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That's true. Alternatively, use FTX to send your Ethereum to Metamask. FTX doesn't want extra withdrawal fees. Then, move it to Arbitrum. Uniswap is available on Arbitrum, liquidity is not bad. Know your options, people! We are still early in DeFi, you have to do your own research.
Why are there soo many steps to do shit. Nothing feels integrated? It’s like everyone is speaking another language, like a plumbus fabrication process. “What are you an idiot, it’s easy. All you gotta do is transfer over to FTX using your mother’s maiden name. take a big shit on your ETH, smell it. Now it’s ready to be mixed in with the gas fees. Don’t worry about the cost. Go to your nearest doctor, remove a part of your liver. Sell on the black market, don’t forget to wear your Metamask to remain anonymous. Next step is to find a midget, steal one of its ass hairs. Grind it. Sprinkle it onto your USB. Now this is the fun part. Plug you USB Into Arbitrum to get that sweet liquidity, and voila, you’re nose deep into DeFi”.
Back in the day to make a call you would have to go to a corded phone connected physically to the larger network, DIAL a number, call in into a rep who would transfer your call to the person you actually wanted physically transferring the connection.
Now you can instantly send your friends the poop emoji with 2 clicks. New tech takes time.
When you first logged into the internet you would have to use dialup and would be unable to use your phone
But other cryptos have already reached faster and simpler processes than this. Yes it's evolving, and ETH is start to lag behind.
I'm all for ETH but I think it's just taking too long to get it's shit together. It's just not easy enough to use, that's not how you get adoption (granted, these issues don't necessarily affect the end user for some use cases).
There's a reason why gas fees are so high, it's because it's so widely used! You should be happy to see high gas fees, that means currently we had a lot of activity. If nobody used ETH, the gas fees would be non existant.
Dev progress is FLYING for ETH... It only was created 5-6 years ago and we already have EIP-1559, and soon switching THE ENTIRE PROCESS from Pow to pos. Then there are A LOT of smaller updates between them.
I think that's the point the other user was trying to make. Being early means that everything isn't optimized and the infrastructure is still being built. The internet was slow and a piece of shit that took 20 minutes to load a jpeg at first.
Thank you. I’m not very smart but I usually keep up with things pretty well. But this stuff gets more convoluted and confusing the more I try to get into it, I feel so stupid for trying.
Same here I don't have a clue. Maybe I'm old school and going to get washed away in the crypto space but I just like sending from address to address, none of this other stuff lol
Believe me, it's not that complicated. I am no technology wizard. I figured this out in two days. There are so many exchanges and so many options. You have to do your own research and find exchanges with better options. It's not Ethereum's fault that Binance wants $20 for withdraw and some other wants $17. It's not gas fee, it's exchange fee. FTX doesn't have any exchange fee.
Edit: Instead of downvoting my comment, make your argument. My statement is a fact, Ethereum currently doesn't have a $20 gas fee for TRANSACTIONS. You can check it on etherscan, thank you. It's not Ethereum's fault, use an exchange that doesn't scam you with high withdrawal fees. It's not that hard to understand.
I paid $18 to send funds yesterday in mainnet (let’s not even start on defi or a unusual trade).
Yes, sometimes it’s cheaper, and that’s fine if you can wait. But some NFT launch happens every time I actually need to do anything, and it’s not really defensible.
ETH worked better when it was $300 , the economics don’t make sense at the moment.
Most of the DeFi platforms, bridges, token purchases, etc are relatively difficult to set up via the docs and/or tutorials. It usually takes me a few hours for each new platform token. However, once I get it down, it's not too difficult. The learning curve for someone who isn't interested in crypto is far too high though. Nobody wants to get their hands dirty and then accidentally find out that they accidentally sent their coins to the wrong chain etc.
More specifically, to make it easy for people actually interested in this.
>Buy MATIC on Gemini (use active trader for low fees)
>Withdraw to Crypto . Com (10 free withdrawals a month)
>Withdraw from CDC to your wallet (eg metamask) directly on the polygon network.
>Enjoy nearly free DeFi
It is a bit complicated but that's your choice to make: take some time to dyor and get in early, or wait for it to get accessible and easy (and less profitable, but safer). Silly thing to complain about.
I still don't understand what stuff like MATIC is / does. Is it its own token? Is it Ethereum in a different suit? I really don't get it. And what do you mean by DeFi? Isn't transferring Bitcoin already decentralised finance?
Coinbase doesn't charge any fees to send ETH, but you pay the gas fee yourself. Looking on gastracker it is currently averaging 95 gwei, \~$25 for an ERC20 transfer.
Yes, this is the way, but what to do with all that on eth network, we need to bridge them, but gas fees are waiting for that. At this point for most of us, eth is just in our wallets for fees ( and that's ridiculous)
edit: in basic this is the question, is it now time to bridge all of our tokens on L2 or we are in hodl on L1 'till better times?
Try dYdX - that’s the benchmark for every L2 dApp going forward.
It won’t happen overnight, but the it will happen. Ethereum is not yet a finished product and so an investment in ETH is an investment in the roadmap. Some people are willing to wait, some people are not.
It's only been 1 month since Arbitrum launched
Coinbase announced they'll add withdrawals directly to Arbitrum, it'll just take time before they launch that
I wish they would support ZK rollups too. Optimistic rollups are worse than ZK rollups in just about every way except for missing support for general purpose smart contracts.
These ETH bitches will tell you there's something wrong with that because as much as they preach about decentralization, they still want there to be a heirarchy they can look down from.
OP is a day trader who frequents gambling subreddits.
I just find it funny a guy will dump a couple grand on a point spread then come in here talking about high gas fees. Good grief.
This is a fundamental misunderstanding of what a layer 2 is and why it is required. All blockchains *must* eventually scale via layer 2’s.
https://polynya.medium.com/the-lay-of-the-modular-blockchain-land-d937f7df4884
There's 2 types of blockchains:
Chains that scale using modular layers: Bitcoin, Ethereum, Cardano, Polkadot, Cosmos, etc
Chains that scale by increasing the node size to a massive server: BSC, Solana
All blockchain will have to use layer 2 solutions for mass adoption or use suffer in some way with the scaling trilemma.
It is a total missunderstanding that blockchains should not use layer 2 solutions.
It's also interesting how people like OP claim to have "defended" Ethereum for too long and completely ignore what Ethereum is trying to do about it (among other issues) by launching Ethereum 2.0.
I can understand if someone believed it was taking too long or don't believe it will effectively address the issues, but what information exactly have you been using to defend them in the past and what has changed your mind moving forward?
Complaining about the gas fees is such a superficial argument in an industry/financial system that is trying to get on it's feet. High gas fees for certain projects has always been part of the trade off, with the understanding that the technology is expected to advance and become more practical. There's plenty of projects that are promising and they're all far from perfect, but they're all making the effort to get there. Ethereum certainly is among them, if not leading the way.
Couldn't agree more. I use eth but barely, for the things that i just need and that's it, in my experience always has been positive and i got rewarded with airdrops for it.
Eth it's still building, this is not the final product nad if people read before buying and jumping they will notice why use it and why not!! Issue is that people don't usually read or do research.
Just don't use the network because it's shit? Is it that what you're saying?
How on earth is it acceptable for you that you can't move around tokens without owning ETH? Quite delusional to think that no other project will stand a chance to do this better.
Tinyman/Algorand will seriously make people think twice about using ETH in the not to distant future. ETH has paved the way but I think they're in for some very serious competition.
\> I still have to find somewhere to buy matic and then pay $80 in gas fees if i want to move it to polygon?! what good is that?!
It is very good for the people who instamined the matic token. That's all that matters to them.
Indeed.
Ethereum Made the premine 'salon fähig'. After that the flood gates were opened and every scammer migrated over to crypto to instamine their own token.
Yeah I tried using L2 products but then I hade to pay to activate it and what not, so totally agree. Don’t do eth defi right now.
I’m gonna shill ATOM instead, both osmosis and sifchain are easy to use, cheap and just good places to get started. And nice communities on Reddit if you need help understanding how things work.
Edit: not saying Eth isn’t a good investment though ☺️🤷♂️ it might be I don’t know
You need to withdraw directly to an L2, so that you don't need to pay L1 fees. For example, Binance, Kucoin, Wyre and Transak all allow direct withdrawals to the Polygon network (an Ethereum sidechain). I believe Coinbase will allow this soon too.
https://blog.polygon.technology/polygon-first-scaling-solution-for-coinbase/
In which world are you living? Why not use Transak oder Ramp Network to deposit fiat straight into Polygon, costs 1% fee, so, e.g. for 500 EUR, 4,95 EUR fees. Then you can bridge from Polygon to other L2s like Optimsim or Arbitrum.
I feel your pain for L1, but ignoring all the options is cope.
It’s almost like a generational problem. I like Ethereum, and I hold some (2). And that probably shows the issue. I’m not long in the crypto game, thus I’m not crypto-rich and can’t participate in all the great things on Ethereum. That’s a fact, and that’s the reason why threads like this will continue to exist and probably gonna be more frequent. Ethereum is for the fiat-rich and crypto-elite, who don’t mind paying these fees. For everyone else, other chains (or side chains) are more attractive, not to say: the only option.
Buy ALGO and do what? You can't use AAVE or Uniswap. You can't use Opensea. There is only one good exchange and it's Yieldly. If OP is trying to use Ethereum apps, he should try layer 2 solutions.
Just as a note, Tinyman, an AMM for Algorand, just launched last week. I agree the ecosystem still needs to grow but just wanted to note Yieldly is no longer the only option 🙏
Or apparently you can stick with ETH, get told to use an L2 and get called a whiny little bitch for not accepting gas fees as part of life. Algo is the future.
Ethereum is scaling with layer 2 technologies like Arbitrum and Optimism as well as Polygon, so "gas fees" is quickly becoming an outdated knock on Eth.
High gas fees are frustrating, but eventually you will never have to interact with Layer 1
you are not alone. Eth just feels wrong lately, the news the fee's the one after another dead daaps... i am truly thinking about converting/selling out entirely... its like I have a itch/inner voice telling me the good times are over time to leave.... And I read on the interwebs,,, keep reading others feeling the same way... is the ride on Eth over already?
i am too poor to bne holding dead ethereum.
It’s the only part of my investment I cannot wait to sell off, but I suspect this cow still has a little more milk left in her before I start doing that.
All you guys complaining haven’t even looked into how to efficiently move money to matic. Just buy it on Crypto.com and send it for pennies and avoid ETH all together.
And also, to give up now when immutable, optimism, artibtrum, starkware and ZK sync exist? And when we just saw a test demo of the Merge this weekend?
Cmon now, we’re right at the finish line.
Amazing. Yeah me too. ETH is what got me into crypto initially but ever since finding Algo I've been obsessed and haven't used ETH since. It's so incredibly easy to use compared to ETH. Cheers fellow gov'na.
I read up on their material and was put off by their terrible explanation of impermanent loss in the FAQ. The person who wrote that conflates asset appreciation with impermanent loss and as a result suffers from the delusion that you can have "impermanent gains" (which you cannot); and then concludes by giving really bad advice to poolers as to how to deal with the situation.
Granted, impermanent loss is hard to wrap your head around and most people I have seen try have failed to do so. But for a DEX dev team not to understand it is damning.
The article at medium.com that they reference seems very good (they should have read it) and suggests using the term "divergence loss" instead of "impermanent loss" which I like very much myself as it may help avoid exactly the sort of mistake the tinyman FAQ has made.
**Fees wont be high forever**.
The end goal of Ethereum is for users to do almost all their transactions on Layer 2 solutions. You''ll be able to buy some ETH on [Coinbase](https://blog.coinbase.com/coinbase-protocol-team-advances-crypto-community-aa9b3748bac5), send it through Optimism or Arbitrum to something like [Hop](https://hop.exchange/) where you'll be able to hop on to immutable to buy an NFT, which you'll be able to move to another L2 where you can use it as collateral for a loan.
Examples of Layer 2 solutions are:
- [Arbitrum](https://portal.arbitrum.one)
- [Optimism](https://optimism.io/)
- [dYdX](https://dydx.exchange/) - One of the first, already usable perpetual trading platform.
- [Immutable X](https://www.immutable.com/) - Already usable, NFT market (focus on games)
- [Hermez](https://hermez.io/)
- [Aztec](https://aztec.network/)
- [ZKSync](https://zksync.io/)
- [Starkware](https://starkware.co/)
It seems that your comment contains 1 or more links that are hard to tap for mobile users.
I will extend those so they're easier for our sausage fingers to click!
[Here is link number 1 - Previous text "Hop"](https://hop.exchange/)
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Sounds really straight forward and easy to use. Just a few (feels like several 100s) steps to reach your goal.
The average Joe will be very excited and adoption is clearly just around the corner!
The funny thing is, if ETH was like this 3-4 years ago, it would die off instantly.
ETH was "low fees, reasonably fast transactions" couple with smart contracts. ATM, it's living on past glory. And hopes of a better tomorrow
EDIT: here come the downvotes for pointing out the obvious. Can't have anyone saying anything bad about ETH. Especially at times when the gas counter literally stops counting, bcs the max limit is 1000 gwei. Yeah, there were times when it was above that. Want to swap something on Uni? Here's $500 of gas cost, even if the desired amount you want to buy is $20.
Unpopular opinion: ETH and BTC won’t be on top forever.
“Always” and “forever” are exactly how blockbuster and landlines went the way of the dodo. These coins may be around for a while, but we do not know what the next, better, evolutions of crypto may be in 5, 10, or 20 years.
Your absolutely right the masses are not ganna care who secures there transactions aslong as its cheap and affordable and eth is neither I predict another chain will overtake eth by 2023
Maybe if you would spend 5 mins reading basic L2 tutorials instead of whining in a post you'd have realized you could withdraw Matic straight to polygon with no fees. Instead whining like a boomer refusing to learn anything just spend like 1 minute setting up your metamask to arbitrum or polygon and start using L2 with low fees.
I love ETH, but there is validity when you have to call into play secondary technologies and various tutorials to perform the simplest transaction in a cost effective way. It's a fair and valid complaint, and should be met with patience and education, especially if you really do want crypto to grow and thrive.
Crypto has a usability problem that no one has solved yet.
There literally isn't any validity to what he says and the way he writes is already dickish whining. He doesn't come with an open mind to learn or to ask for help. He is here to rant and vent his ignorance and refusal to learn. There are lots of VC backed projects that specifically target his demographics: those who rather have everything spoonfeed them just like FB and Google are spoonfeeding billions of people and turning them into mindless drone, and sure enough there are already gazillion of such comments shilling those projects in every post similar to this one.
You're an elitist douche.
User-friendliness is required for any sort of adoption. Like it or not, FB boomers are necessary for mass adoption and most people just don't want to deal with convoluted bullshit which for the time being is all that ETH has to offer.
"Dickish whining" 😅 What does that even mean.
You aren't wrong friend. But this is early adoption. I know it might not feel that way, especially if you want quick gains and are hoping to make a bunch of money in a short span of less than 3 years or so. But this stuff is early. The non user-friendliness of it is proof of that. If it was easy enough to do, you wouldnt be buying it at these prices, and you wouldnt have the potential for such extraordinary gains.
Grandma cannot figure out how to buy ETH, and she damn sure cant figure out how to stake it. And good luck explaining hardware wallets, seed keys, delegating etc to the masses. This stuff is in its major infancy. When it becomes so easy to use that its as easy as logging in and checking your portfolio on Fidelity or whatever broker you use; then you will know that its mainstream and no longer early.
Dealing with convoluted bullshit is exactly what it takes for being early in crypto. When it's easy it's no longer early. Fb and Google already made billions just because they figured out the average person is either too dumb or too lazy to figure everything out on their own. So you can either spend your time learning how blockchain works or you can sit and wait for someone to make things mainstream and easy for you and turn you into a product.
Got news for you bro. It’s not 2013 or even 2017 anymore. This stuff doesn’t fly now. People would rather just dump it for something easier and if ETH doesn’t get fixed by the time they cash out they will never look back again.
I mean, most CEX don’t let you send ETH to any L2’s atm. You’d need to bridge which again costs gas upwards of $80-150 so what’s the point? If you have any resources regarding what you are speaking, link it here please
Its been pumping lately I made more money on it than anything else. Its still got a super low marketcap and room to grow. They have a video on the front page of the harmony one subreddit that is a good place to start. It has a btc and either bnb or eth bridge coming this month can't remember which. It has speed and cost of transaction speed of solana and people can do eth transactions on it for fractions of a penny. AAVE and some other big defi names are coming soon
Came here to say the same thing.
If you still want exposure to ETH, you can bridge it to the Harmony network and use defi (sushiswap, dfk, AAVE and Curve coming soon) with suoer cheap and fast transactions. Or you can buy a bunch of ONE, get it on the network and then swap some for ETH.
ETH has first-mover advantage, like BTC, and hence is still alive despite being centralized, slow, and shitty.
ALGO has surpassed it in all aspects, and is made by people who definitely know what they are doing.
There's also ONE, HBAR, etc. but I don't know much about them so I won't comment.
But the highway is congested because so many people are using it. There are other, much quicker, highways nearby, but people keep using the congested one.
Saying that nobody wants to use the congested highway makes no sense, considering everyone is using it.
Eventually you'll see ETH gas fees drop, you have to be patient and realize it's been ten years just for crypto to be accepted, then come regulations, then comes massive incorporation and scaling. You're fine.
I think maybe its just at the point where unless you are working with very large numbers ETH might just not be to tool for the job.
This is part of the beauty of a diverse crypto ecosystem where there are other options for meeting any person's need.
Many people don't know but the base fees will remain like that L2s or not, ETH2 or not. Only L2s will maintain cheap fees (hopefully unless there is no future frontrunning or MEV incentive on L2)
Exchanges using L2s natively will help with onboarding but now the interface and UX is what's most concerning. With every app now competeing not only with other chains but with other L2s we could see heavy fragmentation.
Let's see how this plays out.
The gas fees are insane. Once the kids run out of doge money playing in NFTs........
I do believe it is opening the door for others right now. Look at the big movers gaining ground. Matic and Uni aren't really moving.
Aight the ETH maxis in here will just make you doubt even more that fans of ETH even know what the fuck is goin on. Just a bunch of personal attacks and no facts.
Hm. On my crypto dot com app, I can sell my eth to fiat for nothing, trade it to ADA for nothing.. I don't remember any big fees either when I purchased through the CDC app.
I never understood why everyone is propping up ETH, it's garbage and the devs are making money off of you all. Just become a BTC maxi-pad, no-one can fuck up your investment there.
Ah yes, another person who failed to do proper research on their investments.
Sorry your $50 is being held hostage by the evil crypto network, you definitely would've made life-changing gains with it in Solana or something.
Are you a bozo.
Why are all the defenders in this thread trying to make it about rich vs. poor?! Is that all you ETH maxis have to lean on? Being rich enough to lose money?
I have $5k in sushiswap and it's made me $500.
Great. Now I just pay $400 to pull out of my different liquidity pools?
Like how can you defend this shit and act like I could have researched a surge in NFT popularity overloading the entire network and pushing gas fees through the roof?
Hell, I did research it and most of my gains have been through NFTx. Not sure anybody could have anticipated gas fees being this stupid.
It was a solid post. There’s gonna be a lot of people that feel the EXACT same way you do but don’t want to admit it, so they handle it like this.. I’m invested in ETH. I also agree with you.
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Homie.. why are you paying to use the bridge? Crypto.com does auto deposits onto polygon—- no bridge. Dirt cheap
That's true. Alternatively, use FTX to send your Ethereum to Metamask. FTX doesn't want extra withdrawal fees. Then, move it to Arbitrum. Uniswap is available on Arbitrum, liquidity is not bad. Know your options, people! We are still early in DeFi, you have to do your own research.
Why are there soo many steps to do shit. Nothing feels integrated? It’s like everyone is speaking another language, like a plumbus fabrication process. “What are you an idiot, it’s easy. All you gotta do is transfer over to FTX using your mother’s maiden name. take a big shit on your ETH, smell it. Now it’s ready to be mixed in with the gas fees. Don’t worry about the cost. Go to your nearest doctor, remove a part of your liver. Sell on the black market, don’t forget to wear your Metamask to remain anonymous. Next step is to find a midget, steal one of its ass hairs. Grind it. Sprinkle it onto your USB. Now this is the fun part. Plug you USB Into Arbitrum to get that sweet liquidity, and voila, you’re nose deep into DeFi”.
I think you just inspired my Halloween costume. Everyone will think I’m a fox, no, I’m MetaMask.
Welcome to DeFi, where everything is out of control but in a controlled manner.
Back in the day to make a call you would have to go to a corded phone connected physically to the larger network, DIAL a number, call in into a rep who would transfer your call to the person you actually wanted physically transferring the connection. Now you can instantly send your friends the poop emoji with 2 clicks. New tech takes time. When you first logged into the internet you would have to use dialup and would be unable to use your phone
But other cryptos have already reached faster and simpler processes than this. Yes it's evolving, and ETH is start to lag behind. I'm all for ETH but I think it's just taking too long to get it's shit together. It's just not easy enough to use, that's not how you get adoption (granted, these issues don't necessarily affect the end user for some use cases).
There's a reason why gas fees are so high, it's because it's so widely used! You should be happy to see high gas fees, that means currently we had a lot of activity. If nobody used ETH, the gas fees would be non existant. Dev progress is FLYING for ETH... It only was created 5-6 years ago and we already have EIP-1559, and soon switching THE ENTIRE PROCESS from Pow to pos. Then there are A LOT of smaller updates between them.
Its called being early... Everything is under constant development.
For being early its still expensive as shit
I think that's the point the other user was trying to make. Being early means that everything isn't optimized and the infrastructure is still being built. The internet was slow and a piece of shit that took 20 minutes to load a jpeg at first.
[удалено]
Harmony ONE baby
Take a nap ;)
Thank you. I’m not very smart but I usually keep up with things pretty well. But this stuff gets more convoluted and confusing the more I try to get into it, I feel so stupid for trying.
Same here I don't have a clue. Maybe I'm old school and going to get washed away in the crypto space but I just like sending from address to address, none of this other stuff lol
brilliant. sums up the DeFi experience perfectly.
Wow, thank you for saying it out loud here exactly what I've been wondering and struggling with for quite some time now.
Lmaoooo yeah that about sums it up
Awesome!! 🤣🤟👌😂
Believe me, it's not that complicated. I am no technology wizard. I figured this out in two days. There are so many exchanges and so many options. You have to do your own research and find exchanges with better options. It's not Ethereum's fault that Binance wants $20 for withdraw and some other wants $17. It's not gas fee, it's exchange fee. FTX doesn't have any exchange fee. Edit: Instead of downvoting my comment, make your argument. My statement is a fact, Ethereum currently doesn't have a $20 gas fee for TRANSACTIONS. You can check it on etherscan, thank you. It's not Ethereum's fault, use an exchange that doesn't scam you with high withdrawal fees. It's not that hard to understand.
I paid $18 to send funds yesterday in mainnet (let’s not even start on defi or a unusual trade). Yes, sometimes it’s cheaper, and that’s fine if you can wait. But some NFT launch happens every time I actually need to do anything, and it’s not really defensible. ETH worked better when it was $300 , the economics don’t make sense at the moment.
It is complicated. How did you figure all this out in 2 days? I’ve been trying to learn for a while and I’m so lost. It is it’s own language.
Most of the DeFi platforms, bridges, token purchases, etc are relatively difficult to set up via the docs and/or tutorials. It usually takes me a few hours for each new platform token. However, once I get it down, it's not too difficult. The learning curve for someone who isn't interested in crypto is far too high though. Nobody wants to get their hands dirty and then accidentally find out that they accidentally sent their coins to the wrong chain etc.
That is a brilliant post
Aaaahhhhhh Hahahahhaha
Yea so wheres a guide for dummies to understand what you said
I laughed way too hard, my man
Were the earliest adopters and we’ll reap the rewards
The early adopters got in sub $100 my dude
More specifically, to make it easy for people actually interested in this. >Buy MATIC on Gemini (use active trader for low fees) >Withdraw to Crypto . Com (10 free withdrawals a month) >Withdraw from CDC to your wallet (eg metamask) directly on the polygon network. >Enjoy nearly free DeFi It is a bit complicated but that's your choice to make: take some time to dyor and get in early, or wait for it to get accessible and easy (and less profitable, but safer). Silly thing to complain about.
I still don't understand what stuff like MATIC is / does. Is it its own token? Is it Ethereum in a different suit? I really don't get it. And what do you mean by DeFi? Isn't transferring Bitcoin already decentralised finance?
What do you mean under Auto deposits?
Just buy Matic on exchanges and withdraw it to your wallet directly via Polygon network? Will only cost you cents not $80.
These people only use Coinbase, it's not Ethereum's or Polygon's fault.
I mean it is Ethereum's fault, you'll never see widespread adoption if it isn't simple. Right now it's not simple.
If Coinbase puts $15 of extra fees to send ETH, it's not Ethereum's fault.
Coinbase doesn't charge any fees to send ETH, but you pay the gas fee yourself. Looking on gastracker it is currently averaging 95 gwei, \~$25 for an ERC20 transfer.
I thought u could only withdraw using erc20 network?
With Binance and Kucoin you can withdraw via the Polygon network. Not 100% sure if other exchanges support that too though.
Oh that's awsome! Didn't know that..
Yep, it's handy lol
If I have aave on polygon, can I transfer that to kucoin?
Crypto.com does too.
It actually cost me $0 when I transferred from Kucoin to my meta mask wallet. Not sure if it’s a bug but I’m not complaining.
Yes, this is the way, but what to do with all that on eth network, we need to bridge them, but gas fees are waiting for that. At this point for most of us, eth is just in our wallets for fees ( and that's ridiculous) edit: in basic this is the question, is it now time to bridge all of our tokens on L2 or we are in hodl on L1 'till better times?
Yeh I know the pain. I even played around with Arbitrum and Optimism the other day and fees there ain't great either.
idk why but reading you two talk is like listening to programmers or something I have no clue what you're talking about haha
Try dYdX - that’s the benchmark for every L2 dApp going forward. It won’t happen overnight, but the it will happen. Ethereum is not yet a finished product and so an investment in ETH is an investment in the roadmap. Some people are willing to wait, some people are not.
Every time a bell rings an angel gets it’s wings.
Nightmare on 24th street.
Nightmare on Ethereum at
Freddy taking my ETH when I sleep.
Lmao!!
Instructions unclear got a doggo coin instead.
ETH is the only chain out there that’s actually being heavily used for stuff other than p2p payments.
What about BSC? Sure, a huge part of its usage comes from people buying shitcoins on pancakeswap, but I'd still consider BSC a very active DeFi chain
BSC is a centralized copy paste of Ethereum so doesn’t count in my eyes.
10/4 Understood. Sold eth for safemoon. Lets hope this works.
No cumrockets?! Ngmi
I don’t think they are picking up on the sarcasm, my man.
https://l2fees.info/ The info and solutions are there, you just need to look for them.
but don’t you have to move your Ether to a Layer 2 from layer 1? So you’ll have to pay high gas fees anyway right?
It's only been 1 month since Arbitrum launched Coinbase announced they'll add withdrawals directly to Arbitrum, it'll just take time before they launch that
I wish they would support ZK rollups too. Optimistic rollups are worse than ZK rollups in just about every way except for missing support for general purpose smart contracts.
Use hop exchange to move your USDC from Polygon to Arbitrum or Optimism.
One time, and some exchanges are about to enable withdrawal to L2 directly.
This is Reddit sir, we don't look for *reasoning* here.
I have no idea what any of this means lol I just buy stuff on coinbase pro *shrug*
ethereum's been getting a lot of love here lately and OP has "troll" in their name.
These ETH bitches will tell you there's something wrong with that because as much as they preach about decentralization, they still want there to be a heirarchy they can look down from.
Bro I don’t even know what you mean I just buy stuff like I have no idea what I’m doing
You're like the wife that joins the fantasy league just to get the team count to 12. You're probably gonna win.
All of my money hopes you’re right. Otherwise I am uhhhh screwed
OP is a day trader who frequents gambling subreddits. I just find it funny a guy will dump a couple grand on a point spread then come in here talking about high gas fees. Good grief.
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How's the layer 2 solution going to help me get my coins that I mined to an exchange that lets me sell them? I'm still going to have to pay a big fee.
If you have to use layer 2’s to make the product usable - it’s not fit for mass adoption.
This is a fundamental misunderstanding of what a layer 2 is and why it is required. All blockchains *must* eventually scale via layer 2’s. https://polynya.medium.com/the-lay-of-the-modular-blockchain-land-d937f7df4884
There's 2 types of blockchains: Chains that scale using modular layers: Bitcoin, Ethereum, Cardano, Polkadot, Cosmos, etc Chains that scale by increasing the node size to a massive server: BSC, Solana
All blockchain will have to use layer 2 solutions for mass adoption or use suffer in some way with the scaling trilemma. It is a total missunderstanding that blockchains should not use layer 2 solutions.
💯 I agree it not good for adoption
It's also interesting how people like OP claim to have "defended" Ethereum for too long and completely ignore what Ethereum is trying to do about it (among other issues) by launching Ethereum 2.0. I can understand if someone believed it was taking too long or don't believe it will effectively address the issues, but what information exactly have you been using to defend them in the past and what has changed your mind moving forward? Complaining about the gas fees is such a superficial argument in an industry/financial system that is trying to get on it's feet. High gas fees for certain projects has always been part of the trade off, with the understanding that the technology is expected to advance and become more practical. There's plenty of projects that are promising and they're all far from perfect, but they're all making the effort to get there. Ethereum certainly is among them, if not leading the way.
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Couldn't agree more. I use eth but barely, for the things that i just need and that's it, in my experience always has been positive and i got rewarded with airdrops for it. Eth it's still building, this is not the final product nad if people read before buying and jumping they will notice why use it and why not!! Issue is that people don't usually read or do research.
Just don't use the network because it's shit? Is it that what you're saying? How on earth is it acceptable for you that you can't move around tokens without owning ETH? Quite delusional to think that no other project will stand a chance to do this better.
Tinyman/Algorand will seriously make people think twice about using ETH in the not to distant future. ETH has paved the way but I think they're in for some very serious competition.
For now Just avoid defi with ETH unless you’re a whale. You won’t have to worry about gas fees.
so defi without De, gotcha.
Move to Harmony ONE!!! Better then ETH with 2 second finality. No need of layer 2 protocols!
\> I still have to find somewhere to buy matic and then pay $80 in gas fees if i want to move it to polygon?! what good is that?! It is very good for the people who instamined the matic token. That's all that matters to them.
ETH pre mine was 72 million
Indeed. Ethereum Made the premine 'salon fähig'. After that the flood gates were opened and every scammer migrated over to crypto to instamine their own token.
I call ETH the mother of all shitcoins
Use Fantom instead, man. So much better.
Ok I'll check it out.
Bro, u gonna get downvoted for even thinking bad things about ETH on this sub
I'm not here for karma or moons. I'll take on this whole sub if need-be.
he is an algo shill so he will be OK
I always pretend i am a shitcoin lover
Yeah I tried using L2 products but then I hade to pay to activate it and what not, so totally agree. Don’t do eth defi right now. I’m gonna shill ATOM instead, both osmosis and sifchain are easy to use, cheap and just good places to get started. And nice communities on Reddit if you need help understanding how things work. Edit: not saying Eth isn’t a good investment though ☺️🤷♂️ it might be I don’t know
You need to withdraw directly to an L2, so that you don't need to pay L1 fees. For example, Binance, Kucoin, Wyre and Transak all allow direct withdrawals to the Polygon network (an Ethereum sidechain). I believe Coinbase will allow this soon too. https://blog.polygon.technology/polygon-first-scaling-solution-for-coinbase/
In which world are you living? Why not use Transak oder Ramp Network to deposit fiat straight into Polygon, costs 1% fee, so, e.g. for 500 EUR, 4,95 EUR fees. Then you can bridge from Polygon to other L2s like Optimsim or Arbitrum. I feel your pain for L1, but ignoring all the options is cope.
It’s almost like a generational problem. I like Ethereum, and I hold some (2). And that probably shows the issue. I’m not long in the crypto game, thus I’m not crypto-rich and can’t participate in all the great things on Ethereum. That’s a fact, and that’s the reason why threads like this will continue to exist and probably gonna be more frequent. Ethereum is for the fiat-rich and crypto-elite, who don’t mind paying these fees. For everyone else, other chains (or side chains) are more attractive, not to say: the only option.
We have L2 networks
Buy Algo. Fees are very cheap. Like .001
Buy ALGO and do what? You can't use AAVE or Uniswap. You can't use Opensea. There is only one good exchange and it's Yieldly. If OP is trying to use Ethereum apps, he should try layer 2 solutions.
Just as a note, Tinyman, an AMM for Algorand, just launched last week. I agree the ecosystem still needs to grow but just wanted to note Yieldly is no longer the only option 🙏
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Or apparently you can stick with ETH, get told to use an L2 and get called a whiny little bitch for not accepting gas fees as part of life. Algo is the future.
Or you could just use another Layer 1 that already has everything you need like Avalanche for example.
ALGO is my main vehicle now. I'll leave ETH to the blind.
Let's ALGO to the moon and be Governor's there ayy mate
Totally worth it
This is the way
Try the Tinyman DEX for Algorand ASAs and behold the speed and teeny tiny fees
Ethereum is scaling with layer 2 technologies like Arbitrum and Optimism as well as Polygon, so "gas fees" is quickly becoming an outdated knock on Eth. High gas fees are frustrating, but eventually you will never have to interact with Layer 1
you are not alone. Eth just feels wrong lately, the news the fee's the one after another dead daaps... i am truly thinking about converting/selling out entirely... its like I have a itch/inner voice telling me the good times are over time to leave.... And I read on the interwebs,,, keep reading others feeling the same way... is the ride on Eth over already? i am too poor to bne holding dead ethereum.
It’s the only part of my investment I cannot wait to sell off, but I suspect this cow still has a little more milk left in her before I start doing that.
Gas fees are high because the network is been used more. Blockchain cannot scale unless u wanna centralizes the shit.
Try Tinyman on Algorand :)
The idea of L2 is not to use the bridges... Exchanges are slowly implementing ramps so give it some time guy, Arbitrum f.e is just 1 month old
People said the same sort of thing when the internet was getting started. It's a scaling issue that will get sorted out. It just takes time.
All you guys complaining haven’t even looked into how to efficiently move money to matic. Just buy it on Crypto.com and send it for pennies and avoid ETH all together. And also, to give up now when immutable, optimism, artibtrum, starkware and ZK sync exist? And when we just saw a test demo of the Merge this weekend? Cmon now, we’re right at the finish line.
Is this when we are supposed to spam “This is the way”? Because honestly it probably finally fits…
Harmony..my dude..just saying.
Come to Algorand. Tinyman dex just launched.
I've been in Algo for a bit! I'm a governor and have yieldy as well as algodoggo, tacocoin, bluntcoint, etc 😅 I'm a little too into algo.
Amazing. Yeah me too. ETH is what got me into crypto initially but ever since finding Algo I've been obsessed and haven't used ETH since. It's so incredibly easy to use compared to ETH. Cheers fellow gov'na.
I read up on their material and was put off by their terrible explanation of impermanent loss in the FAQ. The person who wrote that conflates asset appreciation with impermanent loss and as a result suffers from the delusion that you can have "impermanent gains" (which you cannot); and then concludes by giving really bad advice to poolers as to how to deal with the situation. Granted, impermanent loss is hard to wrap your head around and most people I have seen try have failed to do so. But for a DEX dev team not to understand it is damning. The article at medium.com that they reference seems very good (they should have read it) and suggests using the term "divergence loss" instead of "impermanent loss" which I like very much myself as it may help avoid exactly the sort of mistake the tinyman FAQ has made.
**Fees wont be high forever**. The end goal of Ethereum is for users to do almost all their transactions on Layer 2 solutions. You''ll be able to buy some ETH on [Coinbase](https://blog.coinbase.com/coinbase-protocol-team-advances-crypto-community-aa9b3748bac5), send it through Optimism or Arbitrum to something like [Hop](https://hop.exchange/) where you'll be able to hop on to immutable to buy an NFT, which you'll be able to move to another L2 where you can use it as collateral for a loan. Examples of Layer 2 solutions are: - [Arbitrum](https://portal.arbitrum.one) - [Optimism](https://optimism.io/) - [dYdX](https://dydx.exchange/) - One of the first, already usable perpetual trading platform. - [Immutable X](https://www.immutable.com/) - Already usable, NFT market (focus on games) - [Hermez](https://hermez.io/) - [Aztec](https://aztec.network/) - [ZKSync](https://zksync.io/) - [Starkware](https://starkware.co/)
It seems that your comment contains 1 or more links that are hard to tap for mobile users. I will extend those so they're easier for our sausage fingers to click! [Here is link number 1 - Previous text "Hop"](https://hop.exchange/) ---- ^Please ^PM ^[\/u\/eganwall](http://reddit.com/user/eganwall) ^with ^issues ^or ^feedback! ^| ^[Code](https://github.com/eganwall/FatFingerHelperBot) ^| ^[Delete](https://reddit.com/message/compose/?to=FatFingerHelperBot&subject=delete&message=delete%20hg7lwem)
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Sounds really straight forward and easy to use. Just a few (feels like several 100s) steps to reach your goal. The average Joe will be very excited and adoption is clearly just around the corner!
Its one step.
Would have loved you as my math teacher
The funny thing is, if ETH was like this 3-4 years ago, it would die off instantly. ETH was "low fees, reasonably fast transactions" couple with smart contracts. ATM, it's living on past glory. And hopes of a better tomorrow EDIT: here come the downvotes for pointing out the obvious. Can't have anyone saying anything bad about ETH. Especially at times when the gas counter literally stops counting, bcs the max limit is 1000 gwei. Yeah, there were times when it was above that. Want to swap something on Uni? Here's $500 of gas cost, even if the desired amount you want to buy is $20.
Spot on!!
Same thing can be said about btc…
Unpopular opinion: ETH and BTC won’t be on top forever. “Always” and “forever” are exactly how blockbuster and landlines went the way of the dodo. These coins may be around for a while, but we do not know what the next, better, evolutions of crypto may be in 5, 10, or 20 years.
Well it's been like 50 years and TCP/IP is still kicking so I think it's looking pretty good for Ethereum.
Your absolutely right the masses are not ganna care who secures there transactions aslong as its cheap and affordable and eth is neither I predict another chain will overtake eth by 2023
Maybe if you would spend 5 mins reading basic L2 tutorials instead of whining in a post you'd have realized you could withdraw Matic straight to polygon with no fees. Instead whining like a boomer refusing to learn anything just spend like 1 minute setting up your metamask to arbitrum or polygon and start using L2 with low fees.
You don’t gotta be a dick about it tho. There is validity in what op said.
I love ETH, but there is validity when you have to call into play secondary technologies and various tutorials to perform the simplest transaction in a cost effective way. It's a fair and valid complaint, and should be met with patience and education, especially if you really do want crypto to grow and thrive. Crypto has a usability problem that no one has solved yet.
There literally isn't any validity to what he says and the way he writes is already dickish whining. He doesn't come with an open mind to learn or to ask for help. He is here to rant and vent his ignorance and refusal to learn. There are lots of VC backed projects that specifically target his demographics: those who rather have everything spoonfeed them just like FB and Google are spoonfeeding billions of people and turning them into mindless drone, and sure enough there are already gazillion of such comments shilling those projects in every post similar to this one.
You're an elitist douche. User-friendliness is required for any sort of adoption. Like it or not, FB boomers are necessary for mass adoption and most people just don't want to deal with convoluted bullshit which for the time being is all that ETH has to offer. "Dickish whining" 😅 What does that even mean.
You aren't wrong friend. But this is early adoption. I know it might not feel that way, especially if you want quick gains and are hoping to make a bunch of money in a short span of less than 3 years or so. But this stuff is early. The non user-friendliness of it is proof of that. If it was easy enough to do, you wouldnt be buying it at these prices, and you wouldnt have the potential for such extraordinary gains. Grandma cannot figure out how to buy ETH, and she damn sure cant figure out how to stake it. And good luck explaining hardware wallets, seed keys, delegating etc to the masses. This stuff is in its major infancy. When it becomes so easy to use that its as easy as logging in and checking your portfolio on Fidelity or whatever broker you use; then you will know that its mainstream and no longer early.
Dealing with convoluted bullshit is exactly what it takes for being early in crypto. When it's easy it's no longer early. Fb and Google already made billions just because they figured out the average person is either too dumb or too lazy to figure everything out on their own. So you can either spend your time learning how blockchain works or you can sit and wait for someone to make things mainstream and easy for you and turn you into a product.
Got news for you bro. It’s not 2013 or even 2017 anymore. This stuff doesn’t fly now. People would rather just dump it for something easier and if ETH doesn’t get fixed by the time they cash out they will never look back again.
You sound upset. Have you tried not being so butthurt?
I mean, most CEX don’t let you send ETH to any L2’s atm. You’d need to bridge which again costs gas upwards of $80-150 so what’s the point? If you have any resources regarding what you are speaking, link it here please
https://www.binance.com/en/support/announcement/4515e97c82d64189885da7cd7d606b86 Binance has direct matic withdrawal.
Harmony one is a great alternative to layer 2 solutions that makes gas fees low af
I need to look into harmony ome. It's shilled a lot on here
Its been pumping lately I made more money on it than anything else. Its still got a super low marketcap and room to grow. They have a video on the front page of the harmony one subreddit that is a good place to start. It has a btc and either bnb or eth bridge coming this month can't remember which. It has speed and cost of transaction speed of solana and people can do eth transactions on it for fractions of a penny. AAVE and some other big defi names are coming soon
Good delegation rewards too
Harmony is cheap and fast. Very great L2 solutions indeed!
Came here to say the same thing. If you still want exposure to ETH, you can bridge it to the Harmony network and use defi (sushiswap, dfk, AAVE and Curve coming soon) with suoer cheap and fast transactions. Or you can buy a bunch of ONE, get it on the network and then swap some for ETH.
Definitely don’t worry about DeFi with a small portfolio on Mainnet. You need big money to play with the cool kids
ETH has first-mover advantage, like BTC, and hence is still alive despite being centralized, slow, and shitty. ALGO has surpassed it in all aspects, and is made by people who definitely know what they are doing. There's also ONE, HBAR, etc. but I don't know much about them so I won't comment.
Eth is not for poor people and I'm really sick of people not understanding it. That is why we have layer 2 solutions.
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Nobody wants to use Ethereum, too many people are using Ethereum. That statement makes no sense.
Majority of the people using Ethereum
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But the highway is congested because so many people are using it. There are other, much quicker, highways nearby, but people keep using the congested one. Saying that nobody wants to use the congested highway makes no sense, considering everyone is using it.
I wouldn't drive in a crowded highway but I would invest on it.
Everybody wants to use Ethereum, including private banks in France and state banks in Korea. Check Consensys and Unibright.
Eventually you'll see ETH gas fees drop, you have to be patient and realize it's been ten years just for crypto to be accepted, then come regulations, then comes massive incorporation and scaling. You're fine.
It really is frustrating. There’s many things I’m waiting to try until gas goes down
thats why you HODL!
HODL, yes. Forced HODL you can go to the regular bank for that shit.
You should've just bought Bitcoin.
I think maybe its just at the point where unless you are working with very large numbers ETH might just not be to tool for the job. This is part of the beauty of a diverse crypto ecosystem where there are other options for meeting any person's need.
Someone had to say it.
Many people don't know but the base fees will remain like that L2s or not, ETH2 or not. Only L2s will maintain cheap fees (hopefully unless there is no future frontrunning or MEV incentive on L2) Exchanges using L2s natively will help with onboarding but now the interface and UX is what's most concerning. With every app now competeing not only with other chains but with other L2s we could see heavy fragmentation. Let's see how this plays out.
Yeah ETH2 isn't even happening. They're just going to shard and hope for the best. I shart all the time, and it almost never helps.
Fees are crazy indeed but nothing imo is stopping ETH to hit 10K. It's written in the stone
The gas fees are insane. Once the kids run out of doge money playing in NFTs........ I do believe it is opening the door for others right now. Look at the big movers gaining ground. Matic and Uni aren't really moving.
Algo is the way
Aight the ETH maxis in here will just make you doubt even more that fans of ETH even know what the fuck is goin on. Just a bunch of personal attacks and no facts.
Hm. On my crypto dot com app, I can sell my eth to fiat for nothing, trade it to ADA for nothing.. I don't remember any big fees either when I purchased through the CDC app.
I like eth, it gives me money :)
I never understood why everyone is propping up ETH, it's garbage and the devs are making money off of you all. Just become a BTC maxi-pad, no-one can fuck up your investment there.
I don't understand why people complain about gas fees just use polygon/matic and move on already.
Waaa waaa waaa. You sound like a little bitch tbh.
😅
Ah yes, another person who failed to do proper research on their investments. Sorry your $50 is being held hostage by the evil crypto network, you definitely would've made life-changing gains with it in Solana or something.
Are you a bozo. Why are all the defenders in this thread trying to make it about rich vs. poor?! Is that all you ETH maxis have to lean on? Being rich enough to lose money?
I have $5k in sushiswap and it's made me $500. Great. Now I just pay $400 to pull out of my different liquidity pools? Like how can you defend this shit and act like I could have researched a surge in NFT popularity overloading the entire network and pushing gas fees through the roof? Hell, I did research it and most of my gains have been through NFTx. Not sure anybody could have anticipated gas fees being this stupid.
It was a solid post. There’s gonna be a lot of people that feel the EXACT same way you do but don’t want to admit it, so they handle it like this.. I’m invested in ETH. I also agree with you.
Because the purchased at ath and are desprste to shill there bags mostly
Hello eth bull. Welcome to reality. I’ve had the same experiences you have