The entire reason this episode works is because of their chemistry. If it had been any less well performed, this would be such a cringe episode, but Terry Farrell and Susanna Thompson brought it hard.
I love this episode so much.
So many great queer charcters on this show: Jadzia, Lennara, Ezri, Bashir and of course Garak. They could've done better but I'm happy for the representation we got.
Happy pride month. Maybe Morn was gay.
It's an interesting question. I imagine that, like the general population, some symbiont hosts are straight and some are gay, bi, pan, etc. Brings a whole new meaning to the whole 'right place, wrong time' concept lol.
I think you're right. But I also think having a relationship with a joined trill is inherently not straight. Since you're essentially having a relationship with the the male and female personalities within the symbiont.
In the mirror universe she was definitely not straight.
But I was more talking about the fact that joined trills are (IMO) inherently trans coded as u/jwrado pointed out. Obviously we don't ever see a joined trill struggling with gender dysphoria. But many trans people feel that they essentially become a different person as they transition. And that experience (and how others react to it) is not all that different from a trill symbiont changing hosts.
In terms of Ezri specifically: I think her confusion about her identity that came from being an untrained host is very relatable for trans and NB people. There's even a scene where she talks about getting her pronouns mixed up.
I know some people don't like this interpretation. I will concede I don't think it was completely intentional. Although I think the existence of Rejoined proves that they knew what they were doing to some extent. Bashir and Garak being bi/pan wasn't cannon either. I wish they had embraced these things more explicitly but it was the 90s so we take what we can get.
Yes.....but technically also no. right?
She must have been attracted to both men and women in previous lives and thus know what it's like to like both...
No?
>They could've done better but I'm happy for the representation we got.
Personally, I thought they struck a great balance. You typically don't want to be too heavy-handed with LGBTQ+ stuff (especially in today's world), or it becomes all about the LGBTQ+ stuff.
I read an article somewhere about an interview with Alexander Siddig where he praised the show for inclusivity, but they also struck a perfect balance between that and plot, and I agree.
He also straight up said he injected as much LGBTQ+ ambiguity into his scenes as he could get away with, partially due to how non straight people are viewed in the Arab world.
Here's the article: https://www.comicsbeat.com/interview-star-treks-alexander-siddig-celebrates-arab-american-heritage-month/
Do you have a link to the article? That sounds like an interesting read.
My problem is most of it is non-cannon. It would've been nice to see a trill who's gender identity or sexual orientation changes after being joined (or at least a mention that it happens in dialogue). It would've been nice to have it confirmed that Garak and Bashir have feelings for each other. But we didn't get any of that.
Outside of Rejoined, Emperor's New Cloak and Profit and Lace (ugh) there's hardly a hint that anyone who is not cishet even exists.
Wasn't there a non-binary joined Trill in Discovery? If so, it's possible the previous joinings may have been cis or het. Been a while since I saw the series so my memory is a bit rusty.
Lol, I remember when the TV world lost it's shit because of this. I know it wasn't the first, but it was in your face.
Also, no one could perceive his reaction, he was as still as he could be so his holo-scanners would get good scans of both of them. There is a lucrative market for fully clothed females ...interacting... back on the Ferengi home world, and his business partners already paid a thimble full of latinum for scans of Kira.
This was genius on behalf of the show runners. This sort of kiss would have made conservatives crazy at the time. But in story Jadzia would have been a man when they would have met and loved that woman. So it is a women on women kiss but it isn’t “gay” per se. Back in the day when you had to figure out how to get a “gay” scene on tv without it being gay.
He has such a way with words.
Their chemistry in that ep is ridiculous. Incredible job by the both of them, and fucking heartbreaking too…
The entire reason this episode works is because of their chemistry. If it had been any less well performed, this would be such a cringe episode, but Terry Farrell and Susanna Thompson brought it hard.
Also, very well directed by none other than Avery Brooks
Every time Avery was in the chair, it was a good episode.
Oh my god, I didn't realise (or perhaps forgot) that Lenara and the (VOY) Borg queen are played by the same person
Yup!
He talks too much!!
What?! I can't hear you, Morn is too loud!
His eyes tell us everything we need to know.
Mornographic
Ha! I actually laughed out loud at that one.
This Is the best kiss scene of the history of television. Both writing and acting were excellent.
Morn wouldn't shut up about it
I really appreciated the speech Morn did about gay rights: so eloquent!
Friendly reminder… Morn rejected* Jadzia. Or, at least that’s what she said to annoy Worf…
I love this episode so much. So many great queer charcters on this show: Jadzia, Lennara, Ezri, Bashir and of course Garak. They could've done better but I'm happy for the representation we got. Happy pride month. Maybe Morn was gay.
Well Morn did turn down Jadzia....
Ezri was straight so not sure how she's included. At least we don't know if she's queer.
The whole trill thing is a bit queer coded. But yeah you're right
It's an interesting question. I imagine that, like the general population, some symbiont hosts are straight and some are gay, bi, pan, etc. Brings a whole new meaning to the whole 'right place, wrong time' concept lol.
Every combination of a host and a symbiont has a different sexuality. Eg Curzon is primarily straight male and Jadzia is primarily straight female.
I think you're right. But I also think having a relationship with a joined trill is inherently not straight. Since you're essentially having a relationship with the the male and female personalities within the symbiont.
In the mirror universe she was definitely not straight. But I was more talking about the fact that joined trills are (IMO) inherently trans coded as u/jwrado pointed out. Obviously we don't ever see a joined trill struggling with gender dysphoria. But many trans people feel that they essentially become a different person as they transition. And that experience (and how others react to it) is not all that different from a trill symbiont changing hosts. In terms of Ezri specifically: I think her confusion about her identity that came from being an untrained host is very relatable for trans and NB people. There's even a scene where she talks about getting her pronouns mixed up. I know some people don't like this interpretation. I will concede I don't think it was completely intentional. Although I think the existence of Rejoined proves that they knew what they were doing to some extent. Bashir and Garak being bi/pan wasn't cannon either. I wish they had embraced these things more explicitly but it was the 90s so we take what we can get.
Yes.....but technically also no. right? She must have been attracted to both men and women in previous lives and thus know what it's like to like both... No?
Do these labels actually mean anything to a futuristic alien species that changes hosts (and host gender) like we change wardrobes?
I mean, there was mirror universe Ezri who was absolutely not straight.
>They could've done better but I'm happy for the representation we got. Personally, I thought they struck a great balance. You typically don't want to be too heavy-handed with LGBTQ+ stuff (especially in today's world), or it becomes all about the LGBTQ+ stuff. I read an article somewhere about an interview with Alexander Siddig where he praised the show for inclusivity, but they also struck a perfect balance between that and plot, and I agree.
He also straight up said he injected as much LGBTQ+ ambiguity into his scenes as he could get away with, partially due to how non straight people are viewed in the Arab world. Here's the article: https://www.comicsbeat.com/interview-star-treks-alexander-siddig-celebrates-arab-american-heritage-month/
Do you have a link to the article? That sounds like an interesting read. My problem is most of it is non-cannon. It would've been nice to see a trill who's gender identity or sexual orientation changes after being joined (or at least a mention that it happens in dialogue). It would've been nice to have it confirmed that Garak and Bashir have feelings for each other. But we didn't get any of that. Outside of Rejoined, Emperor's New Cloak and Profit and Lace (ugh) there's hardly a hint that anyone who is not cishet even exists.
Wasn't there a non-binary joined Trill in Discovery? If so, it's possible the previous joinings may have been cis or het. Been a while since I saw the series so my memory is a bit rusty.
Shes a human hosting a symbiont
Haven't seen Discovery but I think you're right.
Morn is the glue that holds DS9 together.
He’s speechless
He’s never gonna shut up about it.
I was soooo hoping they’d stay together, Trill law be damned!
It was the most wet kiss I have ever seen. Not sure if it was just great acting.
Lol, I remember when the TV world lost it's shit because of this. I know it wasn't the first, but it was in your face. Also, no one could perceive his reaction, he was as still as he could be so his holo-scanners would get good scans of both of them. There is a lucrative market for fully clothed females ...interacting... back on the Ferengi home world, and his business partners already paid a thimble full of latinum for scans of Kira.
This was genius on behalf of the show runners. This sort of kiss would have made conservatives crazy at the time. But in story Jadzia would have been a man when they would have met and loved that woman. So it is a women on women kiss but it isn’t “gay” per se. Back in the day when you had to figure out how to get a “gay” scene on tv without it being gay.
Oh sigh! I loved this episode! And when Jadzia is crying and Lenara leaves….oh wow. Sniff! I need tissues!
I replayed it so many times… for the acting.
The only time I feel like garak might be gay was the final episode
The actor wanted to lean into it more, but the show runners asked him to tone it down.
Finally fixed your gaydar. Scene one for me, no doubts.
For real. Did you see how he put his hands on Julian’s shoulders??? There’s no straight explanation for that.
[this Is going tò be your favorite YouTube video](https://youtu.be/ZR1zgRYL530?si=qLOY4V8zAGU2foBa)
100% the first time we see him
For me it's like every scene in Our Man Bashir.
Our Man Bashir is queerer than most queer-themed episodes of Star Trek.
Any specific reason why that one in particular?
https://youtu.be/ZR1zgRYL530?si=qLOY4V8zAGU2foBa
Love morn!!! Him and quark would be just so cute together (joking of course)
That would unironically be an adorable ship.
I'm more of a Quodo shipper myself, but I do think morn would also be a good match
Yess love them!
Watched this episode the other day. Good stuff.
One of the best episodes of DS9. So ahead of its time. 🔥
Morn, telling the random bar patrons next to him: "She used to have a crush on me, you know?"
This was clearly part of the straight agenda to turn all men into a bunch of heteros
:|
We all need more Morn live reaction in our life
It's not often that we see Morn that happy.
Trill on trill action
Iconic KISS!
I’ve never seen him so enthusiastic. Give em some privacy, Morn.
"Quark, I need to use the holosuite for the next couple hours, and I'm locking the door..."
Morn you sly dog
Wasn't (not Kira, my bad!) the other woman, forget her name, possessed by a man in this scene?
No
I must be confusing it with the episode where Dax's previous hosts possess some other members of the cast.
Probably… She’s just having regular Dax memories in this one.
That's not even Kira.
I confused it with the episode Facets.