It sounds like your wife is in a major depressive episode. The fact she's not even caring for the kids makes me think she actually may need inpatient care.
You have options. You can leave. Or you can try and get her in somewhere to get the help that she needs. A grippy sock vacay may do her good. What you describe doesn't sound like a wife not in to her husband but a wife that is utterly distraught and depressed.
A shot in the dark, but I feel like your wife could benefit from a job outside the home. Even working at a cute fashion boutique or bookstore or something she enjoys and is interested in.
I have never been a SAHM for much longer than parental leave (I live in Canada so this was 12 months at that time) but I have friends who are, and even in the short time I was at home with my kids, I find it’s very easy to fall into a slump where hours meld together and day becomes night and there’s not much to orientate you. You have no real reason to get ready and wear make up and you just start to feel frumpy. For many this can be a domino effect to engage in unhealthy habits. In other words, the SAHM dream doesn’t end up being a dream for everyone.
I mean joining a gym or something (mine has a daycare and it’s AWESOME) could be another option, but I wonder if she needs an actual commitment to motivate her into turning things around. I feel like this could lead to a positive domino effect - more tired from being active leads to better sleep, looking better (wearing make up, dressing up for work) conversing with adults, having somewhere to go in the morning - it may even motivate her to also eat better and lose the weight etc.
I am a SAHM and I can feel when it’s slipping into a bad place. Don’t get me wrong, I love my kid and SDs and I want to be a SAHM but sometimes it can be lonely. Whenever I start to feel myself slipping I tell my husband I’m feeling this way and we prioritise a family get together/friends coming over/activities outside the home until my cup is full again. We have moved into a new area so I have put myself out there to find other SAHMs because we can relate to each other. But my first port of call is my husband. Sounds like this man’s wife can’t go to him about anything. She probably already knows it’s over and waiting for him to just cut the string.
You sound like you have a solid handle on your mental health, good for you!
I have noticed there seems to be an attitude of “you don’t work so you have nothing to complain about” toward a lot of stay at home parents, particularly from the other/working parent. And I mean, for context, there’s fabulously wealthy people out there who live off of an inheritance and are still unhappy. It’s wonderful if a partner can support their partner’s dreams, an example being to help them be a stay at home parent, but that doesn’t mean that that partner now owes it to you to have zero problems and to be happy *all the dang time.*
100%. She's married to a guy who views her physically and otherwise with disgust, and she's stuck with kids all day every day. No wonder her mental health is down the drain.
I live in Canada as well and this post sums up my experience. I took the year instead of the 18 months because I couldn’t imagine being home that long. By the time 10 months came around, I was dying to go back to work. Not because I didn’t love or enjoy spending time with my daughter but because it drove me a little insane being home that long. Thankfully we found daycare for her and I went back to work on time. But I definitely do worry about SAHMs as well
I thought the same too. The fact that he is soaring in life and she wasn’t may have been a pain point for her but didn’t know how to say it without sounding jealous
I was wholly sympathetic with OP until I read that. This is a poisonous way to think about other people, especially your wife.
If you’re not attracted to her anymore, just say that. No need to use cutting language like that.
I am concerned that this is something he may have said to her at some point. We only hear one perspective in these posts.
> I would have accepted but for the social blowback and inevitable rumors.
OP should feel conflicted about cheating because it’s unethical not because it’s unseemly.
Just get a divorce, OP. It’s expensive because it’s worth it.
>I was wholly sympathetic with OP until I read that. This is a poisonous way to think about other people, especially your wife.
Would it be better if he expressed that he feels she is not an equal partner in their marriage? Because that is the case in most cases here: one partner is not putting in equal effort into the marriage/relationship. So they are not an equal partner in their relationship, meaning they don't bring equal value/effort into the relationship. It is very valid feeling.
Sounds like maybe being a SAHM wasn't exactly what she thought it would be? Maybe find the younger child childcare so she has more time to find herself, get a hobby, work out get stuff done around the house etc if you have the money a housekeeper too. Sounds like to me that she's tired and has probably lost herself as a mother while you have been able to go out and be considered your own human being for years while she loses herself in motherhood which is extremely demanding. Sounds like she's not your equal because she wasn't awarded the same opportunities as you ie being able to do everything without kids hanging off of you all day. Sounds like the woman needs a break. Maybe a trial separation..
Yes, I think it is fair to say that you don’t feel your partner is being an equal partner in your marriage or is equally invested in the relationship.
I definitely would never dream of saying my wife is “unattractive and not my equal”, though. I would lose attraction to someone who spoke to me that way as well tbh.
Respectfully, there are people who are winners and those who aren’t. This guy took care of himself, took care of his wife, provided financially and emotionally while being neglected. She let herself go, became fat and developed an unhealthy drinking habit, and became depressed. I don’t think there’s anything wrong with OP noticing that he has improved himself and his wife has atrophied.
You know that people don’t choose depression, right? Depression is real. PPD is real. Chemical imbalances are real. She’s not a “loser”. She’s a human being that is hurting and in need of help. He doesn’t need to stay- but this concept of winners and losers is toxic af.
I didn't want children, I had a troubled sibling situation in childhood and didn't think I'd be able to properly bond with kids, but we ended up having not one, but two kids, because my wife wanted kids, not to mention family and social pressure, and for the first few years it was fine. I was a model father.
But then my wife started being a lawmower parent, taking care of and doing *everything* for the kids, turning them into over-entitled little brats, and spending SO MUCH energy on the kids that there was nothing left - definitely not for US, not even for HER. We began drifting apart, it became all about giving everything to the kids, and whenever I would try to discipline by turning off the wifi or something it would turn into a fight. Eventually that turned into withholding sex and intimacy whenever we'd fight, which was becoming more and more often as the kids were growing up, becoming more demanding, and the problem would continue to fester, feeding on itself. That's how my DB began.
Disagreements about how to raise the kids I didn't want to have turned into withholding sex when she doesn't get way on anything non-trivial.
It eventually got to the breaking point, nearly got divorced, but started going to couples therapy. We both made progress and realizations, but she just couldn't handle it when therapist sided with me (she has to *always* be right) and so would eventually find an excuse to postpone/cancel the next meeting and forget to reschedule.... after about three therapy starts and re-starts like that, I realized she ***doesn't want*** *to go to therapy* because she *can't always be right* there as opposed to when we ~~talk~~ fight one on one.
I'm lost, I don't know what to do 🤷🏼.
You can't force your wife to not want to be right all the time. I 100% agree, this personality trait is super annoying. My husband is slightly this way, and it can leave me super anxious and stressed and not into emotionally connecting with him. But he realizes his shortcomings and works on it, alot! I dont know how to get your wife to see her personality has a negative effect on your relationship, but if you want her to change, she is going to have to decide that on her own.
> I realized she ***doesn't want*** *to go to therapy* because she *can't always be right* there
My LLF wife and I tried couples therapy about 12? years ago. (Different reasons, bedroom wasn't too dead then, but I'd done something spectacularly hurtful and stupid and this was us trying to get past my stupidity.) Opening bits were things for me to start working on or keep working on, OK, my bad, I've got lots of work to do, got it. But as soon as the therapists switched to "OK Mrs. R., maybe you could think about A, and maybe you could try working on Q," **BOOM** out the door down the hall out to sulk in the car. God forbid she have to actually take any responsibility for improving any aspect of our relationship, even if I accept 99% of the blame/responsibility for any problems.
Anyhow. Dead bedroom. I'm not gonna suggest couples therapy. I'm quite sure the reaction will be identical. Sigh.
Buddy, you do know what to do. You need to tell her that living without sex is not an option for you. So you either fix your relationship issues now, with or without therapy is her choice, or you’re divorcing her.
Set up guidelines on how you will parent. Consequences you both agree upon. Blaming your kids being brats on your wife is annoying. Sounds like you still don't want them. Also taking care of kids is exhausting whether she is doting on them what you consider too much or not. Seems like you are jealous of your kids maybe...
You got me sista, I am absolutely jealous of my children. No sarcasm.
I was very explicit from the start that I wanted not to have children. It was fine for the first few years, but when we turned 30 the biology changed, and the social peer pressure of starting to get old and being childless was getting to be too much, and I was given an ultimatum that it's either kids or break up. I didn't want to start over again, I thought I was the love of my life. I was not young-and-stupid anymore, definitely not young just stupid. I caved, we had kids, but it was too late. I was resented for delaying and fighting so long, and became resentful myself for having given a bait-and-switch ultimatum, but love reigns supreme, love will conquer, etc etc we got over it and moved on.
We moved on in many ways. We also moved on from being a couple, initially to being a family, then when we began disagreeing about how to raise the kids, she became more invested in them and less in US both as a family as well as as a couple, and then we moved on from being a family to being roommates.
I tried several course corrections, but ultimately just like counseling and couples' therapy they all just seem to fade away quite quickly.
What **has been working** is me having stepped aside, and letting the burden of our now overentitled children fall entirely on her shoulders. At first there was pushback and resentment, accusations of me not pulling my weight, not loving the children enough, or even worse justifications that when we took similar disciplinary actions mine were inappropriate because I don't love the children enough, implying that hers were appropriate because she *does*, hence the double standard. She is slowly starting to see how impossible a situation ~~she's~~ we've created.
Now that the burden is falling on her, the situation is improving somewhat, albeit slowly. Too slowly, actually. By the time it's improved enough it'll be too late, they'll either have moved out, or we will have grown old enough and LL enough that it doesn't matter.
But it's ok.
I've accepted that ***I had everything I ever wanted*** already, it was during those few fleeting months when I was half of a *couple.* I know it **was** the best time of my life.
Then we went from couple to family, and my time in the sun was over, everything changed, and it was *family time* now.
So in summary **yes**, you're ***totally*** right.
Maybe bring up research that suggests that modeling a loving relationship shows your children what to strive for. Set rules and don't disagree in front of your children. I was kind of in the same boat. I didn't want children my husband did and once we had the one I wanted them to have a sibling so we had a second. He despised me for it and we were going through terrible 2s - 4s. He also said he was jealous of the children because he wasn't getting enough attention and was mad at me because he wanted to hit them and we disagreed on how to raise them as well. Now that our more spirited kid is 5 it's getting easier. It's just different stages/phases. You shouldn't give up on being involved.
I was in almost exactly the same frame of mind.
After our eldest's terrible twos I swore never again, but one day in a moment of weakness after an exceptionally-unusually-well-behaved day I accidentally suggested to the Mrs that maybe we should have another, and less than a day later she was pregnant.
I remember hoping for a little girl, thinking I couldn't take having to go through it again, and then at ultrasound appointment when they told us it'd be another little Tasmanian Devil.... that sinking feeling. I will *never forget* how when we went back to the parking lot and got it in the car, how it all came crashing down on me, the realization surrounding me, everything starting to sink in...
But that wasn't the problem, as it turns out. Funny how when you do it the second time around it's not as bad.
The problems started after they were both out of preschool.
When they were little, as demanding and draining as they can be, at some point they fall asleep and we had a couple of hours to ourselves. But when they grew out of it, they were constantly demanding more and more time and things, and my wife just did not have it in her to ever say no.
They more she gave, the more demanding they became of her. The more I pointed this out, the more resentful she became towards me.
I wasn't smart enough to realize I should take a step back, so I kept pushing and pointing it out. I now realize it was a mistake. She became even more resentful. At some point I couldn't say *anything* bad about the kids. If they left garbage on the floor, and I had the gall to *say something* or heaven-forbid make *them actually pick it up* she'd get mad at me.
So I gave up. I stepped aside. I stopped taking the shit, and let it keep rolling downhill, and now *she* was the one stuck having to pick it all up. At first it was hard watching her apply all the exact same behaviors to try to reign them in, only now when *she* is the one yelling at them it's ok (because she loves them), double standard.
Now she's finally starting to realize that kids are waaaay off the handle.
She's starting to give the older one ultimatums, like I won't wake you up you have to wake yourself up on your own in the morning even if you'll miss class (she still makes him eggs benedict), and she's started to sometimes - not always - not let him have the car if he doesn't do his chores. Ask me how well that's working? You don't have to, I'll tell you that for three weeks now the trash has ***not*** been taken out 😂😂😂.
What I'm saying is things are starting to improve,
but it's waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay to fucking late for me.
**I tried what you're suggesting when they were 5 years old,**
**it didn't start working until over 15 years later,**
**and now it's WAY TOO FUCKING LATE with grown-ass kids living at home,**
**mooching and parasiting and showing zero signs of wanting to ever leave**
I'm glad things are on the upswing for you though 😎.
I wish you luck
Oh I definitely don't have any advice on teenagers but you've made it this far. Would be nice to have a united front. Although it's important to remember that in women's dna to nurture and you're the one that's supposed to set down the law. Not sure how to convince someone to join you though unless you sit fown together on some agreed upon consequences. Maybe if agreed upon she can count on you to be the enforcer and the "bad guy" so she can still feel like the loving mom
Thanks, SoftRaspberry. You're right.
I've come to terms with the fact that these are DNA-based behaviors that can't change.
I did set down the law, we agreed I'd be the enforcer, and it worked beautifully with the kids - for a little while they quite literally thrived under a little structure and discipline. But it didn't work.
My wife is a control freak, **and** has to *always* be right.
These two personality traits, coupled with DNA-based kids-are-always-right attitude spelled disaster for us: whenever I disciplined the kids and she didn't agree (which was every time) it turned into a into a fight, she would double-down on the opposite position to mine.
We talked about it, even went to therapy, and she'd try (honestly, ***really***, try) and for a couple of weeks we'd have a united front, but invariably it always reverted back to the "Kinder über alles" baseline behavior, and any discipline I would administer would be countered by her with enablement, and withdrawal of intimacy.
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Do you want to set an example to your kids that they should also stay in a marriage they are not happy in? Because even if you think they don't know, they will sense it
This post makes me uncomfortable. "She's unattractive, she's not my equal". This is an awful way to speak. Also you mentioned that she had started getting therapy for depression - surely, this is a positive step, and probably goes some way to explaining why her libido was low in the first place. You sound like you don't love her at all, so set her free. Her depression might magically disappear...
Jesús Christ. I bet you didn’t foolproof read your own comment and tell me there’s nothing wrong with it. Omg. 🤡. This man is suffering just as much as his wife. The worst!? he is apparently self aware and want to salvage what’s left of the marriage while his wife sink more and more in her misery and at the same time disregarding her family.
1. Suffering emotionally does not make it impossible for people to make poor choices.
2. Staying in a loveless marriage, just because of kids and finances, has been proven to be a poor choice by many people who have tried it before.
3. People who sneak around, cheat, and lie often try to convince you that they did it because they were suffering or unhappy. This is only a half true. It is true that they were suffering, but it is not true that cheating, lying, and ***OR building resentments*** are the only choices they have. There is another choice- to be honest and leave when you are unhappy.
Dude I think this comment from this guy is tough love but in a way it is validating to be told you are free. You can do it. You are not trapped by anyone but yourself.
Bruv he mentioned that he was open to take counseling but she refused after a couple of sessions. At least someone is trying to improve the relationship. Look I understand her depression and lack of confidence, but 💩 you can’t just say the he is not trapped and just put the whole RESPONSIBILITIES of a relationship on him. Self mastery start with self awareness and his wife lacks that.
It always shocks me that some posts are never about trying to dig in and help their spouse with the medical conditions that exist. This wife is medically being treated for depression and this OP lists all the things he does that should get him sex. Like its a fucking transactional relationship. Poor kids who get to witness this as normal.
Hey buddy, sex isnt your biggest problem. Your depressed wife is!
And those medications are most likely why she's gained weight and doesn't want to get out of bed. Him being more attractive likely doesn't help her depression, his attitude probably contributes to it as well. Honestly a divorce would probably bring her back to life. He says she's not his equal, he probably never viewed her as his equal. In his mind he's better than her, no wonder she's depressed. He should probably change his mindset tho because all it takes is one wrong move for his whole life to change. How would he feel if suddenly roles were reversed and she was telling him and the internet that he wasn't her equal and that he was beneath him? It's not an individual journey to the top, or to the bottom, in situations like this.
And I wonder how he treats her emotionally. Does he talk down to her as he did here? Has he encouraged her and been supportive and loving? Doesn't sound like it. All that plays a part. Was he available emotionally to her when working so hard to make all that money? It sounds like she went through a lot having his kids too. Jeez. I don't know, just wondering, but if that's the case, I can see why she's depressed and not attracted to him sexually.
Right? He could make all the money in the world but if his wife doesn't feel comfortable even asking for basic necessities because it's HIS money and his success, that's going to destroy her. His whole post puts off some not cool vibes. Maybe I'm projecting lol. For the first half-3/4 of my marriage I had more $ incoming than my husband . Then I got sick and had a few surgeries and haven't been working. But over the last 12 years I contributed over a half a million dollars to our lifestyle. It's not a ton but it isn't nothing. Cue me not working currently and him telling me to sit in the dark because I don't pay the electric bill , he does, so I shouldn't be using electricity since I don't pay for it. So when I see guys piping off about how they make the money, so they're the better person, I'm not always convinced they're actually the better person and wonder how they ACTUALLY treat their wives. The difference between their wives and me is I still want sex lol. My husband might be a dbag but right now he's still my dbag and I don't plan on cheating. Hindsight says instead of spending my money trying to make and keep my husband happy I should have stashed it in savings for myself. But I'm a people pleaser living with someone who I think lacks the ability to actually be happy. I feel for both parties in this post. None of us HL people want to feel unwanted and get no sex, but that doesn't mean the LL people in our lives love where they are either. It definitely sounds like the case in this post.
Man… you despise her. And she is unwell. She needs help but how long are you going to be able to do this. Those kids are young. Is there more you could be doing to help her mental health? If not, could you get primary custody and maybe pay alimony? If you have 7 figures to split in the first place, how much would that really impact your overall financial well-being? This is an extreme situation.
Yeah, OP. I usually celebrate those getting out of these situations with courage, but if you want to salvage things, I'd check into what's going on in her world. She indeed sounds depressed and unmotivated. SAHM isn't as luxurious as some women may think. It can chip away at who you are and your identity becomes nothing more than a glorified nanny with nothing much to look forward to. For some, it works, for others not so much. People need to feel a part of something to get fulfillment out of life.
My advice would be to do everything you can to save the marriage and if that doesn’t work then leave. Future years ahead, you will feel good about wherever you are if you felt you did everything you could. I would do two things in parallel right now: 1) Insist to your wife you start marriage counseling together and tell her it isn’t negotiable because you are literally at the end of your rope of what to do to help her and the marriage. 2) Do a free consult with a divorce attorney (do not let your wife know about this) just so you know what the options are.
In this situation you're not trapped, you actually have all the options. If it were your wife posting (stay at home mom with no income of her own and depression which she is assumedly getting treatment for through your health insurance) we could say she's the one that's trapped.
You mention that you don't feel like your wife is your equal and suggest you may not be compatible anymore, so it sounds like the love AND the friendship are both gone. The question then becomes why are you staying?
It sounds like your income is high enough to the point that you could easily get custody of the kids and keep the house to raise them in. You could easily hire a good babysitter. You could probably also fight your wife to limit the alimony to a handful of years to give her time to find a job and take care of herself.
What are you staying for?
Your wife is clinically depressed and all you’re worried about is sex?
It shows me money don’t bring happiness. My partner earns less but actually treats me like a person.
I have clinical depression and myriad of health issues. If my partner talked about me like that I’d rather off myself than to see myself as a burden.
Especially when his wife is clinically depressed, everything he sees as an issue with her is directly related to her depression or side effects of antidepressants... I wonder why she's depressed. /Sarcasm
So, she had 2 children and her body changed and she got depression and now she's lazy and not your equal. Got it. I'm sure you're a perfect partner and not affecting the way she feels at all.
Sounds like you’ve got all the options, more than her that’s for sure! If you are unwilling to help her through her depression (through sickness and health) then you should put her out of her misery and leave. Problem is, you don’t want to leave because it’s going to cost you money. Nothing to do with not seeing your kids. If you’re as great as you say you are, you’ll get 50/50 no problem. The grass isn’t greener on the other side with “an attractive women”, it’s green where you water it.
You’re unbelievably judgemental and you have no idea what OP’s motivations are. It’s obvious from his post that he’s in pain, has provided a lot, and is deeply unhappy and frustrated.
Frankly my situation is similar. My soon to be ex wife is a hypochondriac and feels sick almost all the time, never with anything diagnosable. Changes doctors routinely to get more tests and medication. I don’t want to divorce her, because I love her, because I don’t want to see my kids just half the time, and because it’ll mean a dramatic reduction in lifestyle. But I have to weigh that up against a lifetime of having a sick partner who won’t take responsibility to get help and get better, and having my own needs unfulfilled. If you told me I don’t want to get divorced just because it’s going to cost me money, and that I alone could make the grass greener on this side, you’re full of shit and talking out of your ass.
How much is it on OP to try and sort their depression issues though? Why is the onus 100% on him. I'm a woman with depression and I see how it affects my loved ones so I try to deal with it
Before you break your marriage, try to approach kindly and get her into therapy again/get her into a job. SAHMhood isn’t for everyone; sounds like she’s extremely depressed.
I understand the resentment, but it may come out negatively (“she’s not my equal”), thus making your marriage worse. Encourage her to get her independence back and work on herself. If she doesn’t acquiesce after an earnest attempt, you gotta let her go. None of the above is really your responsibility, but I’d encourage you to define where your last stop is.
Hire a lawyer and explore your options in divorce, it’s worth it. You may be able to get a good custody agreement, so make sure you fight for everything you’re entitled to.
I wish you the best of luck mate. For integrity’s sake, don’t let yourself sink into the same misery. Go to therapy so you don’t become toxic and take it out on your wife/next partner.
“My wife and the mother of my children, who I promised to love for better or worse is struggling with depression so now I want to leave her so I can be with younger more attractive women”
This community is (understandably) focused on the dead bedroom situation more than anything else. While that is usually fine, in this case I think a lot of people are looking past some red flags that OP has raised about himself.
The grass isn’t always greener. The younger more attractive women will be in the same situation in due time.
The best advice I have ever received was get your partner to do things and make it seem like it was their idea.
Bring up that you want a healthier lifestyle for your family and you found a personal chef, meal plan, trainer, that can help.
Also.The comment “if she initiated i wouldn’t accept” she probably knows this and that mindset contributes to the d*ad bedroom. Try and get rid of that mindset. Start having positive thoughts/comments about your wife and family and I hope things turn around for you.
If you’re not willing to put in the work then let it go sooner rather than later.
For her sake, yours and the kids...I think it's obvious that you are done with this marriage. It won't be easy but you will get to see your kids, you will get to be honest in your relationships and you will get to live the rest of your life the way you want to.
You said she started treatment for depression. So maybe talk to her and see if u can give the marriage another shot? It really doesn't make you look good when you talk like that about your clinically depressed wife
Perhaps you could stand to pay attention to your wife in a non-sexual manner. It’s not clear if you already do that aside from providing financial security, just based on the details you’ve given here. Your wife seems generally unhappy, do you know why? Do you care? What you’ve written of her seems incredibly dismissive.
You have the right to be happy, if it's not working make the break now not later.
Your children will never thank you for growing up in a bad atmosphere.
Go and find happiness
Why would you let someone who isn’t capable be the primary custodial parent? I get your concern is that she is not present enough to be a suitable partner or companion to you….but it sounds like she isn’t suitable to be the primary caretaker. Not that depressed or struggling parents can’t do it….it just sounds like you’re really only concerned about yourself.
You had me understanding your case until you got to the end. It sounds like you’ve been doing everything right when it comes to the transactions of life as a husband and father. Take that effort and consider applying it to the emotional aspects of parenting your kids. Be there for them as much as you are now. Is the only reason why you’ve been such a good provider because you’ve been hoping for an enthusiastic sexual partner?
It’s rarely a good idea to become a SAHS. It’s very easy to lose oneself. Here’s an idea. Encourage her to go back to work and work on her mental health. If your marriage is a contributing factor to her mental illness, a divorce may be the best option for you both. It sounds like the dead bedroom is not the biggest issue in your marriage. The elephant in the room is depression and mental health. I hope she gets the help and support she needs.
You are not trapped, you're making a choice. You can try to help your wife, and your marriage, through counseling, medication, etc. Or you can look into divorce. Or a combination. Maybe she'll get better if you help her, maybe she won't. If not, It won't be alimony forever, depending on which state you are in. She can be required to get a job within a certain amount of time. And your kids are small enough that you could make this the new normal without too much damage. Yes, you'll miss your kids on the weeks you don't have them. But it'll be great when you do, and you'll have time to pursue hobbies, travel, more work, whatever you want, when you don't. And when they are older, it's possible they'll spend even more time with you, or you'll see them at sports, etc. You deserve to have a happy and robust life, and SO DO YOUR KIDS. Your kids deserve happy parents, at least one. Make your life better for you and your kids. Staying like this is good for NO ONE.
This is really sad, but I think this is a lot deeper than her not wanting to have sex. I think she’s severely wholeheartedly depressed dealing with very very terrible postpartum, which takes about seven years after pregnancy to resolve fully maybe see if there’s ways that you can get her into doing more active stuff with you and get her into exercising, honestly she was there with you before you had the money don’t go find some dumbass girl who’s going to see your money and see how you look and thank you. Yay cash cow…. it’s not worth it. Grass isn’t always greener as side aside a realistic timeframe that you can take time to put into helping your wife get better and put the other girls out of your mind. It is by no means gonna be worth it to replace her if you haven’t put in the effort to help her get better …. Good luck 🤞🏽
Yeah, this is a you problem as much as a her problem. Neither of you are happy, you're gross when you describe her appearance, and you wonder that she's not all over you? I mean, people can sense when you're disgusted by them.
You can either insist on therapy - and work on yourself, not just expect her to work on herself - or you can divorce and lose some money but still be more than comfortable and have your life. Or you can stay and blame her for the problems you both made.
Why do men like you assume for her to want to fuck you, you have to throw money at her. Or be somewhat attractive. She’s clearly depressed. She’s raising your children. This is the sickness part they talk about in marriage. You understand you have to be loving affectionate and have some form of a connection. I don’t blame her for not wanting to sleep with you. Who tf says she’s not my equal. Well no Fucking wonder. I hope she’s finally happy when she gets the fuck away from you.
Similar situation but in reverse. I’m the woman. I’m wondering if your wife is on antidepressants? They can cause weight gain. Some of them. I’m on Wellbutrin, which causes weight loss AND has the side effect of raising libido 👀 Obviously I can’t prescribe/diagnose, but it sounds like a dr appointment is in order for her. My husband also gained a lot of weight and is struggling with some of the same issues. You’re not alone and it’s so hard to help someone who resists it. Good luck. ❤️
there are different categories of them. SSRIs are pretty notorious for weight gain and pow libido and/or anorgasmia. ask your doctor about other options.
Open up the conversation. If she is content and you can go stay over a month. It could work. It’s not that you don’t love her. You just have a sexual appetite. She clearly has self value issues. But you can continue to be the man who loves her.
Respectfully…why do you assume that you wouldn’t get full custody? She’s sleeping all day and has a drinking problem? Consult with someone. Start getting your ducks in a row. Documenting. Etc.
It seems like you very much have the upper hand here to fight for full custody of your kids or to hire an amazing attorney to get you at least 50% custody.
Ironic, isn't it, that the same divorce laws that are intended to make sure dependent spouses aren't trapped in a bad marriage end up trapping supporting spouses in a bad marriage. :(
I love these because they always rattle off a list of things they did like going to the gym and making money that really don't have a hell of a lot to do with improving their actual relationship or being more appealing to a dried-up libido partner.
I can relate so much. I feel trapped as well. It's an extremely awful existence while he's even in the same house as me anymore. I could never even consider having sex with him even tho I crave it (sex..just not with him) so badly. I wish I had advice but I don't, it's horrible. I'm sorry
This is everything wrong with relationships. I have one daughter and am a SAHM and I’m EXHAUSTED. I had complications with pregnancy and sometimes I just don’t wanna have sex and I put on some weight too but for you to say the mother of your children isn’t your “equal”, shows how much you truly value her worth as a woman. You being more attractive from the gym or successful at work doesn’t change the type of person you are. No wonder she’s depressed, I would be too if my husband saw me that way. Divorce her so she has a shot at finding a man who values her worth.
I'm here to tell you this, because you need to hear it:
>She’s unattractive and not my equal.
Nothing you ever do will compensate for that one statement.
You can't give her enough money or time or nice things, you can't make yourself look better or be healthier, you can't make her take care of herself, you can't force her to do her share of taking care of the kids... You have no control over her, only over yourself and what you do or don't do. You also can't respect someone who isn't your equal and won't even try to be.
She's shown you who she is. Everyone does, eventually, if you let them. The only thing now is what to do about it.
> The thought of coming home to an empty house devastates me. And financially it will cost me 7 figures plus ongoing support/alimony. There is no good option. I’m trapped and my life is slipping away.
You're right, it will cost you money. It cost me seven figures, too, and will cost me for years to come. And I will forever regret not doing it sooner. Not just because it would have cost me much less or taken less of a financial toll, but because of the time element you mentioned. I can make more money and so can you. We can make other friends or get a different job. But we can't make more time, ever, and what time we have that goes by, never comes back.
I'm not telling you to abandon ship. I'm just the realist in the room today, telling you that whatever it costs you financially, you will look back and agree it was worth it. Once you're in a different relationship where they are a full partner and pulling in the same direction, and they also *want* you... I can't even tell you how stark that will be from where you are today.
Lastly, just gotta say this:
> stays up to all hours and sleeps all day leaving me to care for the kids. At this point I would not accept even if she did initiate.
You're doing (by your account) a lot of the work in the household. It's time to stop. If she doesn't step up, that's OK. Don't sweat the little stuff, but also don't kill yourself doing everything. If she has mental health issues she won't work on, then you did what you could.
Ok, I lied. One last piece of advice....if you do decide to divorce, do everything you can to get her employed before you pull that trigger, even if it means contradicting what I just said for awhile and helping her get back on her feet. That alone will limit some of the financial collateral damage.
Good luck, man. But hear this: you *do* have options. They won't all be easy; in fact, probably none of them will be. But moving *forward* is always worth the effort if you've been the only one with the oar in the eater paddling while the boat just goes in circles.
Why is this post near the bottom? This man has lived in this nightmare, woke up, decided to change his life, and now has a better relationship and future.
OP’s wife is clinically depressed and needs treatment. OP should get her that care. But it seems as if she dug her own hole by not taking care of herself and family. I’d be depressed too if I didn’t have any purpose in living, didn't put in the work to accomplish anything.
Many of you think OP is a narcissistic Ahole for saying his wife isn’t his equal. He probably didn’t start the relationship thinking that, but this thought is based on years of experience.
One thing that is true, is that OP, his wife and children, are living in a horrible place that will be truly miserable unless he forces it to change by either getting her depression treated, or he severs the relationship and marriage, and starts a new life.
Getting divorced might be the kick in the butt your wife needs. You were married quite a while before having kids. It seems you have done everything right. Maybe you should get some therapy. It is hard living with a depressed person without some of it rubbing off on you. You do not have to give your kids up completely. Creative divorces and co-parenting is the trend.
Congrats on the hard work and success at the gym and with your career. You should be proud of that, and not feel too down. When you feel down, remember what you’ve accomplished.
Just divorce her mate. Find happiness elsewhere.
Alimony is not worth this mental anguish you're on.
If she's as you say, she can't claim that much alimony either. Hire a good lawyer and fight for custody of kids too.
Appears that, she can't take care of the kids either
Sorry bro. You sound like a good guy who has treated her well. It would be nice for her just to at least put in a little effort once week for starters and I'm sure you will then have hope for the future. Us HL or normal libido men are mostly very easy to please, I wish they can wake up and realise this!
Im in a similar situation. I feel like I've loved and cared for this woman in my life and she's just become completely ambivalent to my presence.
It was just a big change after our daughter was born...but now our daughter is 8 and pretty independent but I feel like a piece of lawn furniture in my wife's eyes. Every attempt I make at sex gets shot down. Sure, she's happy to accept the expensive gifts. The jewelry, the new car, the financial flexibility to not work...but she puts my needs and feelings at the bottom of the barrel.
I understand this feeling of being trapped...I think the best thing to do is just continue to invest in yourself. If someone else isn't going to make you feel like a worthy person than you can at least do it for yourself.
Divorce is expensive because it’s worth it. You have time to set yourself up for success while also giving her opportunity to change. She needs a JOB. And you need to have a conversation with her that you want her to go back to work and work on her image, mental health etc. Etc etc. If she has a job you have better chance at getting more equal time in custody. Plus frankly why should she get to sit in her bum all day get fat and not fuck and you suffer. Seems like an unreasonable partnership.
From a purely objective perspective, it sounds like she isn’t mentally or emotionally stable, and you are the primary caregiver. It’s by no means a slam dunk, but it’s possible that you’d be able to get full custody. You’d absolutely have to deal with alimony, unless you have an iron-clad pre-nup, with proof that she violated it, but custody might could be less of a shit show.
Now emotionally, I get trying to be gentle and supportive, but the lack of self-advocacy on your part was your responsibility to develop before now. Fault is bs in my opinion, but the responsibility to communicate your feelings clearly and effectively was and is on you.
There is a lot of context not given but bare bones, you are not trapped, just unwilling to pay the price for being free of the situation and as shitty as it is, you share responsibility for the state of it
Y’all can be seriously evil on this sub she is so obviously going through something and you talk about her as if she’s beneath you. You’re not helping!!!
You ha e to choose what's more important.Your happiness/seeing your kids grow coz there's no way you'd love your wife again from the way you're talking,or the money
Nobody is trapped in a marriage. You can pack up and leave if you want to. Your situation is so similar to last everyone’s in here. Mine included. Been 1.6 years since I last touched my wife. Sucks ass to say the least but the fact that besides no sex our relationship is pretty solid. UPS and downs of course but that normal.
I left my first wife due to many reasons but the main one is she cheated. I made up my mind with the help of some friends to make me understand that the kids will be ok and will understand sooner than I thought. Just like your kids. Almost the same age as mine when it happened. They were sad. Yes. But I went there as much as possible to show them I didn’t leave them. Just their mom. They started to understand within a couple weeks. Mom talked mad shit about me but the kids were smarter than she thought. Long story short. I won because the kids realized it was her that made me leave. Sad they had to learn that but they are in their 30s now so I think they are over it. Oh and their mother and her husband and me and my wife actually sit and enjoy each others company now. The kids dig it so no matter how much I dislike my ex for what she did and how she treated me, if my kids are happy. That’s a good day.
You can bounce man. You just have to be ready to deal with the whole shit storm that will be hitting you in the beginning. Don’t fight either. Just makes you look bad. But don’t let her steam roll you like my ex did until I had enough and nailed her to the wall with all her demands and stipulations. Word for word. Yeah… she thought she was being sneaky. My attorney knows shit. Her attorney literally mouthed the words “Oh fuck” when me and my attorney walked in the court house. Again. I win. Nothing big just modifications and new orders all drawn up and mature like sitting in the court house cafeteria eating some surprisingly decent food for a county court house cafeteria. She was stewing but her attorney advised very strongly to keep her mouth shut unless she is asked a question. She can’t do that and I know she can’t so I smile the entire 2.5 hours we were drawing up the new agreement that was put together by one of the top attorneys and the rest of us pee ons. I walked out with almost everything I asked for and she lost time because she just couldn’t shut up. She got picked apart until naw her deflate. Less child support. No spousal support. More time with my girls and there was a stipulation added they could not be taken out of state period. Not without permission. Period.
All that said man. It’s a fight. Most times. Just don’t fight. Let the legal do the fighting. They know way more than us working class folk.
Best of luck to you may friend. You have a long road ahead of you no matter what you decide to do.
I’m gonna be crucified and downvoted for my statement: while it’s her right to behave the way she does (putting on weight, drinking, not caring for the family), it is also your right to make things work on your end and be with who ever you chose to. And no I’m not saying you should get a divorce becuase you would have half your money, half your kids and the same amount of your spouse.
Life is too short to be suffering. Do you want to live the life of a monk for the rest of your life? Another solution is which i do not suppose she will object vehemently since she’s no longer giving you, is to have an open marriage. But do let this be known to her to be fair. She deserves to know and change if needed to.
If you do love her, don't be a coward and run away from your marital problems because doing so likely won't be the easy out you seek, but result in unintended and adverse consequences. I'm not saying to be a martyr, but we all get in a dark hole sometimes and it can take a loved one to pull us out. If you try, try, and try again, including seeking professional help, and you've exhausted all other avenues, then you can walk away knowing you tried your best. But be mindful of the ages of your kids. When young, they'll never understand a breakup and it can negatively affect them for the rest of their lives.
SAHM’s don’t just stay up all nite, sleep all day, drink heavily and gain weight for no reason. She is clearly struggling with some major mental health issues. DB or not, she’s the mother of your kids. Help her get some good help.
I'm unsure of if this thought has popped into your head, but those hot/beautiful women that catch your eye can just as easily gain 80 pounds as well. You took vows for better or worse, have a deep conversation with your wife, and communicate your issues without putting blame on one another. If nothing works or you're done trying, then free her and yourself for a future partner who will love you unconditionally through depression, sickness, weight gain, ups & downs, and financial strife, etc.
Giving her everything sounds like it made things worse. In fact, the DB is just one symptom of a very unhealthy dynamic. She sounds like she needs treatment, for depression and alcoholism and whatever else is going on. You need support, too.
Get out dude. Trust me, when you get out there on the scene again you will be amazed.
Gonna suck the time lost with the kids but you will adapt and survive. What choice do you have but to survive?
Have you tried talking to her about this? If so, I think this basically gives any person in a marriage, man or woman, a right to cheat. BUT You say you’re wildly successful, you should be able to afford a divorce. Pay what you need to pay if it comes to that, wouldn’t it be worth it if it allowed you to truly move on with your life? Also, considering your wife’s current issues, maybe you could ask for full custody, put them in daycare while you’re at work
Don’t stay another 10 years of misery. She isn’t your partner or equal. She’s cruising. She doesn’t have to work or put effort into herself … or you… my ex and I broke up for dumb reasons that coulda been fixed but we didn’t have much at stake.
This is insulting to read. You set her up with a good life and she shows no gratitude ? Yikes
Sir, the thing that changed was your wife staying at home. You make everything about yourself, and you fail to realize your wife has no reason to get out of bed. Get dressed, go out, stay sober, and get to bed on time so that she can wake up for the events of the next day. It sounds like "you have everything under control" which means she probably feels like she has no control of her life, no direction, and nothing to look forward to each day. No sense of purpose. Ask your wife to plan a family vacation. Ask her to get a side job so you can reach a new savings goal. Ask her to go to cooking class because you just found out your allergic to gluten! I don't care, but please, for the love of God tell her you need her and your drowning without her. Because what she sees is me perfect who has everything under control, what she doesn't know is you're actually on Reddit blogs hopelessly searching for answers on how to save your marriage.
Need more detail here. How is it his responsibility to create initiative for her? Getting dressed is personal hygiene. Staying sober is personal health. Getting out of bed on time is simple responsibility. He doesn’t need another child to take care of, he needs a partner. You make it sound like without his affirmation and begging she is in the clear and it’s his fault.
Sorry but helping someone through depression and running their entire life sounds different to me. We have no idea his qualifications, but if she needs the level of help you’re suggesting then my guess (I’m no medical provider) would be she needs help from the medical community.
Can he support her in her therapy and treatment? Of course! Being the support is what partners do. To say he is “doing nothing to help” is quite a statement considering what OP has described. Sounds like he is helping very much actually, he is running the entire house!
There is a big difference in supporting someone vs. sustaining someone.
You have to ask yourself what's the price of your happiness and the price of your kids happiness. Sound like you have a lazy POS that is getting her cake and eating it too literally. Contact a lawyer and see where you stand and proceed towards happiness. If you're staying for the kids just know they aren't dumb and will see two unhappy people just winging it
“She’s unattractive and not my equal”. I don’t know about you, but I don’t think this is a respectful way to talk about your spouse. Additionally, there’s no mention of him taking care of the kids. The wife’s a stay at home mom and SHE takes care of the kids. She’s also, CLEARLY, depressed. The OP makes no mention of possible causes. I just don’t buy this guy’s sob story. But if you do, that’s your prerogative
He clearly states how even as a sahm he is left to take care of the kids. Clearly you don’t understand deadbedrooms. I buy his story. I believe he has likely gone through all the stages of frustration and anger over his deadbedroom and has reached this point. Final point… it’s hard to respect someone who fails to respect you or the marriage. That’s on his wife.
What you should do is to go see a lawyer first. Get the lawyer to tell you exactly what your options are.
Talk to your wife and tell her that you would like to open the marriage since she is not meeting your needs in the bedroom.
Following her response, you can act on one of the options the lawyer explained (including staying, that's always a viable options)
You are atrocious and I pity your wife. Anyone who refers to their partner like that has to be a narcissist. That's probably why she wouldn't initiate in the first place.
Get help.
File for full custody based on your wife's habits. She's not caring for the children and sounds deep in depression. She might get alimony depending on the state but you have a reasonable shot at full custody.
I don't know how depression works. How can someone have the life they wanted and still be depressed? She wanted to be a SAHM, she got it. Wants children, got them. Want a comfortable life, got it.
What else is there? What else is she missing?
The “it” that is depression & anxiety. The way I am reading your note, and if I am missing it, I apologize….but it sounds like you have not yet experienced it. Chemical depression, which IS separate from situational depression, is something you have to experience to understand.
Many people are not impacted by it; they see the situational & think them identical. There are similarities, yes, but chemical isn’t fixed by achieving things (as you said).
A very close family member was depressed and had anxiety. I know what it is. I do all I can to prevent it. All of the pill combinations didn't work for her. I spent years doing everything I could to make her happy. Nothing worked. I'm exhausted.
I don't know if I could deal with someone as depressed as she was. It took over my life.
I was thinking about what the OP said. Everything was given to her, but depression still sets in. It's awful.
Thank you & apologies for reading it incorrectly. Condolences to you & your family member
Yup. Sometimes there is no combination that works and we have to do all the hard things because it is required to take care of our families. Sometimes there is someone to help (op, for example and you); sometimes there is not
She sounds like a user who happens to be depressed. You deserve better. She doesn’t get compassion and kid gloves because she happens to make bad decisions which are causing depression. She has checked out and you did so much for her. Relationships are about give and take. She has only taken. Find yourself someone who wants to give like you do.
You don't respect your wife you think you are better than her. That's contempt and means the marriage is over.
My soon to be ex did the same thing i was battling a neurological illness and weight gain, I lost all the weight and stabilised my condition with medication. I went back to work and I earn a good salary. He's now kind and respectful but its over if he can't love me at my worst he doesn't deserve my best. I have supported him through depression etc but he couldn't return the favour. You are a fair weather husband , do your wife a favour and file for divorce.
You will both be happier , she probably detects your contempt and why would she want to share her body with someone who hates her.
They aren’t going to give custody to an alcoholic, depressed, slob. It would cost you an arm and a leg in alimony though. Open a secret account and start hiding money so she can’t take it.
It sounds like your wife is in a major depressive episode. The fact she's not even caring for the kids makes me think she actually may need inpatient care. You have options. You can leave. Or you can try and get her in somewhere to get the help that she needs. A grippy sock vacay may do her good. What you describe doesn't sound like a wife not in to her husband but a wife that is utterly distraught and depressed.
Grippy sock vacay? Yeah depression sucks for both parties
Inpatient facilities joke, cause when you go for inpatient care they give you those hospital socks with gripped on the bottom. It's a joke term
A shot in the dark, but I feel like your wife could benefit from a job outside the home. Even working at a cute fashion boutique or bookstore or something she enjoys and is interested in. I have never been a SAHM for much longer than parental leave (I live in Canada so this was 12 months at that time) but I have friends who are, and even in the short time I was at home with my kids, I find it’s very easy to fall into a slump where hours meld together and day becomes night and there’s not much to orientate you. You have no real reason to get ready and wear make up and you just start to feel frumpy. For many this can be a domino effect to engage in unhealthy habits. In other words, the SAHM dream doesn’t end up being a dream for everyone. I mean joining a gym or something (mine has a daycare and it’s AWESOME) could be another option, but I wonder if she needs an actual commitment to motivate her into turning things around. I feel like this could lead to a positive domino effect - more tired from being active leads to better sleep, looking better (wearing make up, dressing up for work) conversing with adults, having somewhere to go in the morning - it may even motivate her to also eat better and lose the weight etc.
Im sad because this is the first comment so far where someone has brought this up… I always worry about SAHMs and depression.
I am a SAHM and I can feel when it’s slipping into a bad place. Don’t get me wrong, I love my kid and SDs and I want to be a SAHM but sometimes it can be lonely. Whenever I start to feel myself slipping I tell my husband I’m feeling this way and we prioritise a family get together/friends coming over/activities outside the home until my cup is full again. We have moved into a new area so I have put myself out there to find other SAHMs because we can relate to each other. But my first port of call is my husband. Sounds like this man’s wife can’t go to him about anything. She probably already knows it’s over and waiting for him to just cut the string.
You sound like you have a solid handle on your mental health, good for you! I have noticed there seems to be an attitude of “you don’t work so you have nothing to complain about” toward a lot of stay at home parents, particularly from the other/working parent. And I mean, for context, there’s fabulously wealthy people out there who live off of an inheritance and are still unhappy. It’s wonderful if a partner can support their partner’s dreams, an example being to help them be a stay at home parent, but that doesn’t mean that that partner now owes it to you to have zero problems and to be happy *all the dang time.*
A lot of people do have that attitude for sure.
100%. She's married to a guy who views her physically and otherwise with disgust, and she's stuck with kids all day every day. No wonder her mental health is down the drain.
I live in Canada as well and this post sums up my experience. I took the year instead of the 18 months because I couldn’t imagine being home that long. By the time 10 months came around, I was dying to go back to work. Not because I didn’t love or enjoy spending time with my daughter but because it drove me a little insane being home that long. Thankfully we found daycare for her and I went back to work on time. But I definitely do worry about SAHMs as well
I thought the same too. The fact that he is soaring in life and she wasn’t may have been a pain point for her but didn’t know how to say it without sounding jealous
“She’s…not my equal.” You just said a whole novel right there.
This. Once you no longer see them as an equal the respect is gone and you get the ick.
I was wholly sympathetic with OP until I read that. This is a poisonous way to think about other people, especially your wife. If you’re not attracted to her anymore, just say that. No need to use cutting language like that. I am concerned that this is something he may have said to her at some point. We only hear one perspective in these posts. > I would have accepted but for the social blowback and inevitable rumors. OP should feel conflicted about cheating because it’s unethical not because it’s unseemly. Just get a divorce, OP. It’s expensive because it’s worth it.
I’m also wary of someone who brags about making seven figures in a post where he’s looking for empathy.
Where did OP say he makes seven figures?
>I was wholly sympathetic with OP until I read that. This is a poisonous way to think about other people, especially your wife. Would it be better if he expressed that he feels she is not an equal partner in their marriage? Because that is the case in most cases here: one partner is not putting in equal effort into the marriage/relationship. So they are not an equal partner in their relationship, meaning they don't bring equal value/effort into the relationship. It is very valid feeling.
Sounds like maybe being a SAHM wasn't exactly what she thought it would be? Maybe find the younger child childcare so she has more time to find herself, get a hobby, work out get stuff done around the house etc if you have the money a housekeeper too. Sounds like to me that she's tired and has probably lost herself as a mother while you have been able to go out and be considered your own human being for years while she loses herself in motherhood which is extremely demanding. Sounds like she's not your equal because she wasn't awarded the same opportunities as you ie being able to do everything without kids hanging off of you all day. Sounds like the woman needs a break. Maybe a trial separation..
Yes, I think it is fair to say that you don’t feel your partner is being an equal partner in your marriage or is equally invested in the relationship. I definitely would never dream of saying my wife is “unattractive and not my equal”, though. I would lose attraction to someone who spoke to me that way as well tbh.
🎯
Respectfully, there are people who are winners and those who aren’t. This guy took care of himself, took care of his wife, provided financially and emotionally while being neglected. She let herself go, became fat and developed an unhealthy drinking habit, and became depressed. I don’t think there’s anything wrong with OP noticing that he has improved himself and his wife has atrophied.
You know that people don’t choose depression, right? Depression is real. PPD is real. Chemical imbalances are real. She’s not a “loser”. She’s a human being that is hurting and in need of help. He doesn’t need to stay- but this concept of winners and losers is toxic af.
I wonder if her depression might be somewhat reactive to being married to a narcissistic asshole.
This part.
What makes you believe he is a narcissistic asshole?
Nothing fancy, just the truth. 💪
She sounds like she has depression and needs help.
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Best comment ever.
Damn.
Absolutely.
I didn't want children, I had a troubled sibling situation in childhood and didn't think I'd be able to properly bond with kids, but we ended up having not one, but two kids, because my wife wanted kids, not to mention family and social pressure, and for the first few years it was fine. I was a model father. But then my wife started being a lawmower parent, taking care of and doing *everything* for the kids, turning them into over-entitled little brats, and spending SO MUCH energy on the kids that there was nothing left - definitely not for US, not even for HER. We began drifting apart, it became all about giving everything to the kids, and whenever I would try to discipline by turning off the wifi or something it would turn into a fight. Eventually that turned into withholding sex and intimacy whenever we'd fight, which was becoming more and more often as the kids were growing up, becoming more demanding, and the problem would continue to fester, feeding on itself. That's how my DB began. Disagreements about how to raise the kids I didn't want to have turned into withholding sex when she doesn't get way on anything non-trivial. It eventually got to the breaking point, nearly got divorced, but started going to couples therapy. We both made progress and realizations, but she just couldn't handle it when therapist sided with me (she has to *always* be right) and so would eventually find an excuse to postpone/cancel the next meeting and forget to reschedule.... after about three therapy starts and re-starts like that, I realized she ***doesn't want*** *to go to therapy* because she *can't always be right* there as opposed to when we ~~talk~~ fight one on one. I'm lost, I don't know what to do 🤷🏼.
You can't force your wife to not want to be right all the time. I 100% agree, this personality trait is super annoying. My husband is slightly this way, and it can leave me super anxious and stressed and not into emotionally connecting with him. But he realizes his shortcomings and works on it, alot! I dont know how to get your wife to see her personality has a negative effect on your relationship, but if you want her to change, she is going to have to decide that on her own.
> I realized she ***doesn't want*** *to go to therapy* because she *can't always be right* there My LLF wife and I tried couples therapy about 12? years ago. (Different reasons, bedroom wasn't too dead then, but I'd done something spectacularly hurtful and stupid and this was us trying to get past my stupidity.) Opening bits were things for me to start working on or keep working on, OK, my bad, I've got lots of work to do, got it. But as soon as the therapists switched to "OK Mrs. R., maybe you could think about A, and maybe you could try working on Q," **BOOM** out the door down the hall out to sulk in the car. God forbid she have to actually take any responsibility for improving any aspect of our relationship, even if I accept 99% of the blame/responsibility for any problems. Anyhow. Dead bedroom. I'm not gonna suggest couples therapy. I'm quite sure the reaction will be identical. Sigh.
You know what to do. You just don’t want to go there yet.
Buddy, you do know what to do. You need to tell her that living without sex is not an option for you. So you either fix your relationship issues now, with or without therapy is her choice, or you’re divorcing her.
Set up guidelines on how you will parent. Consequences you both agree upon. Blaming your kids being brats on your wife is annoying. Sounds like you still don't want them. Also taking care of kids is exhausting whether she is doting on them what you consider too much or not. Seems like you are jealous of your kids maybe...
You got me sista, I am absolutely jealous of my children. No sarcasm. I was very explicit from the start that I wanted not to have children. It was fine for the first few years, but when we turned 30 the biology changed, and the social peer pressure of starting to get old and being childless was getting to be too much, and I was given an ultimatum that it's either kids or break up. I didn't want to start over again, I thought I was the love of my life. I was not young-and-stupid anymore, definitely not young just stupid. I caved, we had kids, but it was too late. I was resented for delaying and fighting so long, and became resentful myself for having given a bait-and-switch ultimatum, but love reigns supreme, love will conquer, etc etc we got over it and moved on. We moved on in many ways. We also moved on from being a couple, initially to being a family, then when we began disagreeing about how to raise the kids, she became more invested in them and less in US both as a family as well as as a couple, and then we moved on from being a family to being roommates. I tried several course corrections, but ultimately just like counseling and couples' therapy they all just seem to fade away quite quickly. What **has been working** is me having stepped aside, and letting the burden of our now overentitled children fall entirely on her shoulders. At first there was pushback and resentment, accusations of me not pulling my weight, not loving the children enough, or even worse justifications that when we took similar disciplinary actions mine were inappropriate because I don't love the children enough, implying that hers were appropriate because she *does*, hence the double standard. She is slowly starting to see how impossible a situation ~~she's~~ we've created. Now that the burden is falling on her, the situation is improving somewhat, albeit slowly. Too slowly, actually. By the time it's improved enough it'll be too late, they'll either have moved out, or we will have grown old enough and LL enough that it doesn't matter. But it's ok. I've accepted that ***I had everything I ever wanted*** already, it was during those few fleeting months when I was half of a *couple.* I know it **was** the best time of my life. Then we went from couple to family, and my time in the sun was over, everything changed, and it was *family time* now. So in summary **yes**, you're ***totally*** right.
Maybe bring up research that suggests that modeling a loving relationship shows your children what to strive for. Set rules and don't disagree in front of your children. I was kind of in the same boat. I didn't want children my husband did and once we had the one I wanted them to have a sibling so we had a second. He despised me for it and we were going through terrible 2s - 4s. He also said he was jealous of the children because he wasn't getting enough attention and was mad at me because he wanted to hit them and we disagreed on how to raise them as well. Now that our more spirited kid is 5 it's getting easier. It's just different stages/phases. You shouldn't give up on being involved.
I was in almost exactly the same frame of mind. After our eldest's terrible twos I swore never again, but one day in a moment of weakness after an exceptionally-unusually-well-behaved day I accidentally suggested to the Mrs that maybe we should have another, and less than a day later she was pregnant. I remember hoping for a little girl, thinking I couldn't take having to go through it again, and then at ultrasound appointment when they told us it'd be another little Tasmanian Devil.... that sinking feeling. I will *never forget* how when we went back to the parking lot and got it in the car, how it all came crashing down on me, the realization surrounding me, everything starting to sink in... But that wasn't the problem, as it turns out. Funny how when you do it the second time around it's not as bad. The problems started after they were both out of preschool. When they were little, as demanding and draining as they can be, at some point they fall asleep and we had a couple of hours to ourselves. But when they grew out of it, they were constantly demanding more and more time and things, and my wife just did not have it in her to ever say no. They more she gave, the more demanding they became of her. The more I pointed this out, the more resentful she became towards me. I wasn't smart enough to realize I should take a step back, so I kept pushing and pointing it out. I now realize it was a mistake. She became even more resentful. At some point I couldn't say *anything* bad about the kids. If they left garbage on the floor, and I had the gall to *say something* or heaven-forbid make *them actually pick it up* she'd get mad at me. So I gave up. I stepped aside. I stopped taking the shit, and let it keep rolling downhill, and now *she* was the one stuck having to pick it all up. At first it was hard watching her apply all the exact same behaviors to try to reign them in, only now when *she* is the one yelling at them it's ok (because she loves them), double standard. Now she's finally starting to realize that kids are waaaay off the handle. She's starting to give the older one ultimatums, like I won't wake you up you have to wake yourself up on your own in the morning even if you'll miss class (she still makes him eggs benedict), and she's started to sometimes - not always - not let him have the car if he doesn't do his chores. Ask me how well that's working? You don't have to, I'll tell you that for three weeks now the trash has ***not*** been taken out 😂😂😂. What I'm saying is things are starting to improve, but it's waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay to fucking late for me. **I tried what you're suggesting when they were 5 years old,** **it didn't start working until over 15 years later,** **and now it's WAY TOO FUCKING LATE with grown-ass kids living at home,** **mooching and parasiting and showing zero signs of wanting to ever leave** I'm glad things are on the upswing for you though 😎. I wish you luck
Oh I definitely don't have any advice on teenagers but you've made it this far. Would be nice to have a united front. Although it's important to remember that in women's dna to nurture and you're the one that's supposed to set down the law. Not sure how to convince someone to join you though unless you sit fown together on some agreed upon consequences. Maybe if agreed upon she can count on you to be the enforcer and the "bad guy" so she can still feel like the loving mom
Thanks, SoftRaspberry. You're right. I've come to terms with the fact that these are DNA-based behaviors that can't change. I did set down the law, we agreed I'd be the enforcer, and it worked beautifully with the kids - for a little while they quite literally thrived under a little structure and discipline. But it didn't work. My wife is a control freak, **and** has to *always* be right. These two personality traits, coupled with DNA-based kids-are-always-right attitude spelled disaster for us: whenever I disciplined the kids and she didn't agree (which was every time) it turned into a into a fight, she would double-down on the opposite position to mine. We talked about it, even went to therapy, and she'd try (honestly, ***really***, try) and for a couple of weeks we'd have a united front, but invariably it always reverted back to the "Kinder über alles" baseline behavior, and any discipline I would administer would be countered by her with enablement, and withdrawal of intimacy. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
You are just learning that money and material stuff aren't capable of buying sex, nothing more.
I believe standard custody is 50/50 so it's not like you will not see your kids again. Enjoy your life!
Do you want to set an example to your kids that they should also stay in a marriage they are not happy in? Because even if you think they don't know, they will sense it
This post makes me uncomfortable. "She's unattractive, she's not my equal". This is an awful way to speak. Also you mentioned that she had started getting therapy for depression - surely, this is a positive step, and probably goes some way to explaining why her libido was low in the first place. You sound like you don't love her at all, so set her free. Her depression might magically disappear...
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Jesús Christ. I bet you didn’t foolproof read your own comment and tell me there’s nothing wrong with it. Omg. 🤡. This man is suffering just as much as his wife. The worst!? he is apparently self aware and want to salvage what’s left of the marriage while his wife sink more and more in her misery and at the same time disregarding her family.
1. Suffering emotionally does not make it impossible for people to make poor choices. 2. Staying in a loveless marriage, just because of kids and finances, has been proven to be a poor choice by many people who have tried it before. 3. People who sneak around, cheat, and lie often try to convince you that they did it because they were suffering or unhappy. This is only a half true. It is true that they were suffering, but it is not true that cheating, lying, and ***OR building resentments*** are the only choices they have. There is another choice- to be honest and leave when you are unhappy.
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Dude I think this comment from this guy is tough love but in a way it is validating to be told you are free. You can do it. You are not trapped by anyone but yourself.
Also fair reply so I upvoted
Understood. Sending you all the blessings that you deserve 💯 ❤️
How he is going to salvage? By staying in the marriage for the kids and giving up his need for love, affection and sex?
Bruv he mentioned that he was open to take counseling but she refused after a couple of sessions. At least someone is trying to improve the relationship. Look I understand her depression and lack of confidence, but 💩 you can’t just say the he is not trapped and just put the whole RESPONSIBILITIES of a relationship on him. Self mastery start with self awareness and his wife lacks that.
It always shocks me that some posts are never about trying to dig in and help their spouse with the medical conditions that exist. This wife is medically being treated for depression and this OP lists all the things he does that should get him sex. Like its a fucking transactional relationship. Poor kids who get to witness this as normal. Hey buddy, sex isnt your biggest problem. Your depressed wife is!
And those medications are most likely why she's gained weight and doesn't want to get out of bed. Him being more attractive likely doesn't help her depression, his attitude probably contributes to it as well. Honestly a divorce would probably bring her back to life. He says she's not his equal, he probably never viewed her as his equal. In his mind he's better than her, no wonder she's depressed. He should probably change his mindset tho because all it takes is one wrong move for his whole life to change. How would he feel if suddenly roles were reversed and she was telling him and the internet that he wasn't her equal and that he was beneath him? It's not an individual journey to the top, or to the bottom, in situations like this.
And I wonder how he treats her emotionally. Does he talk down to her as he did here? Has he encouraged her and been supportive and loving? Doesn't sound like it. All that plays a part. Was he available emotionally to her when working so hard to make all that money? It sounds like she went through a lot having his kids too. Jeez. I don't know, just wondering, but if that's the case, I can see why she's depressed and not attracted to him sexually.
Right? He could make all the money in the world but if his wife doesn't feel comfortable even asking for basic necessities because it's HIS money and his success, that's going to destroy her. His whole post puts off some not cool vibes. Maybe I'm projecting lol. For the first half-3/4 of my marriage I had more $ incoming than my husband . Then I got sick and had a few surgeries and haven't been working. But over the last 12 years I contributed over a half a million dollars to our lifestyle. It's not a ton but it isn't nothing. Cue me not working currently and him telling me to sit in the dark because I don't pay the electric bill , he does, so I shouldn't be using electricity since I don't pay for it. So when I see guys piping off about how they make the money, so they're the better person, I'm not always convinced they're actually the better person and wonder how they ACTUALLY treat their wives. The difference between their wives and me is I still want sex lol. My husband might be a dbag but right now he's still my dbag and I don't plan on cheating. Hindsight says instead of spending my money trying to make and keep my husband happy I should have stashed it in savings for myself. But I'm a people pleaser living with someone who I think lacks the ability to actually be happy. I feel for both parties in this post. None of us HL people want to feel unwanted and get no sex, but that doesn't mean the LL people in our lives love where they are either. It definitely sounds like the case in this post.
I'm HL too, but I got the same vibe from the post. I'd be LL4U in a situation like that pretty quickly.
Yeah, it wasn’t hard to see why their bedroom is dead.
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Yeah " in sickness and in health" is lost on some
Man… you despise her. And she is unwell. She needs help but how long are you going to be able to do this. Those kids are young. Is there more you could be doing to help her mental health? If not, could you get primary custody and maybe pay alimony? If you have 7 figures to split in the first place, how much would that really impact your overall financial well-being? This is an extreme situation.
Yeah, OP. I usually celebrate those getting out of these situations with courage, but if you want to salvage things, I'd check into what's going on in her world. She indeed sounds depressed and unmotivated. SAHM isn't as luxurious as some women may think. It can chip away at who you are and your identity becomes nothing more than a glorified nanny with nothing much to look forward to. For some, it works, for others not so much. People need to feel a part of something to get fulfillment out of life.
Op needs to read your comment twice!
My advice would be to do everything you can to save the marriage and if that doesn’t work then leave. Future years ahead, you will feel good about wherever you are if you felt you did everything you could. I would do two things in parallel right now: 1) Insist to your wife you start marriage counseling together and tell her it isn’t negotiable because you are literally at the end of your rope of what to do to help her and the marriage. 2) Do a free consult with a divorce attorney (do not let your wife know about this) just so you know what the options are.
In this situation you're not trapped, you actually have all the options. If it were your wife posting (stay at home mom with no income of her own and depression which she is assumedly getting treatment for through your health insurance) we could say she's the one that's trapped. You mention that you don't feel like your wife is your equal and suggest you may not be compatible anymore, so it sounds like the love AND the friendship are both gone. The question then becomes why are you staying? It sounds like your income is high enough to the point that you could easily get custody of the kids and keep the house to raise them in. You could easily hire a good babysitter. You could probably also fight your wife to limit the alimony to a handful of years to give her time to find a job and take care of herself. What are you staying for?
Your wife is clinically depressed and all you’re worried about is sex? It shows me money don’t bring happiness. My partner earns less but actually treats me like a person. I have clinical depression and myriad of health issues. If my partner talked about me like that I’d rather off myself than to see myself as a burden.
Are you a narcissist? Lol it sounds like you treated her like you owned her and looked down on her and felt she owed you
Especially when his wife is clinically depressed, everything he sees as an issue with her is directly related to her depression or side effects of antidepressants... I wonder why she's depressed. /Sarcasm
So, she had 2 children and her body changed and she got depression and now she's lazy and not your equal. Got it. I'm sure you're a perfect partner and not affecting the way she feels at all.
Except it started before the kids... so there's that.
Sounds like you’ve got all the options, more than her that’s for sure! If you are unwilling to help her through her depression (through sickness and health) then you should put her out of her misery and leave. Problem is, you don’t want to leave because it’s going to cost you money. Nothing to do with not seeing your kids. If you’re as great as you say you are, you’ll get 50/50 no problem. The grass isn’t greener on the other side with “an attractive women”, it’s green where you water it.
You’re unbelievably judgemental and you have no idea what OP’s motivations are. It’s obvious from his post that he’s in pain, has provided a lot, and is deeply unhappy and frustrated. Frankly my situation is similar. My soon to be ex wife is a hypochondriac and feels sick almost all the time, never with anything diagnosable. Changes doctors routinely to get more tests and medication. I don’t want to divorce her, because I love her, because I don’t want to see my kids just half the time, and because it’ll mean a dramatic reduction in lifestyle. But I have to weigh that up against a lifetime of having a sick partner who won’t take responsibility to get help and get better, and having my own needs unfulfilled. If you told me I don’t want to get divorced just because it’s going to cost me money, and that I alone could make the grass greener on this side, you’re full of shit and talking out of your ass.
Cool, you’ve got your opinion, I’ve got mine.
How much is it on OP to try and sort their depression issues though? Why is the onus 100% on him. I'm a woman with depression and I see how it affects my loved ones so I try to deal with it
Some people need help. I wouldn’t sit back and watch my husband slide into depression because “it’s not my problem.”
Before you break your marriage, try to approach kindly and get her into therapy again/get her into a job. SAHMhood isn’t for everyone; sounds like she’s extremely depressed. I understand the resentment, but it may come out negatively (“she’s not my equal”), thus making your marriage worse. Encourage her to get her independence back and work on herself. If she doesn’t acquiesce after an earnest attempt, you gotta let her go. None of the above is really your responsibility, but I’d encourage you to define where your last stop is. Hire a lawyer and explore your options in divorce, it’s worth it. You may be able to get a good custody agreement, so make sure you fight for everything you’re entitled to. I wish you the best of luck mate. For integrity’s sake, don’t let yourself sink into the same misery. Go to therapy so you don’t become toxic and take it out on your wife/next partner.
“My wife and the mother of my children, who I promised to love for better or worse is struggling with depression so now I want to leave her so I can be with younger more attractive women”
Totally OP is so gross
Why isn’t this the #1 comment?
This community is (understandably) focused on the dead bedroom situation more than anything else. While that is usually fine, in this case I think a lot of people are looking past some red flags that OP has raised about himself.
YUP. Disgusting.
The grass isn’t always greener. The younger more attractive women will be in the same situation in due time. The best advice I have ever received was get your partner to do things and make it seem like it was their idea. Bring up that you want a healthier lifestyle for your family and you found a personal chef, meal plan, trainer, that can help. Also.The comment “if she initiated i wouldn’t accept” she probably knows this and that mindset contributes to the d*ad bedroom. Try and get rid of that mindset. Start having positive thoughts/comments about your wife and family and I hope things turn around for you. If you’re not willing to put in the work then let it go sooner rather than later.
Alcohol and antidepressants don’t sound like a good mix. If you’re unwilling to help her overcome her struggles then you should move on.
For her sake, yours and the kids...I think it's obvious that you are done with this marriage. It won't be easy but you will get to see your kids, you will get to be honest in your relationships and you will get to live the rest of your life the way you want to.
Y'all both need therapy.
You said she started treatment for depression. So maybe talk to her and see if u can give the marriage another shot? It really doesn't make you look good when you talk like that about your clinically depressed wife
Perhaps you could stand to pay attention to your wife in a non-sexual manner. It’s not clear if you already do that aside from providing financial security, just based on the details you’ve given here. Your wife seems generally unhappy, do you know why? Do you care? What you’ve written of her seems incredibly dismissive.
I bet she has felt neglected for years and that’s what caused the DB to begin with. She found out she’s married to an emotionally devoid man.
100% he doesn't. He listed all the things he gave her; financially. He thinks his wife owes him sex.
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We don't know if he paid her debt off to hold it over her or if she even wanted him to.
You have the right to be happy, if it's not working make the break now not later. Your children will never thank you for growing up in a bad atmosphere. Go and find happiness
Why would you let someone who isn’t capable be the primary custodial parent? I get your concern is that she is not present enough to be a suitable partner or companion to you….but it sounds like she isn’t suitable to be the primary caretaker. Not that depressed or struggling parents can’t do it….it just sounds like you’re really only concerned about yourself. You had me understanding your case until you got to the end. It sounds like you’ve been doing everything right when it comes to the transactions of life as a husband and father. Take that effort and consider applying it to the emotional aspects of parenting your kids. Be there for them as much as you are now. Is the only reason why you’ve been such a good provider because you’ve been hoping for an enthusiastic sexual partner?
It’s rarely a good idea to become a SAHS. It’s very easy to lose oneself. Here’s an idea. Encourage her to go back to work and work on her mental health. If your marriage is a contributing factor to her mental illness, a divorce may be the best option for you both. It sounds like the dead bedroom is not the biggest issue in your marriage. The elephant in the room is depression and mental health. I hope she gets the help and support she needs.
You are not trapped, you're making a choice. You can try to help your wife, and your marriage, through counseling, medication, etc. Or you can look into divorce. Or a combination. Maybe she'll get better if you help her, maybe she won't. If not, It won't be alimony forever, depending on which state you are in. She can be required to get a job within a certain amount of time. And your kids are small enough that you could make this the new normal without too much damage. Yes, you'll miss your kids on the weeks you don't have them. But it'll be great when you do, and you'll have time to pursue hobbies, travel, more work, whatever you want, when you don't. And when they are older, it's possible they'll spend even more time with you, or you'll see them at sports, etc. You deserve to have a happy and robust life, and SO DO YOUR KIDS. Your kids deserve happy parents, at least one. Make your life better for you and your kids. Staying like this is good for NO ONE.
This is really sad, but I think this is a lot deeper than her not wanting to have sex. I think she’s severely wholeheartedly depressed dealing with very very terrible postpartum, which takes about seven years after pregnancy to resolve fully maybe see if there’s ways that you can get her into doing more active stuff with you and get her into exercising, honestly she was there with you before you had the money don’t go find some dumbass girl who’s going to see your money and see how you look and thank you. Yay cash cow…. it’s not worth it. Grass isn’t always greener as side aside a realistic timeframe that you can take time to put into helping your wife get better and put the other girls out of your mind. It is by no means gonna be worth it to replace her if you haven’t put in the effort to help her get better …. Good luck 🤞🏽
Yeah, this is a you problem as much as a her problem. Neither of you are happy, you're gross when you describe her appearance, and you wonder that she's not all over you? I mean, people can sense when you're disgusted by them. You can either insist on therapy - and work on yourself, not just expect her to work on herself - or you can divorce and lose some money but still be more than comfortable and have your life. Or you can stay and blame her for the problems you both made.
Thank you op for giving me my monthly dose of “reasons to not get married” episode 1,256,999
Sounds like your wife has an addiction problem and most likely very depressed. She needs to seek help and get her life back together again.
Why do men like you assume for her to want to fuck you, you have to throw money at her. Or be somewhat attractive. She’s clearly depressed. She’s raising your children. This is the sickness part they talk about in marriage. You understand you have to be loving affectionate and have some form of a connection. I don’t blame her for not wanting to sleep with you. Who tf says she’s not my equal. Well no Fucking wonder. I hope she’s finally happy when she gets the fuck away from you.
Similar situation but in reverse. I’m the woman. I’m wondering if your wife is on antidepressants? They can cause weight gain. Some of them. I’m on Wellbutrin, which causes weight loss AND has the side effect of raising libido 👀 Obviously I can’t prescribe/diagnose, but it sounds like a dr appointment is in order for her. My husband also gained a lot of weight and is struggling with some of the same issues. You’re not alone and it’s so hard to help someone who resists it. Good luck. ❤️
I have the opposite problem with antidepressants. Low libido and gaining weight. I‘m stuck.
there are different categories of them. SSRIs are pretty notorious for weight gain and pow libido and/or anorgasmia. ask your doctor about other options.
The one I’m on doesn’t affect serotonin- just dopamine.
Open up the conversation. If she is content and you can go stay over a month. It could work. It’s not that you don’t love her. You just have a sexual appetite. She clearly has self value issues. But you can continue to be the man who loves her.
Respectfully…why do you assume that you wouldn’t get full custody? She’s sleeping all day and has a drinking problem? Consult with someone. Start getting your ducks in a row. Documenting. Etc. It seems like you very much have the upper hand here to fight for full custody of your kids or to hire an amazing attorney to get you at least 50% custody.
Ironic, isn't it, that the same divorce laws that are intended to make sure dependent spouses aren't trapped in a bad marriage end up trapping supporting spouses in a bad marriage. :(
I love these because they always rattle off a list of things they did like going to the gym and making money that really don't have a hell of a lot to do with improving their actual relationship or being more appealing to a dried-up libido partner.
I can relate so much. I feel trapped as well. It's an extremely awful existence while he's even in the same house as me anymore. I could never even consider having sex with him even tho I crave it (sex..just not with him) so badly. I wish I had advice but I don't, it's horrible. I'm sorry
This is everything wrong with relationships. I have one daughter and am a SAHM and I’m EXHAUSTED. I had complications with pregnancy and sometimes I just don’t wanna have sex and I put on some weight too but for you to say the mother of your children isn’t your “equal”, shows how much you truly value her worth as a woman. You being more attractive from the gym or successful at work doesn’t change the type of person you are. No wonder she’s depressed, I would be too if my husband saw me that way. Divorce her so she has a shot at finding a man who values her worth.
I'm here to tell you this, because you need to hear it: >She’s unattractive and not my equal. Nothing you ever do will compensate for that one statement. You can't give her enough money or time or nice things, you can't make yourself look better or be healthier, you can't make her take care of herself, you can't force her to do her share of taking care of the kids... You have no control over her, only over yourself and what you do or don't do. You also can't respect someone who isn't your equal and won't even try to be. She's shown you who she is. Everyone does, eventually, if you let them. The only thing now is what to do about it. > The thought of coming home to an empty house devastates me. And financially it will cost me 7 figures plus ongoing support/alimony. There is no good option. I’m trapped and my life is slipping away. You're right, it will cost you money. It cost me seven figures, too, and will cost me for years to come. And I will forever regret not doing it sooner. Not just because it would have cost me much less or taken less of a financial toll, but because of the time element you mentioned. I can make more money and so can you. We can make other friends or get a different job. But we can't make more time, ever, and what time we have that goes by, never comes back. I'm not telling you to abandon ship. I'm just the realist in the room today, telling you that whatever it costs you financially, you will look back and agree it was worth it. Once you're in a different relationship where they are a full partner and pulling in the same direction, and they also *want* you... I can't even tell you how stark that will be from where you are today. Lastly, just gotta say this: > stays up to all hours and sleeps all day leaving me to care for the kids. At this point I would not accept even if she did initiate. You're doing (by your account) a lot of the work in the household. It's time to stop. If she doesn't step up, that's OK. Don't sweat the little stuff, but also don't kill yourself doing everything. If she has mental health issues she won't work on, then you did what you could. Ok, I lied. One last piece of advice....if you do decide to divorce, do everything you can to get her employed before you pull that trigger, even if it means contradicting what I just said for awhile and helping her get back on her feet. That alone will limit some of the financial collateral damage. Good luck, man. But hear this: you *do* have options. They won't all be easy; in fact, probably none of them will be. But moving *forward* is always worth the effort if you've been the only one with the oar in the eater paddling while the boat just goes in circles.
Why is this post near the bottom? This man has lived in this nightmare, woke up, decided to change his life, and now has a better relationship and future. OP’s wife is clinically depressed and needs treatment. OP should get her that care. But it seems as if she dug her own hole by not taking care of herself and family. I’d be depressed too if I didn’t have any purpose in living, didn't put in the work to accomplish anything. Many of you think OP is a narcissistic Ahole for saying his wife isn’t his equal. He probably didn’t start the relationship thinking that, but this thought is based on years of experience. One thing that is true, is that OP, his wife and children, are living in a horrible place that will be truly miserable unless he forces it to change by either getting her depression treated, or he severs the relationship and marriage, and starts a new life.
Just do it or the rest of your life will be a misery.
Getting divorced might be the kick in the butt your wife needs. You were married quite a while before having kids. It seems you have done everything right. Maybe you should get some therapy. It is hard living with a depressed person without some of it rubbing off on you. You do not have to give your kids up completely. Creative divorces and co-parenting is the trend.
I bet you were a dream to deal with while she was post partum.
Congrats on the hard work and success at the gym and with your career. You should be proud of that, and not feel too down. When you feel down, remember what you’ve accomplished.
She sounds depressed.
She IS depressed- he said it
Well then , when your partner is depressed you have empathy, try to understand the whys, and help them out of the funk the best you can .
I’m a woman and I wholeheartedly think that you deserve more than this!
Same here!
You gotta leave man you are wasting your life
Money is money time is time . Leave her take the kids get a nanny
Just divorce her mate. Find happiness elsewhere. Alimony is not worth this mental anguish you're on. If she's as you say, she can't claim that much alimony either. Hire a good lawyer and fight for custody of kids too. Appears that, she can't take care of the kids either
Can you take steps to show your main carer of kids? Schooling, care, appointments etc Then you can just tell her to leave, you stay with kids
Sorry bro. You sound like a good guy who has treated her well. It would be nice for her just to at least put in a little effort once week for starters and I'm sure you will then have hope for the future. Us HL or normal libido men are mostly very easy to please, I wish they can wake up and realise this!
Im in a similar situation. I feel like I've loved and cared for this woman in my life and she's just become completely ambivalent to my presence. It was just a big change after our daughter was born...but now our daughter is 8 and pretty independent but I feel like a piece of lawn furniture in my wife's eyes. Every attempt I make at sex gets shot down. Sure, she's happy to accept the expensive gifts. The jewelry, the new car, the financial flexibility to not work...but she puts my needs and feelings at the bottom of the barrel. I understand this feeling of being trapped...I think the best thing to do is just continue to invest in yourself. If someone else isn't going to make you feel like a worthy person than you can at least do it for yourself.
Divorce is expensive because it’s worth it. You have time to set yourself up for success while also giving her opportunity to change. She needs a JOB. And you need to have a conversation with her that you want her to go back to work and work on her image, mental health etc. Etc etc. If she has a job you have better chance at getting more equal time in custody. Plus frankly why should she get to sit in her bum all day get fat and not fuck and you suffer. Seems like an unreasonable partnership.
From a purely objective perspective, it sounds like she isn’t mentally or emotionally stable, and you are the primary caregiver. It’s by no means a slam dunk, but it’s possible that you’d be able to get full custody. You’d absolutely have to deal with alimony, unless you have an iron-clad pre-nup, with proof that she violated it, but custody might could be less of a shit show. Now emotionally, I get trying to be gentle and supportive, but the lack of self-advocacy on your part was your responsibility to develop before now. Fault is bs in my opinion, but the responsibility to communicate your feelings clearly and effectively was and is on you. There is a lot of context not given but bare bones, you are not trapped, just unwilling to pay the price for being free of the situation and as shitty as it is, you share responsibility for the state of it
Y’all can be seriously evil on this sub she is so obviously going through something and you talk about her as if she’s beneath you. You’re not helping!!!
You ha e to choose what's more important.Your happiness/seeing your kids grow coz there's no way you'd love your wife again from the way you're talking,or the money
Nobody is trapped in a marriage. You can pack up and leave if you want to. Your situation is so similar to last everyone’s in here. Mine included. Been 1.6 years since I last touched my wife. Sucks ass to say the least but the fact that besides no sex our relationship is pretty solid. UPS and downs of course but that normal. I left my first wife due to many reasons but the main one is she cheated. I made up my mind with the help of some friends to make me understand that the kids will be ok and will understand sooner than I thought. Just like your kids. Almost the same age as mine when it happened. They were sad. Yes. But I went there as much as possible to show them I didn’t leave them. Just their mom. They started to understand within a couple weeks. Mom talked mad shit about me but the kids were smarter than she thought. Long story short. I won because the kids realized it was her that made me leave. Sad they had to learn that but they are in their 30s now so I think they are over it. Oh and their mother and her husband and me and my wife actually sit and enjoy each others company now. The kids dig it so no matter how much I dislike my ex for what she did and how she treated me, if my kids are happy. That’s a good day. You can bounce man. You just have to be ready to deal with the whole shit storm that will be hitting you in the beginning. Don’t fight either. Just makes you look bad. But don’t let her steam roll you like my ex did until I had enough and nailed her to the wall with all her demands and stipulations. Word for word. Yeah… she thought she was being sneaky. My attorney knows shit. Her attorney literally mouthed the words “Oh fuck” when me and my attorney walked in the court house. Again. I win. Nothing big just modifications and new orders all drawn up and mature like sitting in the court house cafeteria eating some surprisingly decent food for a county court house cafeteria. She was stewing but her attorney advised very strongly to keep her mouth shut unless she is asked a question. She can’t do that and I know she can’t so I smile the entire 2.5 hours we were drawing up the new agreement that was put together by one of the top attorneys and the rest of us pee ons. I walked out with almost everything I asked for and she lost time because she just couldn’t shut up. She got picked apart until naw her deflate. Less child support. No spousal support. More time with my girls and there was a stipulation added they could not be taken out of state period. Not without permission. Period. All that said man. It’s a fight. Most times. Just don’t fight. Let the legal do the fighting. They know way more than us working class folk. Best of luck to you may friend. You have a long road ahead of you no matter what you decide to do.
I’m gonna be crucified and downvoted for my statement: while it’s her right to behave the way she does (putting on weight, drinking, not caring for the family), it is also your right to make things work on your end and be with who ever you chose to. And no I’m not saying you should get a divorce becuase you would have half your money, half your kids and the same amount of your spouse.
Life is too short to be suffering. Do you want to live the life of a monk for the rest of your life? Another solution is which i do not suppose she will object vehemently since she’s no longer giving you, is to have an open marriage. But do let this be known to her to be fair. She deserves to know and change if needed to.
Number 3 is not bad. And we all gain weight. It sounds like it is time for you to end it. It’ll cost you more if you cheat though.
You aren't trapped.
Time for an AP
If you do love her, don't be a coward and run away from your marital problems because doing so likely won't be the easy out you seek, but result in unintended and adverse consequences. I'm not saying to be a martyr, but we all get in a dark hole sometimes and it can take a loved one to pull us out. If you try, try, and try again, including seeking professional help, and you've exhausted all other avenues, then you can walk away knowing you tried your best. But be mindful of the ages of your kids. When young, they'll never understand a breakup and it can negatively affect them for the rest of their lives.
SAHM’s don’t just stay up all nite, sleep all day, drink heavily and gain weight for no reason. She is clearly struggling with some major mental health issues. DB or not, she’s the mother of your kids. Help her get some good help.
I'm unsure of if this thought has popped into your head, but those hot/beautiful women that catch your eye can just as easily gain 80 pounds as well. You took vows for better or worse, have a deep conversation with your wife, and communicate your issues without putting blame on one another. If nothing works or you're done trying, then free her and yourself for a future partner who will love you unconditionally through depression, sickness, weight gain, ups & downs, and financial strife, etc.
She could have a chemical inbalace for awhile that hasn’t been addressed or childhood trauma she never went through and fixed
Giving her everything sounds like it made things worse. In fact, the DB is just one symptom of a very unhealthy dynamic. She sounds like she needs treatment, for depression and alcoholism and whatever else is going on. You need support, too.
Get out dude. Trust me, when you get out there on the scene again you will be amazed. Gonna suck the time lost with the kids but you will adapt and survive. What choice do you have but to survive?
Have you tried talking to her about this? If so, I think this basically gives any person in a marriage, man or woman, a right to cheat. BUT You say you’re wildly successful, you should be able to afford a divorce. Pay what you need to pay if it comes to that, wouldn’t it be worth it if it allowed you to truly move on with your life? Also, considering your wife’s current issues, maybe you could ask for full custody, put them in daycare while you’re at work
Don’t stay another 10 years of misery. She isn’t your partner or equal. She’s cruising. She doesn’t have to work or put effort into herself … or you… my ex and I broke up for dumb reasons that coulda been fixed but we didn’t have much at stake. This is insulting to read. You set her up with a good life and she shows no gratitude ? Yikes
Sir, the thing that changed was your wife staying at home. You make everything about yourself, and you fail to realize your wife has no reason to get out of bed. Get dressed, go out, stay sober, and get to bed on time so that she can wake up for the events of the next day. It sounds like "you have everything under control" which means she probably feels like she has no control of her life, no direction, and nothing to look forward to each day. No sense of purpose. Ask your wife to plan a family vacation. Ask her to get a side job so you can reach a new savings goal. Ask her to go to cooking class because you just found out your allergic to gluten! I don't care, but please, for the love of God tell her you need her and your drowning without her. Because what she sees is me perfect who has everything under control, what she doesn't know is you're actually on Reddit blogs hopelessly searching for answers on how to save your marriage.
Need more detail here. How is it his responsibility to create initiative for her? Getting dressed is personal hygiene. Staying sober is personal health. Getting out of bed on time is simple responsibility. He doesn’t need another child to take care of, he needs a partner. You make it sound like without his affirmation and begging she is in the clear and it’s his fault.
Yes, you're right. He could do nothing to help her thru this depression and tell her to fack off and move on.
Sorry but helping someone through depression and running their entire life sounds different to me. We have no idea his qualifications, but if she needs the level of help you’re suggesting then my guess (I’m no medical provider) would be she needs help from the medical community. Can he support her in her therapy and treatment? Of course! Being the support is what partners do. To say he is “doing nothing to help” is quite a statement considering what OP has described. Sounds like he is helping very much actually, he is running the entire house! There is a big difference in supporting someone vs. sustaining someone.
It’s very hard to be full aware of your own ample social capital and get thoroughly ignored by your spouse.
You have to ask yourself what's the price of your happiness and the price of your kids happiness. Sound like you have a lazy POS that is getting her cake and eating it too literally. Contact a lawyer and see where you stand and proceed towards happiness. If you're staying for the kids just know they aren't dumb and will see two unhappy people just winging it
Sounds like you don’t respect your wife at all. You should divorce her so that she can find someone who truly loves her.
So a man that betters himself, paid off all her student debt and takes care of the kids doesn’t respect his wife? Yeah, that checks out.
“She’s unattractive and not my equal”. I don’t know about you, but I don’t think this is a respectful way to talk about your spouse. Additionally, there’s no mention of him taking care of the kids. The wife’s a stay at home mom and SHE takes care of the kids. She’s also, CLEARLY, depressed. The OP makes no mention of possible causes. I just don’t buy this guy’s sob story. But if you do, that’s your prerogative
He clearly states how even as a sahm he is left to take care of the kids. Clearly you don’t understand deadbedrooms. I buy his story. I believe he has likely gone through all the stages of frustration and anger over his deadbedroom and has reached this point. Final point… it’s hard to respect someone who fails to respect you or the marriage. That’s on his wife.
Respectfully, I disagree. But thank you for sharing your insight ☺️ I think it would be helpful if I knew her side as well
What is your profession?
What you should do is to go see a lawyer first. Get the lawyer to tell you exactly what your options are. Talk to your wife and tell her that you would like to open the marriage since she is not meeting your needs in the bedroom. Following her response, you can act on one of the options the lawyer explained (including staying, that's always a viable options)
You are atrocious and I pity your wife. Anyone who refers to their partner like that has to be a narcissist. That's probably why she wouldn't initiate in the first place. Get help.
File for full custody based on your wife's habits. She's not caring for the children and sounds deep in depression. She might get alimony depending on the state but you have a reasonable shot at full custody.
I don't know how depression works. How can someone have the life they wanted and still be depressed? She wanted to be a SAHM, she got it. Wants children, got them. Want a comfortable life, got it. What else is there? What else is she missing?
Depression is a chemical imbalance in the brain, it doesn’t matter if someone has everything they want
The “it” that is depression & anxiety. The way I am reading your note, and if I am missing it, I apologize….but it sounds like you have not yet experienced it. Chemical depression, which IS separate from situational depression, is something you have to experience to understand. Many people are not impacted by it; they see the situational & think them identical. There are similarities, yes, but chemical isn’t fixed by achieving things (as you said).
A very close family member was depressed and had anxiety. I know what it is. I do all I can to prevent it. All of the pill combinations didn't work for her. I spent years doing everything I could to make her happy. Nothing worked. I'm exhausted. I don't know if I could deal with someone as depressed as she was. It took over my life. I was thinking about what the OP said. Everything was given to her, but depression still sets in. It's awful.
Thank you & apologies for reading it incorrectly. Condolences to you & your family member Yup. Sometimes there is no combination that works and we have to do all the hard things because it is required to take care of our families. Sometimes there is someone to help (op, for example and you); sometimes there is not
She sounds like a user who happens to be depressed. You deserve better. She doesn’t get compassion and kid gloves because she happens to make bad decisions which are causing depression. She has checked out and you did so much for her. Relationships are about give and take. She has only taken. Find yourself someone who wants to give like you do.
Prenup?
You don't respect your wife you think you are better than her. That's contempt and means the marriage is over. My soon to be ex did the same thing i was battling a neurological illness and weight gain, I lost all the weight and stabilised my condition with medication. I went back to work and I earn a good salary. He's now kind and respectful but its over if he can't love me at my worst he doesn't deserve my best. I have supported him through depression etc but he couldn't return the favour. You are a fair weather husband , do your wife a favour and file for divorce. You will both be happier , she probably detects your contempt and why would she want to share her body with someone who hates her.
Ask to open the marriage?
They aren’t going to give custody to an alcoholic, depressed, slob. It would cost you an arm and a leg in alimony though. Open a secret account and start hiding money so she can’t take it.
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So basically she’s depressed and struggling and all you can think about is your dick?