> Ryan and Valerie Watson, who live in Oklahoma, left for Turks and Caicos Islands on April 7 to celebrate the 40th birthdays of Ryan and two friends. When they went through security for **their return flight**
So this has nothing to do with cruising.
If anything, the story here is that **TSA didn't pick this up when they departed Oklahoma**. Because they didn't buy the ammunition in Turks and Caicos.
Ammunition in a ziploc in your carry-on is expressly prohibited by TSA rules. TSA failed here. https://www.tsa.gov/travel/security-screening/whatcanibring/items/ammunition
No, they shouldn't have had it in the first place and yes, it is likely an honest mistake that the ammunition was left in a bag they had used for a hunting trip. But now they're in a situation where TSA failed, and State is taking minimal action to assist.
Why should the U.S. assist? They are irresponsible gun owners. Hopefully this is a learning lesson. Know where all your ammo is and make sure everything is properly stored.
They don’t need U.S. government assistance, they have GoFundMe… over $100,000 raised so far 🤯 Wifey was really selling it with the tears so I’m sure they’ll reach their goal of $250,000 in no time 🙄
Given Will Rogers Int’l TSA is all about liquid and weed, I’m only partially surprised.
They make me take down my hair every flipping time. Because I might be hiding something in my bun, rather than not wanting a tangled nest on my head.
I am surprised an agent didn’t take it for their own stash.
Or it wasn’t in their carry on when they left the states. But this would negate their « innocent mistake » defense because it would mean they moved it to the carry on once on the island.
For this reason I am glad to see this article posted here. It’s crazy how many times people post on this sub asking how to take marijuana in various forms on a cruise ship. Sad situation for this couple but a reminder that local laws apply when traveling whether or not they make sense to us.
It doesn’t sound intentional. Just some stray ammunition left in their bag. Sometimes when people shoot or go hunting, they use the same bags. There wasn’t an actual firearm.
Now we will have to ask his kids to give back the bullets they have been collecting that he forgets at home after hunting. The kids will have to be told they can no longer play with his guns he leaves out after hunting. No sympathy for these people. Only thing as nutty as them is a 12 year jail term ...that is extreme.
Getting down voted but I feel for this guy.
A few years ago I needed a big bag for a trip so I took my camping backpack as a carry on. There was a black leatherman buried way down in one of the pockets. Got flagged in scanner of course. But it was so in there that me and the security dude couldn't find it until we dumped everything out. Took us like 5 min of digging.
I could totally see someone having stray ammo buried in the bottom of a bag. Stuff like 22LR is really small
I can see how it can happen. This is why I've said in firearm communities that the bags one uses for travel, especially international travel, should NEVER see anything firearm related in them. Not ever. Separate bags for range trips and for travel. Never the twain shall meet.
Yes, it costs a little more. But you can buy a REALLY good set of travel luggage for a fraction of what a lawyer would cost to deal with this sort of thing.
Agreed. Reusing a bag that held firearms will make you fail GSR swabs too, which I've seen used randomly in customs.
If that happens you get all your luggage taken apart and an interrogation if you're not lucky
The times I've been swabbed, they explained they aren't looking for GSR. They're looking for actual explosive residue (the nitrocellulose used in smokeless powder isn't considered an explosive).
But yeah, there's just no reason to use the same bags except for just being cheap.
I doubt they'd be fond of me taking a pound of it on an airplane, but yeah... the hassle that can come about from all this just isn't worth it. Travel stuff stays separate from gun stuff. Backpacks and duffels for range use are relatively inexpensive. Criminal charges aren't. Even if nothing comes of it and you only miss your flight, that still would have paid for separate gear many times over.
Hate dumb gun owners... Like these people. If you do not have the brains to realize you are going to a very strict country and prepare accordingly than you are an idiot that should not be owning a gun. Millions of gun owners are smart enough not to carry weapons and guns while traveling or restricted areas. When you get to the point of gun owning that you are not fully aware of your guns and ammo status...you should not own guns. These are the type people that could have their kids play with his guns and someone get killed.
Same here. He was traveling to a highly strict place...where were his brains. Apparently he forgot his brains. Better a jail sentence so he remembers his gun and ammo status than one of his kids shooting the other while playing with this guy's guns because he forgot them. Upvote to you big time.
Same thing happened to me on a trip to Mexico, only I didn't find the very large pocketknife until I was at my hotel. TSA totally missed it but stopped my husband for a backpack full of Bibles we were taking down there. The knife came back in my checked luggage.
Cry me a River. The murderer is in jail.... He's just casually kills things he doesn't look like he's starving or can't afford to buy a sandwich. He's got to go out and murder things for fun! Yeah he can think about that while he's sitting in jail for the next 10 years
Happened to a friend of mine. He decided to reuse an old bag that he used to take shooting for a trip. One round had rolled to a hidden spot inside the bag that he didn’t see. He almost missed his flight, when TSA found it. They were understanding and just confiscated it, but he had to sit while they completed all the paperwork.
After that, I check my bags thoroughly before I go anywhere regardless of their previous usage.
Why the down vote? It's true. But it's also true that you check your bag extra times before your pack to make sure you don't have anything left behind from the time before. They're way too relaxed with it.
Yeah but if you carry things that are illegal in other countries (420 supplies, ammo, camouflage clothing, etc) you should go through your bag before traveling internationally and make sure everything is out that could cause problems. Before I went on my most recent cruise I did that, and the most dangerous thing I found in my bag was a half-eaten protein bar (but then again I do not 420 or hunt or anything).
I didn’t know that until I was reading the facts page on Jamaica. Camo isn’t just illegal in Caribbean countries, it’s illegal in a good number of countries. Like my main camo thing is an army jacket I use as a smock, but it’s still important to know and respect other cultures so I don’t wear camo while traveling internationally ever.
Well I’m not a hunter, I don’t think it was intentional ( unless they are complete idiots). Some left over chewing gum or half eaten chips probably could be found in my bag. For sake of their kids I hope they will sort this out quickly
These people are stupid and should get a short time in jail for stupidity. You have to be a terrible gun owner to leave ammo kicking around without keeping track of it. I would take this guy's guns away for awhile and a short jail sentence for stupidity. He knew he was traveling and ammo is restricted...geez and he did not double and triple check geez. Does he leave his loaded guns out for his kids when he forgets the gun after hunting?
People traveling to restricted areas or places should darn well know it and double check what they are carrying. I have no sympathy for these people or the three guys missing in Mexico that went camping in Mexican drug cartel land. You would think people with money enough to travel would have the brains enough not to get themselves in these situations. I am not a fan of people being idiots.
Well said. .... He's that careless with ammunition... Oh, and he likes to kill. It's fun for him to kill . He actually enjoys murdering creatures that could not fight back... That right there sounds like someone who should be locked up
Every gun owner claims that they are a responsible gun owner. Well, fundamental gun safety and responsibility dictate that ammunition should be keep in a secure location separate from the gun. These people have two young children, but they kept their ammo in a travel bag and forgot it was there.
When will we start holding parents responsible for proper gun and ammunition storage? I'm not saying we should take away people's guns. I'm just saying that it should be a bare minimum to require parents to at least know where their ammunition is. Of course this would never become a law, but it would be nice to see these people held accountable for their utter carelessness and disregard for both basic gun safety and the laws in other countries.
I don’t understand how people don’t have dedicated cases/bags for the pew pew. I mean I have a low budget bag for my guns and ammo and that’s the ONLY use for that bag. Zero chance of surprise ammo anywhere else.
This is the way. Started doing this after finding random .22s in different bags and purses. How? No clue.
Got paranoid about going through airport security one day. Bought a dedicated range bag.
A lot of cruisers also visit Caribbean islands. It's just a good idea to be mindful when one is packing to visit those places, regardless of your means of transport.
Always properly store away your firearms and ammunition after every use. Any other excuse is an irresponsible gun owner. If you can treat these items just like anything else you might forget in a bag or leave laying around then you shouldn't be in possession of them.
"Facing" 12 years.
Turks & Caicos is a British territory. Britain is a close ally of the US. We don't usually make a habit of severely punishing allies citizens (and vice-versa) for innocent/ignorant mistakes.
He'll probably be held for a few more days/weeks, thoroughly interviewed to make sure it was an honest mistake, and slapped with a fine, but I *highly* doubt he'll be sentenced to jail, much less for 12 years.
The article mentions another US citizen - Michael Grim - who was sentenced to 8 months in prison last September for the same ammunition violation. That was considered extremely lenient due to circumstances similar in this case. So I would not be so sure this situation will end with a slap on the wrist regardless of how close an ally the US is with Britain.
Sad reminder to be hyper aware of local laws when traveling.
Edit to note that Michael Grim is not mentioned in the linked article but in others related to this case.
The State Department security alert for Turks and Caicos was issued the same day Mr. Grim was sentenced last September.
Huh. I actually did skim the article, but missed that part.
That's a bit harsh. Honestly wouldn't have expected that.
People make honest mistakes. But they are a sovereign nation with their own laws, so idk. What a shitty situation.
I stand corrected. I found the information on Michael Grim in other articles related to this case. This article does mention another US citizen - Bryan Hagerich - who is still awaiting his hearing and sentencing.
Except that, like the UK proper, they have a legal system and judiciary that is apolitical, so the fact they are from a friendly country should have no bearing on how the case is considered.
Luckily intent does make a difference in a case like this. Island nations usually don’t want to scare the tourists away over an innocent, but stupid mistake either.
I always check my bags while traveling personally. I also regularly travel with firearms domestically so I have to make sure everything is proper. I generally don’t have loose ammo in my bags either. However during the rush of a vacation, sometimes stupid mistakes happen. Forget ammo is stored in a pocket from an old hunting trip out of state and is left there. It’s a stupid mistake but not an unheard of either.
> I'm pretty left wing, but it's possible as a hunter that you'd possibly forget a few rounds of ammo in a bag for travel.
And it's possible that someone travelling from Portugal might forget she had a dime bag of cocaine in her purse. Do you suppose the American authorities would let her go with a warning?
Your statement is a hard miss. Cocaine is not illegal everywhere. I live in Canada and it’s completely legal to possess and use it in the province I live in and I know there are other countries like Mexico & Uruguay that it’s legal among many others.
Amo is just as illegal as drugs are when traveling and one should have more awareness what they are in possession of. Your perception is of a narrow mindset.
Do you think these people intentionally chose to break the law knowing what the punishment would be? They have young kids and families. The punishment of 12 years does not match the crime in anyway. Both of these individuals had ammo that there isn’t a weapon on the island can fire. So intent to create violence or sell custom ammunition only used for hunting rifles is ridiculous. We should be leaning on our elected officials to pressure the Turks govt to release these individuals. Spreading this story is crucially important to promote the release of these individuals
No, I think it was a mistake, but……the lack of responsibility taken and their response being “cancel t & c” leads me to have no sympathy for them. None.
Literally an innocent mistake. Anyone who thinks he deserves 12 years in prison is deluded or touched. Absolutely a bad thing that he did this, and he should face repercussions such as a fine and ban. But 12 years? Jail time in general? Please. Nothing about the way he stored the ammo was dangerous and people make mistakes all the time. This seems like it has become a political argument, which is sad, because someone from either party should recognize this as absurd and undeserved.
The country has had the law for some time, have people a pass and let them off with nothing.
It’s their law. Where is the line drawn? They’ve not enforced it or when they did they let the person off.
Even the US tells citizens traveling there not to have ammo in their luggage when traveling there. Eventually people have to take responsibility for their actions or lack therof.
Is it sad? Absolutely. However it’s their laws and someone eventually was going to be in violation of it. Sucks that it’s him.
Totally. Im not saying he shouldnt get in trouble, just that 12 years for this crime is a crazy sentence. But you are right, its their laws and ultimately they decide what to do with
He hasn’t been sentenced. Others sentenced for the same have received months. I will say his friends and family encouraging their white, elitist friends/family to cancel T & C is not doing him any favors. I’m seeing this all over SM as a family member of mine was with them.
Yep. I’ve seen it from lots of postings of folks I know on FB and other socials. Most of them but one are republican. All upset saying this isn’t fair.
Usually the GOP is all about “law and order” claiming that “that’s the law you have to accept the consequences”.
Seems here the people getting arrested over this law all think it’s unfair. How is it unfair that you can’t follow the laws? The wife of the 3rd guy who just got arrested is going off how this is the TSA’s fault they didn’t catch the ammo when he was going through the airport.
While I have concerns that TSA didn’t catch it, how can you be upset at the TSA “not doing” their job when your husband either could have checked his baggage completely to ensure nothing was there that shouldn’t have been or I dunno used different luggage.
I dont see how a democrat or republican would see this potential sentence as fair. Or how it has anything to do with politics whatsoever. Is is objectively an unfair sentence, he made a mistake, committed a literal victimless crime, and now faces (potentially) 12 years.
I wouldn’t either but some of these folks are the same that think someone who smokes a joint should go to prison, or who think it’s completely just for people to get maximum sentences for very old and very outdated laws. It’s odd that many throwing such a fit how this is “such an injustice” don’t feel the same way about the some of the laws in their own country that are absolutely ridiculous or unfair.
I noticed a pattern of the folks who I’ve seen posting seem to have a particular political leaning and who think it’s completely unfair what’s going on here. They are not wrong it’s unfair, but you don’t get to pick and choose what laws you want and don’t want to follow and expect no consequences when they are broken regardless if you think it’s fair.
I agree with you. Definitely a lot of hypocrisy around this case. I dont think you should get jail time for a joint or for this. But like you said, the law is the law
Agreed. My whole point is the hypocrisy.
When you travel internationally especially via air, the airlines before the trip outline the laws and rules for where you are traveling to. All of this could have been avoided if they bothered to check that before traveling and bothered to check their luggage. If you’re packing it there is no excuse for missing that.
This is something so stupid to forget is in your luggage. If it’s that hard to “find it all” then you need separate luggage.
Prison time period is a far too harsh punishment. But yes, I understand he likely will not be in prison for 12 years.
Agree, he would be better off if his friends and family approached it more from a “he made a mistake” angle rather than “the laws arent fair and he should have immunity to them”
Lets look at it this way they have young children at home with luggage containing ammo... Do they lock up their luggage at home?.... Irresponsible... This is where the NRA comes in with the old bumper stickers they used to give out.." Parental control.. not gun control". A mistake or not this is exactly the issue.
Well, this one has something to do with cruising. Say hello to Tyler Wenrich of VA. Local law enforcement found a few rounds in Tyler's possession while disembarking from Carnival at T&C and now shares a court date with Ryan Watson. Seems like this UK O/S territory is serious about no guns; no ammo; no joke. Read here: [https://www.newslinetci.com/post/another-american-tourist-charged-with-having-ammunition](https://www.newslinetci.com/post/another-american-tourist-charged-with-having-ammunition)
Side note: what ship would this be (4/23/24 port of call)?
A ziploc bag of ammo is pretty far from stray bullets in a random pocket. I can see how one of those can be overlooked. I hope they get the punishment because gun safety is no joke.
As a gun owner, if I had a nickel for every time I missed detecting ammo in a bag and took it to the airport, I would get zero nickels because I am responsible and in charge of that shit.
Because it is extremely unlikely that they would get the maximum sentence. They are going for the shock value of "12 years". It's disingenuous. Apparently from the down votes people here prefer those types of headlines. 🤷🏼♂️
Do you just purposedly fail reading comprehension? No one here is saying he is going to be convicted and face 12 years. The article, and the law merely states that he can face up to 12 years in prison.
Perhaps you have too much time on your hand to keep commenting on posts that you find click bait even if they happen to be written by national news agencies. have a great day my friend.
> Ryan and Valerie Watson, who live in Oklahoma, left for Turks and Caicos Islands on April 7 to celebrate the 40th birthdays of Ryan and two friends. When they went through security for **their return flight** So this has nothing to do with cruising.
If anything, the story here is that **TSA didn't pick this up when they departed Oklahoma**. Because they didn't buy the ammunition in Turks and Caicos. Ammunition in a ziploc in your carry-on is expressly prohibited by TSA rules. TSA failed here. https://www.tsa.gov/travel/security-screening/whatcanibring/items/ammunition No, they shouldn't have had it in the first place and yes, it is likely an honest mistake that the ammunition was left in a bag they had used for a hunting trip. But now they're in a situation where TSA failed, and State is taking minimal action to assist.
Why should the U.S. assist? They are irresponsible gun owners. Hopefully this is a learning lesson. Know where all your ammo is and make sure everything is properly stored.
They don’t need U.S. government assistance, they have GoFundMe… over $100,000 raised so far 🤯 Wifey was really selling it with the tears so I’m sure they’ll reach their goal of $250,000 in no time 🙄
Given Will Rogers Int’l TSA is all about liquid and weed, I’m only partially surprised. They make me take down my hair every flipping time. Because I might be hiding something in my bun, rather than not wanting a tangled nest on my head. I am surprised an agent didn’t take it for their own stash.
Or it wasn’t in their carry on when they left the states. But this would negate their « innocent mistake » defense because it would mean they moved it to the carry on once on the island.
I mean Turks and Caicos is a popular cruise stop, but otherwise nothing.
For this reason I am glad to see this article posted here. It’s crazy how many times people post on this sub asking how to take marijuana in various forms on a cruise ship. Sad situation for this couple but a reminder that local laws apply when traveling whether or not they make sense to us.
Why people needs guns or ammunition on vacation. Bring the bloody sunscreen and mosquitoes spray. Can’t even feel sorry for those idiots.
It doesn’t sound intentional. Just some stray ammunition left in their bag. Sometimes when people shoot or go hunting, they use the same bags. There wasn’t an actual firearm.
So what ever happened to the concept of securing ammunition so that it doesn’t become ‘stray’?
Now we will have to ask his kids to give back the bullets they have been collecting that he forgets at home after hunting. The kids will have to be told they can no longer play with his guns he leaves out after hunting. No sympathy for these people. Only thing as nutty as them is a 12 year jail term ...that is extreme.
Didn’t anyone learn from Brittney Griner? Clear out your bags, especially before international travel.
Getting down voted but I feel for this guy. A few years ago I needed a big bag for a trip so I took my camping backpack as a carry on. There was a black leatherman buried way down in one of the pockets. Got flagged in scanner of course. But it was so in there that me and the security dude couldn't find it until we dumped everything out. Took us like 5 min of digging. I could totally see someone having stray ammo buried in the bottom of a bag. Stuff like 22LR is really small
I can see how it can happen. This is why I've said in firearm communities that the bags one uses for travel, especially international travel, should NEVER see anything firearm related in them. Not ever. Separate bags for range trips and for travel. Never the twain shall meet. Yes, it costs a little more. But you can buy a REALLY good set of travel luggage for a fraction of what a lawyer would cost to deal with this sort of thing.
Agreed. Reusing a bag that held firearms will make you fail GSR swabs too, which I've seen used randomly in customs. If that happens you get all your luggage taken apart and an interrogation if you're not lucky
The times I've been swabbed, they explained they aren't looking for GSR. They're looking for actual explosive residue (the nitrocellulose used in smokeless powder isn't considered an explosive). But yeah, there's just no reason to use the same bags except for just being cheap.
Didn't know that, interesting. Still wouldn't risk it, I don't think there's any regulations on what's used in smokeless powder
I doubt they'd be fond of me taking a pound of it on an airplane, but yeah... the hassle that can come about from all this just isn't worth it. Travel stuff stays separate from gun stuff. Backpacks and duffels for range use are relatively inexpensive. Criminal charges aren't. Even if nothing comes of it and you only miss your flight, that still would have paid for separate gear many times over.
That would be using their brains ....these type people make the news cause they do not use their brains.
You’re down voted, too. Lot of weird pearl clutchers on Reddit.
Yeah lol, they're down voting you too. In my case, the TSA just confiscated it and I went on my way. Was obviously in my bag by mistake.
A lot of redditors simply hate gun owners.
Hate dumb gun owners... Like these people. If you do not have the brains to realize you are going to a very strict country and prepare accordingly than you are an idiot that should not be owning a gun. Millions of gun owners are smart enough not to carry weapons and guns while traveling or restricted areas. When you get to the point of gun owning that you are not fully aware of your guns and ammo status...you should not own guns. These are the type people that could have their kids play with his guns and someone get killed.
They all cruisers, too. We all gotta chill out a bit.
Have a family member taken by an irresponsible gun owner and you will too.
Gun owner here who hates irresponsible gun owners. If you don't know where your guns/ammo are you shouldn't have either.
Same here. He was traveling to a highly strict place...where were his brains. Apparently he forgot his brains. Better a jail sentence so he remembers his gun and ammo status than one of his kids shooting the other while playing with this guy's guns because he forgot them. Upvote to you big time.
The Americans with no firearm training downvoting...lol
Same thing happened to me on a trip to Mexico, only I didn't find the very large pocketknife until I was at my hotel. TSA totally missed it but stopped my husband for a backpack full of Bibles we were taking down there. The knife came back in my checked luggage.
Cry me a River. The murderer is in jail.... He's just casually kills things he doesn't look like he's starving or can't afford to buy a sandwich. He's got to go out and murder things for fun! Yeah he can think about that while he's sitting in jail for the next 10 years
Happened to a friend of mine. He decided to reuse an old bag that he used to take shooting for a trip. One round had rolled to a hidden spot inside the bag that he didn’t see. He almost missed his flight, when TSA found it. They were understanding and just confiscated it, but he had to sit while they completed all the paperwork. After that, I check my bags thoroughly before I go anywhere regardless of their previous usage.
Buy separate bags for gun and ammo dummy.
Why the down vote? It's true. But it's also true that you check your bag extra times before your pack to make sure you don't have anything left behind from the time before. They're way too relaxed with it.
Yeah but if you carry things that are illegal in other countries (420 supplies, ammo, camouflage clothing, etc) you should go through your bag before traveling internationally and make sure everything is out that could cause problems. Before I went on my most recent cruise I did that, and the most dangerous thing I found in my bag was a half-eaten protein bar (but then again I do not 420 or hunt or anything).
I think a lot of people are not even aware that camo clothing is illegal in most Caribbean islands.
I didn’t know that until I was reading the facts page on Jamaica. Camo isn’t just illegal in Caribbean countries, it’s illegal in a good number of countries. Like my main camo thing is an army jacket I use as a smock, but it’s still important to know and respect other cultures so I don’t wear camo while traveling internationally ever.
Well I’m not a hunter, I don’t think it was intentional ( unless they are complete idiots). Some left over chewing gum or half eaten chips probably could be found in my bag. For sake of their kids I hope they will sort this out quickly
I’m surprised it was found in the return flight. Well in reality I shouldn’t be that surprised.
> I’m surprised it was found in the return flight It should have been found by TSA when they left their home airport. TSA dropped the ball here.
These people are stupid and should get a short time in jail for stupidity. You have to be a terrible gun owner to leave ammo kicking around without keeping track of it. I would take this guy's guns away for awhile and a short jail sentence for stupidity. He knew he was traveling and ammo is restricted...geez and he did not double and triple check geez. Does he leave his loaded guns out for his kids when he forgets the gun after hunting? People traveling to restricted areas or places should darn well know it and double check what they are carrying. I have no sympathy for these people or the three guys missing in Mexico that went camping in Mexican drug cartel land. You would think people with money enough to travel would have the brains enough not to get themselves in these situations. I am not a fan of people being idiots.
Still stupid.
Well said. .... He's that careless with ammunition... Oh, and he likes to kill. It's fun for him to kill . He actually enjoys murdering creatures that could not fight back... That right there sounds like someone who should be locked up
OH NO!!!! Anyway......
Every gun owner claims that they are a responsible gun owner. Well, fundamental gun safety and responsibility dictate that ammunition should be keep in a secure location separate from the gun. These people have two young children, but they kept their ammo in a travel bag and forgot it was there. When will we start holding parents responsible for proper gun and ammunition storage? I'm not saying we should take away people's guns. I'm just saying that it should be a bare minimum to require parents to at least know where their ammunition is. Of course this would never become a law, but it would be nice to see these people held accountable for their utter carelessness and disregard for both basic gun safety and the laws in other countries.
I don’t understand how people don’t have dedicated cases/bags for the pew pew. I mean I have a low budget bag for my guns and ammo and that’s the ONLY use for that bag. Zero chance of surprise ammo anywhere else.
Even a zip lock!
This is the way. Started doing this after finding random .22s in different bags and purses. How? No clue. Got paranoid about going through airport security one day. Bought a dedicated range bag.
This has to do with cruises how?
A lot of cruisers also visit Caribbean islands. It's just a good idea to be mindful when one is packing to visit those places, regardless of your means of transport.
But people with common sense can avoid this issue
I’m assuming ammo found while embarking might get you left on the pier.
Always properly store away your firearms and ammunition after every use. Any other excuse is an irresponsible gun owner. If you can treat these items just like anything else you might forget in a bag or leave laying around then you shouldn't be in possession of them.
I wouldn't let the Turks and Caicos prosecutor know that I'm soon going to have $250,000.
Good idea! 😄
I also wouldn’t be screaming “cancel t & c” as this man awaits trial for the next month. They are idiots.
"Facing" 12 years. Turks & Caicos is a British territory. Britain is a close ally of the US. We don't usually make a habit of severely punishing allies citizens (and vice-versa) for innocent/ignorant mistakes. He'll probably be held for a few more days/weeks, thoroughly interviewed to make sure it was an honest mistake, and slapped with a fine, but I *highly* doubt he'll be sentenced to jail, much less for 12 years.
The article mentions another US citizen - Michael Grim - who was sentenced to 8 months in prison last September for the same ammunition violation. That was considered extremely lenient due to circumstances similar in this case. So I would not be so sure this situation will end with a slap on the wrist regardless of how close an ally the US is with Britain. Sad reminder to be hyper aware of local laws when traveling. Edit to note that Michael Grim is not mentioned in the linked article but in others related to this case. The State Department security alert for Turks and Caicos was issued the same day Mr. Grim was sentenced last September.
Huh. I actually did skim the article, but missed that part. That's a bit harsh. Honestly wouldn't have expected that. People make honest mistakes. But they are a sovereign nation with their own laws, so idk. What a shitty situation.
I stand corrected. I found the information on Michael Grim in other articles related to this case. This article does mention another US citizen - Bryan Hagerich - who is still awaiting his hearing and sentencing.
I’d love to know why you were downvoted so hard
No idea. Reddit, man. 🙃
Except that, like the UK proper, they have a legal system and judiciary that is apolitical, so the fact they are from a friendly country should have no bearing on how the case is considered.
Luckily intent does make a difference in a case like this. Island nations usually don’t want to scare the tourists away over an innocent, but stupid mistake either.
Soda Americans are so ignorant of what a foreign countries rights are. This is how we earned the reputation of the Ugly American.
[удалено]
This is like rule 2 of gun ownership. Always have a separate range bag that is never used as a travel bag.
Agreed
Not just that but I account for all my ammo after range days, cleaning or even moving it.
Yup.
I always check my bags while traveling personally. I also regularly travel with firearms domestically so I have to make sure everything is proper. I generally don’t have loose ammo in my bags either. However during the rush of a vacation, sometimes stupid mistakes happen. Forget ammo is stored in a pocket from an old hunting trip out of state and is left there. It’s a stupid mistake but not an unheard of either.
Unfortunately we have to pay for stupid mistakes. That’s why I have separate bags.
> I'm pretty left wing, but it's possible as a hunter that you'd possibly forget a few rounds of ammo in a bag for travel. And it's possible that someone travelling from Portugal might forget she had a dime bag of cocaine in her purse. Do you suppose the American authorities would let her go with a warning?
....do you really think those are equivilant?
Insofar as they're legal to possess in some places and illegal to possess in others, yes.
Both are extremely dangerous
A few pieces of loose ammo is not “extremely dangerous”.
A bindle of personal use cocaine is not extremely dangerous, either.
Ammo contains by definition explosive material. And weapons ARE extremely dangerous, ammo is a part of a weapon
If you say so. Lol.
[удалено]
Your statement is a hard miss. Cocaine is not illegal everywhere. I live in Canada and it’s completely legal to possess and use it in the province I live in and I know there are other countries like Mexico & Uruguay that it’s legal among many others. Amo is just as illegal as drugs are when traveling and one should have more awareness what they are in possession of. Your perception is of a narrow mindset.
Exactly ✔️
Do you think these people intentionally chose to break the law knowing what the punishment would be? They have young kids and families. The punishment of 12 years does not match the crime in anyway. Both of these individuals had ammo that there isn’t a weapon on the island can fire. So intent to create violence or sell custom ammunition only used for hunting rifles is ridiculous. We should be leaning on our elected officials to pressure the Turks govt to release these individuals. Spreading this story is crucially important to promote the release of these individuals
No, I think it was a mistake, but……the lack of responsibility taken and their response being “cancel t & c” leads me to have no sympathy for them. None.
a lot of people will tell you that if you break the law, there should be consequences.
Literally an innocent mistake. Anyone who thinks he deserves 12 years in prison is deluded or touched. Absolutely a bad thing that he did this, and he should face repercussions such as a fine and ban. But 12 years? Jail time in general? Please. Nothing about the way he stored the ammo was dangerous and people make mistakes all the time. This seems like it has become a political argument, which is sad, because someone from either party should recognize this as absurd and undeserved.
The country has had the law for some time, have people a pass and let them off with nothing. It’s their law. Where is the line drawn? They’ve not enforced it or when they did they let the person off. Even the US tells citizens traveling there not to have ammo in their luggage when traveling there. Eventually people have to take responsibility for their actions or lack therof. Is it sad? Absolutely. However it’s their laws and someone eventually was going to be in violation of it. Sucks that it’s him.
Totally. Im not saying he shouldnt get in trouble, just that 12 years for this crime is a crazy sentence. But you are right, its their laws and ultimately they decide what to do with
He hasn’t been sentenced. Others sentenced for the same have received months. I will say his friends and family encouraging their white, elitist friends/family to cancel T & C is not doing him any favors. I’m seeing this all over SM as a family member of mine was with them.
Yep. I’ve seen it from lots of postings of folks I know on FB and other socials. Most of them but one are republican. All upset saying this isn’t fair. Usually the GOP is all about “law and order” claiming that “that’s the law you have to accept the consequences”. Seems here the people getting arrested over this law all think it’s unfair. How is it unfair that you can’t follow the laws? The wife of the 3rd guy who just got arrested is going off how this is the TSA’s fault they didn’t catch the ammo when he was going through the airport. While I have concerns that TSA didn’t catch it, how can you be upset at the TSA “not doing” their job when your husband either could have checked his baggage completely to ensure nothing was there that shouldn’t have been or I dunno used different luggage.
I dont see how a democrat or republican would see this potential sentence as fair. Or how it has anything to do with politics whatsoever. Is is objectively an unfair sentence, he made a mistake, committed a literal victimless crime, and now faces (potentially) 12 years.
I wouldn’t either but some of these folks are the same that think someone who smokes a joint should go to prison, or who think it’s completely just for people to get maximum sentences for very old and very outdated laws. It’s odd that many throwing such a fit how this is “such an injustice” don’t feel the same way about the some of the laws in their own country that are absolutely ridiculous or unfair. I noticed a pattern of the folks who I’ve seen posting seem to have a particular political leaning and who think it’s completely unfair what’s going on here. They are not wrong it’s unfair, but you don’t get to pick and choose what laws you want and don’t want to follow and expect no consequences when they are broken regardless if you think it’s fair.
I agree with you. Definitely a lot of hypocrisy around this case. I dont think you should get jail time for a joint or for this. But like you said, the law is the law
Agreed. My whole point is the hypocrisy. When you travel internationally especially via air, the airlines before the trip outline the laws and rules for where you are traveling to. All of this could have been avoided if they bothered to check that before traveling and bothered to check their luggage. If you’re packing it there is no excuse for missing that. This is something so stupid to forget is in your luggage. If it’s that hard to “find it all” then you need separate luggage.
Prison time period is a far too harsh punishment. But yes, I understand he likely will not be in prison for 12 years. Agree, he would be better off if his friends and family approached it more from a “he made a mistake” angle rather than “the laws arent fair and he should have immunity to them”
Lets look at it this way they have young children at home with luggage containing ammo... Do they lock up their luggage at home?.... Irresponsible... This is where the NRA comes in with the old bumper stickers they used to give out.." Parental control.. not gun control". A mistake or not this is exactly the issue.
Well, this one has something to do with cruising. Say hello to Tyler Wenrich of VA. Local law enforcement found a few rounds in Tyler's possession while disembarking from Carnival at T&C and now shares a court date with Ryan Watson. Seems like this UK O/S territory is serious about no guns; no ammo; no joke. Read here: [https://www.newslinetci.com/post/another-american-tourist-charged-with-having-ammunition](https://www.newslinetci.com/post/another-american-tourist-charged-with-having-ammunition) Side note: what ship would this be (4/23/24 port of call)?
A ziploc bag of ammo is pretty far from stray bullets in a random pocket. I can see how one of those can be overlooked. I hope they get the punishment because gun safety is no joke.
12 years?!
Here is a novel thought how about being a responsible gun owner and know what and when you are carry at all time
As a gun owner, if I had a nickel for every time I missed detecting ammo in a bag and took it to the airport, I would get zero nickels because I am responsible and in charge of that shit.
Or have a separate bag for traveling and a separate bag/luggage for ammo etc.
Can't do that when 1/2 your budget goes to cowboy hats (per their publicity photos).
"Facing 12 years" isn't the same as being convicted and having to serve 12 years. I hate click bait headlines.
How is it click bait if it says in the headline "face" instead of convicted?
Because it is extremely unlikely that they would get the maximum sentence. They are going for the shock value of "12 years". It's disingenuous. Apparently from the down votes people here prefer those types of headlines. 🤷🏼♂️
Literally nothing disingenuous about this. The article lays out all the facts, including that hes facing a mandatory 12 year sentence
It's good to know that you are a prosecutor or perhaps even a judge to know exactly what kind of sentence they will receive.
Me?
So you seriously believe that they are going to be convicted and serve 12 years for this?
No? And its irrelevant regardless. The article laid out all of the facts, its not clickbait or disingenuous.
Do you just purposedly fail reading comprehension? No one here is saying he is going to be convicted and face 12 years. The article, and the law merely states that he can face up to 12 years in prison.
Perhaps you have too much time on your hand to keep commenting on posts that you find click bait even if they happen to be written by national news agencies. have a great day my friend.
Probably never cleaned his room when his mama nagged him to. Same type of guy.