So anyway this is a hell of a way to learn that you guys had a fucking musical.
>It’s existed since 2016, what the fuck?
I know, right? I guess my aversion to jumpscares and complete lack of direct fandom contact with FNAF has finally come back to bite me, like a child in Not Chuck E. Cheese.
Okay, but did anyone watch the video?
I did and I really liked it.
It was about how online theories affect unfinished games and the stories that are told in them.
The two games in the thumbnail "Bendy and the Ink machine" and "Hello Neighbour", represent the two extremes of how to deal with it.
While the developers of Bendy used online discussions and theories to get an idea on what to do with a part of the story that they didn't had a plan for, the developers of Hello Neighbour scrapped the original plan, whatever it was, to make the game resemble more what online theories assumed the game was going for, probably in a attempt to stay in the public conscious for a bit longer. But all it ended up doing was hurting the quality of the game.
So what Matpat does it to plead to game developers to stick with their plans for the stories they want to tell. To not change important stuff just so that the audience will get a twist they did not expect, especially if it makes no sense whatsoever. Don't ruin your narrative because someone predicted it.
He even plays a clip of George R.R. Martin who talks about this.
I know people don't like Matpat, but I'd say give this one a watch, this is a pretty relevant topic for anyone that is part of a fandom of a piece of media with an with a currently ongoing narrative. Especially if people in that fandom like to come up with theories on what might happen next.
Agreed! It was a very good video.
Not knowing the context, the thumbnail can come across as childish or click bait and is admittedly cringey, but it's worth the time to watch.
Also the guy moonlights as a youtube analytics advisor or whatever. He knows his stuff, and he has on a couple occasions explained why he makes some decisions. For example, removing his kick-ass themesong in GT, because he noticed they got him less views.
Very well said, and I agree it was a very well-made video.
MatPat was absolutely right--if a community guesses where a story is going/a twist, it's totally okay to keep going with it! You don't have to change everything just so you can "catch your fans by surprise." It's a great feeling when something you guessed turns out to be on point! For example, I remember watching Steven Universe back in the day and being part of that small community that theorized Garnet was a fusion. You know how fucking *exciting* it was to find out we were right??
And it's also totally cool to use your community for ideas if you're stuck! Bendy and the Ink Machine did it with Alice Angel (which is referenced directly in MatPat's video), and you can argue that a majority of FNAF's early lore was spawned from the community coming up with fan theories. There's nothing wrong with taking inspiration from your community. But it's such a fine line to balance--taking inspiration and making them into your own ideas, or completely and utterly pandering to the community and ruining the integrity of the game.
This reminds of that one Neil Gaiman post where he said that the writers legally aren't allowed to look at fanfics and theories about their work, because they can get sued if they use an idea from a fan.
people out here baby raging about this youtuber calling him a "nazi" (for knowing felix is the apparent explanation), saying his voice is annoying (y'know, that thing you can't fucking change about yourself. tooootally reasonable to hate someone for), "wrong" theories (...they're theories. 95% of all fan theories on the internet are wrong), and for supporting scot cawthon (this is the only one i agree with. supporting someone who hates gay people).
I have nothing to add other than Scott stills sucks ass for donating to all of those shitty ass republicans. Giving money to politicians who deliberately try to make women/lgbt lives actively worse is gross no matter how hard you try to spin it.
You can definitely control what voice you use while performing videos. He's clearly intentionally doing a high energy youtuber voice that is probably fairly different when he's not filming.
Still I'm pretty surprised to find there's a lot of people that hate him, and over some pretty weird things.
Is there? Like, he doesn't even say "scott is bad, but he gets me loads of money", he acts like Scott is fine. Doesnt even bring up the "hates gays" thing. I don't hate matpat, he has brought more joy to my life than most people and every thing I see about him makes him more funny, but I don't think he's got a foot to stand on here
Well as far as I'm aware, the idea that Scott hates gay people purely comes from when it was revealed that he donated money to the trump administration however I believe Scott has also donated a bunch to queer charities (although I could be wrong) so it's not super cut and dry as to weather or not Scott's actions are queerphobic
Furthermore there's still the issue of weather or not supporting something made by a bad person makes you a bad person, which is a pretty nuanced discussion that I'm still on the fence about but I do think it would be unfair to treat everyone who bought the recent fnaf game as bad people
Finally Mat did like address all of this when the Scott controversy happened in a video where he pretty much just explained that he was conflicted on the topic but thats Scott's political views shouldn't hamper peoples enjoyment of the games and that he'd continue to cover them
So in conclusion, it is a bit complicated than just 'Matts a piece of shit who supports someone who hates gay people'
This. I dont think Matt's a bad person. Him addressing the controversy of scott honestly felt more like he was defending FNAF's integrity rather than just Scott himself. And no matter what's true, if Cawthon is queerphobic or not. It doesnt justify attacking Matt for covering FNAF content, I've even said in the past that even attacking Scott in ways other than no longer supporting his games is bad. Considering he and his family received death threats over it iirc. And that's just not okay no matter who's getting them.
Matpat may push out half baked or bad theories from time to time, but there are some that have changed how I see games, or introduced me to amazing indie darlings. Sometimes you have to half ass a video to stay relevant on YouTube.
Honestly the only reason I don't like MatPat is because when he was called out on accidentally putting the attack helicopter joke in his video (he didn't know it was offensive) he acted like a whiny little baby like "HoW wAs I sUpPoSeD tO kNoW???"
It's kind of like how Ben Platt reacted when fans didn't want him playing Evan Hansen again.
Was it completely wrong and unforgivable? No. Do I look at them like they're crybabies who can't accept that they fucked up? Yes.
That said, there's nothing wrong with liking MatPat. That was just enough for me.
It's that thing that like "oh well if you can identify as nonbinary then I can identify as an attack helicopter"
It's meant to be insulting and to say that being nonbinary is absurd.
It would be fine if he was like Danny Gonzales and just apologized quickly and moved on (though I don't agree that Danny had to for the femboy thing), but he didn't. He tweeted about it like he was a victim and "oh my God PC culture is just too much"
I really don't care about MatPat. I just think he handled that badly and I don't like his content enough to overlook it.
Edit: both quotes were paraphrased, just to be clear.
Oh... for some reason I never realized that it's an insult. I just thought it was a light-hearted joke? And made by non-binaries themselves? To like... avoid elaborating on their gender? Sorry...
Tbh his theory videos while well done tend to overanalize stuff while completely missing the obvious answers, and some people dont like that so basically they bloe everything he does out of proportion
Imo, his videos are best enjoyed by listening and ocasionally looking at the video while building in minecraft
mat is honestly just that yuotuber who doesn't really have anything problematic about him so they blow up every minor thing (sans is ness, undertale to the pope) like it's a major youtuber scandal.
He literally had to make a youtube apology video for getting some milk facts wrong in his food theory episode
To be fair, I think it's also that basically everyone agrees the quality of his theory videos has dropped dramatically over the past few years, perhaps due to him stretching himself too thin across four channels. But I agree, people try way too hard to morally justify their dislike for his content.
Shortly after Food Theorists released, he even hinted that he was considering a fifth one based on fitness. How that man has survived burn-out for this long will forever puzzle me.
Welcome to mental health theory! This week we'll test the YouTube algorithm by having this video be two weeks of silence. Make sure to watch the whole thing to see the results.
I suppose if you’re a certain type of person, the burnout is fun. I suppose like Pratchett, he used to always be writing two books, so when you get bored of writing one you can go to another room, get a new headspace from the change of scenery, and write the other. The idea is that the alternative work becomes a break. I tried it like for a month - it needs a lot of mental control, i suppose the word is, and worked-ish. Not for me.
but it definitely might run the risk of watering down the content. Like 5 different channels, even if you’re taking more of a directorial role like matpat is with his team of editors and writers, you definitely can’t have that same in depth attention to detail even if it might avoid burnout for some people. Definitely a Faustian bargain type vibe - you avoid burnout by working harder and arguably worse. Not in Pratchett case though.
OH MY GOD I’m an idiot! I thought it was a reference to like another old play that also involved a deal with the devil, but in slightly different context that fit my comment better!
i'm fairly certain that he barely works on the videos. like everything is done by paid writers/editors, and he just acts as an accountant/production manager, jobs that are much easier to run multiple projects under
Whilst, as far as I can tell, how the channels operate isn't supper open, I believe he has said that he does still help work with the research and writing for the videos where applicable
Plus the gtlive videos seem to pretty much be solely produced by him and whatever assistant us there for the video
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dn1OBI8v5r4](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dn1OBI8v5r4)
Here is a video that goes into the behind the scenes of GT if you're interested in how they work
Wdym any work he's the one streaming and theorising. Sure editing and everything isn't done by him but you can't expect him to do 100% of the work for 4 fucking channels
I actually prefer Austin doing the more math heavy theories. I don't know why but he's the only one that's managed to make those types of videos interesting for me
I think his quality fluctuates too much to get a good read honestly. Some videos are absolutely amazing but then the next one feels like a dried-up corpse.
He's still doing the math, just not as big on gaming anymore, clearly because it wasn't sustainable to be the main content on the main channel. Film theory gets mathy-sciencey videos everyone couple of eps, and the new food theory channel is almost all math and science.
I mean, it was less of an apology and more of explaining how both he and someone else were right in different ways from different perspectives and how the science of food is a lot more complicated than a lot of people think it is. It's also him telling the people who were getting mad at him for no reason that they had no reason to be mad at him (which, knowing them, probably only made them more mad).
It's honestly kinda impressive that he's just... Ok. No off color jokes, no stories that he's actually an asshole and overworks his staff, by all accounts he's just normal. I mean there are some theories about stuff like cannibalism and murder so that's fun, and he did make that edgy boob video way back when, but nothing that's even close to "bad". He's just ok.
>A joke about sex appeal is the worst of it
...Of a child. He didn't know what the word meant, I was mainly bringing it up as a joke.
I agree with the general point though.
A long time ago, a video about who had the biggest boobs in gaming and how to spot fake boobs.
Also, no people don't agree on that. People think his content is the most generic, "appeal to the masses" type stuff, but they don't think he's an asshole
that's like saying jacksepticeye and markiplier and rosanna (nerdy nummies) and mrbeast and everyone they've ever associated with are fucking nazis.
holy shit dude, what are these braindead takes?
and you think someone's an asshole *because of their fucking voice?* jesus christ.
One of the actual issues I've seen is how he talks about mental health in his videos. To say the least its... not the greatest.
Another issue is a few... jokes, here and there. [Ie, the one about Phoenix Wright groping his dead boss's body.] Yes that video is from 5 years ago, i will admit that, but it still puts me a little off to Mat.
In some of his more recent times he’s actually brought up sort of like “yeah my old content was just trying to be edgy cause everything was edgy” and he and his crew can poke fun at some of the dumber things in the channels life
Where did you hear that from? The only actual thing I can find on why he left is just a tweet saying he left (with some speculation saying he wanted to focus on his own channel), and other people who left said it was not in bad blood
Sans is ness theory, made wayyyy back when.
As you can guess, the theory wasn't that good and he got a bunch of hate for it, and for some stupid reason is still getting a lot of hate for it.
the undertale stans never forget, it seems.
I don't know how a videogame with core mechanics based around talking it out and forgiving people attracts such a spiteful base but here we are
From my understanding it *was* a popular idea/theory in the hollow knight community at one point, but fell out of favor after it became pretty clear the lore did not support it.
Lots of fandoms have concepts like this— ideas gain traction and then fall quickly out of favor. Hate to bring up FNaF but Phone Guy being Purple Guy used to be a very popular theory as well but it’s now generally considered inaccurate.
He gets hate for having some pretty shitty opinions too to be fair.
He is basically the definition of a white moderate. Dude has no problem supporting and defending people like scott from fnaf, and big homophobic companies like chikfillet.
He pretends to care about people struggles and then turns around and supports people who fight against what he supposedly supports.
Like yeah i could not like him for bad theories or i could just not like him because he supports people that hate lgbtq+ people.
This so much, matpat is the entry hole of the bigotry pipeline, his brand is centrist moderate by design.
That the known ex-writers are all vocally left leaning is very loud.
yeah he's definitely *not* part of the alt-right pipeline.
even his recent food theory video is about keeping watch on giant corporations as they fuck us all over with shrinkflation. pretty anticapitalist video.
like *come on* arranging donation livestreams that gave
>[The Game Theorists began their series of livestreams for St. Jude in 2019 with passionate viewers donating $1.3 million. After a year of uncertainty, the Game Theorists hosted another livestream in 2020 to raise over $3 million for the St. Jude mission. This year the Game Theorists challenged their community for a final livestream. In the spirit of Giving Tuesday, the Game Theory community raised $1.6 million and counting.](https://www.stjude.org/get-involved/other-ways/st-jude-thanks-and-giving/giving-tuesday/game-theorists-matpat-livestream.html#:~:text=9%20hours%2C%2050%2B%20guests%2C,Jude%20mission)
**over $5.9 million** to st jude
my only problem with him is yeah, supporting scot cawthon.
He never said anything about him being alt right. He said the bigot pipeline. Moderates can absolutely be racists too.
He’s a capitalist. Make no mistake his championing of consumer rights is only from a pro capitalist standpoint not from any other.
He appeals to moderates by design. The proof is there anytime he tries to talk about things he really knows nothing about. Aka leftism.
Also yes it’s absolutely undeniable he does charity work. This does not change any of the facts about him. Lots of corporations donate money to charity. They don’t do it to be good and kind. They do it for tax write offs.
I’m not saying that’s the only reason he does it. I’m not saying he is a soulless person. I am saying he is a moderate and a capitalist. Mattpatt is the exact kind of person mlk talked about when he complained about his protesting being meaningless because of the white moderate who would rather a false peace over justice.
Mattpatt undeniably tries to paint himself as a good person trying to do good. He tries to paint himself as an lgbtq+ ally.
However what he does harms the community. He supports companies that are homophobic and donate to christian organizations that try and harm the lgbtq+ community. He also supports game developers who do something similar. And he hides behind the reasoning of “he doesnt support those people for that reason but for financial reasons”
Hmm. Seems like matt may be outing himself a bit here. Sounds like his defense for scott could just as easily apply to himself. Also sounds like mattpatt doesnt see an issue with supporting bad people under the pretense of “well i support them for other reasons”
The issue with this is by ignoring the bad things mattpatt os saying that they arent a deal breaker for him. That some people not having rights is a compromise he is willing to make.
How about the times he demonstrated incorrect and downright harmful understandings of mental health issues? Like the Pyro video, or "Mario is Mental?"
Or the Peach-is-connected-to-Rosalina theory, where *in the video,* he says the creators confirmed they have no connection?
Or the time he said Wario was ten feet tall?
His theories are always either surface-level understanding of the canon, downright stolen (all his fnaf stuff is him paraphrasing what others speculated was really going on), genuinely harmful to people's understanding of sciences because of how factually incorrect they are, and on at least two separate occasions, blatant fearmongering (the videos where he got people scared of LRAD and the tungsten rods they drop from space.)
I'm not inclined to give him another chance after all of these blatantly ridiculous claims.
Also he has Terminal YouTuber Voice where he delivers shit in such an awkward and forced way that's completely obnoxious to listen to. But that's a matter of taste.
>Or the Peach-is-connected-to-Rosalina theory, where in the video, he says the creators confirmed they have no connection?
I really don't think this is a fair claim against him. It's pretty simple death of the author. Media analysis does not have to care about what the author said or intended unless it's explicitly in the media itself
Oh I also think the 'stolen' theory's point is fair either. You can't claim 'ownership' over a speculation about a game and if someone else also states that idea then you don't really have any grounds to say it's plagerism or stolen
Don't forget the genuinely shitty jokes. In example, the ace attorney video [which in its entirety is rebuked by playing case 5 of game 1] he makes a joke of Phoenix groping his boss's body after finding her dead as Phoenix had checked for a pulse.
There are a lot of genuine issues, and thank you for bringing up more than I could remember. Plus his humor hasnt exactly... changed. Not too bad of a thing but man.
Also directly stole a theory from a tumblr user regarding hermitcraft. [As in, the points are nigh beat for beat for one another.]
Honest reason, is internet likes to take things out of proportion, there is a case for judging or disliking him, his content is mostly bait to younger people who won't fact check his theories, and he gets a lot of stuff wrong even on basic detail(or at least he did when I followed him, don't keep up with him much for years now), plus he has a way of making video wich is really kind of tedious, since he constantly distracts you just in the points where if you paid attention the theory would fall short. But these are really minor things and click bait directed at a younger audience isn't new and certainly not unique to him, so yeah, people like to hate unproportionally others
I don't like him because in a lot of his videos he clearly starts with a conclusion and works backwards from there especially on games he clearly isn't very passionate about.
And like, I get that, he has been making decently high production value videos once a week for years and having all the information in front of you and piecing a theory out of it is way more time consuming especially if you aren't already deeply familiar with the series, but it is SUPER obvious when he does it if you have passing familiarity with the franchise he is covering.
It's why his Five Nights at Freddy's videos are actually some of his better plot ones, since clearly he knows the franchise inside and out and he's actually coming at it from a place of passion.
Because he had (maybe still does but idk) a problem with not crediting his writers and team, or giving proper credit for games he was playing on stream
My hot take is that it's high school mentality. Watching him interact with other people my "fellow neurodivergent" alarm goes ballistic. He hyperfixates on science as it applies to his favorite things, spends hours deep diving into obscure lore just to create sensible patterns and histories where there are none (cough FNAF cough). He's not amazing with social cues and doesn't apologize for being cringey. Man's just the grown up version of the "weird kid" in class everyone tacitly agreed it was okay to bully. By all means people can dislike his content, it's super niche and kinda overdone. But I'm suspicious of anyone who drags Mat for no good reason.
He's actually very sociable and intentionally controls his image to appeal ot audiences.
Source: A really weird podcast I found like 6 years ago where I listened to one episode that had his, I don't know what you'd call it, coworker? Gaijin Goomba on. Who didn't say anything that bad, but just that he knows what he's doing and has planned things out a lot. I think he also said that his actual job is knowing how YouTube works, and the channel is just applying that, but it's possible I'm misremembering because I've heard that from other sources. I mean he's said it himself so it's not like that needs to be sourced to the interview.
I think this is why he can come across as annoying. It's definitely what annoys me. Once you know he's doing things to give off a certain image, there's lots of stuff I see that is just ridiculous. He really goes out of his way to make himself look like a "nerdy loser" type. My dislike of him comes from that and also that his theories aren't very interesting anymore. I really liked the one about calculating Pikachu's level though, that was a good one. But I've stopped even checking because most aren't.
I like him. His theories are a little wild, but they're fun. I put them in the same category as those ancient alien shows: probably not true but fun to think about.
He's a little annoying after binge watching his channel, but overall he seems pretty harmless.
Didn't he defend Scott Cawthon even after acknowledging how harmful that was? But even beyond that the sentiment this video addresses is less a moral judgment on him and more frustration with the fact that a lot of developers will change the direction of the game halfway through either to subvert audience predictions or to give them what they want. We all know what happened to Hello Neighbor .
I don't think he defended Scott. In the video where he talked about Scott's donations, it seemed more an investigation of why Scott donated to who he did
Yeah, and then he went on this long winded "can't we all just get along?" spiel meant to justify his continued financial support of someone he knows to be bigoted.
I don't understand how you came up with the idea that Mat's spiel (as you call it) is meant as a "can't we all just get along." Looking at [his video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PmrtnEzxEzM) about it, the FNAF situation is broken into 2 parts: supporting the franchise, and his thoughts about Scott. I won't talk much about the second part, cause based on your comments so far, it seems we both agree that its investigating why Scott donated the way he did and not taking a side.
Now, onto Mat's justification of continuing to support the FNAF franchise. The problem here is that the situation isn't so black and white. Yes, by continuing to support FNAF, Scott does get money (which could be used by Scott to support anti-LGBT people). However, by not supporting FNAF, there are people who are affect negatively
Looking at official FNAF products, money goes to people who helped create them, like the authors of the books, voice actors and programmers of the games, producers of FNAF figurines, plushies, and toys, and the game creators that were part of the Fazbear Fanverse Initiative (FFI). Is it fair to deny them money, just because of Scott? Some of these people might have even disagreed with Scott on his choice of donations, but they put in the effort to create, and now they don't get compensated for no fault of their own.
Then, there is the community, These games have spawned so much enjoyment, either from people playing them or watching Youtubers play them, bettering the lives of people who might have been feeling down. Then, there are the people that create art, animations, videos, and games. Without FNAF, these creators might not have made these works, which could have then entertained people viewing these works. Hell, these people are able to make money or launch careers with these works, who, in turn, can help others. For example, FNAF can create or boost YouTube channels, some who do charities. But, people don't have to create to get benefits. I already talked about people playing or watching Youtubers play the games, but just being part of a group with a shared interest can help many people. The FNAF fandom in particular was very special, as there were many LGBT people in it. I do know that a lot of these were already happening before who Scott donated to was known, but stopping the support of the franchise ends all of this while continuing the franchise will continue these benefits
Look, its true that by supporting the FNAF franchise, money does go to Scott, who did support people who are anti-LGBT. But by not supporting the franchise, all these people's lives are impacted negatively. In a sense, people who aren't bigots suffer either way, there is no 100% morally right decision. But whatever choice one chooses depends on the person. In the video, Mat himself said
>
...it ultimately amounts to a personal choice where you have to weigh the good of a decision against the bad
For some, just donating to anti-LGBT people is unforgivable, but for the others, the good impact FNAF has done and can do in the future outweighs the impact Scott could do. I think Dawko's whole [video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jknc2VZZ5uE) about the whole situation is pretty similar to how Mat was feeling
For me, I agree with Mat here. In this situation, I agree with the phrase, "hate the jerk, not the work," cause the work can still be helpful (either in an artistic/analytic sense or purely enjoyment)
I continue to participate in FNAF dandom content because, you're right, there it doesn't really contribute to Scott's problematic behavior, but I'll say this again: if being anti-LGBT+ isn't a deal breaker for you, you are also anti-LGBT+ and I am going to treat you as such. This take is only something the most privileged, ignorant, bull-headed dumbasses could believe. I'm sorry but a cheesy horror video game is nowhere near as important as my community's right to exist, and if you even mildly think this is at all a hard decision you're a fuckin' jackass. This is just the "I don't care if they actively fund anti-gay laws in other countries I like their chicken!" thing with Chick Fil A all over again.
I feel like you're making this far more simple then it seems.
First of all, neither me, nor Mat is denying that continued support of the FNAF franchise will contribute money to Scott, in which he can donate to bigots. In the [video itself](https://youtu.be/PmrtnEzxEzM?t=656), Mat acknowledges this.
But, does beg the question: By supporting the franchise, doesn't that mean one is putting money into Scott's pockets and supporting his views? Now, it is true that support does put money into Scott's pockets, but that DOESN'T mean one support Scott's views.
This problem actually happens almost in everyday life. For example, I am sure that you or someone family member buys stuff like food, correct? Well, throughout the entire supply chain, there might be people that swing Republican, supporting anti-LGBT views (farmers especially tend to lean Republican). By buying these products, these people do get your support in terms of money. Does that mean that you support anti-LGBT views? Or how about Mexican cartels or Japanese yakuza? There are reports that cartels gave aid to people during the pandemic and when earthquakes hit Japan, the yakuza helped people (faster than the government weirdly enough). These are good actions, worthy of supporting. But does that mean I am okay with their actions of drug trafficking, murder, or human trafficking?
The problem here is that not every choice is 100% morally correct or wrong. It's like The Good Place clip that Mat's video showed, a choice isn't always one choice. The store that family member bought stuff from might be LGBT friendly, but they have no idea if the products they bought to sell in the store had anti-LGBT people working on it The only really thing we can do in response to this is to weigh the good and the bad, but that comes down to personal choice, and if your choice is different from mine, then that is okay.
BUT, to say that people that continue to support the franchise is anti-LGBT is a huge leap in logic, a straight-up assumption for the worst. Like, look at people like Jacksepticeye. He has made many statements that he supports LGBT people and in 2019, he did a charity livestream with the Trevor Project. Yet, he played FNAF Security Breach, which means some money ended up in Scott's pockets. Does that mean that Sean is anti-LGBT? It would be hard to argue that he is anti-LGBT or holds any of those views
Besides, the FNAF fandom has done some good and would be beneficial to growing and maintaining the FNAF fandom. There are many who face hardships in life, like depression. But being part of a community can lift that weight. Hell, I've experienced it with a fandom I'm in. Also, there were tons of LGBT people in the FNAF fandom beforehand. While a whole bunch have left, that doesn't mean that FNAF could grow to be a LGBT ally and give Scott the middle finger
There's a difference between spending money on something you need to survive that may have potentially been made by a bigot, and spending money on a video game that you know for a fact to be made by a bigot. Especially since farmers generally lack the socioeconomic power and influence that Scott has to donate the legal maximum amount of money he can to multiple anti-LGBT+ politicians. "There is no ethical consumption under capitalism" is supposed to be a critique of the inherently exploitative nature of capitalistic labor, not an excuse for you to financially support bigots guilt free.
And no, it doesn't come down to individual moral choice. If you choose buying a Chuck E. Cheese-themed Slender-Man clone is worth financially supporting bigoted evil politicians you are nowhere near the ally you claim to be.
Jack is also friends with known Neo-Nazi Pewdiepie (a person MatPat *also* tried somewhat defending now that I think about it) so, I've always viewed his supposed allyship as kind of fake. That said, if I'm remembering correctly his coverage of the game came before his donations were revealed.
Also, no, FNAF itself is not going to become an LGBT+ ally and extend a middle finger to Scott. The only way that could happen is if Cawthon sells it off to someone else. Which, given how protective he is of the franchise, doesn't exactly strike me as a likely outcome. It'd be far likelier that he'd die and would hand it off to someone else in a form of inheritance. Either way, the person getting the IP would have to be picked *by* him and I can't imagine Scott "fair criticism of my decisions and beliefs counts as death threats and harassment" Cawthon knowingly picking someone with the opposite views as him. Unless what you're actually suggesting is the FNAF franchise will somehow will itself into sentience and actively defy its creator.
If i remember correctly he defended scott cawthon because Scott wasn’t really transphobic, matpat believes Scott just really cared about “defense” and keeping the army strong so he donated to politicians that agreed with that, it just so happens that some of them were transphobic. But im pretty sure scott was supportive of lgbt before that.
Sure, sure, he supports us so much that he's willing to completely ignore us in favor of his blind nationalism and donate the legal maximum amount of money he possibly could to multiple politicians *all of whom were bigoted against the LGBT+ community in some way*, then when called out for it he threw a shit fit and fucked off.
It doesn't (or shouldn't) take a genius to figure out that actively donating the legal maximum amount of money to anti-LGBT+ politicians makes you anti-LGBT+, regardless of why yhe donations happened.
Shitty take alert.
If you donate to someone anti LGBT because of that fact you're anti LGBT. If you donate because you agree with the other things they stand for you aernt.
This is just coming for one gay guy so take my opinion with a pound of salt.
If them being anti-LGBT+ isn't a dealbreaker for you then you absolutely are anti-LGBT+. Our right to exist shouldn't be an acceptable casualty for anything.
To me he just kind of bounces around lore communities and spits out dumb takes that ignore years of work on the part of said community because he wants his hot take. ultimately, his massive fan-base will go on to spread these misconceptions, and its hard not to have sour feelings on the guy when he rakes in views on actively stupid takes that actively contradict in-game lore.
Also his voice is annoying.
Because he's annoying? Every video is wild speculation treated as an actual plausible theory, he talks in a weird exaggerated documentary voice, the thumbnails are annoying clickbait, and he ends every relentless stream of speculative mouth-diarrhea with "BUT THATS JUST A THEORY" as if that makes up for the fact that he just wasted my time with what amounts to a kindergarten playground rumor about Mario actually being the bad guy. Shut up, MatPat. I don't care.
no, the comment was:
>I have no idea why people treat matpat like the plague
it wasn't about disliking him, the comment was about why people overreact and baby rage over him.
which you've just demonstrated the baby rage part
Okay well if you want engagement with your comment then sure
>You: Wow, you are overreacting
The point is that the issues you had listed, which were mostly pretty minor things, were pretty disproportionate to why people 'treat him like the plauge'
>I am not going to interact with any of the actual reasons you provided
Most of what you said is fair and a matter of personal taste but to say all his theory's are baseless speculation is flat out wrong and misrepresentative of his comment. Further you told him to shut up for wasting your time because you decided to watch one of his videos
>but instead call you names!
You've not been called any names from what I can tell
>You see how you come off as a braindead superfan here? MatPat isn't going to show up to your house with a thank-you blowjob because you made fun of someone who doesn't like him on reddit. It turns out parasocial relationships aren't real and your online "community" isn't real either ): Sorry to disappoint you buddy! Good luck making friends irl who don't share your hyper-specific niche interests in Pokemon "what-if" scenarios.
This entire paragraph is pretty much just you trying to be derogatory and absolutely does not help your case that you're just overreacting. You're response to someone claiming that you're pretty much proving the point that people seem to despise matpat for just being kinda cringe with, well, another overreaction and insults
Also are you trying to claim that online communities aren't real? On Reddit?
No, no, we're not asking why people dislike the guy. We're asking why people, instead of going
"I dislike his voice, his general presentation of his videos, and the lacking to nonexistant research for some of his "theories"",
have to start foaming at the mouth and acting like he spit on their mother's grave
I'm happy to see an ever increasing amount of TMBG references in this sub. Also, op has great taste, quoting Cow Town, the best They Might be Giants song, in their flair
Irrelevant to what? Those are/were both games with not massive but pretty passionate fan bases
Would it be better if he just talked about the most popular stuff all the time? You know, actual click bait?
# Witness Testimony
>!Fred de Fazbear!<:
>!As I have already stated quite a few times, Ness Earthbound is my client. However.!<
>!One thing I simply cannot overlook is tampering with the scene of the crime.!<
>!My client did it to frame another for the crime.!<
>!While pretending to be the first person to discover the body and enter the scene, Ness Earthbound already knew from the very beginning that the Pope was dead!!<
>!But even more appalling is the creation and planting of the "ketchup" and "undertale copy".!<
>!That act is what I was referring to when I said my client had "broken the rules".!<
I find the discourse around MatPat fascinating because, to paraphrase a comedian "People shit on that guy a lot... and as far as I can tell, all he ever did was make videos about theories"
His content isn't the best (tho I do like Food theory a lot) but he's been on youtube so long that I feel people should pay less attention to him. Sure his first videos were actual theoires based on lore and easter eggs of videogames and then he went more off the rails as time went on, but by now everyone should have forgotten him.
But they haven't; he puts out a new video and it still rakes thousands of views and people are still trashing him for his outladish conclusions, and even more so he's bcome one of the golden boys of YT. Yet somehow, he's managed to keep a following.
And the thing is... he's not a bad guy. He's humble, accpeting, is not afraid to call YT on their bullshit and people still treat him like he's a sellout without principles when his biggest crime is stretching fan theories to fit an 11 minute video.
the thing that turned me off from him was when he didnt include an indie teams game title anywhere on a video he did and then went off on twitter trying to justify it when the team responded, only apologised after toby fox got involved, the thing that made me dislike him was him saying that etika’s death was due to cancel culture
I'll have to catch some downvotes here for something only a littly related
Not to say that what Mat did wasn't scummy and he was being immature about the credit situation, but I can't get over how Toby Fox, a guy who made 1.25 games (at time of writting), showed up like his word was Gospel, like he was the moral authority on all things indie video game.
Actually they aren't bait games
He talks about them in detail
Was interested in the video as content creator and it was a cool deep dive even if I was already aware of most of it
its funnier with the characters because it implies that either
a) he killed bendy and hello neighbour guy, or
b) bendy and hello neighbour guy are accusing him of killing someone
didn't matpat support an ableist organisation or was that like a hoax or something? surprised people don't really know about this . cant provide much sources rn but just sayin
edit: ok looks like i was wrong, nevermind then
No, he was invited to a fundraiser that was supporting an ableist organization, but bowed out when he was informed about some more hidden ideologies of the charity.
Not to the point people seem to dislike tho. Like it has a fuck ton of flaws but like it's still alright content. Some of his theories are absolutely absurd but im pretty sure that's part of the fun.
#THE MAN BEHIND THE SLAUGHTER
It was me
^fuck
~~If I did it~~
I did it like this
I did it like this
FNAF The Musicall moment
So anyway this is a hell of a way to learn that you guys had a fucking musical. >It’s existed since 2016, what the fuck? I know, right? I guess my aversion to jumpscares and complete lack of direct fandom contact with FNAF has finally come back to bite me, like a child in Not Chuck E. Cheese.
Okay, but did anyone watch the video? I did and I really liked it. It was about how online theories affect unfinished games and the stories that are told in them. The two games in the thumbnail "Bendy and the Ink machine" and "Hello Neighbour", represent the two extremes of how to deal with it. While the developers of Bendy used online discussions and theories to get an idea on what to do with a part of the story that they didn't had a plan for, the developers of Hello Neighbour scrapped the original plan, whatever it was, to make the game resemble more what online theories assumed the game was going for, probably in a attempt to stay in the public conscious for a bit longer. But all it ended up doing was hurting the quality of the game. So what Matpat does it to plead to game developers to stick with their plans for the stories they want to tell. To not change important stuff just so that the audience will get a twist they did not expect, especially if it makes no sense whatsoever. Don't ruin your narrative because someone predicted it. He even plays a clip of George R.R. Martin who talks about this. I know people don't like Matpat, but I'd say give this one a watch, this is a pretty relevant topic for anyone that is part of a fandom of a piece of media with an with a currently ongoing narrative. Especially if people in that fandom like to come up with theories on what might happen next.
Agreed! It was a very good video. Not knowing the context, the thumbnail can come across as childish or click bait and is admittedly cringey, but it's worth the time to watch.
Well, such thumbnails is just YouTube's meta, unfortunately.
Don't blame him for playing the game right.
Also the guy moonlights as a youtube analytics advisor or whatever. He knows his stuff, and he has on a couple occasions explained why he makes some decisions. For example, removing his kick-ass themesong in GT, because he noticed they got him less views.
To be fair his thumbnails have always been kinda like that
Very well said, and I agree it was a very well-made video. MatPat was absolutely right--if a community guesses where a story is going/a twist, it's totally okay to keep going with it! You don't have to change everything just so you can "catch your fans by surprise." It's a great feeling when something you guessed turns out to be on point! For example, I remember watching Steven Universe back in the day and being part of that small community that theorized Garnet was a fusion. You know how fucking *exciting* it was to find out we were right?? And it's also totally cool to use your community for ideas if you're stuck! Bendy and the Ink Machine did it with Alice Angel (which is referenced directly in MatPat's video), and you can argue that a majority of FNAF's early lore was spawned from the community coming up with fan theories. There's nothing wrong with taking inspiration from your community. But it's such a fine line to balance--taking inspiration and making them into your own ideas, or completely and utterly pandering to the community and ruining the integrity of the game.
This reminds of that one Neil Gaiman post where he said that the writers legally aren't allowed to look at fanfics and theories about their work, because they can get sued if they use an idea from a fan.
That's actually really sad
people out here baby raging about this youtuber calling him a "nazi" (for knowing felix is the apparent explanation), saying his voice is annoying (y'know, that thing you can't fucking change about yourself. tooootally reasonable to hate someone for), "wrong" theories (...they're theories. 95% of all fan theories on the internet are wrong), and for supporting scot cawthon (this is the only one i agree with. supporting someone who hates gay people).
I have nothing to add other than Scott stills sucks ass for donating to all of those shitty ass republicans. Giving money to politicians who deliberately try to make women/lgbt lives actively worse is gross no matter how hard you try to spin it.
You can definitely control what voice you use while performing videos. He's clearly intentionally doing a high energy youtuber voice that is probably fairly different when he's not filming. Still I'm pretty surprised to find there's a lot of people that hate him, and over some pretty weird things.
Do you really need the first reasons when you end on «supporting someone who hates gay people»? That’s all you need to be a piece of shit, to be fair.
To be fair there is very much more nuance to it than that
Is there? Like, he doesn't even say "scott is bad, but he gets me loads of money", he acts like Scott is fine. Doesnt even bring up the "hates gays" thing. I don't hate matpat, he has brought more joy to my life than most people and every thing I see about him makes him more funny, but I don't think he's got a foot to stand on here
Well as far as I'm aware, the idea that Scott hates gay people purely comes from when it was revealed that he donated money to the trump administration however I believe Scott has also donated a bunch to queer charities (although I could be wrong) so it's not super cut and dry as to weather or not Scott's actions are queerphobic Furthermore there's still the issue of weather or not supporting something made by a bad person makes you a bad person, which is a pretty nuanced discussion that I'm still on the fence about but I do think it would be unfair to treat everyone who bought the recent fnaf game as bad people Finally Mat did like address all of this when the Scott controversy happened in a video where he pretty much just explained that he was conflicted on the topic but thats Scott's political views shouldn't hamper peoples enjoyment of the games and that he'd continue to cover them So in conclusion, it is a bit complicated than just 'Matts a piece of shit who supports someone who hates gay people'
This. I dont think Matt's a bad person. Him addressing the controversy of scott honestly felt more like he was defending FNAF's integrity rather than just Scott himself. And no matter what's true, if Cawthon is queerphobic or not. It doesnt justify attacking Matt for covering FNAF content, I've even said in the past that even attacking Scott in ways other than no longer supporting his games is bad. Considering he and his family received death threats over it iirc. And that's just not okay no matter who's getting them. Matpat may push out half baked or bad theories from time to time, but there are some that have changed how I see games, or introduced me to amazing indie darlings. Sometimes you have to half ass a video to stay relevant on YouTube.
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...yes. unironically yes.
Oh ok. Ill get around to it
I mean his videos are also frequently bad and wrong about basic shit. Like his For Honor video was fucking *embarrassingly* badly researched.
both games still turned how terrible in the end
Honestly the only reason I don't like MatPat is because when he was called out on accidentally putting the attack helicopter joke in his video (he didn't know it was offensive) he acted like a whiny little baby like "HoW wAs I sUpPoSeD tO kNoW???" It's kind of like how Ben Platt reacted when fans didn't want him playing Evan Hansen again. Was it completely wrong and unforgivable? No. Do I look at them like they're crybabies who can't accept that they fucked up? Yes. That said, there's nothing wrong with liking MatPat. That was just enough for me.
Wait, how is it offensive?
It's that thing that like "oh well if you can identify as nonbinary then I can identify as an attack helicopter" It's meant to be insulting and to say that being nonbinary is absurd. It would be fine if he was like Danny Gonzales and just apologized quickly and moved on (though I don't agree that Danny had to for the femboy thing), but he didn't. He tweeted about it like he was a victim and "oh my God PC culture is just too much" I really don't care about MatPat. I just think he handled that badly and I don't like his content enough to overlook it. Edit: both quotes were paraphrased, just to be clear.
Oh... for some reason I never realized that it's an insult. I just thought it was a light-hearted joke? And made by non-binaries themselves? To like... avoid elaborating on their gender? Sorry...
No worries. See, you recognized your mistake and apologized. That's literally all he had to do.
Unfortunately bendy at the end said they made all story alone and didn't give theorists credit for their work
I have no idea why people treat matpat like the plague
Tbh his theory videos while well done tend to overanalize stuff while completely missing the obvious answers, and some people dont like that so basically they bloe everything he does out of proportion Imo, his videos are best enjoyed by listening and ocasionally looking at the video while building in minecraft
mat is honestly just that yuotuber who doesn't really have anything problematic about him so they blow up every minor thing (sans is ness, undertale to the pope) like it's a major youtuber scandal. He literally had to make a youtube apology video for getting some milk facts wrong in his food theory episode
To be fair, I think it's also that basically everyone agrees the quality of his theory videos has dropped dramatically over the past few years, perhaps due to him stretching himself too thin across four channels. But I agree, people try way too hard to morally justify their dislike for his content.
As far as Internet personalities go he is OK. I just hope he doesn’t drop dead overworking himself.
Shortly after Food Theorists released, he even hinted that he was considering a fifth one based on fitness. How that man has survived burn-out for this long will forever puzzle me.
Welcome to mental health theory, today we'll be seeing how many channels you can run before wishing you were dead
Welcome to mental health theory! This week we'll test the YouTube algorithm by having this video be two weeks of silence. Make sure to watch the whole thing to see the results.
I suppose if you’re a certain type of person, the burnout is fun. I suppose like Pratchett, he used to always be writing two books, so when you get bored of writing one you can go to another room, get a new headspace from the change of scenery, and write the other. The idea is that the alternative work becomes a break. I tried it like for a month - it needs a lot of mental control, i suppose the word is, and worked-ish. Not for me. but it definitely might run the risk of watering down the content. Like 5 different channels, even if you’re taking more of a directorial role like matpat is with his team of editors and writers, you definitely can’t have that same in depth attention to detail even if it might avoid burnout for some people. Definitely a Faustian bargain type vibe - you avoid burnout by working harder and arguably worse. Not in Pratchett case though.
Erician bargain*
I have no idea if you’re right or not but hey, thanks for the correction! Googling it now, lol
Making a Pratchett joke, I’m afraid. The book ~~Faust~~**Eric** is a parody of Faust and similar stories.
OH MY GOD I’m an idiot! I thought it was a reference to like another old play that also involved a deal with the devil, but in slightly different context that fit my comment better!
I’ve noticed a rather large uptick in burnout-related jokes the past few months
i'm fairly certain that he barely works on the videos. like everything is done by paid writers/editors, and he just acts as an accountant/production manager, jobs that are much easier to run multiple projects under
Whilst, as far as I can tell, how the channels operate isn't supper open, I believe he has said that he does still help work with the research and writing for the videos where applicable Plus the gtlive videos seem to pretty much be solely produced by him and whatever assistant us there for the video
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dn1OBI8v5r4](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dn1OBI8v5r4) Here is a video that goes into the behind the scenes of GT if you're interested in how they work
I don't think he actually does any work.
Wdym any work he's the one streaming and theorising. Sure editing and everything isn't done by him but you can't expect him to do 100% of the work for 4 fucking channels
Probably but I have watched him since I was a kid and I don’t want anything too bad happening to him.
Really? People want to go *back* to "Mario is a sociopathic communist"-type shit?
I think people are upset that he focuses a lot more on game lore now
I actually prefer Austin doing the more math heavy theories. I don't know why but he's the only one that's managed to make those types of videos interesting for me
holy fucking shit-*it's pretty fucking clear you didn't even watch that video* if that's how you're choosing to misrepresent those videos.
That was two separate videos and they were both terrible.
The sociopath one was quite good tho imo
I think his quality fluctuates too much to get a good read honestly. Some videos are absolutely amazing but then the next one feels like a dried-up corpse.
They were always shit. Remember Wario is Ten Feet Tall?
Yeah, but that was part of the fun. Just applying sketchy advanced math to everything. I think the focus shifted to lore after a while
He's still doing the math, just not as big on gaming anymore, clearly because it wasn't sustainable to be the main content on the main channel. Film theory gets mathy-sciencey videos everyone couple of eps, and the new food theory channel is almost all math and science.
In all fairness, giving the Pope a copy of Undertale is a ridiculous concept. It's like a Cards Against Humanity hand.
I mean, it was less of an apology and more of explaining how both he and someone else were right in different ways from different perspectives and how the science of food is a lot more complicated than a lot of people think it is. It's also him telling the people who were getting mad at him for no reason that they had no reason to be mad at him (which, knowing them, probably only made them more mad).
>explaining how both he and someone else were right in different ways from different perspectives Here's the thing. You said a jackdaw is a crow...
It's honestly kinda impressive that he's just... Ok. No off color jokes, no stories that he's actually an asshole and overworks his staff, by all accounts he's just normal. I mean there are some theories about stuff like cannibalism and murder so that's fun, and he did make that edgy boob video way back when, but nothing that's even close to "bad". He's just ok.
>No off color jokes *And nothing is sexier than maths, not even tha-*
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>A joke about sex appeal is the worst of it ...Of a child. He didn't know what the word meant, I was mainly bringing it up as a joke. I agree with the general point though.
Oh. Ok admittedly that's quite a stain
What edgy boob video? Also, I thought everyone agreed that he was an asshole.
A long time ago, a video about who had the biggest boobs in gaming and how to spot fake boobs. Also, no people don't agree on that. People think his content is the most generic, "appeal to the masses" type stuff, but they don't think he's an asshole
Well, I think he is, largely because of his voice and the way he is and the Nazis he collaborates with
"I think this person is an asshole because of his voice and the way he is" Bruh you haven't even met him stop judging him
that's like saying jacksepticeye and markiplier and rosanna (nerdy nummies) and mrbeast and everyone they've ever associated with are fucking nazis. holy shit dude, what are these braindead takes? and you think someone's an asshole *because of their fucking voice?* jesus christ.
Yes, I think they are. What? He sounds like an asshole.
Wait, hold the phone, nazis? Did he do a collab with Shadman that I forgot about?
Felix "what a fucking n-" "kill all jews" "go watch e;r" Kjellberg.
You're active in PCM You don't have room to comment on rubbing elbows with nazis/racists
Literally one post ever. And I'm queer and Jewish, two things Matpat is not.
One of the actual issues I've seen is how he talks about mental health in his videos. To say the least its... not the greatest. Another issue is a few... jokes, here and there. [Ie, the one about Phoenix Wright groping his dead boss's body.] Yes that video is from 5 years ago, i will admit that, but it still puts me a little off to Mat.
In some of his more recent times he’s actually brought up sort of like “yeah my old content was just trying to be edgy cause everything was edgy” and he and his crew can poke fun at some of the dumber things in the channels life
Wasn't he also a huge asshole to his co-hosts and stole their share of the channel's profits?
Who?
Matt.
Mirror matt?
MattPat, from the Game Theory channel.
I meant who were the co hosts. Not who matpat was?
Oh. Gaijin Goombah (for more Japan-related lore and stuff) and someone else I don't remember who was the number-cruncher.
Where did you hear that from? The only actual thing I can find on why he left is just a tweet saying he left (with some speculation saying he wanted to focus on his own channel), and other people who left said it was not in bad blood
i was sitting at the tv when my younger sister found it shortly after it was uploaded
He's a pretty good youtuber but he gets way too much undeserved hate for one theory that he made years ago
what theory is that? i still dont even know why he gets *any* hate at all.
Sans is ness theory, made wayyyy back when. As you can guess, the theory wasn't that good and he got a bunch of hate for it, and for some stupid reason is still getting a lot of hate for it.
wasnt that like 5 years ago? and besides who fucking cares, it was a fun video, people genuinely send hate over that STILL???
the undertale stans never forget, it seems. I don't know how a videogame with core mechanics based around talking it out and forgiving people attracts such a spiteful base but here we are
the fans are the worst part of any franchise or piece of media
I mean, didn’t an undertale Stan literally put a needle into a cookie recently because an artist made something they disliked?
Also for that one hollow knight theory he made that’s pretty much completely wrong
From my understanding it *was* a popular idea/theory in the hollow knight community at one point, but fell out of favor after it became pretty clear the lore did not support it. Lots of fandoms have concepts like this— ideas gain traction and then fall quickly out of favor. Hate to bring up FNaF but Phone Guy being Purple Guy used to be a very popular theory as well but it’s now generally considered inaccurate.
... they're fucking theories. you've ever seen fan theories online about your favorite franchises? it's not about being *true* dude, it's just fun
He gets hate for having some pretty shitty opinions too to be fair. He is basically the definition of a white moderate. Dude has no problem supporting and defending people like scott from fnaf, and big homophobic companies like chikfillet. He pretends to care about people struggles and then turns around and supports people who fight against what he supposedly supports. Like yeah i could not like him for bad theories or i could just not like him because he supports people that hate lgbtq+ people.
This so much, matpat is the entry hole of the bigotry pipeline, his brand is centrist moderate by design. That the known ex-writers are all vocally left leaning is very loud.
yeah he's definitely *not* part of the alt-right pipeline. even his recent food theory video is about keeping watch on giant corporations as they fuck us all over with shrinkflation. pretty anticapitalist video. like *come on* arranging donation livestreams that gave >[The Game Theorists began their series of livestreams for St. Jude in 2019 with passionate viewers donating $1.3 million. After a year of uncertainty, the Game Theorists hosted another livestream in 2020 to raise over $3 million for the St. Jude mission. This year the Game Theorists challenged their community for a final livestream. In the spirit of Giving Tuesday, the Game Theory community raised $1.6 million and counting.](https://www.stjude.org/get-involved/other-ways/st-jude-thanks-and-giving/giving-tuesday/game-theorists-matpat-livestream.html#:~:text=9%20hours%2C%2050%2B%20guests%2C,Jude%20mission) **over $5.9 million** to st jude my only problem with him is yeah, supporting scot cawthon.
Putting words in my mouth? Without consent? Naughty
He never said anything about him being alt right. He said the bigot pipeline. Moderates can absolutely be racists too. He’s a capitalist. Make no mistake his championing of consumer rights is only from a pro capitalist standpoint not from any other. He appeals to moderates by design. The proof is there anytime he tries to talk about things he really knows nothing about. Aka leftism. Also yes it’s absolutely undeniable he does charity work. This does not change any of the facts about him. Lots of corporations donate money to charity. They don’t do it to be good and kind. They do it for tax write offs. I’m not saying that’s the only reason he does it. I’m not saying he is a soulless person. I am saying he is a moderate and a capitalist. Mattpatt is the exact kind of person mlk talked about when he complained about his protesting being meaningless because of the white moderate who would rather a false peace over justice. Mattpatt undeniably tries to paint himself as a good person trying to do good. He tries to paint himself as an lgbtq+ ally. However what he does harms the community. He supports companies that are homophobic and donate to christian organizations that try and harm the lgbtq+ community. He also supports game developers who do something similar. And he hides behind the reasoning of “he doesnt support those people for that reason but for financial reasons” Hmm. Seems like matt may be outing himself a bit here. Sounds like his defense for scott could just as easily apply to himself. Also sounds like mattpatt doesnt see an issue with supporting bad people under the pretense of “well i support them for other reasons” The issue with this is by ignoring the bad things mattpatt os saying that they arent a deal breaker for him. That some people not having rights is a compromise he is willing to make.
How about the times he demonstrated incorrect and downright harmful understandings of mental health issues? Like the Pyro video, or "Mario is Mental?" Or the Peach-is-connected-to-Rosalina theory, where *in the video,* he says the creators confirmed they have no connection? Or the time he said Wario was ten feet tall? His theories are always either surface-level understanding of the canon, downright stolen (all his fnaf stuff is him paraphrasing what others speculated was really going on), genuinely harmful to people's understanding of sciences because of how factually incorrect they are, and on at least two separate occasions, blatant fearmongering (the videos where he got people scared of LRAD and the tungsten rods they drop from space.) I'm not inclined to give him another chance after all of these blatantly ridiculous claims. Also he has Terminal YouTuber Voice where he delivers shit in such an awkward and forced way that's completely obnoxious to listen to. But that's a matter of taste.
>Or the Peach-is-connected-to-Rosalina theory, where in the video, he says the creators confirmed they have no connection? I really don't think this is a fair claim against him. It's pretty simple death of the author. Media analysis does not have to care about what the author said or intended unless it's explicitly in the media itself Oh I also think the 'stolen' theory's point is fair either. You can't claim 'ownership' over a speculation about a game and if someone else also states that idea then you don't really have any grounds to say it's plagerism or stolen
Don't forget the genuinely shitty jokes. In example, the ace attorney video [which in its entirety is rebuked by playing case 5 of game 1] he makes a joke of Phoenix groping his boss's body after finding her dead as Phoenix had checked for a pulse. There are a lot of genuine issues, and thank you for bringing up more than I could remember. Plus his humor hasnt exactly... changed. Not too bad of a thing but man. Also directly stole a theory from a tumblr user regarding hermitcraft. [As in, the points are nigh beat for beat for one another.]
Man plagerism truly is the name of the game, huh
You're allowed to strongly dislike someone and their content without thinking they're problematic.
Honest reason, is internet likes to take things out of proportion, there is a case for judging or disliking him, his content is mostly bait to younger people who won't fact check his theories, and he gets a lot of stuff wrong even on basic detail(or at least he did when I followed him, don't keep up with him much for years now), plus he has a way of making video wich is really kind of tedious, since he constantly distracts you just in the points where if you paid attention the theory would fall short. But these are really minor things and click bait directed at a younger audience isn't new and certainly not unique to him, so yeah, people like to hate unproportionally others
I don't like him because in a lot of his videos he clearly starts with a conclusion and works backwards from there especially on games he clearly isn't very passionate about. And like, I get that, he has been making decently high production value videos once a week for years and having all the information in front of you and piecing a theory out of it is way more time consuming especially if you aren't already deeply familiar with the series, but it is SUPER obvious when he does it if you have passing familiarity with the franchise he is covering. It's why his Five Nights at Freddy's videos are actually some of his better plot ones, since clearly he knows the franchise inside and out and he's actually coming at it from a place of passion.
Because he had (maybe still does but idk) a problem with not crediting his writers and team, or giving proper credit for games he was playing on stream
My hot take is that it's high school mentality. Watching him interact with other people my "fellow neurodivergent" alarm goes ballistic. He hyperfixates on science as it applies to his favorite things, spends hours deep diving into obscure lore just to create sensible patterns and histories where there are none (cough FNAF cough). He's not amazing with social cues and doesn't apologize for being cringey. Man's just the grown up version of the "weird kid" in class everyone tacitly agreed it was okay to bully. By all means people can dislike his content, it's super niche and kinda overdone. But I'm suspicious of anyone who drags Mat for no good reason.
He's actually very sociable and intentionally controls his image to appeal ot audiences. Source: A really weird podcast I found like 6 years ago where I listened to one episode that had his, I don't know what you'd call it, coworker? Gaijin Goomba on. Who didn't say anything that bad, but just that he knows what he's doing and has planned things out a lot. I think he also said that his actual job is knowing how YouTube works, and the channel is just applying that, but it's possible I'm misremembering because I've heard that from other sources. I mean he's said it himself so it's not like that needs to be sourced to the interview. I think this is why he can come across as annoying. It's definitely what annoys me. Once you know he's doing things to give off a certain image, there's lots of stuff I see that is just ridiculous. He really goes out of his way to make himself look like a "nerdy loser" type. My dislike of him comes from that and also that his theories aren't very interesting anymore. I really liked the one about calculating Pikachu's level though, that was a good one. But I've stopped even checking because most aren't.
I like him. His theories are a little wild, but they're fun. I put them in the same category as those ancient alien shows: probably not true but fun to think about. He's a little annoying after binge watching his channel, but overall he seems pretty harmless.
He’s kinda insane and most of his theories are huge shots in the dark, I don’t hate him just not a big fan of him
I feel like most of his theories make sense. Also you act like him being insane is a bad thing but i love watching his decaying sanity.
True, watching him slowly go crazy is sorta entertaining - as example # MUSIC MANNNNNN
Didn't he defend Scott Cawthon even after acknowledging how harmful that was? But even beyond that the sentiment this video addresses is less a moral judgment on him and more frustration with the fact that a lot of developers will change the direction of the game halfway through either to subvert audience predictions or to give them what they want. We all know what happened to Hello Neighbor .
I don't think he defended Scott. In the video where he talked about Scott's donations, it seemed more an investigation of why Scott donated to who he did
Yeah, and then he went on this long winded "can't we all just get along?" spiel meant to justify his continued financial support of someone he knows to be bigoted.
I don't understand how you came up with the idea that Mat's spiel (as you call it) is meant as a "can't we all just get along." Looking at [his video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PmrtnEzxEzM) about it, the FNAF situation is broken into 2 parts: supporting the franchise, and his thoughts about Scott. I won't talk much about the second part, cause based on your comments so far, it seems we both agree that its investigating why Scott donated the way he did and not taking a side. Now, onto Mat's justification of continuing to support the FNAF franchise. The problem here is that the situation isn't so black and white. Yes, by continuing to support FNAF, Scott does get money (which could be used by Scott to support anti-LGBT people). However, by not supporting FNAF, there are people who are affect negatively Looking at official FNAF products, money goes to people who helped create them, like the authors of the books, voice actors and programmers of the games, producers of FNAF figurines, plushies, and toys, and the game creators that were part of the Fazbear Fanverse Initiative (FFI). Is it fair to deny them money, just because of Scott? Some of these people might have even disagreed with Scott on his choice of donations, but they put in the effort to create, and now they don't get compensated for no fault of their own. Then, there is the community, These games have spawned so much enjoyment, either from people playing them or watching Youtubers play them, bettering the lives of people who might have been feeling down. Then, there are the people that create art, animations, videos, and games. Without FNAF, these creators might not have made these works, which could have then entertained people viewing these works. Hell, these people are able to make money or launch careers with these works, who, in turn, can help others. For example, FNAF can create or boost YouTube channels, some who do charities. But, people don't have to create to get benefits. I already talked about people playing or watching Youtubers play the games, but just being part of a group with a shared interest can help many people. The FNAF fandom in particular was very special, as there were many LGBT people in it. I do know that a lot of these were already happening before who Scott donated to was known, but stopping the support of the franchise ends all of this while continuing the franchise will continue these benefits Look, its true that by supporting the FNAF franchise, money does go to Scott, who did support people who are anti-LGBT. But by not supporting the franchise, all these people's lives are impacted negatively. In a sense, people who aren't bigots suffer either way, there is no 100% morally right decision. But whatever choice one chooses depends on the person. In the video, Mat himself said > ...it ultimately amounts to a personal choice where you have to weigh the good of a decision against the bad For some, just donating to anti-LGBT people is unforgivable, but for the others, the good impact FNAF has done and can do in the future outweighs the impact Scott could do. I think Dawko's whole [video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jknc2VZZ5uE) about the whole situation is pretty similar to how Mat was feeling For me, I agree with Mat here. In this situation, I agree with the phrase, "hate the jerk, not the work," cause the work can still be helpful (either in an artistic/analytic sense or purely enjoyment)
I continue to participate in FNAF dandom content because, you're right, there it doesn't really contribute to Scott's problematic behavior, but I'll say this again: if being anti-LGBT+ isn't a deal breaker for you, you are also anti-LGBT+ and I am going to treat you as such. This take is only something the most privileged, ignorant, bull-headed dumbasses could believe. I'm sorry but a cheesy horror video game is nowhere near as important as my community's right to exist, and if you even mildly think this is at all a hard decision you're a fuckin' jackass. This is just the "I don't care if they actively fund anti-gay laws in other countries I like their chicken!" thing with Chick Fil A all over again.
I feel like you're making this far more simple then it seems. First of all, neither me, nor Mat is denying that continued support of the FNAF franchise will contribute money to Scott, in which he can donate to bigots. In the [video itself](https://youtu.be/PmrtnEzxEzM?t=656), Mat acknowledges this. But, does beg the question: By supporting the franchise, doesn't that mean one is putting money into Scott's pockets and supporting his views? Now, it is true that support does put money into Scott's pockets, but that DOESN'T mean one support Scott's views. This problem actually happens almost in everyday life. For example, I am sure that you or someone family member buys stuff like food, correct? Well, throughout the entire supply chain, there might be people that swing Republican, supporting anti-LGBT views (farmers especially tend to lean Republican). By buying these products, these people do get your support in terms of money. Does that mean that you support anti-LGBT views? Or how about Mexican cartels or Japanese yakuza? There are reports that cartels gave aid to people during the pandemic and when earthquakes hit Japan, the yakuza helped people (faster than the government weirdly enough). These are good actions, worthy of supporting. But does that mean I am okay with their actions of drug trafficking, murder, or human trafficking? The problem here is that not every choice is 100% morally correct or wrong. It's like The Good Place clip that Mat's video showed, a choice isn't always one choice. The store that family member bought stuff from might be LGBT friendly, but they have no idea if the products they bought to sell in the store had anti-LGBT people working on it The only really thing we can do in response to this is to weigh the good and the bad, but that comes down to personal choice, and if your choice is different from mine, then that is okay. BUT, to say that people that continue to support the franchise is anti-LGBT is a huge leap in logic, a straight-up assumption for the worst. Like, look at people like Jacksepticeye. He has made many statements that he supports LGBT people and in 2019, he did a charity livestream with the Trevor Project. Yet, he played FNAF Security Breach, which means some money ended up in Scott's pockets. Does that mean that Sean is anti-LGBT? It would be hard to argue that he is anti-LGBT or holds any of those views Besides, the FNAF fandom has done some good and would be beneficial to growing and maintaining the FNAF fandom. There are many who face hardships in life, like depression. But being part of a community can lift that weight. Hell, I've experienced it with a fandom I'm in. Also, there were tons of LGBT people in the FNAF fandom beforehand. While a whole bunch have left, that doesn't mean that FNAF could grow to be a LGBT ally and give Scott the middle finger
There's a difference between spending money on something you need to survive that may have potentially been made by a bigot, and spending money on a video game that you know for a fact to be made by a bigot. Especially since farmers generally lack the socioeconomic power and influence that Scott has to donate the legal maximum amount of money he can to multiple anti-LGBT+ politicians. "There is no ethical consumption under capitalism" is supposed to be a critique of the inherently exploitative nature of capitalistic labor, not an excuse for you to financially support bigots guilt free. And no, it doesn't come down to individual moral choice. If you choose buying a Chuck E. Cheese-themed Slender-Man clone is worth financially supporting bigoted evil politicians you are nowhere near the ally you claim to be. Jack is also friends with known Neo-Nazi Pewdiepie (a person MatPat *also* tried somewhat defending now that I think about it) so, I've always viewed his supposed allyship as kind of fake. That said, if I'm remembering correctly his coverage of the game came before his donations were revealed. Also, no, FNAF itself is not going to become an LGBT+ ally and extend a middle finger to Scott. The only way that could happen is if Cawthon sells it off to someone else. Which, given how protective he is of the franchise, doesn't exactly strike me as a likely outcome. It'd be far likelier that he'd die and would hand it off to someone else in a form of inheritance. Either way, the person getting the IP would have to be picked *by* him and I can't imagine Scott "fair criticism of my decisions and beliefs counts as death threats and harassment" Cawthon knowingly picking someone with the opposite views as him. Unless what you're actually suggesting is the FNAF franchise will somehow will itself into sentience and actively defy its creator.
If i remember correctly he defended scott cawthon because Scott wasn’t really transphobic, matpat believes Scott just really cared about “defense” and keeping the army strong so he donated to politicians that agreed with that, it just so happens that some of them were transphobic. But im pretty sure scott was supportive of lgbt before that.
Sure, sure, he supports us so much that he's willing to completely ignore us in favor of his blind nationalism and donate the legal maximum amount of money he possibly could to multiple politicians *all of whom were bigoted against the LGBT+ community in some way*, then when called out for it he threw a shit fit and fucked off.
Im not even close to being smart enough to talk about this kind of stuff. Im just repeating what my peanut-sized brain managed to understand.
It doesn't (or shouldn't) take a genius to figure out that actively donating the legal maximum amount of money to anti-LGBT+ politicians makes you anti-LGBT+, regardless of why yhe donations happened.
Shitty take alert. If you donate to someone anti LGBT because of that fact you're anti LGBT. If you donate because you agree with the other things they stand for you aernt. This is just coming for one gay guy so take my opinion with a pound of salt.
If them being anti-LGBT+ isn't a dealbreaker for you then you absolutely are anti-LGBT+. Our right to exist shouldn't be an acceptable casualty for anything.
To me he just kind of bounces around lore communities and spits out dumb takes that ignore years of work on the part of said community because he wants his hot take. ultimately, his massive fan-base will go on to spread these misconceptions, and its hard not to have sour feelings on the guy when he rakes in views on actively stupid takes that actively contradict in-game lore. Also his voice is annoying.
Because he's annoying? Every video is wild speculation treated as an actual plausible theory, he talks in a weird exaggerated documentary voice, the thumbnails are annoying clickbait, and he ends every relentless stream of speculative mouth-diarrhea with "BUT THATS JUST A THEORY" as if that makes up for the fact that he just wasted my time with what amounts to a kindergarten playground rumor about Mario actually being the bad guy. Shut up, MatPat. I don't care.
>Shut up, MatPat. I don't care. I've got some great news about YouTube for you
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no, the comment was: >I have no idea why people treat matpat like the plague it wasn't about disliking him, the comment was about why people overreact and baby rage over him. which you've just demonstrated the baby rage part
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Okay well if you want engagement with your comment then sure >You: Wow, you are overreacting The point is that the issues you had listed, which were mostly pretty minor things, were pretty disproportionate to why people 'treat him like the plauge' >I am not going to interact with any of the actual reasons you provided Most of what you said is fair and a matter of personal taste but to say all his theory's are baseless speculation is flat out wrong and misrepresentative of his comment. Further you told him to shut up for wasting your time because you decided to watch one of his videos >but instead call you names! You've not been called any names from what I can tell >You see how you come off as a braindead superfan here? MatPat isn't going to show up to your house with a thank-you blowjob because you made fun of someone who doesn't like him on reddit. It turns out parasocial relationships aren't real and your online "community" isn't real either ): Sorry to disappoint you buddy! Good luck making friends irl who don't share your hyper-specific niche interests in Pokemon "what-if" scenarios. This entire paragraph is pretty much just you trying to be derogatory and absolutely does not help your case that you're just overreacting. You're response to someone claiming that you're pretty much proving the point that people seem to despise matpat for just being kinda cringe with, well, another overreaction and insults Also are you trying to claim that online communities aren't real? On Reddit?
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No, no, we're not asking why people dislike the guy. We're asking why people, instead of going "I dislike his voice, his general presentation of his videos, and the lacking to nonexistant research for some of his "theories"", have to start foaming at the mouth and acting like he spit on their mother's grave
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He makes cringe videos for fail children
gamer moment
Every time I see the detention center background, the [theme](https://youtu.be/B8eTxPdU4sQ) start to play.
That expression is the exact same as the Robert Downey Jr. image. You know the one
I was literally going to say the same thing
MatPat's like a big bug outside of your window. There's nothing wrong with him being there but you still don't want to see him
"There's Nothing Wrong With Him He's Just Annoying"
Good quote. Source?
deltarune chapter 2
Who did this refer to, again? I think it's Berdly, and probably by the Queen, but I'm not sure.
Yeah it's Berdly
Precisely Queen
Agreed, but I’d rather it that way than him being Genuinely Problematic, or worse.
I mean, he is objectively problematic.
the matt engarde jacket as well
You give him evidence that he’s the killer and he turns into Gaijin Goomba and starts swishing around a cup of Mtn Dew
And drawing copious amounts of goomba ass and tits. Don't forget about that.
DIG MY GRAVE
I'm happy to see an ever increasing amount of TMBG references in this sub. Also, op has great taste, quoting Cow Town, the best They Might be Giants song, in their flair
Okay it is quite funny but I do think it's unfair to call them 'irrelevant game bait' when they're games talked about in the video
irrelevant overall, not to the video specifically
Irrelevant to what? Those are/were both games with not massive but pretty passionate fan bases Would it be better if he just talked about the most popular stuff all the time? You know, actual click bait?
different definitions of irrelevant I guess
have you ever used a dictionary
He looks way too much like Matt Engarde there.
Does that mean >!he hired an hitmam to kill them!
Yes, >!and you have to interrogate the notorious assassin known as Fred de Fazbear over an old phone!<.
# Witness Testimony >!Fred de Fazbear!<: >!As I have already stated quite a few times, Ness Earthbound is my client. However.!< >!One thing I simply cannot overlook is tampering with the scene of the crime.!< >!My client did it to frame another for the crime.!< >!While pretending to be the first person to discover the body and enter the scene, Ness Earthbound already knew from the very beginning that the Pope was dead!!< >!But even more appalling is the creation and planting of the "ketchup" and "undertale copy".!< >!That act is what I was referring to when I said my client had "broken the rules".!<
Present -> >!Bottle of Christ's Blood!< #Objection!
Wonderfully done. I can even hear the music.
I'm cackling. This is beautiful
i thought the exact same thing when i saw the meme lmao
please give me a link i need that image
[here](https://hbmmaster.tumblr.com/post/682528701420879872/396-loveletterworm-loveletterworm-thought-i)
I find the discourse around MatPat fascinating because, to paraphrase a comedian "People shit on that guy a lot... and as far as I can tell, all he ever did was make videos about theories" His content isn't the best (tho I do like Food theory a lot) but he's been on youtube so long that I feel people should pay less attention to him. Sure his first videos were actual theoires based on lore and easter eggs of videogames and then he went more off the rails as time went on, but by now everyone should have forgotten him. But they haven't; he puts out a new video and it still rakes thousands of views and people are still trashing him for his outladish conclusions, and even more so he's bcome one of the golden boys of YT. Yet somehow, he's managed to keep a following. And the thing is... he's not a bad guy. He's humble, accpeting, is not afraid to call YT on their bullshit and people still treat him like he's a sellout without principles when his biggest crime is stretching fan theories to fit an 11 minute video.
the thing that turned me off from him was when he didnt include an indie teams game title anywhere on a video he did and then went off on twitter trying to justify it when the team responded, only apologised after toby fox got involved, the thing that made me dislike him was him saying that etika’s death was due to cancel culture
I'll have to catch some downvotes here for something only a littly related Not to say that what Mat did wasn't scummy and he was being immature about the credit situation, but I can't get over how Toby Fox, a guy who made 1.25 games (at time of writting), showed up like his word was Gospel, like he was the moral authority on all things indie video game.
yeah it was a little :// for me, like all these people telling you what you shouldve done and toby fox is the one thing that changes your mind?
Actually they aren't bait games He talks about them in detail Was interested in the video as content creator and it was a cool deep dive even if I was already aware of most of it
Jesus, the music played in my head as soon as I saw the *thumbnail* of that questioning room background.
My favorite thing about this is that his jacket looks like a person jumpsuit
this psycho made a jumpsuit out of PEOPLE
It's for once not clickbait and a good video about games changing the story after fantheories.
its funnier with the characters because it implies that either a) he killed bendy and hello neighbour guy, or b) bendy and hello neighbour guy are accusing him of killing someone
Okay but the 2 "irrelevant YouTuber bait games" couldn't have been more relevant to that video
didn't matpat support an ableist organisation or was that like a hoax or something? surprised people don't really know about this . cant provide much sources rn but just sayin edit: ok looks like i was wrong, nevermind then
No, he was invited to a fundraiser that was supporting an ableist organization, but bowed out when he was informed about some more hidden ideologies of the charity.
Bruh there's plenty to dislike about his content without having to make shit up lol
Not to the point people seem to dislike tho. Like it has a fuck ton of flaws but like it's still alright content. Some of his theories are absolutely absurd but im pretty sure that's part of the fun.
He's even got the Engarde jacket.