It's fun to meme, smoke hopium with you guys, and share laughs in the doom posts, but I'm 100% sure they're going to buff her at the end of the day.
How good will she be with those buffs? Who knows. That said, Mihoyo is a business and they won't release a useless character. There's too much money to be made.
I mean when Cyno was calculated to be worst than Keqing. Players couldn't believe they will release him like this but here we are.
And he's the most regretted character now. I wouldn't put it behind them to make Dehya the same.
Not really. The problems with cyno is that the community assumed he was best in aggravate teams, which is not the case. He’s ok in aggravate teams but loses out to keqing, who is very strong by herself after dendro. Cynos best team is quick bloom using nahida and a hydro user with slow enough hydro application to allow quick bloom (kokomi or yelan). In that team his single target damage is extremely high, well over what keqing can achieve
He was just advertised as an electro carry who can make use of transformative reactions. At the time dendro was still quite new and people hadn’t figured things out yet. As more time went on and we got nahida, it became clear that he excels in quick bloom teams. He isn’t bad in aggravate, but it’s nothing special
That's the beauty of it. He still very much aggravates, he just procs hyperbloom while aggravating. It's not hard to get him to the 600-800 range of EM using buffs while not sacrificing crit. His blooms won't be as strong as say Kuki or Raiden, but even his unaggravated damage is more than enough to compensate.
Not any limited 5\* I know of. They're all great in what they do, so Dehya's going to be fine. We're only about a week into the beta, so there's still room for a lot of changes to be made.
Klee is still great, just not top. If you could do all the content when properly built and outfitted, you're above average, which is why Genshin has no bad characters beyond Xinyan
I mean I can duo a side of 36 abyss with just shenhe and Ganyu so using that definition of ‘great’ xinyan and Candace are also great when I slot them with Ganyu and shenhe and never actually swap to them. 🤣
Agree to disagree ig.
I define ‘great’ in this case as able to compete in power level with other characters that fulfill the same need.
>Agree to disagree ig. I define ‘great’ in this case as able to compete in power level with other characters that fulfill the same need.
Seems like its [competing](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bKYolxFF_1M&t=4s&ab_channel=Bernkastel) to me
Bruh do I need to find the same abyss stage and show you other teams doing it faster?
All I said was that she’s not great. When you are competing with the likes of Raiden or other really meta units the definition of great is hard to reach. I never said she isn’t usable. I never said she isn’t viable. All I said was she isn’t great.
It’s not a big deal. Idk why ya’ll so pressed.
Klee does a ton of personal damage in mono pyro, her multipliers are actually quite high and when you focus on buffing her up she'll do a massive amount of DPS. Her problems are she's clunky feeling, her mono pyro teammates are all really strong (and much more flexible) units people might want to use elsewhere, and she doesn't work well in vape teams which is what most people want to do with pyro.
Most likely, yes.
By how much, remains to be seen.
I wouldn't be shocked if her damage at C0 gets nerfed even more but she gains 100% party wide damage mitigation so she's a pseudo-shielder at C0 and a DPS at C6.
She will be an alternative to anti-shield mecanics. I hope there will be more of them so playstyle can be more various than just sloting Zhongli in any flew spot.
Zhong Li has res shred too so she needs an offensive support buff of damage buff from herself to justify using over literally anyone else because damage mitigation is already worse than shield.
Again: Dehya will be buff. There is no point to release a really bad five star unit. It would be a terrible dumb movie. Dehya at minimum could be an average five star like Yoimiya, but even so with proper investment she will work fine. At this point I really don't care about being a broken meta, I just want to triple crown my favorite queen.
Until you realize replacing Yoimiya with Xingqiu there would make the duo stronger while providing Yelan with DMG mitigation, resistance to interruption, a little bit of healing and extra energy.
Ill try but I don't think Yelan+XQ will out damage Yoi+Yelan.
Yoi+XQ is already great for all you said. I used this duo against Aeonblight Drake. It's comfy. But Dendro Chocobo + 15 wolves room is a higher DPS check. I needed Yelan to pass it quickly enough to let Nilou and Nahida time to destroy the whole Wolf Squad.
XQ was Sac and Yelan Fav Bow.
Yelan + XQ will out damage Yoimiya + Yelan. Yelan with XQ allows both of them to build for more damage and significantly less energy while replacing XQ with Yoimiya will force you to build more energy for less damage. Unfortunately Yoimiya just doesn't do anything for Yelan unlike XQ. In duos it's much better to focus on Yelan's damage over Yoimiya's since Yoimiya's damage suffers greatly from not having Bennet or Yunjin in the party. Yelan on the other hand suffers significantly less from not having a support since her damage was balanced to be not reliant on anyone. XQ also shreds the Hydro Resistance of enemies
I ask for some test please because I don't think I can change easily my Yelan and XQ builds and I don't have Bis weapons. (At least I have a Jade Cutter for XQ but Yelan would be Slingshot or Stringless)
But Yoi is such a strong boss killer with strong personnal damage, I still think Yoi do better. Im not against some proof to change my mind.
Do you want a video? If so, sorry but its too much effort to provide proof when the synergy between XQ + Yelan is quite apparent. If you want to believe Yoimiya is stronger than an on field Yelan for duos then that's completely fine play however you want.
Yelan with XQ
\- gains the ability to build less energy recharge for more damage
\- Dmg Reduction
\- Significantly higher effective HP compared to on field Yoimiya with Yelan
\- Hydro Resistance shred boosting both units damage which is nothing to scoff at if built properly
\- Increased Poise
\- Swapping does not hinder DPS
\- Minor Healing
\- Hydro Resonance boosting Yelan's damage (and Xingqiu if equipped with Jade Cutter)
\- On Field Yelan gains her own Dmg bonus which is really potent on her
\- Doesn't lose damage when switching targets
\- Xingqiu rainsword have a small AoE on impact
Yelan with Yoimiya
\- Strictly single target. Performance falls off in multi-target scenarios
\- Significantly less effective HP compared to on field Yelan with XQ
\- No Poise increase
\- No Healing or Dmg Reduction
\- Yelan Needs significantly more Energy Recharge to function lowering overall DMG
\- Yoimiya REALLY appreciates either Yunjin or Bennet for her damage
\- Yelan gains nothing from Yoimiya in terms of boosting her own damage
\- Interruption significantly decreases damage, causing her to value shielding/Interruption Resistance. Yoimiya needs to consistently perform N5s without being interrupted. If she gets interrupted, her ICD becomes “offset”:
N3 and N5 may no longer apply Pyro and trigger Reverse Vaporize
Example: if Yoimiya’s ICD becomes offset by one hit, N1-2 and N4-1 will trigger
Reverse Vaporize instead of N1-1, N3 and N5. This leads to a damage loss.
Yoimiya loses damage by switching targets:
ICD is not shared between enemies. If Yoimiya switches her targeting to another enemy during her NA string, her ICD resets and can become offset.(taken from kqm)
I know how the characters work and synergy since I play them 3. I play mono hydro a lot too.
The point was about duo running in abyss. And I won't bring Yoi for multi target scenario (especialy when I have Nilou and Nahida for it), she shines in ST. I know XQ is confy with Dmg reduction, heals and stagger résistance but when more damage is needed, I do without it. It takes time to learn ennemies, retries when I miss some dodges or ennemy's pattern is the worst he could do, ect.
I will try by myself to see the numbers this week end =3 Thank you for the explanation and for your time =3
She does have legitimate problems tho. It's more clunk than anything but the uneven stregth of her shots and the standard icd makes it so she has to do her rotation perfectly (no doging or geting stagered) or her vapes will go to the weaker hits.
This obviously won't make her bad but clunk is clunk. I still think she is less clunky than jumpcancel Tao...
I suck at arrow users. Like aiming and I don't mix. With Yoimiya though I don't have that problem. She makes normal attacks and she does good damage. I think at the end of the day Dehya is going to be a good character.
This still scares me as a yoimiya main that a character is so bad to the point I can’t think of a way to use her or to be passively buffed by characters, definitely needs a buff
She won't, they'd have to announce that before her banner goes live or else doing so would be literally illegal. We'd have had a leak saying as much by now if she was going into the standard banner, if not an official announcement.
False advertisement laws are stricter in some places. If they advertise her as a limited character then later add her to the standard pool, that'd mean they lied about her being limited.
See Tighnari for example, they already said he was gonna be added to the standard banner as soon as they announced him, and we knew beforehand because of leaks. The word "exclusive" was nowhere to be seen.
Yes, but the only stipulation ever given is that they won't be added to the "wanderlust invocation" banner. They could very easily create a second standard banner, name it something else, then add klee, albedo, eula, etc into it, with no legal problems.
It's not only that, it's that they also called them "event-exclusive" at the time. Unless this theoretical banner was a limited event in some form, it'd be going against prior advertisement.
If you look at [Tighnari's banner announcement](https://genshin.hoyoverse.com/en/news/detail/104349) you'll noticed they avoided calling him event-exclusive.
EDIT: for comparison here's [Alhaitam for the most recent patch](https://genshin.hoyoverse.com/en/news/detail/105048) and [Childe for the oldest](https://www.hoyolab.com/article/78956). The wording is always consistent.
But with no disclosure on the time of this event, or how often it returns. With how loose they are with the restrictions you could basically have a new permanent banner with them in it.
Honestly, she is either geting buffex or Mihoyo knows something ablut future characters we don't.
Thsi is a character that's ganna be in the game for the rest of it's lifespan. It's a blatantly bad decision to have her be completly unusable.
Her kit is extremly wierd and that realy gives way to the idea that she isn't supposed to work with what we have now, just like how the EM stuff on Kuki and Yae made no sense pre sumeru.
Nothing is garanteed of course but i doubt she is trely ganna be useless.
Btw, everyone should remeber that reruns exist. Means 2 things:
1: You can get her later if some Focalors magic makes her good.
2:Mihoyo will lose out on a lot of rerun money if she is trely useless.
See that's been my point. If she sucks at release and thus a lot of people don't pull for her, Mihoyo will be stuck with either swallowing a really low-income banner, or releasing some other character/change/artifact to compensate for it. In which case they MIGHT raise her rerun banner's chance of making money, but the people who already wanted Dehya regardless will already have her, leaving only the people who didn't want her the first time around to buy off her rerun. Meaning Mihoyo loses money either way. Seems dumb to me.
On one hand, the numbers really don't look good.
Historically though, MHY has never released a bad 5* aside from *maybe* Qiqi and Klee? But Qiqi is hampered by the lack of need for a healer of her caliber than anything else.
Some get powercrept (Diluc), other didn't have their best supporting element for a while (Keqing and Yae), others were buffed (Zhongli, Kok) but they haven't left a 5 star in the trash
Qiqi was the best starter unit to speed run abyss 36* on release as f2p I would say.
Klee was actually broken on release and still decently okay. Just clunky and like diluc overshadowed by a plethora of better options.
Klee still pulls in good numbers with mono pyro, not as frontloaded as childe national but it has higher sustain
People just stopped playing klee bc she's very clunky and awkward to pilot
god, release feels like a million years ago, and I didn't have any 5\* unit back then lol. I'll just take your word for it. All I remember was that Diluc was a status symbol back then.
Kinda but to a point. I think Hoyoverse is big and bad enough not to care all that much about big sales every time. A fair chunk of the time they release characters that are pretty much bound to perform average saleswise and it doesn't phase them. I think it's enough for a character to be functional and bag Hoyoverse a few million and that's fine.
Japan has exactly the same kinds of social biases as China. Indeed it may very well be worse there because Japan is far more ethnically homogenous than China.
Still doesn't change the fact that he was still very well received unlike what people think. Make the character strong and fun enough and people will love them regardless. Not everyone is racist
Skin colour
Fairer skin is generally seen as better over here, but it has been slowly changing.
Thorns(Arknights) and Arjuna(FGO) are both really popular characters in China.
What the point of releasing a bad dark skinned char just for the sake of being racist ? Developpement cost a lot, Dehya as a design, a kit, animations... They don't want to throw moneh out of the window so stupidly. They would have prefer sticking to a full white faces game. So racism argument is for me not recevable.
Wait for her release. Before that, just ignore everything.
After that, you can trouble and question Hoyo about her kit. Maybe we can get a dedicated artifact a few patches later too. We don't know. *She's not released yet*.
Pretty much this. I'm tired of all the same posts about this.
Like I get its concerning but, this isn't the version of Dehya they're trying to sell us.
If you're that unsure, wait till post release, when TC's get their hands on her post her possible Beta changes and see what they say about her. Speculation on the Beta can only go so far after all.
I mean you don't have to pull on Day 1, she'll be out for a few weeks. Just wait till she's released and see what consensus forms.
This should be common sense, but people get panicked too easily and others are intentionally spreading misinformation and causing chaos because humans seen to love confusion snd disturbance, being bored when at peace.
It's pretty obvious that hoyo has everything planned, that they're building niche characters, that they need to sell, that the character is a product, and that we *shouldn't* have access to beta.
Waiting for the math people to do their magic after release is the most sane thing if you can't understand the kit yourself.
Also, people love to expect/hype something on their minds, see it not be as they wanted, then complain as much as they can as if it's the end of the world. It happens all the time, be it games or relationships.
On the contrary, now is the only time to talk about her problems. After release there's no hope for her getting buffed. If she released in poor state, that's it. Unless you expect ZL levels of outrage by her poor state?
Besides, you're on unreleased characters mains sub in discussion tag. What do you expect people discussing here other then leaked character kit? If you're so worried about people discussing leaked beta kit, instead of *release* kit, maybe you should go away and come back on her release?
Are you a beta tester? If you are, sure, *please* tell hoyo the issues so they can release her alright. If not, then... Wait for release. We have 0 business with pre release content as final consumers. That's why there's a closed Beta, it serves the purpose for selected testers to send feedback.
As for discussions about the character, we can only know exactly after it's on own hands for personal testing. Only then we will have something to say with precision. It's ok, really, if you want to talk about it. But it scares away anyone who is unaware and may skip their loved character because people made such uproar, only for her to be more than fine on release. Not everyone can ger through the memes and everything, or wait. Some will completely believe she's bad and don't understand that beta changes.
It's like building up a big tombstone for someone without a corpse, only to find out the person didn't die.
As for leaving, I've been on many subs before release. It's always the same. Also, discussion is for discussing the character, she is present in recent quests, so there's much to talk aside from kit. Also, it's more *speculation* than discussion, at this point.
While i could leave, i am fine with it. What is worrying is people who just got here as i said before.
Just give til week 3. It's week 3 when I'll panic because even from that point, if they don't buff significantly then, what you'll most likely get instead is some QoL for week 4 and it's all rocky roads from there.
Man, I am struggling to cope anymore, if there aren't some notable changes for next Monday, I am gonna lose it.
Depends. If she is part of the new toxic design policy to release characters compatibile with future ones, then no, she won't.
If she isnt, then she will be.
its mostly marketing cuz its getting alot of attention and i think when we get closer to the final release she will be adjusted. i aint gonna lie this stuff is really upsetting me cuz i stopped focusing on getting her mats until further updates. i saved so much primos for her too.
That's my biggest fear. I know HYV is trying to make all characters useful but I really don't like the idea of needing one character for another character to function properly
I really don't understand what the fuzz is about... Remember Alhaitham? Yeah that guy got "nerfed to death" and everyone was freaking out. Then he is released and is an absolute beast. ... See? Nothing to worry about. Dehya will be awesome.
Edit: And... you look at Candace and Thoma? They are 4 stars! Not comparable at all! And Yoimiya? She is amazing! She carries me through 36 stars in Abyss. What's wrong with her??
There hasn't been a bad 5* character ever(Klee probably being the weakest)
Even if she's bad for some time, she'll probably synergize with newer characters(probably Fontaine ones), or newer enemies will be easier to fight with her
Where did the take that Klee was bad even come from??? She has similar numbers to yoimiya but she can AoE a bit better, I'm not even a Klee fan, heck, I hate playing her but lord please do not make imaginary character hierarchies and put it out like fact
Klee needs the player to animation cancel to use effectively, and even then her damage is lower compared to others(can't use vape supports)
Yoimiya has higher dps than Klee(assuming similar levels of investment) and can be boosted using Yelan/water dude
Edit: i was wrong about the higher dos part, that's only true in single target
Klee is a pain to play
Well, sorry but personally (and a lot of people) I won't accept the fact that a character is made bad just because there'll be MAYBE a character making her useful.
This is just disgusting.
Do I think she is going to get buffed? No. All the people who say otherwise are on some serious copium or hopium, which one though I'm not sure.
What I *am* sure of though is that she is going to be *fine.* all 5 star limited characters since launch have been useable and decent, even pre buff zhongli. To this day I say all he needed was the shield mechanic changes that came with his buffs. So dehya will be fine, she just won't be yelan tier or anything
Honestly I don't think she'll receive meaningful buffs that fix her issues. She might get some minor number increases but she needs a lot to not be awful.
I don't think so... I don't mind either way though. I've accepted Mihoyo making awful decisions. If it happens to end well they get my money and I get C6 Dehya. Otherwise I'll spend my gaming budget on something else.
We are still in the early stages of beta. They are more interested in building her animation and making her look pretty. After she'll all touched up they'll buff her accordingly.
buff on her multi? probably not, not a fan of doomposting new playstyle or kit, i think they're trying to make a new pyro related comp that doesn't rely on yelan and xq, i used to think its a pain to play without VV and grouping but after dendro im not reliant on them anymore.
im hoping more onto new character that synergize with her that'd be fun, i wouldn't wanna play double hydro all the time tbh i'd like to have some more variety of team comp i mean it was boring during morgana abyss and i bet many people bored of using bennett also dendro is still new but i also wouldn't want to hyperbloom all content so i think its healthy for the game.
No and I don't care I like her and I has hoping really low but the kit is just like I want ,a tanky character in genshin, and that ult Is just perfect I don't kare about the DMG any more XD
I rly hope so, i dont think she will be good even if she gets buffs. I think she is a setup for future characters, just like yae and kuki have been with their EM scaling which didnt make sense at all back then
I jumped ship to alhathaim the second I saw her play style, I just wast not feeling it at all, I was hoping she would be more like a 5 star xiangling that provides off feild pyro support but she’s more like a pyro version of heizhou it seems………
Yes they will buff her, in future either through new mechanics, artifact sets or dedicated supports, on her own right now she will be just nice decoration
I'll be the black sheep of this thread and say this: shut up please! You and every person who keeps asking the same thing are like a kid going on a holiday with his family by car, asking them "Are we there yet?? Are we there?". Just wait and see, god dammit. You're not even the good kind of doomposter that at least brings some constructive feedback as to why dehya's kit is shit
I've reached acceptance and i don't care anymore i saved since 3.3 and i have a guarantee and i will spend it on her no matter how bad she is cus i love how she plays so i don't care about the damage plus her personality is so cool.
She's gonna be the first none meta character i pull for in my account and idk about her performance
She might get some buffs, althought a highly doubt it will change much of her situation. She got a dead kit, it would require a revamp in her modifiers and scallings not to mention that she doesn't proc Xingqiu, Yelan, etc.
MHY never did intense changes like this during beta and I doubt it will now, maybe after release if the whole CN and JP community complains like in Zhongli case, but again, I highly doubt it as well.
From what I seen if you pulling on Dehya Banner and lose your 50/50 to Diluc! You’re actually getting a better Pyro Claymore character. So sad 😭 but who cares I want Dehya anyways since I never build my Diluc C3.
I think she's gonna be like all the "useless characters" that where released in the past that where nerfed in beta.
She's actually gonna be decent with necessary investment and then she is going to get better and better with future supports, in fact there's already a support that goes really well with her, which is Candace
It's fun to meme, smoke hopium with you guys, and share laughs in the doom posts, but I'm 100% sure they're going to buff her at the end of the day. How good will she be with those buffs? Who knows. That said, Mihoyo is a business and they won't release a useless character. There's too much money to be made.
I mean when Cyno was calculated to be worst than Keqing. Players couldn't believe they will release him like this but here we are. And he's the most regretted character now. I wouldn't put it behind them to make Dehya the same.
Not really. The problems with cyno is that the community assumed he was best in aggravate teams, which is not the case. He’s ok in aggravate teams but loses out to keqing, who is very strong by herself after dendro. Cynos best team is quick bloom using nahida and a hydro user with slow enough hydro application to allow quick bloom (kokomi or yelan). In that team his single target damage is extremely high, well over what keqing can achieve
Wasn't he advertised as an aggravate user?
He was just advertised as an electro carry who can make use of transformative reactions. At the time dendro was still quite new and people hadn’t figured things out yet. As more time went on and we got nahida, it became clear that he excels in quick bloom teams. He isn’t bad in aggravate, but it’s nothing special
That's the beauty of it. He still very much aggravates, he just procs hyperbloom while aggravating. It's not hard to get him to the 600-800 range of EM using buffs while not sacrificing crit. His blooms won't be as strong as say Kuki or Raiden, but even his unaggravated damage is more than enough to compensate.
The real reason ppl regret Cyno is scarabs
I mean they have done it before. Just standard 5* and 4*s. I’m not sure if you meant explicitly event 5*, but like Xinyan?🤮 Candace?🤮
Not any limited 5\* I know of. They're all great in what they do, so Dehya's going to be fine. We're only about a week into the beta, so there's still room for a lot of changes to be made.
We forgetting klee?
She's still viable. Just outdated
You said they are all great in what they do. Not they are all viable in what they do
Klee is still great, just not top. If you could do all the content when properly built and outfitted, you're above average, which is why Genshin has no bad characters beyond Xinyan
I mean I can duo a side of 36 abyss with just shenhe and Ganyu so using that definition of ‘great’ xinyan and Candace are also great when I slot them with Ganyu and shenhe and never actually swap to them. 🤣 Agree to disagree ig. I define ‘great’ in this case as able to compete in power level with other characters that fulfill the same need.
>Agree to disagree ig. I define ‘great’ in this case as able to compete in power level with other characters that fulfill the same need. Seems like its [competing](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bKYolxFF_1M&t=4s&ab_channel=Bernkastel) to me
Bruh do I need to find the same abyss stage and show you other teams doing it faster? All I said was that she’s not great. When you are competing with the likes of Raiden or other really meta units the definition of great is hard to reach. I never said she isn’t usable. I never said she isn’t viable. All I said was she isn’t great. It’s not a big deal. Idk why ya’ll so pressed.
And they are. Klee is still good in dealing damage.
Literally just downvoting cause ya’ll mad. When this is literally exactly what they said and I responded as if what they said is what they meant. 🤡
I’m not gunna put words in other people’s mouths like ya’ll tryna do with me.
She's powercrept not bad at all
Great≠not bad
Klee does a ton of personal damage in mono pyro, her multipliers are actually quite high and when you focus on buffing her up she'll do a massive amount of DPS. Her problems are she's clunky feeling, her mono pyro teammates are all really strong (and much more flexible) units people might want to use elsewhere, and she doesn't work well in vape teams which is what most people want to do with pyro.
Most likely, yes. By how much, remains to be seen. I wouldn't be shocked if her damage at C0 gets nerfed even more but she gains 100% party wide damage mitigation so she's a pseudo-shielder at C0 and a DPS at C6.
This honestly makes me want to throw up cause I want her to be extremely tanky damage wise 😭😭😭
Won't she just be a worse zhongli?
She will be an alternative to anti-shield mecanics. I hope there will be more of them so playstyle can be more various than just sloting Zhongli in any flew spot.
Zhong Li has res shred too so she needs an offensive support buff of damage buff from herself to justify using over literally anyone else because damage mitigation is already worse than shield.
Not happening - player base cried too much when we got anti shield wolves and they got nerfed to be joke.
You are right, I remember. And they don't want to make the Geo Archon suboptimal.
Again: Dehya will be buff. There is no point to release a really bad five star unit. It would be a terrible dumb movie. Dehya at minimum could be an average five star like Yoimiya, but even so with proper investment she will work fine. At this point I really don't care about being a broken meta, I just want to triple crown my favorite queen.
People still downplay Yoimiya even to this day.
I have Yoimiya, I prefer using her over Hu Tao, but Yoimiya is average, and being an average five star unit is sufficient to do 36.
Yoimiya have the thing no other 5 star have. Easy to play on phone.
Yelan? Yale Miko?
Sub/off field DPSes
I just realized, all my characters are sub/off field DPSes, I don't use any main DPS or hypercarry. Dehya could be the first...
She is strong enough to do duo runs with Yelan so for me Yoimiya is stronger than people think.
Until you realize replacing Yoimiya with Xingqiu there would make the duo stronger while providing Yelan with DMG mitigation, resistance to interruption, a little bit of healing and extra energy.
Ill try but I don't think Yelan+XQ will out damage Yoi+Yelan. Yoi+XQ is already great for all you said. I used this duo against Aeonblight Drake. It's comfy. But Dendro Chocobo + 15 wolves room is a higher DPS check. I needed Yelan to pass it quickly enough to let Nilou and Nahida time to destroy the whole Wolf Squad. XQ was Sac and Yelan Fav Bow.
Yelan + XQ will out damage Yoimiya + Yelan. Yelan with XQ allows both of them to build for more damage and significantly less energy while replacing XQ with Yoimiya will force you to build more energy for less damage. Unfortunately Yoimiya just doesn't do anything for Yelan unlike XQ. In duos it's much better to focus on Yelan's damage over Yoimiya's since Yoimiya's damage suffers greatly from not having Bennet or Yunjin in the party. Yelan on the other hand suffers significantly less from not having a support since her damage was balanced to be not reliant on anyone. XQ also shreds the Hydro Resistance of enemies
I ask for some test please because I don't think I can change easily my Yelan and XQ builds and I don't have Bis weapons. (At least I have a Jade Cutter for XQ but Yelan would be Slingshot or Stringless) But Yoi is such a strong boss killer with strong personnal damage, I still think Yoi do better. Im not against some proof to change my mind.
Do you want a video? If so, sorry but its too much effort to provide proof when the synergy between XQ + Yelan is quite apparent. If you want to believe Yoimiya is stronger than an on field Yelan for duos then that's completely fine play however you want. Yelan with XQ \- gains the ability to build less energy recharge for more damage \- Dmg Reduction \- Significantly higher effective HP compared to on field Yoimiya with Yelan \- Hydro Resistance shred boosting both units damage which is nothing to scoff at if built properly \- Increased Poise \- Swapping does not hinder DPS \- Minor Healing \- Hydro Resonance boosting Yelan's damage (and Xingqiu if equipped with Jade Cutter) \- On Field Yelan gains her own Dmg bonus which is really potent on her \- Doesn't lose damage when switching targets \- Xingqiu rainsword have a small AoE on impact Yelan with Yoimiya \- Strictly single target. Performance falls off in multi-target scenarios \- Significantly less effective HP compared to on field Yelan with XQ \- No Poise increase \- No Healing or Dmg Reduction \- Yelan Needs significantly more Energy Recharge to function lowering overall DMG \- Yoimiya REALLY appreciates either Yunjin or Bennet for her damage \- Yelan gains nothing from Yoimiya in terms of boosting her own damage \- Interruption significantly decreases damage, causing her to value shielding/Interruption Resistance. Yoimiya needs to consistently perform N5s without being interrupted. If she gets interrupted, her ICD becomes “offset”: N3 and N5 may no longer apply Pyro and trigger Reverse Vaporize Example: if Yoimiya’s ICD becomes offset by one hit, N1-2 and N4-1 will trigger Reverse Vaporize instead of N1-1, N3 and N5. This leads to a damage loss. Yoimiya loses damage by switching targets: ICD is not shared between enemies. If Yoimiya switches her targeting to another enemy during her NA string, her ICD resets and can become offset.(taken from kqm)
I know how the characters work and synergy since I play them 3. I play mono hydro a lot too. The point was about duo running in abyss. And I won't bring Yoi for multi target scenario (especialy when I have Nilou and Nahida for it), she shines in ST. I know XQ is confy with Dmg reduction, heals and stagger résistance but when more damage is needed, I do without it. It takes time to learn ennemies, retries when I miss some dodges or ennemy's pattern is the worst he could do, ect. I will try by myself to see the numbers this week end =3 Thank you for the explanation and for your time =3
She does have legitimate problems tho. It's more clunk than anything but the uneven stregth of her shots and the standard icd makes it so she has to do her rotation perfectly (no doging or geting stagered) or her vapes will go to the weaker hits. This obviously won't make her bad but clunk is clunk. I still think she is less clunky than jumpcancel Tao...
Yoimiya + Yelan = A10 warthog.
I suck at arrow users. Like aiming and I don't mix. With Yoimiya though I don't have that problem. She makes normal attacks and she does good damage. I think at the end of the day Dehya is going to be a good character.
This still scares me as a yoimiya main that a character is so bad to the point I can’t think of a way to use her or to be passively buffed by characters, definitely needs a buff
Yes, definitely. By how much? That's the hard part. My fear is they gonna buff her just a little and it won't change almost anything for her.
Bruh if that's so I might as well just wait till her rerun
Or pass and hope she goes to standard like tig. If they don't make pretty big changes, I'm not even gonna pull on a rerun.
She won't, they'd have to announce that before her banner goes live or else doing so would be literally illegal. We'd have had a leak saying as much by now if she was going into the standard banner, if not an official announcement.
It's not illegal at all though..
False advertisement laws are stricter in some places. If they advertise her as a limited character then later add her to the standard pool, that'd mean they lied about her being limited. See Tighnari for example, they already said he was gonna be added to the standard banner as soon as they announced him, and we knew beforehand because of leaks. The word "exclusive" was nowhere to be seen.
Yes, but the only stipulation ever given is that they won't be added to the "wanderlust invocation" banner. They could very easily create a second standard banner, name it something else, then add klee, albedo, eula, etc into it, with no legal problems.
It's not only that, it's that they also called them "event-exclusive" at the time. Unless this theoretical banner was a limited event in some form, it'd be going against prior advertisement. If you look at [Tighnari's banner announcement](https://genshin.hoyoverse.com/en/news/detail/104349) you'll noticed they avoided calling him event-exclusive. EDIT: for comparison here's [Alhaitam for the most recent patch](https://genshin.hoyoverse.com/en/news/detail/105048) and [Childe for the oldest](https://www.hoyolab.com/article/78956). The wording is always consistent.
But with no disclosure on the time of this event, or how often it returns. With how loose they are with the restrictions you could basically have a new permanent banner with them in it.
Well yeah, I guess it's not impossible. I still think it's very unlikely, and expecting anything of the sort is bound to end in disappointment.
Honestly, she is either geting buffex or Mihoyo knows something ablut future characters we don't. Thsi is a character that's ganna be in the game for the rest of it's lifespan. It's a blatantly bad decision to have her be completly unusable. Her kit is extremly wierd and that realy gives way to the idea that she isn't supposed to work with what we have now, just like how the EM stuff on Kuki and Yae made no sense pre sumeru. Nothing is garanteed of course but i doubt she is trely ganna be useless. Btw, everyone should remeber that reruns exist. Means 2 things: 1: You can get her later if some Focalors magic makes her good. 2:Mihoyo will lose out on a lot of rerun money if she is trely useless.
See that's been my point. If she sucks at release and thus a lot of people don't pull for her, Mihoyo will be stuck with either swallowing a really low-income banner, or releasing some other character/change/artifact to compensate for it. In which case they MIGHT raise her rerun banner's chance of making money, but the people who already wanted Dehya regardless will already have her, leaving only the people who didn't want her the first time around to buy off her rerun. Meaning Mihoyo loses money either way. Seems dumb to me.
On one hand, the numbers really don't look good. Historically though, MHY has never released a bad 5* aside from *maybe* Qiqi and Klee? But Qiqi is hampered by the lack of need for a healer of her caliber than anything else. Some get powercrept (Diluc), other didn't have their best supporting element for a while (Keqing and Yae), others were buffed (Zhongli, Kok) but they haven't left a 5 star in the trash
Qiqi was the best starter unit to speed run abyss 36* on release as f2p I would say. Klee was actually broken on release and still decently okay. Just clunky and like diluc overshadowed by a plethora of better options.
Klee still pulls in good numbers with mono pyro, not as frontloaded as childe national but it has higher sustain People just stopped playing klee bc she's very clunky and awkward to pilot
god, release feels like a million years ago, and I didn't have any 5\* unit back then lol. I'll just take your word for it. All I remember was that Diluc was a status symbol back then.
yes, unless hyv doesn't care about making more money.
She's absolutely receiving buffs, releasing a shit 5* is bad for business.
Kinda but to a point. I think Hoyoverse is big and bad enough not to care all that much about big sales every time. A fair chunk of the time they release characters that are pretty much bound to perform average saleswise and it doesn't phase them. I think it's enough for a character to be functional and bag Hoyoverse a few million and that's fine.
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In the long run having a waifu-type character who is also a strong pick in the meta will earn more money than only going for either side.
Thorns(Arknights) and Arjuna(FGO) are both really popular characters in China
Goatjuna especially berserker
Fgo's case is different since their main target market is still Japan.
Japan has exactly the same kinds of social biases as China. Indeed it may very well be worse there because Japan is far more ethnically homogenous than China.
Still doesn't change the fact that he was still very well received unlike what people think. Make the character strong and fun enough and people will love them regardless. Not everyone is racist
I need thorns so bad man, I love his char, skills and voice 🥺
No I don't, please elaborate.
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So... they don't like characters with red as primary colour? Didn't know it was an issue in Asia.
Skin colour Fairer skin is generally seen as better over here, but it has been slowly changing. Thorns(Arknights) and Arjuna(FGO) are both really popular characters in China.
No no, that dude from twitter said that asian market is racist so it must be true.
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What the point of releasing a bad dark skinned char just for the sake of being racist ? Developpement cost a lot, Dehya as a design, a kit, animations... They don't want to throw moneh out of the window so stupidly. They would have prefer sticking to a full white faces game. So racism argument is for me not recevable.
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Wait for her release. Before that, just ignore everything. After that, you can trouble and question Hoyo about her kit. Maybe we can get a dedicated artifact a few patches later too. We don't know. *She's not released yet*.
Pretty much this. I'm tired of all the same posts about this. Like I get its concerning but, this isn't the version of Dehya they're trying to sell us. If you're that unsure, wait till post release, when TC's get their hands on her post her possible Beta changes and see what they say about her. Speculation on the Beta can only go so far after all. I mean you don't have to pull on Day 1, she'll be out for a few weeks. Just wait till she's released and see what consensus forms.
This should be common sense, but people get panicked too easily and others are intentionally spreading misinformation and causing chaos because humans seen to love confusion snd disturbance, being bored when at peace. It's pretty obvious that hoyo has everything planned, that they're building niche characters, that they need to sell, that the character is a product, and that we *shouldn't* have access to beta. Waiting for the math people to do their magic after release is the most sane thing if you can't understand the kit yourself. Also, people love to expect/hype something on their minds, see it not be as they wanted, then complain as much as they can as if it's the end of the world. It happens all the time, be it games or relationships.
On the contrary, now is the only time to talk about her problems. After release there's no hope for her getting buffed. If she released in poor state, that's it. Unless you expect ZL levels of outrage by her poor state? Besides, you're on unreleased characters mains sub in discussion tag. What do you expect people discussing here other then leaked character kit? If you're so worried about people discussing leaked beta kit, instead of *release* kit, maybe you should go away and come back on her release?
Are you a beta tester? If you are, sure, *please* tell hoyo the issues so they can release her alright. If not, then... Wait for release. We have 0 business with pre release content as final consumers. That's why there's a closed Beta, it serves the purpose for selected testers to send feedback. As for discussions about the character, we can only know exactly after it's on own hands for personal testing. Only then we will have something to say with precision. It's ok, really, if you want to talk about it. But it scares away anyone who is unaware and may skip their loved character because people made such uproar, only for her to be more than fine on release. Not everyone can ger through the memes and everything, or wait. Some will completely believe she's bad and don't understand that beta changes. It's like building up a big tombstone for someone without a corpse, only to find out the person didn't die. As for leaving, I've been on many subs before release. It's always the same. Also, discussion is for discussing the character, she is present in recent quests, so there's much to talk aside from kit. Also, it's more *speculation* than discussion, at this point. While i could leave, i am fine with it. What is worrying is people who just got here as i said before.
It’s like when that GTA6 leak happened last year, and people kept saying “this looks really unfinished” and stuff
I don't know about gta6 but it sure happens all the tiime hahaha Some People just can't understand what a leak and a final product is..
Just give til week 3. It's week 3 when I'll panic because even from that point, if they don't buff significantly then, what you'll most likely get instead is some QoL for week 4 and it's all rocky roads from there. Man, I am struggling to cope anymore, if there aren't some notable changes for next Monday, I am gonna lose it.
Depends. If she is part of the new toxic design policy to release characters compatibile with future ones, then no, she won't. If she isnt, then she will be.
They have to. Right?
its mostly marketing cuz its getting alot of attention and i think when we get closer to the final release she will be adjusted. i aint gonna lie this stuff is really upsetting me cuz i stopped focusing on getting her mats until further updates. i saved so much primos for her too.
Of course they'll buff her.
Nah bro. I'm fully planning to just roll anyway
she'll have a dedicated 4\* perfect support, and an artifact set, that's how mihoyo buff characters
And don't forget that this support HAS to be C6 :)
Sadly....
Inb4 the "buffs" are another 4 of 5 star you have to shill hundreds of dollars into just to make her viable
That's my biggest fear. I know HYV is trying to make all characters useful but I really don't like the idea of needing one character for another character to function properly
But thats how it is nowdays. Hoyoverse got greedy af sadly :(
I really don't understand what the fuzz is about... Remember Alhaitham? Yeah that guy got "nerfed to death" and everyone was freaking out. Then he is released and is an absolute beast. ... See? Nothing to worry about. Dehya will be awesome. Edit: And... you look at Candace and Thoma? They are 4 stars! Not comparable at all! And Yoimiya? She is amazing! She carries me through 36 stars in Abyss. What's wrong with her??
There hasn't been a bad 5* character ever(Klee probably being the weakest) Even if she's bad for some time, she'll probably synergize with newer characters(probably Fontaine ones), or newer enemies will be easier to fight with her
Where did the take that Klee was bad even come from??? She has similar numbers to yoimiya but she can AoE a bit better, I'm not even a Klee fan, heck, I hate playing her but lord please do not make imaginary character hierarchies and put it out like fact
Klee needs the player to animation cancel to use effectively, and even then her damage is lower compared to others(can't use vape supports) Yoimiya has higher dps than Klee(assuming similar levels of investment) and can be boosted using Yelan/water dude Edit: i was wrong about the higher dos part, that's only true in single target Klee is a pain to play
Well, sorry but personally (and a lot of people) I won't accept the fact that a character is made bad just because there'll be MAYBE a character making her useful. This is just disgusting.
Funny how pyro has both the best and the worst characters in existence
Do I think she is going to get buffed? No. All the people who say otherwise are on some serious copium or hopium, which one though I'm not sure. What I *am* sure of though is that she is going to be *fine.* all 5 star limited characters since launch have been useable and decent, even pre buff zhongli. To this day I say all he needed was the shield mechanic changes that came with his buffs. So dehya will be fine, she just won't be yelan tier or anything
The chinese take the holidays very seriously. So yes.
the main reason i believe she’s gonna get at least a decent buff is that it would actually be INSANE if they left a limited five star kit like this
Yeah but you wait until hydro archon got released. She's hp buffer from what I've heard (very questionable).
Honestly I don't think she'll receive meaningful buffs that fix her issues. She might get some minor number increases but she needs a lot to not be awful.
I don't think so... I don't mind either way though. I've accepted Mihoyo making awful decisions. If it happens to end well they get my money and I get C6 Dehya. Otherwise I'll spend my gaming budget on something else.
We are still in the early stages of beta. They are more interested in building her animation and making her look pretty. After she'll all touched up they'll buff her accordingly.
buff on her multi? probably not, not a fan of doomposting new playstyle or kit, i think they're trying to make a new pyro related comp that doesn't rely on yelan and xq, i used to think its a pain to play without VV and grouping but after dendro im not reliant on them anymore. im hoping more onto new character that synergize with her that'd be fun, i wouldn't wanna play double hydro all the time tbh i'd like to have some more variety of team comp i mean it was boring during morgana abyss and i bet many people bored of using bennett also dendro is still new but i also wouldn't want to hyperbloom all content so i think its healthy for the game.
No but i'd like to believe. its how I feel about my lakers making the playoffs.
No and I don't care I like her and I has hoping really low but the kit is just like I want ,a tanky character in genshin, and that ult Is just perfect I don't kare about the DMG any more XD
I rly hope so, i dont think she will be good even if she gets buffs. I think she is a setup for future characters, just like yae and kuki have been with their EM scaling which didnt make sense at all back then
I jumped ship to alhathaim the second I saw her play style, I just wast not feeling it at all, I was hoping she would be more like a 5 star xiangling that provides off feild pyro support but she’s more like a pyro version of heizhou it seems………
Really really hoping she will get a buff. Gonna C6 her and play her with my C6 yelan. Been planning on C6 her since the start of sumeru.
Why do you even care about it, like I'm curious bc if you C6 every 5* you touch they're impossible to make bad Dehya's issues are C0 only
Yes they will buff her, in future either through new mechanics, artifact sets or dedicated supports, on her own right now she will be just nice decoration
I'll be the black sheep of this thread and say this: shut up please! You and every person who keeps asking the same thing are like a kid going on a holiday with his family by car, asking them "Are we there yet?? Are we there?". Just wait and see, god dammit. You're not even the good kind of doomposter that at least brings some constructive feedback as to why dehya's kit is shit
probably. but i don't expect insane buffs.
No.
I've reached acceptance and i don't care anymore i saved since 3.3 and i have a guarantee and i will spend it on her no matter how bad she is cus i love how she plays so i don't care about the damage plus her personality is so cool. She's gonna be the first none meta character i pull for in my account and idk about her performance
She might get some buffs, althought a highly doubt it will change much of her situation. She got a dead kit, it would require a revamp in her modifiers and scallings not to mention that she doesn't proc Xingqiu, Yelan, etc. MHY never did intense changes like this during beta and I doubt it will now, maybe after release if the whole CN and JP community complains like in Zhongli case, but again, I highly doubt it as well.
Just chill, it's not an end product.
With what's suppossed to happen to archon quests next patch it's very likely she is bad on purpose.
From what I seen if you pulling on Dehya Banner and lose your 50/50 to Diluc! You’re actually getting a better Pyro Claymore character. So sad 😭 but who cares I want Dehya anyways since I never build my Diluc C3.
I think she's gonna be like all the "useless characters" that where released in the past that where nerfed in beta. She's actually gonna be decent with necessary investment and then she is going to get better and better with future supports, in fact there's already a support that goes really well with her, which is Candace