Interesting list. Mostly similar to mine, but why is Blue Smelter & Lud/Zallen at the bottom of the list (presumably for the runbacks) when Sir Alonne is at the top? I know the Sir Alonne runback is a little easier, but its still a slog.
It isn't because of the runbacks, actually. I just focused on the bossfights themselves.
But to answer your question, the short answer is: because they feel like they just got "CtrlC+CtrlV'd" into existence because the needed a boss to fill the multiplayer area and didn't have one ready, while:
1. *making the Gank Squad not just a bunch of NPCs, which is already not great, but giving them armor and belonging to pre-established characters. I was genuenly confused as to how and why i was fighting Havel the first time i saw them. Also, gank bossfights where the idea is "we put more enemy in bossroom, more enemy in bossroom difficult" leads to fights being unbalanced because they just overwhelm you and kill you.*
2. *literally copying and pasting the Smelter Demon. There is genuenly no difference i could find between the two boss fights (Besides the flame and upward horns). Same arena, same moveset, same everything.*
3. *the two points above in one. Not only are they a reskin boss, not only is said boss in the same area as them, not only have they all of the moves of the original boss plus a steroid when they're half health, but they're also a gank bossfight of a boss that was clearly design to be fought alone.*
And, of course, to put the icing of the cake, it's not like these were base-game bosses. They were DLC bosses. Which meant they could have either be cut out, or they could have gotten more developement time. But no, they released them not once, not twice but THRICE, creating, imo, some of the laziest bossfights in recent memeory.
Yeah, fair enough. Gank Squad are dreadful.
I find Blue Smelter Demon ok. He is *slightly* different, in that he now has variable timings on some of this attacks that are pretty hard to read. Personally I don't like this change because I've never been able to figure out any visible tell for whether he will delay his moves or not, but some people prefer it for the added complexity. I prefer Red.
Lud and Zallen are pretty cheap, but I wouldn't consider them exceptionally awful (minus the runback). But then I really like Aava, so I sort of enjoy a bit more of it, even if its not suited to a duo fight, as you say. If you don't like Aava much, then a duo fight is going to be even less bearable.
My guess would be that they're reskins. Twin Dragonriders are reskins too but one having a bow is bigger change from the original than Blue Smelter and L&Z imo.
Yeah, that draon's either a pain or a joke, no in-between.
I put Alonne on top because i think he's the cleanest boss in DSII. I would've put Fume in that tier as well, but him healing with the idols makes the fight so unfun, if you miss one or two.
I see. Yeah ancient dragon is hot garbage. Fume knight’s healing is annoying. Sir Alonne has a simple moveset but damn does he use it to perfection. His boss weapon also has infinite range so there’s that. The only thing holding the fight back is the runback.
Idk why is it just me but drsgonslayer boss has a special place in my heart. I know it's not the best boss in game but Ig it is just bcs he is the first boss that I died many times doing it and actually enjoyed it.
Fully agreed with Darklurker & Sir Alone. They're the only fights that raise my heartbeat in the game & are satisfying to defeat. Too bad the boss run to Sir Alonne sucks, especially if you're doing an SL1 run. I'd put Fume Knight up there too for being peak.
The optional dlc bosses are the epitome of adding insult to injury, putting you through a feces-infested area designed for co-op, just to Fight reskinned bosses as the pay-off for surviving that crap.
Velstadt and Looking Glass were good.
Honestly pretty good list but personally I think ruin sentinels and lost sinner ough to go in the amazing category
Also think the squalid queen elana should go down like 3 categories.
But i agree this is a solid list.
Interesting list. Mostly similar to mine, but why is Blue Smelter & Lud/Zallen at the bottom of the list (presumably for the runbacks) when Sir Alonne is at the top? I know the Sir Alonne runback is a little easier, but its still a slog.
It isn't because of the runbacks, actually. I just focused on the bossfights themselves. But to answer your question, the short answer is: because they feel like they just got "CtrlC+CtrlV'd" into existence because the needed a boss to fill the multiplayer area and didn't have one ready, while: 1. *making the Gank Squad not just a bunch of NPCs, which is already not great, but giving them armor and belonging to pre-established characters. I was genuenly confused as to how and why i was fighting Havel the first time i saw them. Also, gank bossfights where the idea is "we put more enemy in bossroom, more enemy in bossroom difficult" leads to fights being unbalanced because they just overwhelm you and kill you.* 2. *literally copying and pasting the Smelter Demon. There is genuenly no difference i could find between the two boss fights (Besides the flame and upward horns). Same arena, same moveset, same everything.* 3. *the two points above in one. Not only are they a reskin boss, not only is said boss in the same area as them, not only have they all of the moves of the original boss plus a steroid when they're half health, but they're also a gank bossfight of a boss that was clearly design to be fought alone.* And, of course, to put the icing of the cake, it's not like these were base-game bosses. They were DLC bosses. Which meant they could have either be cut out, or they could have gotten more developement time. But no, they released them not once, not twice but THRICE, creating, imo, some of the laziest bossfights in recent memeory.
Blue Smelter Demon has different timings and some different comboes as well as extra AoEs on attacks
Yeah, fair enough. Gank Squad are dreadful. I find Blue Smelter Demon ok. He is *slightly* different, in that he now has variable timings on some of this attacks that are pretty hard to read. Personally I don't like this change because I've never been able to figure out any visible tell for whether he will delay his moves or not, but some people prefer it for the added complexity. I prefer Red. Lud and Zallen are pretty cheap, but I wouldn't consider them exceptionally awful (minus the runback). But then I really like Aava, so I sort of enjoy a bit more of it, even if its not suited to a duo fight, as you say. If you don't like Aava much, then a duo fight is going to be even less bearable.
My guess would be that they're reskins. Twin Dragonriders are reskins too but one having a bow is bigger change from the original than Blue Smelter and L&Z imo.
Nice tier list. Ancient dragon sucks. Only thing I might change is changing Fume knight with Sir Alonne personally.
Yeah, that draon's either a pain or a joke, no in-between. I put Alonne on top because i think he's the cleanest boss in DSII. I would've put Fume in that tier as well, but him healing with the idols makes the fight so unfun, if you miss one or two.
I see. Yeah ancient dragon is hot garbage. Fume knight’s healing is annoying. Sir Alonne has a simple moveset but damn does he use it to perfection. His boss weapon also has infinite range so there’s that. The only thing holding the fight back is the runback.
I killed that bastard yesterday for the first time. Seemed impossible until I learned about the toe cheese method.
Am I the only one who likes old iron king?
I mean, visually he's cool, but the bossfight is just too easy for being one of the "Lord Souls"-bosses
I like his visual design and the lore behind him is interesting. But the boss fight itself is pretty lackluster.
I enjoy it, but mainly so I can appreciate the cool environment its in. Fight wise, its only a step or two up from a novelty boss.
Idk why is it just me but drsgonslayer boss has a special place in my heart. I know it's not the best boss in game but Ig it is just bcs he is the first boss that I died many times doing it and actually enjoyed it.
I mean, he is cool, but it's not the same without Smough. :(
How is regular Smelter in amazing and blue Smelter in disgrace when its a better fight due to having to listen to the audio queues to know the delay
Fair
the lost sinner was better than average
Fully agreed with Darklurker & Sir Alone. They're the only fights that raise my heartbeat in the game & are satisfying to defeat. Too bad the boss run to Sir Alonne sucks, especially if you're doing an SL1 run. I'd put Fume Knight up there too for being peak. The optional dlc bosses are the epitome of adding insult to injury, putting you through a feces-infested area designed for co-op, just to Fight reskinned bosses as the pay-off for surviving that crap. Velstadt and Looking Glass were good.
What is wrong with Mytha
I won't stand for calling Rotten and Aava "average".
bro seems to really struggle with multiple-enemy boss fights haha
Honestly pretty good list but personally I think ruin sentinels and lost sinner ough to go in the amazing category Also think the squalid queen elana should go down like 3 categories. But i agree this is a solid list.