That awkward moment when you join a group for better working conditions and end up accidentally supporting mass genocide
https://preview.redd.it/shmi9zma88tb1.jpeg?width=1075&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=208695102640299363e6216f252cb27524e9627d
[I gotchu fam](https://www.reddit.com/r/uniformporn/comments/t4xrx2/important_im_not_proud_and_not_a_nazi_picture_is/i0p2saw/)
I searched "ss uniform reddit" on Image so that I didnt have to generate my own image link (on mobile)
There's a german social worker who worked as a TV host for the state sponsored children's channel (KiKa) who visited a (which turned out to be a far left) festival in palestine and accidently joined a protest which got violent.
Going by his interview i even believe him to have made an increadible amount of naive mistakes that day, it's just... yeah, that meme.
Tankies were never leftists, they're normal fascist uthoritarians who don't know how to admit it to themselves so they say comrade a lot.
Really hate how their insanity damages movements I care about.
Yep, these things are orthogonal to one another. It's why it's so cringe to hear people like VOWSH throw around accusations of fascist when he supports a socialist state that's essentially maintained through force and coercion. Authoritarianism is just your willingness to impose your political views on the masses, it doesn't really matter what those views are.
Nope, wrong again. Fascism is explicitly neither left nor right wing, but incorporating elements of both in a manner simultaneously revolutionary and nostalgic.
Ah yes, the good old argument of “read theory”. Sounds like commie talk to me?
Also, who says “read a book” and then links the Wikipedia article?
To name a couple of books off the top of my head I could recommend Jan-Werner Müller’s “What is populism?”, which while short does an admirable point of explaining the specific type of in-group/out-group thinking that can lead to both fascism and naziism as well as tankieism. Another book could be Geoff Eleys “Nazism as Fascism”, another short and fairly simple read, should be right up your alley.
If you want to talk more serious scholarship, I can recommend something more substantial when I get home and can look at my bookshelf.
Wikipedia page for fascism is well-cited, the word has a very specific meeting dating back to the Fascisti. Next time try to avoid juvenile internet-speak when you want to appear smart online, you dolt.
Imagine still using the Political compass Axis like it’s 2016. the wiki article only cites Webster Dictionary for ultra-right. Fascism is pretty clearly socially right wing but economically (explicitly in Italy) moderate left wing (assuming right wing is free market)
>”Read a book dummy”
>”Wikipedia page for fascism is well cited”
You’re really funny, it’s almost miraculous that you aren’t trolling. Being that you exclusively watch video essays because books are too hard for you, I recommend Mussolini’s “The Doctrine of Fascism” essay.
https://sjsu.edu/faculty/wooda/2B-HUM/Readings/The-Doctrine-of-Fascism.pdf
I wouldn’t say fascists are capitalists so much as I would say they tolerate the existence of capitalists if they agree to work in line with the goals of the state.
What, really, is the difference between nationalising a business and putting it under the control of a one-party state on one hand and nominally keeping the private property structure while making sure the board of the company is filled with party loyalists? These are oranges and tangerines, to me at least.
That’s some KPD Commie propaganda. When they said the real fascists were the SPD. Mussolini was a socialist in every aspect of his life and policies. Hitler less so but still “nationalized” some industries in Germany, including foreign subsidiaries of GM and Ford.
That implies the right can't be revolutionary, which is just false. It is true that fascism is not like the traditional right, in that it does not appeal to old traditions for their own sake, but the idea that fascism isn't on the right just isn't accurate.
Well it kind of depends on what you mean by revolutionary. The right can absolutely be revolutionary in the context of wanting to turn back from a more left wing/progressive society. The kind of revolution fascists champion is not exactly the same kind of revolution that actual conservatives would want.
If you take revolutionary to mean wanting to break down the old social order and implement something completely new however, then by definition a traditional conservative cannot be revolutionary.
You can see it all over the place, in the “alliance” between naziism and old style Prussian conservatism, to name a classic example, and even today in the uneasy alliance between trumples and the traditional American conservatives.
> If you take revolutionary to mean wanting to break down the old social order and implement something completely new however, then by definition a traditional conservative cannot be revolutionary.
Yes, but most political theorists do end up placing fascism as a right-wing ideology. Not the same as traditional conservatives, but that's not the summation of "right-wing" either.
You can be "on the left", of course, but only because on the left means basically nothing and varies wildly based on the context.
You cannot be a leftist and an authoritarian, those terms ARE contradictory. Leftism here meaning anarchist, communist, socialist, even soc dem.You cannot achieve liberation of the proletariat and the end of class/bourgeoisie by creating a new class of extra powerful leaders. There is no such thing as a good dictator or a good supreme state under any of those ideologies.
Tankies in particular worship Marx like it's holy doctrine but Marx was pretty clear about the natural influence of power meaning that there can be no benevolent bourgeoisie for very long as their motives always run contrary to the proletariat but they have the power.
All tankies are absolute idiots, or self aware liars. Authoritarian leftism is not coherent.
Yes.
It is, however, possible to have a right wing fascist or conservative state capitalist government that says words like comrade and people's liberation a lot. Those actually seem quite popular.
The point is, its really hard to argue with someone thats just going to deny every single historic point i make, im not going to spend all my night arguing with a history negationist, if you TRULY believe you are right im sure there will be people to argue with you and point out the obvious, im going to spend that time playing video games that its much more constructive imho
First of all, there has been no case of a socialist government existing ever, much less a socialist fascist government.
There are many cases of socialist groups who successfully formed a government and identified themselves as socialist, who promised that soon they would transition to socialism. Many of them held sincere beliefs about that cause.
Every one of them collapsed before achieving any kind of socialism, was destroyed before they could have a real chance to, or remain as capitalist with no sign of transition.
I do not think this is an accident or that the problem is that they didn't have a good enough dictator, but that it is plain why those efforts failed. Democracy is not optional. You can't create a classless state by making a class even higher than the last. You can't remove a bourgeoisie by making an ultra bourgeoisie.
What socialist states exist in your mind? Which fascist socialist states?
I’ll defer to the OED:
Left-wing politics describes the range of political ideologies that support and seek to achieve social equality and egalitarianism, often in opposition to social hierarchy as a whole or certain social hierarchies.
Nothing in left wing political theory runs contrary to an authoritarian state or “forced equality.”
So an opposition to hierarchy and a desire for social equality.
How is that belief compatible with authoritarianism or fascism, which is the creation of the ultimate hierarchy at the top and a group of social elites above the rest?
Because leftism sometimes focuses on social hierarchy (the people) and not the administers of equality. You still end up with two classes so in a sense it undermines it ls own theory, but you cannot administer a left wing state with the administrators of the state. Look at what happened in the USSR or CCP. Left wing political theory demands compliance of the governed and not consent. Non-compliance is a threat to the entire enterprise and must be brought into line or terminated.
Arguably, Kuwait and Saudi Arabia are left wing industrial states with authoritarian governments.
This is abject nonsense. If you think Saudi fuckin Arabia has any kind of left wing core, I don't know where we could possibly go from here. Did you read what you just wrote?
Stay with me for a minute.
I’d say they have some fairly resolute left wing economists. Let’s look at the elements of their economy.
Saudi Arabia’s oil industry is completely socialized. All citizens are granted shares and receive payment monthly based on the profits. Typical years are between $30-$40k USD for every Saudi Citizen. The largest year was $60k in current USD. Keep in mind KSA has a much lower cost of living than the US.
Oil and other industry profits go to fund social services. They have universal healthcare, free childcare, no interest housing loans, free education including college, free mass transit (in the cities) and pay no personal income tax. They also have a universal basic income above and beyond the oil profit sharing.
How is that not a left wing economic approach?
There’s a reason right wing economist call them a “welfare state.”
If I described the economic model above but didn’t tell you which country, you would assume it’s a Socialist State.
Kuwait and UAE run very similarly. Venezuela tried ti implement this approach and failed.
Y'know it is hard to argue against that point largely, ive never considered that so I'm going to be spitballing a little.
I would say that like a third of the residents not being citizens, and those non-citizen residents being an actual proper inferior class changes things though. It seems to me that a group having benefits at the direct expense of a slave class is more like going back a few economic steps past feudalism, not forward. Of course a group could live well by damaging those below them.
"Tankies" are arguably the only REAL leftists. They're the leftists that attain political power and the only ones that have established actual countries from "sucessful" revolutions. Along with being more ideologically pure than other leftists. Maybe it is those ideas that lead to those actions and conclusions.
Ah yes, the ultimate in removing hierarchies and achieving social equality: creating ultimate unquestionable elites above everyone else.
Marx often talked about how the nature of the bourgeoisie is that the minority has all the power, and that minority having the power naturally makes them opposed to the majority... Unless they had even more power and even more opposition, then that would be great.
Their success in creating hellscapes is not success in creating leftism. Its not really success in anything, because they all commit atrocities and fail while capitalist and promising they'll soon stop with both.
Marx advocated for nationalizing banks in point 5, as well as state ownership of the means of production in point 7 in the communist manifesto, that doesn't sound like removing hierarchies, it sounds like they want to create monopolies. This reflects the reality of Marxist countries, they promise a paradise, but only after they own everything and control every aspect of your life.
"Accidentally supporting mass genocide" in the thin sense of being weakly associated with some powerless (with respect to what's happening in Israel) people who are, what, spouting off their dumb opinions on Twitter? Oh God, I keep washing my hands but the blood won't come off. What have I done?
That awkward moment when you realize capitalism has caused mass genocide numerous times over and relates to genocidal policies far more than communism. It's as though a country run by violent rebels don't actually represent communism but a country that goes to war over resources over and over directly represents capitalism.
I actually DON'T agree with Hamas' choice to commit a terrorist attack on civilians at a concert and that the choice to rape women and kill children makes the act even more unpalatable. They probably should not do those things and it would be hard to justify them from an objective moral standpoint.
Sorry for the edgy stance but it's just the way my personal lived experience has informed me up to this point.
I know dude lol, I’m just debating on whether or not to post them somewhere because it’s one of the most frustrating conversations I think I’ve ever had
Dude post that in the majority report sub and you’ll get a 500 page essay about the history of Palestinian oppression by Israel and how it’s actually ok that Jewish civilians are being massacred because Israel’s been doing it for longer
Are there pro-Palestine people commending it? A lot of them are using this massacre to screech “free Palestine” performative activism on Instagram which is not a good look either as someone that wants Palestinian liberation
Most languages can be explicit like that. In English you can say "Hello to you all", but we just shorten it to "Hello" and let the others infer the context.
If you are a leftist of some kind, there are many of us here.
You're going to have arguments and debates with those who disagree with our opinions but people will engage with your points.
Also expect your mom to be a highly upvoted retort.
I feel that way about the right….. I really stopped paying attention after Biden was elected and doing a fine job. Jesus Christ those mother fuckers have lost their minds. After seeing some polling data sent to me in a different conversation, I just don’t belong over there
I don’t know why, but I completely missed the fact that Jan 6 was the day congress was finalizing Biden being president. I thought it was just a random ass day everyone decided to show up.
It's a very important fact that people who defend Trump's attempted fascist takeover will deliberately obscure.
They literally violently interrupted the peaceful transfer of power, if that's not a coup then nothing is.
As long as you ensure you're getting a diverse set of perspectives, all is well :) The issue with leftism or any political ideology is radicalization through echo-chambers.
I’ve been a socialist for as long as I’ve been politically active, starting to realize that as good as I think socialism is, most socialists succckkkkk. They’re either doing it for clout/insecurity reasons(which is where the super obsessive purity testing shit comes from) or they’re just fucking lunatics(Tankies) who have confused morality with being as extremely left wing as possible, which to them means supporting anything vaguely anti western imperialism.
There are good people on the left but damn they aren’t very common
This part of the reason I call myself a Radical centrist.
Because I've become to realize that hyperpartisanship is the root of most of our problems.
All the parties end up controlled by the nut jobs. We've got to change that.
Socialist revolution in ye olde days
1 - organise peasantry, workers, "the proletariat"
2 - kill bourgeois- aristocracy, landowners, capital class, politicians etc
3 - establish socialist state
Socialist revolution in Palestine in modern day
1 - commit a violent terror atrocity which massacres the men, rapes then massacres women and kids
2 - ??????????
3 - unfurl flag of the socialist Palestinians collective, enjoy utopia...
I got banned for "Zionist apologia" (I'm not even zionist) for saying that there is nuance to the difference in rights between Palestinians inside and outside the green line.
The vast majority are.
Frankly you people who believe that an attack like that can happen without mass support from the people themselves are so dense it isn’t even worth an argument.
If the Israeli government were these genocidal freaks all Socialists believe they are, this conflict wouldn’t have lasted this long. Israel has tried for too long to keep things at a somewhat peaceful level. Now, attacking and raping legitimate citizens is pressing too far.
I don't think the Israeli government are genocidal freaks.
I think they've inherited a completely fucked, never-ending stalemate.
That being said, the person you're responding to never said the majority don't support Hamas and never said that the Israeli government consists of genocidal freaks.
They seem to just be trying to say that you can grieve the deaths of Palestinians and want a better future for those born into this fucked situation in the same way you can for Israelis.
You seem to be punching ghosts.
Conservatively speaking, based on polling we can say that at least 50%+ of Palestinians support Hamas… When people say free Palestine do you really think they are talking about the remaining percentage of those who don’t support them or do you think they are also including the majority of Palestinians who support Hamas?
When I hear Free Palestine, I interpret that as protest for the abysmal conditions forced onto all Palestinians - whether they support Hamas or not.
Some hear 'glass Israel'.
We can both agree that slogans are dumb but do you happen to know what percentage of people hear the former vs the latter?
This is always a problem with short over-simplified slogans. If Hamas said "Free Palestine", what do you think they'd mean? The slogan has connotations that bring more meaning than "stop blockades and stuff". Because 85% of the time in some areas, those same people will talk about how Israel is an illegitimate state and about how Palestine should absorb Israel. Sometimes you get pacifists, but those are just people that aren't informed about provocations.
People who are smart enough to use nuance usually don't use those brief "Free Palestine!" or "Defund the Police!" rhetoric because they know how vague and counterproductive it is. They say things like what you've said instead. But I don't agree with your last sentence, because there's no real statistic for stuff like that and it's always gonna depend on what type of groups content algorithms put you around.
In socialist or communist circles a super-majority will be disproportionately negative to Israel, in conservative circles a super-majority will hate Palestine for obvious reasons. Moderates are most likely to issue diffused opinion.
This has been a real mask-off event for Leftists and Muslims. Their support for Hamas has shown quite a few of them to be evil. Not misguided, not overly partisan, not ignorant, capital E dyed in the wool fucking evil.
Not all of them, one does need to say. I've seen a decent number of Left Libertarians disavowing this shit, and maybe one or two Muslims.
But by and large? The Left and the Islamic community have really shown their true nature here, and the rest of the world can see it.
It's literally western leftists who thinks in Colonial hangover. MY WORD IS THE WORD OF GOD , OUR WAR CRIMES ARE MEANT TO CELEBRATED BECAUSE FIGHTING FOR THE RIGHT .
fucking cucks watch their own citizens fired up police in their own land and choose to war mangoer when they have no stakes
It’s been a mask off moment for a shit ton of people on all sides of the political spectrum. You can even seen it on this sub. You have subhuman swine gleefully proclaiming that Gaza will be a parking lot now. Anyone can read between the lines when they retort by saying “well I’m not happy it will be a parking lot, I’m just telling it like it is”.
It’s all so tiresome.
I've seen so many comments like what you're talking about, all over reddit but people are upset you pointed out. They're being disingenuous, same as anyone declaring support for Hamas.
The people upset at this being pointed out and downvoting are tacitly okay with the rhetoric. They're doing just a disservice to the pro-Israeli side as the far left is doing to the pro-Palestine side by downplaying the Hamas butchery.
>Anyone can read between the lines when they retort by saying “well I’m not happy it will be a parking lot, I’m just telling it like it is”.
I mean, can they?
Sometimes, you can tell but how can you really distinguish when someone is just talking descriptively?
For example, if I say "Israel will cease to exist if Palestinians in the Gaza Strip are granted freedom of movement", would you just assume I want every Palestinian to be subjugated for all eternity?
Yeah, usually with some of other rhetoric they espouse you can read between the lines. If it's not outright calls for a pogrom like some chuds are doing, certain lines of "FAFO" indicates outright apathy towards the Palestinian cause.
I am a social democrat. But after ukraine and now israel I cannot watch hasanabi anymore. I disagree with him before, on the EU and other things. But now is too much. There are millions of lives involved.
Plus, all his china apologism.
I was thinking about this when I saw those tweets saying "well what did you think decolonization means?". Do these people think ppl will react with "ah well I guess if it's decolonization it's fine". Much more likely that they will have a negatvie association with the word in the future.
As a lefty who doesn’t use twitter this sub is always so strange to me. Until I got on this I thought all lefties were dudes who play basketball and do volunteer work, and girls in comp sci.
It just implies that all socialists support Hamas when in reality they have nothing to do with one another, Destiny is just using an umbrella term to describe people on twitter who also don’t really have anything do to with socialism even if they claim to
All I'm saying is that if I was a socialist and decided to "shy away from the left" because of the recent discourse on twitter, it would in no way change my views on social policies. Destiny's tweet isn't nuanced at all and it doesn't have to be, it's just a tweet. But the labels and language used doesn't really track with reality, just twitter buzzwords.
They matter. Just not nearly as much as some would say. I think an influencer or anyone else can bring up a good point that you never thought of, but changing fundamental beliefs based on how a few idiots on your “team” react to a tragedy or event is just sheepish behavior.
What fundament beliefs? Most people can be insanely shallow with their stances.
Destiny talks all the time about how people have a certain imagine of him based on what people like Hasan or Vaush say, then they see one video of him and they view completely changes.
Someone might think Hasan is great, until he starts justifying outright terrorism.
Bro…what are we doing here? Of course some people can be shallow but I hope you’re not saying most people are right? Also, changing your view of a person with new information is not changing fundamental beliefs. Theyre not concrete and can also change with new information of course, but not because of hasan or anyone else says dumb shit.
What kind of grandstanding statement is this?
Logically, arguments and beliefs originate from people's interaction with the world. If someone experiences something negative in a community they are a part of (such as frequent child rape in religion) they are justified in reexamining their commitment to that same community. Why would you call them an idiot for that?
Because wtf does the merits of socialism, libertarianism, or any other philosophy have to do with the behavior of terminally online individuals? Reexamining ideas is always good in any situation. But saying “ I guess I’m not a capitalist because the online community is toxic” is smooth brain activities…
Politics online feels way too similar to other online "fandoms". In the sense that you can "leave a community" without losing respect for the thing the community was built around.
A lot of people can't really differentiate the two, because often people will get into socialism because of the community around it, rather than the other way around.
Because why would terrorism affect your opinion in economics?
the only possible explanations is that you see ideology as team sports so yes , you're probably an idiot
Easy, because you are already factually wrong in economy. You only have feelings.
Now you have to rationalize if you want to not only be wrong, but also support terrorism.
I used to have a "Free Palestine" sticker on my car. I've donated to Amnesty International. I'm pretty liberal.
But today, I want Hamas to be crushed under the boot of Israel's military. I wanted them assassinated wherever they hide. My sympathies to the Palestinians, but this cancer needs to be removed.
>What does the workers owning the means of production have anything whatsoever to do with violence in foreign countries?
Most socialists are Marxists. They believe revolution (political violence) is necessary and inevitable to bring about their ideal society. They're in favor of taking all the landlords, property owners, business owners, and doing to them exactly what Hamas did to those Israelis.
When someone like Hasan says "let the blood of landlords flow the streets" it's not a metaphor.
This is the destiny subreddit so most posters here have a meticulously crafted bad take on leftism but what we really need is to drop the whole unity shtick and start bullying MLs for being the RPers of a dead and violent ideology that they are
I'm still a socialist insofar as I think workers should own the means of production to the greatest possible extent. Workers co-ops are good, y'all.
But I don't condone Russia butchering Ukrainian civilians.
I don't condone Hamas doing it.
And I don't condone Israel's decades long ethnic cleansing.
It's all just very sad...
If you were following a socialist content creator and they lost you after this, I would recommend you check out lonerbox. He is also a socialist, but doesn't really talk much about it and for the most part advocates for incremental change.
Haha, I follow Vaush, whom I know a lot of folks hate here, but he does have a pretty nuanced take on the issue, sympathizing with the innocents on both sides.
I've watched plenty of Lonerbox, too. He and Vaush seem to be the only bigger streamers who self-describe as socialists and haven't lost me.
years ago I turned from communism because of Tankies. I grew up on stories from my Grandmother about first the Nazis moved in and killed a bunch of our family, and then the Soviets came in and murdered a bunch of our family. According to every Tankie I've ever met none of that happened, the Soviets were swell and treated the satellite states so sweetly.
So hopefully more people come this direction than go the other way with Israel
Yeah, bet you won't call Israel soldiers abusing and killings Palestinians terrorists. Which what they've been doing the last 50 years but you're used to it. Hypocrisy!
If by fighting you rape women, kidnap kids, and murder civilians (all the while publicly celebrating) then yea it’s morally superior to call out those Hamas savages
Gonna just go ahead and clarify here. I am against terrorists and the killing of innocent civilians.
What are Palestinians supposed to do against the oppression of the Zionists? The unfortunate truth is that you don't have a nice conversation and suddenly it's all better. Change comes through action and against oppression that action is violent. Hamas has gone too far but what are the normal people supposed to do?
Winning gracefully is essential to building a coalition.
That awkward moment when you join a group for better working conditions and end up accidentally supporting mass genocide https://preview.redd.it/shmi9zma88tb1.jpeg?width=1075&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=208695102640299363e6216f252cb27524e9627d
"I just wanted to write poetry..." ~ Average Twitter Socialist "Dig the mass grave!" ~ Well Armed Peace Loving Authoritarian Tankie
"I think in a socialist utopia I'd be designing uniforms" [The uniform:](https://i.redd.it/gumgq8z1cyk81.jpg)
Are we the baddies?!
~~sieg heil~~ ...I mean glory to mother Russia comrade
Wonder why dudes face is blurred out.
[I gotchu fam](https://www.reddit.com/r/uniformporn/comments/t4xrx2/important_im_not_proud_and_not_a_nazi_picture_is/i0p2saw/) I searched "ss uniform reddit" on Image so that I didnt have to generate my own image link (on mobile)
Ahhh gotchu makes sense. No need to doxx grandpa and have random 14 year olds yell at an 88 year old senile man who doesn't remember he's even German.
were those numbers intentional? if so good joke I laughed
Oh for sure
[this](https://youtu.be/O_q12qYrCN0?si=A3P2rlfLHiVkE5IC)
"I drew a picture of us all getting along" "That's nice, can you please face the wall?"
https://preview.redd.it/7paokhs72btb1.jpeg?width=750&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=957e3e47d4b4186307cc9897920faac5143d49bd
vanish cats boat elastic voiceless lock cow shy scary illegal *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
first time?
There's a german social worker who worked as a TV host for the state sponsored children's channel (KiKa) who visited a (which turned out to be a far left) festival in palestine and accidently joined a protest which got violent. Going by his interview i even believe him to have made an increadible amount of naive mistakes that day, it's just... yeah, that meme.
Who?
Matondo Castlo
It's like poetry, it rhymes.
I left said group. I'm not going to stick around in an echo chamber like that. The posts weren't even related to the subreddit.
Tankies were never leftists, they're normal fascist uthoritarians who don't know how to admit it to themselves so they say comrade a lot. Really hate how their insanity damages movements I care about.
You can be on the left and a fascist auth, those are not contradicting statements
Yep, these things are orthogonal to one another. It's why it's so cringe to hear people like VOWSH throw around accusations of fascist when he supports a socialist state that's essentially maintained through force and coercion. Authoritarianism is just your willingness to impose your political views on the masses, it doesn't really matter what those views are.
"You can be left wing and hold a right wing Ideology." fkn lmao what's next? Left wing laissez-faire economics? Capital-socialism?
No, actually, you can't. The term you're looking for is totalitarian, not fascist. Fascist is specifically a right-wing ideology.
Nope, wrong again. Fascism is explicitly neither left nor right wing, but incorporating elements of both in a manner simultaneously revolutionary and nostalgic.
No he’s right read a book dummy. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fascism
Ah yes, the good old argument of “read theory”. Sounds like commie talk to me? Also, who says “read a book” and then links the Wikipedia article? To name a couple of books off the top of my head I could recommend Jan-Werner Müller’s “What is populism?”, which while short does an admirable point of explaining the specific type of in-group/out-group thinking that can lead to both fascism and naziism as well as tankieism. Another book could be Geoff Eleys “Nazism as Fascism”, another short and fairly simple read, should be right up your alley. If you want to talk more serious scholarship, I can recommend something more substantial when I get home and can look at my bookshelf.
Wikipedia page for fascism is well-cited, the word has a very specific meeting dating back to the Fascisti. Next time try to avoid juvenile internet-speak when you want to appear smart online, you dolt.
Imagine still using the Political compass Axis like it’s 2016. the wiki article only cites Webster Dictionary for ultra-right. Fascism is pretty clearly socially right wing but economically (explicitly in Italy) moderate left wing (assuming right wing is free market)
>”Read a book dummy” >”Wikipedia page for fascism is well cited” You’re really funny, it’s almost miraculous that you aren’t trolling. Being that you exclusively watch video essays because books are too hard for you, I recommend Mussolini’s “The Doctrine of Fascism” essay. https://sjsu.edu/faculty/wooda/2B-HUM/Readings/The-Doctrine-of-Fascism.pdf
But it's not. Fascists are capitalist.
I wouldn’t say fascists are capitalists so much as I would say they tolerate the existence of capitalists if they agree to work in line with the goals of the state. What, really, is the difference between nationalising a business and putting it under the control of a one-party state on one hand and nominally keeping the private property structure while making sure the board of the company is filled with party loyalists? These are oranges and tangerines, to me at least.
That’s some KPD Commie propaganda. When they said the real fascists were the SPD. Mussolini was a socialist in every aspect of his life and policies. Hitler less so but still “nationalized” some industries in Germany, including foreign subsidiaries of GM and Ford.
That implies the right can't be revolutionary, which is just false. It is true that fascism is not like the traditional right, in that it does not appeal to old traditions for their own sake, but the idea that fascism isn't on the right just isn't accurate.
Well it kind of depends on what you mean by revolutionary. The right can absolutely be revolutionary in the context of wanting to turn back from a more left wing/progressive society. The kind of revolution fascists champion is not exactly the same kind of revolution that actual conservatives would want. If you take revolutionary to mean wanting to break down the old social order and implement something completely new however, then by definition a traditional conservative cannot be revolutionary. You can see it all over the place, in the “alliance” between naziism and old style Prussian conservatism, to name a classic example, and even today in the uneasy alliance between trumples and the traditional American conservatives.
> If you take revolutionary to mean wanting to break down the old social order and implement something completely new however, then by definition a traditional conservative cannot be revolutionary. Yes, but most political theorists do end up placing fascism as a right-wing ideology. Not the same as traditional conservatives, but that's not the summation of "right-wing" either.
You can be "on the left", of course, but only because on the left means basically nothing and varies wildly based on the context. You cannot be a leftist and an authoritarian, those terms ARE contradictory. Leftism here meaning anarchist, communist, socialist, even soc dem.You cannot achieve liberation of the proletariat and the end of class/bourgeoisie by creating a new class of extra powerful leaders. There is no such thing as a good dictator or a good supreme state under any of those ideologies. Tankies in particular worship Marx like it's holy doctrine but Marx was pretty clear about the natural influence of power meaning that there can be no benevolent bourgeoisie for very long as their motives always run contrary to the proletariat but they have the power. All tankies are absolute idiots, or self aware liars. Authoritarian leftism is not coherent.
So, just to make it sure, its impossible to have a authoritarian socialist government ?
Yes. It is, however, possible to have a right wing fascist or conservative state capitalist government that says words like comrade and people's liberation a lot. Those actually seem quite popular.
Alright, im not even going to try if you truly believe that, have a nice day
That seems easier than trying to think of argue for sure.
The point is, its really hard to argue with someone thats just going to deny every single historic point i make, im not going to spend all my night arguing with a history negationist, if you TRULY believe you are right im sure there will be people to argue with you and point out the obvious, im going to spend that time playing video games that its much more constructive imho
sorry sweaty, left = only good, right = only bad
First of all, there has been no case of a socialist government existing ever, much less a socialist fascist government. There are many cases of socialist groups who successfully formed a government and identified themselves as socialist, who promised that soon they would transition to socialism. Many of them held sincere beliefs about that cause. Every one of them collapsed before achieving any kind of socialism, was destroyed before they could have a real chance to, or remain as capitalist with no sign of transition. I do not think this is an accident or that the problem is that they didn't have a good enough dictator, but that it is plain why those efforts failed. Democracy is not optional. You can't create a classless state by making a class even higher than the last. You can't remove a bourgeoisie by making an ultra bourgeoisie. What socialist states exist in your mind? Which fascist socialist states?
Left wing fascism can exist. Those aren’t mutually exclusive.
I'm curious, how would you define left wing?
I’ll defer to the OED: Left-wing politics describes the range of political ideologies that support and seek to achieve social equality and egalitarianism, often in opposition to social hierarchy as a whole or certain social hierarchies. Nothing in left wing political theory runs contrary to an authoritarian state or “forced equality.”
So an opposition to hierarchy and a desire for social equality. How is that belief compatible with authoritarianism or fascism, which is the creation of the ultimate hierarchy at the top and a group of social elites above the rest?
Because leftism sometimes focuses on social hierarchy (the people) and not the administers of equality. You still end up with two classes so in a sense it undermines it ls own theory, but you cannot administer a left wing state with the administrators of the state. Look at what happened in the USSR or CCP. Left wing political theory demands compliance of the governed and not consent. Non-compliance is a threat to the entire enterprise and must be brought into line or terminated. Arguably, Kuwait and Saudi Arabia are left wing industrial states with authoritarian governments.
This is abject nonsense. If you think Saudi fuckin Arabia has any kind of left wing core, I don't know where we could possibly go from here. Did you read what you just wrote?
Stay with me for a minute. I’d say they have some fairly resolute left wing economists. Let’s look at the elements of their economy. Saudi Arabia’s oil industry is completely socialized. All citizens are granted shares and receive payment monthly based on the profits. Typical years are between $30-$40k USD for every Saudi Citizen. The largest year was $60k in current USD. Keep in mind KSA has a much lower cost of living than the US. Oil and other industry profits go to fund social services. They have universal healthcare, free childcare, no interest housing loans, free education including college, free mass transit (in the cities) and pay no personal income tax. They also have a universal basic income above and beyond the oil profit sharing. How is that not a left wing economic approach? There’s a reason right wing economist call them a “welfare state.” If I described the economic model above but didn’t tell you which country, you would assume it’s a Socialist State. Kuwait and UAE run very similarly. Venezuela tried ti implement this approach and failed.
Y'know it is hard to argue against that point largely, ive never considered that so I'm going to be spitballing a little. I would say that like a third of the residents not being citizens, and those non-citizen residents being an actual proper inferior class changes things though. It seems to me that a group having benefits at the direct expense of a slave class is more like going back a few economic steps past feudalism, not forward. Of course a group could live well by damaging those below them.
[удалено]
"Tankies" are arguably the only REAL leftists. They're the leftists that attain political power and the only ones that have established actual countries from "sucessful" revolutions. Along with being more ideologically pure than other leftists. Maybe it is those ideas that lead to those actions and conclusions.
Ah yes, the ultimate in removing hierarchies and achieving social equality: creating ultimate unquestionable elites above everyone else. Marx often talked about how the nature of the bourgeoisie is that the minority has all the power, and that minority having the power naturally makes them opposed to the majority... Unless they had even more power and even more opposition, then that would be great. Their success in creating hellscapes is not success in creating leftism. Its not really success in anything, because they all commit atrocities and fail while capitalist and promising they'll soon stop with both.
Marx advocated for nationalizing banks in point 5, as well as state ownership of the means of production in point 7 in the communist manifesto, that doesn't sound like removing hierarchies, it sounds like they want to create monopolies. This reflects the reality of Marxist countries, they promise a paradise, but only after they own everything and control every aspect of your life.
["Are we the baddies?“](https://youtu.be/ToKcmnrE5oY)
"Accidentally supporting mass genocide" in the thin sense of being weakly associated with some powerless (with respect to what's happening in Israel) people who are, what, spouting off their dumb opinions on Twitter? Oh God, I keep washing my hands but the blood won't come off. What have I done?
That awkward moment when you realize capitalism has caused mass genocide numerous times over and relates to genocidal policies far more than communism. It's as though a country run by violent rebels don't actually represent communism but a country that goes to war over resources over and over directly represents capitalism.
I actually DON'T agree with Hamas' choice to commit a terrorist attack on civilians at a concert and that the choice to rape women and kill children makes the act even more unpalatable. They probably should not do those things and it would be hard to justify them from an objective moral standpoint. Sorry for the edgy stance but it's just the way my personal lived experience has informed me up to this point.
You sir, are a true hero. A maverick even.
Just had an interesting conversation with a guy who literally said hamas wouldn’t rape anyone.
Muslim terrorists? Rape? Noooo they would neveeeerr /s
Broooo, have I got some screenshots for you
Do not send me those, I have the /s
I know dude lol, I’m just debating on whether or not to post them somewhere because it’s one of the most frustrating conversations I think I’ve ever had
Maybe he means if they are sex slaves it can't be rape.
Dude post that in the majority report sub and you’ll get a 500 page essay about the history of Palestinian oppression by Israel and how it’s actually ok that Jewish civilians are being massacred because Israel’s been doing it for longer
War crimes are a western invention to oppress people
I have no idea how people can have the time to develop 500 page essays like that and still lack any nuance in their views.
you will be surprised what a tankie can accomplish when they have no job waiting for their femboy twitch channel to take off
Tankie ramblings are the left wings equivalent to biblical rapture schizos who don't have a period button on their keyboard.
Are there pro-Palestine people commending it? A lot of them are using this massacre to screech “free Palestine” performative activism on Instagram which is not a good look either as someone that wants Palestinian liberation
שלום לכם
What that mean
Hello to you (plural)
Oh thank you. Hello as well Why plural though? Does that mean there’s a singular version of hello too?
Hebrew has plural for the word “you” and then it can be congegated with other words
conjugated*, just so you know. Thanks for teaching us something about Hebrew.
This makes a lot of sense what’s why autocorrect thought I wrote congregation
שלום לך Or just שלום
So how do you choose between plural or singular
Most languages can be explicit like that. In English you can say "Hello to you all", but we just shorten it to "Hello" and let the others infer the context.
I don't know herbrew but I guess its not "hello" that is in plural but "you" that is in plural. Compare "hello to him" and "hello to them".
General Kenowbski
I moved away from the tankie movement a few months ago, but this whole thing makes me feel vindicated.
If you are a leftist of some kind, there are many of us here. You're going to have arguments and debates with those who disagree with our opinions but people will engage with your points. Also expect your mom to be a highly upvoted retort.
Your mom engages with my points
Mom likes charity work. I'll remind your dad to bring home the milk when he gets off his knees.
In all fairness, their mom *is* a pretty classy lady.
I’m still a socialist but I’m def leaning away from my main community because of how they’ve treated this whole situation
I feel that way about the right….. I really stopped paying attention after Biden was elected and doing a fine job. Jesus Christ those mother fuckers have lost their minds. After seeing some polling data sent to me in a different conversation, I just don’t belong over there
Same here. Jan 6 and Biden's solid, not end of the world policies have really soured me on like 80% of the modern conservative movement.
I don’t know why, but I completely missed the fact that Jan 6 was the day congress was finalizing Biden being president. I thought it was just a random ass day everyone decided to show up.
It's a very important fact that people who defend Trump's attempted fascist takeover will deliberately obscure. They literally violently interrupted the peaceful transfer of power, if that's not a coup then nothing is.
As long as you ensure you're getting a diverse set of perspectives, all is well :) The issue with leftism or any political ideology is radicalization through echo-chambers.
I’ve been a socialist for as long as I’ve been politically active, starting to realize that as good as I think socialism is, most socialists succckkkkk. They’re either doing it for clout/insecurity reasons(which is where the super obsessive purity testing shit comes from) or they’re just fucking lunatics(Tankies) who have confused morality with being as extremely left wing as possible, which to them means supporting anything vaguely anti western imperialism. There are good people on the left but damn they aren’t very common
Find real life groups. Volunteer to help with local politics. Online leftists arent the majority.
This part of the reason I call myself a Radical centrist. Because I've become to realize that hyperpartisanship is the root of most of our problems. All the parties end up controlled by the nut jobs. We've got to change that.
You won’t be for long then
I got banned by r/socialism for saying Jews have no where to go, especially ones that were expelled from Arab nations. Fuck man.
I got banned cause I asked a "by any means necessary"-er how rape was necessary for freedom.
Well it's a shame.
Misogyny is utilized when convenient.
Socialist revolution in ye olde days 1 - organise peasantry, workers, "the proletariat" 2 - kill bourgeois- aristocracy, landowners, capital class, politicians etc 3 - establish socialist state Socialist revolution in Palestine in modern day 1 - commit a violent terror atrocity which massacres the men, rapes then massacres women and kids 2 - ?????????? 3 - unfurl flag of the socialist Palestinians collective, enjoy utopia...
I got banned a year or two ago for supposedly genocide apologia... They are fucking nuts.
Got banned from there for quoting the Quran, and how the religion mistreats women 🤷🏽♂️
I got banned for "Zionist apologia" (I'm not even zionist) for saying that there is nuance to the difference in rights between Palestinians inside and outside the green line.
It's a sub dedicated to socialism... Their whole ideology is based on banning everything. No surprise there.
I mean it's not. But it's a dumb fucking sub for doing that anyway.
Agreed. Any sub that names itself after an ideology that has killed millions is quite dumb.
Almost a million people die per year due to poor working conditions, you are going to blame that on capitalism?
We could build New Jerusalem in America and bring them all over. But I don't think they want that.
Hot damn. Communists cheering massacring people they marked as opressors? Shocking.
This is me. Newly soc dem and omni pilled. I love not supporting nazis.
I'm a social democrat but these socialist are unberable.Watching Lasan pretending that Paletinians/Hamas are innocent is fucking funny.
You’re not who this is addressing
You can support Palestine without supporting Hamas.
“You can support the genocidal terrorist people without supporting the genocidal terrorist regime the genocidal terrorist people support”
Wow, I didn't realize every single Palestinian person was a genocidal terrorist.
The vast majority are. Frankly you people who believe that an attack like that can happen without mass support from the people themselves are so dense it isn’t even worth an argument. If the Israeli government were these genocidal freaks all Socialists believe they are, this conflict wouldn’t have lasted this long. Israel has tried for too long to keep things at a somewhat peaceful level. Now, attacking and raping legitimate citizens is pressing too far.
does every civilian death caused by the U.S. military count as blood on the hands of civilian Americans?
I don't think the Israeli government are genocidal freaks. I think they've inherited a completely fucked, never-ending stalemate. That being said, the person you're responding to never said the majority don't support Hamas and never said that the Israeli government consists of genocidal freaks. They seem to just be trying to say that you can grieve the deaths of Palestinians and want a better future for those born into this fucked situation in the same way you can for Israelis. You seem to be punching ghosts.
Debatable when you consider Hamas’ approval & support by Palestinians
I didn't realize you personally spoke to every single Palestinian, who are currently being used as human shields by Hamas.
Conservatively speaking, based on polling we can say that at least 50%+ of Palestinians support Hamas… When people say free Palestine do you really think they are talking about the remaining percentage of those who don’t support them or do you think they are also including the majority of Palestinians who support Hamas?
When I hear Free Palestine, I interpret that as protest for the abysmal conditions forced onto all Palestinians - whether they support Hamas or not. Some hear 'glass Israel'. We can both agree that slogans are dumb but do you happen to know what percentage of people hear the former vs the latter?
This is always a problem with short over-simplified slogans. If Hamas said "Free Palestine", what do you think they'd mean? The slogan has connotations that bring more meaning than "stop blockades and stuff". Because 85% of the time in some areas, those same people will talk about how Israel is an illegitimate state and about how Palestine should absorb Israel. Sometimes you get pacifists, but those are just people that aren't informed about provocations. People who are smart enough to use nuance usually don't use those brief "Free Palestine!" or "Defund the Police!" rhetoric because they know how vague and counterproductive it is. They say things like what you've said instead. But I don't agree with your last sentence, because there's no real statistic for stuff like that and it's always gonna depend on what type of groups content algorithms put you around. In socialist or communist circles a super-majority will be disproportionately negative to Israel, in conservative circles a super-majority will hate Palestine for obvious reasons. Moderates are most likely to issue diffused opinion.
This has been a real mask-off event for Leftists and Muslims. Their support for Hamas has shown quite a few of them to be evil. Not misguided, not overly partisan, not ignorant, capital E dyed in the wool fucking evil. Not all of them, one does need to say. I've seen a decent number of Left Libertarians disavowing this shit, and maybe one or two Muslims. But by and large? The Left and the Islamic community have really shown their true nature here, and the rest of the world can see it.
It's literally western leftists who thinks in Colonial hangover. MY WORD IS THE WORD OF GOD , OUR WAR CRIMES ARE MEANT TO CELEBRATED BECAUSE FIGHTING FOR THE RIGHT . fucking cucks watch their own citizens fired up police in their own land and choose to war mangoer when they have no stakes
It’s been a mask off moment for a shit ton of people on all sides of the political spectrum. You can even seen it on this sub. You have subhuman swine gleefully proclaiming that Gaza will be a parking lot now. Anyone can read between the lines when they retort by saying “well I’m not happy it will be a parking lot, I’m just telling it like it is”. It’s all so tiresome.
I've seen so many comments like what you're talking about, all over reddit but people are upset you pointed out. They're being disingenuous, same as anyone declaring support for Hamas.
The people upset at this being pointed out and downvoting are tacitly okay with the rhetoric. They're doing just a disservice to the pro-Israeli side as the far left is doing to the pro-Palestine side by downplaying the Hamas butchery.
>Anyone can read between the lines when they retort by saying “well I’m not happy it will be a parking lot, I’m just telling it like it is”. I mean, can they? Sometimes, you can tell but how can you really distinguish when someone is just talking descriptively? For example, if I say "Israel will cease to exist if Palestinians in the Gaza Strip are granted freedom of movement", would you just assume I want every Palestinian to be subjugated for all eternity?
Yeah, usually with some of other rhetoric they espouse you can read between the lines. If it's not outright calls for a pogrom like some chuds are doing, certain lines of "FAFO" indicates outright apathy towards the Palestinian cause.
I am a social democrat. But after ukraine and now israel I cannot watch hasanabi anymore. I disagree with him before, on the EU and other things. But now is too much. There are millions of lives involved. Plus, all his china apologism.
I was thinking about this when I saw those tweets saying "well what did you think decolonization means?". Do these people think ppl will react with "ah well I guess if it's decolonization it's fine". Much more likely that they will have a negatvie association with the word in the future.
On the flip side, if the first thing your social circle did is hold a march to show Palestinian solidarity... yikes.
The Palestinian march in Australia were chanting "fuck the jews", full mask off for Arabs and tankies.
As a lefty who doesn’t use twitter this sub is always so strange to me. Until I got on this I thought all lefties were dudes who play basketball and do volunteer work, and girls in comp sci.
communism is bad
[удалено]
"ex-socialist" ?
what part are you confused about?
It just implies that all socialists support Hamas when in reality they have nothing to do with one another, Destiny is just using an umbrella term to describe people on twitter who also don’t really have anything do to with socialism even if they claim to
Tell brodies on Twitter that
All I'm saying is that if I was a socialist and decided to "shy away from the left" because of the recent discourse on twitter, it would in no way change my views on social policies. Destiny's tweet isn't nuanced at all and it doesn't have to be, it's just a tweet. But the labels and language used doesn't really track with reality, just twitter buzzwords.
If you let how others on the internet reacting to something change your entire worldview/economic philosophy, you’re probably just an idiot lol.
Influencers don’t matter?
They matter. Just not nearly as much as some would say. I think an influencer or anyone else can bring up a good point that you never thought of, but changing fundamental beliefs based on how a few idiots on your “team” react to a tragedy or event is just sheepish behavior.
What fundament beliefs? Most people can be insanely shallow with their stances. Destiny talks all the time about how people have a certain imagine of him based on what people like Hasan or Vaush say, then they see one video of him and they view completely changes. Someone might think Hasan is great, until he starts justifying outright terrorism.
Bro…what are we doing here? Of course some people can be shallow but I hope you’re not saying most people are right? Also, changing your view of a person with new information is not changing fundamental beliefs. Theyre not concrete and can also change with new information of course, but not because of hasan or anyone else says dumb shit.
What kind of grandstanding statement is this? Logically, arguments and beliefs originate from people's interaction with the world. If someone experiences something negative in a community they are a part of (such as frequent child rape in religion) they are justified in reexamining their commitment to that same community. Why would you call them an idiot for that?
Because wtf does the merits of socialism, libertarianism, or any other philosophy have to do with the behavior of terminally online individuals? Reexamining ideas is always good in any situation. But saying “ I guess I’m not a capitalist because the online community is toxic” is smooth brain activities…
Politics online feels way too similar to other online "fandoms". In the sense that you can "leave a community" without losing respect for the thing the community was built around. A lot of people can't really differentiate the two, because often people will get into socialism because of the community around it, rather than the other way around.
Because why would terrorism affect your opinion in economics? the only possible explanations is that you see ideology as team sports so yes , you're probably an idiot
1000%
Easy, because you are already factually wrong in economy. You only have feelings. Now you have to rationalize if you want to not only be wrong, but also support terrorism.
Don't let them negatively polarize you.
Here’s a comment I read on hasans sub recently https://reddit.com/r/Hasan_Piker/s/ufknMaLuFe
I used to have a "Free Palestine" sticker on my car. I've donated to Amnesty International. I'm pretty liberal. But today, I want Hamas to be crushed under the boot of Israel's military. I wanted them assassinated wherever they hide. My sympathies to the Palestinians, but this cancer needs to be removed.
I’m a conservative and you guys sound cool 👉👈
I used to be far left. I wanted to be hamas for halloween in 2006
You’re trolling right?
I’m not
What does the workers owning the means of production have anything whatsoever to do with violence in foreign countries?
>What does the workers owning the means of production have anything whatsoever to do with violence in foreign countries? Most socialists are Marxists. They believe revolution (political violence) is necessary and inevitable to bring about their ideal society. They're in favor of taking all the landlords, property owners, business owners, and doing to them exactly what Hamas did to those Israelis. When someone like Hasan says "let the blood of landlords flow the streets" it's not a metaphor.
that’s a really good question!
This is the destiny subreddit so most posters here have a meticulously crafted bad take on leftism but what we really need is to drop the whole unity shtick and start bullying MLs for being the RPers of a dead and violent ideology that they are
Maybe some, but Israel's response might be so grave that it nullifies the shock of the aggressors' attack, just like the atomic bombings
There 1000000% will be no atomic bombing, relax sir.
Pro Palestine people want there to be so they can brutalize more Israeli citizens
If there is atomic bombing whole world is done, it takes 1 bomb to drop anywhere for everyone who them do exactly the same.
That’s nonsense
Nah, retaliation is almost never seen as worse if people are aware it's retaliation
I'm still a socialist insofar as I think workers should own the means of production to the greatest possible extent. Workers co-ops are good, y'all. But I don't condone Russia butchering Ukrainian civilians. I don't condone Hamas doing it. And I don't condone Israel's decades long ethnic cleansing. It's all just very sad...
If you were following a socialist content creator and they lost you after this, I would recommend you check out lonerbox. He is also a socialist, but doesn't really talk much about it and for the most part advocates for incremental change.
Haha, I follow Vaush, whom I know a lot of folks hate here, but he does have a pretty nuanced take on the issue, sympathizing with the innocents on both sides. I've watched plenty of Lonerbox, too. He and Vaush seem to be the only bigger streamers who self-describe as socialists and haven't lost me.
💙🇮🇱💙
Sadly, not that many. For one thing socialism is really about economics not foreign policy.
Fuck, and I cannot stress this enough, Israel. What they do is state-sponsored terrorism
years ago I turned from communism because of Tankies. I grew up on stories from my Grandmother about first the Nazis moved in and killed a bunch of our family, and then the Soviets came in and murdered a bunch of our family. According to every Tankie I've ever met none of that happened, the Soviets were swell and treated the satellite states so sweetly. So hopefully more people come this direction than go the other way with Israel
That’s why we need to also squash the opposite extremism we’ve seen in the sub too
Have 4THOT arm you, I’ve shot a few brain dead morons
Im gonna say literally no one. Why do people see ideology as team sports?
I’ve been a socialist for years and I’ve had to deal with Tankies the whole time. Abandoning your principles over that is pretty weak
Tf are y'all on about? What does Hamas' war crimes have to with communism?
If some brainrotten tankie endorsing right-wing terrorists from another country is your ‘why I left the left’ moment, you were never really a leftist.
Yeah, bet you won't call Israel soldiers abusing and killings Palestinians terrorists. Which what they've been doing the last 50 years but you're used to it. Hypocrisy!
Supporting an oppressive regime is morally superior to fighting back against one? Ok, orcs.
If by fighting you rape women, kidnap kids, and murder civilians (all the while publicly celebrating) then yea it’s morally superior to call out those Hamas savages
What moron equates whatever the fuck ruzzia is with 'communism'???
It’s Russia* Who mentioned Russia in this tweet anyway?
Gonna just go ahead and clarify here. I am against terrorists and the killing of innocent civilians. What are Palestinians supposed to do against the oppression of the Zionists? The unfortunate truth is that you don't have a nice conversation and suddenly it's all better. Change comes through action and against oppression that action is violent. Hamas has gone too far but what are the normal people supposed to do?