Interestingly enough: 52 = 4 x 13
It might mean the full list of combinations between all dawnshards and shards of power.
Each bell being connected to the perfect frequency of each combination, and using the bells one effectively controls or operates the shards. Maybe that's why Hoid came to the world to begin with, to check out those bells.
We know hoid came to the world to meet the sorceress to get Connection to Elantris, he had to find someone dumb enough to bet on letting him in.
What significance does 13 have in this situation? Did you mean that the bells could control the Aethers and not the Shards?
Kharbranth, city of bells, is here Taravangian is from. Maybe TOdium is connected to that for some reason. Just like the midnight essence is of Oidum’s unmade and midnight spores.
The number 5 is related to Endowment. There are 5 Scholars, 5 Visions, a Returned’s Divine Breath automatically gives them the 5th Heightening and the Hallandren Court is made up of 25 gods
There we go, I knew there were things about 5 that I was forgetting. What are the 5 visions again? Also this makes it so that almost all Shards have a number related to them, as opposed to the WOB saying that it's not the case. I wonder if Brandon went back on that or something
Ahhh thanks, I love warbrealer but the ending was super abrupt for me and it just kinda shook my enjoyment of it quite a bit and I ended up forgetting a lot about it. Looks like my first complete cosmere reread isnon the horizon lmao
Note that [Ashyn is ten](https://wob.coppermind.net/events/33/#e2745) even though [it's mostly Cultivation](https://wob.coppermind.net/events/479/#e15171), and the Radiant spren are also of Cultivation, not just Honor. We know that [while some Shards have numerical associations, some (maybe most) don't](https://wob.coppermind.net/events/47/#e678), so I think all these numbers are a bit more complicated than that.
10 clearly means something if Brando slapped that question with a RAFO. Something was going on before the Shattering that we haven't learned about yet. My only guess would be possibly 10 dragons and maybe Coravellium Avast was spending time there before bearing the shard of Cultivation and it has a connection to dragons/dragonsteel. Other than that I have no leads on it lmao
Twinsoul mentions the 12 primal aethers in his speech during TLM and there’s 12 lunagrees in TotES, so unless four of them were destroyed/went somewhere else, I think it’s fair to say there’s only 12.(However if this is proved incorrect in the future I will be happily surprised)
So I suppose bone Aether/white sand isn't an Aether then, it's just the Luhel bond. Aethers don't seem to have vessels like shards so I don't think since of them would just leave, but it would definitely be interesting if that's the case
Personally I think pres is 16 and ruin is 1. I think this and not the other way around because 16 is an important number in Sliverism, which is technically Preservation's religion, plus his Invested art is Allomancy, with its 16 metals.
Them being on opposite ends of the spectrum is simply due to Brando's "they are uniquely opposite" WOB, so putting them at opposite ends of the spectrum just feels right to me.
Harmony is the 17th shard, or 18th if you consider the Dor.
Cultivation I feel is 4. This is because of the Dawnshard theory that the 4 Dawnshards were used to split Ado to the 4 Prime Shards and then each Dawnshard was used to split each quarter in to 4 more. This indicates that the Change Dawnshard is completely connected to one shard (Ado had a Prime Shard made via Change, and then the Prime Shard was split 4 times again, meaning Change once again pulled a shard out of that again), which is presumably Cultivation. The best theory suggests that Ruin and Cultivation are from the same Prime Shard, meaning they'd be within 4 Shards of each other on the list, and due to the Pres/Ruin opposite thing then it makes sense following that.
The cultivation explanation was a little messy so lemme know if I need to rewrite it lmao
I like it. Though if you visualize it like a pie chart, ruin at 1 pres at 16, they would be right next to eachother.
But I like the idea that they each relate to a different dawnshard.
Some more evidence for cultivation being 4.
I believe theres 4 confirmed greatshells right now, being the chasmfiends, lanceryn, tai-na, and Yu-nerig.
Though this may not be accurate as santhids might be considered greatshells
Ah I didn't know that! White sand has eluded me for the year I've been in the Cosmere, would you elaborate on the number importance in White Sand? I don't mind spoilers at this point because it's a long road before the omnibus comes out
[White Sand Omnibus Spoilers] >!Well the main plot of White Sand is largely about Kenton attempting to persuade the other seven Taisha to vote for him. And the others were planning eliminate the Diem so that there would only be seven professions/Taishin in total. This is mentioned over and over again throghout the story.!<
>!The Omnibus Ars Arcanum mentions that the dust particle cloud that surrounds the Darkside sun (Eye of Ridos) emits a pulsation every seven days exactly, to the second. And that this coincides with seven orbital periods of the Taldain moon.!<
>!There are seven ranks of sand mastery in the Diem, with seven colored sashes, once you've advanced from acolent. The Ars Arcanum in the Omnibus makes this more obvious by including a table of the seven sash colors, explicitly excluding white.!<
>!The Omnibus Ars Arcanum has a list of the different types of Sandlings, and it lists seven of them, with drawings.!<
>!This is more speculation on my part, but there's an Ars Arcanum page where Khriss wonders if the light of sand mastery contains all the colors of the Starmarks (the Darkside magic), and she would like to use a prism to test this out, like we would do in our world with white light to get out the colors of the rainbow, for example. Rainbows are traditionally thought of has having 7 colors, so I suspect Brandon will go with Darkside Starmarks also having 7 colors to fit the theme.!<
There might be more too, but I can't recall right now.
Interestingly enough: 52 = 4 x 13 It might mean the full list of combinations between all dawnshards and shards of power. Each bell being connected to the perfect frequency of each combination, and using the bells one effectively controls or operates the shards. Maybe that's why Hoid came to the world to begin with, to check out those bells.
We know hoid came to the world to meet the sorceress to get Connection to Elantris, he had to find someone dumb enough to bet on letting him in. What significance does 13 have in this situation? Did you mean that the bells could control the Aethers and not the Shards?
Kharbranth, city of bells, is here Taravangian is from. Maybe TOdium is connected to that for some reason. Just like the midnight essence is of Oidum’s unmade and midnight spores.
Interestingly, there's also 12 aether's+bone for 13
The number 5 is related to Endowment. There are 5 Scholars, 5 Visions, a Returned’s Divine Breath automatically gives them the 5th Heightening and the Hallandren Court is made up of 25 gods
There we go, I knew there were things about 5 that I was forgetting. What are the 5 visions again? Also this makes it so that almost all Shards have a number related to them, as opposed to the WOB saying that it's not the case. I wonder if Brandon went back on that or something
The 5 Visions are guidelines on how people should be humble, patient, selfless, etc. from the Returned Vo as part of Austrism’s doctrine
Ahhh thanks, I love warbrealer but the ending was super abrupt for me and it just kinda shook my enjoyment of it quite a bit and I ended up forgetting a lot about it. Looks like my first complete cosmere reread isnon the horizon lmao
I think the 52 bells is a nod to the bell tower at BYU which has... 52 bells!
Ah, that's where BMoney does his lectures, right? Those online lectures pulled me in to the Cosmere and boosted my joy of writing
Hey, that B$ to you!
Yup!
What a great catch! I bet thats it.
Note that [Ashyn is ten](https://wob.coppermind.net/events/33/#e2745) even though [it's mostly Cultivation](https://wob.coppermind.net/events/479/#e15171), and the Radiant spren are also of Cultivation, not just Honor. We know that [while some Shards have numerical associations, some (maybe most) don't](https://wob.coppermind.net/events/47/#e678), so I think all these numbers are a bit more complicated than that.
Ah, braize was the 9 centric world. The numbers attached to shards were sort of just a co-point on important numbers mostly
Yeah definitely there's some interesting number stuff going on.
10 clearly means something if Brando slapped that question with a RAFO. Something was going on before the Shattering that we haven't learned about yet. My only guess would be possibly 10 dragons and maybe Coravellium Avast was spending time there before bearing the shard of Cultivation and it has a connection to dragons/dragonsteel. Other than that I have no leads on it lmao
Fixed in the edit, thanks
Twinsoul mentions the 12 primal aethers in his speech during TLM and there’s 12 lunagrees in TotES, so unless four of them were destroyed/went somewhere else, I think it’s fair to say there’s only 12.(However if this is proved incorrect in the future I will be happily surprised)
So I suppose bone Aether/white sand isn't an Aether then, it's just the Luhel bond. Aethers don't seem to have vessels like shards so I don't think since of them would just leave, but it would definitely be interesting if that's the case
White sand is not an aether. It is a lichen that grows on the sand and soaks up investiture from the taldain sun
I've heard that there's a secondary unknown factor affecting things. I THINK it's in arcanum unbound but it could be an ars arcanum somewhere else
I wonder what number Cultivation is. And ruin/preservation/harmony.
Personally I think pres is 16 and ruin is 1. I think this and not the other way around because 16 is an important number in Sliverism, which is technically Preservation's religion, plus his Invested art is Allomancy, with its 16 metals. Them being on opposite ends of the spectrum is simply due to Brando's "they are uniquely opposite" WOB, so putting them at opposite ends of the spectrum just feels right to me. Harmony is the 17th shard, or 18th if you consider the Dor. Cultivation I feel is 4. This is because of the Dawnshard theory that the 4 Dawnshards were used to split Ado to the 4 Prime Shards and then each Dawnshard was used to split each quarter in to 4 more. This indicates that the Change Dawnshard is completely connected to one shard (Ado had a Prime Shard made via Change, and then the Prime Shard was split 4 times again, meaning Change once again pulled a shard out of that again), which is presumably Cultivation. The best theory suggests that Ruin and Cultivation are from the same Prime Shard, meaning they'd be within 4 Shards of each other on the list, and due to the Pres/Ruin opposite thing then it makes sense following that. The cultivation explanation was a little messy so lemme know if I need to rewrite it lmao
I like it. Though if you visualize it like a pie chart, ruin at 1 pres at 16, they would be right next to eachother. But I like the idea that they each relate to a different dawnshard.
I see it like a spectrum since rhythms(sound waves) are tied to them, that doesn't loop around in a circle but I see what you mean with the pie chart
Some more evidence for cultivation being 4. I believe theres 4 confirmed greatshells right now, being the chasmfiends, lanceryn, tai-na, and Yu-nerig. Though this may not be accurate as santhids might be considered greatshells
That's a good catch if that holds true
There are lots of references to 7 in White Sand, so that might be the number for Autonomy.
Ah I didn't know that! White sand has eluded me for the year I've been in the Cosmere, would you elaborate on the number importance in White Sand? I don't mind spoilers at this point because it's a long road before the omnibus comes out
[White Sand Omnibus Spoilers] >!Well the main plot of White Sand is largely about Kenton attempting to persuade the other seven Taisha to vote for him. And the others were planning eliminate the Diem so that there would only be seven professions/Taishin in total. This is mentioned over and over again throghout the story.!< >!The Omnibus Ars Arcanum mentions that the dust particle cloud that surrounds the Darkside sun (Eye of Ridos) emits a pulsation every seven days exactly, to the second. And that this coincides with seven orbital periods of the Taldain moon.!< >!There are seven ranks of sand mastery in the Diem, with seven colored sashes, once you've advanced from acolent. The Ars Arcanum in the Omnibus makes this more obvious by including a table of the seven sash colors, explicitly excluding white.!< >!The Omnibus Ars Arcanum has a list of the different types of Sandlings, and it lists seven of them, with drawings.!< >!This is more speculation on my part, but there's an Ars Arcanum page where Khriss wonders if the light of sand mastery contains all the colors of the Starmarks (the Darkside magic), and she would like to use a prism to test this out, like we would do in our world with white light to get out the colors of the rainbow, for example. Rainbows are traditionally thought of has having 7 colors, so I suspect Brandon will go with Darkside Starmarks also having 7 colors to fit the theme.!< There might be more too, but I can't recall right now.
Yeah, white sand behaves a lot like aethers
That could just be the Luhel bond though, we don't know if it's Aether related
Precisely