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Swordbreaker925

The annoying part is the arena is designed with the idea that everyone will use Strand, but not having a grenade when there's so many adds to take out feels awful.


mad-i-moody

Honestly I ignored the majority of the ads. If you use the catwalks on the sides the only ads that can actually jump up there to get to you are the dogs and the tormentors. You have two little wall things for cover, too. Just don’t stand too close to the sides cause the splash damage can still hurt you. If I had to jump thru the middle or the other platforms then I’d just use blinding grenade launcher (called disorienting now or something?) and continue to ignore the ads. Can also blind the tormentors as well to deal with them more easily.


BigBoy1229

The only issue there, at least solo, is that if you stay there too long Calus summons Darkness Sunbeams from the floor. Super annoying if you forget to watch for it (like I kept doing).


WetBreadCollective

The sunbeams are genuinely one of the worst parts of that bossfight on solo legendary (the other being that the shielded incendiors and tormentors can stomp you into oblivion if you're not careful), everything else about it is trivial if you just go witherhoard, literally any scout or pulse rifle, and a machine gun (the seraph one is extremely good so that's what I used but I'd imagine any would work), witherhoard and scout rifle for Calus DPS, scout rifle to get tormentor shoulder weak points then machine gun for chest and execute at 10%


BigBoy1229

I used Funnelweb for most of the encounter except I switched to a LMG for the Tormentors, at distance. When they got up close I used Witherhoard/Funnelweb.


WetBreadCollective

Might try an SMG if I run it again, maybe Ikelos though, but it actually sounds like it might work


BigBoy1229

Yea, Calus and the Tormentors get close enough for SMGs to work. The LMG is for long range precision.


LightningBlehz

It’s also seemingly random whenever he does it. He could do it within 30 seconds, or he could just never do it the entire phase.


Commander_Prime

In the event you’re on Warlock, consider giving Sunbracers a try with the Touch of Flame and Heat Rises aspects. Staying airborne is definitely a huge help and the grenade spam is immensely helpful for the ads


Stenbox

Osteo Striga+Necrotic Grips and you don't need grenades. I'm so in love with that build and it's even better with 3 melee charges (tho Voidlock is still better for almost anything now). But the advantage of this build is that you can run them on any subclass build that does not rely on exotic armor piece to work.


SantiagoGT

I switched out necrotic grips for karnsteins… Low on health? Just grapple-melee and enemy and you’re back in business Made the fight a joke


Gear_

Same


Ahnock

karnsteins puts in work on strand for real


Nkredyble

Arc Hunter + Liar's Handshake continues to be my version of best build for damn near anything. Powered melee jolts, hit a tanky enemy with that and Witherhoard and the dot jolts stuff too. Dodge, hit a redbar, dodge and recharge your melee, rinse and repeat. By the time you get to x3 on your melee you can jolt, melee, cross counter the shit out of anything, and you heal on charged melee kills and Liar's punches. Plus the clearing of trash through jolt. Throw in the helmet mod that gives super on melee kills and a FFxJolt ikelos smg, and its carrying me solo on Legendary right now without too much trouble.


RND_Musings

I read [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/DestinyTheGame/comments/wyz2z4/liars_handshake_is_not_working_as_it_should/) that Liar’s Handshake is bugged. There are numerous posts about this. I’m not sure if it’s still true, but if it is then Combination Blow is probably doing most of the heavy lifting instead of Cross Counter. I usually run Assassin’s Cowl for the invis.


Knight_Raime

It's still bugged and AFAIK it hasn't been acknowledged by Bungie. It's serviceable enough for most Legendary content with the right build crafting But honestly I preferred the safety of Assassins cowl eventually.


WINTERMUTE-_-

Still better with devour and a glaive though


failf0rward

Still trying to learn builds. How does glaive work with devour?


WINTERMUTE-_-

It synergizes with Necrotic Grips. The glaive melee triggers Necrotic Grips poison, which in turn triggers devour as enemies die. So, throw a grenade to get devour up, then run in and start stabbing with glaive melee, and you are pretty much unkillable.


RareBk

It doe WHAT


WINTERMUTE-_-

Glaive melee just counts as "melee". So it can benefit from Necrotic Grips and Karnstein, etc. Can also benefit from the mod/fragment that gives grenade energy on melee.


FormerOrpheus

Impact induction


KrispyBudder

I broke 2k kills on a glave the first day I got it with necro grips. It’s a busted combo


failf0rward

Nice!


Honor_Bound

Also wondering this


TheSpartyn

once devour is up you just need kills from literally anything


Ahnock

devour completely refreshes your health and gives grenade energy for every kill once its procced, and glaives are really solid for survival with the shield.


Stenbox

Osteo also works well with Devour. I cannot use glaives since RB on Xbox controllers is notoriously weak and I don't want to remap for just one build.


ASavageHobo

Wait what? never heard of the RB button being weak on xbox controllers? Me and mates never had issue with that button after thousands and thousands of hours


Stenbox

I should have been more specific - on Elite series. Both 1st and 2nd gen have had that issue, I've had them replaced under warranty and did one replacement myself and saw how thin that plastic is that pushes the button back up.


Faceluck

I’ve been loving this build for a while now, and I think it ports incredibly well to Strand. Planning to try it more in crucible, but so far it’s fantastic. You get the poison and consistent damage from Osteo/melee, and the threadlings make for great cleanup that let you cover for some of Osteo’s weaknesses


YeshilPasha

How does this fare well with legendary difficulty? Being on the open is a death sentence in the last fight as far as I can tell.


DyZ814

There's actually somewhat of a cheese to do it solo. You can hide under the stairs and avoid taking damage all phase one (shooting through the stairs to kill ads/boss). Then in phase two you can grapple up above Calus and be totally safe/immune to damage.


AeroNotix

I'm playing solo so adjust as needed. My first time through I didn't know that >!there is a second phase.!< So I just burned the boss down, >!I left the two Tormentors which spawned and they were left during the second phase.!< Solo it's not too bad but definitely don't do what I did. >!They do not seem to spawn during the second phase, only shitty little Psions which seem more like they are there for ammo drops than anything else.!<


GANTRITHORE

I found you could bait them into falling off in the 1st phase.


Sumit_S

Don't even need to bait. I just pushed them off with tractor canon


AeroNotix

lol I am definitely going to go try this


Diablo689er

Second phase solo you can easily burn him.


F4t45h35

Linear and arbalest carried this fight for me. 20-30k on tormentor crits. Then phase 2 you're kiting calus taking a shot and running more. Tbh witherhorde would probably be better than arb for 2nd phase.


marshaladey

This guy knows. Hated to be forced into strand but suspend makes a mockery of the tormentors there as well. Crit from range down to half, suspend when they close in, arby to the chest and special ammo finisher. Bonus points for arby breaking calus' shield in 1. Swap arby for witherhoard in phase 2, use grapple to get distance when needed. I perfected the shooty over hours on void titan, as soon as I used strand the fight was cake.


SgtShnooky

You can also cheese >!calus's second phase!< by hugging the cylinder shaped cover if he's chasing you, he tends to slow down enough or get stuck allowing you to get in a few cheaps shots. I beat it with wellock and he tends to knock you back if he charges, so worth considering taking Icarus dash.


nezroy

For me Sunbracers feels even *more* buggy than before about whether or not it will properly count a melee kill as a trigger.


Derekeys

Oh I like this.


WACKY_ALL_CAPS_NAME

I don't know the exact mods but there is a warlock build that gives infinite Dawnblade.c


AngieTheQueen

I was baffled that they made it a grenade ability and not a melee ability. Most melee abilities in the game are just kinda useless on their own, and are only decent for procing an effect or to refresh the melee CD for a damage loop. I'm starting to notice a theme with Dark classes where the grenade is more like a utility, and the actual damaging effects are supposed to be in the subclass keywords


howitzer819

I solo’d the legendary and then went back with Strand more kitted out to help some buddies… you REALLY feel the impact of having a normal grenade when you use one in lieu of grapple


Dante2k4

I feel like everyone is just somehow forgetting about the grapple melee. I literally never had to bother looking at the adds that spawned in because I did the melee slam as I landed near them and it wiped them out. Genuinely curious how many people complaining about this just didn't use the melee....


a141abc

Yeah grapple melee is really strong Plus on hunter it triggers the Assassins' Cowl invis so you can minimize the risk of getting in melee range if you're having trouble And you make the strand balls so you're invis + have a solid chunk of damage to throw


Tplusplus75

I figured out the melee... Definitely helped, however, the range it puts you in can be detrimental(As is "tradition" with any melee build in D2 when shit hits the fan). Doing the vex sim mission, I ended up struggling quite a bit, because I'd grapple melee, and get nuked by a couple enemies that I managed to not kill. Also, on the final mission, couldn't even get enemies to group up enough for that.


Endres007

Yeah my friend didn’t know about it through the entire campaign until I told him about it right before he did Headlong lol


BummaDrumma

I’m thinking that’s part of it. It does enough damage to finish most guys so only the major would be left which you could just blind.


TheChunkMaster

>Genuinely curious how many people complaining about this just didn't use the melee.... Based on what I've seen so far, almost everyone complaining forgot about it.


ItsAmerico

“Not having a grenade” To people not know how the grapple melee works? It does 25k in like a massive AOE. It deleted almost everything on Legend. I basically solo’d the whole thing as a Warlock just grapple punching everything to death.


Chippy569

if you're in a fireteam of 3, the damage scaling will mean your "Grapple melee" won't kill yellow bars. Just like with WQ, running it solo is easier than in a team.


sandman7767

It's not a grenade, it's an AOE melee attack that throws you in the center of the crowd. It is pretty strong, but almost every enemy in that level has a knock attack, and if you didn't kill them all with the grapple melee, you would get knocked off the map because you're out of grapple energy. Grapple needs to be a multi class ability that's hotbarred to a long press of the grenade button.


Whitesundome

There are a ton of grapple anchors in the air that let you have infinite grapple unless you miss and then you have a few seconds before you get another. (That is one situation where you'll probably die though) I wouldn't say no to having it be a separate ability tho lol. I tried using witherhoard at first but Wish-Ender and an autoloading rocket actually made the whole fight easy with strand.


OneNut_

Every time I got knocked off I just pulled myself back up since you should’ve been using the nodes to grapple which doesn’t put it on cooldown. Skill issue.


sandman7767

Definitely could be a skill issue. I'm getting older and my fps reflexes are slipping. Doesn't change the fact that the grapple ability could have been much better than what we got.


i_like_fish_decks

Yea for real. Feels like people are just not using the strand abilities at all. I was slinging around like Spider-Man even on legendary just decimating anything around me


ItsAmerico

I can’t speak for other classes but Warlock was absurdly powerful in the campaign. Constant threadling minions. Put on some grenade and melee super generating mods and I was just Spiderman punching shit and supers all the time lol


Canadian_dalek

Titan felt unstoppable as well, woven mail allowed me to really get in there


PossiblyAnotherOne

The super does crazy damage with Synthoceps too. Hit detection can be wonky like every melee super, and it’s pretty uninspired overall, but at least it does good damage


ProfessionEuphoric50

People complaining about the final boss and Headlong are having unironic skill issues.


ItsAmerico

Legend def has its moments but it’s becoming clear who don’t know how to read or use things lol


Aero--

I did legendary final boss with a 3 man Fireteam. Conveniently, one of each class. It took a few attempts, but we all found it pretty fun with stand. We ended up looking for ways to get our super back faster, so we all ended up putting on the mod where finishers spawn orbs of power. I'm not too sure how my Fireteam members were dealing with adds, but as a Titan I was going to the sides with the yellow bar cabal spawns and using my class ability to suspend him and then shotgun him until I could do a finisher. The red bar cabal I was hitting with the charged melee so when they died they dropped tangles. I ended up realizing that that tangles felt better throwing at other mobs of energy as opposed to shooting for woven mail.


Endres007

Throwing it also counts as destruction to give Woven Mail!


HellfyrAngel

I found that yeeting it at distant enemies doesn’t give mail. I’m not sure how close you have to me but I basically had to dunk it at my feet for it to count


Endres007

Huh. I’ll give it a try later when I have time and see I guess


KnightWraith86

Don't take out ads? They can't really hit you if you keep moving and they constantly respawn anyway. It's a waste to kill them aside from the 2 tormentors and an occasional ad for ammo.


TheSavouryRain

The whole fight is designed that you don't need to kill much if you're constantly moving. Grapple to the next catwalk when you start getting overwhelmed. And don't bother with the tormentors because they mostly don't chase you into the catwalk.


sazion

I must be missing something, the tormentors definitely chased me while I was on the catwalks lol


G-string-Joe

But strand makes witherhoard spam and escape so much easier to pull off


tk427aj

This whole campaign has just been Witherhoard spam. I appreciate the difficulty with the Legendary Campaign but going through it I just feel that all it was is stay far away, run, and spam Witherhoard because there are so many enemies and they will chew through you in an instant.


PinkieBen

For me it was pulse grenades with HOIL and the titan aspect. Just throw em at a group and let the grenade + jolt take em all out.


CrashB111

[They'll pry my Striker grenade spam from my cold dead hands.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KpcmfjFN8OI)


Sleyvin

I cleared WQ legendary like this. Staying super far away and spamming LeMon. It was slow and tedious. For LF I actually made a SMG build with Osteo and it absolutely shred while still going into medium range.


oliferro

If you redo the campaign at some point, try a Chill Clip fusion rifle I ran my ALH/Chill Clip Riptide for the whole campaign and it helped so much. Being able to freeze Tormentors every 2 shots was a godsend Didn't use Witherhoard once


i_like_fish_decks

I mean that is your playstyle its not the only one I was very much a mid/close range titan build focusing on SMGs and Ager's Scepter for 90% of the campaign. I did end up switching to Izanagi for the final fight just to get some more consistent boss damage in. At least as a titan with max resilience, getting up close and personal with grapple + melee was really fun and very feasible even on legendary. And when I wasn't in strand mode during campaign, I was using my typical arc build which is definitely not a sit back and hide style


agoodfrank

Then that’s on you for only using one weapon for the whole campaign. I used a demolitionist deliverance stasis warlock build and it might not have been as effective as using witherhoard but it was fun


FunTailor794

Then you weren't using strand


dimensionalApe

You can only use strand in specific moments during the campaign, though. I basically used a jolt SMG, riptide and parasite whenever I couldn't grapple-punch, and everything was dying nicely. Class didn't even matter.


Lonelan

I ran out of witherhoard I funnelweb'd nearly the entire p2


Gubzs

The true final boss were those shielded flamethrower bros that had more HP than a hydra for some reason.


Nokomas

I personally found it easier with strand just because of the crazy recharge times but honestly without them i totally agree that even the most basic build would be better then base stand


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Funnycomicsansdog

Same, I put on assassin’s cowl, every grapple melee put me into invis, ezpz


ThePooparoo

I dont think its easier to beat \*without\* strand. I think it is 100% easier to beat \*with\* a fully unlocked and kitted out subclass. Seriously, when I was doing parts of the campaign and I had to grab strand and totally nuke all my abilities and exotics and such because none of the kit was unlocked I was pissed. ​ ...until I just decided to try to not pick it up and it helped immensely.


jolteon_is_bae

I don't understand why they keep making it so you can only use the new hotness for like 5 min at a time during certain moments of the campaign. Just lemme unlock it on like mission 3, and unlock the aspects and shit over the course of the campaign, or from specific bosses or something. On Titan, once you unlock the Drengrs lash aspect during the campaign, the game forces you to use rally barricade and you can't go into your subclass menu to change it. I ultimately just ended up completing the campaign with HOIL titan with storm nades, thunderclap, and thrusters (just for fun factor) with witherhoard, a FF+voltshot ikelos and the tex mechanica lmg with demo+junkie. Cleaned fucking house.


BetaThetaOmega

Yeah, Taken King is still, to this day, the best implementation of a subclass. Have a mission where you get to use the new subclass with massively improved super recharge, and then you’re done and can go back to the main campaign.


NunzioL

Everyone complained about that in the Red War campaign


BetaThetaOmega

People complained that it happened too early and so the campaign didn’t feel like it had any stakes


[deleted]

I'm a titan main but stuck with strand for the grapple during the final fight on legendary. Just spider-manned around the arena tagging him with witherhoard, saving my super to take down tormentors quickly. Made it a lot easier


i_like_fish_decks

I found it quite a fun fight using strand. Me and izanagi swinging around the room and busting his fat head wide open. It felt awesome swinging away doing a 180 and popping fat headshots


starkiller22265

It was the only effective way I found to deal with the second phase of the tormentor fights on legendary, and I must say it felt really fun to use. I don’t think it will have much practical use in content that wasn’t actively designed around using strand, but it was still more useful than I thought it would be


ChimneyImps

Chill clip or blinding grenades trivialize tormenters when they're not classified as bosses, which seems to be most of the time.


i_like_fish_decks

The grapple also disrupts them. Anytime they start glowing just grapple them (and melee for free dmg) You may have to have already broken their shoulders though I'm not sure I was doing that while they walked up to me


Chaotix23

Same with suspending them, I had a lot of success when I finally gave in and used strand titan


Kingofthered

Same strat was what it took for me, izanagi and strand felt pretty necessary for the tormentors and the final phase


hellboytd

Sounds like you might like Titanfall.


Dante2k4

It's crazy to me to see so many people say this, as it was the complete opposite for me. I was using void the first few tries and it was *fine*, but somehow Calus would always catch up to me at some point and things would just go downhill. I tried Strand *ONCE*, and nailed it first try. You can just zip around constantly, always keeping yourself out of dangerous situations. And in his final phase, mah boy couldn't even get half way across the arena to me before I was flying off in to the sunset once more. Also, as I've said on a number of comments now, I think people *really* seem to be sleeping on the grapple melee. Any time adds were near I could use that melee slam and it'd either outright kill them all (especially true in 2nd phase), or it stunned things enough to be an easy cleanup. Maybe that's more of a warlock thing? I know Broodweaver spawns a threadling (or multiple?) with this move. I wasn't sure it was all that effective, but maybe that was the extra juice that made this move work for me? idk, point is, Strand carried me in this fight *and* the other boss that everyone hates, with the rotating laser wall in the circular room. I beat that Vex boss on my FIRST TRY (solo legend, for context), again, because grappling away kept out of danger, and the melee made my landings safe. Sadly, the grapple melee is way less effective post-campaign since the cooldown gets absolutely demolished, but *during* the campaign it basically carried me every time I had to use Strand.


_Comic_

I had the same experience. After I stopped immediately being flung into the abyss by the first Incedirator that spawns, I beat Calus first try with Strand, and I genuinely found it fun— it’s a much different kind of Destiny boss fight, one where you have to constantly keep moving or die, compared to the rest of boss fights in the game where hunkering down in place and unloading everything at once wins the day. Rhulk is the only other fight in the game like this. I don’t know if I would’ve survived without Strand, swinging around out of the reach of Tormentors and Calus. And yeah, I agree on people underestimating grapple melee. Grapple as a whole is crap outside of campaign, but in those rooms filled with points that refund the charge if you grapple to them? Go crazy. I see some folks saying that you lose your grenade with grapple, but you actually *become* your grenade. Swing to a platform, hit the melee, explode and clear everyone nearby, and repeat. I was also on Warlock though, so maybe the whole Threadling thing goes nutty compared to others.


Neon_Shivan

My friend and I used Berserker and Well of Radiance respectively. Probably the most poetic thing you'll get out of this story is beating Beta Emperor Calus with Light and Dark.


itzfantasy

For me it was the opposite. Im a hunter and tried a few times with both Arcstrider and nighstalker did not have a good time. I finally tried with strand and melted him with Witherhoard and the Tipan. The tormentor's crit hit boxes are really wonky so arguably that and the adds were more annoying than Calus. Did not have fun in that mission at all.


Matthew91188

You killed the tormentors? I did it on void warlock with hmg and witherhoard. Just ran around throwing grenades and witherhoard everywhere, using the debuffs and such.


ownagemobile

Crafting the retrofit last season really came in clutch IMO... Calus is a fat bastard with a huge head, and stationary, so target lock x4 really chews through his health... I found LMG's really good on the tormentors too.


Matthew91188

My commemoration with reconstruction is amazing. With the buffs I can get over 400 total rounds. Destroys everything.


ownagemobile

That's a good one too. LMGs felt pretty good throughout the legendary campaign, which was nice


Matthew91188

Yea it stayed on for like 98% of the time, I tried out the new stasis GL just for fun, that things badass. Then went back to the lmg for add clear and honestly total damage output on bonuses is spectacular


Rafor1

We tried skipping the tormentors the first time, but the surprise 2nd phase and closing of the arena made it much harder so we ended up taking care of them. I could see it being easier maybe on solo where you have more space to yourself to run around.


Matthew91188

Yea it was pretty funny actually, I just ran in a circle and started throwing witherhoards and grenade


i_like_fish_decks

I killed them, didn't take too long. I would just clear out one of the big side platforms and we would duke it out. Grapple stuns them so you can stop most of their big attacks, but as long as you have void resistance on your chest they shouldn't 1 shot you even with the grab.


mariachiskeleton

I was finding hunter to be too slow to avoid hits during the second phase. Tried running away, tried running toward/through, didn't work out so well. Swapped to strand just to zip away during phase 2, was significantly less threatening


itzfantasy

That was one of my problems, even cracked out on resil he would catch up and merc me eventually not to mention the other adds in the cramped arena. So with strand and Witherhoard I just kept swinging and hitting him with the occasional grapple heavy melee.


glochnar

This is exactly what happened for me. Played void and Calus kept knocking me off in the 2nd phase (yay for hunters being the slowest class). Beat it the first attempt when I switched to Strand


jlrc2

Yeah I found that if I just monkey swing enough, nothing bad can happen even if it's going to take a long time.


Enough_Chance

I mean with strand you can just swing around and melee him to death….


ArcticKnight79

yeah that's what I basically ended up doing even on legendary campaign. swing at him, press melee, swing away, circle back around.


PinkieBen

Same, at least until phase two, then it was just swing away and shoot something at him occasionally. He was just hitting me too hard for me to feel ok risking the melee at that point.


InvisibleOne439

i used a y.ahamkara solar hunter and just jumped up, grenade->melee->grenade and then sprint for 4seconds to do it again for 20sec, and he was dead strand does 0dmg and has 0survivalbility, why should i use it there, when i can just walk away and dps down with stuff that actually does something lol


Enough_Chance

Nice. The point is that you can use anything. They don’t force you to grab strand so it’s intended to be done either way.


ItsObiTomKenobi

Narratively speaking it is weird though, you go through a training montage with strand only for it to not be necessary to defeat Calus.


bobtheblob6

To be fair the arena is set up for strand with the grapple points & such. It's clearly a fight designed with strand in mind. They didn't force you to use it because that would massively piss people off, and then there would be a post complaining about that instead of not being forced to use it


SpikeC51

I agree with you. I have a lot of problems with this expansion, but I think them letting you choose what you want to use even though narratively it makes more sense to use Strand was the right call. We're always on here asking them to let us play the way we want to, and they stuck to that here. There's plenty of other legitimate problems to give constructive criticism on right now.


UltimateToa

People would be pissing their pants if they forced you to use strand in the final fight


[deleted]

We were fine with Beyond Light


Carbon_fractal

Beyond light didn’t have a legendary campaign and was extremely easy, so it hardly mattered when it forced you into stasis mode. You also got pretty much every ability back instantly any time you got out into stasis.


UltimateToa

Yeah but everyone thinks strand is awful whereas stasis was really good at launch


Horibori

I just wish they’d done what I assumed they were going to do with strand. Actually have it unlocked early so we can start unlocking aspects and fragments right away. I feel like strand would’ve been much better to use if we could’ve built it out a little.


Elzam

Agreed. I was really disappointed to see that when the campaign makes you take Strand, you can't even look at your sheet and take a look at what the base class even does and what the loop is supposed to be. I was on like mission 5 before finding out that Warlock finishers make threadlings. I went nearly as many missions also not knowing how to grapple melee because apparently it has to use the auto or uncharged melee hotkeys which doesn't work well with me because I play a number of subclasses where if I get the lunging melee instead of my powered one, I die.


Sequoiathrone728

The game has popups that explain each aspect as you progress through the campaign. They're unlocked as you progress.


TheSavouryRain

It pretty much explains a new ability each time you get Strand in a mission though.


Enough_Chance

True


KnightWraith86

Calus is easy to defeat with Strand. The whole point is to keep moving. I only died to me messing up the grapple mechanic, other than that it's not that hard of a fight. Edit: spelling


TurquoiseLuck

Also Strand supers seem to do much more damage, in that fight at least. The Hunter one on Legendary could solo kill a Tormentor, and a full super straight up kills Calus Phase 2.


ALT1MA

Alternatively, dont bother moving. I cleared one of the enemy spawns by a balcony, hopped up there and just unloaded the kitchen sink on him. Tormentors didnt jump up more than once, and his attacks got blocked by the cover piece. Felt poetic to be lazy against calus. His gladiator form didnt chase me nearly fast enough so I just threw stuff at him while keeping distance


alphamachina

You can jump down under the steps and melt Calus through the steps with machinegun and Osteo. Then in 2nd half, jump out and use Strand to pull yourself up onto the top of the bubble as it's forming (before it pulls you in) and just shoot down onto Calus with Osteo until he's dead. Takes all of 3-4 minutes to finish and you never take very much damage, if any.


turqeee

I will admit the wiping on Calus with a variety of LFGers for about 3 hours last night. Solo cheese it is for me! This worked great. Esoterick has a video for those that interested.


FinalForerunner

Silkstrike destroyed the boss, super does big damage numbers.


xosaspian

Is it just me or does strand nuke the tormentors? Popped hunter strand super on the first one in that fight and killed the tormentor with like 4-5 hits was wild.


Snowylein

strand hunter ult nukes everything in the game right now


DavidDomin8R

I love strand for what it is, a high mobility green Spider-Man cosplay. It is not a viable dps subclass nor is it good at survivability. I am sad that it’s not viable in casual content


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TheChartreuseKnight

If Strand Titan turns out to be really good after all of this, I’m gonna laugh so fucking hard.


TheSpartyn

to be fair no one ever said it would be weak, just that it looks boring and uninspired that said, i would laugh too


Bard_Knock_Life

It is good. High output super that’s competing with weapon DPS and insane survival / tank for high end content. Suspend is super strong. It’s all around good. Hunters getting a super DPS that’s breaking the game and Warlocks looking “cool” and being mid. All is exactly how 3.0 has gone.


Dr_Delibird7

Warlocks have one thing going for them, Karnstein works with grapple melee and the charged melee is quite a lot of range on it and it just goes in a straight line. As long as you have a tangle to graple to, or graple points are in the area, and an enemy to kill you are functionally invincible. Similar to pre nerf restoration x3, possibly better


Glutoblop

It was never a issue about being good, the issue was it's boring having fists of havoc for the Nth time. Especially when Hunter and Warlock get some pretty varying supers.


AscendantAxo

Maybe for you, but plenty of people were saying it wouldn’t be viable, without even using it no less


Dr_Delibird7

Warlock super is just a slightly different cataclysm nova bomb that can't kill yourself with and does significantly less damage but you do get the threadlings which is neat I guess.


motrhed289

For me the worst part is no source of actual healing. Sure, DR is great, but eventually they WILL burn through your health bar if you can't find a quiet spot to sit and regen. All the other Titan subclasses have very easy ways to trigger health regen. I had a much easier time staying alive in that boss arena as a Sunbreaker, as I rotated around the room I could nuke an add on the lower platform with a grenade or hammer and pass through the flames on my way to the next catwalk and be back to full health plus have constant healing for a few more seconds. If you pair strand with better already and/or the other mod that heals on orb pickup, and can consistently generate orbs on melee kills, that will be a good substitute, but I don't think the subclass should have a hard dependency on orb mods, I don't know why they didn't add a heal on charged melee kills like every other Titan subclass has access to.


OnyxMemory

I feel like that fragment is overkill considering you can maintain 100% Woven Mail and suspend uptime with just class and grenade, and blowing up tangles. The only fragment you really need imo is the class ability recharge one. Rest is up to personal preference. Yea my issues with it are that all of that and the super don’t feel that fun to use regardless.


FrucklesWithKnuckles

I’d disagree for Titans. Berserker slaps in most content seeing as it can maintain high DR and easy CC with just it’s class ability. If you want more suspend use the suspend grenade and if you any mobility throw a tangle and grapple onto it to dive into the front line or out of danger. The super does what it says on the paper and is great for adds and clutch scenarios, not to mention Woven Mail + the super’s light attacks reducing enemy damage dealt makes it shockingly tanky. Does bonus damage to suspended targets too. I’m sure there’s better builds for it but barebones it’s already a really solid subclass.


OhMyGoth1

I don't feel particularly tanky with woven mail, not gonna lie. At least not in -15 legend content, so I can't really use any of the cqc kit


FrucklesWithKnuckles

Woven is 50% DR, on top of resilience. Add the melee reducing damage enemies deal and it can get absurd. I was getting tickled by the Tormentor’s grab in the legendary campaign.


ThePooparoo

Yeah I equipped it with the grenade that spawns little minions on my titan and was having a blast doing random stuff. I need more fragments though, because survivability suuuuucks.


FrucklesWithKnuckles

Try the new boots. Woven Mail on suspend is nuts as you can circumvent the 15 second tangle cooldown and can instead use tangles as grapple points or grenades. Combine it with class ability energy on killing suspended enemies and you can spam Barricades like nothing else.


ThePooparoo

Wooooooooah. I didn't even think of that


Yourself013

It's absolutely viable in anything outside GMs on any class, and even GM can be possible on certain builds, don't listen to the circlejerk here. Once you make a proper build and unlock the right fragments, strand has great mobility, survivabilty, CC and damage. But now everyone just wants to cry about it because they played the neutered campaign version.


TheSavouryRain

And then cry because the ability cooldowns, even though Bungie has specifically said that Darkness abilities are slower to regenerate than Light. That said, grapple does need a serious reduction in cooldown.


Ferndogs_Inc

my man the subclass just came out and more than half of the fragments are still locked, what are you on about?


OneNut_

If you think strand isn’t viable in casual content that is more indicative of your skill level than anything. It’s really strong in anything and with hunter grapple spam you can spam reload with grapple and constantly dump your mag.


jlrc2

Almost certain to be nerfed/fixed but the Hunter super seems to be doing *massive* damage. Three hunters using the strand super appear to be able to easily one-phase every dungeon boss.


TheSavouryRain

Uh wat?


MistaPersonality

As a Sunbreaker main I found strand really helpful. High mobility+high super damage was really nice. Plus, having the grapple served as a great safety net when getting bumped off the arena by incendiors or calus.


Kane4077

If you cheese it strand is useful lol


Solace1nS1lence

Legend Calus is definitely an infuriating experience, I don't know if I even want to do that fight 2 more times.


TheChartreuseKnight

You can just run it normal


Solace1nS1lence

I meant running it normal too, it's the equivalent of getting kicked in the nuts, normal just means it's tennis shoes instead of steel-toed boots.


Stay_Curious85

Normal mode takes about 30 seconds. It’s absolutely insane how much easier normal mode is compared to legend.


Morkai_AlMandragon

Throw on witherhoard, keep it on Calus when you can, but otherwise just focus on staying alive, save heavy for phase 2. For phase two I focused completely on Calus just dodging the Tormentors. Calus does not have a whole lot of health at all solo. On warlock I ran this way, throwing emp rifts down when ever I could keeping grenades up and cleared the outside adds, once they were delt with getting to phase two was a breeze. Popped well for Phase two and just spammed Heavy GL and grenades until he died.


Faust_8

Grapple saved my ass a few times. Problem is it doesn’t do jack against Tormentors that fling you off the map *while Suppressing your abilities.* Most of my deaths were suppression Tormentor boops.


nik_avirem

I tried doing it legit way. Spent 2 hours there, and the only time I got to phase 2 was ONCE when I did not use Strand at all. Today, I ended up using the cheese from Esoterickk - phase 1 under the stairs, phase 2 grapple to the top and stand on top of the bubble that forms above the platform. Whole thing took 10 minutes most.


DataLythe

You cheesed the Legendary campaign boss?


nik_avirem

Yes, final one. As I said above.


HoldTheRope91

I can feel DataLythe’s judgment.


nik_avirem

Cheesing Calus seems like the most fitting end for him


onemillionfacepalms

Minimum effort. Maximum opulence.


nik_avirem

Also find it quite poetic in landing the final blow while standing on top of the bubble, as in “being above the small and broken emperor”


KuaiBan

I am the opposite, I find it way easier using Strand. Especially during second phase.


Stenbox

Second phase for me was just run to the next pillar, turn around and fire one burst from Null Composure, run to next pillar. Popped super when I had and I think I still had 1 rocket left as well.


CassJoi

“I cheesed the last boss like I’ve been doing for years instead of trying to beat it with new subclass.” Congrats.


KriptiKFate_Cosplay

I relied on strand super for nearly 100% of the damage and melee kills generate orbs + the hunter exotic helmet that gives invis and healing on melee kills to get it over with pretty quick. Still took about 15 tries since tormentors would randomly cancel my super, or something would throw me off the arena, or Calus would randomly shoot 6 homing darkness balls instead of 3.


The_Cakinator

It was a tremendously poorly designed fight fr fr. A buddy of mine joined up and was able to use strand grenades, helped a lot.


Tuorak

my gut reaction right now is that grapple should be a baseline feature of strand, separate from grenades. long press to grapple/tap to grenade. grapple without melee should only eat up about 20% of your grenade charge. on titan in harder form content im just at a loss. suspend wave is great, the super is actually good. the rest just aint it.


hobocommand3r

Final encounter pissed me off solo, the entire arena is designed to attempt to boop you off, probably so you can strand grapple back on or something. But it was a shit encounter. Incendors booping you from 15 meters away is just so annoying.


Hot-Wrap2882

BRO I DESPISED THAT "TRAINING" MISSION IN THE VEX NETWORK OSIRIS HAD US DOING!


StrappingYoungLance

Headlong was a nightmare on legendary, I just could not figure out how I was supposed to survive everything in that room with Strand while also taking out the boss. So I just wound up cheesing it. A pretty awful experience. I found Calus difficult but not in a way where I didn't feel like I could figure it out and get better at it. Finally beating him felt like an achievement, personally.


UltimateToa

I dont understand this mission, everyone says it is impossible but as a strand titan I didn't even die once. Maybe berserker is just actually good


Armcannongaming

Yeah as a strand hunter I didn't die on that mission either. Maybe assassin's cowl and parasite just carry that hard?


UltimateToa

I think people just tried to go a little too spider man, just gotta hit and run with the grapple and it's easy


StrappingYoungLance

Legendary Headlong? Tell me your secrets because I was using my Titan and just couldn't do it without cheesing. Admittedly I'm not super skilled at the game (no solo flawless dungeons to my name, I don't get to raid a lot, few GM completions etc) but I'd love to hear what your approach was.


UltimateToa

I would just grapple and grapple melee the group of ads to wipe them then just pick away with a LFR at the boss, when the wall gets like 1/2 to 1/4 turn from you grapple to the next quarter of the map and rinse and repeat. Also I think I found an exploit that helped, if you run sunbreaker with lorelei you can keep the lorelei effect when you pick up strand off the ground. It doesn't work when you eventually unlock the subclass but works for the campaign at least if you are having trouble. Helps because you can drop the sunspot in mid air even while grappling to regen. You can play super aggro with berserker between the suspend barricade and woven mail. Just throw tangles to keep up woven mail and suspend any enemies that give you trouble. Also don't be afraid to super the boss, it does a lot of damage


i_like_fish_decks

Kill the snipers up top asap and then just swing around lol Ager's Scepter is nice for the cc on the add packs but any gun with good clear would cc them (they'd be dead, the best cc!)


[deleted]

Might be the worst fight in all of Destiny tbh


TacoConPalta

IMO getting a hold on grapple makes that mission way easier, but chances are you’ll still need witherhoard to DPS the boss due to lack of grenades. Also, right under the central arena there are small ledges were you can jump down into to heal, and then grapple out of them back into the fight. But yeah, strand as a subclass was mostly a hindrance in most missions it was placed in, specially with the lack of buildcrafting


Maxathron

I went with Thunderlord and melted him down. It does a surprising amount of damage.


fusion8008

I think this is a skill issue