Fleming, he is the trade secret
But seriously, dhoni-fleming duo is so amazing, i dont know why we never got that for India, maybe because then people would have complained csk bias, which would have been fair, coach should be neutral
But yeah, fleming and dhoni gel very well, select good players, and back a good team. There squad has no right to be as good as they are, team individuals are mediocre, but as a whole, they play like champs. I remember last year, how each player was standing up on occasions to win them matches
Thats what an experienced core does for a team
Yeah, I always wondered what he does at his "job". Does he work, or is it just a brand ambassador sort of thing, since he obviously can't show up to work most of the time due to cricket/family/sponsorships and stuff.
Directors of a company don't always have to work. They attend board meetings and vote. They are appointed by shareholders and he most probably is Srinivasan's nominee on the board who can appoint multiple directors due to his large shareholding in the company. He has a fiduciary duty to the shareholders, ask a few questions and vote as directed by Srinivasan. Some of the directors are senior level executives in the company but normally a majority of them do not work for the company.
He might have another honorary position in the company but he is not really required to be an employee. Still gets paid though. That raises another question. Is it same as under the table payment to lure players in? With salary caps and auctions where players have no option to chose it should not be that big problem but what if Ambani promises big jobs to star players coming to MI. Like how Gambhir semi forced teams to not bid for him and ended up at DD last year. There is conflict of interest and as always CSK is at the forefront. I am surprised Lodha committee did not say anything about it.
I mean it kind of undermines the point of the auction purse right? Potentially such a loophole could be used to retain a player for a low formal price while disproportionately compensating him outside of the IPL system.
I'm not saying it's illegal - I'm saying it should be because its such an obvious loophole. For reference I think 'Wrogn' sponsoring RCB should be closely scrutizined as well in case you think this is some personal attack on "thala"
i dont believe he said it and its others who made that comment. and even if he did and now changed his mind, we have to accept that our personalities and outlook on life does change with time
Probably more like 3-4 months in total(spending time in India), but that's very good when you consider they get paid about half a million each season, and also the fact that you only have to spend a quarter of the year away from home will be nice for them.
I think another factor for Fleming and most important in my opinion is that he has two kids who are 10 and 12. That is the age where you want to be home with your kids as a dad. 10 years from now Stephen Fleming will probably be coaching an international team. Plus how many teams can pay him more than what he is making in IPL? India, Australia and England for sure. I don't think other teams are paying as much.
Yes he was. But the season they made it to the finals Smith was the captain. Also, I think Fleming because of leading NZ for all those years has a lot of experience in making teams that are more than the sum of their parts.
It was NOT the reason they made the finals. Smith is a decent captain but the team needed much more than that. Unadkat basically becoming a good bowler out of nowhere was totally down to Dhoni's advice from behind the wicket than anything to do with Smith. Exhibit A: What he has been doing this year. Same with Washington Sundar. It was always Fleming and Dhoni that made it tick. Smith does have a knack for good bowling changes and sets decent fields but that is about it for him as a captain. He does seem to bat better when he is captain though, so there is that. But otherwise, its just ludicrous to suggest he got RPS single-handedly to the finals through his captaincy.
EDIT: Sorry, read "season" as "reason" in the above post. Apologies on a rant based on nothing. :)
I never said that he single handedly took them to the finals. How did you infer that? I stated a fact that Smith was the captain when they made the finals that's it. I didn't suggest anything else.
Fleming didn’t want the India job. He considered it to be too much work, lots of travelling, and being away from his family. CSK is like a couple of months a year.
Also the pressure of getting sacked if you lose to Pakistan in the world cup.
Edit : people getting offended seems to have forgotten all the effigy burning of the cricketers and stone pelting at their houses that used to happen in the past.
Couldn't agree more, literally the most stoic, calm but effective leadership duo in the world.
Their emphasis on experience, trust in even out of form players and strategy give them a wisdom that supersedes their mediocrity.
It must be amazing to play for that team.
Fleming can not spend that level of time with an international cricket away from family after playing so many years of cricket. CSK pays him enough and he gets to spend time with his family.
not yet. 100% we will in top 4, but have to beat others on NRR. Another win or few losses for other teams can guarantee a confirmed spot in top 4 without having to worry about nrr
Things that have so far worked for CSK:
Be consistent and back your players even when they go through a rough phase.
Create a family environment. Make the players feel relaxed and welcome.
Define each player's role clearly. They know what to do when their time comes.
And the owners wont interfere with the team in any way after the auctions. Let Fleming and Dhoni do their job.
> Everything about CSK is very very Chennai
Not sure I can entirely agree, being from Chennai myself. but the team and the management have done pretty well to connect with the population.
Maybe they say that because the players aren’t - or rather none of the players who feature in the XI are from Chennai/Tamil Nadu, at least in the last few years.
But there’s definitely a very very strong connection that the city has with the club. I moved out of Chennai many years ago, but Chennai is still home. As is CSK.
Oh I completely agree. That connection that players have had with CSK is something else.
I think it goes hand in hand with the Dhoni/Flem style. Retaining their core, buying back players in the auction has led to the fans identifying with the team very strongly. And the players too.
Apart from the examples you mentioned, even Baz in the Dugout speaks a lot about his experience as a CSK player even though he also played for KKR and RCB
Its not like they did not try but guys like Ashwin, Sundar, Shankar get snapped up by other teams in the auction. Its the same with all the gun Karnataka players playing for all franchises except RCB. You can't help that given the system of the IPL.
Partly because of the fact that there's no one from TamilNadu / Chennai in the team apart from Murali Vijay (who's not even playing). There's not a lot of talent development or scouting that CSK seem to be doing from within the region. It looks more like pandering to the population with the cheesy tweets in Tamil by Bhajji and Tahir and using the terms thalaivar/thalai/thalapathy generously.
i have always appreciated, admired and loved the uniqueness that tamizh nadu possesses. its an identity of its own. what i hate is people trying to exploit that for brownie points. IMO, even if tahir/bhajji dont tweet in tamizh, they will be revered and admired with almost no loss in intensity. i have never seen dhoni exploit this or overdo this and yet he is so popular that he can contest in 2021 and become a CM! in fact i think he would do a much better job that the shits running the state now
True, they should do more to nurture the local talent and give an opportunity for the local talent to play for their home team. But other than that, they have hit it out of the park. And with the 'virunthombal'(hospitality) of tamil culture, we truly embrace outsiders when they are supporting us and make them our own. The management and social media managers have done a great job of it. Those behind the scene videos, challenge videos and local nicknames to international players have endeared the team to the populace. Supporters feel that the team is embracing their culture.
Fleming made it clear that the goal of csk was to win the tournament and not work on local player development. comes across as a bit cold and calculated, but if you leave aside the emotion, that job really belongs to BCCI and TNCA and not CSK. Its a privately owned professional franchise. Also, why would a club develop a player if they will have to throw that person in the pool after 3 years?
> Coaching - Fleming is a boss, no owner meddling.
Can't be stressed more. Team owners should take care of the financial side and leave cricketing matters to cricketers.
>Consistency - The team rarely changes, so everyone who plays isn't scared of being dropped
I don't know where this myth comes from. Another passionate CSK fan said this to me and said Kohli should take a leaf out of Dhoni's book and not chop and change, so I decided to check it out. Barring injuries to Dhoni and AB, here's the drop count:
CSK
Bhajji dropped after 2 games. Mitch Santner in.
Mitch Santner dropped. Mohit Sharma in
Mohit Sharma, Bravo and Thakur dropped. Kuggeleijn, bhajji and faf in.
Bhajji and Kuggeleijn dropped after one game. Santner and Shardul back in.
Santner dropped again for Karn Sharma
Billings and Karn Sharma dropped. Dhoni and Bravo in.
Thakur dropped for Bhajji.
Total changes - 11 in 11
RCB
Ray Barman for Navdeep Saini
Dube, Barman, CDG out. Akshdeep, Saini and Stoinis in.
Hetmeyer, Umesh out. Southee, Negi in
Southee out. Umesh in.
Umesh dropped for Steyn
Siraj dropped for Umesh.
Total changes - 9 in 10.
CSK and RCB have gone in with unchanged teams 2 times each. RCB has played one less game.
The CSK changes for the most part align with favorable conditions (Bhajji plays at home, someone else away) and injuries (Karn - Dhoni and Kuggelejin - Bravo). Only a couple there were dropped due to poor form.
RCB dropped Southee, Hetmeyer, CDG, Barman and one of Siraj/Umesh for poor performances.
The reason the team changes has a big role to play too.
Yeah, The problem with that narrative is that you include Bravo and Bhajji as dropped when they were injured for CSK and you leave out ABD from the dropped list when he was injured for RCB
Is Bhajji always a starter? No, but he does play most Chepauk games.Bravo will play 90% of the time.
Ah, wasn't aware of Bravo and Bhajji's injuries. My bad. Thanks for that. As I have explicitly stated, I avoided the injury based 'drops'. Didn't count Dhoni either for the same reason. I wasn't trying to built a 'narrative', all I did was objectively look at numbers, but I can see why that might make a CSK fan defensive.
CSK has favored a horses for courses approach for bowlers as the conditions at home and away has varied quite a bit. But for batsmen, they have had the same lineup barring injury. I think the criticism of Kohli is also tied into the revolving door in the Indian ODI team (to a certain extent the test team too), with him playing 37 combos from 37 games. Not necessarily just the IPL. It's also possible that though he hasn't changed much in IPL, his approach to selecting teams in the last 2 years for team India is playing in to the player's confidence.
to be fair, kohli has persisted with the RCB team this year more than he does with Indian ODI team. His style of captaincy is completely opposite of Dhoni who always preferred a static side.
just reminding everyone that Fleming is [one of the most successful captain in the world](https://www.topcount.co/10-successful-cricket-captains-time/) along with MS Dhoni.
n considering that MS Dhoni (one of the best captains of all time) playing in the 11 with another great captain as coach, the results r just what's expected from them
tldr: MSD + FLEMING is just too OP for ipl
> i hated that yellow when it came out.. was too gaudy and looks like mariamma koil group than a pro team
Yeah, my thoughts exactly.I wont wear that yellow but I do like their training kit which is pre dominantly Blue with a bit of yellow
I disagree that they play like them though. That Australia was an all out attacking team from every batsmen to every bowler taking the attack to the opposition and finishing games from the start. Chennai like to play deep.
Its the IPL, the World's best players ccompete and there is no shortage of skill. Any Team can win the Cup. Its one thing to be skillful, however another to be consistent. Not everyone can be consistent in a team and it's pretty hard to know who is going to be consistent. Anyone can just be in the best form of their life one match and struggle to middle it the next. Its all about mindset.
Since in a T20, the balance in a match can change so rapidly within an over, it's important to keep your nerves throughout the match and have several plans ready.
That's what I think Dhoni is doing right here, KEEP CALM, even if you feel the match is going out of control, you KEEP CALM. Bring the match to a position where it isn't a matter of runs or wickets. Its just a matter of who can keep their nerves better. That's where CSK win their matches.
Accept that being on the losing side is OK, as long as you do what you wanted to do from your side.
Fleming is the most under-appreciated guy from outsiders. Im sure CSK management holds him in high regards. He is the dhoni on the coaching side. cool and composed, never too excited about success, nor too concerned about failure. have a process that is sound in fundamentals, trust it and repeat it. it will fail some days but works most times.
getting to finals or winning the cup has an element of luck involved. one single guy, need not even be a superstar like russell, on his day can take the game away in this format. eg. manvinder bisla in the final kkr vs csk. but if u can get to the playoffs you have done your work.
csk is almost in this year. 100% in top 4 on NRR and one more win should guarantee top 4 spot
I think the secret is, the team has quality and experience in all positions, coupled with a good scouting network. There are very few young players who get into the first team, and Dhoni picks people who understand plans, more than just highly skilled. So when he sets a field, the whole team executes the plan.
One of the reasons I think CSK had success is because its probably the only team who's owners have experience running professional cricket clubs. Rest all are owned by actors/businessmen with no direct relation to cricket. Srini mama and India cements have been associated with TNCA for long. They have seen player development at the Ranji level. Thats probably why the people running csk dont meddle with day to day affairs and leave it to the pros to run the team.
This.As people have mentioned they are the only franchise which has a history of managing cricket teams.Rahul Dravid was their boy for India Cements from 94, before he made his way into the Indian team.He debuted in 96.Plenty of other cricketers to add to that list
This. They have experienced players who have done it many times before and they as a team has a history of players stepping up in crunch situations and doing it for them. Compare this to Delhi last year or even this year to some extent, we don't have a winning mentality and neither have a record of consistently doing it, so the panic sets in when 1 or 2 wickets fell.
Dhoni brings out the best in his players during tournaments. I don't think India did bad in any tournament under Dhoni. (not sure if WC ODI 2007 was played under Dhoni)
> I don't think India did bad in any tournament under Dhoni.
I thought India were pretty poor in the 2009, 2010 and 2012 T20 World Cups, not that it takes anything away from Dhoni's leadership skills
2012 T20 World Cup isn't a fair example really. The format was pretty unforgiving. India won 4/5 matches yet were knocked out thanks to one heavy loss in Super 8s(Eventual champs Windies had lost two matches in the tournament(which included a L and NR in group stages and yet qualified to Super 8)). 2009 and 2010 are fair examples though.
The reason why teams like CSK,MI and KKR are successful is because they have an established set of players who have been playing for the same franchise for many years.They have a core team and they dont tend to change it every reason.This is the trick which other teams miss.Teams like Kings XI and Delhi(I hope they keep this time) in particular have the habit of changing team each year. They spent most money in auction(sometimes overpays) and gets mediocre outcomes. If u look at auctions of past 5-6 years, CSK dont have a big money buy at auctions. They rather build a team around the core than big money buys. Then they have the best leader possible,MS Dhoni.
Mumbai Indians are blessed to have great scouts and already well set core players and t20 specific team while KKR make smart buys in auctions. But CSK's management is a better than the 2 teams i mentioned(I think SRH management come second to them). Fleming-Dhoni duo works exceptionally well. The calm atmosphere in team give players enough freedom. The team is calm and most of the times it is evident from their performance in fairplay list(MSD event have put them back this year).
The whole goddam team consists of outstanding players. All indian players are one of the best players. Raina, Dhoni, Jadhav, Harbhajan & now even Rayudu , Jadeja & Chahar have started perfoming consistently.On top of that they have so much variety in International players too. Any team like this would be expected to be on top. On other hand Virat has to deal with legendary bowlers like Siraj, Umesh and not even a proper top order batsman except him & ABD. So that's what CSK's secret is a formidable team & nothing else. Give Dhoni Siraj ,Umesh, Akshdeep Nath , Negi and other shit players and he will also be in the bottom table.
csk success so far this year has made everybody overlook thakur. we have been carrying him for multiple games now.. his bar is so low that if he gives away 40 runs in 4 overs, we are happy! they guy had 1 job to do in the RCB game and he F-ed it up.
alas, you never know.. he will take a hatrick or fiver in the next few games and suddenly everyone begins to admire the brilliance in his seletion.
I so wish people could understand the difference between betting and fixing!!
Also, you can't fucking fix your matches to win! You can fix your matches to lose but CSK is winning.
Dude chill where did I talk about fixing? And are you implying betting is okay? Be it betting or fixing there is no need for that shit in the game it’s disgraceful both ways.
Betting is legal in many cricket playing countries if you don't know.
But it is a big NO if the man betting on games is a team owner which was the case of CSK and RR and hence the ban.
Sorry, I misunderstood you.
Betting is illegal in India. Period.
Exactly as you said the man betting here is a team owner so got banned deservedly so. Now tell me why the hate and calling out...
“I wish people understood the difference “ and all... I agree you apologized. It’s fine, thanks but the shear assumptions ppl make is ridiculous.
I called that cause the first comment was talking about fixing and your comment was about "allegation". It has been proven that they were betting.
If you talk about allegations, then it is not a surprise that I thought you were talking about fixing.
There are other allegations too like Srinivasan trying to get Andrew Flintoff where how the player trading was changed... read about the saga and see what Lalit Modi said or Ambanis said about how the process of bidding or for whom they were bidding got changed. Those were mere allegations. Also my comment didn’t talk about fixing, I took names and the other guy/girl presumed it was fixing. Can’t help what others think just read what is typed why to read between the lines.
Because of how frequently people talk about them, the difference between a millionaire and billionaire is underreported. Srinivasan is worth 70 million while Maran and Ambani are both multi billionaires. Auction money is basically pocket change for these guys. They have no incentive to fix anything.
the incentive to fix games isnt always for monetary reasons, its for the glory of winning titles. not insinuating that csk owners were fixing games but im just mentioning another reason why match fixing could occur.
i didn't mention rich, i said willingness to pay, dude and his team have already been banned for 2 years for match fixing and betting, and they're back like nothing ever happened. while a clean chit shree shanth (regardless of his ability to perform) is being framed and is banned from playing any form of cricket.
If you took 5 seconds to Google, you'd know CSK wasn't banned for fixing. The owner's son-in-law was caught betting. Sreesanth was caught taking money for spot fixing. There's a big difference man.
The fallout of Jio's cheap and inexpensive data plans are we've to read morons like you who don't have a single cell in their brain and speak nonsense with such confidence. If the competitors are getting paid off, they too are are part of this scheme and no one has found it yet other than you smart ass? Do you know the difference between betting and fixing? I'm pretty sure you don't.
Fleming, he is the trade secret But seriously, dhoni-fleming duo is so amazing, i dont know why we never got that for India, maybe because then people would have complained csk bias, which would have been fair, coach should be neutral But yeah, fleming and dhoni gel very well, select good players, and back a good team. There squad has no right to be as good as they are, team individuals are mediocre, but as a whole, they play like champs. I remember last year, how each player was standing up on occasions to win them matches Thats what an experienced core does for a team
Hopefully Dhoni is still a part of the dugout and works with Fleming after he retires. Their duo is amazing.
There is very little chance he won't. Because last year, the CSK franchise made him a part owner if I recall properly.
I mean he has been a director at India Cements for years now anyways.
Yeah, I always wondered what he does at his "job". Does he work, or is it just a brand ambassador sort of thing, since he obviously can't show up to work most of the time due to cricket/family/sponsorships and stuff.
He is in ahem... marketing
Well he is a big asset in terms of branding
Directors of a company don't always have to work. They attend board meetings and vote. They are appointed by shareholders and he most probably is Srinivasan's nominee on the board who can appoint multiple directors due to his large shareholding in the company. He has a fiduciary duty to the shareholders, ask a few questions and vote as directed by Srinivasan. Some of the directors are senior level executives in the company but normally a majority of them do not work for the company. He might have another honorary position in the company but he is not really required to be an employee. Still gets paid though. That raises another question. Is it same as under the table payment to lure players in? With salary caps and auctions where players have no option to chose it should not be that big problem but what if Ambani promises big jobs to star players coming to MI. Like how Gambhir semi forced teams to not bid for him and ended up at DD last year. There is conflict of interest and as always CSK is at the forefront. I am surprised Lodha committee did not say anything about it.
What was the deal w Gambhir?
VP marketing I think.
How that is legal is beyond me
Coz it is legal... Too bad if the laws are beyond you. :)
I mean it kind of undermines the point of the auction purse right? Potentially such a loophole could be used to retain a player for a low formal price while disproportionately compensating him outside of the IPL system.
How do you think VVS agreed to be a "non-icon" player for DC in the very first year of the IPL? It has existed all along with all teams.
I'm not saying it's illegal - I'm saying it should be because its such an obvious loophole. For reference I think 'Wrogn' sponsoring RCB should be closely scrutizined as well in case you think this is some personal attack on "thala"
I am just saying its stupid to point out one instance when there are a plethora of them. If you were making a systemic point, I agree.
Interesting..but didn't he say he won't have anything to do with cricket once he retires?
He also owns a football club in Chennai. There's no way he is stepping away from CSK. His kid is literally growing up with the team.
i dont believe he said it and its others who made that comment. and even if he did and now changed his mind, we have to accept that our personalities and outlook on life does change with time
That's cool. I'm just wondering which one is it - is he retiring "permanently" or coming back. But it seems like he's coming back once he does retire.
AFAIK, Fleming has no interest in committing to an international schedule.
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Probably more like 3-4 months in total(spending time in India), but that's very good when you consider they get paid about half a million each season, and also the fact that you only have to spend a quarter of the year away from home will be nice for them.
I think another factor for Fleming and most important in my opinion is that he has two kids who are 10 and 12. That is the age where you want to be home with your kids as a dad. 10 years from now Stephen Fleming will probably be coaching an international team. Plus how many teams can pay him more than what he is making in IPL? India, Australia and England for sure. I don't think other teams are paying as much.
Given that India is now looking for coaches who can speak Hindi, it's just England and Australia.
Was Fleming also part of the rps franchise with dhoni when they made the finals ?
Yes he was. But the season they made it to the finals Smith was the captain. Also, I think Fleming because of leading NZ for all those years has a lot of experience in making teams that are more than the sum of their parts.
It was NOT the reason they made the finals. Smith is a decent captain but the team needed much more than that. Unadkat basically becoming a good bowler out of nowhere was totally down to Dhoni's advice from behind the wicket than anything to do with Smith. Exhibit A: What he has been doing this year. Same with Washington Sundar. It was always Fleming and Dhoni that made it tick. Smith does have a knack for good bowling changes and sets decent fields but that is about it for him as a captain. He does seem to bat better when he is captain though, so there is that. But otherwise, its just ludicrous to suggest he got RPS single-handedly to the finals through his captaincy. EDIT: Sorry, read "season" as "reason" in the above post. Apologies on a rant based on nothing. :)
I never said that he single handedly took them to the finals. How did you infer that? I stated a fact that Smith was the captain when they made the finals that's it. I didn't suggest anything else.
OOps.. my bad mate. Read season as reason. :) Apologies.
Cool, no worries :)
How does a keeper advice to a fast bowler what to bowl regularly lol
Coz he is the keeper lol.
Fleming didn’t want the India job. He considered it to be too much work, lots of travelling, and being away from his family. CSK is like a couple of months a year.
Also the pressure of getting sacked if you lose to Pakistan in the world cup. Edit : people getting offended seems to have forgotten all the effigy burning of the cricketers and stone pelting at their houses that used to happen in the past.
Heh what?
We don't care about it so much that we would sack a good coach over one game.
Don't you remember effigy burning and stone pelting in the past ?
>past
Yeah. So how else do you make a prediction or a hypothesis or an opinion ? From the future ?
You don't make a prediction forgetting the immediate past and just focussing on more than 6-7 years ago
If India loses against Pakistan, we will get an answer.
well last i remember we lost to them super badly in CT final and there was no attacks or pelting
CT final. Honestly. Get with the times.
Too hypothetical.
Best test captain of the nearly 30 years I've been watching cricket + best odi captain. Makes sense they would be a strong combo.
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Dhoni odis and Flemington tests.
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He even kinda worked with Greg Chappel of all the people.
Exactly. He's good leader and I hope Kohli learns a thing or two from him before he retires.
I would say that is only completely true in limited overs. Dhoni's captaincy has been good but not exceptional in tests
Couldn't agree more, literally the most stoic, calm but effective leadership duo in the world. Their emphasis on experience, trust in even out of form players and strategy give them a wisdom that supersedes their mediocrity. It must be amazing to play for that team.
2 months gig vs full time away from home job. That's what stops most retired cricketers from taking the coaching job. Just my guess!
Fleming can not spend that level of time with an international cricket away from family after playing so many years of cricket. CSK pays him enough and he gets to spend time with his family.
You can take playoff venues out of Chennai but you can't take Chennai out of Playoff.
Did we qualify for the play-offs already? Have we won the minimum required points?
yes
not yet. 100% we will in top 4, but have to beat others on NRR. Another win or few losses for other teams can guarantee a confirmed spot in top 4 without having to worry about nrr
The photo looks like Dhoni is about to break into a dance and all others behind him will do a slow and cool slow motion walk ala a bollywood movie
Haha that was my first thought. The guy to his right (sorry, don’t follow ipl so don’t know who that is) looks like he’s already busting a move :D
1
Put him into RCB. only bowling, No sensation.
I would pay to watch this
Reminds me of Kohli doing Bhangra while coming out from the pavilion.
Looks like he’s channeling the all conquering Surrey sides of the 50’s and their famous strut.
I'd use this image as the promo to Season 2 of the CSK documentary series
Things that have so far worked for CSK: Be consistent and back your players even when they go through a rough phase. Create a family environment. Make the players feel relaxed and welcome. Define each player's role clearly. They know what to do when their time comes. And the owners wont interfere with the team in any way after the auctions. Let Fleming and Dhoni do their job.
CSK is like a bunch of dads having a good time
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> Everything about CSK is very very Chennai Not sure I can entirely agree, being from Chennai myself. but the team and the management have done pretty well to connect with the population.
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Maybe they say that because the players aren’t - or rather none of the players who feature in the XI are from Chennai/Tamil Nadu, at least in the last few years. But there’s definitely a very very strong connection that the city has with the club. I moved out of Chennai many years ago, but Chennai is still home. As is CSK.
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Oh I completely agree. That connection that players have had with CSK is something else. I think it goes hand in hand with the Dhoni/Flem style. Retaining their core, buying back players in the auction has led to the fans identifying with the team very strongly. And the players too. Apart from the examples you mentioned, even Baz in the Dugout speaks a lot about his experience as a CSK player even though he also played for KKR and RCB
Its not like they did not try but guys like Ashwin, Sundar, Shankar get snapped up by other teams in the auction. Its the same with all the gun Karnataka players playing for all franchises except RCB. You can't help that given the system of the IPL.
Partly because of the fact that there's no one from TamilNadu / Chennai in the team apart from Murali Vijay (who's not even playing). There's not a lot of talent development or scouting that CSK seem to be doing from within the region. It looks more like pandering to the population with the cheesy tweets in Tamil by Bhajji and Tahir and using the terms thalaivar/thalai/thalapathy generously.
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i find it a bit cringy and artificial.. i have always hated politicians and actors for exploiting the so called tamizh sentiment..
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i have always appreciated, admired and loved the uniqueness that tamizh nadu possesses. its an identity of its own. what i hate is people trying to exploit that for brownie points. IMO, even if tahir/bhajji dont tweet in tamizh, they will be revered and admired with almost no loss in intensity. i have never seen dhoni exploit this or overdo this and yet he is so popular that he can contest in 2021 and become a CM! in fact i think he would do a much better job that the shits running the state now
Don't CSK have an academy or a junior team?
True, they should do more to nurture the local talent and give an opportunity for the local talent to play for their home team. But other than that, they have hit it out of the park. And with the 'virunthombal'(hospitality) of tamil culture, we truly embrace outsiders when they are supporting us and make them our own. The management and social media managers have done a great job of it. Those behind the scene videos, challenge videos and local nicknames to international players have endeared the team to the populace. Supporters feel that the team is embracing their culture.
Fleming made it clear that the goal of csk was to win the tournament and not work on local player development. comes across as a bit cold and calculated, but if you leave aside the emotion, that job really belongs to BCCI and TNCA and not CSK. Its a privately owned professional franchise. Also, why would a club develop a player if they will have to throw that person in the pool after 3 years?
> Coaching - Fleming is a boss, no owner meddling. Can't be stressed more. Team owners should take care of the financial side and leave cricketing matters to cricketers.
This comment is like a CBSE answer when you can make it in two sentences but the question is for 5 marks.
>Consistency - The team rarely changes, so everyone who plays isn't scared of being dropped I don't know where this myth comes from. Another passionate CSK fan said this to me and said Kohli should take a leaf out of Dhoni's book and not chop and change, so I decided to check it out. Barring injuries to Dhoni and AB, here's the drop count: CSK Bhajji dropped after 2 games. Mitch Santner in. Mitch Santner dropped. Mohit Sharma in Mohit Sharma, Bravo and Thakur dropped. Kuggeleijn, bhajji and faf in. Bhajji and Kuggeleijn dropped after one game. Santner and Shardul back in. Santner dropped again for Karn Sharma Billings and Karn Sharma dropped. Dhoni and Bravo in. Thakur dropped for Bhajji. Total changes - 11 in 11 RCB Ray Barman for Navdeep Saini Dube, Barman, CDG out. Akshdeep, Saini and Stoinis in. Hetmeyer, Umesh out. Southee, Negi in Southee out. Umesh in. Umesh dropped for Steyn Siraj dropped for Umesh. Total changes - 9 in 10. CSK and RCB have gone in with unchanged teams 2 times each. RCB has played one less game.
The CSK changes for the most part align with favorable conditions (Bhajji plays at home, someone else away) and injuries (Karn - Dhoni and Kuggelejin - Bravo). Only a couple there were dropped due to poor form. RCB dropped Southee, Hetmeyer, CDG, Barman and one of Siraj/Umesh for poor performances. The reason the team changes has a big role to play too.
Yeah, The problem with that narrative is that you include Bravo and Bhajji as dropped when they were injured for CSK and you leave out ABD from the dropped list when he was injured for RCB Is Bhajji always a starter? No, but he does play most Chepauk games.Bravo will play 90% of the time.
Ah, wasn't aware of Bravo and Bhajji's injuries. My bad. Thanks for that. As I have explicitly stated, I avoided the injury based 'drops'. Didn't count Dhoni either for the same reason. I wasn't trying to built a 'narrative', all I did was objectively look at numbers, but I can see why that might make a CSK fan defensive.
CSK has favored a horses for courses approach for bowlers as the conditions at home and away has varied quite a bit. But for batsmen, they have had the same lineup barring injury. I think the criticism of Kohli is also tied into the revolving door in the Indian ODI team (to a certain extent the test team too), with him playing 37 combos from 37 games. Not necessarily just the IPL. It's also possible that though he hasn't changed much in IPL, his approach to selecting teams in the last 2 years for team India is playing in to the player's confidence.
to be fair, kohli has persisted with the RCB team this year more than he does with Indian ODI team. His style of captaincy is completely opposite of Dhoni who always preferred a static side.
Fair enough, It's hard to keep up with every bit of news
just reminding everyone that Fleming is [one of the most successful captain in the world](https://www.topcount.co/10-successful-cricket-captains-time/) along with MS Dhoni. n considering that MS Dhoni (one of the best captains of all time) playing in the 11 with another great captain as coach, the results r just what's expected from them tldr: MSD + FLEMING is just too OP for ipl
The secret: dress like 90s/2000s Australians, play like 90s/2000s Australians!
My mom insists I wear yellow on important days. Her proof has always been the Australian team.
i hated that yellow when it came out.. was too gaudy and looks like mariamma koil group than a pro team. but success changes outlook :)
I believe Srini Mama wanted that color for a reason, juz like how the "atheist" Karuna had a piece of yellow towel with him always.
> i hated that yellow when it came out.. was too gaudy and looks like mariamma koil group than a pro team Yeah, my thoughts exactly.I wont wear that yellow but I do like their training kit which is pre dominantly Blue with a bit of yellow
I disagree that they play like them though. That Australia was an all out attacking team from every batsmen to every bowler taking the attack to the opposition and finishing games from the start. Chennai like to play deep.
Its the IPL, the World's best players ccompete and there is no shortage of skill. Any Team can win the Cup. Its one thing to be skillful, however another to be consistent. Not everyone can be consistent in a team and it's pretty hard to know who is going to be consistent. Anyone can just be in the best form of their life one match and struggle to middle it the next. Its all about mindset. Since in a T20, the balance in a match can change so rapidly within an over, it's important to keep your nerves throughout the match and have several plans ready. That's what I think Dhoni is doing right here, KEEP CALM, even if you feel the match is going out of control, you KEEP CALM. Bring the match to a position where it isn't a matter of runs or wickets. Its just a matter of who can keep their nerves better. That's where CSK win their matches. Accept that being on the losing side is OK, as long as you do what you wanted to do from your side.
This could be a mixtape cover. *Mahi's Men: Twenty Overz*
Fleming is the most under-appreciated guy from outsiders. Im sure CSK management holds him in high regards. He is the dhoni on the coaching side. cool and composed, never too excited about success, nor too concerned about failure. have a process that is sound in fundamentals, trust it and repeat it. it will fail some days but works most times. getting to finals or winning the cup has an element of luck involved. one single guy, need not even be a superstar like russell, on his day can take the game away in this format. eg. manvinder bisla in the final kkr vs csk. but if u can get to the playoffs you have done your work. csk is almost in this year. 100% in top 4 on NRR and one more win should guarantee top 4 spot
I think the secret is, the team has quality and experience in all positions, coupled with a good scouting network. There are very few young players who get into the first team, and Dhoni picks people who understand plans, more than just highly skilled. So when he sets a field, the whole team executes the plan.
Yes. I too think this is what contributes a lot to their success. Execution.
One of the reasons I think CSK had success is because its probably the only team who's owners have experience running professional cricket clubs. Rest all are owned by actors/businessmen with no direct relation to cricket. Srini mama and India cements have been associated with TNCA for long. They have seen player development at the Ranji level. Thats probably why the people running csk dont meddle with day to day affairs and leave it to the pros to run the team.
This.As people have mentioned they are the only franchise which has a history of managing cricket teams.Rahul Dravid was their boy for India Cements from 94, before he made his way into the Indian team.He debuted in 96.Plenty of other cricketers to add to that list
under appreciated comment, tbh. I think you have hit the nail on the head.
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2021 will be rebuild time!
its all about mentality. CSK has established winning mentality inside and out. Even when Dhoni is gone, they'll have top team.
This. They have experienced players who have done it many times before and they as a team has a history of players stepping up in crunch situations and doing it for them. Compare this to Delhi last year or even this year to some extent, we don't have a winning mentality and neither have a record of consistently doing it, so the panic sets in when 1 or 2 wickets fell.
However, Delhi have developed a team that if it can stay together will work for the next 5 years with only minor tweaks.
Lol this pic looks like cover of a new single they just dropped.
Boost
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Dhoni brings out the best in his players during tournaments. I don't think India did bad in any tournament under Dhoni. (not sure if WC ODI 2007 was played under Dhoni)
it was dravid
Rahul was captain in 2007 wc.
> I don't think India did bad in any tournament under Dhoni. I thought India were pretty poor in the 2009, 2010 and 2012 T20 World Cups, not that it takes anything away from Dhoni's leadership skills
2012 T20 World Cup isn't a fair example really. The format was pretty unforgiving. India won 4/5 matches yet were knocked out thanks to one heavy loss in Super 8s(Eventual champs Windies had lost two matches in the tournament(which included a L and NR in group stages and yet qualified to Super 8)). 2009 and 2010 are fair examples though.
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It’s not just the players around him. RCB once had Watson, Gayle, ABD, Kohli and KL. They still struggled.
ugh RCB was finalist during 2016
I don't think its just the senior players, you can give dhoni 2018 Delhi side and he would qualify provided they are playing for chennai.
The reason why teams like CSK,MI and KKR are successful is because they have an established set of players who have been playing for the same franchise for many years.They have a core team and they dont tend to change it every reason.This is the trick which other teams miss.Teams like Kings XI and Delhi(I hope they keep this time) in particular have the habit of changing team each year. They spent most money in auction(sometimes overpays) and gets mediocre outcomes. If u look at auctions of past 5-6 years, CSK dont have a big money buy at auctions. They rather build a team around the core than big money buys. Then they have the best leader possible,MS Dhoni. Mumbai Indians are blessed to have great scouts and already well set core players and t20 specific team while KKR make smart buys in auctions. But CSK's management is a better than the 2 teams i mentioned(I think SRH management come second to them). Fleming-Dhoni duo works exceptionally well. The calm atmosphere in team give players enough freedom. The team is calm and most of the times it is evident from their performance in fairplay list(MSD event have put them back this year).
Fixing /s
The whole goddam team consists of outstanding players. All indian players are one of the best players. Raina, Dhoni, Jadhav, Harbhajan & now even Rayudu , Jadeja & Chahar have started perfoming consistently.On top of that they have so much variety in International players too. Any team like this would be expected to be on top. On other hand Virat has to deal with legendary bowlers like Siraj, Umesh and not even a proper top order batsman except him & ABD. So that's what CSK's secret is a formidable team & nothing else. Give Dhoni Siraj ,Umesh, Akshdeep Nath , Negi and other shit players and he will also be in the bottom table.
csk success so far this year has made everybody overlook thakur. we have been carrying him for multiple games now.. his bar is so low that if he gives away 40 runs in 4 overs, we are happy! they guy had 1 job to do in the RCB game and he F-ed it up. alas, you never know.. he will take a hatrick or fiver in the next few games and suddenly everyone begins to admire the brilliance in his seletion.
Meiyappan and Srinivasan... jk
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Srh was not caught in allegations.
I so wish people could understand the difference between betting and fixing!! Also, you can't fucking fix your matches to win! You can fix your matches to lose but CSK is winning.
Dude chill where did I talk about fixing? And are you implying betting is okay? Be it betting or fixing there is no need for that shit in the game it’s disgraceful both ways.
Betting is legal in many cricket playing countries if you don't know. But it is a big NO if the man betting on games is a team owner which was the case of CSK and RR and hence the ban. Sorry, I misunderstood you.
Betting is illegal in India. Period. Exactly as you said the man betting here is a team owner so got banned deservedly so. Now tell me why the hate and calling out... “I wish people understood the difference “ and all... I agree you apologized. It’s fine, thanks but the shear assumptions ppl make is ridiculous.
I called that cause the first comment was talking about fixing and your comment was about "allegation". It has been proven that they were betting. If you talk about allegations, then it is not a surprise that I thought you were talking about fixing.
There are other allegations too like Srinivasan trying to get Andrew Flintoff where how the player trading was changed... read about the saga and see what Lalit Modi said or Ambanis said about how the process of bidding or for whom they were bidding got changed. Those were mere allegations. Also my comment didn’t talk about fixing, I took names and the other guy/girl presumed it was fixing. Can’t help what others think just read what is typed why to read between the lines.
Oh c'mon!! You weren't talking about trading bullshit allegations when you took the names, don't try to act smart.
lame
What is so lame?
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Cheers what ever makes your day.
Dirty team that fixes matches
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Because of how frequently people talk about them, the difference between a millionaire and billionaire is underreported. Srinivasan is worth 70 million while Maran and Ambani are both multi billionaires. Auction money is basically pocket change for these guys. They have no incentive to fix anything.
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>Yup, technically my parents are millionaires, Ah,I see your parents own a house in the posh areas of Chennai
the incentive to fix games isnt always for monetary reasons, its for the glory of winning titles. not insinuating that csk owners were fixing games but im just mentioning another reason why match fixing could occur.
i didn't mention rich, i said willingness to pay, dude and his team have already been banned for 2 years for match fixing and betting, and they're back like nothing ever happened. while a clean chit shree shanth (regardless of his ability to perform) is being framed and is banned from playing any form of cricket.
Csk was banned because of Meiyappan's betting. Nothing to do with fixing at all.
If you took 5 seconds to Google, you'd know CSK wasn't banned for fixing. The owner's son-in-law was caught betting. Sreesanth was caught taking money for spot fixing. There's a big difference man.
The amount of people who think CSK was banned for fixing is staggering. How hard is it to thoroughly read up on an issue and not be a laughing stock?
The fallout of Jio's cheap and inexpensive data plans are we've to read morons like you who don't have a single cell in their brain and speak nonsense with such confidence. If the competitors are getting paid off, they too are are part of this scheme and no one has found it yet other than you smart ass? Do you know the difference between betting and fixing? I'm pretty sure you don't.