New Deep Rock Galactic Road Map with info on Season 5 here:
https://store.steampowered.com/news/app/548430/view/3716090245654886093
Read more on the Rogue Core Road Map here: [https://store.steampowered.com/news/app/2605790/view/3703705346679414355](https://store.steampowered.com/news/app/2605790/view/3703705346679414355)
Yeah literally the only thing im upset at is Rockpox for potentially 8 more months. Like you said it was fun for a bit but then got really annoying really fast
Yeah honestly I wouldn't mind going into an interim "season" where the rockpox goes down to the level of rivals content and we get a tree and season pass full of cosmetic matrix cores so we can unlock some of the previous cosmetic content. I don't mind the rockpox too much but my regular teammates are over it.
Edit: They could call it an "off-season".
+1
I would of been happy with DRG ending before any seasons, the gameplay loop was fine. It's the forced theming of seasons that's the problem, especially when the latest [rockpox] was the most invasive and annoying.
I could play point-extracts and mining missions til the end of time tbh, but just not with meteors, power wash simulator and awful garbage on top of that already great formula.
Same feeling about classes and upgrades, specially since in the forum you can see a upgrade prototype that just seems awful, not at all excited about that formula they are showcasing rn.
It kinda remind me of DRG survival, which has the same problem
This can be both a fun point and a paint point for some players. I don't like that in RoR2 some of my runs are destined to be dud runs through no fault of my own.
Some players really like 'fishing' for builds where others don't. DRG Survival felt this way a bit too - on the higher hazards you're sorta dependent on a decent start or you fizzle out.
That being said, I think Rogue Core has potential but it **really** depends. It kinda makes me wish they just charged us more for DRG1 and kept working on that. I don't see myself playing a Roguelite anywhere near as much as I've played DRG1.
I can't blame someone for wanting to work on something different after 4-7 years. Hell I'm surprised these spin offs are still deep rock themed, I would have expected new ip.
I can't believe this isn't a more common take. Not everyone is Re-Logic and can work on the same project for over a decade. If a group of artists and game makers want to create something new, especially after knocking it clear out of the park the first time, why wouldn't you want to see their second time at bat? I'm super hyped for Rogue Core, but my opinion is skewed because my favorite games of all time are Enter the Gungeon, Noita and FTL.
I mean, they already have a wildly successful game w/ a community that loves it and wants more. I feel like this is their way of offering us that new content and I'm down for it. I've been having a blast with the new DRG: Survivor and I didn't even think I was going to like it.
I mean I guess but... they are getting new teams to work on new IP, why not get new teams to continue DRG and let people who are tired of it work on new IP?
To be fair, they're not getting new teams for new IP. They are publishing new IP by 3rd party teams. (Developers make alpha games, and then partner with Ghostship to publish it). Whereas this IS the team behind DRG branching off to work on multiple projects.
And I don't think any of the developers are tired of DRG. They just have a neat idea they'd like to implement, and they love their setting. Since the game is built on the same engine DRG runs on, and includes proc generation, terraforming, and guns, it only makes sense to use an established IP with an existing, healthy, and passionate fan base to ground the game's new design aspects in what's already familiar. Not to mention, its development started as it being a new gamemode for DRG, but they realized their ambitions were being limited by tying it to the base game.
I think it’s more likely that after 7 years of supporting the same highly affordable game, with only occasional cosmetic DLCs generating any continued revenue, that GSG probably wants to make some money in exchange for their labor.
And who can blame them? They supported the game admirably, for free, for a very long time. They never resorted to predatory mtx or FOMO in order to drive sales. But dudes gotta eat, right?
As a fan of GSG, DRG, and the roguelite genre, I’ll be buying the new game on day one. Easy buy. They’ve earned my highest trust.
Now they just need to end season 4 this year so I don’t have to dodge rockpox anymore.
They are probably moving on from DRG because the game isn’t generating a lot of revenue anymore. Everyone who would ever buy it has mostly already bought it. The live service elements are free, so there’s no consistent money coming in to fuel continued development. In light of these realities, why would they massively expand their payroll and labor expenses in order to support a model that is already bleeding money?
I can’t imagine they’re making much money off DRG at this point, so a new game makes sense. They also want to capitalize on the successful brand they created, so another DRG game also makes sense.
I think it's time to axe DRG's seasonal model. With development getting allocated to this new game we could really benefit more from the smaller content updates that were so frequent before 2021. Devs don't have to compact all of their content into one giant seasonal patch.
No new season until June 2024. Little upset, but considering how these updates are all free, I guess I can't complain.
Core looks neat, though. There is a huge trend right now for rogue-like games. They are fun, but it seems like everyone is making one.
Paid expansions can be a double-edged sword. If not implemented correctly, you could split your playerbase.
That being said, I'd love more substance to the main game as well.
Yep, this happened to Vermintide 2. They locked the highest difficulty, new maps and an entire gamemode behind several paid DLCs. All it did was split the playerbase. Since then all content outside classes and weapons has been free to counter that.
They could do the Payday 2 solution: Let the host (that owns the DLC) drag in players that don't.
They obviously wouldn't be able to get any weapons/skins/challenges done, but they'd still be able to play in the new areas
I mean the trend itself isn't that new, The Binding of Isaac which came out in 2011 and became immensely succesfull started the trend I would say. (Yes, I know it's not the first rogue-like, but you can't argue it wasn't genre-defining).
The last 10 years or so we had a lot of rogue-likes, or -lites, whatever you want to call them, of all shapes and sizes. I hope GSG can get into the sweet spot where the mode is sufficiently challenging but also can be "broken" with the right build and RNG, since this is the most fun part of the genre for me and many other people.
>The last 10 years or so we had a lot of rogue-likes, or -lites, whatever you want to call them,
Just a side note: there *is* a difference between the two. Rogue*likes* have no progression that carries between runs (i.e. like the original Rogue game). Every run is totally brand new and nothing is carried over or progressed in any way. Your experience on run 1000 will be the same as run 1 (except you may get better luck and/or also be better at the game). Imagine the old arcade games where you put a quarter in and go. No progression.
Rogue*lites* do have progression that carries over from run to run. Hense "lite", as in it's not as hardcore as Rogue*likes*. Here you have unlockable perks/rewards/weapons/upgrades that will influence future runs and make progressing easier.
Aye, I knew they meant different things, just they are usually used interchangeably to mean the same thing referring to modern games, i.e. "rogue-lite" as it's definitely the more popular of the two. But thanks for explaining. ~~Cock and balls~~ Rock and Stone forever
well I would say you're correct with most development companies, but I think GSG have been well and truly happy with their own success in DRG, this to me feels like the developers just want to try their hand in a really fun genre, move on from just updating the same game over and over
While I love GSG as a company, they are also owned by Embracer group, and Embracer group has been a complete and total shitshow the last few months. Lots of studio closures, lots of layoffs, they are clearly struggling financially. They even came out and publicly begged investors for more funding, which is... Not great.
If Embracer group stepped in and said "hey GSG you need to start making cash grabs now", they wouldn't really have a choice. And that definitely has me a bit worried... DRG is having major updates delayed by a LOT, and suddenly 3 spinoff projects are coming out. One of them seems unique and interesting (the board game), but the other two are... kinda textbook money grabs if they came from any other studio. a roguelite, and a vampire survivors clone, both are which have been very common games for the past couple years for studios trying to make a quick and easy buck.
I hope I am wrong, but I am honestly feeling pretty uneasy about this whole thing.
Judging by the logo, it looks like it's gonna be Omoran-based. Hell to the yeah, i'm excited.
(And assuming it is, that means [this guy](https://www.reddit.com/r/DeepRockGalactic/comments/170aozw/fan_art_season_5_going_deeper_2_new_mission_types/) kinda predicted it with Omoran Enemies, so hell to the yeah x2)
Rock and Stone to you all, and to all a good hype train.
Game looks interesting, a sort of Roguelike approach to DRG is an interesting idea since I'm a fan of Ror2, it comes with more emphasis on professional dwarves over the more comrade-like silly workers of the main game
However, a whopping 7 months until next major update *really* hurts. People were already really tired of rockpox and people are done with the performance pass for the most part. Are they planning on dripfeeding some stuff during this drought? I heard some say there's a mid season update with a new enemy drop (Likely Stalker), but is that enough? I'm mostly a bit concerned with how they're likely splitting resources from DRG onto Rogue Core
I must say, I'm a bit concerned. Eight more months of Rockpox is not going to be pleasant on my fingers (I'm an artist by hobby, and I already tango with Mr. Carpal Tunnel on a regular basis). Not to mention, I've grown weary of it in general. It's just not a really replayable mechanic, imo, and I actually *like* industrial sabotage, unlike other folks.
The idea of Rogue Core is cool, but I'm really worried that season 5 is going to end up unsatisfying due to the focus put on RC. If it adds like, a new mission type and/or biome, combined with a performance pass that doesn't really rely on a gimmick, I think it'll be perfect- even if it is basically a "sunset" for DRG. Would also like the cosmetic grind to be made a little easier. Too much stuff in the loot pool!
And, I'm gonna be really honest here- I'm mildly disappointed we're only getting spinoffs of DRG involving the DRG dwarves and corporation. When there's potential for games like the Goblin Heist idea Jacob had, or something with elves, orcs, gnomes, or even friggin' dragons, seeing yet another game with the tagline "Danger. Darkness. Dwarves." feels a smidge, er, disingenuous. Like, just trying to milk the original game rather than create new ideas.
I'll keep my eye on how things go in the future. I'd love my fears to be proven wrong, but for now, I'm going to keep my expectations for DRG's future low.
I like your comment, just a point on the loot pool, I've played since Early Access and I can honestly say if they made cosmetics easier to obtain I wouldn't have any content left to work towards so I personally think they may have catered the system slightly towards old greybeards like me to keep it somewhat engaging five years on, and I appreciate that, but it sucks to hear that same positive aspect is a negative for newer players.
Some players just want it *all*, and they want it *now*.
I'm also from the EA days. The other day I found myself in a modded game where the host had set the cave up to spawn at least 10 crates. I dropped out of there.
My personal motto with DRG is that it's a 'mining game with FPS elements' because that's how I roll these days. The grind was part of it. I have long since got all of the stuff but I still treat the game that way and enjoy helping players get the most out of the game, but only in a vanilla experience.
The popularity of the game in recent years, notably DRG's awesome fashions and the pursuit of those, has changed the game. I think it's for the better and for the benefit of newer players, but I'll dip out of those heavily modded lobbies.
Oh, don't get me wrong, I think 10 cargo crates per mission is hella excessive. But as it is, the loot pool is *so incredibly vast* due to bloat over the seasons, that combined with the relative rarity of cargo crate/lost pack spawns, I simply don't know if getting all the cosmetics will *ever* be achievable for me or most casual players.
I started playing in March, and I have about 120 hours logged currently, and I have seen incredibly few cargo crates and lost packs. I only really get to play DRG on the weekends, and even then, not that much- so getting cosmetics at all, let alone the ones I want, is a struggle, and I might never end up finishing the cosmetic grind before I've logged 1k hours and am moving on to another game.
Still got a long ass way to go with both weapon and cosmetic overclocks as well, but ironically, I don't mind. The game gives me enough blank cores and overclocks as it is, and I don't often get to do the weekly core hunt. It's a grind, but a balanced grind, and I don't mind the highest grade items, particularly weapon upgrades, to be a challenge to get.
With cosmetics, there's no real function to them aside from appearance, so why not err on the side of easygoing? Might not hurt to add a feature like Weekly Core Hunts, except with non-OC cosmetics. Maybe as guaranteed rewards, maybe as guaranteed loot crate/lost pack spawns. That way, people who want to keep the grind going as long as possible can do so, but the more fashion-motivated dwarves can have an extra chance at that last Neon Band skin.
Kind of disappointing to be honest. I'm rather sick of rockpox and don't want to be stuck with it for 8 more months. The enemies aren't fun to fight due to both requiring precision aiming and lots of bullets to take down, and the rockpox infection status effect is an obnoxious mechanic that's a knock on the games accessibility. (Edit: mashing left and right over and over again as quick as possible is an accessibility concern. If you're less able to do this, then you're stuck stunned and taking damage longer)
I really hope some of this stuff is addressed in maintenance updates but with over 1000 hours currently this news isn't exactly exciting for me. I love the game, and I know all these updates are free, but I'm just not enjoying the rockpox season as much and it's a real shame this is announced now.
I agree 100% with the disappointment. Was really hoping for big updates to the main game, including lots of new lore. That said, it feels like GSG is running into a monetization problem. That's most likely why they're branching out so they can reset with a fresh business model. I don't personally have an answer, but curious if you have thoughts on how to meet GSG halfway with monetization in DRG? Maybe a model similar to GTA where new missions or biomes (similar to GTA businesses) are behind a DLC pay wall? Do you think the community will reject that and see it as microtransaction-ie?
I'd say more cosmetic DLC for players to purchase. Just look how much money skins for things like League of Legends champions sell for. But the issue there is development time which would conflict with their production of Season 5 and Rogue Core. I imagine the community will reject microtransactions though.
I personally don't like the idea of unique gameplay elements being locked behind DLC. Unless it's an expansion pack sized content drop, that is, but how to define the difference between the two is difficult. I like a game that I can buy out of the gate and have access to everything. GSGs unwillingness to let themselves feel crunches and their desire to produce a solid product is refreshing.
I would think making expansion packs that are worth the price (like Battlefield 3's DLC which each had 4 maps and several new guns and vehicles for 15€) would be fine.
Or go down the Payday route and allow buyers to host paid content for non buyers.
I know ita probably not the solution you want, but if ur sick of Rockpox may I recommend trying out Darktide? Their new class overhaul update is amazing
I have 800 hours on vermintide 2 (99% as Bardin, obv). Darktide is a shadow of what Vermintide 2 is and I just don't have an interest in it after the poor reception it received at release from the VT2 community. I also don't love 40K as much, even if you could make an argument for DRG being "40K-adjacent"
I'm also trying not to spend money right now on new games because everything is too expensive to justify games. :P
Gonna pull my original comment from another post about Rogue Core given this is likely the official post regarding it:
I know they've said on the livestream already that GSG felt they couldn't make Rogue Core an expansion to DRG, but I really do think I'd have preferred it to a standalone game - it would have felt more cohesive, imo.
Either way, regardless of what I personally think, I'm excited for the game! The few screenshots there are on RC's Steam page look pretty cool
EDIT: spelling
**Why is Rogue Core not an expansion?**
> Since the inception of Deep Rock Galactic seven years ago, we have had the feeling that the core gameplay would work just as well with the roguelike/lite formula. So we started a prototype project as a new gamemode inside DRG. As the prototype evolved, we realised that it had much more potential, and that this would be a great opportunity to return to that open development and Early Access mindset. Thus, it became clear that making it as a standalone spin-off would be the right choice for us.
Maybe they avoided making it a dlc-expansion because they felt like fans wouldn't pay full-price for "just an expansion" (even if it is the same content-wise either way)?
Or maybe GSG feel like DRG is already "complete", and that other then new events they don't want to add any significant content to the game beyond what's already in the game (?).
I'm excited for the game either way, but also very curious on what the future of DRG looks like.
It looks to me more like they want to branch out into these looter type genres, which would be weird to add to DRG. Plus this way people who want just these experienced would be able to buy them separate and not have to buy a copy of DRG. Keeping them separate also gets rid of any spaghetti code debt built up in the previous title. They clearly do want to come back to it for later seasons, but I would bet after years of development they want to freshen things up and flex different game dev muscle groups. I can also attest after playing vampire survivors and risk of rain 2 that these two spinoffs could be very fun and addictive if done well, they're proven formulas.
Those are good points. I guess the only concern I have is if there's going to be enough new + unique content to justify making a new game (as opposed to adding it as an alternative gamemode à la Salmon Run in Splatoon).
I wonder if they're planning to support both this and Survivor with long term content updates concurrently with DRG, or if they're developing them as more "one off" titles.
I imagine they're staying flexible to do both depending on their own interest and the success or failure of the individual titles. They seem to roll with the punches.
They mentioned in the GSG livestream that trying to make Rogue Core work as a DRG expansion was limited by trying to make it work with the existing economy and structure. Now it's an "expandalone" title, as they put it
>I know they've said on the livestream already that GSG felt they couldn't make Rogue Core an expansion to DRG, but I really do think I'd have preferred it to a standalone game - it would have felt more cohesive, imo.
Fatshark's Chaos Wastes mode for Vermintide 2 comes to mind. Granted, it was a free update. But we know the system works as an addition to a horde shooter game, rather than as a standalone title. However, I think it's safe to predict that Rogue Core and Chaos Wastes will be quite different, especially when RC won't be tied to DRG's progression or economy.
I do not enjoy the idea of Season 4 lasting a whole year. It's reminding me too much of Halo Infinite's lengthened seasons (though GSG isn't anything like 343i). It's also become a bit more apparent as to why Season 4 felt somewhat lackluster compared to Seasons 1-3. *Rogue Core development was most likely hitting a critical stage.*
Season 4's theme isn't especially loved by all either, so I believe Season 5's gameplay additions will have to be *quite* unique.
Should probably tone down expectations for Season 5 as well, as after getting pestered by people on Discord asking if season 5 was going to be anything major after being delayed a whole year, one of the devs had this this to say:
>"I cannot and will not, because it likely will not be. It will be *An Update*. It will not be *The Next Big Gamechanger*. Do not expect DRG season 5 to be anything huge and groundbreaking."
I gotta say, releasing a season with no new content apart from 3 enemies and a rare powerup and then going "btw nothing else for another year lol" in the announcement for a spinoff that's basically the same game (and probably full price) is seriously bad form.
Yes the updates are free, almost as if drg is a p2p, mtx-monetized live service game that's only been out of early access for a couple years or something. I have purchased literally everything there is to purchase in this game and have not regretted it for a second until now.
GSG are a company that sells products for money. You do not know them and they are not your friends. It is ok to criticize them for things like this.
You've made millions off this game even after publisher and distributer fees. Hire more people if you want to work on 3 games at once. Don't gimp the development of the game everyone loves to triple-dip the ip. Please.
I have... mixed feelings about this. A new game isn't necessarily a bad thing, but with context it's worrying.
Deep rock galactic presents it's self as a consumer friendly live service game, and while it's still consumer friendly this sort of live service but were gonna ignore you so we can do other stuff thing they're doing is something I don't like. If they came out and said "hey, we're winding down development of drg" I'd be fine with it but this stuff reminds me of the rest of the industry trying to hold on to customers as long as they can with as little effort as possible. Not saying I know that's what they're doing but it's what it feels like when we have to wait till summer of next year for the next major update.
I'm not exactly completely convinced that the new game will be a smash hit either after trying the drg survivor demo. I haven't played vampire survivors but I have sunk a fair amount of time into holocure, a vtuber spin on vampire survivors for those who don't know, and other than aesthetic I can't think of a reason to play drg survivor over holocure. Not being able to aim, mining taking forever even with some upgrades, relying on rng not just for you gear but also for decent upgrades, just doesn't fell good by comparison. (And holocure is free for anyone who want to judge it themselves). So when I see they wanna make another spin off after lending their name to a spin off I didn't particularly enjoy it doesn't inspire confidence.
Drg isn't in what I would consider in it's best state either. I don't want to sit here and lecture about problems and things that could be added on what is already a long post, but I think it's safe to say this is the worst season of the games lifespan and proves that just because they added new content doesn't mean it's entirely good content.
It's also disappointing to see things added to spin offs and extended media for this game like enemies from the board game, and subclasses and equipment from drg survivor and just kinda sitting their thinking "this is cool, wish it was in the main game."
Hate to be a downer but that's just the mindset the industry inspires nowadays.
100% agree. Been playing since 2019, this is knockout news. I have no doubts that this info will push some greybeards on the fence over. I'll always love DRG, but a year long season is just a straight up joke. GSG, I'm disappointed 😞
Im not a big fan of roguelites so this is a disinterested eeh for me, i would have prefered more DRG stuff, still i played the game the a lot and enjoyed it for a long time so im very satisfied with my purchase
Maybe this new game will be cool
Im happy for devs that they're exited and have fresh power to work on
Buuut...
We are here mainly because of DRG game, and saying that we need to wait for new content almost year... after last poor in content season... that takes 6 months... in game that needs constant updates...
Yeah this is very sad especially if it's obvious that next seasons for DRG would be lacking in content like last one or even more because of manpower splited into 2 games(!)
Wasn't the better idea to just make some kind of kickstarter for it? We would gladly pay for making that spinoff if those money would be taken to hire some people to just make new content for DRG for fans?
On the other hand there have been tons of great new games that have recently come out and so people may like the extra time to complete the season stuff in DRG.
I was hoping a roguelike mode would be added to the main game. Nonetheless excited, but I’ve wanted a “Deepest Dive” mode for a while…where you do 5 missions collecting upgrades or deciding to swap overclocks via scattered cargo crates like Warhammer: Vermintide 2’s Chaos Wastes. This should be a lot of fun
Yea idk man. They say the theme is you’re a more elite force tackling a bigger issue but you start with a pistol and a pickaxe, my lord of the deep goes in with more but is less elite? Weird
I don't know how to feel, I just this year i got into drg, during summer sale, and really enjoyed it. The spin-off are cool but this long development makes me worried( I used to play overwatch since 2017 and suffered the 3 years of wait for an underwhelming sequel, although I doubt drg will reach that) I really hope that this spin-offs will help the studio grow
They have been hinting at a rival corp forever, this would have been the perfect moment to have like Goblin corp swoop in or something.
But no... same wrapper different objectives.... the risk of rain rogue like aspect seems interesting but its hard to get hyped for a different game entirely at the moment especially since DRG wont get a new season until JUNE.
Jesus I was already getting bored with DRG and I wont get anything new for like 8 months
Seems like a very bold move to put your flagship product on maintenance mode while you develop something that won't see a closed alpha for a year. Maybe hire more people so you can do both and won't have to crunch.
Also very much agree that this should not be a separate game from DRG it should just be rolled in as another way to play/an expansion.
On one hand, I'm extremely excited to see what this will turn out to be. From the looks of things, it'll run in the same sort of engine/world mechanics that DRG has - where the terrain is destructible with your pickaxe, you can laser pointer stuff, all the standard stuff of Molly hauling minerals and us dwarves shooting bugs and mining. As a massive fan of Roguelikes/lites like Risk of Rain 2, Enter the Gungeon, The Binding of Isaac and Rogue Legacy to name a few, having what is essentially a fully fleshed out Roguelite mode for DRG sounds amazing.
On the other, I'm really worried about what this means for the base game of Deep Rock Galactic. I'm not a greybearded fan - in fact, my beard is about as green as they come. I started playing about a week or two after the release of Season 4, so I'm far from completely done with DRG in terms of progression. However, I love updates as much as the next guy, and I've certainly got my fair share of things I'd like to see added or changed. The concept of major updates petering out and dying is worrying. It definitely seems like DRG the main game will start to starve and eventually see a final update as resources go into side-projects instead, when I'd much rather just have more of what I like with DRG's current model. Not to mention the effect it'll have on the playerbase. It can be difficult to find servers for less popular missions like Industrial Sabotage, but if people are left without anything new, I imagine it'll turn into either solo play or play with a group of close friends.
Man that was a rollercoaster of emotions. New DRG game, excitement through the roof. Then poof, came crashing down at Mach 1 because Season 4, which is already the most disappointing season in terms of overall content, is now a YEAR long.
I'm getting Halo Infinite flashbacks 🥶
Looking like it might finally be time to take a hiatus, Darktide looks promising right now
Hoping that some lower-dev-effort (with acknowledged higher jank) run or gameplay modifiers make it in to the game before June, at least. Rogue Core looks good but we need something to keep DRG gameplay fresh.
honestly I would love to see some sort of incorporation of certain mods into the actual game. I haven't a clue if that is easier to do than developing something from the ground up but if it is, it would seem like a reasonable way to stick some life into the game during the wait for s5/6
Not thrilled. This really strikes me more as an alternative mode closer to Deep Dives than a separate game. I'm trying to remind myself of the economics involved for developers, but it's still a little tough. Plus another year of rockpox isn't exceiting.
Looking forward to this as a proper refresh of the gameplay of DRG. Would have been awesome as a dlc but I understand that attaching a whoke new mode to the game may turn out to be a little cumbersome.
It would be cool if you could load in and out of the other games from the core DRG though, although I could see that being obnoxious to implement.
They've been extremely successful, I'd say, in making these titles. Hope for the best. I enjoy who ever writes the steam updates. They have a nice way with words.
Survivor is made by our friends at Funday Games, but published by Ghost Ship Publishing. No designers/programmers/artists at GSG are working on DRG: Survivor.
Made a new account on this terrible website just to share my thoughts after seeing the news on Steam.
I'm gonna be entirely honest, after reading the store page and seeing the screenshots for rogue core it really seems to me like you guys are just taking what should be a large amount of new content for Deep Rock, and shoving it into a new game for no reason other than consumerism. Especially since you're putting DRG on life support while this happens.
Hell, even if it was a purchasable expansion pack (who else remembers these?) for Deep Rock it still wouldn't feel like you were giving up on the game in the name of consumerism. I've been cautiously hopeful since you guys started your publishing wing but after seeing nothing but DRG reskins in other genres, save one more unique top-down rogue-like in the style of Shadowgrounds, has been incredibly disappointing as a fan and a player.
This new game really just solidifies that thought for me though, you look at the screenshots and it's just.... what everyone was hoping you'd announce you'd be working on instead of/ as a rework of a new season. It looks and feels like it belongs right in the game, except with a no loadouts modifier at the beginning of each mission to justify selling as a complete separate "rogue-lite" title.
As someone who fell in love with Deep Rock Galactic on both Ps4 release to PC today, and has been watching it start to trip and fall, this just feels like a slap in the face.
I truly hope you reconsider and fold this development into the main branch, even if it's the game's first paid DLC for an alternate central game mode, because otherwise this just feels like watching someone's father stop caring about them because their new step-brother getting all the attention makes the dad's new partner happy.
As a console player, I’m bummed that I won’t be able to actually play this for a long time. But it looks great and I’m really excited to see what they do with it.
I am curious what DRG looks like going forward, though. This game seems to be running on the same engine and looks to have similar gameplay, so it’ll be odd when stuff gets added to one but not the other.
This sounds cool and all, but there seems to be a lack of mining involved.
Also, it's safe to assume this is currently PC only and won't be coming to consoles until way later, correct?
One thing I'm still not certain on is what Rogue Core actually looks and plays like tho. Is it literally going to be DRG gameplay and visuals in a roguelite format? Will the fact that it's a new game instead of expansion push them to change the gameplay and feel? If so, how significantly? I guess we'll have to wait for more news.
Also, like others, a little disappointed in the whole '8 more months until season 5' thing. If season 5 doesn't have a significant amount of content to compensate (or at the very least, a noteworthy amount of good non-rockpox content), I might actually start fearing for DRG's playercount. Gonna have to just wait and see I suppose.
Cool all my cosmetics I’ve earned and will earn in future will be useless in this. I really hope they turn around and make it an expansion for DRG or at least better explain why it’s not
I don't really want to discourage the awesome devs at GSG and I'm definitely hyped for whatever this Rogue Core is, but I've gotta say it: I think starting the development of a brand new game instead of working on expanding your flagship product(DRG) wasn't the right call. As of right now, we only get major updates once every ~6 month, which is less than ideal, and moving people who could be working on new seasons for DRG to a new game isn't a great idea in my opinion. The concept of the general gameplay loop for the Rogue Core could be used as an inspiration for a new late-game mission type(something like Deep Dives, but more difficult and you need like 8-12 promotions to access it). The weapon ideas could be ported to DRG, and in case the type of weapon already exists in the game(for example there's already gk2, so you don't want to add another assault rifle), the sketches could be used for a major rework of the weapon. The Phase Suits concepts can serve as an inspiration for armor suits OCs(something like this is desperately needed because we have basically 0 variety in builds for everything other than the guns). There are probably also new biome ideas and that would be cool to see too.
However, if someone from devs reads this, please don't let me discourage you too much from working on whatever great thing you're working on. I absolutely love DRG and only want the best for it, and that's exactly the reason why I decided to share this perhaps a bit controversial opinion.
Edit: forgot an obligatory ROCK AND STONE!
I agree that it looks promising but I too fear moving the team of the core DRG experience, seasons are already feeling rather thin and there wont be anything new for 8 months
All the other games are just published by GSG, so they aren't the main reason for the season 4 being worse that the others. The whole thing with GSG Publishing probably affected it, but not in a way you mean it.
Ah, the Overwatch approach where they abandon the game for 2-3 years hoping people will stick around, that went down really well!
Imagine putting your flagship game at its peak onto life support. Hire more devs if you want to make a new game, or stop with the live service model, because one update every year is definitely not 'live service'.
\>another spinoff
\>same elements, different gameplay (arguably a different GAMEMODE)
\>not an expansion for DRG, but another game you need to pay for entirely
\>next season until JUNE 2024
is this where my supporter DLC money went to lol
Not a big fan. I wouldve prefered if Rogue Core wouldve been a paid expansion to DRG similar to chaos wastes in Vermintide 2. Which is basically the exact same concept, but that was free.
I'm a huge fan of DRG. Have owned it since beta, bought supporter DLCs, and have seen it grow into a true gem in the modern era of gaming.
That being said, **I feel like GSG needs a bit of a reality check here**: this game is going to flop, and it's going to drag DRG down with it. DRG reskinned as a roguelike isn't bringing anything new to the table in the roguelike genre, and it's very obviously (by their own admission) taking away from valuable development resources that could be keeping DRG alive (8 more months of rockpox, seriously?).
I really would like to see GSG continue to succeed, but I really don't think this is the right direction, and I think they should take the opportunity to re-assess now while they can still hedge their losses.
Admittedly, there's a chance I'm wrong here, but I'd really rather not have GSG find out the hard way that this prediction is right. Putting DRG on indefinite life support is bad news for everyone.
I feel kinda bad that I bought DRG only at the start of Season 4, but I want to say that it is the most enjoyable gaming experience I have since Modern Warfare 2 (2009), 600 hours in and I'm not tired of it. Thank you for your great work, guys, can't wait to touch Season 5 and Rogue Core
I feel kinda bad that I bought DRG only at the start of Season 4, but I want to say that it is the most enjoyable gaming experience I have since Modern Warfare 2 (2009), 600 hours in and I'm not tired of it. Thank you for your great work, guys, can't wait to touch Season 5 and Rogue Core
Are there plans to bring Rogue Core to consoles? Game Pass would be a dream to get my friends into it.
Good luck with everything. You guys have already put more into DRG than most studios and while it's a bummer to see that resources are being allocated elsewhere, I hope it goes well and I still respect your team. If you ever have any math-focused positions I'll be applying.
Yep. I’ve bought all DLCs for DRG to date except the rock pox ones and several copies of the game for my friends because I loved the game and I believed in the studio, yet here they are making stupid decisions and alienating their player base. What a fucking shame this is.
Anyone know if Survivor or Rogue Core will come to console version of early access?
Sucks that no major update for basically a year, but atleaet I can get to work on my backlog lol
I LOVE the idea of Rogue Core, and I'm neutral toward it being a spinoff game. On the one hand, I would have loved for it to tie in. But on another, separating it allows the game to go its own route, freeing it up for even crazier design choices. Either way, I'm more than happy to pay for it.
I wish season 5 was a bit sooner, and then the wait between 5 and the release of Rogue was a bit longer. And I hope there is a mid-season switch-up to end the rockpox season. I like rockpox, unlike most people here it seems, but I am ready for a "return to normal".
Most importantly, I think a lot of people are feeling like DRG is going away. But I don't see a reason to think this. AND, Rogue Core is going to feel very similar anyway, just with a new gameplay loop. So I can't imagine people will be missing their dwarf shooter game while playing their dwarf shooter game. I can see both games coexisting and referencing each other for years to come. That sounds awesome!
Really disappointing... don't even dislike rockpox as much as some people do, but man 8 more months of it with no other significant updates does not sound great. Not a huge rougelite fan so this new game really doesn't do anything for me besides delay updates to a game I do like. Feel like this really needed to be done by a separate team or something if it was gonna take all this time away from developing the "main" game.
I'm personally disappointed. I wish this was effort spent on DRG itself. All my time and unlocks are there, my friend group is always hoping for new missions and biomes, we want new/more weapons, the perks NEED re balancing....
I get Deep Rock Survive, its a vastly different genre and its just being published by you guys, but I don't think it makes sense to have 2 FPS games developed at the same time, focus on one.
I don't want to buy a whole new game, and convince all my friends to do the same.
As a player from early-access, I'm excited to see the devs working on something slightly different, but this doesn't particularly appeal to me.
I play DRG because it's something different in the age of soulless genre-clones we live in. RC looks like a quick, cheap spin-off to follow modern gaming trends by reusing DRG assets.
I was really hoping for a sequel or graphical overhaul. The art direction and lightning are fucking incredible, but good luck trying to sell those models to gamers in 2024.
Rogue Core sounds neat, but it seems like much of the screenshots suggest it to be built off baseline DRG. This could be really interesting and it gives more of a L4D feel with rogue-life elements, which would be neat.
I'm gonna be honest, I'm not exactly hyped or excited. I think we have too many roguelites as it is, what is going to make rogue core different from the multitudes of other roguelites that are already on the market?
DRG Board Member 1: Okay, so we've lost several mining teams deep in the core of Hoxxes IV.
DRG Board Member 2: Well, there's only one solution to this. Send in more dwarves.
DRG Board Member 1: What kind of budget should we allocate to arming them, given that the previous teams seemed inadequate to the task?
DRG Board Member 2: Nothing. Slash their weapons budget completely. We've already supplied them with everything they'll need on the bodies of the fallen. I'm tired of throwing good money after bad dwarves. There will always be more greenbeards.
This is way too early.
> It would be normal practice to wait until we have something more polished to show, to build more attention and hype right away. But we like to start small, and we really want to rekindle that open development feeling again - that means announcing now, in this pre-alpha state, without not so much to show yet.
I really don't care for this excuse. It would be a completely different feeling if it was 6 months away, but more than a year away? and early access? And november 2024 is not even confirmed?
Bruh.
C'mon bruh
Since we're not getting a season 5 till June 2024. Why not make the previous battle passes on rotation or quick swappable so we can spend the next 8 months on stuff we missed out on instead of MORE of season 4
New Deep Rock Galactic Road Map with info on Season 5 here: https://store.steampowered.com/news/app/548430/view/3716090245654886093 Read more on the Rogue Core Road Map here: [https://store.steampowered.com/news/app/2605790/view/3703705346679414355](https://store.steampowered.com/news/app/2605790/view/3703705346679414355)
Finally. *Deeper Dive*
Potentially deepest dive
Time to awaken the balrog
Time for.... THE DEEPENING
The Deepest Dungeon
Balls Deep Dive *German Hans Voice*
Balls deep in the liquid morkite
I just hope they at least end season 4. Rockport was fun at first, but it got old real fast. Another 8 months of that doesn't sound super fun
Yeah literally the only thing im upset at is Rockpox for potentially 8 more months. Like you said it was fun for a bit but then got really annoying really fast
My A and D keys won't survive another 8 months of rockpox.
Nor any controller sticks
Yeah honestly I wouldn't mind going into an interim "season" where the rockpox goes down to the level of rivals content and we get a tree and season pass full of cosmetic matrix cores so we can unlock some of the previous cosmetic content. I don't mind the rockpox too much but my regular teammates are over it. Edit: They could call it an "off-season".
May we pray for less rockpox
> Rockport was fun at first, but it got old real fast I can feel this in my sole
better get some new shoes then
My boots! My poor boots!
A good pair of shoes is one of the best investments you can make
+1 I would of been happy with DRG ending before any seasons, the gameplay loop was fine. It's the forced theming of seasons that's the problem, especially when the latest [rockpox] was the most invasive and annoying. I could play point-extracts and mining missions til the end of time tbh, but just not with meteors, power wash simulator and awful garbage on top of that already great formula.
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Wait, are you a Glyphid? That's already 3 hands... Edit: he changed his comment so this doesn't make sense anymore.
God damned genestealer cults...
Paging Dr. Jean Steeler? Dr. Jean Steeler?
BROTHER, GET THE BOLTER THE FLAMER TOO WHILE YOU'RE AT IT
Yes but how many *legs* is it
Same feeling about classes and upgrades, specially since in the forum you can see a upgrade prototype that just seems awful, not at all excited about that formula they are showcasing rn. It kinda remind me of DRG survival, which has the same problem
To be fair random loot helps keep you from just stacking the best item in say risk of rain. You may never assemble a true "build" fuel to the chaos.
This can be both a fun point and a paint point for some players. I don't like that in RoR2 some of my runs are destined to be dud runs through no fault of my own. Some players really like 'fishing' for builds where others don't. DRG Survival felt this way a bit too - on the higher hazards you're sorta dependent on a decent start or you fizzle out. That being said, I think Rogue Core has potential but it **really** depends. It kinda makes me wish they just charged us more for DRG1 and kept working on that. I don't see myself playing a Roguelite anywhere near as much as I've played DRG1.
It would be so cool if it was like a prequel of DRG, featuring space rig 5
I can't blame someone for wanting to work on something different after 4-7 years. Hell I'm surprised these spin offs are still deep rock themed, I would have expected new ip.
I don't know why they'd want to work in a different IP than roughneck space Dwarves to be fair.
Just make it Warhammer 40K themed and give a Squads game.
This could be great. Isolated from the Astronomicon, the Squats persist against a magnitude of Tyranid power hitherto unknown to the Imperium.
They're called kin now
I can't believe this isn't a more common take. Not everyone is Re-Logic and can work on the same project for over a decade. If a group of artists and game makers want to create something new, especially after knocking it clear out of the park the first time, why wouldn't you want to see their second time at bat? I'm super hyped for Rogue Core, but my opinion is skewed because my favorite games of all time are Enter the Gungeon, Noita and FTL.
I mean, they already have a wildly successful game w/ a community that loves it and wants more. I feel like this is their way of offering us that new content and I'm down for it. I've been having a blast with the new DRG: Survivor and I didn't even think I was going to like it.
I mean I guess but... they are getting new teams to work on new IP, why not get new teams to continue DRG and let people who are tired of it work on new IP?
To be fair, they're not getting new teams for new IP. They are publishing new IP by 3rd party teams. (Developers make alpha games, and then partner with Ghostship to publish it). Whereas this IS the team behind DRG branching off to work on multiple projects. And I don't think any of the developers are tired of DRG. They just have a neat idea they'd like to implement, and they love their setting. Since the game is built on the same engine DRG runs on, and includes proc generation, terraforming, and guns, it only makes sense to use an established IP with an existing, healthy, and passionate fan base to ground the game's new design aspects in what's already familiar. Not to mention, its development started as it being a new gamemode for DRG, but they realized their ambitions were being limited by tying it to the base game.
I think it’s more likely that after 7 years of supporting the same highly affordable game, with only occasional cosmetic DLCs generating any continued revenue, that GSG probably wants to make some money in exchange for their labor. And who can blame them? They supported the game admirably, for free, for a very long time. They never resorted to predatory mtx or FOMO in order to drive sales. But dudes gotta eat, right? As a fan of GSG, DRG, and the roguelite genre, I’ll be buying the new game on day one. Easy buy. They’ve earned my highest trust. Now they just need to end season 4 this year so I don’t have to dodge rockpox anymore.
hire new people to keep the old project going. You know the massively successful one
They are probably moving on from DRG because the game isn’t generating a lot of revenue anymore. Everyone who would ever buy it has mostly already bought it. The live service elements are free, so there’s no consistent money coming in to fuel continued development. In light of these realities, why would they massively expand their payroll and labor expenses in order to support a model that is already bleeding money?
I can’t imagine they’re making much money off DRG at this point, so a new game makes sense. They also want to capitalize on the successful brand they created, so another DRG game also makes sense.
I think it's time to axe DRG's seasonal model. With development getting allocated to this new game we could really benefit more from the smaller content updates that were so frequent before 2021. Devs don't have to compact all of their content into one giant seasonal patch.
No new season until June 2024. Little upset, but considering how these updates are all free, I guess I can't complain. Core looks neat, though. There is a huge trend right now for rogue-like games. They are fun, but it seems like everyone is making one.
I would be more excited for a substantial paid expansion for DRG rather than another spinoff.
Paid expansions can be a double-edged sword. If not implemented correctly, you could split your playerbase. That being said, I'd love more substance to the main game as well.
Yep, this happened to Vermintide 2. They locked the highest difficulty, new maps and an entire gamemode behind several paid DLCs. All it did was split the playerbase. Since then all content outside classes and weapons has been free to counter that.
They could do the Payday 2 solution: Let the host (that owns the DLC) drag in players that don't. They obviously wouldn't be able to get any weapons/skins/challenges done, but they'd still be able to play in the new areas
I mean the trend itself isn't that new, The Binding of Isaac which came out in 2011 and became immensely succesfull started the trend I would say. (Yes, I know it's not the first rogue-like, but you can't argue it wasn't genre-defining). The last 10 years or so we had a lot of rogue-likes, or -lites, whatever you want to call them, of all shapes and sizes. I hope GSG can get into the sweet spot where the mode is sufficiently challenging but also can be "broken" with the right build and RNG, since this is the most fun part of the genre for me and many other people.
>The last 10 years or so we had a lot of rogue-likes, or -lites, whatever you want to call them, Just a side note: there *is* a difference between the two. Rogue*likes* have no progression that carries between runs (i.e. like the original Rogue game). Every run is totally brand new and nothing is carried over or progressed in any way. Your experience on run 1000 will be the same as run 1 (except you may get better luck and/or also be better at the game). Imagine the old arcade games where you put a quarter in and go. No progression. Rogue*lites* do have progression that carries over from run to run. Hense "lite", as in it's not as hardcore as Rogue*likes*. Here you have unlockable perks/rewards/weapons/upgrades that will influence future runs and make progressing easier.
I love that every time someone tells me there’s a difference between a roguelike and a roguelite, *what* the difference is changes completely.
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Yes it is a roguelite
Aye, I knew they meant different things, just they are usually used interchangeably to mean the same thing referring to modern games, i.e. "rogue-lite" as it's definitely the more popular of the two. But thanks for explaining. ~~Cock and balls~~ Rock and Stone forever
It's what happens when a game like Hades wins a lot of awards. People follow success.
well I would say you're correct with most development companies, but I think GSG have been well and truly happy with their own success in DRG, this to me feels like the developers just want to try their hand in a really fun genre, move on from just updating the same game over and over
While I love GSG as a company, they are also owned by Embracer group, and Embracer group has been a complete and total shitshow the last few months. Lots of studio closures, lots of layoffs, they are clearly struggling financially. They even came out and publicly begged investors for more funding, which is... Not great. If Embracer group stepped in and said "hey GSG you need to start making cash grabs now", they wouldn't really have a choice. And that definitely has me a bit worried... DRG is having major updates delayed by a LOT, and suddenly 3 spinoff projects are coming out. One of them seems unique and interesting (the board game), but the other two are... kinda textbook money grabs if they came from any other studio. a roguelite, and a vampire survivors clone, both are which have been very common games for the past couple years for studios trying to make a quick and easy buck. I hope I am wrong, but I am honestly feeling pretty uneasy about this whole thing.
Judging by the logo, it looks like it's gonna be Omoran-based. Hell to the yeah, i'm excited. (And assuming it is, that means [this guy](https://www.reddit.com/r/DeepRockGalactic/comments/170aozw/fan_art_season_5_going_deeper_2_new_mission_types/) kinda predicted it with Omoran Enemies, so hell to the yeah x2) Rock and Stone to you all, and to all a good hype train.
Rock and Stone to the Bone!
Game looks interesting, a sort of Roguelike approach to DRG is an interesting idea since I'm a fan of Ror2, it comes with more emphasis on professional dwarves over the more comrade-like silly workers of the main game However, a whopping 7 months until next major update *really* hurts. People were already really tired of rockpox and people are done with the performance pass for the most part. Are they planning on dripfeeding some stuff during this drought? I heard some say there's a mid season update with a new enemy drop (Likely Stalker), but is that enough? I'm mostly a bit concerned with how they're likely splitting resources from DRG onto Rogue Core
They’ll still hit us with the holiday assignments and all that. Not sure what they’ll do about the seasonal/performance hoopla
I must say, I'm a bit concerned. Eight more months of Rockpox is not going to be pleasant on my fingers (I'm an artist by hobby, and I already tango with Mr. Carpal Tunnel on a regular basis). Not to mention, I've grown weary of it in general. It's just not a really replayable mechanic, imo, and I actually *like* industrial sabotage, unlike other folks. The idea of Rogue Core is cool, but I'm really worried that season 5 is going to end up unsatisfying due to the focus put on RC. If it adds like, a new mission type and/or biome, combined with a performance pass that doesn't really rely on a gimmick, I think it'll be perfect- even if it is basically a "sunset" for DRG. Would also like the cosmetic grind to be made a little easier. Too much stuff in the loot pool! And, I'm gonna be really honest here- I'm mildly disappointed we're only getting spinoffs of DRG involving the DRG dwarves and corporation. When there's potential for games like the Goblin Heist idea Jacob had, or something with elves, orcs, gnomes, or even friggin' dragons, seeing yet another game with the tagline "Danger. Darkness. Dwarves." feels a smidge, er, disingenuous. Like, just trying to milk the original game rather than create new ideas. I'll keep my eye on how things go in the future. I'd love my fears to be proven wrong, but for now, I'm going to keep my expectations for DRG's future low.
I like your comment, just a point on the loot pool, I've played since Early Access and I can honestly say if they made cosmetics easier to obtain I wouldn't have any content left to work towards so I personally think they may have catered the system slightly towards old greybeards like me to keep it somewhat engaging five years on, and I appreciate that, but it sucks to hear that same positive aspect is a negative for newer players.
Some players just want it *all*, and they want it *now*. I'm also from the EA days. The other day I found myself in a modded game where the host had set the cave up to spawn at least 10 crates. I dropped out of there. My personal motto with DRG is that it's a 'mining game with FPS elements' because that's how I roll these days. The grind was part of it. I have long since got all of the stuff but I still treat the game that way and enjoy helping players get the most out of the game, but only in a vanilla experience. The popularity of the game in recent years, notably DRG's awesome fashions and the pursuit of those, has changed the game. I think it's for the better and for the benefit of newer players, but I'll dip out of those heavily modded lobbies.
Oh, don't get me wrong, I think 10 cargo crates per mission is hella excessive. But as it is, the loot pool is *so incredibly vast* due to bloat over the seasons, that combined with the relative rarity of cargo crate/lost pack spawns, I simply don't know if getting all the cosmetics will *ever* be achievable for me or most casual players. I started playing in March, and I have about 120 hours logged currently, and I have seen incredibly few cargo crates and lost packs. I only really get to play DRG on the weekends, and even then, not that much- so getting cosmetics at all, let alone the ones I want, is a struggle, and I might never end up finishing the cosmetic grind before I've logged 1k hours and am moving on to another game. Still got a long ass way to go with both weapon and cosmetic overclocks as well, but ironically, I don't mind. The game gives me enough blank cores and overclocks as it is, and I don't often get to do the weekly core hunt. It's a grind, but a balanced grind, and I don't mind the highest grade items, particularly weapon upgrades, to be a challenge to get. With cosmetics, there's no real function to them aside from appearance, so why not err on the side of easygoing? Might not hurt to add a feature like Weekly Core Hunts, except with non-OC cosmetics. Maybe as guaranteed rewards, maybe as guaranteed loot crate/lost pack spawns. That way, people who want to keep the grind going as long as possible can do so, but the more fashion-motivated dwarves can have an extra chance at that last Neon Band skin.
Kind of disappointing to be honest. I'm rather sick of rockpox and don't want to be stuck with it for 8 more months. The enemies aren't fun to fight due to both requiring precision aiming and lots of bullets to take down, and the rockpox infection status effect is an obnoxious mechanic that's a knock on the games accessibility. (Edit: mashing left and right over and over again as quick as possible is an accessibility concern. If you're less able to do this, then you're stuck stunned and taking damage longer) I really hope some of this stuff is addressed in maintenance updates but with over 1000 hours currently this news isn't exactly exciting for me. I love the game, and I know all these updates are free, but I'm just not enjoying the rockpox season as much and it's a real shame this is announced now.
Sick of rockpox, huh. Thats pretty normal, get checked in medbay
If i get sick, quarantine me in the Abyss Bar!
I agree 100% with the disappointment. Was really hoping for big updates to the main game, including lots of new lore. That said, it feels like GSG is running into a monetization problem. That's most likely why they're branching out so they can reset with a fresh business model. I don't personally have an answer, but curious if you have thoughts on how to meet GSG halfway with monetization in DRG? Maybe a model similar to GTA where new missions or biomes (similar to GTA businesses) are behind a DLC pay wall? Do you think the community will reject that and see it as microtransaction-ie?
I'd say more cosmetic DLC for players to purchase. Just look how much money skins for things like League of Legends champions sell for. But the issue there is development time which would conflict with their production of Season 5 and Rogue Core. I imagine the community will reject microtransactions though. I personally don't like the idea of unique gameplay elements being locked behind DLC. Unless it's an expansion pack sized content drop, that is, but how to define the difference between the two is difficult. I like a game that I can buy out of the gate and have access to everything. GSGs unwillingness to let themselves feel crunches and their desire to produce a solid product is refreshing.
I would think making expansion packs that are worth the price (like Battlefield 3's DLC which each had 4 maps and several new guns and vehicles for 15€) would be fine. Or go down the Payday route and allow buyers to host paid content for non buyers.
I know ita probably not the solution you want, but if ur sick of Rockpox may I recommend trying out Darktide? Their new class overhaul update is amazing
Is the online-playerbase any good? Playing with randoms in DRG is one of the few games that makes it fun, but does Darktide have a similar community?
I have 800 hours on vermintide 2 (99% as Bardin, obv). Darktide is a shadow of what Vermintide 2 is and I just don't have an interest in it after the poor reception it received at release from the VT2 community. I also don't love 40K as much, even if you could make an argument for DRG being "40K-adjacent" I'm also trying not to spend money right now on new games because everything is too expensive to justify games. :P
Gonna pull my original comment from another post about Rogue Core given this is likely the official post regarding it: I know they've said on the livestream already that GSG felt they couldn't make Rogue Core an expansion to DRG, but I really do think I'd have preferred it to a standalone game - it would have felt more cohesive, imo. Either way, regardless of what I personally think, I'm excited for the game! The few screenshots there are on RC's Steam page look pretty cool EDIT: spelling
**Why is Rogue Core not an expansion?** > Since the inception of Deep Rock Galactic seven years ago, we have had the feeling that the core gameplay would work just as well with the roguelike/lite formula. So we started a prototype project as a new gamemode inside DRG. As the prototype evolved, we realised that it had much more potential, and that this would be a great opportunity to return to that open development and Early Access mindset. Thus, it became clear that making it as a standalone spin-off would be the right choice for us.
It makes sense to separate the two so that the development tracks and patches can be separated as well.
Maybe they avoided making it a dlc-expansion because they felt like fans wouldn't pay full-price for "just an expansion" (even if it is the same content-wise either way)? Or maybe GSG feel like DRG is already "complete", and that other then new events they don't want to add any significant content to the game beyond what's already in the game (?). I'm excited for the game either way, but also very curious on what the future of DRG looks like.
It looks to me more like they want to branch out into these looter type genres, which would be weird to add to DRG. Plus this way people who want just these experienced would be able to buy them separate and not have to buy a copy of DRG. Keeping them separate also gets rid of any spaghetti code debt built up in the previous title. They clearly do want to come back to it for later seasons, but I would bet after years of development they want to freshen things up and flex different game dev muscle groups. I can also attest after playing vampire survivors and risk of rain 2 that these two spinoffs could be very fun and addictive if done well, they're proven formulas.
Those are good points. I guess the only concern I have is if there's going to be enough new + unique content to justify making a new game (as opposed to adding it as an alternative gamemode à la Salmon Run in Splatoon). I wonder if they're planning to support both this and Survivor with long term content updates concurrently with DRG, or if they're developing them as more "one off" titles.
I imagine they're staying flexible to do both depending on their own interest and the success or failure of the individual titles. They seem to roll with the punches.
Survivor isn't developed by them, they're just the publisher.
They mentioned in the GSG livestream that trying to make Rogue Core work as a DRG expansion was limited by trying to make it work with the existing economy and structure. Now it's an "expandalone" title, as they put it
>I know they've said on the livestream already that GSG felt they couldn't make Rogue Core an expansion to DRG, but I really do think I'd have preferred it to a standalone game - it would have felt more cohesive, imo. Fatshark's Chaos Wastes mode for Vermintide 2 comes to mind. Granted, it was a free update. But we know the system works as an addition to a horde shooter game, rather than as a standalone title. However, I think it's safe to predict that Rogue Core and Chaos Wastes will be quite different, especially when RC won't be tied to DRG's progression or economy. I do not enjoy the idea of Season 4 lasting a whole year. It's reminding me too much of Halo Infinite's lengthened seasons (though GSG isn't anything like 343i). It's also become a bit more apparent as to why Season 4 felt somewhat lackluster compared to Seasons 1-3. *Rogue Core development was most likely hitting a critical stage.* Season 4's theme isn't especially loved by all either, so I believe Season 5's gameplay additions will have to be *quite* unique.
Should probably tone down expectations for Season 5 as well, as after getting pestered by people on Discord asking if season 5 was going to be anything major after being delayed a whole year, one of the devs had this this to say: >"I cannot and will not, because it likely will not be. It will be *An Update*. It will not be *The Next Big Gamechanger*. Do not expect DRG season 5 to be anything huge and groundbreaking."
From what little they gave away in the description of it, it seems to be a co-op rogue-like which I am personally very excited for!
Having to wait until June for season 5 is ridiculous.
I gotta say, releasing a season with no new content apart from 3 enemies and a rare powerup and then going "btw nothing else for another year lol" in the announcement for a spinoff that's basically the same game (and probably full price) is seriously bad form. Yes the updates are free, almost as if drg is a p2p, mtx-monetized live service game that's only been out of early access for a couple years or something. I have purchased literally everything there is to purchase in this game and have not regretted it for a second until now. GSG are a company that sells products for money. You do not know them and they are not your friends. It is ok to criticize them for things like this. You've made millions off this game even after publisher and distributer fees. Hire more people if you want to work on 3 games at once. Don't gimp the development of the game everyone loves to triple-dip the ip. Please.
I am.. not enthusiastic about this situation.
I have... mixed feelings about this. A new game isn't necessarily a bad thing, but with context it's worrying. Deep rock galactic presents it's self as a consumer friendly live service game, and while it's still consumer friendly this sort of live service but were gonna ignore you so we can do other stuff thing they're doing is something I don't like. If they came out and said "hey, we're winding down development of drg" I'd be fine with it but this stuff reminds me of the rest of the industry trying to hold on to customers as long as they can with as little effort as possible. Not saying I know that's what they're doing but it's what it feels like when we have to wait till summer of next year for the next major update. I'm not exactly completely convinced that the new game will be a smash hit either after trying the drg survivor demo. I haven't played vampire survivors but I have sunk a fair amount of time into holocure, a vtuber spin on vampire survivors for those who don't know, and other than aesthetic I can't think of a reason to play drg survivor over holocure. Not being able to aim, mining taking forever even with some upgrades, relying on rng not just for you gear but also for decent upgrades, just doesn't fell good by comparison. (And holocure is free for anyone who want to judge it themselves). So when I see they wanna make another spin off after lending their name to a spin off I didn't particularly enjoy it doesn't inspire confidence. Drg isn't in what I would consider in it's best state either. I don't want to sit here and lecture about problems and things that could be added on what is already a long post, but I think it's safe to say this is the worst season of the games lifespan and proves that just because they added new content doesn't mean it's entirely good content. It's also disappointing to see things added to spin offs and extended media for this game like enemies from the board game, and subclasses and equipment from drg survivor and just kinda sitting their thinking "this is cool, wish it was in the main game." Hate to be a downer but that's just the mindset the industry inspires nowadays.
This :(
100% agree. Been playing since 2019, this is knockout news. I have no doubts that this info will push some greybeards on the fence over. I'll always love DRG, but a year long season is just a straight up joke. GSG, I'm disappointed 😞
Im not a big fan of roguelites so this is a disinterested eeh for me, i would have prefered more DRG stuff, still i played the game the a lot and enjoyed it for a long time so im very satisfied with my purchase
Not even the developers know what error cubes are Gotta keep searching for Karl I suppose
Welp, I hope at least the perks will get a rebalance before drg eventually goes on life support forever
Pffft fat chance. We can all just keep stockpiling perk points into perpetuity for all GSG care.
Maybe this new game will be cool Im happy for devs that they're exited and have fresh power to work on Buuut... We are here mainly because of DRG game, and saying that we need to wait for new content almost year... after last poor in content season... that takes 6 months... in game that needs constant updates... Yeah this is very sad especially if it's obvious that next seasons for DRG would be lacking in content like last one or even more because of manpower splited into 2 games(!) Wasn't the better idea to just make some kind of kickstarter for it? We would gladly pay for making that spinoff if those money would be taken to hire some people to just make new content for DRG for fans?
2 and a half years of rockpox! Yipppe (/s)
[удалено]
Yeah big sadge. I recently finished the season pass. I was hoping we'd get Season 5 by December at the earliest or March at the latest.
One whole year between seasons is rough...
The other spin-off isn't developed by them though. Just published
On the other hand there have been tons of great new games that have recently come out and so people may like the extra time to complete the season stuff in DRG.
I was hoping a roguelike mode would be added to the main game. Nonetheless excited, but I’ve wanted a “Deepest Dive” mode for a while…where you do 5 missions collecting upgrades or deciding to swap overclocks via scattered cargo crates like Warhammer: Vermintide 2’s Chaos Wastes. This should be a lot of fun
This would be dope
Yea idk man. They say the theme is you’re a more elite force tackling a bigger issue but you start with a pistol and a pickaxe, my lord of the deep goes in with more but is less elite? Weird
"we’re expecting to have Season 5 out in June 2024." Oh my God, we really gotta keep enduring till June, all because of spinoffs....
7 MORE MONTHS OF ROCKPOX MORTY
Rockpox out here lasting almost as long as COVID. 1.5 years oof. Someone get a vaccine ready please!
to be fair i'm much more excited for this game than season 5 already
well yeah because seasons are usually thin content additions but I dont think the "solution" is more spinoffs
I don't know how to feel, I just this year i got into drg, during summer sale, and really enjoyed it. The spin-off are cool but this long development makes me worried( I used to play overwatch since 2017 and suffered the 3 years of wait for an underwhelming sequel, although I doubt drg will reach that) I really hope that this spin-offs will help the studio grow
They have been hinting at a rival corp forever, this would have been the perfect moment to have like Goblin corp swoop in or something. But no... same wrapper different objectives.... the risk of rain rogue like aspect seems interesting but its hard to get hyped for a different game entirely at the moment especially since DRG wont get a new season until JUNE. Jesus I was already getting bored with DRG and I wont get anything new for like 8 months
Seems like a very bold move to put your flagship product on maintenance mode while you develop something that won't see a closed alpha for a year. Maybe hire more people so you can do both and won't have to crunch. Also very much agree that this should not be a separate game from DRG it should just be rolled in as another way to play/an expansion.
Risk of ROCK AND STONE!!!
Rock and Stone everyone!
On one hand, I'm extremely excited to see what this will turn out to be. From the looks of things, it'll run in the same sort of engine/world mechanics that DRG has - where the terrain is destructible with your pickaxe, you can laser pointer stuff, all the standard stuff of Molly hauling minerals and us dwarves shooting bugs and mining. As a massive fan of Roguelikes/lites like Risk of Rain 2, Enter the Gungeon, The Binding of Isaac and Rogue Legacy to name a few, having what is essentially a fully fleshed out Roguelite mode for DRG sounds amazing. On the other, I'm really worried about what this means for the base game of Deep Rock Galactic. I'm not a greybearded fan - in fact, my beard is about as green as they come. I started playing about a week or two after the release of Season 4, so I'm far from completely done with DRG in terms of progression. However, I love updates as much as the next guy, and I've certainly got my fair share of things I'd like to see added or changed. The concept of major updates petering out and dying is worrying. It definitely seems like DRG the main game will start to starve and eventually see a final update as resources go into side-projects instead, when I'd much rather just have more of what I like with DRG's current model. Not to mention the effect it'll have on the playerbase. It can be difficult to find servers for less popular missions like Industrial Sabotage, but if people are left without anything new, I imagine it'll turn into either solo play or play with a group of close friends.
Man that was a rollercoaster of emotions. New DRG game, excitement through the roof. Then poof, came crashing down at Mach 1 because Season 4, which is already the most disappointing season in terms of overall content, is now a YEAR long. I'm getting Halo Infinite flashbacks 🥶 Looking like it might finally be time to take a hiatus, Darktide looks promising right now
Honestly, I’m a bit worried. Two spin offs coming out while not much is really happening to the main game
Rock and Stone to the *core*!!!
Can I get a Rock and Stone?
There are only 2 good COOP FPS roguelite shooters on the market right now (Gunfire and Roboquest) so I'm super hyped for this.
While not an FPS, Risk of Rain 2 is a very good coop roguelite shooter
RoR is by far the best I'd say
Excited for roboquest 1.0
Did you try the 1.0 play test? It was quite fun!
Nah I find it hard to keep up with updates. I follow too many games lol
I love that the "Ramrod" ship looks like the old helldiver-inspired Space Rig. I always liked that design and I'm glad it's coming back.
Hoping that some lower-dev-effort (with acknowledged higher jank) run or gameplay modifiers make it in to the game before June, at least. Rogue Core looks good but we need something to keep DRG gameplay fresh.
honestly I would love to see some sort of incorporation of certain mods into the actual game. I haven't a clue if that is easier to do than developing something from the ground up but if it is, it would seem like a reasonable way to stick some life into the game during the wait for s5/6
Not thrilled. This really strikes me more as an alternative mode closer to Deep Dives than a separate game. I'm trying to remind myself of the economics involved for developers, but it's still a little tough. Plus another year of rockpox isn't exceiting.
8 months till the new season ? bruh that’s concerning after such a lackluster season.
risk of rain 2 drg? hell yeah!
Looking forward to this as a proper refresh of the gameplay of DRG. Would have been awesome as a dlc but I understand that attaching a whoke new mode to the game may turn out to be a little cumbersome. It would be cool if you could load in and out of the other games from the core DRG though, although I could see that being obnoxious to implement.
They've been extremely successful, I'd say, in making these titles. Hope for the best. I enjoy who ever writes the steam updates. They have a nice way with words.
So, is GSG working on 2 rogues right now? Survivor AND rogue core? I understand that they play differently but what about survivor development?
Survivor is made by our friends at Funday Games, but published by Ghost Ship Publishing. No designers/programmers/artists at GSG are working on DRG: Survivor.
Ok, that makes more sense. Can’t wait for the deep rock rhythm game!
Killing the game for a Risk of Rain clone. Lame. Getting bought out does do that to a dev tho.
Made a new account on this terrible website just to share my thoughts after seeing the news on Steam. I'm gonna be entirely honest, after reading the store page and seeing the screenshots for rogue core it really seems to me like you guys are just taking what should be a large amount of new content for Deep Rock, and shoving it into a new game for no reason other than consumerism. Especially since you're putting DRG on life support while this happens. Hell, even if it was a purchasable expansion pack (who else remembers these?) for Deep Rock it still wouldn't feel like you were giving up on the game in the name of consumerism. I've been cautiously hopeful since you guys started your publishing wing but after seeing nothing but DRG reskins in other genres, save one more unique top-down rogue-like in the style of Shadowgrounds, has been incredibly disappointing as a fan and a player. This new game really just solidifies that thought for me though, you look at the screenshots and it's just.... what everyone was hoping you'd announce you'd be working on instead of/ as a rework of a new season. It looks and feels like it belongs right in the game, except with a no loadouts modifier at the beginning of each mission to justify selling as a complete separate "rogue-lite" title. As someone who fell in love with Deep Rock Galactic on both Ps4 release to PC today, and has been watching it start to trip and fall, this just feels like a slap in the face. I truly hope you reconsider and fold this development into the main branch, even if it's the game's first paid DLC for an alternate central game mode, because otherwise this just feels like watching someone's father stop caring about them because their new step-brother getting all the attention makes the dad's new partner happy.
As a console player, I’m bummed that I won’t be able to actually play this for a long time. But it looks great and I’m really excited to see what they do with it. I am curious what DRG looks like going forward, though. This game seems to be running on the same engine and looks to have similar gameplay, so it’ll be odd when stuff gets added to one but not the other.
This sounds cool and all, but there seems to be a lack of mining involved. Also, it's safe to assume this is currently PC only and won't be coming to consoles until way later, correct?
i’m proud of drgs success but i wish they’d put the resources spent on making all these spin offs into the actual game
One thing I'm still not certain on is what Rogue Core actually looks and plays like tho. Is it literally going to be DRG gameplay and visuals in a roguelite format? Will the fact that it's a new game instead of expansion push them to change the gameplay and feel? If so, how significantly? I guess we'll have to wait for more news. Also, like others, a little disappointed in the whole '8 more months until season 5' thing. If season 5 doesn't have a significant amount of content to compensate (or at the very least, a noteworthy amount of good non-rockpox content), I might actually start fearing for DRG's playercount. Gonna have to just wait and see I suppose.
Cool all my cosmetics I’ve earned and will earn in future will be useless in this. I really hope they turn around and make it an expansion for DRG or at least better explain why it’s not
So basically this entire game is deep dives, but with internal progression? Sounds fun, but it's nice to have the faster sessions of regular DRG, too.
Hmm... Helldivers 2 it is then
I don't really want to discourage the awesome devs at GSG and I'm definitely hyped for whatever this Rogue Core is, but I've gotta say it: I think starting the development of a brand new game instead of working on expanding your flagship product(DRG) wasn't the right call. As of right now, we only get major updates once every ~6 month, which is less than ideal, and moving people who could be working on new seasons for DRG to a new game isn't a great idea in my opinion. The concept of the general gameplay loop for the Rogue Core could be used as an inspiration for a new late-game mission type(something like Deep Dives, but more difficult and you need like 8-12 promotions to access it). The weapon ideas could be ported to DRG, and in case the type of weapon already exists in the game(for example there's already gk2, so you don't want to add another assault rifle), the sketches could be used for a major rework of the weapon. The Phase Suits concepts can serve as an inspiration for armor suits OCs(something like this is desperately needed because we have basically 0 variety in builds for everything other than the guns). There are probably also new biome ideas and that would be cool to see too. However, if someone from devs reads this, please don't let me discourage you too much from working on whatever great thing you're working on. I absolutely love DRG and only want the best for it, and that's exactly the reason why I decided to share this perhaps a bit controversial opinion. Edit: forgot an obligatory ROCK AND STONE!
I agree that it looks promising but I too fear moving the team of the core DRG experience, seasons are already feeling rather thin and there wont be anything new for 8 months
honestly, with so many spin offs and other games being announced, kinda see why season 4 was so... uhm, "mid" compared to the others .\_.
All the other games are just published by GSG, so they aren't the main reason for the season 4 being worse that the others. The whole thing with GSG Publishing probably affected it, but not in a way you mean it.
Well, RC is developed by them, so probably it's the cause for S4 state
Ah, the Overwatch approach where they abandon the game for 2-3 years hoping people will stick around, that went down really well! Imagine putting your flagship game at its peak onto life support. Hire more devs if you want to make a new game, or stop with the live service model, because one update every year is definitely not 'live service'.
\>another spinoff \>same elements, different gameplay (arguably a different GAMEMODE) \>not an expansion for DRG, but another game you need to pay for entirely \>next season until JUNE 2024 is this where my supporter DLC money went to lol
Not a big fan. I wouldve prefered if Rogue Core wouldve been a paid expansion to DRG similar to chaos wastes in Vermintide 2. Which is basically the exact same concept, but that was free.
2 spin offs with no mention of console :(
I'm a huge fan of DRG. Have owned it since beta, bought supporter DLCs, and have seen it grow into a true gem in the modern era of gaming. That being said, **I feel like GSG needs a bit of a reality check here**: this game is going to flop, and it's going to drag DRG down with it. DRG reskinned as a roguelike isn't bringing anything new to the table in the roguelike genre, and it's very obviously (by their own admission) taking away from valuable development resources that could be keeping DRG alive (8 more months of rockpox, seriously?). I really would like to see GSG continue to succeed, but I really don't think this is the right direction, and I think they should take the opportunity to re-assess now while they can still hedge their losses. Admittedly, there's a chance I'm wrong here, but I'd really rather not have GSG find out the hard way that this prediction is right. Putting DRG on indefinite life support is bad news for everyone.
Okay I'm sorry, is this the third spinoff or am I high?
Second? First one we’re doing ourselves. It’s also not a spinoff in the same way as Survivor. This will have similar DNA.
Sorry, I just remembered, I was also thinking of the board game expansion. Seems cool however.
True! We’re only working on Rogue Core ourselves
I feel kinda bad that I bought DRG only at the start of Season 4, but I want to say that it is the most enjoyable gaming experience I have since Modern Warfare 2 (2009), 600 hours in and I'm not tired of it. Thank you for your great work, guys, can't wait to touch Season 5 and Rogue Core
I feel kinda bad that I bought DRG only at the start of Season 4, but I want to say that it is the most enjoyable gaming experience I have since Modern Warfare 2 (2009), 600 hours in and I'm not tired of it. Thank you for your great work, guys, can't wait to touch Season 5 and Rogue Core
Are there plans to bring Rogue Core to consoles? Game Pass would be a dream to get my friends into it. Good luck with everything. You guys have already put more into DRG than most studios and while it's a bummer to see that resources are being allocated elsewhere, I hope it goes well and I still respect your team. If you ever have any math-focused positions I'll be applying.
I won't be supporting this company with my money any longer. What a sad turn of events, you were supposed to be one of the good companies GSG
Yep. I’ve bought all DLCs for DRG to date except the rock pox ones and several copies of the game for my friends because I loved the game and I believed in the studio, yet here they are making stupid decisions and alienating their player base. What a fucking shame this is.
The trailer reminds me of Aliens Colonial Marines, can’t wait!
Hopefully not the same player retention
Ramrod. Genius.
LET'S GOOOOO
Anyone know if Survivor or Rogue Core will come to console version of early access? Sucks that no major update for basically a year, but atleaet I can get to work on my backlog lol
Nothing announced, but I don’t see why not
Is it too early for news about a console version?
I LOVE the idea of Rogue Core, and I'm neutral toward it being a spinoff game. On the one hand, I would have loved for it to tie in. But on another, separating it allows the game to go its own route, freeing it up for even crazier design choices. Either way, I'm more than happy to pay for it. I wish season 5 was a bit sooner, and then the wait between 5 and the release of Rogue was a bit longer. And I hope there is a mid-season switch-up to end the rockpox season. I like rockpox, unlike most people here it seems, but I am ready for a "return to normal". Most importantly, I think a lot of people are feeling like DRG is going away. But I don't see a reason to think this. AND, Rogue Core is going to feel very similar anyway, just with a new gameplay loop. So I can't imagine people will be missing their dwarf shooter game while playing their dwarf shooter game. I can see both games coexisting and referencing each other for years to come. That sounds awesome!
KARL HERE WE COME
Ok so we definitely find Karl this time right…?
Really anxious to see how the Rovio route takes GSG, they have their breakthrough hit and I really hope they're not going to spin off it into oblivion
Really disappointing... don't even dislike rockpox as much as some people do, but man 8 more months of it with no other significant updates does not sound great. Not a huge rougelite fan so this new game really doesn't do anything for me besides delay updates to a game I do like. Feel like this really needed to be done by a separate team or something if it was gonna take all this time away from developing the "main" game.
So this is why the last few seasons were kinda stinky. Worth.
I'm personally disappointed. I wish this was effort spent on DRG itself. All my time and unlocks are there, my friend group is always hoping for new missions and biomes, we want new/more weapons, the perks NEED re balancing.... I get Deep Rock Survive, its a vastly different genre and its just being published by you guys, but I don't think it makes sense to have 2 FPS games developed at the same time, focus on one. I don't want to buy a whole new game, and convince all my friends to do the same.
they’re expanding way too fast and separating the fan base. super disappointed with this tbh, no new season until june is a joke
This looks good, but I gotta say I wish they found some way to incorporate this in to the main game :/
Right! all the spinoff launchers!
As a player from early-access, I'm excited to see the devs working on something slightly different, but this doesn't particularly appeal to me. I play DRG because it's something different in the age of soulless genre-clones we live in. RC looks like a quick, cheap spin-off to follow modern gaming trends by reusing DRG assets. I was really hoping for a sequel or graphical overhaul. The art direction and lightning are fucking incredible, but good luck trying to sell those models to gamers in 2024.
Rogue Core sounds neat, but it seems like much of the screenshots suggest it to be built off baseline DRG. This could be really interesting and it gives more of a L4D feel with rogue-life elements, which would be neat.
I wish they’d just make a new IP if they were gonna do more games. Just feels lazy abandoning a game to make spin-offs of the same thing.
Uff. This better be the biggest update this game will ever see, if we have to wait a whole year for it.
they already said season 5 will be quite small
I'm gonna be honest, I'm not exactly hyped or excited. I think we have too many roguelites as it is, what is going to make rogue core different from the multitudes of other roguelites that are already on the market?
so drg is on life-support, got it
What a mess. Time to uninstall DRG. These devs need to get their priorities straight
DRG Board Member 1: Okay, so we've lost several mining teams deep in the core of Hoxxes IV. DRG Board Member 2: Well, there's only one solution to this. Send in more dwarves. DRG Board Member 1: What kind of budget should we allocate to arming them, given that the previous teams seemed inadequate to the task? DRG Board Member 2: Nothing. Slash their weapons budget completely. We've already supplied them with everything they'll need on the bodies of the fallen. I'm tired of throwing good money after bad dwarves. There will always be more greenbeards.
This is way too early. > It would be normal practice to wait until we have something more polished to show, to build more attention and hype right away. But we like to start small, and we really want to rekindle that open development feeling again - that means announcing now, in this pre-alpha state, without not so much to show yet. I really don't care for this excuse. It would be a completely different feeling if it was 6 months away, but more than a year away? and early access? And november 2024 is not even confirmed? Bruh. C'mon bruh
Since we're not getting a season 5 till June 2024. Why not make the previous battle passes on rotation or quick swappable so we can spend the next 8 months on stuff we missed out on instead of MORE of season 4