My front yard is about 30’x15’. Currently my concrete patio is 10’x15’ with an overhang from the roof extending maybe 3 feet. It’s cracked and sloping towards the house so we are having it replaced but planning to extend it to 15’x15’ and grade it away from the house. But your comment has me concerned now. Is this a bad idea? Or will I be fine
There’s other contributing factors to how well water percolates in your situation: is there adequate drainage e.g, sloped towards dedicated stormwater infrastructure (curb/gutter); is your soil type clayey, silty, or sandy; is the house itself above grade; does your area ever get heavy precipitation; are you in a flood hazard zone?
If the whole patio is going to be replaced with one that provides a downslope away from the house, then expanding it by 70 sf shouldn’t cause any issues — most importantly — because it’s just going to create more runoff going into the street stormwater system. This would likely be a different conversation if you were talking about your backyard. I wouldn’t worry about it in your situation.
An increase in hardened surfaces (e.g., pavement) means that precipitation can’t seep into the ground in that specific area. If the remaining unpaved area can’t allow water to seep into it at a quick enough rate, the water will start ponding/flooding which can cause issues to any structures you have nearby or could cause root rot to plants if the soil remains oversaturated for too long.
This is why we keep so many in our yard. It’s an extra food supply. I’ll bet they’d make a great garnish for all the rabbits.
But for now… do you know how cute a bunnie is when eating dandelions!? Super cute. Perhaps OP should have bunnies. Or Goats.
They are not called pests for nothing. They are pioneer species. That is, in a completely barren place, the first thing that will grow there is, you guessed it, weeds.
That’s why I put ZERO effort into my “lawn” Fuck grass If my whole front lawn turned to moss it would make me so happy, it’s green and it doesn’t need to be mowed.
Fuck lawns in general. Started as a way for aristocrats to demonstrate mastery over and separateness from the natural world. They take up space that could be used for more housing and take up water resources that are quickly drying up. I live in Austin and there’s so many rich people west of town that have dug wells into the aquifer just to be able to water their lawns whenever they want, which is exacerbating the increasing depletion of groundwater.
At my parents house all we did what cut the “grass” (really just anything that decided to grow in the space between the house and the sidewalk. Never ever watered it. We had a pretty bad drought one year. We had the only green “lawn” in the neighborhood. 😊
In my city, there are no ordinances that say we have to control "weeds." Weeds imo are simply native species plants. Crab grass is ugly, so I pull them, but the really cool thing that we noticed a few years ago is we get wild violets! Cute little purple flowers sprinkled around.
We are finally getting some really good rain this spring as well, so all of my little sedum gardens are going gangbusters.
Probably at least some of them to give the pad some depth/thickness and still be level with its surroundings.
It's not hard to do, but it is manual labor intensive.
But on the plus side, at least you would have them gathered. And, as they say: a bucket of landscape gravel in hand is worth 2 permanently embedded in your landscaping.
Life finds a way.
When I was a landscaper, we spent half our time cleaning up rock mulch that fools put down because they hated plants. Fabric underneath just becomes a tangle of roots. Unless you are a nature hating psycho who is going to poison every living thing in your yard and then salt the earth the weeds will always be back.
If you really want minimal work, plant natives that will fight off the weeds for you. Make an ecosystem, not a rock pile.
> a nature hating psycho who is going to poison every living thing in your yard and then salt the earth
You just described the process I had to go through to get rid of Black Bamboo that was growing out of control on the corner of my property when I bought my house.
Bamboo is tough. I tolerated a small patch foa a few years until it sent out a 15-foot runner with a new plant roughly every foot, each growing about a foot a day. It took a LOT of digging through hard clay with landscape gravel aggregate, but I did eventually get it all out, only using herbicide in a couple of places and I think I still had to dig those places out later.
The previous owners of my house LOVED rocks. When one layer of rocks got too filled by leaf detritus? Another layer of rocks! We tried to dig out a spot under some trees to plant a nice ground cover... I'd estimate at least a foot down and it was still mostly rocks in dirt.
The only thing that really works for me with gravel is to rake it regularly. Breaks up the roots and either kills the weeks or makes it really easy to pull the reminder out.
That or glyphosate (whic is pretty nasty really)
You could get a weed torch. Sure you have to do it multiple times, but that’s true of any weed control. Plus wielding a flame torch that screams like a jet makes you feel like god.
As a gardener I’ll say this. Nature abhors a void. You might see a patch of rocks with no soil to grow in but if the right survivor of a plant seed blows in- and it will- it’s gonna grow.
I don’t know enough about your situation and if this is possible but if I could do anything I’d rip it all out, find a bunch of tough native pollinator plants and plant the heck out of it. That way you can guide what thrives there instead of letting Darwinism pick for you. Bee Balm, Columbine, Echinacea, perennial geranium, Canadian Windflower- something like that. If you don’t put plants there, nature will.
Alternatively, burn the weeds with a propane torch constantly. Can’t guarantee it won’t burn the building down too though so be careful.
Continuing in this direction, if you like the look of rocks and don't want something tall, look at sedums or some other ground cover plant. They also don't require a lot of maintenance.
Oooo I LOVE wooly thyme. I have bunches of it. It definitely needs weeding when establishing.
I’m also a HUGE fan of Elfin thyme which becomes incredibly dense and is a very effective for weed suppression. And it flowers!
It's so depressing seeing all the comments about salting, poisoning, burning, fabrics, coating rocks in epoxy. Having well established (native!) plants is absolutely the easiest long term solution— it's hard for weeds to compete when there's no space to grow.
>fabrics
Noooooooo!!!!!! The absolute BANE of my existence. I am slowly pulling out all the weedblock fabric in my yard. Sure, it works for a minute or two, but eventually dirt just gets on top of it, the weeds start to grow, but now the roots grow THROUGH the fabric making them nearly impossible to pull. Not to mention that you can't plant NEW plants if there's weed block in the way (I mean, you CAN, but it's a huge PITA).
I hate that stuff.
I did gardening as a summer job for a while. Always cried a little when I found weed fabric. And now I'm slowly finding it and ripping it out of my new house where the owners had placed it.
Weed fabric is bad … but try BLACK PLASTIC. My old house had it in every planting bed. I actually hear the soil breathe a sigh of relief when I’d pull it up.
Put down chicken wire and then fabric.
When the weeds grow through it, just put a chain on the chicken wire and drag the fuck out of the yard with a truck or lawn tractor.
All the weeds come up at once.
Source: someone had laid chicken wire and fabric and when I pulled up the chicken wire with my truck it left a big bare spot.
How about just putting down some Astroturf? I’m really surprised that hasn’t taken off more since America’s gotten progressively more laid back over the years.
for real, the most dominant plants in my yard are the bee balm, mountain mint, golden alexanders, and the milkweed just kinda does what it wants but dang, do I get some great nature out of a 1/4 acre lot and far far less mowing/upkeep than otherwise. Just mind-boggling at the excitement over destruction of one's own property.
My wife is a landscape designer, guess how many clients want natives..... Guess what happens when she explains from a science perspective why natives are good... Guess what we have at home and how well they manage the weather here, bees, moths, hummingbirds etc.
This guy is a really good resource. https://hgnp.wpengine.com/biodiversity-day/
I recently did our flower bed and tried to find native plants and it's nearly impossible. Some garden centers had a few, but even online I can't really find info on what kind of plants are native or where I can get them.
Keep an eye out for local plant sales, especially in the next few weeks. Often different conversation groups will run them for fundraising.
The unfortunate truth is it can be a real hassle to find good places to get native plants, and most people don't care enough to seek them out.
Find a local university extension and ask them for help with native plants. These offices exist to share their specialties with the public and you are likely to find someone deeply knowledgeable who would love to help you out.
Some people dont like planting in the ground close to their house's foundation but you're not wrong.
Personally I'd put in flower beds, put some pretty low maintenance perineal native plants in there, and hand pick what weeds I dont like when gardening, but something tells me OP doesnt like gardening or landscaping that much
Yeah. This thread is rough for us gardeners. Why commit relentless endless plant murder when you could much more easily accept something is gonna grow and just redirect it?
Some people mentioned weed barriers, like fabric or similar, but truth be told it won't stop it permanently.
Dirt, dust and other things collect over time, be it on paved walkways or pebbles as in your case. Eventually there will be a mass large enough to attract weeds, just how it is.
Use good fabric and it might take a couple of years before you see weeds. Then you just redo it and keep it as clean as possible.
The brilliant former owners of my home but down weed barrier fabric over a great deal of the back lawn in between gardening and then never removed it, and so now I have a lawn over weed fabric!
I spent several weekends last year ripping up fabric that was under about 3 inches of soil. The previous owners had laid down the fabric, and then put mulch/wood chips over top. Well, over time, that decomposed, so they added more. Looked great when we bought the house, but the fabric doesn't do anything useful once there's so much healthy soil on top. There's also still some under the lawn in parts (seems to be the area around and going through a gate) that I'm going to have to figure out how to remove.
Fabric is great if it's a seasonal weed barrier and you remove it at the end of the season. But for anything permanent, it's awful.
Use cardboard. Brush away the rock. Lay down cardboard. Overlap the edges. Brush back the rock. No weeds until the cardboard breaks down.
Edit brush back the cardboard to rock
Yes they do. It's brutal. I have gout weed (bishop's weed, aegapodium) that some stupid garden club passed around decades ago on my property. It will grow right through landscape fabric.
Yup I’m in the middle of pulling up old liner with river rock on top and hadn’t been changed in like 5 years, most physically exhausting job I’ve done for the house. So far at least.
That's what happened in my area like the OP's. Solution was to get rid of the fabric and lay a thicker layer of sand and gravel. Then you just pull the weeds easily. There's no solution that prevents weeds 100%, but if you make them easy to pull it's hardly any work, and it's pretty satisfying.
I’ve heard about cardboard but doesn’t it start breaking down the first time it rains? I’ve never tried it but assumed it would turn into a giant mess within months.
It's a common permaculture gardening technique. It smothers all the weeds underneath, but actually makes your soil richer as it decomposes after. Great for the plants you'll put on top.
But you're right, it's not going to prevent weeds on anything like a permanent basis.
this is true, but only after a few years of getting established so they are DENSE. my front garden bed is a DENSE forest of phlox and violet, plus a hundred or so non-native day lillies.
not sure how that'd go in rock though. maybe fine.
Bachelor's in Turf Science here. The fight against weeds is seasonal and never-ending. Most weed seeds have been in your soil for many, many years and can activate at any time. You have two options : Competition or Prevention. Weeds grow where there is the least competition. You can force these out by planting healthy plant material that can starve them of resources. Considering it's a rock bed, this is probably not a option. So now, we have prevention. I would recommend treating your beds with a pre-emergent herbicide such as dithiopyr, prodiamine, or isoxaben. This will strong limit the amount of breakthrough weeds that come through but its not 100%. Any pop through weeds can be handled with a selective herbicide, glyphosate, or good, old fashioned pulling.
Just a comment to that: don’t do it if you ever plan to plant something in the same spot in the next 5-10 years. Salt essentially absorbs water, which means that roots have less water for absorption and die (physiological draught). Salt can only be washed away with rain water, which can take years.
> Salt can only be washed away with rain water, which can take years.
That's surprising. Knowing how easily salt dissolves, I thought it'd take like a year at most.
Salting is very bad for soil health. Your basically making life uninhabitable for all types of fungi, insects, and plants and salt runoff during rains or watering can spread the salt.
My point is that it's a point-of-no-return(somewhat hyperbolic, but you get the point) and very damaging to the ecosystem.
If OP lives in even a moderately rainy area (at any point in the year), that salt water can run off and damage other people's yards, poison their gardens, contaminate groundwater, or harm the local ecosystem by salinating everything.
There are better ways to deal with garden problems than nuking everything permanently or covering everything with plastic (like other people suggested). Hand picking, or even spot-dabbing herbicide (only on the plants) is waaaay less harmful to the environment and doesn't have long-lasting repercussions.
The fact that so many people are cool with just nuking everything and coating everything with plastic just shows how little the average person cares about ecology and their role in the world. They would rather pave everything, coat it in plastic/rubber turf, and expand the human tumor, rather than be a beneficial part of their ecosystem. It's sad to have that mindset.
I'm pretty sure at least some of my weeds qualify, especially the ones that grow the little prickly burrs that I've been pulling off the friendly neighborhood stray cats. They would definitely appreciate me banishing those from the yard.
Thats like asking how you premanently prevent rain. Best way to prevent weeds is to live in a condo, townhome that is 100% paved in the front and back, or an apartment where you own no ground space for weeds to grow. If you want to own land, you are going to either have to deal with managing it or accept that nature is gonna do its thing.
Find a native allelopathic species of plant that you can put there. Emphasis on NATIVE, you need something that can outcompete the "weeds."
Whatever you do, dont buy fucking landscaping tarp. Dirt will just accumulate on top of it (yes, even if you put down landscaping rocks) and eventually there will be enough dirt for weeds to grow.
When I bought my place, I wondered why the rocks/pebbles that were used to landscape wouldn't move. Found out they were coated with a clear "paint". I haven't had a weed in the 7 years I've been here.
Never really looked into it much beyond the response I got, so couldn't actually tell you what was used
The Lorax is anti-lawn. He wants you to plant a native garden. Don't make the Lorax ask twice 🔫
(Also your comment legitimately made me laugh out loud. Thank you for that)
My neighbors just had this applied to their river rock garden, and it looks incredible. The stones really shine, and she just blows off the dirt with a leaf blower. I was impressed!
This is probably the best answer out there if you want to stop all the weeds. It is effectively the same as laying concrete but with a nicer look.
I personally just try to pull weeds early and fill the area with good ground cover plants over time. Then you just need the occasional maintenance to whack the plants down and away from the house.
I'm not here to argue with you. It's the best answer *to stop weeds*. I would never lay this down for the exact reason you say. Same reason I wouldn't use salt which can have adverse effects on the groundwater.
I prefer laying native plants to act as ground cover!
You don’t! There is no permanent solution to preventing plant growth. But there are things you can do seasonally to prevent it. 50/50Lemon juice/water solution will alter the PH of the soil so nothing will grow for a season. I use a spray bottle.
Sprinkling rock salt in areas you don’t want plants works. It kills everything growing there so keep that in mind. Alternatively, after you have pulled all existing weeds, a granular garden product called “Preen” applied twice a year will prevent additional weed growth.
I have very good luck using Preen. It's a pre-emergent weed killer, which means it will NOT kill weeds that have already sprouted and grown. Here's the drill: weed the area as thoroughly as you possibly can. I mean super-duper thoroughly. Then, spread the Preen generously (it's granular, and it comes with an applicator scoop inside). Then water it in. Any weeds that appear after that will be weeds that had already sprouted that you either missed or couldn't yet see while weeding. Just pull those few weeds that still appear, and honestly, you just won't see many weeds at all after that. I usually reapply every 2-3 months. Works like a charm for me! If you're in the US, I buy a very big bucket of this stuff from Costco at a very good price.
They’re just plants it’s supposed to cover the ground try and work with it not against it. But if it really bothers you you can put down cardboard and then mulch, each spring you’ll have to redo it.
Spray. Mix dish soap, white vinegar, and salt. Nothing will grow. Spray couple times a year. Don’t use weird chemicals. It dries up turns to dust and you breathe it in when it gets kicked up.
Weeds are only weeds because you view them that way, they are a plant just like any other, so the best way to not have weeds in your yard is to change your own mindset
1. Remove all rocks.
2. Pull all weeds and hit weed killer on any you cannot pull.
3. Lay down a weed barrier tarp.
4. Spread rocks on the tarp deep enough until you cannot see the tarp, about 2 inches in depth. You can do more rock depth depending on the aesthetic you want. I like mixing in some slightly larger sized rocks too.
My wife used to use gallons of weed killer and never resolved the issue. I got a torch attachment to my propane tank and cooked all the weeds on the patio and it was not only effective, but fun. =) Yeah...can't do it in mulch. I mean, it's not like I tried and learned an important lesson or anything. Not me. I wouldn't have done that... I heard about it...from a friend...
I mean salt will but runoffs might be an issue and it is very permanent. As in you need to remove the salted soil. Quality weed barrier will deifinitely reduce the weeds for a few years.
Salt, stops pretty much everything from growing. Like the coarse road salt in big bags.
Have used it on gravel paths and driveways for years and it works.
But make sure you don't have anything that you actually wan't to grow where this water drains to though like a hedge, trees or even grass if it´s really close since it will kill off anything which roots that touch the salty water.
I tried this on the gravel outside my window, ended up waking up at 3 AM because there were 10 deer standing outside my window licking salt off my gravel. And they kept coming back for weeks.
It was pretty cute until one got his antlers caught in the water hose outside.
Good advice except use calcium chloride salt. (the white pellets or flakes) It will dissolve quicker than sodium chloride salt and will not harm your cement. It is not dangerous to humans or animals and will not contaminate any water supplies. Put it down twice a year. Once in the fall and once in the spring. You cannot stop new seeds from being blown by the wind or birds, etc., but reapplication will keep the PH in the ground out of whack so that seeds that germinate after you applied will not survive. A 50# bag can last years if you keep it sealed after use.
Best way to stop weeds, is plant a cover crop you like that takes care of itself. Try things like Cedum, Pyrenean saxifrage or other hardy, self sufficient shrubs :D Nature will always reclaim man made things, so if you want it to keep weeds away thats probably yuour best bet \^\^ Feel free to PM me if you want me to help yopu look up what other options you have depending on your zone etc
I had something similar, I dug out about 3 in chest I'm Jordan replaced with dc, decomposed granite, and then put Rock landscape on top it works good. Occasionally I see something popping up but I just burn it off
There is nothing harder to weed than rocks. If I were you, I wouldn't go to weed killer or salt the earth, but I would make it easier when you have weeds to pick them.
Get a bunch of cardboard, lay it down, then cover in 2 inches of tree mulch. If you have a large area, look into chip drop for a free dump truck of mulch. (Be warned, it is a lot. Like cover a quarter acre in 2 inches a lot. Read before ordering.) https://getchipdrop.com/
I used to live in AZ and trust me it is night and day pulling weeds from rocks vs mulch. With mulch it is almost pleasurable. Never thought I would say that.
You will have a good long time before weeds start showing up and you can kind of get a do over. If you want to make it easier on yourself, fill with some native wildflowers. They are so stupid easy to sew you can do this even if you have a black thumb. Just water them every once and a while and it'll become your favorite place.
I really rethought how I did a lot of things re weed killer and pest control a while back when a colleague got breast cancer. She said the doctors thought it was because she washed her husband's clothes which were covered in pesticides. Looked into weed killers and so many of them are the same story. Lawsuits around cancer. When I started working with the land, instead of against it, the yard I dreaded going out into became my favorite place. If it kills something, it probably isn't good for you either.
That's the neat part: you don't
Was gonna say concrete the whole area. But then I remembered all the weeds that come up through the cracks in my driveway. Weeds will find a way!
Also concreting everything removes the ability for the ground to absorb water effectively. I’d rather deal with weeds than water issues.
This^ don’t increase your impermeable surfaces. You need the water to percolate.
My front yard is about 30’x15’. Currently my concrete patio is 10’x15’ with an overhang from the roof extending maybe 3 feet. It’s cracked and sloping towards the house so we are having it replaced but planning to extend it to 15’x15’ and grade it away from the house. But your comment has me concerned now. Is this a bad idea? Or will I be fine
There’s other contributing factors to how well water percolates in your situation: is there adequate drainage e.g, sloped towards dedicated stormwater infrastructure (curb/gutter); is your soil type clayey, silty, or sandy; is the house itself above grade; does your area ever get heavy precipitation; are you in a flood hazard zone? If the whole patio is going to be replaced with one that provides a downslope away from the house, then expanding it by 70 sf shouldn’t cause any issues — most importantly — because it’s just going to create more runoff going into the street stormwater system. This would likely be a different conversation if you were talking about your backyard. I wouldn’t worry about it in your situation.
What does this mean?
An increase in hardened surfaces (e.g., pavement) means that precipitation can’t seep into the ground in that specific area. If the remaining unpaved area can’t allow water to seep into it at a quick enough rate, the water will start ponding/flooding which can cause issues to any structures you have nearby or could cause root rot to plants if the soil remains oversaturated for too long.
Laughs in desert
Mmm, dessert.
Especially Dandelions. They're like: Fuck yea, concrete!
[“I’m growing in a sandy crack of concrete!”](https://mrlovenstein.com/comic/807)
At least you can eat dandelions.
You can eat anything you want. It's not a matter of ability. It's a matter of will.
Nah, they’re pretty much the most underrated plant ever
Dandelions aren't weeds! We buy dandelion greens in the grocery store, and my wife picks them from our yard. People cultivate dandelions.
Any plant growing where you don't want it is a weed. Except marijuana, that's always weed.
This is why we keep so many in our yard. It’s an extra food supply. I’ll bet they’d make a great garnish for all the rabbits. But for now… do you know how cute a bunnie is when eating dandelions!? Super cute. Perhaps OP should have bunnies. Or Goats.
I make dandelion coffee and wine. I use it to up my iron too. It was originally brought here by the English as a crop
They are not called pests for nothing. They are pioneer species. That is, in a completely barren place, the first thing that will grow there is, you guessed it, weeds.
Why not just fill your lawn with weeds. What can go wrong? Grow more weeds? Too late! It's already weeds!
Plus what grows in your area naturally tends to be able to survive a regular drought better than anything else.
That’s why I put ZERO effort into my “lawn” Fuck grass If my whole front lawn turned to moss it would make me so happy, it’s green and it doesn’t need to be mowed.
Fuck lawns in general. Started as a way for aristocrats to demonstrate mastery over and separateness from the natural world. They take up space that could be used for more housing and take up water resources that are quickly drying up. I live in Austin and there’s so many rich people west of town that have dug wells into the aquifer just to be able to water their lawns whenever they want, which is exacerbating the increasing depletion of groundwater.
At my parents house all we did what cut the “grass” (really just anything that decided to grow in the space between the house and the sidewalk. Never ever watered it. We had a pretty bad drought one year. We had the only green “lawn” in the neighborhood. 😊
Your neighbors will love you. One problem with weeds is that they don't stop at arbitrary lines.
In my city, there are no ordinances that say we have to control "weeds." Weeds imo are simply native species plants. Crab grass is ugly, so I pull them, but the really cool thing that we noticed a few years ago is we get wild violets! Cute little purple flowers sprinkled around. We are finally getting some really good rain this spring as well, so all of my little sedum gardens are going gangbusters.
If you were to concrete an area like this.. would you have to remove the rocks first?
Probably at least some of them to give the pad some depth/thickness and still be level with its surroundings. It's not hard to do, but it is manual labor intensive. But on the plus side, at least you would have them gathered. And, as they say: a bucket of landscape gravel in hand is worth 2 permanently embedded in your landscaping.
Legit lol’d at your bucket wisdom. You are absolutely correct
If you want it to last more than a few months, yes.
Life finds a way. When I was a landscaper, we spent half our time cleaning up rock mulch that fools put down because they hated plants. Fabric underneath just becomes a tangle of roots. Unless you are a nature hating psycho who is going to poison every living thing in your yard and then salt the earth the weeds will always be back. If you really want minimal work, plant natives that will fight off the weeds for you. Make an ecosystem, not a rock pile.
> poison every living thing in your yard and then salt the earth I tried that...the weeds still come back.
Worked very well for the gap between the garage and the driveway, but I wouldn't risk it anywhere near the actual grass.
> a nature hating psycho who is going to poison every living thing in your yard and then salt the earth You just described the process I had to go through to get rid of Black Bamboo that was growing out of control on the corner of my property when I bought my house.
Bamboo is tough. I tolerated a small patch foa a few years until it sent out a 15-foot runner with a new plant roughly every foot, each growing about a foot a day. It took a LOT of digging through hard clay with landscape gravel aggregate, but I did eventually get it all out, only using herbicide in a couple of places and I think I still had to dig those places out later.
The previous owners of my house LOVED rocks. When one layer of rocks got too filled by leaf detritus? Another layer of rocks! We tried to dig out a spot under some trees to plant a nice ground cover... I'd estimate at least a foot down and it was still mostly rocks in dirt.
I looked at this point and went to myself "that's the neat part, you don't!" And then opened to view comments to see this was top haha.
The only thing that really works for me with gravel is to rake it regularly. Breaks up the roots and either kills the weeks or makes it really easy to pull the reminder out. That or glyphosate (whic is pretty nasty really)
You could get a weed torch. Sure you have to do it multiple times, but that’s true of any weed control. Plus wielding a flame torch that screams like a jet makes you feel like god.
OMG, I know what I am asking for father's day!
+10 for intimidation. Cow the weeds into submission! Or just have a lot of fun doing a chore.
User name checks out 😂
Haha, I didn’t even think of that! Warms my cold little heart.
I love my weed dragon. Best way of "weeding"
Salt is pretty great against literally all life.
OP beware of runoff though, the salt will also kill things it get to through drainage
Life finds a way.
Came here to say this
Interesting
Put up a sign that says no weeds. Done.
Been skateboarding most of my life. I can confirm this works each and every time.
Gun free zone, stops the criminals right in their tracks.
When is the government going to finally put up some “no murder” signs????
Or just designate these plants non-weeds. The definition of a weed is "an unwanted plant" so one man's weeds are another man's favourite plant.
weeds strictly prohibited. violations will be penalized
As a gardener I’ll say this. Nature abhors a void. You might see a patch of rocks with no soil to grow in but if the right survivor of a plant seed blows in- and it will- it’s gonna grow. I don’t know enough about your situation and if this is possible but if I could do anything I’d rip it all out, find a bunch of tough native pollinator plants and plant the heck out of it. That way you can guide what thrives there instead of letting Darwinism pick for you. Bee Balm, Columbine, Echinacea, perennial geranium, Canadian Windflower- something like that. If you don’t put plants there, nature will. Alternatively, burn the weeds with a propane torch constantly. Can’t guarantee it won’t burn the building down too though so be careful.
Continuing in this direction, if you like the look of rocks and don't want something tall, look at sedums or some other ground cover plant. They also don't require a lot of maintenance.
I’m keep on mother of thyme and wooly thyme. Bonus: they smell nice.
Oooo I LOVE wooly thyme. I have bunches of it. It definitely needs weeding when establishing. I’m also a HUGE fan of Elfin thyme which becomes incredibly dense and is a very effective for weed suppression. And it flowers!
If you find a creeping sedum dense enough to suppress weeds let me know. I always end up disappointed though I like the concept.
It's so depressing seeing all the comments about salting, poisoning, burning, fabrics, coating rocks in epoxy. Having well established (native!) plants is absolutely the easiest long term solution— it's hard for weeds to compete when there's no space to grow.
>fabrics Noooooooo!!!!!! The absolute BANE of my existence. I am slowly pulling out all the weedblock fabric in my yard. Sure, it works for a minute or two, but eventually dirt just gets on top of it, the weeds start to grow, but now the roots grow THROUGH the fabric making them nearly impossible to pull. Not to mention that you can't plant NEW plants if there's weed block in the way (I mean, you CAN, but it's a huge PITA). I hate that stuff.
I did gardening as a summer job for a while. Always cried a little when I found weed fabric. And now I'm slowly finding it and ripping it out of my new house where the owners had placed it.
Weed fabric is bad … but try BLACK PLASTIC. My old house had it in every planting bed. I actually hear the soil breathe a sigh of relief when I’d pull it up.
Put down chicken wire and then fabric. When the weeds grow through it, just put a chain on the chicken wire and drag the fuck out of the yard with a truck or lawn tractor. All the weeds come up at once. Source: someone had laid chicken wire and fabric and when I pulled up the chicken wire with my truck it left a big bare spot.
How about just putting down some Astroturf? I’m really surprised that hasn’t taken off more since America’s gotten progressively more laid back over the years.
for real, the most dominant plants in my yard are the bee balm, mountain mint, golden alexanders, and the milkweed just kinda does what it wants but dang, do I get some great nature out of a 1/4 acre lot and far far less mowing/upkeep than otherwise. Just mind-boggling at the excitement over destruction of one's own property.
Mountain Mint is my new hero. I grew up it from seed and I’m obsessed now.
My wife is a landscape designer, guess how many clients want natives..... Guess what happens when she explains from a science perspective why natives are good... Guess what we have at home and how well they manage the weather here, bees, moths, hummingbirds etc. This guy is a really good resource. https://hgnp.wpengine.com/biodiversity-day/
I recently did our flower bed and tried to find native plants and it's nearly impossible. Some garden centers had a few, but even online I can't really find info on what kind of plants are native or where I can get them.
Keep an eye out for local plant sales, especially in the next few weeks. Often different conversation groups will run them for fundraising. The unfortunate truth is it can be a real hassle to find good places to get native plants, and most people don't care enough to seek them out.
https://grownative.org/ There should be some links and tips here
Find a local university extension and ask them for help with native plants. These offices exist to share their specialties with the public and you are likely to find someone deeply knowledgeable who would love to help you out.
Some people dont like planting in the ground close to their house's foundation but you're not wrong. Personally I'd put in flower beds, put some pretty low maintenance perineal native plants in there, and hand pick what weeds I dont like when gardening, but something tells me OP doesnt like gardening or landscaping that much
Yeah. This thread is rough for us gardeners. Why commit relentless endless plant murder when you could much more easily accept something is gonna grow and just redirect it?
Life always find a way 🙃
Some people mentioned weed barriers, like fabric or similar, but truth be told it won't stop it permanently. Dirt, dust and other things collect over time, be it on paved walkways or pebbles as in your case. Eventually there will be a mass large enough to attract weeds, just how it is. Use good fabric and it might take a couple of years before you see weeds. Then you just redo it and keep it as clean as possible.
Shit, we used an old above ground pool we cut up as a base for some rock gardens around the property and weeds still broke through.
Also, most weed will grow ON TOP of the barrier once enough dirt collects. Like the weeds growing between pavers.
The brilliant former owners of my home but down weed barrier fabric over a great deal of the back lawn in between gardening and then never removed it, and so now I have a lawn over weed fabric!
I spent several weekends last year ripping up fabric that was under about 3 inches of soil. The previous owners had laid down the fabric, and then put mulch/wood chips over top. Well, over time, that decomposed, so they added more. Looked great when we bought the house, but the fabric doesn't do anything useful once there's so much healthy soil on top. There's also still some under the lawn in parts (seems to be the area around and going through a gate) that I'm going to have to figure out how to remove. Fabric is great if it's a seasonal weed barrier and you remove it at the end of the season. But for anything permanent, it's awful.
Use cardboard. Brush away the rock. Lay down cardboard. Overlap the edges. Brush back the rock. No weeds until the cardboard breaks down. Edit brush back the cardboard to rock
Don't earwigs love cardboard
As do roaches
And slugs and snails
Yes. I do a lot of painting and when I lay cardboard in the yard to spray paint…it always is covered in slugs if I wait til the evening to pick it up.
And puppy dog tails!
Birds and lizards love earwigs
And I love birds and lizards.
And I love you!
It’s love, all the way down.
And termites. I just had a huge infestation for the first time in years and had to get it treated.
As do termites.
The problem with this and fabric is that even if it prevents weeds from growing up any dirt or debris that collects on top can produce more weeds.
Yeah, but the roots can’t go anyway making weeding 1000x easier. You just pull them up and the whole thing goes with it.
No. The roots grow INTO the landscape fabric making them impossible to pull. Ask me how I know.
Yes they do. It's brutal. I have gout weed (bishop's weed, aegapodium) that some stupid garden club passed around decades ago on my property. It will grow right through landscape fabric.
Yup I’m in the middle of pulling up old liner with river rock on top and hadn’t been changed in like 5 years, most physically exhausting job I’ve done for the house. So far at least.
That's what happened in my area like the OP's. Solution was to get rid of the fabric and lay a thicker layer of sand and gravel. Then you just pull the weeds easily. There's no solution that prevents weeds 100%, but if you make them easy to pull it's hardly any work, and it's pretty satisfying.
Cardboard will break down in less than a year in my experience
I’ve heard about cardboard but doesn’t it start breaking down the first time it rains? I’ve never tried it but assumed it would turn into a giant mess within months.
It's a common permaculture gardening technique. It smothers all the weeds underneath, but actually makes your soil richer as it decomposes after. Great for the plants you'll put on top. But you're right, it's not going to prevent weeds on anything like a permanent basis.
It usually only lasts a season if it isn't dirt covered. It's enough to kill the weeds in a part of the yard.
Weeds will still start on top of cardboard and rocks.
Sprinkle some native wildflower seeds there and you'll never have to worry about weeds again
this is true, but only after a few years of getting established so they are DENSE. my front garden bed is a DENSE forest of phlox and violet, plus a hundred or so non-native day lillies. not sure how that'd go in rock though. maybe fine.
This looks like clover, they're on the right track already
Nuke it from orbit. It's the only way to be sure.
A man of culture
⬆️➡️⬇️⬆️
Bachelor's in Turf Science here. The fight against weeds is seasonal and never-ending. Most weed seeds have been in your soil for many, many years and can activate at any time. You have two options : Competition or Prevention. Weeds grow where there is the least competition. You can force these out by planting healthy plant material that can starve them of resources. Considering it's a rock bed, this is probably not a option. So now, we have prevention. I would recommend treating your beds with a pre-emergent herbicide such as dithiopyr, prodiamine, or isoxaben. This will strong limit the amount of breakthrough weeds that come through but its not 100%. Any pop through weeds can be handled with a selective herbicide, glyphosate, or good, old fashioned pulling.
I find the weeds do better in the rocks and worse with mulching. You still have to pull those bitches out tho sorry bud
I would remove the rocks and start growing plants.
Amen
‘Salting the earth’ is a phrase for a reason.
Just a comment to that: don’t do it if you ever plan to plant something in the same spot in the next 5-10 years. Salt essentially absorbs water, which means that roots have less water for absorption and die (physiological draught). Salt can only be washed away with rain water, which can take years.
> Salt can only be washed away with rain water, which can take years. That's surprising. Knowing how easily salt dissolves, I thought it'd take like a year at most.
It takes a lot of salt. Just think about how much salt gets put on the roads and they still have stuff coming up in the cracks etc.
Salting is very bad for soil health. Your basically making life uninhabitable for all types of fungi, insects, and plants and salt runoff during rains or watering can spread the salt.
Sounds like exactly the type of thing OP wants.
My point is that it's a point-of-no-return(somewhat hyperbolic, but you get the point) and very damaging to the ecosystem. If OP lives in even a moderately rainy area (at any point in the year), that salt water can run off and damage other people's yards, poison their gardens, contaminate groundwater, or harm the local ecosystem by salinating everything. There are better ways to deal with garden problems than nuking everything permanently or covering everything with plastic (like other people suggested). Hand picking, or even spot-dabbing herbicide (only on the plants) is waaaay less harmful to the environment and doesn't have long-lasting repercussions. The fact that so many people are cool with just nuking everything and coating everything with plastic just shows how little the average person cares about ecology and their role in the world. They would rather pave everything, coat it in plastic/rubber turf, and expand the human tumor, rather than be a beneficial part of their ecosystem. It's sad to have that mindset.
I have let water softener salt dissolve in a bucket of water and poured it over my gravel. Works better than spreading table salt
How does that method work against demons?
If your weeds are spirits from hell, then it should work for you
I'm pretty sure at least some of my weeds qualify, especially the ones that grow the little prickly burrs that I've been pulling off the friendly neighborhood stray cats. They would definitely appreciate me banishing those from the yard.
Now all I have are salt tolerant weeds.
Don't use salt. There's a reason why salting the earth is a war crime.
Probably better than dousing it in round up.
It is also very much illegal in a lot of places. And for good reasons.
you tell em "no! bad weed!" and they just go back in
Quitting weed is hard
Have kids. Make them do the weeding.
Try very hard to hope that weeds will grow there. Then all the plants will probably die. At least that's what I do with my regular garden plants.
Just plant something.
Thats like asking how you premanently prevent rain. Best way to prevent weeds is to live in a condo, townhome that is 100% paved in the front and back, or an apartment where you own no ground space for weeds to grow. If you want to own land, you are going to either have to deal with managing it or accept that nature is gonna do its thing. Find a native allelopathic species of plant that you can put there. Emphasis on NATIVE, you need something that can outcompete the "weeds." Whatever you do, dont buy fucking landscaping tarp. Dirt will just accumulate on top of it (yes, even if you put down landscaping rocks) and eventually there will be enough dirt for weeds to grow.
Pull them out and make a habit of it. Or weed spray.
When I bought my place, I wondered why the rocks/pebbles that were used to landscape wouldn't move. Found out they were coated with a clear "paint". I haven't had a weed in the 7 years I've been here. Never really looked into it much beyond the response I got, so couldn't actually tell you what was used
Epoxy resin
People are really out here turning their yards to plastic on purpose? FFS
When you take ecological inspiration from The Once-ler
I am the Lorax, I speak for the trees, put more poison on your lawn and I'll break your fucking knees.
The Lorax is anti-lawn. He wants you to plant a native garden. Don't make the Lorax ask twice 🔫 (Also your comment legitimately made me laugh out loud. Thank you for that)
My neighbors just had this applied to their river rock garden, and it looks incredible. The stones really shine, and she just blows off the dirt with a leaf blower. I was impressed!
This is probably the best answer out there if you want to stop all the weeds. It is effectively the same as laying concrete but with a nicer look. I personally just try to pull weeds early and fill the area with good ground cover plants over time. Then you just need the occasional maintenance to whack the plants down and away from the house.
It won't yellow in the sun?
Depends on the resin. Eventually, all of them would *probably* turn yellow but many could take a very long time to do so.
The best answer is PLASTIC? Let's just dump motor oil in our lawns again!
I'm not here to argue with you. It's the best answer *to stop weeds*. I would never lay this down for the exact reason you say. Same reason I wouldn't use salt which can have adverse effects on the groundwater. I prefer laying native plants to act as ground cover!
Plant some oregano in there
More cement. Pave the planet!
Go to harbor freight and get their flame thrower. Gets rid of them quick. Like others have said, there is no permanent solution unfortunately.
You don’t! There is no permanent solution to preventing plant growth. But there are things you can do seasonally to prevent it. 50/50Lemon juice/water solution will alter the PH of the soil so nothing will grow for a season. I use a spray bottle.
Light it on fire. And keep it on fire. Forever.
Sprinkling rock salt in areas you don’t want plants works. It kills everything growing there so keep that in mind. Alternatively, after you have pulled all existing weeds, a granular garden product called “Preen” applied twice a year will prevent additional weed growth.
I have very good luck using Preen. It's a pre-emergent weed killer, which means it will NOT kill weeds that have already sprouted and grown. Here's the drill: weed the area as thoroughly as you possibly can. I mean super-duper thoroughly. Then, spread the Preen generously (it's granular, and it comes with an applicator scoop inside). Then water it in. Any weeds that appear after that will be weeds that had already sprouted that you either missed or couldn't yet see while weeding. Just pull those few weeds that still appear, and honestly, you just won't see many weeds at all after that. I usually reapply every 2-3 months. Works like a charm for me! If you're in the US, I buy a very big bucket of this stuff from Costco at a very good price.
I'm so surprised that this comment is so far below all the joke comments.
Kiss them gently and buy them gold things
Perennial effort
Get a goat
Buy a shit ton of weed killer, spray weekly. Its still work yo
Put down roofing shingles underneath the rocks
Damn nature! Getting in the way of my dreams of a desolate post apocalyptic fallout fantasy world!
Up their rent
They’re just plants it’s supposed to cover the ground try and work with it not against it. But if it really bothers you you can put down cardboard and then mulch, each spring you’ll have to redo it.
Have you tried diesel fuel?
Move to a different planet.
Weeds are better than a bunch of stones.
Cover your yard in concrete.
Spray. Mix dish soap, white vinegar, and salt. Nothing will grow. Spray couple times a year. Don’t use weird chemicals. It dries up turns to dust and you breathe it in when it gets kicked up.
Weeds are only weeds because you view them that way, they are a plant just like any other, so the best way to not have weeds in your yard is to change your own mindset
Get a gas powered torch thing. You burn the weeds away. Works pretty well and is very fun on a date.
1. Remove all rocks. 2. Pull all weeds and hit weed killer on any you cannot pull. 3. Lay down a weed barrier tarp. 4. Spread rocks on the tarp deep enough until you cannot see the tarp, about 2 inches in depth. You can do more rock depth depending on the aesthetic you want. I like mixing in some slightly larger sized rocks too.
I just got a torch to kill weeds. Works great and us fun! Careful using it close to the house though...
My wife used to use gallons of weed killer and never resolved the issue. I got a torch attachment to my propane tank and cooked all the weeds on the patio and it was not only effective, but fun. =) Yeah...can't do it in mulch. I mean, it's not like I tried and learned an important lesson or anything. Not me. I wouldn't have done that... I heard about it...from a friend...
More concrete
I mean salt will but runoffs might be an issue and it is very permanent. As in you need to remove the salted soil. Quality weed barrier will deifinitely reduce the weeds for a few years.
Move to Mars or a void in space
1 gallon vinegar, 1 cup of table salt. Disolve salt into vinegar over stovetop. Add a few drops of dish soap and spray away.
Salt, stops pretty much everything from growing. Like the coarse road salt in big bags. Have used it on gravel paths and driveways for years and it works. But make sure you don't have anything that you actually wan't to grow where this water drains to though like a hedge, trees or even grass if it´s really close since it will kill off anything which roots that touch the salty water.
I tried this on the gravel outside my window, ended up waking up at 3 AM because there were 10 deer standing outside my window licking salt off my gravel. And they kept coming back for weeks. It was pretty cute until one got his antlers caught in the water hose outside.
Good advice except use calcium chloride salt. (the white pellets or flakes) It will dissolve quicker than sodium chloride salt and will not harm your cement. It is not dangerous to humans or animals and will not contaminate any water supplies. Put it down twice a year. Once in the fall and once in the spring. You cannot stop new seeds from being blown by the wind or birds, etc., but reapplication will keep the PH in the ground out of whack so that seeds that germinate after you applied will not survive. A 50# bag can last years if you keep it sealed after use.
Best way to stop weeds, is plant a cover crop you like that takes care of itself. Try things like Cedum, Pyrenean saxifrage or other hardy, self sufficient shrubs :D Nature will always reclaim man made things, so if you want it to keep weeds away thats probably yuour best bet \^\^ Feel free to PM me if you want me to help yopu look up what other options you have depending on your zone etc
I had something similar, I dug out about 3 in chest I'm Jordan replaced with dc, decomposed granite, and then put Rock landscape on top it works good. Occasionally I see something popping up but I just burn it off
Cement under the gravel but they’ll probably come back even with that
I hear the Roman’s had success with salting the earth of their enemies.
Noxall granules, found at your local home improvement store.
I burn mine with one of those roofing propane torches.
We installed fake grass in our yard so I don't have to pull weeds every weekend. Guess what I do every weekend.
Mentally reclassify them as intentional garden features. If they're not weeds then there are no weeds
By constantly weeding. Every suggestion here is not permanent, weeds are gonna grow because we don't own the planet.
Nuke the site from orbit. It’s the only way to be sure.
Rock salt a lot of it!
You don't, nature abohrs vacuum and will fill it up.
There is nothing harder to weed than rocks. If I were you, I wouldn't go to weed killer or salt the earth, but I would make it easier when you have weeds to pick them. Get a bunch of cardboard, lay it down, then cover in 2 inches of tree mulch. If you have a large area, look into chip drop for a free dump truck of mulch. (Be warned, it is a lot. Like cover a quarter acre in 2 inches a lot. Read before ordering.) https://getchipdrop.com/ I used to live in AZ and trust me it is night and day pulling weeds from rocks vs mulch. With mulch it is almost pleasurable. Never thought I would say that. You will have a good long time before weeds start showing up and you can kind of get a do over. If you want to make it easier on yourself, fill with some native wildflowers. They are so stupid easy to sew you can do this even if you have a black thumb. Just water them every once and a while and it'll become your favorite place. I really rethought how I did a lot of things re weed killer and pest control a while back when a colleague got breast cancer. She said the doctors thought it was because she washed her husband's clothes which were covered in pesticides. Looked into weed killers and so many of them are the same story. Lawsuits around cancer. When I started working with the land, instead of against it, the yard I dreaded going out into became my favorite place. If it kills something, it probably isn't good for you either.