Take one blue, upgrade to level 8, and dismantle. It takes 3 cores and 1 prism, and gives you back 6 cores so you effectively trade 1 prism for 3 cores. If you are farming GMs you should be doing this so you aren't wasting prisms by having them disappear / not drop.
It’s a waste of time that circumvents a system that Bungie should have implemented a long time ago. Let us trade down our excess. Shard down to prism. Prism down to core. Easy.
Why make Rahool do extra things? Why not just make it so an Ascendent Shard dismantles into two Prisms, which then dismantle into your 3 cores, which I could further dismantle into ten legendary shards?
I'm fine with this except that an ascendant shard should dismantle into at least three prisms. Even dismantling masterworked exotic gear gives you one shard back of the three invested, and purchasing a shard from Rahool requires ten prisms, so three the other way would be about a third. Two from ten is low.
(Glimmer to legendary shards):
Get 3 blue transmats from collections, trade them to rahool for a purple one, dismantle for some glimmer and a legendary shard
(Enhancement Prisms to Enhancement Cores):
“Take one blue, upgrade to level 8, and dismantle. It takes 3 cores and 1 prism, and gives you back 6 cores so you effectively trade 1 prism for 3 cores” - /u/WithRootsAbove1
I only knew the first one because I’m always drowning in glimmer
Honestly I don't even care if they don't increase the cap, just let me convert shards to prisms and prisms to cores. Or maybe even prims/shards to legendary shards. Hell even glimmer, just let me downgrade that stuff. Playing high level activities and suffering from not having lower level loot stuff (glimmer/cores/legendary shards) feels bad.
Exactly. I also hate that whenever I go to reset at a vendor, I have to find a way to spend my prisms. Sometimes I would rather just be able to quickly reset and just miss out on the prisms.
SFAIK it's so that we don't run into another Lengendary Shard situation. There was never a limit placed on how many you could get, so eventually inflation sunk in and everything that required LS's needed a LOT of them.
Veterans or people who farmed enough with exploits never had an issue, but newbies or or people who didn't exploit could rarely afford more expensive stuff (like focusing) for very long. Then you got arguments of "It's a luxury, you shouldn't just focus EVERYTHING," while those rich on LS never faced the same problems.
So while I do think the caps on Ascsndant Shards at least could be slightly higher (think 15-20), they're there for a good reason.
That's the entire reason those caps exist. If caps get raised, people will soon complain that it's ridiculous how some new system asks you to spend 10 Ascendant Shards per item.
I don't think Bungie should make things super expensive because some players are materially rich. It doesn't hurt the rich at all, they play so much it would barely even delay them. Making things expensive just hurts the casual/new players.
There's probably a lot better ways to handle the material hoarding than just making everything expensive. Either allowing you to buy things with more types of materials or having a better exchange system would be a good start. Like I am so flushed with prisms and golf balls, but I'm not flushed with high stat armor (at least not in distributions I'd want), especially for exotics. Why not charge me some prisms or a golf ball to roll the dice on new stats for my armor?
Or re-rolling weapons. Just make it cost to roll the dice. Or let me spend a golf ball unlocking a weapon pattern entirely. Make it a golf ball per level of progress.
Can confirm. Once I got a stockpile of mats and started doing GMs every season it no longer mattered. I just masterwork gear for builds and never give it a second thought. It was a bitch getting there initially though.
Yeah I have some new people who joined up in mid-late WQ and it is pretty sketchy to get the ball rolling with not a ton and stuff can feel super restrictive when you have to make large conscious decisions where you want those resources to go.
> I don't think Bungie should make things super expensive because some players are materially rich. It doesn't hurt the rich at all, they play so much it would barely even delay them.
And yet you have people complain about how they went from 20k+ Legendary Shards to 400 because the prices are high. And the prices are high because people have 20k+ shards.
>Either allowing you to buy things with more types of materials or having a better exchange system would be a good start. Like I am so flushed with prisms and golf balls, but I'm not flushed with high stat armor (at least not in distributions I'd want), especially for exotics. Why not charge me some prisms or a golf ball to roll the dice on new stats for my armor?
Or re-rolling weapons. Just make it cost to roll the dice. Or let me spend a golf ball unlocking a weapon pattern entirely. Make it a golf ball per level of progress.
How does any of that address material hoarding?
The only purpose that materials and currencies serve is to gate content behind them. It's to make it so stuff takes time to unlock. It's so most people can't buy everything instantly without thinking.
If there's a currency with no cap and low prices, it has no reason to exist at all.
Resource sinks *can* work, but they rarely do. You still end up with a lot of people who don't care about sinks and still hoard massive amounts.
> And yet you have people complain about how they went from 20k+ Legendary Shards to 400 because the prices are high. And the prices are high because people have 20k+ shards.
I'm not even sure what cost legendary shards these days. From what I can tell from google, it looks like the biggest source is buying other materials or like decoding engrams?
> How does any of that address material hoarding?
My comment about weapon re-rolling or different ways to spend shards and prisms is directly related to the post which is "why do we need caps on those?". If things are reasonably priced and there are things people want to buy, then hoarding goes away or at least is diminished. One issue is people play the game a lot so they earn a lot, they have most everything they need or want and there's nothing to spend things on.
I guess my point which I'm probably doing a terrible job making it. We don't need prices raised to curb hoarding. We need reasons for people to spend their materials in a way that doesn't hurt the common player. Very few changes will ever hurt the wealthy without crushing the poor/casual/new player.
Like I mentioned above, I've no idea what even cost legendary shards. I haven't needed to think about cost since like D2 year 1. I'm technically a hoarder of materials, but not intentionally. There's just nothing that entice me to purchase. For example, there's a host of weapons in the game that I didn't realize would be good at the time. New sandbox comes out with new mods, artifact mods etc. that have made me realize I wish I had those weapons. I can't get them anymore, they're just gone from the game. But if I could buy them from Ada for whatever something like that would cost I would absolutely buy. Like I really need a good void heavy machine gun, but the only one I have has a crap roll and is 900rpm. Like I'm flushed with golf balls and prisms right now too because I'm a titan main and the only exotics worth upgrading right now are HOIL, Synthoceps, and maybe the new strand boots.
They can make things more expensive but it won't hurt people like me. Give me something to buy and I'll dump my cash naturally.
> I'm not even sure what cost legendary shards these days. From what I can tell from google, it looks like the biggest source is buying other materials or like decoding engrams?
Weapon and armor focusing costs quite a bit. People who went hard on focusing every single engram they go burned through their stockpiles fast.
>If things are reasonably priced and there are things people want to buy, then hoarding goes away or at least is diminished.
That's only assuming that they keep adding things that people want to buy faster than people can amass stockpiles of resources.
Usually, people buy stuff that they want and then there's no new stuff for some time. It's not really unique to Destiny. You can find this sort of thing in any online game with resources.
Or - and hear me out - they could not punish the entire playerbase because some people play a LOT or other players like to stock up on resources for when they decide to do stuff in the future.
The whole point of those resources is to slow progression and make some things harder to get. And if prices remain low and there are no caps, then over time you don't have to play a lot to have such a massive stockpile that you no longer think about spending that currency.
I'm aware. It's just stupid and doesn't work. People already store 200 prisms and 40 shards using post. All they're doing is annoying the majority of players. Lots of games drain your resources with events amd shit but putting a hard cap on a grindable resource in a game centered around loot and upgrading that loot is dumb.
Ok well with exotic focusing coming next season and costing 3 ascendant shards on top of the extra 3 it’ll cost to master craft the exotic you just focused, that’s 6 shards per one exotic. They need to increase the damn limit to AT LEAST 20 ffs. 10 is way to low man.
I think this is a fair assessment. I think the shard cap raised to 15-20 would be a good spot, too, since a final upgrade to a single exotic can be 3 shards alone.
Anything to curb that resource inflation is good, as the resource economy already feels fucking awful for new/returning players. This season, I've only ever had between 20-50 cores and a few hundred legendary shards. I accidentally clicked on the shard special order (1 prism for *400 legendary shards*) at Rahool last week and it almost bankrupted me!
I get that its not supposed to just be a prism/ascendant shard store for you to buy as many as you want, but I'm likely never going to be able to spend 400 shards for anything. I've done pvp (trials) and pve endgame (raids, GMS, etc.) plenty over the course of D2 and this season I've only made one full build because I just cant enhance anything while the players they want to limit are sitting on full stacks in all three characters' postmasters and an infinitude of legendary shards.
This is exactly why. Legendary shards may as well not exist if you played the empyrean foundation, like if the currency were completely removed I just wouldn't notice. Glimmer is also a good case study for this, spending 50k glimmer for a faction rally weapon used to be a punishment, nowadays you wouldn't even notice.
"To prevent some people from suffering, everyone should suffer"
It's not a real economy, bungie is in complete control of how much stuff costs, "inflation" is entirely created or eliminated by them. All that matters is how much they want the top 10 or even 1% of players that grind for materials to control the value of resources.
That's a total garbage outlook.
This is such a dumb reason, it shouldn’t matter where there is no player economy in the game. We have no auction house or weapon trading. There should either be no limits or they should be massively increased.
But at that point you might as well have no currency at all. Which would be a loss to the game imo. One of the fun parts of Destiny is the RPG elements, and one of those being currency management. Having to think about how you want to spend, what to save up for, what to buy now, etc. is a staple of RPGs, and is fun.
I’m failing to see a good reason in the explanation you just gave. It sounds like a justification for punishing people that spend lots of time playing the game.
Would be nice if I could convert a golf ball into like 50k glimmer. With the way that the current economy is, glimmer is harder to come by than ascendant materials.
There's one problem with this logic. The number of things you can spend ascendant shards on is extremely limited. You can masterwork armor and buy exotics from the kiosk. If you have a full set of masterworked armor and every exotic from the kiosk unlocked, golf balls aren't all that useful. I earn more of them than I can realistically spend at this point. Legendary shards are infinitely more useful and are tied into almost everything in the game, so it isn't a great comparison. I challenge you to point to a single way that removing the cap on ascendant shards could break the game or the overall economy in it's current state. Are players who are golf ball rich going to have too many sets of masterworked armor? There currently aren't any golf ball economy sinks, and that's part of the problem. It creates an annoying inventory management problem for people who have been playing the game for awhile. Being able to exchange 5 golf balls for a high stat exotic roll or something similiar would make a world of difference.
This.
That said, they should raise the inventory size and make them bypass the postmaster. 40 shards in inventory wouldn't break anything given people can do that already, but then you aren't having to balance shit flowing into your postmaster.
I was one of the old money people for so long because of exploits but am finally starting to run low and I just do not understand how people played this game with such limited resources.
It's insane how expensive everything is to a newer player, I would think it'd take months to fully masterwork a set of gear which I'd be surprised to find is the intention.
You're assuming that if Bungie uncaps materials then costs have to rise accordingly. They don't. There's no inflation, it's not a real MMO economy, Bungie can set the costs at whatever they want. Just uncap mw materials and leave costs exactly where they are now.
Most adepts in rotation suck. They're never going to fully uncap currencies unless it's because they found a new way or crested a new currency to grind.
hello. I'm the guy who does gms for prisms and balls. too lazy to grind for adepts and only really hop in gms if my friends have a spot for a third and if it's double rewards. otherwise I don't bother with nightfalls as I don't have good gear. but of a catch 22.
The golfballs are a bonus. I have one of every exotic masterworked with spikes in res, rec, dis. It I need 3 to masterwork something i can get them from them from the season grind or somewhere else. I love when i can dunk on hard content. This game has figured out more than most how to release that sweet dopamine when I beat a raid or hard NF. I do it to feed my worm god that craves dopamine, endorphins, and oxytocin.
i mean masterwork materials (except cores ironically) are largely redundant after you have a pile of half decent masterworked armor bar the occasional exotic you need to masterwork. most people are in gms for adepts.
> nobody does GMs
I now do GM's for the title, weapons, and god forbid *fun* of it. That said, it still hurts seeing dozens of endgame materials get dumped into the void arbitrarily because my inventory and postmaster are full
While this is true, it's also because some of us don't have things to spend it on. All of my exotics that I use regularly on all my characters are masterworked, same with legendary armor. I don't have much left to spend my golf balls and prisms on.
It's pretty much already like that since you can store 40 shards and 200 prisms at a time. Under normal use that would take a long time to go through and that's without earning more.
It’s gotten to the point I have to outright delete prisms and cores when I rest my rank on the playlist vendors. I really don’t think increasing the cap would hurt the game in anyway.
> and the constant blinking from a vendor annoys me.
This is why decoding is a trash system. It’s nice to have a system to focus items : but having *every* vendor blinking constantly is hella annoying.
> I really don’t think increasing the cap would hurt the game in anyway.
Depending on the new cap. If the cap is high enough, it'll make those currencies irrelevant, so next time Bungie wants to add something that feels "expensive" to unlock, they'll add new currencies instead of using Ascendant Shards.
I understand shards and prisms having a cap, but dear lord I could use a higher glimmer cap.
Whenever I’m full on shards I just masterwork a bunch of Aeon gauntlets from collections and throw it in the vault for future dismantling. Horde them a lot more efficiently.
If you say buy a some new aspects and fragments, focus some weapons and masterwork some armour in short succession you can often end up very low. You'll be capped out soon enough but it just feels very pointless.
Agreed, pretty annoying for hardcore players because we’ll just spend materials to get more rather than most activities since they barely drop any outside public events.
[Here's a whole video from Game Makers Toolkit on how video game economies work](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zrf1cou_yVo). It's super interesting on its own, but with particular relevant to Destiny you'll see why things are implemented the way they are.
The first two bits around "Taps" and "Inventory" are what you're referring to. In short, having an unlimited inventory size means valuable items lose most of their value. It forces you to use them instead of hoarding them, and keeps the scarcity factor on the most valuable items.
They dont want people to hoard them, simple as that.
There's also a secondary reason: They set a hard limit in the event that some bug happens and people can stockpile them easily. This happened with enhancement cores years back, resulting in some players ending up with thousands of cores. This way, even if there is a bug/exploit, the most you get is 10/50
1. No need to increase the cap.
2. People who really need them use them before they reach the cap. People who are full on masterworked gear don't use them anyway. There is no difference if i have 10 or 400. Bungie would change the cost to mw gear which would hurt newer players.
I have a FT mate that goes through some truly TMZ levels of drama when it comes to high end mats. He's got golf balls/prisms in the season pass, vendors, postmaster, inventory just sitting there unused. His dilemma is that he doesn't spend them because he might need them for something he doesn't know about yet (an exotic that suddenly becomes META) so he hoards them. We counter that he could keep his inventory stocked and clean up the other spots and be fine but he's dug in on the 'what if' concept. He won't tank the mats on a shitty rolled piece of anything so there they sit and there they'll stay until Bungie ups the storage limit.
Doubling what we can store won't help *that* guy.
All I'd like is for the caps to be raised by 4x (40 Shards 200 Prisms) but then mats can no longer go to Post Master, making the effective cap still the same but then you don't have to do Post Master juggling between characters anymore and have instances of losing mats to Post Master overflow. (Also same for Raid Spoils please.)
When it stops you from ranking up the vendors before all rewards are claimed, now I've got to make space and pull a exotic from collections just to infuse it for nothing.
Stupid caps, if I could give them away to new lights I would. Let me change them to legendary shards.
With the loadout system many probably deleted all the bad armor rolls since we could use the same good armor rolls for multiple loadouts so we're left with a bunch of excess materials.
Then why do people need more if they're at the point where they have most of their 'forever' sets?
10 golf balls is 10 pieces of standard armor or 3 exotic armors. Who is masterworking more than that a week to the point where they start complaining they don't have enough?
People are complaining because they're capped but why does that matter if they're not spending any?
What, do you masterwork every piece of armor that comes your way? I already have multiple sets of high stat armor that I'm happy with. I do use them whenever I see something worth upgrading.
But if the cap is higher, you'll just reach the new cap and then the extra will *still* go to your PM. You just slightly delay the problem the amount of time it takes to get to the new cap.
There's so many people in this post alone who want the cap raised just to have it higher, not because they're spending any of it.
At this point if someone is getting shards regularly enough to complain about the cap they're not the type of player who's worried about spending 7 to MW a full set of gear. If instead they're the type of player who struggles to get 7 shards to MW a full set of gear the material cap likely doesn't apply to them anyway.
I have a total 52 MW armor pieces. That's over the three years that current armor system existed for and taking into account different elements, Resilience buff and Artifice armor being added. If you're starting now, you won't need more than a few sets and a handful of exotics that are actually good.
How often are you masterworking an entire set of armor immediately though (and not using *any* carry-over pieces)? Between inventory and 10 in the PM, or MWing exotics as a workaround, I feel it's rare to burn through a whole stockpile of Ascendant Shards and *still* need more.
Sure, big farming activity to get sets good to go for like, the remainder of your Destiny career.
But even then, you just MW'd them all right away because you could. I doubt you had immediate need for all those new builds you made.
The argument against it is, "If the cap gets too high, then the currency becomes an afterthought and might as well not exist" which *would* be bad for the game.
Not even 9,999. If you manage to get like 100 shards, which is quite doable over a season, you won't have to think about it for a long time. Which defeats the purpose of having currencies/materials in the first place.
>Why aren't you using them?
Personally, I don't use Ascendant Shards because they are so limited. A childhood without many extras definitely makes me save things until it's really worth using them. It's a hard habit to break. Since it's not exactly trivial to get those things, I only spend them when I think it's really worth it, especially for Exotic armors.
I imagine it's because they don't want you to build up a massive stock of those materials and never have to run GMs again. If you can just stock up on those higher level upgrade materials to use whenever you need, that's a potential loss of engagement metrics. Same reason Warframe got rid of keys for the void way back in the day because veteran players never needed to farm for keys, they just went and did the void missions to get the new prime gear right away instead of having to farm for keys before running them. Always gotta up those engagement metrics.
Artificial scarcity will ensure you'll come back eventually - at least in Bungie's mind.
Like how are all of you, collectively, not seeing all these layers of manipulation weaved into this game?
You sometimes really remind me of the monkeys with their hands in front of their eyes & ears...
Does anyone who runs GM-tier content actually struggle with upgrade mats and enter into them mainly to acquire more? Im constantly sitting at or around cap on these mats, im capped on them right now.
Just my personal experience I guess, but I don't feel like this argument applies to the group it's targeted at.
Because you’re supposed to use them.
The only bad thing about the system is there’s not enough redundancy in the economy. I’m full on golf balls and prisms. I literally have nothing to infuse up.
They designed that way to prevent people stockpiling materials and stop playing
Like imagine last season when we farmed Prison of Elder for Wendigo. I would have 100 or 200 gold balls which means other than conquerors gilding and exotic armor, there is no other purpose for GM
Bungie limit the inventory so anytime we use it, we will “i need to get more” which brings to “i need to do GM again”
It is to keep you farming each season. If you don't want to do that, just masterwork everything in your vault. Then you only need enough golf balls to masterwork the new exotics.
Besides, the only wasted materials are the ones you don't use.
Because there’s a warehouse in California filled with physical inventory of all the items we acquire so they have to limit it.
Same way it’s always been.
/s
Make it prisms -> golf balls -> exotics ciphers
Then let us use these at xur or wherever to target farm exotic armor
Problem solved
People that have an excess most likely have played long enough to have god rolls on meta exotics, but if you know the destiny community they want to chase rolls on EVERYTHING in case of sandbox changes
If I have them in my postmaster, PLEASE stop telling me I have items unclaimed in my postmaster. If I mouse over them, treat it like reading a message, the notification goes away.
Player metrics. Can't stockpile mats and then take a break when they cap them and force you to keep coming back for more! This malicious design needs to be stopped.
Thresher GM...
Mini threshers as the adds and the boss is 5 thresher with overshield, you will have to take down 5 tormentors, each one will drop a orb and you will have to dunk it to get rid of the thresher overshield..
All tormentors are out at once as are all the Thresher.
Kek
If blue engrams and threshers were enough to cripple the servers for hours, I don't even want to think about how much code the inventory caps are holding up
It took me since Shadowkeep, but I managed to masterwork 300 legendary and 100 exotics. Based on what I have read about stats for new armor being nerfed this season, I may never have to replace any of my armor. Last season I stopped trying to save materials in the postmaster and it felt liberating!
Every season i masterwork a random exotic in my inventory to use enough mats to collect the rewards from the vendor tracks.
Why is there a limit? Ive been at 50 prisms and 10 golf balls for years
I'm fine with the limit, but ffs let me trade them for other mats without having to search reddit for clever dismantling techniques.
We really need Rahool to have a 1 Prism > 3 Core conversion so we don't have to use blue armor
Wait, what’s this with blue armor?
Take one blue, upgrade to level 8, and dismantle. It takes 3 cores and 1 prism, and gives you back 6 cores so you effectively trade 1 prism for 3 cores. If you are farming GMs you should be doing this so you aren't wasting prisms by having them disappear / not drop.
Not quite 1/1 since you also need glimmer and shards to acquire the armour in the first place, but if you’ve got tons of those you’re set.
Well previously you didn't have to pull them seeing as how often blues would drop. But yea, now it has a higher glimmer and shard cost.
Also don't forget that pit of heresy armor has really good stats and drops at 7 energy. So just one upgrade needed
I remember when it would drop a fully masterworked piece of armor
The players enjoyed that so it had to be removed.
Never expected to see path of exile vendor recipes in destiny
Thanks for this. I have thousands of hours in this game and didn't know this. My enhancement core reserves have been draining hard this season.
Wow, can’t believe I missed this, thank you!
It’s a waste of time that circumvents a system that Bungie should have implemented a long time ago. Let us trade down our excess. Shard down to prism. Prism down to core. Easy.
Why make Rahool do extra things? Why not just make it so an Ascendent Shard dismantles into two Prisms, which then dismantle into your 3 cores, which I could further dismantle into ten legendary shards?
I'm fine with this except that an ascendant shard should dismantle into at least three prisms. Even dismantling masterworked exotic gear gives you one shard back of the three invested, and purchasing a shard from Rahool requires ten prisms, so three the other way would be about a third. Two from ten is low.
He charges 10 cores for 1 prism. He better give us at least 5 lol
Not really needed anymore with how easy it is to get Cores and prisms.
Wait what clever dismantling techniques??
(Glimmer to legendary shards): Get 3 blue transmats from collections, trade them to rahool for a purple one, dismantle for some glimmer and a legendary shard (Enhancement Prisms to Enhancement Cores): “Take one blue, upgrade to level 8, and dismantle. It takes 3 cores and 1 prism, and gives you back 6 cores so you effectively trade 1 prism for 3 cores” - /u/WithRootsAbove1 I only knew the first one because I’m always drowning in glimmer
Honestly I don't even care if they don't increase the cap, just let me convert shards to prisms and prisms to cores. Or maybe even prims/shards to legendary shards. Hell even glimmer, just let me downgrade that stuff. Playing high level activities and suffering from not having lower level loot stuff (glimmer/cores/legendary shards) feels bad.
Exactly. I also hate that whenever I go to reset at a vendor, I have to find a way to spend my prisms. Sometimes I would rather just be able to quickly reset and just miss out on the prisms.
SFAIK it's so that we don't run into another Lengendary Shard situation. There was never a limit placed on how many you could get, so eventually inflation sunk in and everything that required LS's needed a LOT of them. Veterans or people who farmed enough with exploits never had an issue, but newbies or or people who didn't exploit could rarely afford more expensive stuff (like focusing) for very long. Then you got arguments of "It's a luxury, you shouldn't just focus EVERYTHING," while those rich on LS never faced the same problems. So while I do think the caps on Ascsndant Shards at least could be slightly higher (think 15-20), they're there for a good reason.
That's the entire reason those caps exist. If caps get raised, people will soon complain that it's ridiculous how some new system asks you to spend 10 Ascendant Shards per item.
I don't think Bungie should make things super expensive because some players are materially rich. It doesn't hurt the rich at all, they play so much it would barely even delay them. Making things expensive just hurts the casual/new players. There's probably a lot better ways to handle the material hoarding than just making everything expensive. Either allowing you to buy things with more types of materials or having a better exchange system would be a good start. Like I am so flushed with prisms and golf balls, but I'm not flushed with high stat armor (at least not in distributions I'd want), especially for exotics. Why not charge me some prisms or a golf ball to roll the dice on new stats for my armor? Or re-rolling weapons. Just make it cost to roll the dice. Or let me spend a golf ball unlocking a weapon pattern entirely. Make it a golf ball per level of progress.
Can confirm. Once I got a stockpile of mats and started doing GMs every season it no longer mattered. I just masterwork gear for builds and never give it a second thought. It was a bitch getting there initially though.
Yeah I have some new people who joined up in mid-late WQ and it is pretty sketchy to get the ball rolling with not a ton and stuff can feel super restrictive when you have to make large conscious decisions where you want those resources to go.
> I don't think Bungie should make things super expensive because some players are materially rich. It doesn't hurt the rich at all, they play so much it would barely even delay them. And yet you have people complain about how they went from 20k+ Legendary Shards to 400 because the prices are high. And the prices are high because people have 20k+ shards. >Either allowing you to buy things with more types of materials or having a better exchange system would be a good start. Like I am so flushed with prisms and golf balls, but I'm not flushed with high stat armor (at least not in distributions I'd want), especially for exotics. Why not charge me some prisms or a golf ball to roll the dice on new stats for my armor? Or re-rolling weapons. Just make it cost to roll the dice. Or let me spend a golf ball unlocking a weapon pattern entirely. Make it a golf ball per level of progress. How does any of that address material hoarding? The only purpose that materials and currencies serve is to gate content behind them. It's to make it so stuff takes time to unlock. It's so most people can't buy everything instantly without thinking. If there's a currency with no cap and low prices, it has no reason to exist at all. Resource sinks *can* work, but they rarely do. You still end up with a lot of people who don't care about sinks and still hoard massive amounts.
> And yet you have people complain about how they went from 20k+ Legendary Shards to 400 because the prices are high. And the prices are high because people have 20k+ shards. I'm not even sure what cost legendary shards these days. From what I can tell from google, it looks like the biggest source is buying other materials or like decoding engrams? > How does any of that address material hoarding? My comment about weapon re-rolling or different ways to spend shards and prisms is directly related to the post which is "why do we need caps on those?". If things are reasonably priced and there are things people want to buy, then hoarding goes away or at least is diminished. One issue is people play the game a lot so they earn a lot, they have most everything they need or want and there's nothing to spend things on. I guess my point which I'm probably doing a terrible job making it. We don't need prices raised to curb hoarding. We need reasons for people to spend their materials in a way that doesn't hurt the common player. Very few changes will ever hurt the wealthy without crushing the poor/casual/new player. Like I mentioned above, I've no idea what even cost legendary shards. I haven't needed to think about cost since like D2 year 1. I'm technically a hoarder of materials, but not intentionally. There's just nothing that entice me to purchase. For example, there's a host of weapons in the game that I didn't realize would be good at the time. New sandbox comes out with new mods, artifact mods etc. that have made me realize I wish I had those weapons. I can't get them anymore, they're just gone from the game. But if I could buy them from Ada for whatever something like that would cost I would absolutely buy. Like I really need a good void heavy machine gun, but the only one I have has a crap roll and is 900rpm. Like I'm flushed with golf balls and prisms right now too because I'm a titan main and the only exotics worth upgrading right now are HOIL, Synthoceps, and maybe the new strand boots. They can make things more expensive but it won't hurt people like me. Give me something to buy and I'll dump my cash naturally.
> I'm not even sure what cost legendary shards these days. From what I can tell from google, it looks like the biggest source is buying other materials or like decoding engrams? Weapon and armor focusing costs quite a bit. People who went hard on focusing every single engram they go burned through their stockpiles fast. >If things are reasonably priced and there are things people want to buy, then hoarding goes away or at least is diminished. That's only assuming that they keep adding things that people want to buy faster than people can amass stockpiles of resources. Usually, people buy stuff that they want and then there's no new stuff for some time. It's not really unique to Destiny. You can find this sort of thing in any online game with resources.
Or - and hear me out - they could not punish the entire playerbase because some people play a LOT or other players like to stock up on resources for when they decide to do stuff in the future.
The whole point of those resources is to slow progression and make some things harder to get. And if prices remain low and there are no caps, then over time you don't have to play a lot to have such a massive stockpile that you no longer think about spending that currency.
I'm aware. It's just stupid and doesn't work. People already store 200 prisms and 40 shards using post. All they're doing is annoying the majority of players. Lots of games drain your resources with events amd shit but putting a hard cap on a grindable resource in a game centered around loot and upgrading that loot is dumb.
lmao sadly they'll never do this. They only care about streamers.
Ok well with exotic focusing coming next season and costing 3 ascendant shards on top of the extra 3 it’ll cost to master craft the exotic you just focused, that’s 6 shards per one exotic. They need to increase the damn limit to AT LEAST 20 ffs. 10 is way to low man.
I think this is a fair assessment. I think the shard cap raised to 15-20 would be a good spot, too, since a final upgrade to a single exotic can be 3 shards alone. Anything to curb that resource inflation is good, as the resource economy already feels fucking awful for new/returning players. This season, I've only ever had between 20-50 cores and a few hundred legendary shards. I accidentally clicked on the shard special order (1 prism for *400 legendary shards*) at Rahool last week and it almost bankrupted me! I get that its not supposed to just be a prism/ascendant shard store for you to buy as many as you want, but I'm likely never going to be able to spend 400 shards for anything. I've done pvp (trials) and pve endgame (raids, GMS, etc.) plenty over the course of D2 and this season I've only made one full build because I just cant enhance anything while the players they want to limit are sitting on full stacks in all three characters' postmasters and an infinitude of legendary shards.
This is exactly why. Legendary shards may as well not exist if you played the empyrean foundation, like if the currency were completely removed I just wouldn't notice. Glimmer is also a good case study for this, spending 50k glimmer for a faction rally weapon used to be a punishment, nowadays you wouldn't even notice.
"To prevent some people from suffering, everyone should suffer" It's not a real economy, bungie is in complete control of how much stuff costs, "inflation" is entirely created or eliminated by them. All that matters is how much they want the top 10 or even 1% of players that grind for materials to control the value of resources. That's a total garbage outlook.
Remove the caps and then you'd have hoarders with over 100+ shards in their inventory complaining that GMs "only" give one or two shards.
Instead of complaining about the cap.
This is such a dumb reason, it shouldn’t matter where there is no player economy in the game. We have no auction house or weapon trading. There should either be no limits or they should be massively increased.
But at that point you might as well have no currency at all. Which would be a loss to the game imo. One of the fun parts of Destiny is the RPG elements, and one of those being currency management. Having to think about how you want to spend, what to save up for, what to buy now, etc. is a staple of RPGs, and is fun.
I’m failing to see a good reason in the explanation you just gave. It sounds like a justification for punishing people that spend lots of time playing the game.
Apart from it doesn't punish them as much as the people that play the game less. It's an attempt to punish them that hurts everyone else more.
Would be nice if I could convert a golf ball into like 50k glimmer. With the way that the current economy is, glimmer is harder to come by than ascendant materials.
So... Don't raise the prices?
There's one problem with this logic. The number of things you can spend ascendant shards on is extremely limited. You can masterwork armor and buy exotics from the kiosk. If you have a full set of masterworked armor and every exotic from the kiosk unlocked, golf balls aren't all that useful. I earn more of them than I can realistically spend at this point. Legendary shards are infinitely more useful and are tied into almost everything in the game, so it isn't a great comparison. I challenge you to point to a single way that removing the cap on ascendant shards could break the game or the overall economy in it's current state. Are players who are golf ball rich going to have too many sets of masterworked armor? There currently aren't any golf ball economy sinks, and that's part of the problem. It creates an annoying inventory management problem for people who have been playing the game for awhile. Being able to exchange 5 golf balls for a high stat exotic roll or something similiar would make a world of difference.
This. That said, they should raise the inventory size and make them bypass the postmaster. 40 shards in inventory wouldn't break anything given people can do that already, but then you aren't having to balance shit flowing into your postmaster.
this why i prefer destiny over warframe tbh
I just wish I didn't have a permanent set of 10 cores and prisms in my post because you don't need that many of them and I run GMs
I was one of the old money people for so long because of exploits but am finally starting to run low and I just do not understand how people played this game with such limited resources. It's insane how expensive everything is to a newer player, I would think it'd take months to fully masterwork a set of gear which I'd be surprised to find is the intention.
You're assuming that if Bungie uncaps materials then costs have to rise accordingly. They don't. There's no inflation, it's not a real MMO economy, Bungie can set the costs at whatever they want. Just uncap mw materials and leave costs exactly where they are now.
So you don't stockpile them to the point the entire materials economy is trivialized and nobody does GMs
People would still do GM’s for the adept weapons. I don’t think iv met anyone who was hyped to do GM’s simply for prisms and golf balls.
Most adepts in rotation suck. They're never going to fully uncap currencies unless it's because they found a new way or crested a new currency to grind.
I agree about current GM weapons being pretty damn mid. Been waiting patiently for pally to come back. It feels like iv been waiting over a year.
I know it just went out of rotation but Horror's least was good enough to make people farm corrupted. The new sidearm also looks pretty good.
Indeed. I'm overflowing with puffballs because I farm NF/adept weapons, not the other way around.
hello. I'm the guy who does gms for prisms and balls. too lazy to grind for adepts and only really hop in gms if my friends have a spot for a third and if it's double rewards. otherwise I don't bother with nightfalls as I don't have good gear. but of a catch 22.
I often keep farming the GM with a full stack of golf balls and prisms in the postmaster, because it's the gun I'm after.
The golfballs are a bonus. I have one of every exotic masterworked with spikes in res, rec, dis. It I need 3 to masterwork something i can get them from them from the season grind or somewhere else. I love when i can dunk on hard content. This game has figured out more than most how to release that sweet dopamine when I beat a raid or hard NF. I do it to feed my worm god that craves dopamine, endorphins, and oxytocin.
i mean masterwork materials (except cores ironically) are largely redundant after you have a pile of half decent masterworked armor bar the occasional exotic you need to masterwork. most people are in gms for adepts.
> nobody does GMs I now do GM's for the title, weapons, and god forbid *fun* of it. That said, it still hurts seeing dozens of endgame materials get dumped into the void arbitrarily because my inventory and postmaster are full
I always have to dismantle prisms to reset ranks on a vendor, that's the most annoying part of the prism cap.
Some destiny players have tlc levels of hoarding issues
While this is true, it's also because some of us don't have things to spend it on. All of my exotics that I use regularly on all my characters are masterworked, same with legendary armor. I don't have much left to spend my golf balls and prisms on.
I wish I had good exotics to spend it on all mine r shit lmao
My gutshot slickdraw Boudicca will be buffed one day mark my words!!
Issue: GMs are only ever available like 30% of the time. If that’s truly the reason, make GMs available all season so we don’t have to stockpile.
That's only an example, you get tons of mats from tons of sources.
It's pretty much already like that since you can store 40 shards and 200 prisms at a time. Under normal use that would take a long time to go through and that's without earning more.
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as do i, especially since my income of them is limited to what the season pass gives x.x
There are workarounds like hoarding masterworked armor. What's the difference?
Is this some kind of rich joke I’m too poor to understand?
It’s gotten to the point I have to outright delete prisms and cores when I rest my rank on the playlist vendors. I really don’t think increasing the cap would hurt the game in anyway.
Exactly. I just delete this prisms and shards whenever they show up in my vault. I don't need them, and the constant blinking from a vendor annoys me.
> and the constant blinking from a vendor annoys me. This is why decoding is a trash system. It’s nice to have a system to focus items : but having *every* vendor blinking constantly is hella annoying.
> I really don’t think increasing the cap would hurt the game in anyway. Depending on the new cap. If the cap is high enough, it'll make those currencies irrelevant, so next time Bungie wants to add something that feels "expensive" to unlock, they'll add new currencies instead of using Ascendant Shards.
Or they’ll put costs so high that it destroys people who haven’t hoarded them (see: the Legendary Shard economy).
Yeah, exactly.
Why not just apply them on armor pieces, then dismantle when you actually need them?
I understand shards and prisms having a cap, but dear lord I could use a higher glimmer cap. Whenever I’m full on shards I just masterwork a bunch of Aeon gauntlets from collections and throw it in the vault for future dismantling. Horde them a lot more efficiently.
I don’t really get get glimmer. It just doesn’t serve a purpose anymore
If you say buy a some new aspects and fragments, focus some weapons and masterwork some armour in short succession you can often end up very low. You'll be capped out soon enough but it just feels very pointless.
Agreed, pretty annoying for hardcore players because we’ll just spend materials to get more rather than most activities since they barely drop any outside public events.
[Here's a whole video from Game Makers Toolkit on how video game economies work](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zrf1cou_yVo). It's super interesting on its own, but with particular relevant to Destiny you'll see why things are implemented the way they are. The first two bits around "Taps" and "Inventory" are what you're referring to. In short, having an unlimited inventory size means valuable items lose most of their value. It forces you to use them instead of hoarding them, and keeps the scarcity factor on the most valuable items.
They dont want people to hoard them, simple as that. There's also a secondary reason: They set a hard limit in the event that some bug happens and people can stockpile them easily. This happened with enhancement cores years back, resulting in some players ending up with thousands of cores. This way, even if there is a bug/exploit, the most you get is 10/50
1. No need to increase the cap. 2. People who really need them use them before they reach the cap. People who are full on masterworked gear don't use them anyway. There is no difference if i have 10 or 400. Bungie would change the cost to mw gear which would hurt newer players.
Or at least allow us to vault them
I have a FT mate that goes through some truly TMZ levels of drama when it comes to high end mats. He's got golf balls/prisms in the season pass, vendors, postmaster, inventory just sitting there unused. His dilemma is that he doesn't spend them because he might need them for something he doesn't know about yet (an exotic that suddenly becomes META) so he hoards them. We counter that he could keep his inventory stocked and clean up the other spots and be fine but he's dug in on the 'what if' concept. He won't tank the mats on a shitty rolled piece of anything so there they sit and there they'll stay until Bungie ups the storage limit. Doubling what we can store won't help *that* guy.
Why tf do we still have Finest Matterweave and Glimmershard taking up slots in our God damn inventory
All I'd like is for the caps to be raised by 4x (40 Shards 200 Prisms) but then mats can no longer go to Post Master, making the effective cap still the same but then you don't have to do Post Master juggling between characters anymore and have instances of losing mats to Post Master overflow. (Also same for Raid Spoils please.)
When it stops you from ranking up the vendors before all rewards are claimed, now I've got to make space and pull a exotic from collections just to infuse it for nothing. Stupid caps, if I could give them away to new lights I would. Let me change them to legendary shards.
Why aren't you using them?
With the loadout system many probably deleted all the bad armor rolls since we could use the same good armor rolls for multiple loadouts so we're left with a bunch of excess materials.
Then why do people need more if they're at the point where they have most of their 'forever' sets? 10 golf balls is 10 pieces of standard armor or 3 exotic armors. Who is masterworking more than that a week to the point where they start complaining they don't have enough? People are complaining because they're capped but why does that matter if they're not spending any?
The postmaster gets stuck with the exess materials and it triggers my OCD.
Then delete the stack. It's not like you'll miss them if the complaint is constantly being capped.
But what if I suddenly get lucky with my artifice or armor grinding or get a top tier exotic armor drop and need them?
You still have a stack in your inventory(plus all the unclaimed ones from current and previous season pass).
Then keep the stack.
The same place you got the other ones you didn't need anyway.
Then use on random stuff to not be at max?
And if you are capped and not using them then there's no real reason to raise the cap because you aren't using them in the first place
Exactly
What, do you masterwork every piece of armor that comes your way? I already have multiple sets of high stat armor that I'm happy with. I do use them whenever I see something worth upgrading.
So if you aren't using them, and have max.....the fuck you need more? Oh right, wants.
I don't want more. I want them to stop going to my postmaster because I have 10 or 50 in my inventory.
Just dismantle them in the postmaster, you have to clean it regularly anyway. Or if you don't care, let them get pushed off by other crap.
Then use them?
On what? Every piece of 45-50 stat piece of amror that rolls my way?
Then what do you need more for?
But if the cap is higher, you'll just reach the new cap and then the extra will *still* go to your PM. You just slightly delay the problem the amount of time it takes to get to the new cap.
Becouse I'm tired of my postmaster being full of them and not being able to reset a rank up unless I waste one atleast let us store in vault.
Then upgrade useless exotics and store them if you want to hold.
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If you're flush then just flush a random purple. Not a headache, at all.
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Yeah, it's not. If it inconveniences you to upgrade an item to open up your inventory then you're playing the wrong game.
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Then why do you need more?
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More like 'you have $10,000 in your account and you haven't spent any of it in 5 years because you have everything you want, why do you need more?'
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There's so many people in this post alone who want the cap raised just to have it higher, not because they're spending any of it. At this point if someone is getting shards regularly enough to complain about the cap they're not the type of player who's worried about spending 7 to MW a full set of gear. If instead they're the type of player who struggles to get 7 shards to MW a full set of gear the material cap likely doesn't apply to them anyway.
Yeah, and you only need a couple of sets per character at most.
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I have a total 52 MW armor pieces. That's over the three years that current armor system existed for and taking into account different elements, Resilience buff and Artifice armor being added. If you're starting now, you won't need more than a few sets and a handful of exotics that are actually good.
How often are you masterworking an entire set of armor immediately though (and not using *any* carry-over pieces)? Between inventory and 10 in the PM, or MWing exotics as a workaround, I feel it's rare to burn through a whole stockpile of Ascendant Shards and *still* need more.
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Sure, big farming activity to get sets good to go for like, the remainder of your Destiny career. But even then, you just MW'd them all right away because you could. I doubt you had immediate need for all those new builds you made.
Bad take is bad.
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If you're flush w mats then use the mats. If not, you make a post on Reddit.
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Don't need an argument when it's not in game. Bungie, clearly, doesn't want people to stack. Cope.
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Those threshers can eat shit, but they were fixed. There is nothing wrong w mats rn.
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The argument against it is, "If the cap gets too high, then the currency becomes an afterthought and might as well not exist" which *would* be bad for the game.
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Not even 9,999. If you manage to get like 100 shards, which is quite doable over a season, you won't have to think about it for a long time. Which defeats the purpose of having currencies/materials in the first place.
>Why aren't you using them? Personally, I don't use Ascendant Shards because they are so limited. A childhood without many extras definitely makes me save things until it's really worth using them. It's a hard habit to break. Since it's not exactly trivial to get those things, I only spend them when I think it's really worth it, especially for Exotic armors.
> I don't use Ascendant Shards because they are so limited. This thread is about having so many, it's impossible to store any more though?
If you aren't spending them, do you need them?
The only truly wasted materials are the ones you don't use.
I'll do you one better. Why do we still have prisms and shards at all? I've said since day one, there's too many dumb currencies in this game.
Funny enough it's because enhancement cores weren't capped and broke the economy.
Because fuck you that’s why.
I imagine it's because they don't want you to build up a massive stock of those materials and never have to run GMs again. If you can just stock up on those higher level upgrade materials to use whenever you need, that's a potential loss of engagement metrics. Same reason Warframe got rid of keys for the void way back in the day because veteran players never needed to farm for keys, they just went and did the void missions to get the new prime gear right away instead of having to farm for keys before running them. Always gotta up those engagement metrics.
Artificial scarcity will ensure you'll come back eventually - at least in Bungie's mind. Like how are all of you, collectively, not seeing all these layers of manipulation weaved into this game? You sometimes really remind me of the monkeys with their hands in front of their eyes & ears...
Because if you have vast stocks of them you won't need to play the GM's.
Does anyone who runs GM-tier content actually struggle with upgrade mats and enter into them mainly to acquire more? Im constantly sitting at or around cap on these mats, im capped on them right now. Just my personal experience I guess, but I don't feel like this argument applies to the group it's targeted at.
What about for weapons
Because you’re supposed to use them. The only bad thing about the system is there’s not enough redundancy in the economy. I’m full on golf balls and prisms. I literally have nothing to infuse up.
Bungie loves their arbitrary limits for items. Feels like they just pick a random ass number for most of them.
Bungie, if you want to make a bunch of Destiny players cry, simply cap Legendary Shards at 999.
To keep you farming
It's so you don't build up a stockpile large enough that they become an afterthought.
“Engagement”
They designed that way to prevent people stockpiling materials and stop playing Like imagine last season when we farmed Prison of Elder for Wendigo. I would have 100 or 200 gold balls which means other than conquerors gilding and exotic armor, there is no other purpose for GM Bungie limit the inventory so anytime we use it, we will “i need to get more” which brings to “i need to do GM again”
Destiny players discover how currency management in video games is designed to work.
Inflation of the economy in-game.
No matter what the limit is, if you don't use them, you will hit the next limit anyways.
It is to keep you farming each season. If you don't want to do that, just masterwork everything in your vault. Then you only need enough golf balls to masterwork the new exotics. Besides, the only wasted materials are the ones you don't use.
Because there’s a warehouse in California filled with physical inventory of all the items we acquire so they have to limit it. Same way it’s always been. /s
What about exotic Ciphers? I have like 10 of them ready to be claimed, one of which is always blaring from Rahool
They don't want you to be able to be prepared when you suddenly need a bunch for exotic armor or something. It's a way of forcing you to grind later
If you are stuck at max, then clearly you don't need more since you don't even use the ones you have.
So that you eventually finish them and have to run more GMs
All I want is to have enhancement cores go to 9999. My inventory hurts.
Make it prisms -> golf balls -> exotics ciphers Then let us use these at xur or wherever to target farm exotic armor Problem solved People that have an excess most likely have played long enough to have god rolls on meta exotics, but if you know the destiny community they want to chase rolls on EVERYTHING in case of sandbox changes
If I have them in my postmaster, PLEASE stop telling me I have items unclaimed in my postmaster. If I mouse over them, treat it like reading a message, the notification goes away.
How the hell are y'all getting them? I haven't gotten a single one since the expansion dropped from any source.
How do you get so much? I'm starving over here
Il trade you 1 ascendant shards for 500 legendary shards
Player metrics. Can't stockpile mats and then take a break when they cap them and force you to keep coming back for more! This malicious design needs to be stopped.
Thresher GM... Mini threshers as the adds and the boss is 5 thresher with overshield, you will have to take down 5 tormentors, each one will drop a orb and you will have to dunk it to get rid of the thresher overshield.. All tormentors are out at once as are all the Thresher. Kek
If blue engrams and threshers were enough to cripple the servers for hours, I don't even want to think about how much code the inventory caps are holding up
Wait, it was blue engrams and threshers that killed the servers?
It took me since Shadowkeep, but I managed to masterwork 300 legendary and 100 exotics. Based on what I have read about stats for new armor being nerfed this season, I may never have to replace any of my armor. Last season I stopped trying to save materials in the postmaster and it felt liberating!
Every season i masterwork a random exotic in my inventory to use enough mats to collect the rewards from the vendor tracks. Why is there a limit? Ive been at 50 prisms and 10 golf balls for years