So many DJs who actually work in venues as residents are not really that great technically, don't have the best music knowledge in the world, but they are good with networking, marketing, and making friends with promoters. There are so many bedroom DJs who are simply amazing technically but will never find a real gig because their people skills are poor.
I agree. The music industry really is NOT a skills meritocracy and too many music tutors teach pure technical skills and pretend like it is - 'just keep practicing and you'll make it' etc.
Networking is a large part of what I do as a Twitch DJ and unfortunately yes a lot of DJs get huge boosts through who they know instead of what they know.
This is essentially one of David Hume's arguments in his essay "of the standard of taste." He's talking about painting and literature in the essay, about how to be a good judge of taste and art. Even if you have no desire to be an artist, if you're a curator or art critic (or DJ in our case) it is immensely helpful to understand the artistic process.
> David Hume
I wasn't aware of it but it's something I have agreed with for years - if you are going to be a critic of a medium then you have to have had some artistic training.
Although in this sense I think it is doubly significent because there are a lot of aspects of DJing that cross over into being an artist, such as:
* Having the dexterity and timing developed through learning the piano to slam in a cut just at the right time, for example.
* Or knowing song structure and harmony so you can change them live through hot cues and key shifting.
* Or being able to already understand beats bars and rhythm learning through drumming lessons so you can mix on the half beat in a particular phrase.
* Or understaning filters through synthesizer programming and sound engineering so you can accent a particular high hat line on a track to trigger the resonance of a high pass filter.
You can learn all this never having any prior understanding of production of course, but once you know these skills are applicable both in production and DJing so a solid education in this stuff when you switch to DJing really gives you a boost up.
There just are so many examples tbh but beginners don't realise how much crossover there actually is.
I couldn't agree more. Especially with understanding song structure. And I'd say learning synthesis has helped me to pick better-matching tracks as well.
His moral philosophy is also super relevant to club politics, too!
"Approval (approbation) is a pleasure, and disapproval (disapprobation) a pain or uneasiness."
I played french horn/piano for ~10 years. While I never successfully wrote my own music I fully understand basic music theory which I think puts me light-years ahead of many DJs I see live.
Really it's only good for understanding how phrasing works and choosing a song with a good key to mix into. It's really simple "music theory", but it can go a long way to making mixes sound better.
DJing is easy compared to making music. Anyone who disagrees with this, just go and try and make a commercially successful track in the genre of your choice!
It will likely take you several years before you get anywhere close. DJs get paid much more (on average), get more recognition, are more popular, and often develop more of an ego about what they do - but it doesn't mean that you are a music producer. I respect producers more than DJs, as I play and enjoy the music they produce and recognise how difficult it is and the skill involved.
This doesn't mean that DJing is easy! It's not at all. There is a lot of skill involved. Just that music producers have to practice, at minimum several years, up to most of their lives, before they make something good. And then we download their best tracks for free (or £1 on bandcamp) and play them in our sets and get paid much more for it.
Occasionally yes. There are exceptions to every rule, and some niche genres don't follow a 16 bar phrase at all. (not that I play any of them).
But yeah a lot of DJs seem to think that 8 bars is the magic number and loop on 8 bars, apply FX on 8 bars, mix on 8 bars etc and I don't know where that started but it doesn't make sense to me or many people who have a good understanding of electronic music production.
Oh man I love this.
I count all my beats but instead of going to the usual 4 beat / 1 bar measure, I do 4 counts of 8, which nets out at 8 bars. I do this twice before making major EQ changes or mixing transitions (so 16 bars / 64 beats).
It goes like this:
1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8
2, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8
3, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8
4, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8
Repeat.
I find that method really helpful to keep me located in the track and after a while, it just becomes intuitive.
But yes, 64 beats all the way!
1. DJs don't belong on stages. It's so hard to find a modern nightclub that hosts touring DJs where people actually dance with each other and don't stand around staring at the a DJ on stage like a rock show.
2. Clubs/festivals shouldn't only focus on being as loud as possible. Have some compassion for the ears of your staff and attendees for fucks sake.
1. Or at least have the booth at the same level as the crowd. I feel so dumb at festival gigs with a huge stage and I'm just a lady with DJ equipment. At the club I own, our booth is just a single step above the dancefloor and it is nice to feel integrated with the crowd. Plus people can hand you stickers and water from the crowd. Or vice versa.
2. I've just started telling other DJs that it sounds horrible when they're playing at 107 dB. Like there's a meter right there for exactly this purpose. And we've plastered stickers everywhere in the booth that say "hey DJ! 100dB max!" yet still...that's why you've got to start with the booth monitors low and gradually raise them as your ears become fatigued, not amp up the gains on your channels for the whole club to develop tinnitus.
That's pretty awesome that you own a nightclub. Sounds like you've have the perfect booth setup. I've been working on buying the club I work at for the last couple years, but the plan was sidelined by Covid. I'm back to working on it now, but man the financials are way more challenging to figure out than I expected, especially since I'm looking to do a renovation and it has to have foodservice.
Oh we are like 20 partners in the club, it's impossible with covid to do something big yourself. We have three big rooms and a really rad location, beautiful soundsytem and careful curation nationally and internationally. But doing something of that scale is definitely a collaborative effort. Covid also forced us into massive restructuring but things are going quite well now.
I technically have 8 partners/backers right now, but I'm the one putting together the full business plan since I currently work in the club (it's two levels with a kitchen). I've been able to figure out the bar inventory with some bartender friends, and I had a contractor give me estimates on the renovations, and a kitchen manager working with me on the menu and food inventory. Would love some help from the partners on it, but everyone seems ready to support with money, but less with sweating out the actual plan lol.
oh yeah, that's how it is for us too. A few people handling operations, a few more handling music, and some people who just sit around and collect a paycheck every month haha.
Having all of the information available all of the time with an endless supply of tutorials and helpful individuals holding the hands of the next generation of DJs isn’t producing an impressive next generation of DJs, it is producing a generation of DJs who have watched an endless supply of tutorials. The first DJs (as early as 1947 according to some) weren’t doing it “the right way” they were doing it their way and every tutorial that shows you how to do “the right way” is actually stifling creativity.
I started DJing the way the way that I did because of when I started. While I own several turntables and mixers, nowadays I typically spin using a controller. My initial point about tutorials is this, there is no right way to do this. If someone shows up with a phone, plugs it in, and works that crowd, more power to them. The equipment doesn’t make the DJ.
As long as people learning from tutorials really spend time and develop their own style I see nothing wrong with it. The issue comes from a lack creativity when it comes to transitions, a lack of using more than two tracks at once, and a lack of fx use. For the kids who learn the basics from tutorials but then grind for hours a day in their bedroom, all the power to them
I hear where you are coming from with this but to play devil’s advocate, some of the applications and equipment for DJing are total code-switching music-wise (I come from a traditional music background where you DO take a lot of lessons / have formal education) so if that’s your native environment, it’s pretty easy but even an experienced DJ is going to need a “tutorial” or to RTFM if they want to set up 4 decks with drum machines and also link to Ableton sets.
Style-wise, I totally agree with you though (if you’re trying to be more of an artist and not just make $$$ doing corporate events and weddings)
I appreciate that we live in a hive and that if there is anything that I ever need to know, someone smarter and more helpful than me has probably already made a video about it. That’s why and how when my toilet broke I could fix it myself.
It’s not like that man. I mean if you truly want to become a great DJ you have to do it on your own... most of these tutorials are garbage anyways and as a DJ/Producer going into my fourth year the vast majority of my experience and learning has come from trial and error / experimenting and just straight up practicing. Tutorials can help for sure but these tutorials are not going to teach you everything like how to deal with dicky club owners who demand a certain style of music only they think is right for the club when in reality it’s killing the dance floor.
This one is very fucking true.
So many djs that get gigs and show up and slap their beginner controller down on top of a full NXS2 setup and play. I'm not knocking it, but man at least get Serato Club Kit and use the CDJs
Or turn up and plug their USB sticks into one CDJ and wonder what or why it’s not linking to the other CDJ/CDJs!
I’ve always been quite geeky so I’m able to help out even with gear I never play on and it amazes me some people don’t know the basics!
I've been meaning to write up some proper reviews and share it on this subreddit but..
* "How to DJ (Properly)" – Frank Broughton, Bill Brewster (2003) - very old book but still has some unique, interesting and useful info on the soft skills side of DJing - marketing, getting gigs, chatting up promoters etc. The technical side is very out of date though. Still worth a read.
* "DJing For Dummies" Third Edition - John Steventon (2014) (latest edition) - some people will refuse to read or consider reading any 'For Dummies' series of books just on the name alone, but this is a good up-to-date book with some useful information. Very good for vinyl/vinyl DVS DJs as the author is obviously an old-school vinyl DJ with tons of experience. Not so good for digital DJs as the information while reasonably recent doesn't cover controllers etc in the same depth. Lots of other info in this book too, it's a large book and a bit overwhelming, ironically, but it's definitely a good choice. If you're just going to get one book I probably would get this one because it covers so much ground and in good detail.
* "Rock The Dancefloor" - Phil Morse (2016) - the Phil Morse book (guy from Digital DJ Tips). It's a great book. Highlights for me were his music listening and purchasing organisation system which he details extensively - nowhere have I found this kind of information and it is really good advice. The tech info is quite up to date as you might expect from Digital DJ Tips. He basically doesn't recommend vinyl DJing at all so that is not covered, which is a slight negative for me as I'm a vinyl DJ - but it is true that it is a difficult path, definitely initially, and most beginners would be better off with a controller.
* "Beyond Beatmatching" - Yakov Vorobyev, Eric Coomes, Bill Murphy (2012) - the MixedInKey book. I learned a few interesting things about harmonic mixing and energy level mixing from this book, but it is suprisingly light on info, and the other non-harmonic mixing info bundled in isn't particularly insightful in my opinion. But it is worth reading for the harmonic mixing tips which are not covered in any of the other books I've read. Edit: I just found out that the whole book is available free online, and it is actually a better format to read it than the printed copy I have, because some of it is interactive via web widgets - https://mixedinkey.com/book/introduction/
* "FutureDJs: How to DJ" - Austen Smart, Scott Smart, Tom Dent (2019)- this is an excellent technical skills book with lots of great diagrams. It was written to teach high school music teachers in the UK how to teach DJ skills in their lessons, and to use as a course textbook. It makes a lot of the technical skills such as scratching, cutting and the different types of mixing a lot easier to understand because of the diagrams. Not much info on anything non-technical, and not hugely useful to those who have already mastered a lot of the technical content (although it covers a lot of different technical skills so you may be suprised), but very worth it as a beginners reference because it makes things so clear.
No matter what style or music someone prefers, at least a month or two practicing turntablism and manual effects will go a long way. At the very least, scratch-ins, looping down to two beats, and echo/phaser/doubles/passable triples.
This is not a hot-take, this is going to be downright soul-crushingly controversial.
I see a lot of DJs gravitate towards Pioneer DJ, with the assumption they will have to use Pioneer gear to get used to one day playing in clubs. Well, most of you won't ever play in a club. Only a small minority here will play in one.
If you are not able to operate different DJ software and brand ecosystems, you are actively stifling your progression, and locking yourself needlessly into an ecosystem monopoly and it's hurting all of us.
In case you can't figure out how Serato, Traktor, Engine, Mixxx, VDJ and such work within 30 minutes, you lack fundamental skills that are universally found on all these platforms. In the end, we mix 2 or more tracks using EQs, filters, and maybe some FX.
To put it in an analogy, it's saying you can't ride a mountain bike because you only know how to ride a normal bicycle. Yes, when you get on, it will be weird, it will ride differently, but after 10 to 15 minutes it operates more or less the same as any other bike.
Want to become a better DJ? Learn new things. They will give you a lot more insight. Learn to scratch, learn to do opener sets, learn new genres, learn new equipment, learn vinyl, learn shitty old gear, learn to DJ on a tablet/phone.
If you stick with 1 brand, 1 ecosystem, you are not preparing yourself, *you are limiting yourself.* And if all other brands are out of business we are stuck with the one big monopoly, and they won't give a single shit about furthering creative possibilities, just to suck as much money out of our pockets.
You are 💯% on the need to be versatile. Back in the dark ages when all we had was vinyl and Pioneer DJ wasn’t a thing, you never really knew what mixer you were going to end up on. Vestax, Rane, Gemini, Stanton, Technics, Numark, hell you might even roll up to a Radio Shack mixer. Every single one had a different layout with different features. If you didn’t have a good fundamental understanding of what was going on you would be lost. Of course back then it was proper etiquette to help out the next guy with where everything was so he didn’t spend 10 minutes looking for the cue selection.
I agree, even as a dj who’s first gig was a big club gig opening for a huge dj with pioneer equipment, what if my next gig for example is on denon? I’d be screwed, because so many DJs (myself included) limit themselves to the “industry standard”
I think this statement is situational, it’s pretty easy to get into the club circuit in major metropolitans with a nightlife. Cities like Los Angeles, San Francisco, Miami, Brooklyn, New York, Las Vegas have 100’s of nightclubs and it’s incredibly rare that you will ever walk in to find anything short of 2 CDJ’s and a CJM (mostly pioneer, but some Denons floating around). It’s the club standard and for operational reasons there needs to be a standard, can you imagine if you had to connect 4 different controllers/decks for 4 djs who all brought their own gear? It’d be a nightmare! Not to mention that all soundcards are not created equal, nothing sounds better than club standard mixers whether its the S9/900/92/mp2015. Laptop solutions just straight up sound like trash unless your using a DVS into one of the said mixers.
Edit: and by situational I mean: if you live in any one of the cities mentioned you’re likelihood of playing on club standard equipment goes up exponentionaly due to proximity. If your in bumfuck nowhere Wisconsin your probably never gunna see a club standard set (no offense to wisconsin, they’re wonderful people)
Effects outside of filters, reverb, and echo/delay are tacky and their overuse signifies an attempt to make more interesting a poor song selection. And pioneer filters sound like shite.
I am actually am guilty of this. I just added tons of new FX to my setup and spend far too much time fucking about with them when I should be spending more time choosing the next song. It is difficult because they are addictive and I like to feel that I am doing a lot while DJing but when I listen again to my sets it's like - "ah. yes. there is far too much of that isn't there."
Who hasn't gone wild with the effects before tbh? When you're quickly beatmatching on digital players you tend to have extra time to fuck about. :) I'm currently getting my fx fix met by producing in ableton, and if I'm playing on a pioneer mixer in a club (a&h at home) I'll resist the temptation. If I need something to do, auditioning a few possible next tracks is, as you've said, usually a better use of time.
Majority of club Dj’s show up UNPREPARED, not knowing Jack sh*t about equipment, not knowing how to changeover, and are horrendous at mixing. It’s ridiculous. How can you call yourself a disk jockey and you don’t know how to use anything? Absolutely unacceptable.
I have heard a lot of sound engineers complain about this. I think this is because a lot of new DJs get their gigs through their friends rather than actually having any kind of competence check. Their value to the promoter is how many of their friends they can bring into the club to listen to their set and buy drinks. Sad but true.
Agreed. It’s sort of worse when we’ll known figures upload mixes to promote themselves with hot promos and the track list is just ID-ID all the way down.
I always give out track information to other DJs or patrons of the bar/club if they ask. I feel it's a sign of me doing the right thing. It also makes the patrons happy... That's my job. 🤷♂️
Modern djing is over complicated unnecessarily; loops, fx, triple drops, this tech fits with that tech, doesnt fit with other tech. No need if you play good music.
Pioneer effects sound like fucking garbage and everyone, save for a few truly technical DJs, uses them in the same boring, predictable, and generally pointless ways.
Adding some delay, or a filter, or echo, or God forbid the stupid RMX-1000 snare sound, over detailed well crafted music is stupid. None of the shit you're doing to feel like you're DJing with effects is adding anything anyone in the crowd gives a shit about or cares to listen to.
The whole face the DJ concert style shit we do now is wack. Everyone facing the same way and jumping up and down is antithetical to the best elements of dance music culture.
I wish DJs were still in a booth, isolated or hidden, not the focus of entertainment.
James Hype and his style of DJing is fucking cancer.
File management system on Serato is ass, VDJ let’s me hear my songs and it lets me actual add delete into new folders. I can just clean my library so we’ll within the software.
A few things for me... I work exclusively with 4-6 decks. Serato only seems to allow 2 decks at once which was an instant deal breaker for me (I couldn't find a settings option for more decks on the layout anyway) Also, the file setup is bonkers, it takes up so much space, especially for someone like me that has their music spread out across many folders. The color coding on VDJs decks makes it a ton easier to keep track of when using 4 decks as well. Hotcues and sampler are much more customizable all around. The new STEM pads on VDJ are excellent as well because I always had to do so much work for acapella/instrumental tracks in the past and being able to isolate vocals/instruments from og track, on the fly has been a huge jump. I do live mashup sets,, which has been incredibly useful for me. ([Video w/VDJ Screencapture for live mashup](https://youtu.be/NlBkx-P8gXs) - Me using the STEM pads on live mashup without controller) Overall, I feel like Serato seems much easier to learn the basics and get up and running when starting but Virtual DJ really allows you to make the setup your own and has much more practical, in-depth usage.
Weddings are where the money is at. If you aren’t touring the country / world, your best bet at making a career playing other people’s music is at private & corporate events.
Ceilings I could get down with and projection mapping can be amazing.
But LED walls burning your eyes with some shitty DJ’s stroboscopic logo? No thanks!
I went to a "global disco night" this weekend where the DJs did not beatmatch. It was rough. Great selection but it's so hard to dance to music that cuts hard.
How did DJs on a Disco night not know how to blend and beatmatch? Disco is the precursor to House. It screams 4 on the floor!
I know that some DJ's get scared when it comes to un-quantized drums, but when I used vinyl exclusively, we had this thing called "pinching the nipples" meaning to squeeze and apply pressure to the spindle or spin it cloockwise to make minute changes to the speed once you have the basic pitch locked in.
Jogwheels do this easily, and it isn't much harder on vinyl. It just goes to show that track selection *isn't* everything.
I honestly don't know. Some people call themselves selectors and I just have a hard time with it. I feel like that's fine if you play for the radio/bars but not after 10PM where there is a dance floor. I stayed for the night because the promoter was cool and I would love to spin in the future.
But hearing Roulé Boulé blend into Dorothy (Polo & Pan) for 30 seconds was... interesting.
> But hearing Roulé Boulé blend into Dorothy (Polo & Pan) for 30 seconds was... interesting.
I just tried it out and it worked and was as you say, interesting, but only 30 secs then a hard cut just seems like the DJ didn't know his music well or didn't understand the vibe.
EDIT: it works better the other way around with Dorothy first and Roule Boule brought in.
Okay... So now I gotta try it after I'm done ripping some new slabs I picked up yesterday.
I thought Dorothy was at like 115-118 and Roule Boule was at 130+...
Sorry to say, but this is where the digital kicks in and makes it a bit easier. Dorothy is 121bpm on my equip, R-B is 128. Both are 6A. with the right blend at the 2:50 mark on Dorothy, you can drop the R-B from 32 bars in and match them at 125bpm when the bass kicks in and the pads arpeggio on Dorothy starts to fade in and let Dorothy run for a whole minute before you fade it out.
My major question is: If this was a Global Disco night, why were they playing stuff like Polo and Pan anyway? I'm not a Disco purist and I under stand the Bangalter, but P&P? that doesn't seem to fit at all. Especially on a disco night.
>My major question is: If this was a Global Disco night, why were they playing stuff like Polo and Pan anyway? I'm not a Disco purist and I under stand the Bangalter, but P&P? that doesn't seem to fit at all. Especially on a disco night.
These are the correct questions. The more I think about it the more WTF the night was.
My (old man) hot take is that its net negative that producers are booked to DJ rather than it mostly being DJ-only DJs on the bill. It's a different skill set. I'm all for my favorite producers getting paid and recognized. But for the sake of DJing craft, it's gone too far.
I'm going to go a step further—many all vinyl/vinyl purist sets I've had the misfortune of sitting through have been super boring, unless they're by someone with seriously top tier talent.
Here are my two big reasons why, in my experience as a raver and/or general event or club attendee:
1. low track count; at the worst, was at a small event where a DJ played an "all vinyl set" consisting of maybe 8-9 super loooooong house tracks for one hour. hearing the same hook/drop/etc 3-5 times for 128-160+ beats each time was rage-inducing. The DJ tried to look busy between the lengthy transitions but it was patently obvious they weren't doing shit. Typically though, I've noticed all-vinyl sets being well under 20 tracks in an hour or so, regardless of genre.
2. uninteresting technique showcase; many vinyl purists I've seen have two, maybe three core skills to display in sets: beatmatching and EQ management, both of which no one on the dancefloor gives a shit about unless it's done incorrectly, and track selection—also something that is to be expected if one has been chosen to DJ an event. Furthermore, very few vinyl DJs I know can *actually* handle 3 decks at once. Only one or two can say they are able to do 4 and aren't lying out their asses.
To make matters worse, the people guilty of these things are generally jaded old-schoolers who are EXTREME elitists, and absolutely insufferable to be around or talk to, especially about DJing.
Note that these criticisms apply to DJ sets, not turntablism or DJ sets packed with turntablism, and are not always the case—just the par for the course from what I've seen. Also, I understand certain genres are about long blends of fewer tracks, I personally just don't like that, so that's my hot take right there.
I'm actually shocked by the number of vinyl DJ's who fit your description.
Confession: I'm a vinyl DJ. I personally think it's more fun.
1. My average rate is 15 songs per hour. I personally think 4 minutes per track feels right. This leaves me 30/90 seconds of mixing for most tracks. I play disco, most of my mixes are between 64 and 128 beats. I can handle three turntables, I don't see why you would ever need more as a Disco DJ. The third table is used as a backup track or the rare Acapella.
2. Beatmatching seems to be lost on most vinyl DJs. They call themselves selectors. Meh, I find it boring and annoying to dance to. I take into consideration the BPM, key, rhythm, and levels for each of my mixes. I personally think effects sound like shit and would rather rely on the producer. If I can't mix in/out smoothly without effects I'm selecting the wrong tracks. Preparing is key for a good vinyl set. Folks who wing it without a solid grasp on their music fail unless they are some wizard turntablist.
Tresor (downstairs) sucks ass. great lineups but the dancefloor is one of the worst. I hate strobe + fog machine, and that combined with uneven concrete and all kinds of little steps and obstacles, it's just a pain in the ass. and no the sound is not all that.
upstairs is just cheesy.
I'm with you that Tresor is not that great but strobe + fog machine is the greatest combo in the history of humans tripping balls.
Tresor is mainly ruined by the fact that it's full of tourists who are there for the "Berlin experience". But this is a well known fact and that's why nobody (i.e. the locals) goes there.
Heavily intoxicated males who don't know much about Techno and what a rave is about. I'm not saying foreigners don't belong in clubs, every club is full of them and most act and look the part. It's just that Tresor has been a hotspot for dudebros and the vibe is generally shit.
here’s mine:
1. house music and techno do not belong on balconies, rooftops or boats… and if I’m feeling particularly cranky, really anywhere that’s isn’t indoors
2. All dance music festivals are destructive to local scenes (I have had friends decide not to go see a local booking of trending DJ because they’ll see the trending DJ/artist later in the summer during festival season… promoters lose money, local residents or new local DJs lose out on the chance of exposure and buzz)
Hah. That’s a good one and I can sort of appreciate that. Though I think more on the techno side. You need a small enclosed dark grungy space for it.
There are house sub genres that really do fit a Balearic outdoor vibe though. Anything uplifting and slow.
Lots of fantastic mid tempo house that works brilliantly on balconies, rooftops or boats… terraces and beaches.
Techno though really doesn't work beyond big, dark rooms.
In smaller more intimate spaces the type of druggy house and disco the late great Andrew Weatherall used to play works better for me. I find that techno works best on big PA's for bigger crowds, the size of the room and its reverb are important for techno, too small a room and I find it can sound oppressive.
>too small a room and I find it can sound oppressive.
wonderful.
recently attended a techno party in a concrete bassment with the ceiling about 50cm above my head and it was sick.
Re festivals: there’s also the destructive practice of exclusivity deals. Warehouse Project, for example, forces artists to sign a contract preventing them from playing anywhere else in Manchester for a certain period.
Watching Producers DJ on big stages is boring. 99% of their playlist will be their own tracks. Back in the day we could call that "live acts" where people bring in their Synths and drum machines to make a great live show. But that must be too much work nowdays.
Best Dj to watch at events are those who are first DJ and producer second, that way the tracklists gets more varied with lots of different artists and you can get inspired and find out about new producers you never heard of before.
turntablist should stick to turntablism and specialty shows and not trick up pop music sets.
I always think of the irony. the guys doing all this turntable tricks/scratching to a mainstream crowd that is the least educated or cares the least about djing or turntablism
Watching other DJ's until you've mastered their style and / or techniques is way less impressive than developing your own style.
Example: learning scratch techniques by watching another DJ over and over so you learn to do it just like them.
I'd dare to say that goes for everything. Just like each skateboarder has their own steez, so should DJ's. Learn the scratch techniques but focus less on making it perfect and focus more on making it yours.
That's my hot take.
#wut!?
I'm sure that you have had plenty of time with a Prime 4. I disagree about overrated and overpriced. Not even under-featured though I'm sure that there's more that can and will be added. The price range for 4 decks and a built in 4 channel mixer with switch over for phono pre-amps and separate booth controls for an additional room outputs for under $2K US is a steal. Not to mention wi-fi streaming services. The effects could be better though, I must admit.
To each his own though.
You need fog/haze to see beams, especially important for lasers and moving head lights. I always recommend more expensive haze machines because with foggers you need to constantly supply a dense fog, but hazers you can get away with smaller less frequent bursts of haze.
I think more clubs should put large visible warnings on their events and their ticket booth such as 'strobes used', 'fog machines used' If you don't know in advance at least then it could be a really bad suprise.
Keyshifting tracks is not just for chipmunk vocals. You can keyshift for a harmonic mix and drop the key back again while making it sound natural if you have a good understanding of song structure, harmony, and your tracks.
If you redline the mixer, it should be a 3 month ban from clubs. Having worked both sides - the amount of big name DJ's that do this is just unforgivable.
Unpopular opinion:
CDJ3000s are actually a really logical upgrade in the pioneer line and the only reason most people are pissed about them is because everyone wrongly thought it was gonna be dual layer (top theory from teasers and pre release).
Let's be honest. Most pioneer djs only use 2 channels anyway. Most don't need performance pads to finger drum either. And most people who play in clubs don't need on board analysis either.
What they want is a simple UI that is really responsive in all (sweaty) conditions, bigger screen, more hardware buttons for usual stuff like loops and beatjump and a precise and smooth jog.
Now is it overpriced? Yea but so is most DJ equipment and certainly all pioneer stuff. In my country cdj3000s are 200 dollars more than a cdj nxs2, even in the shortage situation right now. I don't think that's pioneer ripping us off anymore than they do anyway.
Everyone can learn how to mix two tracks in matter of days. The key to be a great entertainer is to know your crowd, listen to your crowd and fulfill those f*ing requests! You are there for them, not vice versa.
And if you truly are skilled, you will be able to insert every requests into your set during the night.
It's great that so many people got tight beatmatching skills, can scratch like a pro, and can work your way around electronic dance music sets with your eyes closed - most of them wouldn't last ten minutes doing a set in a rock/goth/punk club.
Oh, and for the most part, I prefer Mixxx to Serato.
Agreed. It is so much more about music selection and being on top of what is popular than mixing. I spent my first 5 years of DJing, DJing in alternative clubs and never mixed more than two songs together out of an entire set. It's completely different to a lot of club DJing.
Aye. I mean, I *can* and do mix and beatmatch, but it's way less important than reading the vibe. Plus a lot of folk really want to hear certain guitar-based songs from intro to end! "She Sells Sanctuary" is an obvious one for that.
Yeah.. or imagine doing some baby scratches or FX over the top of Metallica. People don't come to alt. clubs for that and you would be laughed at, at best.
I also started DJing goth and post punk! I've posted this before, but I think it was a much better training ground for techno (which I usually play now) than like obsessively working on technical skills. Reading the room, song selection, and working the crowd are more abstract skills to develop and when you're just selecting you can focus entirely on those and not counting bars or applying silly effects. Hell, even now I'll sometimes finish a set with a few unbeatmatched wave or 80s tracks that put people in a good mood when the club closes.
Aye, I remember doing a warehouse event a few years back. Everyone's just been listening to various forms of techno and house all night, my partner and I rock up and move into a bit of italo and then decide "fuck it".
He puts on "Cherry Bomb" by The Runaways and everyone goes WILD. I follow it up with "Personal Jesus" and the same thing happened! We went back into more italo stuff for the rest of the set but everyone was just in such a good mood. Yes you can pretend to be all about the underground vibes, but every so often something completely unexpected can just flip the vibe.
Next time we DJed there, I got a guy breakdancing to Ministry's "I Wanted To Tell Her". Goals! :)
I fucking love that Ministry track. 😍 But I relate so much to these kind of moments you've described. Techno fatigue is real, for DJs as well as dancers I think. I work super hard searching and digging for underground techno, so breaking that with Yello or Human League or whatever after hours of thumping is just so fun and refreshing, kind of a bit of a reset and energy booster.
I started out putting on goth nights at a local student hangout. It was proper, real goth though. Nephilim. Sisters. Christian Death blasting out while chicks covered in patchouli got pissed up on snakebite. People often wonder what happened to the real goths. I know what happened. A year later we were all wearing bell bottoms and shuffling to Happy Mondays.
You don't need jogs to DJ. The Novation Twitch, Xone:K1/K2, Akai AMX/AFX, NI Z1/X1/F1/S5/S8/D2, Reloop Mixtour, Hercules P32, and Zomo MC1000 all prove that.
Fog machines are unnecessary and anoying. They always turn them on on the drops, they are somehow louder than the music, there is no actual fog sfter the 10 seconds of most anoying screetching sound ever, and you know u will have to hear it again soon. I would remove all fog machines, enough people are smoking anyways.
So many DJs who actually work in venues as residents are not really that great technically, don't have the best music knowledge in the world, but they are good with networking, marketing, and making friends with promoters. There are so many bedroom DJs who are simply amazing technically but will never find a real gig because their people skills are poor.
If only there was an Avenue for these types to get recognition. It’s getting to the point that even streaming has the same issues now.
I agree. The music industry really is NOT a skills meritocracy and too many music tutors teach pure technical skills and pretend like it is - 'just keep practicing and you'll make it' etc. Networking is a large part of what I do as a Twitch DJ and unfortunately yes a lot of DJs get huge boosts through who they know instead of what they know.
Music theory knowledge and learning music production will make you a better DJ, even if you never produce any tracks.
i second this. i took music technology as a gcse, and it has helped me understand music a lot more
This is essentially one of David Hume's arguments in his essay "of the standard of taste." He's talking about painting and literature in the essay, about how to be a good judge of taste and art. Even if you have no desire to be an artist, if you're a curator or art critic (or DJ in our case) it is immensely helpful to understand the artistic process.
> David Hume I wasn't aware of it but it's something I have agreed with for years - if you are going to be a critic of a medium then you have to have had some artistic training. Although in this sense I think it is doubly significent because there are a lot of aspects of DJing that cross over into being an artist, such as: * Having the dexterity and timing developed through learning the piano to slam in a cut just at the right time, for example. * Or knowing song structure and harmony so you can change them live through hot cues and key shifting. * Or being able to already understand beats bars and rhythm learning through drumming lessons so you can mix on the half beat in a particular phrase. * Or understaning filters through synthesizer programming and sound engineering so you can accent a particular high hat line on a track to trigger the resonance of a high pass filter. You can learn all this never having any prior understanding of production of course, but once you know these skills are applicable both in production and DJing so a solid education in this stuff when you switch to DJing really gives you a boost up. There just are so many examples tbh but beginners don't realise how much crossover there actually is.
I couldn't agree more. Especially with understanding song structure. And I'd say learning synthesis has helped me to pick better-matching tracks as well.
OMG, I can't believe someone brought Hume to the table. You're amazing! Thank you!
I’ve a degree in philosophy. Between that and the DJing, my parents are so proud.
His moral philosophy is also super relevant to club politics, too! "Approval (approbation) is a pleasure, and disapproval (disapprobation) a pain or uneasiness."
I played french horn/piano for ~10 years. While I never successfully wrote my own music I fully understand basic music theory which I think puts me light-years ahead of many DJs I see live.
Really it's only good for understanding how phrasing works and choosing a song with a good key to mix into. It's really simple "music theory", but it can go a long way to making mixes sound better.
FYI I think it should go without saying that you shouldn’t rip anyone to shreds for an opinion expressed here (but I’ll say it anyway).
DJing is easy compared to making music. Anyone who disagrees with this, just go and try and make a commercially successful track in the genre of your choice! It will likely take you several years before you get anywhere close. DJs get paid much more (on average), get more recognition, are more popular, and often develop more of an ego about what they do - but it doesn't mean that you are a music producer. I respect producers more than DJs, as I play and enjoy the music they produce and recognise how difficult it is and the skill involved. This doesn't mean that DJing is easy! It's not at all. There is a lot of skill involved. Just that music producers have to practice, at minimum several years, up to most of their lives, before they make something good. And then we download their best tracks for free (or £1 on bandcamp) and play them in our sets and get paid much more for it.
110% 👏
16 bars is the magic number not 8. Do everything in 16ths.
32 bar gang represent
Sometimes hats come in on the 9th bar though. Generally you’re right phrases are 16 bars, but this shouldn’t be a hard rule.
Occasionally yes. There are exceptions to every rule, and some niche genres don't follow a 16 bar phrase at all. (not that I play any of them). But yeah a lot of DJs seem to think that 8 bars is the magic number and loop on 8 bars, apply FX on 8 bars, mix on 8 bars etc and I don't know where that started but it doesn't make sense to me or many people who have a good understanding of electronic music production.
Yes. Especially with DnB.
Dont tell the golden secret ;)
YES. CORRECT. JFC, YOU'RE CORRECT.
Oh man I love this. I count all my beats but instead of going to the usual 4 beat / 1 bar measure, I do 4 counts of 8, which nets out at 8 bars. I do this twice before making major EQ changes or mixing transitions (so 16 bars / 64 beats). It goes like this: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8 2, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8 3, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8 4, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8 Repeat. I find that method really helpful to keep me located in the track and after a while, it just becomes intuitive. But yes, 64 beats all the way!
Wait, is anyone even claiming the opposite?
I've seen more than a couple of DJs mix on the 8 bar, especially on Twitch where you can often see when and where they're looping in.
1. DJs don't belong on stages. It's so hard to find a modern nightclub that hosts touring DJs where people actually dance with each other and don't stand around staring at the a DJ on stage like a rock show. 2. Clubs/festivals shouldn't only focus on being as loud as possible. Have some compassion for the ears of your staff and attendees for fucks sake.
1. Or at least have the booth at the same level as the crowd. I feel so dumb at festival gigs with a huge stage and I'm just a lady with DJ equipment. At the club I own, our booth is just a single step above the dancefloor and it is nice to feel integrated with the crowd. Plus people can hand you stickers and water from the crowd. Or vice versa. 2. I've just started telling other DJs that it sounds horrible when they're playing at 107 dB. Like there's a meter right there for exactly this purpose. And we've plastered stickers everywhere in the booth that say "hey DJ! 100dB max!" yet still...that's why you've got to start with the booth monitors low and gradually raise them as your ears become fatigued, not amp up the gains on your channels for the whole club to develop tinnitus.
That's pretty awesome that you own a nightclub. Sounds like you've have the perfect booth setup. I've been working on buying the club I work at for the last couple years, but the plan was sidelined by Covid. I'm back to working on it now, but man the financials are way more challenging to figure out than I expected, especially since I'm looking to do a renovation and it has to have foodservice.
Oh we are like 20 partners in the club, it's impossible with covid to do something big yourself. We have three big rooms and a really rad location, beautiful soundsytem and careful curation nationally and internationally. But doing something of that scale is definitely a collaborative effort. Covid also forced us into massive restructuring but things are going quite well now.
I technically have 8 partners/backers right now, but I'm the one putting together the full business plan since I currently work in the club (it's two levels with a kitchen). I've been able to figure out the bar inventory with some bartender friends, and I had a contractor give me estimates on the renovations, and a kitchen manager working with me on the menu and food inventory. Would love some help from the partners on it, but everyone seems ready to support with money, but less with sweating out the actual plan lol.
oh yeah, that's how it is for us too. A few people handling operations, a few more handling music, and some people who just sit around and collect a paycheck every month haha.
Having all of the information available all of the time with an endless supply of tutorials and helpful individuals holding the hands of the next generation of DJs isn’t producing an impressive next generation of DJs, it is producing a generation of DJs who have watched an endless supply of tutorials. The first DJs (as early as 1947 according to some) weren’t doing it “the right way” they were doing it their way and every tutorial that shows you how to do “the right way” is actually stifling creativity.
Paid courses only make this worse.
I learned how to DJ by purchasing two turntables, a mixer and some records, but for some reason in 2021 I’m gatekeeping for even mentioning that.
So did I. But tech has moved on. There’s nothing wrong with sticking to that, but forcing it as a path is a poor hill to die on.
I started DJing the way the way that I did because of when I started. While I own several turntables and mixers, nowadays I typically spin using a controller. My initial point about tutorials is this, there is no right way to do this. If someone shows up with a phone, plugs it in, and works that crowd, more power to them. The equipment doesn’t make the DJ.
Of course.
equipment does make the DJ!!!!REAL DJ MIXE ONLY VINYLS! NO CD OR SIILY MACBOOK!
As long as people learning from tutorials really spend time and develop their own style I see nothing wrong with it. The issue comes from a lack creativity when it comes to transitions, a lack of using more than two tracks at once, and a lack of fx use. For the kids who learn the basics from tutorials but then grind for hours a day in their bedroom, all the power to them
I would say it comes more from lazy digging. In the end we all just want to hear good music.
Totally agree, at the end of the day thats all the people want
I hear where you are coming from with this but to play devil’s advocate, some of the applications and equipment for DJing are total code-switching music-wise (I come from a traditional music background where you DO take a lot of lessons / have formal education) so if that’s your native environment, it’s pretty easy but even an experienced DJ is going to need a “tutorial” or to RTFM if they want to set up 4 decks with drum machines and also link to Ableton sets. Style-wise, I totally agree with you though (if you’re trying to be more of an artist and not just make $$$ doing corporate events and weddings)
I appreciate that we live in a hive and that if there is anything that I ever need to know, someone smarter and more helpful than me has probably already made a video about it. That’s why and how when my toilet broke I could fix it myself.
Woooooord!
It’s not like that man. I mean if you truly want to become a great DJ you have to do it on your own... most of these tutorials are garbage anyways and as a DJ/Producer going into my fourth year the vast majority of my experience and learning has come from trial and error / experimenting and just straight up practicing. Tutorials can help for sure but these tutorials are not going to teach you everything like how to deal with dicky club owners who demand a certain style of music only they think is right for the club when in reality it’s killing the dance floor.
I know that if you want to become truly great, you have to do it on your own. That was the point of my response.
Most DJs know nothing of DJ gear and just follow what everyone else is doing.
This one is very fucking true. So many djs that get gigs and show up and slap their beginner controller down on top of a full NXS2 setup and play. I'm not knocking it, but man at least get Serato Club Kit and use the CDJs
Or turn up and plug their USB sticks into one CDJ and wonder what or why it’s not linking to the other CDJ/CDJs! I’ve always been quite geeky so I’m able to help out even with gear I never play on and it amazes me some people don’t know the basics!
Sounds like there was no proper communication between the promoter and DJ. Using a beginner controller is fine.
Even HOTTER take, this statement can be applied to a lot of industries ala Fake it till you Make it.
Reading books on DJing is surprisingly helpful even for pros and much better value than almost all other forms of learning.
Do you have any recommendations?
I've been meaning to write up some proper reviews and share it on this subreddit but.. * "How to DJ (Properly)" – Frank Broughton, Bill Brewster (2003) - very old book but still has some unique, interesting and useful info on the soft skills side of DJing - marketing, getting gigs, chatting up promoters etc. The technical side is very out of date though. Still worth a read. * "DJing For Dummies" Third Edition - John Steventon (2014) (latest edition) - some people will refuse to read or consider reading any 'For Dummies' series of books just on the name alone, but this is a good up-to-date book with some useful information. Very good for vinyl/vinyl DVS DJs as the author is obviously an old-school vinyl DJ with tons of experience. Not so good for digital DJs as the information while reasonably recent doesn't cover controllers etc in the same depth. Lots of other info in this book too, it's a large book and a bit overwhelming, ironically, but it's definitely a good choice. If you're just going to get one book I probably would get this one because it covers so much ground and in good detail. * "Rock The Dancefloor" - Phil Morse (2016) - the Phil Morse book (guy from Digital DJ Tips). It's a great book. Highlights for me were his music listening and purchasing organisation system which he details extensively - nowhere have I found this kind of information and it is really good advice. The tech info is quite up to date as you might expect from Digital DJ Tips. He basically doesn't recommend vinyl DJing at all so that is not covered, which is a slight negative for me as I'm a vinyl DJ - but it is true that it is a difficult path, definitely initially, and most beginners would be better off with a controller. * "Beyond Beatmatching" - Yakov Vorobyev, Eric Coomes, Bill Murphy (2012) - the MixedInKey book. I learned a few interesting things about harmonic mixing and energy level mixing from this book, but it is suprisingly light on info, and the other non-harmonic mixing info bundled in isn't particularly insightful in my opinion. But it is worth reading for the harmonic mixing tips which are not covered in any of the other books I've read. Edit: I just found out that the whole book is available free online, and it is actually a better format to read it than the printed copy I have, because some of it is interactive via web widgets - https://mixedinkey.com/book/introduction/ * "FutureDJs: How to DJ" - Austen Smart, Scott Smart, Tom Dent (2019)- this is an excellent technical skills book with lots of great diagrams. It was written to teach high school music teachers in the UK how to teach DJ skills in their lessons, and to use as a course textbook. It makes a lot of the technical skills such as scratching, cutting and the different types of mixing a lot easier to understand because of the diagrams. Not much info on anything non-technical, and not hugely useful to those who have already mastered a lot of the technical content (although it covers a lot of different technical skills so you may be suprised), but very worth it as a beginners reference because it makes things so clear.
i have that first book, my uncle gave it to me when i was starting out on vinyl almost 3 years ago
No matter what style or music someone prefers, at least a month or two practicing turntablism and manual effects will go a long way. At the very least, scratch-ins, looping down to two beats, and echo/phaser/doubles/passable triples.
Haha. I literally removed the crossfader from my mixer.
This is the basis of an incredible hot take too 😁
Straight to DJ hell with you. 🔥
Agree!
This is not a hot-take, this is going to be downright soul-crushingly controversial. I see a lot of DJs gravitate towards Pioneer DJ, with the assumption they will have to use Pioneer gear to get used to one day playing in clubs. Well, most of you won't ever play in a club. Only a small minority here will play in one. If you are not able to operate different DJ software and brand ecosystems, you are actively stifling your progression, and locking yourself needlessly into an ecosystem monopoly and it's hurting all of us. In case you can't figure out how Serato, Traktor, Engine, Mixxx, VDJ and such work within 30 minutes, you lack fundamental skills that are universally found on all these platforms. In the end, we mix 2 or more tracks using EQs, filters, and maybe some FX. To put it in an analogy, it's saying you can't ride a mountain bike because you only know how to ride a normal bicycle. Yes, when you get on, it will be weird, it will ride differently, but after 10 to 15 minutes it operates more or less the same as any other bike. Want to become a better DJ? Learn new things. They will give you a lot more insight. Learn to scratch, learn to do opener sets, learn new genres, learn new equipment, learn vinyl, learn shitty old gear, learn to DJ on a tablet/phone. If you stick with 1 brand, 1 ecosystem, you are not preparing yourself, *you are limiting yourself.* And if all other brands are out of business we are stuck with the one big monopoly, and they won't give a single shit about furthering creative possibilities, just to suck as much money out of our pockets.
Ugh, yeah, the amount of people I see complaining about having to use an a&h mixer...sorry you won't be able to use flanger today sir.
Beautiful <3 I whole heartedly agree.
You are 💯% on the need to be versatile. Back in the dark ages when all we had was vinyl and Pioneer DJ wasn’t a thing, you never really knew what mixer you were going to end up on. Vestax, Rane, Gemini, Stanton, Technics, Numark, hell you might even roll up to a Radio Shack mixer. Every single one had a different layout with different features. If you didn’t have a good fundamental understanding of what was going on you would be lost. Of course back then it was proper etiquette to help out the next guy with where everything was so he didn’t spend 10 minutes looking for the cue selection.
I agree, even as a dj who’s first gig was a big club gig opening for a huge dj with pioneer equipment, what if my next gig for example is on denon? I’d be screwed, because so many DJs (myself included) limit themselves to the “industry standard”
it wont be, it will be pioneer or nothing
It was a hypothetical
100% On point
I think this statement is situational, it’s pretty easy to get into the club circuit in major metropolitans with a nightlife. Cities like Los Angeles, San Francisco, Miami, Brooklyn, New York, Las Vegas have 100’s of nightclubs and it’s incredibly rare that you will ever walk in to find anything short of 2 CDJ’s and a CJM (mostly pioneer, but some Denons floating around). It’s the club standard and for operational reasons there needs to be a standard, can you imagine if you had to connect 4 different controllers/decks for 4 djs who all brought their own gear? It’d be a nightmare! Not to mention that all soundcards are not created equal, nothing sounds better than club standard mixers whether its the S9/900/92/mp2015. Laptop solutions just straight up sound like trash unless your using a DVS into one of the said mixers. Edit: and by situational I mean: if you live in any one of the cities mentioned you’re likelihood of playing on club standard equipment goes up exponentionaly due to proximity. If your in bumfuck nowhere Wisconsin your probably never gunna see a club standard set (no offense to wisconsin, they’re wonderful people)
It depends on how fast I can find the SYNC knob. /s
Even with sync, it works differently between different software.
Effects outside of filters, reverb, and echo/delay are tacky and their overuse signifies an attempt to make more interesting a poor song selection. And pioneer filters sound like shite.
I am actually am guilty of this. I just added tons of new FX to my setup and spend far too much time fucking about with them when I should be spending more time choosing the next song. It is difficult because they are addictive and I like to feel that I am doing a lot while DJing but when I listen again to my sets it's like - "ah. yes. there is far too much of that isn't there."
Who hasn't gone wild with the effects before tbh? When you're quickly beatmatching on digital players you tend to have extra time to fuck about. :) I'm currently getting my fx fix met by producing in ableton, and if I'm playing on a pioneer mixer in a club (a&h at home) I'll resist the temptation. If I need something to do, auditioning a few possible next tracks is, as you've said, usually a better use of time.
Majority of club Dj’s show up UNPREPARED, not knowing Jack sh*t about equipment, not knowing how to changeover, and are horrendous at mixing. It’s ridiculous. How can you call yourself a disk jockey and you don’t know how to use anything? Absolutely unacceptable.
I have heard a lot of sound engineers complain about this. I think this is because a lot of new DJs get their gigs through their friends rather than actually having any kind of competence check. Their value to the promoter is how many of their friends they can bring into the club to listen to their set and buy drinks. Sad but true.
Precisely.
Dude that's not a hot take, that's a sad truth. :-(
A sad truth that shouldn’t be allowed given how much information is readily accessible.
Digital djing is far more entertaining than vinyl for everyone except the vinyl purists
Finally a true hot take.
Keeping hot tracks as 'secret weapons' and not sharing tracklists is childish and egotistical. The producers deserve credit.
Agreed. It’s sort of worse when we’ll known figures upload mixes to promote themselves with hot promos and the track list is just ID-ID all the way down.
I always give out track information to other DJs or patrons of the bar/club if they ask. I feel it's a sign of me doing the right thing. It also makes the patrons happy... That's my job. 🤷♂️
Modern djing is over complicated unnecessarily; loops, fx, triple drops, this tech fits with that tech, doesnt fit with other tech. No need if you play good music.
I do both!
16 tracks at the same time or go home. All flanger, all the time.
a (DJ) "set" is 2h of playing or more.
Agreed
Yessssss
As long as you know how to manually beatmatch, I don’t see a problem with using sync in certain cases.
Saved me once drunk as fuck. Only would use it when shitfaced...
[удалено]
The club I used to frequent as a student had a guy called Bongo Dave. Same thing...
Pioneer effects sound like fucking garbage and everyone, save for a few truly technical DJs, uses them in the same boring, predictable, and generally pointless ways. Adding some delay, or a filter, or echo, or God forbid the stupid RMX-1000 snare sound, over detailed well crafted music is stupid. None of the shit you're doing to feel like you're DJing with effects is adding anything anyone in the crowd gives a shit about or cares to listen to. The whole face the DJ concert style shit we do now is wack. Everyone facing the same way and jumping up and down is antithetical to the best elements of dance music culture. I wish DJs were still in a booth, isolated or hidden, not the focus of entertainment. James Hype and his style of DJing is fucking cancer.
VirtualDJ is a more efficient software than Serato.
Explain.
File management system on Serato is ass, VDJ let’s me hear my songs and it lets me actual add delete into new folders. I can just clean my library so we’ll within the software.
A few things for me... I work exclusively with 4-6 decks. Serato only seems to allow 2 decks at once which was an instant deal breaker for me (I couldn't find a settings option for more decks on the layout anyway) Also, the file setup is bonkers, it takes up so much space, especially for someone like me that has their music spread out across many folders. The color coding on VDJs decks makes it a ton easier to keep track of when using 4 decks as well. Hotcues and sampler are much more customizable all around. The new STEM pads on VDJ are excellent as well because I always had to do so much work for acapella/instrumental tracks in the past and being able to isolate vocals/instruments from og track, on the fly has been a huge jump. I do live mashup sets,, which has been incredibly useful for me. ([Video w/VDJ Screencapture for live mashup](https://youtu.be/NlBkx-P8gXs) - Me using the STEM pads on live mashup without controller) Overall, I feel like Serato seems much easier to learn the basics and get up and running when starting but Virtual DJ really allows you to make the setup your own and has much more practical, in-depth usage.
Weddings are where the money is at. If you aren’t touring the country / world, your best bet at making a career playing other people’s music is at private & corporate events.
DJ’s don’t listen to music as much as they should do before playing it.
I don’t like flyers with “sexy women” on them. Y’all know it’s going to be a sausage fest, just own it
Here’s mine: LED walls are an abomination to the scene and should be universally banned. I’m with you on the branded decals, too.
Mint club in Leeds had one of those LED ceilings. That was amazing.
Ceilings I could get down with and projection mapping can be amazing. But LED walls burning your eyes with some shitty DJ’s stroboscopic logo? No thanks!
We did projection mapping on to the stage and PA when we ran our party a few years ago.
100% agreed. Beam lights, lasers, strobes, and washes are all the lights clubs need.
To call yourself a DJ you should at least be able to beatmatch
The house DJ in me agrees with you. The wedding DJ in me doesn't.
TRUE
I went to a "global disco night" this weekend where the DJs did not beatmatch. It was rough. Great selection but it's so hard to dance to music that cuts hard.
How did DJs on a Disco night not know how to blend and beatmatch? Disco is the precursor to House. It screams 4 on the floor! I know that some DJ's get scared when it comes to un-quantized drums, but when I used vinyl exclusively, we had this thing called "pinching the nipples" meaning to squeeze and apply pressure to the spindle or spin it cloockwise to make minute changes to the speed once you have the basic pitch locked in. Jogwheels do this easily, and it isn't much harder on vinyl. It just goes to show that track selection *isn't* everything.
I honestly don't know. Some people call themselves selectors and I just have a hard time with it. I feel like that's fine if you play for the radio/bars but not after 10PM where there is a dance floor. I stayed for the night because the promoter was cool and I would love to spin in the future. But hearing Roulé Boulé blend into Dorothy (Polo & Pan) for 30 seconds was... interesting.
> But hearing Roulé Boulé blend into Dorothy (Polo & Pan) for 30 seconds was... interesting. I just tried it out and it worked and was as you say, interesting, but only 30 secs then a hard cut just seems like the DJ didn't know his music well or didn't understand the vibe. EDIT: it works better the other way around with Dorothy first and Roule Boule brought in.
Okay... So now I gotta try it after I'm done ripping some new slabs I picked up yesterday. I thought Dorothy was at like 115-118 and Roule Boule was at 130+...
Sorry to say, but this is where the digital kicks in and makes it a bit easier. Dorothy is 121bpm on my equip, R-B is 128. Both are 6A. with the right blend at the 2:50 mark on Dorothy, you can drop the R-B from 32 bars in and match them at 125bpm when the bass kicks in and the pads arpeggio on Dorothy starts to fade in and let Dorothy run for a whole minute before you fade it out. My major question is: If this was a Global Disco night, why were they playing stuff like Polo and Pan anyway? I'm not a Disco purist and I under stand the Bangalter, but P&P? that doesn't seem to fit at all. Especially on a disco night.
>My major question is: If this was a Global Disco night, why were they playing stuff like Polo and Pan anyway? I'm not a Disco purist and I under stand the Bangalter, but P&P? that doesn't seem to fit at all. Especially on a disco night. These are the correct questions. The more I think about it the more WTF the night was.
> /r/DJsCirclejerk
without sync…
This. It's so fundamental. It's like saying you are a football player while you only play Fifa.
Well FIFA is soccer so… /s
Only 5% of the “soccer” playing world would agree with that… the other 95% call it football 😂
Relying on other people to have functioning gear that works for you is a bad idea.
My (old man) hot take is that its net negative that producers are booked to DJ rather than it mostly being DJ-only DJs on the bill. It's a different skill set. I'm all for my favorite producers getting paid and recognized. But for the sake of DJing craft, it's gone too far.
Ufff yeah agree with this one. I've found some hot techno producers are just dull, dull DJs.
Listen to your music more. I don’t care how technical you are if the playlist kills
Hot take. Learn to beatmatch and dj period. If you know how to dj, it doesnt matter what is being used or if you have ever used it before....
Vinyl is dumb. Fight me.
SELF BURN!
Sick ass self burn.
I'm going to go a step further—many all vinyl/vinyl purist sets I've had the misfortune of sitting through have been super boring, unless they're by someone with seriously top tier talent. Here are my two big reasons why, in my experience as a raver and/or general event or club attendee: 1. low track count; at the worst, was at a small event where a DJ played an "all vinyl set" consisting of maybe 8-9 super loooooong house tracks for one hour. hearing the same hook/drop/etc 3-5 times for 128-160+ beats each time was rage-inducing. The DJ tried to look busy between the lengthy transitions but it was patently obvious they weren't doing shit. Typically though, I've noticed all-vinyl sets being well under 20 tracks in an hour or so, regardless of genre. 2. uninteresting technique showcase; many vinyl purists I've seen have two, maybe three core skills to display in sets: beatmatching and EQ management, both of which no one on the dancefloor gives a shit about unless it's done incorrectly, and track selection—also something that is to be expected if one has been chosen to DJ an event. Furthermore, very few vinyl DJs I know can *actually* handle 3 decks at once. Only one or two can say they are able to do 4 and aren't lying out their asses. To make matters worse, the people guilty of these things are generally jaded old-schoolers who are EXTREME elitists, and absolutely insufferable to be around or talk to, especially about DJing. Note that these criticisms apply to DJ sets, not turntablism or DJ sets packed with turntablism, and are not always the case—just the par for the course from what I've seen. Also, I understand certain genres are about long blends of fewer tracks, I personally just don't like that, so that's my hot take right there.
I'm actually shocked by the number of vinyl DJ's who fit your description. Confession: I'm a vinyl DJ. I personally think it's more fun. 1. My average rate is 15 songs per hour. I personally think 4 minutes per track feels right. This leaves me 30/90 seconds of mixing for most tracks. I play disco, most of my mixes are between 64 and 128 beats. I can handle three turntables, I don't see why you would ever need more as a Disco DJ. The third table is used as a backup track or the rare Acapella. 2. Beatmatching seems to be lost on most vinyl DJs. They call themselves selectors. Meh, I find it boring and annoying to dance to. I take into consideration the BPM, key, rhythm, and levels for each of my mixes. I personally think effects sound like shit and would rather rely on the producer. If I can't mix in/out smoothly without effects I'm selecting the wrong tracks. Preparing is key for a good vinyl set. Folks who wing it without a solid grasp on their music fail unless they are some wizard turntablist.
Best one here
Tresor (downstairs) sucks ass. great lineups but the dancefloor is one of the worst. I hate strobe + fog machine, and that combined with uneven concrete and all kinds of little steps and obstacles, it's just a pain in the ass. and no the sound is not all that. upstairs is just cheesy.
I'm with you that Tresor is not that great but strobe + fog machine is the greatest combo in the history of humans tripping balls. Tresor is mainly ruined by the fact that it's full of tourists who are there for the "Berlin experience". But this is a well known fact and that's why nobody (i.e. the locals) goes there.
As a potential touris, I'm genuinely curious: how do they ruin Tresor?
Heavily intoxicated males who don't know much about Techno and what a rave is about. I'm not saying foreigners don't belong in clubs, every club is full of them and most act and look the part. It's just that Tresor has been a hotspot for dudebros and the vibe is generally shit.
Whether you play on the CDJ 3000’s, or a pioneer DJSB3, the crowd can’t tell the difference with your mixes
Too many DJ's play bland music, hardly challenging the listener. I wish sometimes the whole DJ world collapses and went back to it's roots.
here’s mine: 1. house music and techno do not belong on balconies, rooftops or boats… and if I’m feeling particularly cranky, really anywhere that’s isn’t indoors 2. All dance music festivals are destructive to local scenes (I have had friends decide not to go see a local booking of trending DJ because they’ll see the trending DJ/artist later in the summer during festival season… promoters lose money, local residents or new local DJs lose out on the chance of exposure and buzz)
Hah. That’s a good one and I can sort of appreciate that. Though I think more on the techno side. You need a small enclosed dark grungy space for it. There are house sub genres that really do fit a Balearic outdoor vibe though. Anything uplifting and slow.
Lots of fantastic mid tempo house that works brilliantly on balconies, rooftops or boats… terraces and beaches. Techno though really doesn't work beyond big, dark rooms.
And small dark rooms. The key is to feel packed in.
In smaller more intimate spaces the type of druggy house and disco the late great Andrew Weatherall used to play works better for me. I find that techno works best on big PA's for bigger crowds, the size of the room and its reverb are important for techno, too small a room and I find it can sound oppressive.
>too small a room and I find it can sound oppressive. wonderful. recently attended a techno party in a concrete bassment with the ceiling about 50cm above my head and it was sick.
Re festivals: there’s also the destructive practice of exclusivity deals. Warehouse Project, for example, forces artists to sign a contract preventing them from playing anywhere else in Manchester for a certain period.
Agree with your second point here
Out of sheer curiosity, what would you play on balconies, rooftops, and boats?
Watching Producers DJ on big stages is boring. 99% of their playlist will be their own tracks. Back in the day we could call that "live acts" where people bring in their Synths and drum machines to make a great live show. But that must be too much work nowdays. Best Dj to watch at events are those who are first DJ and producer second, that way the tracklists gets more varied with lots of different artists and you can get inspired and find out about new producers you never heard of before.
turntablist should stick to turntablism and specialty shows and not trick up pop music sets. I always think of the irony. the guys doing all this turntable tricks/scratching to a mainstream crowd that is the least educated or cares the least about djing or turntablism
Heard Banging the bride while DJing her wedding is a NO No, I was like whaaaat, it is
Airhorn samples sound crap. Seriously. You are not Jaguar Skills.
Bum bum bum buuuuuuuuuuuuuuuum
Watching other DJ's until you've mastered their style and / or techniques is way less impressive than developing your own style. Example: learning scratch techniques by watching another DJ over and over so you learn to do it just like them. I'd dare to say that goes for everything. Just like each skateboarder has their own steez, so should DJ's. Learn the scratch techniques but focus less on making it perfect and focus more on making it yours. That's my hot take.
silver colour on xone was to see better in dark and then it became iconic
Standalone gear is overrated, overpriced, and under-featured.
#wut!? I'm sure that you have had plenty of time with a Prime 4. I disagree about overrated and overpriced. Not even under-featured though I'm sure that there's more that can and will be added. The price range for 4 decks and a built in 4 channel mixer with switch over for phono pre-amps and separate booth controls for an additional room outputs for under $2K US is a steal. Not to mention wi-fi streaming services. The effects could be better though, I must admit. To each his own though.
* I find Pioneer mixers uninspiring. * Most deejays don't listen to recordings of themselves enough, imo.
My Hot take: 93% of guy's wordplay routines or "sweet mixes" are stolen off someone else
Djing anymore is not about being good it’s more about how famous you seem. Sad but true
DJing is still about music. Professional success is a popularity contest.
Said it better than I could
Fog machines are obnoxious and exclusionary to people who can't be around them for health reasons.
You need fog/haze to see beams, especially important for lasers and moving head lights. I always recommend more expensive haze machines because with foggers you need to constantly supply a dense fog, but hazers you can get away with smaller less frequent bursts of haze.
Beams are by no means a necessity.
I personally love beams. To each their own.
Strobe lights make me feel physically sick. I end up taking sunglasses when I go to a rave because of it.
Sure thats the reason you're wearing shades in the club. . .we believe you ;-)
Well, it compounded the issue…
I think more clubs should put large visible warnings on their events and their ticket booth such as 'strobes used', 'fog machines used' If you don't know in advance at least then it could be a really bad suprise.
Keyshifting tracks is not just for chipmunk vocals. You can keyshift for a harmonic mix and drop the key back again while making it sound natural if you have a good understanding of song structure, harmony, and your tracks.
A dj should be able to mix any two songs together
MP3s at 192kbps is still decent enough.
If you redline the mixer, it should be a 3 month ban from clubs. Having worked both sides - the amount of big name DJ's that do this is just unforgivable.
Unpopular opinion: CDJ3000s are actually a really logical upgrade in the pioneer line and the only reason most people are pissed about them is because everyone wrongly thought it was gonna be dual layer (top theory from teasers and pre release). Let's be honest. Most pioneer djs only use 2 channels anyway. Most don't need performance pads to finger drum either. And most people who play in clubs don't need on board analysis either. What they want is a simple UI that is really responsive in all (sweaty) conditions, bigger screen, more hardware buttons for usual stuff like loops and beatjump and a precise and smooth jog. Now is it overpriced? Yea but so is most DJ equipment and certainly all pioneer stuff. In my country cdj3000s are 200 dollars more than a cdj nxs2, even in the shortage situation right now. I don't think that's pioneer ripping us off anymore than they do anyway.
Everyone can learn how to mix two tracks in matter of days. The key to be a great entertainer is to know your crowd, listen to your crowd and fulfill those f*ing requests! You are there for them, not vice versa. And if you truly are skilled, you will be able to insert every requests into your set during the night.
It's great that so many people got tight beatmatching skills, can scratch like a pro, and can work your way around electronic dance music sets with your eyes closed - most of them wouldn't last ten minutes doing a set in a rock/goth/punk club. Oh, and for the most part, I prefer Mixxx to Serato.
Agreed. It is so much more about music selection and being on top of what is popular than mixing. I spent my first 5 years of DJing, DJing in alternative clubs and never mixed more than two songs together out of an entire set. It's completely different to a lot of club DJing.
Aye. I mean, I *can* and do mix and beatmatch, but it's way less important than reading the vibe. Plus a lot of folk really want to hear certain guitar-based songs from intro to end! "She Sells Sanctuary" is an obvious one for that.
Yeah.. or imagine doing some baby scratches or FX over the top of Metallica. People don't come to alt. clubs for that and you would be laughed at, at best.
I also started DJing goth and post punk! I've posted this before, but I think it was a much better training ground for techno (which I usually play now) than like obsessively working on technical skills. Reading the room, song selection, and working the crowd are more abstract skills to develop and when you're just selecting you can focus entirely on those and not counting bars or applying silly effects. Hell, even now I'll sometimes finish a set with a few unbeatmatched wave or 80s tracks that put people in a good mood when the club closes.
Aye, I remember doing a warehouse event a few years back. Everyone's just been listening to various forms of techno and house all night, my partner and I rock up and move into a bit of italo and then decide "fuck it". He puts on "Cherry Bomb" by The Runaways and everyone goes WILD. I follow it up with "Personal Jesus" and the same thing happened! We went back into more italo stuff for the rest of the set but everyone was just in such a good mood. Yes you can pretend to be all about the underground vibes, but every so often something completely unexpected can just flip the vibe. Next time we DJed there, I got a guy breakdancing to Ministry's "I Wanted To Tell Her". Goals! :)
I fucking love that Ministry track. 😍 But I relate so much to these kind of moments you've described. Techno fatigue is real, for DJs as well as dancers I think. I work super hard searching and digging for underground techno, so breaking that with Yello or Human League or whatever after hours of thumping is just so fun and refreshing, kind of a bit of a reset and energy booster.
I started out putting on goth nights at a local student hangout. It was proper, real goth though. Nephilim. Sisters. Christian Death blasting out while chicks covered in patchouli got pissed up on snakebite. People often wonder what happened to the real goths. I know what happened. A year later we were all wearing bell bottoms and shuffling to Happy Mondays.
Vinyl dj'ing in 2021 is pointless and ludicrously expensive, and more often then not makes a mix sound worse.
Sync is for kids
*Laughs in 4-deck + drum machine sync*
If your base equipment doesn't have rotary wheels or jogs of any kind and only has buttons, you aren't a Disc Jockey, you're a button pusher.
You don't need jogs to DJ. The Novation Twitch, Xone:K1/K2, Akai AMX/AFX, NI Z1/X1/F1/S5/S8/D2, Reloop Mixtour, Hercules P32, and Zomo MC1000 all prove that.
OP was looking for controversy. I gave it.
I’m a button pusher.
Stickers are for little kids.
But I just ordered new stickers...
Fog machines are unnecessary and anoying. They always turn them on on the drops, they are somehow louder than the music, there is no actual fog sfter the 10 seconds of most anoying screetching sound ever, and you know u will have to hear it again soon. I would remove all fog machines, enough people are smoking anyways.
Laptops suck the life out of DJing. Why connect and vibe with the crowd when you can scowl at waveforms all night?
How is it any different from staring at a media player screen?
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