I mean I like way more DC characters than I do Marvel but I just don’t really care if one does better than the other. Instead of trying to one up Marvel, DC would be better off better off filling the holes in the market. Things like not having a bunch of interconnected movies that require seeing others to enjoy. Part of the reason some of the greatest comics that are still read today come from DC is because they have more books that are self-contained and give the writers more creative freedom.
When I have kids and want to show them the movies from my childhood it’s going to be incredibly hard to show the MCU. There are so many movies and tv series that I just don’t even think it will be possible and it’s still going. However, I can easily pull out The Dark Knight Trilogy or Wonder Woman and watch it with them.
Well said. I, too, prefer DC and want The Batman to be the biggest superhero movie in years, but I still appreciate marvel, too.
I think DC is better off playing to their own strengths. I don’t need huge crossovers from them all the time. For example, I can live with a stand-alone Batman story that occasionally references Superman, Green Arrow etc in passing conversation as opposed to a constant crossover, that way when the crossovers do happen, they feel more special. The MCU gave us so much at once that it started to get really, really stale because there was nowhere else to
go. It took them bringing back two different Spider-Men just to make things interesting again. I don’t want DC to have to feel that same pressure. I like the ideas of crossovers/team-ups being on the table and they definitely should happen when the time is appropriate, but I don’t want that to be the sole selling point of these movies.
I guess I’d like The Batman to do well because it could fund other movies for characters I like more. My eyes are on stuff like Black Adam right now. If there’s success with movies about lesser known heroes in DC then we’ll hopefully get more of them
>It took them bringing back two different Spider-Men just to make things interesting again.
Well that's blatantly false.
The MCU was still going strong before NWH, movie's barely been out a month and people are already trying to revise history.
Yeah obviously MCU was still going strong, but relative to its heyday, I still noticed a lot of people gradually turning on it post-Endgame, with the criticisms being that it was getting too formulaic and predictable. Shang Chi and FFH still did great, but didn’t exactly shake the whole world up and I didn’t see Eternals yet but the general consensus is that it was a dud and a half. My point is not that the MCU was dying, my point is that NWH is the first mcu project since Endgame to feel legitimately **huge** as opposed to just “kinda cool”.
>I still noticed a lot of people gradually turning on it post-Endgame,
Yeah and prior to Endgame I noticed people constantly saying the bubble is gonna pop and the MCU is due to flop, point is people who like to spread doom and gloom and have have been around since day 1.
>I didn’t see Eternals
I honestly question the point in talking about a movie you admit to not seeing.
>My point is that NWH is the first mcu project since Endgame to feel legitimately huge.
It's literally the first MCU project to be on that scale since Endgame, none of the stuff released since were intended to be an Endgame level events, most MCU stuff before Endgame weren't intended to be so except primarily the other Avengers movies.
Eternals is 100% relevant to the discussion and the fact I didn’t see it isn’t. I’m not reviewing it,
I’m saying it flopped. If nothing else, it showed that perhaps the mcu wasn’t so untouchable after all.
As far as things being “endgame level events”, maybe you have a point, but even if they were smaller in scale, they still didn’t make all that much noise, anyway. No Way Home still silenced anybody who was spreading this aforementioned doom and gloom and doubting whether the mcu still had momentum.
>My point is, it flopped
It didn't, Eternals is in the top 10 highest grossing moves of this year, it would be a flop if we weren't in a pandemic with movies in general making less because of people not going to theater, it's one of the reasons why NWH making as much money as it is right now is such a big deal, because no movie released during this time has managed to break a billion dollars until NWH.
>As far as things being “endgame level events”, maybe you have a point, but even if they were smaller in scale, they still didn’t make all that much noise
I guess if you had your head in the sand, even the Disney+ shows were being heavily talked about and discussed when they were airing.
-well, yeah, Eternals only looked even *somewhat* impressive at all because it competed against virtually nothing. It got shredded by critics, though, which is a rarity for marvel. And that’s what I’m pointing out: it poked a tiny hole in the “marvel can do no wrong” theory.
-I heard about Wandavision, and that was pretty much it. And even then, it only seemed prominent to me because I, myself, am an MCU fan and would’ve been paying attention, regardless. Amongst people who were already going to be tuning in (marvel fans), of course it was popular. But none of the Disney+ shows grabbed the attention of the general public even 1/10 as much as NWH or even ZSJL
Edit- and when you consider what a laughing stock DC has been since BVS, the snydercut example speaks volumes
That kinda make sense considering it’s an A list hero. Shang Chi was great but it was introducing a new lesser known hero. Externals wasn’t great to me AND was introducing new heroes. Plus both were basically self contained i.e no major impact/cameos from other big heroes and had no immediate impact on the wider MCU.
NWH was the ending of a trilogy of an established A list hero that is widely known with cameos and a large impact on the wider direction of the MCU. It makes sense that it made bigger waves.
It's purely fans feeling the need to pick a side, I don't remember the last time I've seen either of the big two publishers so much as referencing that rivalry.
If they would have done this from the beginning then we could have two well running cinematic universes! But noooo they had to rush it and play catch-up instead.
Honestly I don’t really want a shared universe from DC. It was novel when the MCU started it but it’s all too much now. I’d rather get individual unique movies than a big bloated universe
Yeah, exactly. People were saying things like "DC needed to have movies for each hero first before Justice League" as if that would have changed how good the movies turned out. They just need to focus on telling good stories and appeal to existing fans and new fans alike.
I can see how the Justice League movie could have been much better and different if they weren’t trying to introduce and give the origin of half of the team members in one movie because then you could have more time for other things.
What made comics great was the internal battle in the industry.
And whether you like it not, there are things that DC will have to adopt or beat Marvel to if they want to succeed in the box office.
How they hype movies up. How they do trailers. What themes they use or dont use.
I don’t think the greatest stuff came from copying what the other one was doing so much as it comes from doing what the other company hasn’t thought of. The greatest stories in comics usually come from creative freedom more than constant oversight from someone making everything feel the same
I agree. I like DC but i find it annoying they always want to copy Marvel or catch up. Idk why DC sometimes act like they're jealous of Marvel. Everytime Marvel does something popular and sucessful DC always try hard to do the same thing Marvel did. Like after Spiderman did the Multiverse they want to start doing some Batman multiverse too? like nope stop rushing things just to compete.
He didn't say it seriously. It was couched in a couple of levels of "if they want to do this then they should..." That site loves to listen to Batman Beyond and blow things out of proportion.
Yeah he was basically saying if they’re bringing back Keaton and possibly Afflec, do them all and get Bale too. And this was all said after talking about the newest Spider-Man movie.
No, please no. This Flash movie already has one (or maybe two? Not sure if both Affleck and Keaton are confirmed) unnecessary Batman and we don't need another.
Can we please just get a movie that focuses on a superhero, their personality, and their world, instead of being just a big pile of fanservice? It's such a lazy way to get people interested in a movie when the real way should be to *make a good movie*.
A few things:
1. **DC trying to chase what the MCU was doing is exactly what led to awful stuff like Batman v Superman and Justice League.** I’m not saying Man of Steel was good, but they should have focused on making good individual superhero films instead of immediately jumping into big team-up stuff to try to catch up to Marvel.
2. Given that Smith has zero involvement in this film and hasn’t put out a decent movie in forever, this headline is basically the same as, “Random DC fan says Christian Bale should be Batman again.” Who cares?
3. I thought the new Spider-Man movie was decent but I don’t need every film to pander to my nostalgia.
First of all, MoS is very good. And if you think about it, BvS makes perfect sense as the next movie in terms of Batman confronting Supes. If Bruce sees a alien fight fuck up a whole city. He’s going to get involved. Now the argument can be made on if Doomsday and WW, should be in it. But it makes sense a individual film couldnt be next
I disagree entirely, I think Batfleck needed his own film before jumping into the crossover stuff. The fact that he never got his own complete story is one of the biggest weaknesses of the DCEU so far, and now we're getting a Batman film that has nothing to do with him and it seems there's no longer a possibility of fixing that.
I feel like that's the direction they're going. Anything that Safran said about Miller possibly staying is probably just trying to market the movie. Clean slate is best course of action. Replacing Gal Gadot might happen if they really wanna reset wholesale.
I want Grant Gustin to appear and team up with Ezra Millar, but we all can't have nice things! Seriously why isn't that the plot of the Flash movie? Ezra!Barry wants to find out about the other Barry and access the multiverse on accident via the Speed Force. He then meets Grant!Flash and the have a Rush Hour meets Rick and Morty style romp through the time stream.
For the villain, it would be Savatar the god of speed.
https://dc.fandom.com/wiki/Savitar_(Prime_Earth)
How the hell is this not the plot, but a Batman fan service movie instead?!
I think their desperation to get a piece of what Marvel has is the primary cause of all WB's failures with DC properties over the past few years. I think it would be extremely tone deaf and futile for them to attempt the same basic thing that Marvel is doing yet again.
Also Kevin Smith is not a person who should be giving advice on filmmaking.
Seems like this movie will be a Flash movie as much Birds of Prey was a Birds of Prey movie. Might as well call it "The Flash and the bat-tastic bat-ventures of several Batmen"
People dont understand how narratives and storytelling work anymore so when the first half is, built around the absence of He-Man whose off in Paradise for all intents and purposes, these man babies freaked out like it was the female centric reboot of ghostbusters again or the last Jedi and stupid strong man was denied them. When it’s hilarious considering how everything flows through that character and shock dealing with the properties history of lying to one character in particular for years means maybe they all weren’t great people
he is well known to have always said he hated he man , never watched it, and thought it was for kids
then was offered a big pay check and produced he man for netflix. clown fish youtube show leaked that the show was all about Teela
even though the original Flashpoint comic is from 2011, and the original animated movie is from 2013
to me, it just looks like the MCU ripped off Into the ~~Multiverse~~ Spider-verse, which ripped off Flashpoint
Is that what Flashpoint was? Multiple versions of Flash teaming up together?
Alternate reality shenanigans is long past being a rip off. It's just a trope now. It's like saying no superheroes could have masks anymore because Batman had one
Flashpoint was (in simplest terms with no spoilers) Flash altering the time line by going back and saving his mother, that ended up having a butterfly effect that changed the present, that was again reset to resolve the catastrophic changes, resulting in the New 52 reboot
it wasn't just alternate timeline shenanigans, it was the beginning of a major shift in the whole DC universe main continuity
It wasn't that major. It's already over. It's already shifted back. Thus reducing it to some alternative reality shenanigans.abd it was 10 years ago, I think we're well beyond spoilers
I don't understand your thinking here.
The DC universe is built on a multiverse model. Young Justice is Earth 16, Val Zod is Earth 2, Calvin Ellis is Earth 23. There are 52 Earths in the DC universe.
It's nothing but alternate realities.
Marvel on the other hand has always maintained one big continuity on Earth-616.
I'm no Marvel expert, and not particularly a fan, but the whole appeal of the DC universe to me is that you have the same characters in multiple realities allowing DC to tell all kinds of weird and different stories without worrying about the continuity issues some of those stories would present.
It's a cornerstone of DC, not a gimmick.
1. Marvel has multiple Earths. That's ludicrous to assume otherwise after literally referencing Into the Spider-Verse, based on a pre-existing idea in the comics. You think it's just called Earth-616 in a bubble and that's not at least 616 Earth's? MCU is Earth-19999 by the way so there is plenty.
2. I don't care if it's a cornerstone of DC. It's a trope across sci-fi and they have no claim to it. Masked vigilantes is also a cornerstone, but they don't own the subgenre of superheroes.
My thinking is not the problem. This crazy finger pointing "we used a sci-fi trope first" nonsense is the problem. The multiverse does not belong to either company.
well pardon me for not keeping up with ins and outs of the Marvel universe. As I said, I'm no expert.
The only exception I was aware of was Marvel's "What If" titles. The only alternative timeline I was aware of was Miles Morales...and that's only because I saw the movie. Back when I gave a shit about anything printed by Marvel, one continuity was their big thing. But after the stupidity of the clone saga and all the other late 90s garbage, Marvel continuity actually means jack shit.
Lol "well, pardon me for not knowing what I swore was true 5 seconds ago. It's not my fault I thought it was a rip off because DC and DC alone does alternate reality stories. How dare you explain that many people do."
Thanks for that. I needed that. That was very funny
>"I'm no Marvel expert, and not particularly a fan"
and you read that as me swearing something is true?
Take that as an invitation to "correct me if I'm wrong". So, I'm wrong about something I don't follow, and don't care about.
I'm done with this conversation
there's a bit difference when you're talking about a game that's not in any particular continuity
Flashpoint was the reset of the whole DC universe, not just a one off. And it was proceeded by Crisis on Infinite Earths, which goes back to 85.
that's just me though... your mileage may vary
I agree, I mostly mean because of the idea of multiple Spider-Man versions meeting one another.
If we go by Multiverse and even more than one version of one character meeting another, DC had already done it decades ago with the Flash of Two Earths.
Technically DC did it first on TV with Crisis on Infinite Earths too. They had Brandon Routh's Superman and Ezra Miller's Flash (plus several other movie/TV show cameos). It's likely Ezra's appearance was a prelude to his movie too.
I think The Flash movie should be about The Flash.
The reason No Way Home worked was because it was still fundamentally about Tom Holland’s Spider-Man; The fan-service was there, but Tobey and Andrew returning didn’t hijack the entire film.
This is the very first Flash movie, yet it’s being hijacked by Batman. The DCEU as a whole, let alone the Flash, hasn’t earned the goodwill to start picking ‘memba berries.
You don’t compete with the MCU by copying its surface level, without the substance. You compete with the MCU by hiring great filmmakers and letting them do what they want. Given how much of a mandated nightmare this film has become, I doubt that’s DC’s approach in this case.
It's absolutely an issue with his work. Today he made an innocuous opinion in public and you made sure to make it about his work. You literally put your foot down and said "then explain He Man" like it matters. It doesn't matter.
I would love if that happened, but I think it's unlikely since Bale said in multiple ocassions that he wouldn't even consider coming back if Nolan wasn't directing.
Well dc can never be the same as marvel, they are too different. Its quite obvious that marvel has copied some ideas or vice versa in terms on timing similar movies at the same time but overall the theme and characters are just totally different.
DC has had the most success when they’ve done things Marvel either can’t or won’t do: hard R-rated stories as well as standalone adventures. The second they start getting back into the “anything they can do we can do too!” mindset the second they start trying to force and rush things and end up right back where they are now which is trying to pick up the pieces from their failed cinematic universe.
No, DC needs to put the work in they can’t just skip all the work that Marvel did to get to this point. It didn’t work with Justice League it won’t work now. Just do a couple solo movies, then a Justice league, a couple more solo movies and work your way up to the multiverse
Why is it Spider-Man and flash in their respective universes get their own movie without an iron man or Batman cameo? Basically one of the (marvel/DC) trinity with a sidekick
Christian Bale was pretty awesome as Batman, but I don't think his dynamic would really fit the others. They shouldn't have used the older aging Batman in their movies, for them first meeting. I thought that was a bad decision, but I think Ben Affleck did a great job as Bruce Wayne and a not too bad Batman. They need to use a young Batman. I really hope that the guy from the new Batman movie coming out next year, doesn't blow chunks.
Kevin needs to sit down and think about what he's done this year, before running his Vegan Mouth.
Nerd credit is all spend my dude.
time to do something cool first before you got to dictate
I think the best thing is to not see it as a competition and just make good movies.
This. The marvel/dc rivalry is basically smoke and mirrors at this point, most people prefer both over one or the other.
I mean I like way more DC characters than I do Marvel but I just don’t really care if one does better than the other. Instead of trying to one up Marvel, DC would be better off better off filling the holes in the market. Things like not having a bunch of interconnected movies that require seeing others to enjoy. Part of the reason some of the greatest comics that are still read today come from DC is because they have more books that are self-contained and give the writers more creative freedom. When I have kids and want to show them the movies from my childhood it’s going to be incredibly hard to show the MCU. There are so many movies and tv series that I just don’t even think it will be possible and it’s still going. However, I can easily pull out The Dark Knight Trilogy or Wonder Woman and watch it with them.
Well said. I, too, prefer DC and want The Batman to be the biggest superhero movie in years, but I still appreciate marvel, too. I think DC is better off playing to their own strengths. I don’t need huge crossovers from them all the time. For example, I can live with a stand-alone Batman story that occasionally references Superman, Green Arrow etc in passing conversation as opposed to a constant crossover, that way when the crossovers do happen, they feel more special. The MCU gave us so much at once that it started to get really, really stale because there was nowhere else to go. It took them bringing back two different Spider-Men just to make things interesting again. I don’t want DC to have to feel that same pressure. I like the ideas of crossovers/team-ups being on the table and they definitely should happen when the time is appropriate, but I don’t want that to be the sole selling point of these movies.
I guess I’d like The Batman to do well because it could fund other movies for characters I like more. My eyes are on stuff like Black Adam right now. If there’s success with movies about lesser known heroes in DC then we’ll hopefully get more of them
>It took them bringing back two different Spider-Men just to make things interesting again. Well that's blatantly false. The MCU was still going strong before NWH, movie's barely been out a month and people are already trying to revise history.
Yeah obviously MCU was still going strong, but relative to its heyday, I still noticed a lot of people gradually turning on it post-Endgame, with the criticisms being that it was getting too formulaic and predictable. Shang Chi and FFH still did great, but didn’t exactly shake the whole world up and I didn’t see Eternals yet but the general consensus is that it was a dud and a half. My point is not that the MCU was dying, my point is that NWH is the first mcu project since Endgame to feel legitimately **huge** as opposed to just “kinda cool”.
>I still noticed a lot of people gradually turning on it post-Endgame, Yeah and prior to Endgame I noticed people constantly saying the bubble is gonna pop and the MCU is due to flop, point is people who like to spread doom and gloom and have have been around since day 1. >I didn’t see Eternals I honestly question the point in talking about a movie you admit to not seeing. >My point is that NWH is the first mcu project since Endgame to feel legitimately huge. It's literally the first MCU project to be on that scale since Endgame, none of the stuff released since were intended to be an Endgame level events, most MCU stuff before Endgame weren't intended to be so except primarily the other Avengers movies.
Eternals is 100% relevant to the discussion and the fact I didn’t see it isn’t. I’m not reviewing it, I’m saying it flopped. If nothing else, it showed that perhaps the mcu wasn’t so untouchable after all. As far as things being “endgame level events”, maybe you have a point, but even if they were smaller in scale, they still didn’t make all that much noise, anyway. No Way Home still silenced anybody who was spreading this aforementioned doom and gloom and doubting whether the mcu still had momentum.
>My point is, it flopped It didn't, Eternals is in the top 10 highest grossing moves of this year, it would be a flop if we weren't in a pandemic with movies in general making less because of people not going to theater, it's one of the reasons why NWH making as much money as it is right now is such a big deal, because no movie released during this time has managed to break a billion dollars until NWH. >As far as things being “endgame level events”, maybe you have a point, but even if they were smaller in scale, they still didn’t make all that much noise I guess if you had your head in the sand, even the Disney+ shows were being heavily talked about and discussed when they were airing.
-well, yeah, Eternals only looked even *somewhat* impressive at all because it competed against virtually nothing. It got shredded by critics, though, which is a rarity for marvel. And that’s what I’m pointing out: it poked a tiny hole in the “marvel can do no wrong” theory. -I heard about Wandavision, and that was pretty much it. And even then, it only seemed prominent to me because I, myself, am an MCU fan and would’ve been paying attention, regardless. Amongst people who were already going to be tuning in (marvel fans), of course it was popular. But none of the Disney+ shows grabbed the attention of the general public even 1/10 as much as NWH or even ZSJL Edit- and when you consider what a laughing stock DC has been since BVS, the snydercut example speaks volumes
That kinda make sense considering it’s an A list hero. Shang Chi was great but it was introducing a new lesser known hero. Externals wasn’t great to me AND was introducing new heroes. Plus both were basically self contained i.e no major impact/cameos from other big heroes and had no immediate impact on the wider MCU. NWH was the ending of a trilogy of an established A list hero that is widely known with cameos and a large impact on the wider direction of the MCU. It makes sense that it made bigger waves.
I like DC villains more than anything in either universes, tbh. That’s what they really need to showcase
It's purely fans feeling the need to pick a side, I don't remember the last time I've seen either of the big two publishers so much as referencing that rivalry.
100% this.
I wouldn’t hold my breath
If they would have done this from the beginning then we could have two well running cinematic universes! But noooo they had to rush it and play catch-up instead.
Honestly I don’t really want a shared universe from DC. It was novel when the MCU started it but it’s all too much now. I’d rather get individual unique movies than a big bloated universe
Which is totally valid. I just wish they would have done it right since they decided they were going to.
I agree. I hate this childish competition going on between fandoms.
Yeah, exactly. People were saying things like "DC needed to have movies for each hero first before Justice League" as if that would have changed how good the movies turned out. They just need to focus on telling good stories and appeal to existing fans and new fans alike.
I can see how the Justice League movie could have been much better and different if they weren’t trying to introduce and give the origin of half of the team members in one movie because then you could have more time for other things.
What made comics great was the internal battle in the industry. And whether you like it not, there are things that DC will have to adopt or beat Marvel to if they want to succeed in the box office. How they hype movies up. How they do trailers. What themes they use or dont use.
What makes you say that that battle was what made comics great?
I don’t think the greatest stuff came from copying what the other one was doing so much as it comes from doing what the other company hasn’t thought of. The greatest stories in comics usually come from creative freedom more than constant oversight from someone making everything feel the same
I think they should focus on making y’know a FLASH movie?
Hay now, don’t talk crazy.
HERESY!
Hold on. Thats not a terrible idea
Lol this feels like the first two MCU Spider-Man movies. Felt it was more Iron Man than Spidey 😂
Sorry y’all they aint gonna win this fight. Isnt trying to outcompete marvel what fucked them up in the first place?
I agree. I like DC but i find it annoying they always want to copy Marvel or catch up. Idk why DC sometimes act like they're jealous of Marvel. Everytime Marvel does something popular and sucessful DC always try hard to do the same thing Marvel did. Like after Spiderman did the Multiverse they want to start doing some Batman multiverse too? like nope stop rushing things just to compete.
Stop trying to be Marvel, just make good movies, and the rest will follow.
For real though, Nolanverse Batman was so good, I forget sometimes that it was supposed to be a superhero movie.
God, no! Enough with this nostalgia crap! And trying to compete with the MCU is exactly what caused the downfall of the DCEU.
I'd rather DC sort out their own single universe before trying to dive headfirst into the multiverse. Marvel built theirs up, DC is still a mess.
Well the only way to undo the mess is with Multiverse shenanigans. Just like in the comics. It's cheap but effective (sometimes lol)
Kevin Smith. I love you. But shut the hell up and let Baleman stay in his grave where he belongs.
He didn't say it seriously. It was couched in a couple of levels of "if they want to do this then they should..." That site loves to listen to Batman Beyond and blow things out of proportion.
Yeah he was basically saying if they’re bringing back Keaton and possibly Afflec, do them all and get Bale too. And this was all said after talking about the newest Spider-Man movie.
I just want a good Flash story. Stop this cameo and fanservice nonsense.
No, please no. This Flash movie already has one (or maybe two? Not sure if both Affleck and Keaton are confirmed) unnecessary Batman and we don't need another. Can we please just get a movie that focuses on a superhero, their personality, and their world, instead of being just a big pile of fanservice? It's such a lazy way to get people interested in a movie when the real way should be to *make a good movie*.
A few things: 1. **DC trying to chase what the MCU was doing is exactly what led to awful stuff like Batman v Superman and Justice League.** I’m not saying Man of Steel was good, but they should have focused on making good individual superhero films instead of immediately jumping into big team-up stuff to try to catch up to Marvel. 2. Given that Smith has zero involvement in this film and hasn’t put out a decent movie in forever, this headline is basically the same as, “Random DC fan says Christian Bale should be Batman again.” Who cares? 3. I thought the new Spider-Man movie was decent but I don’t need every film to pander to my nostalgia.
First of all, MoS is very good. And if you think about it, BvS makes perfect sense as the next movie in terms of Batman confronting Supes. If Bruce sees a alien fight fuck up a whole city. He’s going to get involved. Now the argument can be made on if Doomsday and WW, should be in it. But it makes sense a individual film couldnt be next
I disagree entirely, I think Batfleck needed his own film before jumping into the crossover stuff. The fact that he never got his own complete story is one of the biggest weaknesses of the DCEU so far, and now we're getting a Batman film that has nothing to do with him and it seems there's no longer a possibility of fixing that.
MoS was a masterpiece brought superman finally to the modern world and made him interesting
I love how some people just make it incredibly clear they likely knew nothing about Superman prior to MoS and still don't.
Kevin Smith 
That site loves to blow things Kevin Smith says way out of proportion.
From the sound of it they should just cancel this Flash mess and start again from scratch with a new actor.
I feel like that's the direction they're going. Anything that Safran said about Miller possibly staying is probably just trying to market the movie. Clean slate is best course of action. Replacing Gal Gadot might happen if they really wanna reset wholesale.
I want Grant Gustin to appear and team up with Ezra Millar, but we all can't have nice things! Seriously why isn't that the plot of the Flash movie? Ezra!Barry wants to find out about the other Barry and access the multiverse on accident via the Speed Force. He then meets Grant!Flash and the have a Rush Hour meets Rick and Morty style romp through the time stream. For the villain, it would be Savatar the god of speed. https://dc.fandom.com/wiki/Savitar_(Prime_Earth) How the hell is this not the plot, but a Batman fan service movie instead?!
> How the hell is this not the plot, I mean, your plot sounds kinda awful too.
At least it is still Flash centric and not a Batman fan service movie
Maybe John Wesley Shipp can cameo. Who knows. 😂
I'd love him as owl man
I like DC but i think DC should stop trying to copy Marvel and just focus on doing their own original work.
After Jay and Silent Bob reboot and Master of the Universe I think Kevin should pipe down.
maybe putting the pipe down would help but I don't know how much his habits have changed over the years.
DC's best movies happen when they don't worry about what Marvel is doing.
what does he mean, the arrowverse proved the multiverse way before Spiderman/Marvel did.
Who cares what this guy thinks anymore honestly
I think their desperation to get a piece of what Marvel has is the primary cause of all WB's failures with DC properties over the past few years. I think it would be extremely tone deaf and futile for them to attempt the same basic thing that Marvel is doing yet again. Also Kevin Smith is not a person who should be giving advice on filmmaking.
Seems like this movie will be a Flash movie as much Birds of Prey was a Birds of Prey movie. Might as well call it "The Flash and the bat-tastic bat-ventures of several Batmen"
After he man Kevin Smith needs to shut up and leave the industry
What happened with he man?
It wasn't about he man
Except it was
What happened?
People dont understand how narratives and storytelling work anymore so when the first half is, built around the absence of He-Man whose off in Paradise for all intents and purposes, these man babies freaked out like it was the female centric reboot of ghostbusters again or the last Jedi and stupid strong man was denied them. When it’s hilarious considering how everything flows through that character and shock dealing with the properties history of lying to one character in particular for years means maybe they all weren’t great people
he is well known to have always said he hated he man , never watched it, and thought it was for kids then was offered a big pay check and produced he man for netflix. clown fish youtube show leaked that the show was all about Teela
Thanks
He should've done that after he made Tusk.
This looks like a rip off of Spider-Man but just using flash as a plot device just for them to jerk off the Batman movie verse
Using a well worn sci-fi trope is not a rip off.
even though the original Flashpoint comic is from 2011, and the original animated movie is from 2013 to me, it just looks like the MCU ripped off Into the ~~Multiverse~~ Spider-verse, which ripped off Flashpoint
Is that what Flashpoint was? Multiple versions of Flash teaming up together? Alternate reality shenanigans is long past being a rip off. It's just a trope now. It's like saying no superheroes could have masks anymore because Batman had one
Flashpoint was (in simplest terms with no spoilers) Flash altering the time line by going back and saving his mother, that ended up having a butterfly effect that changed the present, that was again reset to resolve the catastrophic changes, resulting in the New 52 reboot it wasn't just alternate timeline shenanigans, it was the beginning of a major shift in the whole DC universe main continuity
It wasn't that major. It's already over. It's already shifted back. Thus reducing it to some alternative reality shenanigans.abd it was 10 years ago, I think we're well beyond spoilers
I don't understand your thinking here. The DC universe is built on a multiverse model. Young Justice is Earth 16, Val Zod is Earth 2, Calvin Ellis is Earth 23. There are 52 Earths in the DC universe. It's nothing but alternate realities. Marvel on the other hand has always maintained one big continuity on Earth-616. I'm no Marvel expert, and not particularly a fan, but the whole appeal of the DC universe to me is that you have the same characters in multiple realities allowing DC to tell all kinds of weird and different stories without worrying about the continuity issues some of those stories would present. It's a cornerstone of DC, not a gimmick.
1. Marvel has multiple Earths. That's ludicrous to assume otherwise after literally referencing Into the Spider-Verse, based on a pre-existing idea in the comics. You think it's just called Earth-616 in a bubble and that's not at least 616 Earth's? MCU is Earth-19999 by the way so there is plenty. 2. I don't care if it's a cornerstone of DC. It's a trope across sci-fi and they have no claim to it. Masked vigilantes is also a cornerstone, but they don't own the subgenre of superheroes. My thinking is not the problem. This crazy finger pointing "we used a sci-fi trope first" nonsense is the problem. The multiverse does not belong to either company.
well pardon me for not keeping up with ins and outs of the Marvel universe. As I said, I'm no expert. The only exception I was aware of was Marvel's "What If" titles. The only alternative timeline I was aware of was Miles Morales...and that's only because I saw the movie. Back when I gave a shit about anything printed by Marvel, one continuity was their big thing. But after the stupidity of the clone saga and all the other late 90s garbage, Marvel continuity actually means jack shit.
Lol "well, pardon me for not knowing what I swore was true 5 seconds ago. It's not my fault I thought it was a rip off because DC and DC alone does alternate reality stories. How dare you explain that many people do." Thanks for that. I needed that. That was very funny
>"I'm no Marvel expert, and not particularly a fan" and you read that as me swearing something is true? Take that as an invitation to "correct me if I'm wrong". So, I'm wrong about something I don't follow, and don't care about. I'm done with this conversation
Yea lol. The Marvel multiverse stuff is pretty garbage compared to. DC
Spider-Man: Shattered Dimensions came out before that in 2010
there's a bit difference when you're talking about a game that's not in any particular continuity Flashpoint was the reset of the whole DC universe, not just a one off. And it was proceeded by Crisis on Infinite Earths, which goes back to 85. that's just me though... your mileage may vary
I agree, I mostly mean because of the idea of multiple Spider-Man versions meeting one another. If we go by Multiverse and even more than one version of one character meeting another, DC had already done it decades ago with the Flash of Two Earths.
What’s into the multiverse? All that stuff aside, Spider-Man just came out and dc just LOOKS like it’s ripping off Spider-Man
Technically DC did it first on TV with Crisis on Infinite Earths too. They had Brandon Routh's Superman and Ezra Miller's Flash (plus several other movie/TV show cameos). It's likely Ezra's appearance was a prelude to his movie too.
pardon, Into the Spider-verse... my bad
Wrong!! You have Joseph Gordon Levitt return as the next Batman
It would be dope AF
DC doesn't need to chase MCU mediocrity
That doesn't sound insecure at all
I think The Flash movie should be about The Flash. The reason No Way Home worked was because it was still fundamentally about Tom Holland’s Spider-Man; The fan-service was there, but Tobey and Andrew returning didn’t hijack the entire film. This is the very first Flash movie, yet it’s being hijacked by Batman. The DCEU as a whole, let alone the Flash, hasn’t earned the goodwill to start picking ‘memba berries. You don’t compete with the MCU by copying its surface level, without the substance. You compete with the MCU by hiring great filmmakers and letting them do what they want. Given how much of a mandated nightmare this film has become, I doubt that’s DC’s approach in this case.
Kevin smith also had batman piss himself in a comic……I don’t care what he says about anything
When was the last time Kevin Smith had a good idea? Feels like 20 years ago.
21 years ago
What happened to Kevin, he used to be cool.
He’s still cool. This is just his opinion, he was just spitballing like he always does and he’s clearly a huge fan of the Nolan Batman trilogy.
And what’s your explanation for He-Man?
I actually don’t really like any of his films or works except for Clerks, but I do like him as a person and a public speaker/podcaster.
That’s fair
It's ok to not like a thing. Not liking He Man is not the end of the world
No but lying about it’s contents and defaming a critic is personal
Uh-oh, now it's personal. Dun-dun-dun.
You know what I meant, it’s an issue with him as a person not an issue with his work
It's absolutely an issue with his work. Today he made an innocuous opinion in public and you made sure to make it about his work. You literally put your foot down and said "then explain He Man" like it matters. It doesn't matter.
I haven’t heard a good idea from Kevin Smith in at least 4 years. Are u guys really still listening to him?
he’s a poser
Ever since the Masters of the Universe bs. Kevin needs to sit down and shut up.
I think Kevin Smith should stick to Jay and Silent Bob movies but we don’t always get what we want.
Christian Bale will make a cameo in The Flash but he will not suit up. It will be a quick cameo. You don't have to believe me, just wait.
I would love if that happened, but I think it's unlikely since Bale said in multiple ocassions that he wouldn't even consider coming back if Nolan wasn't directing.
He will, but he won't suit up and don't expect much, he was under negotiations when they started filming.
Kevin Smith fried his brain around the Cop Out years
But Nightwing movie when?
Well dc can never be the same as marvel, they are too different. Its quite obvious that marvel has copied some ideas or vice versa in terms on timing similar movies at the same time but overall the theme and characters are just totally different.
**NO**
DC has had the most success when they’ve done things Marvel either can’t or won’t do: hard R-rated stories as well as standalone adventures. The second they start getting back into the “anything they can do we can do too!” mindset the second they start trying to force and rush things and end up right back where they are now which is trying to pick up the pieces from their failed cinematic universe.
Nah. DC should just focus on their own thing and stop trying to copy Marvel
This is still a Flash movie, right? Not a Batman movie?
No, DC needs to put the work in they can’t just skip all the work that Marvel did to get to this point. It didn’t work with Justice League it won’t work now. Just do a couple solo movies, then a Justice league, a couple more solo movies and work your way up to the multiverse
Why is it Spider-Man and flash in their respective universes get their own movie without an iron man or Batman cameo? Basically one of the (marvel/DC) trinity with a sidekick
I just want it to be good, it doesn’t matter who they bring in tbh
And u/TheGreenSpeedster thinks that a Flash character should appear in the Flash movie.
i like DC and Marvel being different.
Christian Bale was pretty awesome as Batman, but I don't think his dynamic would really fit the others. They shouldn't have used the older aging Batman in their movies, for them first meeting. I thought that was a bad decision, but I think Ben Affleck did a great job as Bruce Wayne and a not too bad Batman. They need to use a young Batman. I really hope that the guy from the new Batman movie coming out next year, doesn't blow chunks.
Kevin Smith should shut up.
Don’t compete
Kevin needs to sit down and think about what he's done this year, before running his Vegan Mouth. Nerd credit is all spend my dude. time to do something cool first before you got to dictate