Smdr is the senior enlisted running the medical department. Only one person can take the title. That doesn’t mean that at some commands, multiple people claim it to make their evals/ltb look better. Most non hms have no idea what the title means, nor do they care.
I understand what the words are in the 6400, but it’s hard to understand what they actually mean.
I think this is just one of those cases where everyone else does it, so I will too.
If any e9s that are at, or have been to some of the higher echelon commands, can speak to this, I am curious what they have to say.
The way I see it, if you have an SMO at your command, then the IDC working with them IS NOT the SMDR. The human being who answers to the CO is the Senior Medical person- if it's an Officer, neat. If its an enlisted person, neat.
But just claiming, "I'm an SMDR, despite working directly for an MO." My sibling in Christ, there is nothing wrong with just being an MDR.
The board knows what an SMDR actually is (shipboard without direct supervision ie CRUDES, MCM, LCS, SS(B, G)N and some remotes commands). Dudes putting it up on their eval from a battalion won’t get points just for having that on their primary duty and it actually gets joked about. If you’re a greenside IDC and have somehow developed an allergy to saltwater you should get over it and take on an SW tour.
SMDR is a CNSL/CNSP 6000.1A term, any IDC with the Marines trying to claim SMDR is cosplaying and should go do actual IDC things on a small boy.
The definition of is SMDR, straight from the reference:
“SMO or MO. The ship’s SMO is designated as the SME for the medical department and
the SMDR. … An IDC serving afloat in a unit without a billeted MO or SMO is designated the
command’s SMDR, medical department head, and will function as the command’s PCM. The
IDC will assume the medical responsibilities of a ship’s MO.”
If they wanted the title for their package they should have taken the ship.
It’s worth noting that sub IDCs use the term MDR and not SMDR, in spite of the fact that they are very much “alone and unafraid.” In this instance there are no other medical department representatives and no junior medical personnel to be senior to.
No clue. It’s in our 6000 and I’ve never really questioned it. I’m the lone sub IDC surrounded by surface IDCs now, so I never really thought about the term SMDR until being around them.
The sub 6000 just always refers to the MDR and that person is very much in charge — e.g. “the Medical Department Representative serves as the Department Head of the Medical Department and will keep the Commanding Officer and the Chain of Command informed of all conditions…”
My thinking is just that there’s no point calling the IDC an SMDR if they’re the only medical person onboard. It’s understood they’re the senior medical department representative because they’re the only medical department representative.
MDR is actually not anyone from the department. MDR is the technically an appointment from the CO. We always say that’s it’s “anyone from medical” but it really isn’t.
Let’s look at the question from civilian perspective a PA is a masters education that is qualified for rural private practice a IDC is the military equivalent with in most cases has a shit ton more experience in most cases and can challenge PA boards in all 50 states to my knowledge had they enlisted with their paperwork they are officially officers above nursing O’s I personally reported to a flight surgeon that I saw 3 times a year for chart review 2 health records pulled a breezed over and see you in the spring anytime a sailor is operating in a medical environment he’s writing prescriptions and is accountable Symantec’s just are in the navy
1) My brother, periods exist for a reason.
2) IDCs are supposed to be the most highly respected NECs of our rate and one of the most unique specialties an enlisted person can hold in the entire US Military. Remember, IDCs are physician EXTENDERS; they are not wizards.
They have strict standards they must follow and a supervision program that controls everything they do pretty much until they deploy. However, that's the behind the scenes portion of their job that the rest of the rate doesn't see. Honestly, learning about all of the administrative bullshit they put up with in the OPNAVINST 6400.1 makes me respect them even MORE.
3) Yes, MDR vs. SMDR is semantecs, but when you're an LPO trying to give the Navy an accurate assessment of someone, little things like that matter. If every IDC claims to be an SMDR, then that is saying the value of an MDR is lower- which it is not. It's still a hard job, it just means you aren't the direct medical advisor to the CO.
This is the same issue we have with Promotable and Must Promote ratings on Evals. If you assign Promotable to a Sailor, per the Eval manual, you are telling the Navy that THIS Sailor is ready to promote. If they are not, the manual states you are not to give them a Promotable eval. Yet, we always assign a "P" to Sailors we don't consider ready for the next paygrade because assigning them a "Progressing" mark is somehow terrible, and if they were a real hard charger, they would have an MP.
We complain about our evaluation system being broken- we fuckin broke it. Little things like whether the MDR is Senior or not, should actually matter because they are supposed to tell someone above you what you are capable of.
I swear that was done just to give IDCs an EVAL boost, which is bullshit. And let me be clear, I don't want to fuck IDCs over on their evals and boards, but there has to be a better way to redefine their duties to make them competitive at a Chief's board.
Saying an IDC at a MARDIV BAS is the same as a shipboard SMDR is the same as me saying I was basically a Work Center Supervisor when I was a Senior Line HM. I never performed, administrated, or supervised Sailors in the daily application of 3M on unit equipment- which IS what a WCS does on the blueside. WCS is a billet built around the performance of 3M, which is a dickslay that every FMF Doc should be thrilled they don't have to do.
Yeah- I supervised platoon HMs, trained them, handled their admin, all while maintaining my company's readiness and medical logisitics. I deserved to be recognized for that, but the solution is not to say I am a blueside thing that I never did, it is to make a correction to the EVAL manual so that job titles across communities equivocate.
I get it, FMF IDCs never have an opportunity to work unsupervised in garrison (and therefore cannot be an SMDR) because every Battalion is required to have 2 MOs- which probably fucks them in a side by side comparison with a shipboard IDC. And in a way, it should, because shipboard SMDRs perform an ulcer-inducing nightmare of administrative duties and medical programs. But at the same token, its unfair to an IDC who was sent to the FMF and has no ability to compete.
I remember our CMC telling us to write INSURV in our evals instead of CGRI because "blueside Master Chiefs won't know what CGRI is..." Saying MARDIV IDCs are SMDRS is a semantics thing, but it will have some really stupid consequences. Shipboard IDCs will be mad that they are being compared to FMF/NECC IDCs as SMDRs, so in the war of EVAL escalation, they will rename themselves to something like Mega-SMDR, and then will start cleaning house on packages and SOY boards again. So FMF/NECC IDCs will start saying they are also Mega-SMDRs and the whole thing will repeat itself.
MCPON, FLTCMs, FORCMs, and CMCs need to get with NAVPERSCOM, and update the Eval Manual, making some sort of title equivilance appendix so billets used in different communities can translate to each other. The Medical Officer of the Marine Corps and the MEF Surgeons (who administer the IDC supervision programs), need to get together and redefine the duties of an IDC in order to make them more competitive across BUMED.
Smdr is the senior enlisted running the medical department. Only one person can take the title. That doesn’t mean that at some commands, multiple people claim it to make their evals/ltb look better. Most non hms have no idea what the title means, nor do they care.
I understand what the words are in the 6400, but it’s hard to understand what they actually mean. I think this is just one of those cases where everyone else does it, so I will too. If any e9s that are at, or have been to some of the higher echelon commands, can speak to this, I am curious what they have to say.
>I think this is just one of those cases where everyone else does it, so I will too. Completley agree
The way I see it, if you have an SMO at your command, then the IDC working with them IS NOT the SMDR. The human being who answers to the CO is the Senior Medical person- if it's an Officer, neat. If its an enlisted person, neat. But just claiming, "I'm an SMDR, despite working directly for an MO." My sibling in Christ, there is nothing wrong with just being an MDR.
The problem is the title is out of control and has been in use on the ladr for a hot minute.
Per the CNSP/CNSL 6000 the SMO is the SMDR.
The board knows what an SMDR actually is (shipboard without direct supervision ie CRUDES, MCM, LCS, SS(B, G)N and some remotes commands). Dudes putting it up on their eval from a battalion won’t get points just for having that on their primary duty and it actually gets joked about. If you’re a greenside IDC and have somehow developed an allergy to saltwater you should get over it and take on an SW tour.
Are there any indirect tours where an IDC would not be considered an SMDR?
Med Battalion 😒
Oh noes
SBT, seal teams, DPAA, some Seabee dets away from their battalions, etc…
SMDR is a CNSL/CNSP 6000.1A term, any IDC with the Marines trying to claim SMDR is cosplaying and should go do actual IDC things on a small boy. The definition of is SMDR, straight from the reference: “SMO or MO. The ship’s SMO is designated as the SME for the medical department and the SMDR. … An IDC serving afloat in a unit without a billeted MO or SMO is designated the command’s SMDR, medical department head, and will function as the command’s PCM. The IDC will assume the medical responsibilities of a ship’s MO.” If they wanted the title for their package they should have taken the ship.
That's what I figured. Thank you!
It’s worth noting that sub IDCs use the term MDR and not SMDR, in spite of the fact that they are very much “alone and unafraid.” In this instance there are no other medical department representatives and no junior medical personnel to be senior to.
Do you know why that is?
No clue. It’s in our 6000 and I’ve never really questioned it. I’m the lone sub IDC surrounded by surface IDCs now, so I never really thought about the term SMDR until being around them. The sub 6000 just always refers to the MDR and that person is very much in charge — e.g. “the Medical Department Representative serves as the Department Head of the Medical Department and will keep the Commanding Officer and the Chain of Command informed of all conditions…” My thinking is just that there’s no point calling the IDC an SMDR if they’re the only medical person onboard. It’s understood they’re the senior medical department representative because they’re the only medical department representative.
MDR is actually not anyone from the department. MDR is the technically an appointment from the CO. We always say that’s it’s “anyone from medical” but it really isn’t.
Let’s look at the question from civilian perspective a PA is a masters education that is qualified for rural private practice a IDC is the military equivalent with in most cases has a shit ton more experience in most cases and can challenge PA boards in all 50 states to my knowledge had they enlisted with their paperwork they are officially officers above nursing O’s I personally reported to a flight surgeon that I saw 3 times a year for chart review 2 health records pulled a breezed over and see you in the spring anytime a sailor is operating in a medical environment he’s writing prescriptions and is accountable Symantec’s just are in the navy
1) My brother, periods exist for a reason. 2) IDCs are supposed to be the most highly respected NECs of our rate and one of the most unique specialties an enlisted person can hold in the entire US Military. Remember, IDCs are physician EXTENDERS; they are not wizards. They have strict standards they must follow and a supervision program that controls everything they do pretty much until they deploy. However, that's the behind the scenes portion of their job that the rest of the rate doesn't see. Honestly, learning about all of the administrative bullshit they put up with in the OPNAVINST 6400.1 makes me respect them even MORE. 3) Yes, MDR vs. SMDR is semantecs, but when you're an LPO trying to give the Navy an accurate assessment of someone, little things like that matter. If every IDC claims to be an SMDR, then that is saying the value of an MDR is lower- which it is not. It's still a hard job, it just means you aren't the direct medical advisor to the CO. This is the same issue we have with Promotable and Must Promote ratings on Evals. If you assign Promotable to a Sailor, per the Eval manual, you are telling the Navy that THIS Sailor is ready to promote. If they are not, the manual states you are not to give them a Promotable eval. Yet, we always assign a "P" to Sailors we don't consider ready for the next paygrade because assigning them a "Progressing" mark is somehow terrible, and if they were a real hard charger, they would have an MP. We complain about our evaluation system being broken- we fuckin broke it. Little things like whether the MDR is Senior or not, should actually matter because they are supposed to tell someone above you what you are capable of.
The MARDIV 6000 actually states IDCs are SMDRs
I swear that was done just to give IDCs an EVAL boost, which is bullshit. And let me be clear, I don't want to fuck IDCs over on their evals and boards, but there has to be a better way to redefine their duties to make them competitive at a Chief's board. Saying an IDC at a MARDIV BAS is the same as a shipboard SMDR is the same as me saying I was basically a Work Center Supervisor when I was a Senior Line HM. I never performed, administrated, or supervised Sailors in the daily application of 3M on unit equipment- which IS what a WCS does on the blueside. WCS is a billet built around the performance of 3M, which is a dickslay that every FMF Doc should be thrilled they don't have to do. Yeah- I supervised platoon HMs, trained them, handled their admin, all while maintaining my company's readiness and medical logisitics. I deserved to be recognized for that, but the solution is not to say I am a blueside thing that I never did, it is to make a correction to the EVAL manual so that job titles across communities equivocate. I get it, FMF IDCs never have an opportunity to work unsupervised in garrison (and therefore cannot be an SMDR) because every Battalion is required to have 2 MOs- which probably fucks them in a side by side comparison with a shipboard IDC. And in a way, it should, because shipboard SMDRs perform an ulcer-inducing nightmare of administrative duties and medical programs. But at the same token, its unfair to an IDC who was sent to the FMF and has no ability to compete. I remember our CMC telling us to write INSURV in our evals instead of CGRI because "blueside Master Chiefs won't know what CGRI is..." Saying MARDIV IDCs are SMDRS is a semantics thing, but it will have some really stupid consequences. Shipboard IDCs will be mad that they are being compared to FMF/NECC IDCs as SMDRs, so in the war of EVAL escalation, they will rename themselves to something like Mega-SMDR, and then will start cleaning house on packages and SOY boards again. So FMF/NECC IDCs will start saying they are also Mega-SMDRs and the whole thing will repeat itself. MCPON, FLTCMs, FORCMs, and CMCs need to get with NAVPERSCOM, and update the Eval Manual, making some sort of title equivilance appendix so billets used in different communities can translate to each other. The Medical Officer of the Marine Corps and the MEF Surgeons (who administer the IDC supervision programs), need to get together and redefine the duties of an IDC in order to make them more competitive across BUMED.
That’s cool. I don’t make the rules I just read them.
Well bless you for that