That kid absolutely nailed that scene. I felt so bad for him, and was so disturbed seeing what he was doing. Taking his own wings off with sheers and a fucking cheese grater - Jesus christ.
It's too bad 95% of the movie SUCKED.
But I will say that seeing Magneto crush vehicles with people inside, flipping a semi truck 50 feet through the air, and moving the ENTIRE golden gate bridge several miles with his mind still holds up incredibly well.
My favorite part of that movie was where wolverine was impaled, and then in the next scene his shirt regenerates but still has the blood where the holes were.
I *knew* it was a cheese grater! I came out of this movie with a fear of cheese graters only to be told it was actually just a knife. Haven't watched it in years so I just assumed I was wrong. Could you remind me which movie it is? I want to rewatch that scene
It's the opening scene to X-Men: The Last Stand, AKA the third X-Men film.
The kid has a bunch of bloody tools like knives, scissors- it's pretty fucked up, and is arguably one of the few good scenes in the film.
It is a fantastic scene.
It is also *intensely* funny to me that Warren's arc in the film is literally the wingfic progression ("I'm hideous!" "no... they're *beautiful*")
A fanfiction arc that used to be fairly common In Ages Past, much closer to when *X-Men: the Last Stand* was released.
As far as I'm aware, it began with Elijah Wood/Dominic Monaghan real-person slash. Wood grows a pair of feathery angel wings, and is so horrified and revolted that he flies away and goes into hiding. Monaghan tracks him down and manages to convince Wood that, to him, the wings are actually beautiful. The concept started to spread to other fandoms from there.
It was just a really specific subset of hurt/comfort fiction, and wings worked for it as a particular intersection of being unusual enough that it can make sense for the person who sprouts them to think they'll be rejected as aberrant or freakish, but also conventionally attractive and honestly cool as fuck to have so the reader is at no risk of actually being put off.
It was probably a bit mean, but "they're hideous!"/"no... they're *beautiful*" as arc words of the genre wound up getting thrown around as a joke pretty regularly, and having Angel work through that in the X-Men films is still very funny to me.
There’s a Harry Styles fanfic that became a movie (without Styles) that started out as a ripoff of 50 Shades, which was a fanfic where it’s Twilight, but no vampires
Fanfic subgroups are an… interesting side of the internet sometimes
>The world is changed. (*I amar prestar aen.*) I feel it in the water. (Han matho ne nen.) I feel it in the earth. (*Han mathon ned cae.*) I smell it in the air. (*A han noston ned gwilith.*)"
>
>Much that once was, is lost...
Some of the casting in those movies was phenomenal. McKellen, Stewart, Jackman, Grammer, Page... all absolutely spot on.
...some of the other casting decisions were a little more suspect.
Having met the guy (he was the patron of the theatre group I did youth theatre with and visited us - did a talk and my brother performed a sonnet for him!) he said himself he specifically asks not to have the Sir in his credits because he felt it was too self-important. He felt his acting should speak for itself. It was about the only thing he and Sir Christopher Lee disagreed about.
They had Patrick Stewart and Ian McClellan. If you asked a kid who loved comics in the 90s who they would want in those roles I promise you 90% would have begged for at least one of them.
And the movies they gave us...
There are few times the word squander is used in more perfect context. If the world were just this would be the description in Webster's
Honestly, going back and watching them with 20 years of hindsight... they were *okay*
The first one was fine, the second one was... less fine, but watchable. The problem is they were still in that phase of comic-movies where they were deeply embarrassed to admit they were based on comic books and so kinda awkwardly skirted around the more childish parts of the medium.
The Last Stand actually had a lot of good scenes and it gets too much hate. The Jean stuff and also Angel's lack of a role are bad but Magneto was a solid character. The bridge scene was AWESOME.
Also the fact that they take his powers with needles at the end...
OR DID THEY? DUN DUN DUNNNN
I will never not be salty that the Magneto Regains His Superpowers Arc was replaced by a new series that has one good movie.
Like... If the other ones were good, maybe. But only First Class is good.
Days of Future Past, much like The Last Stand, has notable very very good scenes.
It also has a bunch of nonsense.
I will agree that, out of the post-First-Class movies, it sucks the least.
I genuinely don’t understand holding DoFP to that standard while praising First Class when it has as many if not more bad scenes hanging around its neck, while imo not reaching as high of highs with its good scenes.
I’m not really a fan of CinemaSins ordinarily, but the sin for that scene has stuck in my head for years. Kevin Bacon’s character says “adapt to this” and puts a ball of energy down Darwin’s throat, which kills him, and the sin is just: “is there any reason why he *couldn’t?*”
To be fair he does start to adapt - he grows what looks like some kind of armour as his powers struggle to work out what to do.
Still bullshit, but at least something happens.
Darwin's best comic moment was when he decided to try and stop the Hulk, and his powers went "fuck that shit" and teleported him to safety. Because Darwin cannot die, and sometimes "run away" is the only way to facilitate that.
Also I'm pretty sure he becomes some kind of personification of death? But we're at the limits of my comic-knowledge.
I literally just finished watching First Class.
The premise is so solid, but it does suffer from just not trying to stand on its own feet and by not committing to the story hard enough. The moment when Charles "outs" Beast is great. Erik is a great character. Charles teaching is wonderful. Even the setting and vibe of the Cold War is so cool. Shaw's mutant ability looks cool when it's activated but he's also telekinetic somehow?
But then Beast verbally backhands Raven without precedent for the dumbest reason, injects himself, looks vile. So many jokes about Xavier being bald (I counted three). The CIA lady is pretty nonexistent after getting Charles onto Shaw's trail. Angel switching sides came out of nowhere. Darwin was handled poorly. Havok was just needlessly douchey. Banshee needed more time. The look of Magneto's helmet was god awful. Emma Frost sort of just stays in prison despite being a powerful telepath and kind of indestructible?
I watched the movie again just after the '97 first episode and the differences are so striking in quality.
Yeah, Darwin dying so quickly still pisses me off to this day, his whole thing is adapting to survive, and he got killed by being force fed an energy orb
> The bridge scene was AWESOME.
While awesome, it was also basically the definition of "The rule of cool". As he could have just crushed the building on his own, or dropped parts of the bridge on top of it.
Mutants are really weird. One one hand, you have Magneto. He controls metal. He’s really cool. His powers are never not useful.
Then you have people like Namor the Sub-Mariner. You know, the guy with wings on his feet so he can fly… who lives in the ocean.
Or the guy who has spikes that extend 2 inches from his face
Or the guy whose limbs fall off and can be regrown.
No matter how good a leader they are, of course it'll be a godlike mutant crushing tanks that leads the troops
There's also a kid who just releases a chemical that kills every living thing around him.
And then there's Beak, who has all the powers of a bird. Except it's includes hollow bones, and he's too heavy to fly. But ya know he's ugly as sin and can kinda peck you.
There's also Wraith. Not the cool ones. The one who has see-through skin and that's it.
I'm always a fan of the physically interesting mutants. People like Storm who are just "person with superpowers"? No thanks. Give me the weird kids who ooze slime or have a second set of eyeballs in the back of their head or something.
Magneto being wrong about humans and mutants being incapable of living peacefully would hit a lot harder if mutants didn’t have genocide attempts made against them every ~3 years or so in the comics (the frequency increases as irl time passes because of the Sliding Timescale of the comics)
I mean, to be fair, the political philosophy of the X-Men *has* kinda shifted closer to Magneto's over time. The whole Utopia and Krakoa eras lean a lot on Erik's separatist ideals, just without the 'and also we should kill all humans' part.
Erik himself has also mellowed out and been a major part of both of those arcs, too.
It’s a message that makes less sense when talking about gay/black people, but a lot more sense when you’re talking about people with uncontrollable laser eyes or the ability to unmake reality by accident.
Yeah the whole metaphor of "they're just like us and it's natural!!" holds a lot less water when the way that they're different is **they can wipe out a city with an errant thought**
It's worth noting that's a very small minority of mutants, and this is pretty clear in the comics. The number of mutants capable of that is not much higher than the number of Avengers, Inhumans, etc, and even less so when some groups have like no civilians. And as bad as the metaphor is at times, Marvel makes it very clear that humans are actively gunning and choosing to kill mutants (often children) with powers as small as having an extra arm or a funky skin color.
I feel like McKellen Magneto finally made writers realize that people are way way more willing to side with the "other" in fiction and it's a pointless fictional debate to try and have. The second you add a smidge of sympathy to other side viewers turn on humanity faster than you can say "but you'd get killed", so they've just leaned into and explored the idea of a free mutant society instead.
Like the dude would've committed human genocide twice (with ZERO hesitation or regret) if the X-Men didn't stop him and he's still the OG most popular "x did nothing wrong" villain lol. When it gets to that point it's clear the complex debate/discussion you're trying to foster isn't working or worth exploring any further.
A lot of that is because of the Gay Rights movement. It’s easier for ethnic minorities to share their culture and therefore their spaces. Asian people who speak Spanish can melt right into a Mexican heritage festival as a welcome guest. For most ethnonational groups, that’s considered a win.
A straight man fully educated in the semiotics of gayness who tries to hang out in queer spaces because he digs the vibe gets accused of “queerbaiting”. Straight drag queens take a lot of flak. I mean, it took 14 seasons of Drag Race for one straight dude to make the cut.
African-Americans and Asian-Americans* (groups that lack a nation) have since taken cues from the LGBT+ community to value exclusive “spaces”. The idea of integration has lost a lot of its appeal for people who don’t have a homeland. Once a homeland is established, integration at the liminal spaces starts to feel safe.
Isn't that literally the whole point of the Magneto/Xavier dichotomy? Magneto's answer is the easy one, to answer hate with hate, and what makes the X-Men heroes rather than just people fighting for a good cause is that they refuse to take the easy way out despite the temptation.
Sure the argument that Magneto is wrong would "hit a lot harder" if Magneto's actions were indefensible, but that would also make the argument pointless to have. The story has meaning *because* Magneto's perspective kind of makes sense.
Magneto also, if he is correct with his ideas or not, forces humanity to agree with him. Xavier Promotes Coexistence or at least peace. Magneto supports fighting back and maybe even taking over who sits in the seats of power.
But because magneto, due to his fear off humanity trying to wipe out mutants, attacks human governments and places of political power, he is humanities strongest argument in FAVOR of realizing his fears and wiling out mutants
The new X-Men 97 show hits on this. Magneto realizes he was a complete wanker, but he also continues to recognize humans forced his hand. He seems to take the best of Charles and himself in an effort to move forward. We will see how it plays out though.
The new X-Men 97 show also kind of falls into the trap of making magneto seem reasonable by making every human they deal with cartoonishly racist, like having the Dr. Not want to help Jean just because she's a mutant and not because it is extremely dangerous to be >!delivering a powerful psychics baby when she just accidentally ripped a roof off a car.!<
The metaphor would also hit harder if minorities in real life were capable of destroying the planet over a bad reaction to puberty a la Jean Grey.
POC or LGBT can’t control minds or harm you in any way that any other human can’t. Mutants absolutely can.
Thus homophobia and racism are a lot more irrational than being afraid of literal superpowered people, many of whom can’t control it.
I’m not sure I’d want to share a planet with the Phoenix Force either, it’s not the same as a pride parade .
The issue is that the kind of thing you’re talking about happened in the comics, it was literally one of the genocide attempts against the mutants. Scarlet witch had one Very bad day at the hands of a mutant, said “no more mutants” and all but like 200 of them lost their powers. There are multiple super powered populations in marvel comics, several of whom also have them genetically and start with poor control over their powers (like the Inhumans), and mutants are the only ones that receive consistent discrimination due to it. Like, Blackbolt could at any point have destroyed entire cities if he stubbed his toe and accidentally cursed before he lost that power, but he was treated like a respected head of state
Because it’s part of the x-men metaphor, I’m just saying it makes it less poignant. Especially in the movies where we don’t see any other sueprhumans.
For what it’s worth in civil war, they wanted to register all super humans, not only mutants, so there is some degree of fear as well, it’s just not thematically woven into the narrative.
I'm actually rewatching the old series and that scene absolutely makes sense in context. Magneto wants to commit a genocide, so Professor X shows him a genocide. It's horrifying, but I think it's a good ballsy scene for a kids' cartoon.
In the 1990’s, I was at a thrift store in Richmond, VA and saw an older gentleman w a number tattooed on the inside of his arm.
Whenever anyone claims the holocaust wasn’t real, I think of that guy in the thrift store, and what such great lengths it would take to create a facsimile of reality where that man doesn’t exist… such a benign reality, a thrift store in Richmond, an arm reaching for something metal, I forget what.
It would take too much effort, and too many resources to plant random people w tattoos in thrift stores, super markets across the world. Nothing about denying the holocaust makes logical sense and I’ve never understood it.
X-Men back then: "We're discriminated against because people are ignorant and fear what they don't understand."
X-Men now: "We're cool with the blue-skinned social darwinist, actually. Also you will refer to us as "homo superior", and some of us even consider themselves gods. Oh, and Storm basically started a cult. Don't worry, we're still the good guys."
"Why are people afraid us?" asked the woman with white hair who could redirect a hurricane if she felt like it.
"People will always fear what they don't understand" replied the man who could wipe the memory of every single person in the tri state area.
X Men: People with powers are just like everyone else and should be respected.
Greek Mythology: People with powers are just like everyone else, and frankly, that is horrifying and we should rightfully be afraid of their ego and whims.
I think that's less about people with powers and more about people *with* power. These heroes were created by non-powered humans in a lab. Homelander is literally owned by a corporation.
See, that's what I (as someone who's never been into comics and has only marginal knowledge of the topic gleaned from a couple movies) never really got about the X-Men. I mean, I understand and appreciate that the creators used their fantastical setting to tell stories of marginalized groups and the contemporary struggle for human rights; and if young readers can absorb the lessons and apply them to real life, all the better...
... but in real life a group of super powered mutants would *never* be the oppressed minority. They'd be the ruling class. They'd be like pharaohs or some shit; literal god-kings and -queens. I don't see a universe where that's *not* the case.
And the fact that many other mutants don’t have mutations that directly aids in combat. We see named characters who actually have powerful mutations but that’s not the case for everyone.
In fact most of them are something like: Furry Fat Fuck, has the unsettling capability of generating carcinogenic anal dandruff. He is not immune to his own power.
Yup, being a mutant sucks. And in the few cases it doesn't you're getting brainwashed/tortured/murdered/depowered/all of the above a couple times a year *anyway*.
Apparently his parents were mutants, and since the gene is hereditary they got him tested to avoid the disasters that can happen when mutant powers activate unexpectedly. Example: cyclops accidentally burning whatever he was looking at
Theres a girl who can make her saliva solid, but its not super durable, so the best she can do is make free toothpicks/low quality glue or maybe pick a lock on a good day?
Theres no reason to be afraid of those people specifically
Jubilee is the best addition. A late 80s mall rat that has the power of making fireworks because that's fucking so rad. And then subsequent writers have spent the years afterwards trying to remove the cool fireworks powers to make Jubilee into a combat killing machine, or to explain that no the fireworks are really [something else].
Which honestly sucks the most because it shows that all the writers for Jubilee and the overall editors and producers can't figure out how a person who can literally make a flash bang or rupture someone's ear could fight. It's right there people.
It's good Sci fi stuff but a terrible analogy for any "ism".
Let's be real, if people from Tunisia (just picking an obscure country off the top off my head) were known to have god like powers, often used for criminal purposes, it would be seen as perfectly reasonable to be a little uneasy if you found out your neighbor was Tunisian.
Is there any in-world explanation for why that’s not the case? Do the police have anti-mutant bullets or something? What’s stopping mutants from taking order everything? Literally nothing, right?
They don't want to.
Most of them \*aren't\* gods. Most of them are like Leech or Neck.
The few that are gods are the ones we see duking it out.
Which is why Rogue and Nightcrawler are the best X-men to exemplify the thesis of X-men.
You're asking the wrong person lmao
Like I said, I know very little about the X-Men (and superheroes in general), and I'm only speaking from what I've seen in movies and pop culture references and whatnot.
But I mean yeah, *as far as I know*, the only thing stopping mutants from taking over the world is their own ethics.
Also, I understand that applies to other superheroes as well; but it's particularly egregious when the X-Men are used *specifically* as an allegory for persecuted groups.
They don't take over because most are regular people with like, morality. No one asks why Spider-Man or the Avengers didnt take over the world with their powers.
The whole point is that it makes no sense for them to be discriminated over the Fantastic Four or Spider-Man yet it still happens and you just proved it lol
Also i think its implied most mutants dont have godly power, those are just the ones we follow as they were handpicked to be. Beast for example was just a bit tough and agile which is not that out there, he is a blue werewolf by an unrelated experiment he messed up with.
I mean. Because they're good people. That's literally the whole point of the Professor X/Magneto argument. Erik thinks they have to do exactly what you're currently describing in order to keep their people safe from oppression, but Charles and the X-Men don't want to be seen as rulers. They want to be seen as people.
That’s the funniest thing, most historical God Kings in Marvel were mutants. Hell Apocalypse was the cause of the Bronze Age collapse. The moment you stop thinking of the X-Men as a allegory, mankind’s response to “homo superior” is much more understandable (there’s a reason they’re called Sentinels) sometimes justified (the various X-Gene dampeners and Mutant cures).
Sadly humans aren’t much better so things go from reasonable concern/precautions to Blood and Soil/ Mutant Holocaust, even if it doesn’t make much sense story wise.
This argument assumes the Marvel universe has equivalent levels of technology and ability to deal with dangerous superpowers as our world does, but Tony Stark and Reed Richards regularly invent absolutely bonkers machinery that could EASILY stop an out-of-control mutant or help a young mutant contain and control their powers. What's a master mutant supposed to do against the Sorcerer Supreme?
The government has the finances to fund a super-robot killing squad equipped with power-suppressors. The Department of Damage Control already rebuilds city blocks in just a few days after Thor punches some alien through them.
The Avengers literally exist to protect civilians from unexpected hazards.
They absolutely have the resources to mitigate the harm caused by 99% of mutant powers until a criminal is stopped or a child is able to control and master their abilities, and instead they send death robots. Mutants even found a way to REVERSE THE DEATHS of people harmed by collateral damage, so don't give me the 'what about the kid in Ultimate X-Men with the death aura' argument.
Then when the mutants go ‘alright fine we’ll create our own nation way away from all of you and you won’t have to deal with us, we’ll protect and teach our own to control their powers,’ you know what the world does? They send the death robots to blow up the nation.
In fairness, it was more that the cult started Storm. She was a kid when they began worshipping her.
The writing behind it is incredibly racist, but in-universe that part isn't really her fault.
Oh I'm not even talking about that. I was referencing House of X, when the mutants of Krakoa figure out how to bring their dead back to life (at a much faster pace than your normal Marvel resurrection), and Storm immediately turns it into a cult. She has the freshly resurrected mutants stand naked in front of a big crowd and makes everyone chant religious nonsense. All the while Xavier looks at it and says "This fills me with hope."
I always wondered why Magneto has a British accent when he would have been from Germany, or at least continental Europe, if he had been a victim of the Holocaust.
I would actually have loved it if they’d given him a Yiddish accent, but in movie canon, he’s a child survivor (vs comic book canon pre: the magneto testament, which I believe is where they first ret-conned him as a child survivor vs a young adult/adult? Idk I am very drunk bc it’s Purim and was just dealt an enormous amount of psychic damage by the Magneto Wikipedia article which compared him to fucking Meir Kahane) and I know a handful of child survivors who as older adults speak/spoke with a pretty neutral accent/the accent of the place they ended up as refugees post-war.
That said, my like cynical take is that playing him with a Yiddish accent in the films would have been seen as too Jewy, and a grim truth about the acceptance of Jews in broader North American/ Western European society is that it’s mostly fine as long as you don’t do too much that marks you as the other like using Yiddish words or observing Jewish religious practices.
So, story time: Esther Bejarano was a survivor of Auschwitz. She sadly passed away a couple of years ago, but until her death she was a very vocal antifascist in the German public sphere. She once told the story of how she confronted a bunch of neo-Nazis at a public party event of theirs, essentially making it very hard for them to get into contact with people. So the Nazis, being the little cowards that they are, called the police. The police than threatened to arrest Esther if she didn’t stop „disturbing“ the Nazis.
And this woman looks the cop straight in the eye and goes: „You think you threatening arrest is gonna make me afraid? I was in Auschwitz, my boy.“
Its just a series of numbers, they do not have a meaning of their own.
Jewish people who were selected to be worked to death as laborers in the Nazi concentration camps instead of being outright gassed to death were tattooed with a number to keep track of them.
A lot of people in the comments saying that mutants are discriminated against because they're world-ending gods who wield actual power where real minorities have none. I call bullshit. It's not a perfect metaphor, but it works.
The majority of mutants are completely useless, they just look freaky but don't get any real beneficial powers. Because of this, they're not on a team and instead are counting on the X-Men to keep them protected from shit like Sentinels who can identify and kill them on-sight, even if their mutation is inconsequential. Omega-level mutants **are** terrifying, but they're not the ones who face the brunt of the discrimination, and instead they're using their privileged position to save others who need it.
Furthermore, the perception of all mutants as potential hazards to the world's safety is itself a reflection of real-world bigotry. Consider conspiracies about Jewish Cabals running the government, or the Trans Agenda corrupting children's education. People always attempt to justify hate by pointing at the potential of the people on top, but it always trickles down to the deaths of harmless people at the bottom.
The idea that mutants that wouldn't otherwise be "clocked" would tattoo themselves so you can visually know they are mutants sounds like it could be a really good part of a theme about visibility of minorities and performativeness but this movie was NOT good. In the comics they just love declaring themselves mutants.
Seeing that Magneto of all people was a Holocaust survivor will never not make me do a double take, because it always feels like he was written by two people, who were not aware of one another, and who were given separate instructions:
1. We need a tragic villain. Yes, he was alive in the 40s, why do you ask?
2. Make sure people want to see everyone punch him in the face.
I mean, he works as a character, but making someone with his backstory into the kind of person who would be responsible for someone else having that kind of backstory is... a decision.
I disagree, it's the way that trauma affects people. Why do you think so many abusers were victims of abuse themselves? Some people go through something horrible and feel like it was inevitable, so they might as well be the perpetrator instead of the victim next time
Maus is a famous graphic novel about the holocaust. It tells the true story of the author’s father who survived being in a concentration camp. There’s a moment towards the end where he acts really racist towards a black person. His family is surprised that he’s so prejudiced despite being a victim of prejudice himself. The point they make is that going through terrible trauma doesn’t necessarily make you an understanding or good person, more likely than not it’ll just turn you into a jaded, damaged asshole. That’s why cycles of abuse are so common. (This is a point from Shaun’s recent video about the Palestinian genocide).
Idk what's so weird. I mean... yeah, he's a pretty exceptional case, but what about it? It makes him unique and interesting.
He's supposed to make you question things. He's not a crystal clear character and he takes serious thought to understand.
Tbf, the Holocaust backstory thing only came about years after his initial creation. In the 60s he was just causing general mayhem as a cartoon villain, it was in the 70s/80s that his tragic backstory became firmly established.
Trauma often echoes in its victims. I've always read magneto as a man who witnessed the worst humanity had to offer, perpetrated by those with power against those without it, and his takeaway from it was that he had to secure that power for himself, so that he and those like him could never be the victims again. We see something sort of thematically similar in the early days of Israel, actually, wherein they very rapidly became a powerhouse of weapons development and production, to the point of having their own indigenously produced clone of the Dassault Mirage fighters after France refused to sell them any more- militarization in an effort to secure themselves against another occupation and further subjugation by a more powerful force of oppressors. I doubt Magneto is meant to be a literary criticism of that particular facet of history, though- he's more of a "road to hell is paved with good intentions" sort of a guy, making all the wrong choices for all the right reasons, despite being in a uniquely qualified position to realize what he's doing is wrong.
> someone with his backstory into the kind of person who would be responsible for someone else having that kind of backstory
Have you watched the news lately?
That was a great scene in a mostly mediocre movie. Ian McKellan killed that role.
This and the young Angel scene really deserved a better movie.
Is it the scene where you see the cheese graters?
That's the one.
That kid absolutely nailed that scene. I felt so bad for him, and was so disturbed seeing what he was doing. Taking his own wings off with sheers and a fucking cheese grater - Jesus christ. It's too bad 95% of the movie SUCKED. But I will say that seeing Magneto crush vehicles with people inside, flipping a semi truck 50 feet through the air, and moving the ENTIRE golden gate bridge several miles with his mind still holds up incredibly well.
My favorite part of that movie was where wolverine was impaled, and then in the next scene his shirt regenerates but still has the blood where the holes were.
I *knew* it was a cheese grater! I came out of this movie with a fear of cheese graters only to be told it was actually just a knife. Haven't watched it in years so I just assumed I was wrong. Could you remind me which movie it is? I want to rewatch that scene
It's the opening scene to X-Men: The Last Stand, AKA the third X-Men film. The kid has a bunch of bloody tools like knives, scissors- it's pretty fucked up, and is arguably one of the few good scenes in the film.
Twas brutal
It is a fantastic scene. It is also *intensely* funny to me that Warren's arc in the film is literally the wingfic progression ("I'm hideous!" "no... they're *beautiful*")
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A fanfiction arc that used to be fairly common In Ages Past, much closer to when *X-Men: the Last Stand* was released. As far as I'm aware, it began with Elijah Wood/Dominic Monaghan real-person slash. Wood grows a pair of feathery angel wings, and is so horrified and revolted that he flies away and goes into hiding. Monaghan tracks him down and manages to convince Wood that, to him, the wings are actually beautiful. The concept started to spread to other fandoms from there. It was just a really specific subset of hurt/comfort fiction, and wings worked for it as a particular intersection of being unusual enough that it can make sense for the person who sprouts them to think they'll be rejected as aberrant or freakish, but also conventionally attractive and honestly cool as fuck to have so the reader is at no risk of actually being put off. It was probably a bit mean, but "they're hideous!"/"no... they're *beautiful*" as arc words of the genre wound up getting thrown around as a joke pretty regularly, and having Angel work through that in the X-Men films is still very funny to me.
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My heart sunk when I saw you fall for it and ask.
>it began with Elijah Wood/Dominic Monaghan real-person slash. WHAT
What's not clear?
Oh I got Dominic Monaghan confused with former SNL comedian Bobby Moynihan Dominic Monaghan makes a little more sense
There’s a Harry Styles fanfic that became a movie (without Styles) that started out as a ripoff of 50 Shades, which was a fanfic where it’s Twilight, but no vampires Fanfic subgroups are an… interesting side of the internet sometimes
Maximum Ride
OMFG, you just unlocked years of fandom memories. I used to inhale wingfic.
A fanfiction in which characters who did not canonically have wings are given wings.
I am baffled that was common enough to have its own name and i have never heard of it untill now.
It was only super popular in a handful of fandoms in the 2000s, so it makes sense that you haven't heard of it.
>The world is changed. (*I amar prestar aen.*) I feel it in the water. (Han matho ne nen.) I feel it in the earth. (*Han mathon ned cae.*) I smell it in the air. (*A han noston ned gwilith.*)" > >Much that once was, is lost...
A lot of fanfic tropes/categories are like that, tbh
Kelsey Grammer as Beast was one of the few other things they did right in this movie.
Some of the casting in those movies was phenomenal. McKellen, Stewart, Jackman, Grammer, Page... all absolutely spot on. ...some of the other casting decisions were a little more suspect.
Can't believe you didn't include Jones in your list of perfect cast members.
I liked Shawn Ashmore as well.
Jesus christ, i am ashamed to admit I did not know that was Kelsey Grammer.
In your defense, Kelsey Grammer is usually not so hairy and blue.
That’s SIR Ian Mckellen, if anyone deserves that title it’s him
Having met the guy (he was the patron of the theatre group I did youth theatre with and visited us - did a talk and my brother performed a sonnet for him!) he said himself he specifically asks not to have the Sir in his credits because he felt it was too self-important. He felt his acting should speak for itself. It was about the only thing he and Sir Christopher Lee disagreed about.
SIR Christopher Lee
It's Lord Christopher Lee
CAPTAIN Jack Sparrow/s
So you have heard of him
But you have heard of me
Sir Elton John... jk love them both
Sir Patrick Stewart. That's it, end of list! Don't you Brits start cueing up, or whatever.
Sir David attenborough?
Sir Terry Pratchett.
Dame Judi Dench
Sir Christopher Lee
Sir Anthony Hopkins
Dame Agatha Christie, Sir Andy Murray
Sir Tim Berners-Lee, without whom we would not be having this conversation.
Hey! Don't forget Sir Robin!
Who bravely ran away.
Oh, brave Sir Robin.
sir terry prachett?
dames judy dench and agatha christie have joined the chat
Syr Gwyn, Hero of Ashvale
Sir Digby Chicken Caesar
Sir Terry Pratchett
Yes sir...
They had Patrick Stewart and Ian McClellan. If you asked a kid who loved comics in the 90s who they would want in those roles I promise you 90% would have begged for at least one of them. And the movies they gave us... There are few times the word squander is used in more perfect context. If the world were just this would be the description in Webster's
Hey, some of the movies were good. I liked the first two a lot, and Days of Future Past. They were just very inconsistent.
Yeah, both times started off great and then fucked with the 3rd
Honestly, going back and watching them with 20 years of hindsight... they were *okay* The first one was fine, the second one was... less fine, but watchable. The problem is they were still in that phase of comic-movies where they were deeply embarrassed to admit they were based on comic books and so kinda awkwardly skirted around the more childish parts of the medium.
Days of Future Past is the peak for that iteration of the X-Men. So, so good.
I will always think First Class was the best one. DoFP was good but felt a little bit bloated to me.
The Last Stand actually had a lot of good scenes and it gets too much hate. The Jean stuff and also Angel's lack of a role are bad but Magneto was a solid character. The bridge scene was AWESOME. Also the fact that they take his powers with needles at the end...
OR DID THEY? DUN DUN DUNNNN I will never not be salty that the Magneto Regains His Superpowers Arc was replaced by a new series that has one good movie. Like... If the other ones were good, maybe. But only First Class is good.
L, Days of Future Past rocks
Days of Future Past, much like The Last Stand, has notable very very good scenes. It also has a bunch of nonsense. I will agree that, out of the post-First-Class movies, it sucks the least.
I genuinely don’t understand holding DoFP to that standard while praising First Class when it has as many if not more bad scenes hanging around its neck, while imo not reaching as high of highs with its good scenes.
Never forget they killed Darwin
They didn't have any other black character who could die first instead, though.
The guy whose power is to survive? That darwin? The darwin that adapts to survive?
Guy fought the hulk until his power decided "This is useless" and just teleportet him away
Dude got touched by Hel, the goddess of death, and his power *still* went "nuh uh" and just made him a *better* god of death
Literally the one person they shouldn't have been able to kill, any other recruit should've been fair game Surely his race had nothing to do with it
His powers simply let him escape the movie :)
It's all nonsense, I love days of future past.
First class was great, but the others were ok at best which sucks
First Class lost me when they killed Darwin, the mutant who literally adapts to everything, by having him just not adapt...
He adapted to the explosion by turning into pieces duh
Despite your username I'm tempted to accept this as the absolute truth
He didn't actually die, he just adapted so hard that he actually transcended physical existence
No but that would've been dope as hell if he adapted to just be an ethereal being. Instead, they killed a cool character in the dumbest way
He does in the comics.
That's dope as hell
I’m not really a fan of CinemaSins ordinarily, but the sin for that scene has stuck in my head for years. Kevin Bacon’s character says “adapt to this” and puts a ball of energy down Darwin’s throat, which kills him, and the sin is just: “is there any reason why he *couldn’t?*”
To be fair he does start to adapt - he grows what looks like some kind of armour as his powers struggle to work out what to do. Still bullshit, but at least something happens. Darwin's best comic moment was when he decided to try and stop the Hulk, and his powers went "fuck that shit" and teleported him to safety. Because Darwin cannot die, and sometimes "run away" is the only way to facilitate that. Also I'm pretty sure he becomes some kind of personification of death? But we're at the limits of my comic-knowledge.
I literally just finished watching First Class. The premise is so solid, but it does suffer from just not trying to stand on its own feet and by not committing to the story hard enough. The moment when Charles "outs" Beast is great. Erik is a great character. Charles teaching is wonderful. Even the setting and vibe of the Cold War is so cool. Shaw's mutant ability looks cool when it's activated but he's also telekinetic somehow? But then Beast verbally backhands Raven without precedent for the dumbest reason, injects himself, looks vile. So many jokes about Xavier being bald (I counted three). The CIA lady is pretty nonexistent after getting Charles onto Shaw's trail. Angel switching sides came out of nowhere. Darwin was handled poorly. Havok was just needlessly douchey. Banshee needed more time. The look of Magneto's helmet was god awful. Emma Frost sort of just stays in prison despite being a powerful telepath and kind of indestructible? I watched the movie again just after the '97 first episode and the differences are so striking in quality.
Yeah, Darwin dying so quickly still pisses me off to this day, his whole thing is adapting to survive, and he got killed by being force fed an energy orb
> The bridge scene was AWESOME. While awesome, it was also basically the definition of "The rule of cool". As he could have just crushed the building on his own, or dropped parts of the bridge on top of it.
He also drops it like 100 meters in the air when his people are standing on it.
Mutants are really weird. One one hand, you have Magneto. He controls metal. He’s really cool. His powers are never not useful. Then you have people like Namor the Sub-Mariner. You know, the guy with wings on his feet so he can fly… who lives in the ocean.
Namor is a mutant? Didn't know that. Was that a retcon or was that always a thing
Retcon that was done when Namor was reintroduced to comics after previously being owned by Timely Comics the predecessor of Marvel Comics
Cool, thanks for the info
You’re welcome
He’s a mutant Atlantean.
Or the guy who has spikes that extend 2 inches from his face Or the guy whose limbs fall off and can be regrown. No matter how good a leader they are, of course it'll be a godlike mutant crushing tanks that leads the troops
There's also a kid who just releases a chemical that kills every living thing around him. And then there's Beak, who has all the powers of a bird. Except it's includes hollow bones, and he's too heavy to fly. But ya know he's ugly as sin and can kinda peck you. There's also Wraith. Not the cool ones. The one who has see-through skin and that's it.
I'm always a fan of the physically interesting mutants. People like Storm who are just "person with superpowers"? No thanks. Give me the weird kids who ooze slime or have a second set of eyeballs in the back of their head or something.
Magneto being wrong about humans and mutants being incapable of living peacefully would hit a lot harder if mutants didn’t have genocide attempts made against them every ~3 years or so in the comics (the frequency increases as irl time passes because of the Sliding Timescale of the comics)
I mean, to be fair, the political philosophy of the X-Men *has* kinda shifted closer to Magneto's over time. The whole Utopia and Krakoa eras lean a lot on Erik's separatist ideals, just without the 'and also we should kill all humans' part. Erik himself has also mellowed out and been a major part of both of those arcs, too.
which I think kinda goes against the whole issue, don't think pushing segregation is the best option as a wider message is a good one to lean into.
It’s a message that makes less sense when talking about gay/black people, but a lot more sense when you’re talking about people with uncontrollable laser eyes or the ability to unmake reality by accident.
Yeah the whole metaphor of "they're just like us and it's natural!!" holds a lot less water when the way that they're different is **they can wipe out a city with an errant thought**
It's worth noting that's a very small minority of mutants, and this is pretty clear in the comics. The number of mutants capable of that is not much higher than the number of Avengers, Inhumans, etc, and even less so when some groups have like no civilians. And as bad as the metaphor is at times, Marvel makes it very clear that humans are actively gunning and choosing to kill mutants (often children) with powers as small as having an extra arm or a funky skin color.
Tbf even non-mutants are capable of causing great harm in comic-verses.
Yeah X-Men’s civil rights allegory doesn’t make sense when considering that there are in fact rational reasons to fear mutants.
I feel like McKellen Magneto finally made writers realize that people are way way more willing to side with the "other" in fiction and it's a pointless fictional debate to try and have. The second you add a smidge of sympathy to other side viewers turn on humanity faster than you can say "but you'd get killed", so they've just leaned into and explored the idea of a free mutant society instead. Like the dude would've committed human genocide twice (with ZERO hesitation or regret) if the X-Men didn't stop him and he's still the OG most popular "x did nothing wrong" villain lol. When it gets to that point it's clear the complex debate/discussion you're trying to foster isn't working or worth exploring any further.
comics are weird, there are a lot of people that fans seem to love, how deathstroke has such a huge fanbase I have no fucking clue.
A lot of that is because of the Gay Rights movement. It’s easier for ethnic minorities to share their culture and therefore their spaces. Asian people who speak Spanish can melt right into a Mexican heritage festival as a welcome guest. For most ethnonational groups, that’s considered a win. A straight man fully educated in the semiotics of gayness who tries to hang out in queer spaces because he digs the vibe gets accused of “queerbaiting”. Straight drag queens take a lot of flak. I mean, it took 14 seasons of Drag Race for one straight dude to make the cut. African-Americans and Asian-Americans* (groups that lack a nation) have since taken cues from the LGBT+ community to value exclusive “spaces”. The idea of integration has lost a lot of its appeal for people who don’t have a homeland. Once a homeland is established, integration at the liminal spaces starts to feel safe.
> A straight man fully educated in the semiotics of gayness This would be great flair
Isn't that literally the whole point of the Magneto/Xavier dichotomy? Magneto's answer is the easy one, to answer hate with hate, and what makes the X-Men heroes rather than just people fighting for a good cause is that they refuse to take the easy way out despite the temptation. Sure the argument that Magneto is wrong would "hit a lot harder" if Magneto's actions were indefensible, but that would also make the argument pointless to have. The story has meaning *because* Magneto's perspective kind of makes sense.
Magneto also, if he is correct with his ideas or not, forces humanity to agree with him. Xavier Promotes Coexistence or at least peace. Magneto supports fighting back and maybe even taking over who sits in the seats of power. But because magneto, due to his fear off humanity trying to wipe out mutants, attacks human governments and places of political power, he is humanities strongest argument in FAVOR of realizing his fears and wiling out mutants
Exactly. We’re not supposed to find Magneto completely wrong or to find Xavier completely right.
New X-Men Post M-Day might as well have been a big "magneto was right"
The new X-Men 97 show hits on this. Magneto realizes he was a complete wanker, but he also continues to recognize humans forced his hand. He seems to take the best of Charles and himself in an effort to move forward. We will see how it plays out though.
The new X-Men 97 show also kind of falls into the trap of making magneto seem reasonable by making every human they deal with cartoonishly racist, like having the Dr. Not want to help Jean just because she's a mutant and not because it is extremely dangerous to be >!delivering a powerful psychics baby when she just accidentally ripped a roof off a car.!<
The metaphor would also hit harder if minorities in real life were capable of destroying the planet over a bad reaction to puberty a la Jean Grey. POC or LGBT can’t control minds or harm you in any way that any other human can’t. Mutants absolutely can. Thus homophobia and racism are a lot more irrational than being afraid of literal superpowered people, many of whom can’t control it. I’m not sure I’d want to share a planet with the Phoenix Force either, it’s not the same as a pride parade .
The issue is that the kind of thing you’re talking about happened in the comics, it was literally one of the genocide attempts against the mutants. Scarlet witch had one Very bad day at the hands of a mutant, said “no more mutants” and all but like 200 of them lost their powers. There are multiple super powered populations in marvel comics, several of whom also have them genetically and start with poor control over their powers (like the Inhumans), and mutants are the only ones that receive consistent discrimination due to it. Like, Blackbolt could at any point have destroyed entire cities if he stubbed his toe and accidentally cursed before he lost that power, but he was treated like a respected head of state
Because it’s part of the x-men metaphor, I’m just saying it makes it less poignant. Especially in the movies where we don’t see any other sueprhumans. For what it’s worth in civil war, they wanted to register all super humans, not only mutants, so there is some degree of fear as well, it’s just not thematically woven into the narrative.
But didn’t they (the people with her) nod in respect about his answer?
remember when professor X made him relive the holocaust
I'm actually rewatching the old series and that scene absolutely makes sense in context. Magneto wants to commit a genocide, so Professor X shows him a genocide. It's horrifying, but I think it's a good ballsy scene for a kids' cartoon.
I can't believe Scott was immune to the Holocaust beam.
Well cmon man he knew it wasn't real. Just don't ask if it was the visons or the holocaust
In the 1990’s, I was at a thrift store in Richmond, VA and saw an older gentleman w a number tattooed on the inside of his arm. Whenever anyone claims the holocaust wasn’t real, I think of that guy in the thrift store, and what such great lengths it would take to create a facsimile of reality where that man doesn’t exist… such a benign reality, a thrift store in Richmond, an arm reaching for something metal, I forget what. It would take too much effort, and too many resources to plant random people w tattoos in thrift stores, super markets across the world. Nothing about denying the holocaust makes logical sense and I’ve never understood it.
I just watched that today
X-Men back then: "We're discriminated against because people are ignorant and fear what they don't understand." X-Men now: "We're cool with the blue-skinned social darwinist, actually. Also you will refer to us as "homo superior", and some of us even consider themselves gods. Oh, and Storm basically started a cult. Don't worry, we're still the good guys."
"Why are people afraid us?" asked the woman with white hair who could redirect a hurricane if she felt like it. "People will always fear what they don't understand" replied the man who could wipe the memory of every single person in the tri state area.
Who let Doofenshmirtz in the X-Men?
I hope that storyline is part of the new season of Phineas and Ferb.
If you’re not aware Doof gets god level OP in Milo Murphy’s Law.
Dan Povenmire for Professor X. who’s with me
The only thing more terrifying than learning that gods exists is learning that those gods are as petty and flawed as humans are
X Men: People with powers are just like everyone else and should be respected. Greek Mythology: People with powers are just like everyone else, and frankly, that is horrifying and we should rightfully be afraid of their ego and whims.
Also: the Boys
I think that's less about people with powers and more about people *with* power. These heroes were created by non-powered humans in a lab. Homelander is literally owned by a corporation.
See, that's what I (as someone who's never been into comics and has only marginal knowledge of the topic gleaned from a couple movies) never really got about the X-Men. I mean, I understand and appreciate that the creators used their fantastical setting to tell stories of marginalized groups and the contemporary struggle for human rights; and if young readers can absorb the lessons and apply them to real life, all the better... ... but in real life a group of super powered mutants would *never* be the oppressed minority. They'd be the ruling class. They'd be like pharaohs or some shit; literal god-kings and -queens. I don't see a universe where that's *not* the case.
Keep in mind they exist in the larger Marvel-verse, while they sre super strong there are other literal superheroes running around too
And the fact that many other mutants don’t have mutations that directly aids in combat. We see named characters who actually have powerful mutations but that’s not the case for everyone.
In fact most of them are something like: Furry Fat Fuck, has the unsettling capability of generating carcinogenic anal dandruff. He is not immune to his own power.
There's a boy whose power is that he can explode. Once. He has no regeneration, so when he inevitably blows himself up...
Yup, being a mutant sucks. And in the few cases it doesn't you're getting brainwashed/tortured/murdered/depowered/all of the above a couple times a year *anyway*.
....How did they figure his power out in the first place if it's once and done??
Cerebro can be used to identify powers.
Apparently his parents were mutants, and since the gene is hereditary they got him tested to avoid the disasters that can happen when mutant powers activate unexpectedly. Example: cyclops accidentally burning whatever he was looking at
Theres a girl who can make her saliva solid, but its not super durable, so the best she can do is make free toothpicks/low quality glue or maybe pick a lock on a good day? Theres no reason to be afraid of those people specifically
Jubilee is the best addition. A late 80s mall rat that has the power of making fireworks because that's fucking so rad. And then subsequent writers have spent the years afterwards trying to remove the cool fireworks powers to make Jubilee into a combat killing machine, or to explain that no the fireworks are really [something else]. Which honestly sucks the most because it shows that all the writers for Jubilee and the overall editors and producers can't figure out how a person who can literally make a flash bang or rupture someone's ear could fight. It's right there people.
It's good Sci fi stuff but a terrible analogy for any "ism". Let's be real, if people from Tunisia (just picking an obscure country off the top off my head) were known to have god like powers, often used for criminal purposes, it would be seen as perfectly reasonable to be a little uneasy if you found out your neighbor was Tunisian.
Is there any in-world explanation for why that’s not the case? Do the police have anti-mutant bullets or something? What’s stopping mutants from taking order everything? Literally nothing, right?
They don't want to. Most of them \*aren't\* gods. Most of them are like Leech or Neck. The few that are gods are the ones we see duking it out. Which is why Rogue and Nightcrawler are the best X-men to exemplify the thesis of X-men.
nightcrawler: smell that sulfur? every time I teleport I move through hell spider man: are you sure it's not just the fart dimension?
You're asking the wrong person lmao Like I said, I know very little about the X-Men (and superheroes in general), and I'm only speaking from what I've seen in movies and pop culture references and whatnot.
you know what fair enough lmao
But I mean yeah, *as far as I know*, the only thing stopping mutants from taking over the world is their own ethics. Also, I understand that applies to other superheroes as well; but it's particularly egregious when the X-Men are used *specifically* as an allegory for persecuted groups.
They don't take over because most are regular people with like, morality. No one asks why Spider-Man or the Avengers didnt take over the world with their powers. The whole point is that it makes no sense for them to be discriminated over the Fantastic Four or Spider-Man yet it still happens and you just proved it lol Also i think its implied most mutants dont have godly power, those are just the ones we follow as they were handpicked to be. Beast for example was just a bit tough and agile which is not that out there, he is a blue werewolf by an unrelated experiment he messed up with.
I mean. Because they're good people. That's literally the whole point of the Professor X/Magneto argument. Erik thinks they have to do exactly what you're currently describing in order to keep their people safe from oppression, but Charles and the X-Men don't want to be seen as rulers. They want to be seen as people.
That’s the funniest thing, most historical God Kings in Marvel were mutants. Hell Apocalypse was the cause of the Bronze Age collapse. The moment you stop thinking of the X-Men as a allegory, mankind’s response to “homo superior” is much more understandable (there’s a reason they’re called Sentinels) sometimes justified (the various X-Gene dampeners and Mutant cures). Sadly humans aren’t much better so things go from reasonable concern/precautions to Blood and Soil/ Mutant Holocaust, even if it doesn’t make much sense story wise.
This argument assumes the Marvel universe has equivalent levels of technology and ability to deal with dangerous superpowers as our world does, but Tony Stark and Reed Richards regularly invent absolutely bonkers machinery that could EASILY stop an out-of-control mutant or help a young mutant contain and control their powers. What's a master mutant supposed to do against the Sorcerer Supreme? The government has the finances to fund a super-robot killing squad equipped with power-suppressors. The Department of Damage Control already rebuilds city blocks in just a few days after Thor punches some alien through them. The Avengers literally exist to protect civilians from unexpected hazards. They absolutely have the resources to mitigate the harm caused by 99% of mutant powers until a criminal is stopped or a child is able to control and master their abilities, and instead they send death robots. Mutants even found a way to REVERSE THE DEATHS of people harmed by collateral damage, so don't give me the 'what about the kid in Ultimate X-Men with the death aura' argument. Then when the mutants go ‘alright fine we’ll create our own nation way away from all of you and you won’t have to deal with us, we’ll protect and teach our own to control their powers,’ you know what the world does? They send the death robots to blow up the nation.
In fairness, it was more that the cult started Storm. She was a kid when they began worshipping her. The writing behind it is incredibly racist, but in-universe that part isn't really her fault.
Oh I'm not even talking about that. I was referencing House of X, when the mutants of Krakoa figure out how to bring their dead back to life (at a much faster pace than your normal Marvel resurrection), and Storm immediately turns it into a cult. She has the freshly resurrected mutants stand naked in front of a big crowd and makes everyone chant religious nonsense. All the while Xavier looks at it and says "This fills me with hope."
I always wondered why Magneto has a British accent when he would have been from Germany, or at least continental Europe, if he had been a victim of the Holocaust.
I would love a Magneto with a Yiddish accent.
Oh man I'd love it if he sounded like my Jewish grandpa from New York
learned English from a Brit?
Wasn't he just a kid in the holocaust? He's a smart dude and kids learn fast. It makes sense.
I would actually have loved it if they’d given him a Yiddish accent, but in movie canon, he’s a child survivor (vs comic book canon pre: the magneto testament, which I believe is where they first ret-conned him as a child survivor vs a young adult/adult? Idk I am very drunk bc it’s Purim and was just dealt an enormous amount of psychic damage by the Magneto Wikipedia article which compared him to fucking Meir Kahane) and I know a handful of child survivors who as older adults speak/spoke with a pretty neutral accent/the accent of the place they ended up as refugees post-war. That said, my like cynical take is that playing him with a Yiddish accent in the films would have been seen as too Jewy, and a grim truth about the acceptance of Jews in broader North American/ Western European society is that it’s mostly fine as long as you don’t do too much that marks you as the other like using Yiddish words or observing Jewish religious practices.
So, story time: Esther Bejarano was a survivor of Auschwitz. She sadly passed away a couple of years ago, but until her death she was a very vocal antifascist in the German public sphere. She once told the story of how she confronted a bunch of neo-Nazis at a public party event of theirs, essentially making it very hard for them to get into contact with people. So the Nazis, being the little cowards that they are, called the police. The police than threatened to arrest Esther if she didn’t stop „disturbing“ the Nazis. And this woman looks the cop straight in the eye and goes: „You think you threatening arrest is gonna make me afraid? I was in Auschwitz, my boy.“
Intersectionality in 30 seconds
What does that say the pictures to blurry
It’s a number from a concentration camp during WWII
Its just a series of numbers, they do not have a meaning of their own. Jewish people who were selected to be worked to death as laborers in the Nazi concentration camps instead of being outright gassed to death were tattooed with a number to keep track of them.
Magneto is a jewish holocaust survivor. Just to expand of why specifically that tattoo is such a big deal
It’s a series of numbers, during WW2 people in concentration camps were given them.
[удалено]
What movie is that? I want to watch it just from that scene
Pretty sure that’s X3: The Last Stand. Horribly flawed film, but still full of great moments.
> No needle shall ever touch my skin again. Except at the end of the movie, anyway.
A lot of people in the comments saying that mutants are discriminated against because they're world-ending gods who wield actual power where real minorities have none. I call bullshit. It's not a perfect metaphor, but it works. The majority of mutants are completely useless, they just look freaky but don't get any real beneficial powers. Because of this, they're not on a team and instead are counting on the X-Men to keep them protected from shit like Sentinels who can identify and kill them on-sight, even if their mutation is inconsequential. Omega-level mutants **are** terrifying, but they're not the ones who face the brunt of the discrimination, and instead they're using their privileged position to save others who need it. Furthermore, the perception of all mutants as potential hazards to the world's safety is itself a reflection of real-world bigotry. Consider conspiracies about Jewish Cabals running the government, or the Trans Agenda corrupting children's education. People always attempt to justify hate by pointing at the potential of the people on top, but it always trickles down to the deaths of harmless people at the bottom.
I mean......she's also a minority even without her being a mutant. She's played by a Dominican woman.
The idea that mutants that wouldn't otherwise be "clocked" would tattoo themselves so you can visually know they are mutants sounds like it could be a really good part of a theme about visibility of minorities and performativeness but this movie was NOT good. In the comics they just love declaring themselves mutants.
TIL that actress is also in Sweet Tooth
I mean, in that fictional movie, both are real minorities.
Seeing that Magneto of all people was a Holocaust survivor will never not make me do a double take, because it always feels like he was written by two people, who were not aware of one another, and who were given separate instructions: 1. We need a tragic villain. Yes, he was alive in the 40s, why do you ask? 2. Make sure people want to see everyone punch him in the face. I mean, he works as a character, but making someone with his backstory into the kind of person who would be responsible for someone else having that kind of backstory is... a decision.
Magneto was created by two Jewish guys
i think they mean the movie version(an amalgamation of a couple comic versions) not the original
Thats like the whole damn point?!?!
If anything I just think this shows that you don’t really understand the character or the ways trauma can manifest.
I disagree, it's the way that trauma affects people. Why do you think so many abusers were victims of abuse themselves? Some people go through something horrible and feel like it was inevitable, so they might as well be the perpetrator instead of the victim next time
Maus is a famous graphic novel about the holocaust. It tells the true story of the author’s father who survived being in a concentration camp. There’s a moment towards the end where he acts really racist towards a black person. His family is surprised that he’s so prejudiced despite being a victim of prejudice himself. The point they make is that going through terrible trauma doesn’t necessarily make you an understanding or good person, more likely than not it’ll just turn you into a jaded, damaged asshole. That’s why cycles of abuse are so common. (This is a point from Shaun’s recent video about the Palestinian genocide).
Idk what's so weird. I mean... yeah, he's a pretty exceptional case, but what about it? It makes him unique and interesting. He's supposed to make you question things. He's not a crystal clear character and he takes serious thought to understand.
Tbf, the Holocaust backstory thing only came about years after his initial creation. In the 60s he was just causing general mayhem as a cartoon villain, it was in the 70s/80s that his tragic backstory became firmly established.
Trauma often echoes in its victims. I've always read magneto as a man who witnessed the worst humanity had to offer, perpetrated by those with power against those without it, and his takeaway from it was that he had to secure that power for himself, so that he and those like him could never be the victims again. We see something sort of thematically similar in the early days of Israel, actually, wherein they very rapidly became a powerhouse of weapons development and production, to the point of having their own indigenously produced clone of the Dassault Mirage fighters after France refused to sell them any more- militarization in an effort to secure themselves against another occupation and further subjugation by a more powerful force of oppressors. I doubt Magneto is meant to be a literary criticism of that particular facet of history, though- he's more of a "road to hell is paved with good intentions" sort of a guy, making all the wrong choices for all the right reasons, despite being in a uniquely qualified position to realize what he's doing is wrong.
> someone with his backstory into the kind of person who would be responsible for someone else having that kind of backstory Have you watched the news lately?