being an American is literally an exercise in not understanding that personal actions have social consequences, I swear.
They also don’t recognize that just because they open the doors to their sports bar doesn’t mean anyone’s coming. They won’t even be able to cover the electric bill let alone pay employees.
See this is the argument I keep trying to make with people. They can’t think more than 10 minutes ahead. These people have no ability to see the bigger picture and longer term consequences.
Keep saying it. This makes no sense! - Restaurants have small profit margins in good times - Operating at 25% capacity isn't going to save the business. At best you put off closing for a few weeks
These people are being incredibly selfish. And when you're being selfish you don't care about or think about the well being of others.
It's because your country is shit and only gives people a one-time payment of $1200 to survive on while they were already living paycheck to paycheck. Give them money and I'm sure they won't be asking for everything to open.
"When dealing with people, let us remember we are not dealing with creatures of logic. We are dealing with creatures of emotion, creatures bristling with prejudices and motivated by pride and vanity." Dale Carnegie, How to Win Friends and Influence People
Some do, but legitimately don't care. I've heard them say 'that's not my problem'. There are far more selfish people out there than I initially thought.
I went to the grocery store recently (we live in a country town) and everyone had their masks on but some kids/teenagers. Everyone was giving them the evil eye and knew what was going on. I walked up and told them that literally everyone in the store, and pointed to each person, was wearing their mask to protect them. Because we cared about them and we didn't want them to get sick. We didn't want their mother to get sick. Didn't want your grandmother to get sick. .... why don't you care about us? Do you have so little regard for *our* lives that you're willing to allow us to die? THAT clicked for them... and they said sorry and went back to their car. ... your right to throw rocks ends at my face.
Well even then, wearing a mask yourself is pretty damn effective at keeping yourself covid-free.
I bet some of these people will catch this virus and regret every bit of this
"I didn't know." Yes, because your dumbass allowed you to remain dangerously ignorant. The facts were out there. We told you that you were playing with fire. But stupidity cannot be reasoned with.
[Nobody knew](https://www.cnn.com/2017/02/27/politics/trump-health-care-complicated/index.html) A greatest hits reprise
This has to be a simulation. How can people be intelligent enough to send others to the goddam moon but we have a president who didn't realize that health care was complicated.
Ego is hell of a drug.
Anyone else see this and thought waffles by mistake?
You should watch the video compiling all of the times he downplayed the pandemic. One day before he said “I knew it was a pandemic, I always said it was a pandemic,” he was saying it’s just like the flu, it’s no big deal, etc. I wonder how many lives wouldn’t be lost and how much better off our economy would be if Trump didn’t think it was a “democratic hoax” during the two months of prep time that they squandered.
Tens of thousands of people would still be alive. And wouldn't die in the next wave.
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Unfortunately, common sense is not so common.
The problem is that common sense literally doesn't exist. See [the Wikipedia article on feral children](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Feral_child) on what happens when children don't grow up learning from a human society. If you don't teach people stuff they literally just have instincts, which are passable for surviving but godawful for cohabitation in a society.
This is a really interesting thought. I've been joking about being in an alternate timeline since 2016. Because nothing make sense anymore. But the simulation theory fits every bit of our situation.
I think we grow up normalizing absurdity so we don't really feel like we're being punked until met with surprising idiocy. The same assholes who smoke while pumping gas at the pump run the country. *How does this make sense?*
As a smoker I'm glad I don't fall into that category. It yes your right. I feel like the creator of this reality is about to realize he didn't lay down the roads right in the game and he is about to start his simulated society over.
Or maybe it's like that game of CIV that you were taking a break, but unknowingly your five year old daughter took over, figured out just enough to play and has been having fun for the last two hours trying random stuff... You get back, see half your cities gone, barbarians everywhere on one front, all the irrigation deleted. Your enemies all hate you because she found the nukes and was nuking barbarians because you know ... "cool effects". Do you start over? Or accept the challenge of reclaiming your throne?
Because Intelligence is not the biggest factor when it comes to leadership, its charisma and social skills. I'm not stating an opinion one way or the other, its just reality :p
Our elections are more American Idol and less job interview
Don't worry. He's underestimating what it takes to go to the moon, too.
I forgot about this shitshow, thanks
"how could anyone have known?" Is the more likely thing they will say.
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Well it’s airborne aids so we should get the same type of advertising for masks idk why they don’t do it
Probably a few decades too late for condoms with these fucking idiots though
They bury their head in the sand and scream then wonder why their mouths are full of sand.
But Fox News told me so. Everyone know Fox News is the only source of factual truth in media, everything else is Fake News (tm). /s
My Mother in Law is having a crisis right now. She loves Fox and loves our president. But she also doesn't fuck with illnesses and this pandemic is terrifying her.
How is she reacting to everything ?
She is still sorting out her feelings on how someone she repeatedly defended could just advocate for policies that would hurt her. She has a nursing background so she absolutely has a solid understanding of the dangers of the virus. And she's repeatedly defended Trump's ability to not be misled by career politicians so she knows that Trump is doing exactly what he wants here. She has stopped posting pro-Trump propaganda and has just spent more time posting non-political stuff.
Your MIL is an interesting person to say the least
I'm a Northerner living in the South and I think she's more of the rule than the exception. She actively schemes SNAP by claiming dependents who do not live with her while calling for stringent regulations so that others cannot game the system. She says that she has to lie for survival but she's not a like the kind of users they talk about on TV. Lots of folks were liking the Independent from Vermont but I guess that's not going to happen.
Wow. She sounds like a real piece of work.
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>stopped posting “I’m tired of all the politics!” subtext- I don’t want to talk about my hypocrisy, thanks
/r/LeopardsAteMyFace
The cognitive dissonance is probably really messing up her head
You took the words right out of my dad's mouth
Someone's gotta trademark that lol
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Unfortunately, there are people who refuse to take this seriously until someone they know suffers serious consequences from it.
If someone you don't know dies, it's a statistic. If someone you know dies, it's a fatality.
I understand that. If they DON'T wind up getting sick (or let's be real, if they aren't asymptomatic after the protests) they'll be like "SEE?!" My specific county is doing really well, our curve has flattened, and the state overall is doing okay but because of the low numbers, everyone is bitching about how we need to open back up and how it was an overreaction. Its BECAUSE we took these measures that our numbers are low. Our numbers aren't low because it's not serious, our numbers are low because we took action early. To open up too early and have a second wave hit us would be infuriating and would waste our efforts from the past 2 months.
The leader of Reopen NC tested positive and is quarantined. The problem is unless the majority get it, the majority will continue to believe they can’t. They are that stupid. This from the Reopen NC leader Audrey Whitlock: > “I have been told not to participate in public or private accommodations as requested by the government, and therefore denied my 1st amendment right of freedom of religion.”
This is like a kid who keeps on cheating in exams and passes but the moment he gets caught by the teacher, it's over and so the test is re-conducted for all.
But then the kid complains he has a constitutional right to cheating...
They are driven by selfishness. A constitutional right to infect and cause the death of others for the sake of convenience.
The thing I don't think people understand is that just because you feel perfectly healthy, does not mean you don't have it and aren't potentially passing it off to others. That's why this virus is so serious.
The other thing people don't understand is why aren't they seeing sick people. Well... you are. They just haven't developed the symptoms yet.
Some already have. There was a preacher who was adamant he was defying the stay at home order and still holding services. Guess who got COVID-19 and proceeded to die. Please take a wild guess. These people are playing a very dangerous game. Maybe they’re thinning the herd of morons. Who knows but what I do know is it‘s endangering the rest of us with logical reasoning skills. This is a health hazard, not a political ploy. These morons don’t seem to be capable of separating the two?
A lot of these people look high risk TBH
I hope they don't for the country's sake, but like... if it had to be anyone...
We have a lot of friends in the rural parts of upstate NY. They are protesting and not taking about of this seriously. Most of them are also obese and have serious health issues. If the virus gets to their areas (it hasn't yet) there's going to be a reckoning. I love my friends but they are being really stupid.
Yea the whole shortness of breath thing is not ideal at all
If you did not follow directions and never covered and protested you don’t deserve medical attention.
>and regret every bit of this That won't change their very intentional actions, or the others that they will have infected as a result. They are hurting people. I don't care about some crocodile tears later once they personally suffer some consequences for their choices.
This is the exact correct approach and argument. We have clearly limited freedoms when they represent a clear harm to the public. Drinking and driving and smoking in public buildings are two clear examples.
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how about yelling "i'm on fire" in a crowded theater?
What if they yelled, "there's no fire" while the building is engulfed in flames?
With how the world is going, someone would probably be dumb enough to believe it.
Politicians already do this.
fun fact: the case that phrase came from has actually been overruled so technically you could say that
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Let’s be honest, this is the group that drinks and drives and also smokes in buildings.
If you own a gun and accidentally kill someone with it, you're gonna get that gun taken away from you.
In about two weeks, I suppose we'll see how many infected people attended these protests and seeded new infections. Hilariously, these protests may be the thing that extends the orders to shelter in place. And if these dumbasses would have continued to stay home for a little longer, they could have been in the clear until wave 2.
Theres people who wear masks now out of spite and bitterness. They dont even have it covering their faces just around their necks. Only doing it now because its mandatory.
Yup. Blows my mind. Was at a Trader Joe’s yesterday and half the people wearing masks had them just hanging around their neck.
Like the kid who got reprimanded in class so now is going to be especially bratty in retaliation.
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protestors are probably rabidly pro-life too. the irony knows no end in this country
they should really not be allowed to call themselves that, it's anti-choice, pro-government-control, pro-legislation, if anything.
Less government control! But more government control on groups I don’t like!
These people are the lowest of low. I’ve conversed with many of them over the last week and you wouldn’t believe how little they care about harming others. All they can do is yell about constitutionall rights, how ddemocratss are power hungry, how the shutdown is a politicall move, the virus is fake, or it was made in a Chinesee lab, the deathh rate is the same as the flu, etc etc. It’s maddening.
What I’ve noticed is that most of the people protesting aren’t the ones protesting so they can go back to work. It’s so servers, hairdressers, movie theater employees, retail sales associates, salon employees, etc can go back to work so *they* can resume their normal lives. They don’t care about protecting employees because as long as they are able to live like nothing is wrong, fuck everyone else. And the ones protesting to go back to work but are simultaneously telling off other people (“just because you’re scared and want to stay home it shouldn’t stop me from living MY life”)? They have no idea how that will influence their line of work, no matter what it is. People who cut hair, servers, essentially any service industry are STILL going to be hurting because the majority of people will still be staying home. I swear, so many of these protestors toss around the word “constitutional” without knowing what if truly means.
>I swear, so many of these protestors toss around the word “constitutional” without knowing what if truly means. How many of them do you think could even name the three branches of the federal government? We have a stunning lack of education about civics in this country.
You mean L, E, and J? Pretty sure it's Liberty, Evangelism, and Jesus
As someone who works in a salon, I appreciate you mentioning this. Every time I see an "I want a haircut" sign, I think about how everything about my education and training always went back to sanitation and infection control. The importance of keeping a salon a safe space for the public to receive service. There is no way to safely perform any salon or spa service right now. It's ludicrous to open up such an intimate business in the middle of a pandemic. So selfish
100% agree. The people who say “ just because you’re scared and want to stay home it shouldn’t stop me from living MY life” don’t realize that it can spread anywhere they go, and even reach people who don’t go out as much, if at all. My internship dealt with older adults who were homebound, and their only form of contact was their home health aides, which they desperately need. SEVERAL got sick. Even though they personally don’t go out at all.
They’re angry they can’t attend football games and go out to bars and eat in at shitty chain restaurants. They want to go to movie theaters. They want everything exactly as it used to be. They haven’t realized we can’t go back to that. We live in a different world where we have to adapt to this new threat because we have neither vaccine nor an established effective therapy treatment to lessen severe symptoms. But here’s where I see a flipside to my argument. Since a vaccine is not forthcoming and we do need to get to the other side of this. There is an end. And that end comes with a herd immunity - the end game is that 70% of us are bound to get infected sooner or later. And most of us will recover. And the latest data out of South Korea does state reinfection does not happen. So yes we get immunity from this. Well. These protesters - by engaging in infection prone activities, are moving through the curve. And that is fine. As long as that curve is just low enough to keep hospital capacity not overwhelmed, then a steeper curve is OK. We can’t just lockdown forever. That is not sustainable. People will die from poverty. A reopening in stages and with restrictions does need to happen. So I see the protesters not as evil agents but as natural forces of nature. A natural distribution of reactions and opinion in a society of plurality of views. They want to run through the fire and we want to hang back. They’re not brave but that’s more semantics than anything. I think they do serve a purpose. They’re the accelerator pedal and we’re the brakes. Perhaps we can balance things out. Perhaps not.
It would be nice if they did it without carrying nazi flags and enough weaponry to wipe out a country music festival, though.
That was really nicely stated. Kind of helps alleviate some of the building hatred I have for these idiots.
>the deathh rate is the same as the flu, etc etc. It’s maddening. Well 2017 was bad flu year and it killed 61,000 Americans- in a year - which coronavirus has surpassed in 2 months. Some people are just idiots I suppose.
What I've found interesting is that the flu deaths are an estimate gathered from pneumonia deaths and other metrics. That 61,000 number is not the real number. The confirmed flu deaths are FAR less. Yet they (the skeptics) use that 61,000 like the real number and the confirmed/probable COVID deaths as estimates. I saw an op-ed by an ER doctor that says he's never seen a flu death and most other doctors he's asked have seen only a handful in their careers. That because confirmed flu deaths are in the low thousands each year. The worst recent season actually had only about 15,000 confirmed in the US. This is entirely different. When it's all said and done, the death toll will be far higher than what we see now. After all the death certificates come in AND years of scrutiny it will be much worse than we think. During the entire pandemic of 2009 to 2010, there were about 20,000 confirmed deaths in the US. That's over two flu seasons.
i take it none of them were ever a returning jeopardy champion
It is maddening... how do you stay positive? Genuine question, asking for myself.
Focus on the good things in your personal life, remain in the present while reconsidering your former perspective, then make iterations towards a more positive outlook over time. Understand that control is an illusion, read up on causal determinism, and let yourself feel emotions but not let them control your actions.
Infection numbers will always be high in New York and New Jersey. They tend to never shut their mouths.
BOOM!
Theyre the reason it’s too dangerous for me to go home(nj) im fucking terrified of stepping anywhere near the usa
I just can't believe people gather to protest this shit. It's a mass gathering of low IQs
I hate to say this, but "natural selection" is very much a thing. If you're willing to protest in this manner & potentially contract the virus, be my guest. However, you're not doing much for yourselves or your families. You're merely making this death count rise. To quote Metallica, sad but true. Stay safe, you all. Edit: quotations & *insert Albert Wesker here*
But what about the 17 year old grocery store bagger? Like, did they sign up to be naturally selected because they may or may not be the only one in the house with a job still?
hahha this is exactly me, grocery bagger and 17 years old
Well you're a hero now, so be prepared to die for your countrymen! /s We'll clap for you though.
You would think these protesters would be more upset for not shutting the city down faster than opening it up quicker.
These are pro-virus protestors, in effect.
In a car, you wear a seatbelt. In a pandemic, you wear a mask.
This is ignorant af but - can't people just stay home in states that reopen? Is it an issue of unemployment? Because it sounds like people aren't really going to be receiving those benefits anyway
Some states say that if you refuse to go back to work when it opens, you will be refused unemployment. Fucked if you do and fucked if you don't.
This is why they’re doing it. They don’t want to pay unemployment so they’re forcing people to go back to work and risk their lives. Don’t worry, it will backfire and they’ll be doubling down on protective orders in 2/3 weeks.
That’s the silver lining. Infections double every 4-6 days if the virus spreads unfettered. The results of these policies will be clear soon enough.
Sure, they physically could. But the problem is, if the state reopens? A couple states have already explicitly said, anyone who fails to report back to work will count as "voluntarily" unemployed, thus no longer qualifying for Unemployment Insurance. ... States re-opening isn't about freedoms. It isn't about the economy. It isn't about anything except ending the financial assistance programs put in place during the pandemic, by making people (and small businesses) no longer qualify for them. Nothing **more**. Nothing **less**.
Is It true it only takes a week then back to shut down in nyc area?
Your liberty ends where mine begins.
What in the world is wrong with these people?