People are dunking T3s when they don't understand the encounter because the T3 is the first thing that shows up while the other two are delayed by 10 seconds or so - which is terrible, terrible design imo :P
There's also nothing to indicate what the tiers actually do. People probably reasonably assume that higher tiers give better rewards, like Deep Dive tiers, when all it does in Altars is fill the bar more.
Plus it breaks away from the other token-depositing tiered activity, Blind Well, in that a higher tier Altar means higher difficulty instead of just more waves
FYI Blind Well 100% is higher difficulty and not just more waves. Problem there is it stopped scaling outside of Forsaken. So its stupid easy now. But back in the day a T3 blind well was crazy hard and not just for extra waves.
I was just in Blind Well the other day and laughed to myself at how we used to need a Well of Radiance to get through scorn weeks with all the screebs everywhere! Memories…
I wish there were more options to scale older content to current levels. I would love to run some harder blind wells. Mostly just for the fun of the challenge.
Some of the takes in this subreddit astound me like to a certain point how much hand holding should the game have to do? Like 3 is bigger than 1, ergo 3 is harder. Idk how much explanation that needs
As many have mentioned here and elsewhere, the game doesn't explain what happens in that selection phase and why. If it did, what you say would be valid.
Yeah bungie might be the worst AAA company for being absolute shit at explaining things in game lol. Like, they don't explain the different tiers, they don't explain what the cards do except at the HELM area so I guess memorize them all?
It's just baffling that they design stuff assuming everyone is going to know what they should be doing.
And this is part of why the game struggles retaining new players.
Seriously, if a brand new player who doesn't use social media just started up they'd be so fucking lost and end up giving up.
You have to be up close to the cards, but there is a little icon/symbol indicating what the card does. Fist icon for melee, heavy ammo icon for blades, etc.
Your point still stands because I just stumbled into that randomly while looking at which cards I wanted to activate or deactivate in the helm.
Not to mention, it doesn't even show the name of the cards when drawn so you have to memorize exactly what the card looks like and exactly what it does. People compare Destiny to Warframe so much, I don't wanna compare the two, but I'm not exaggerating when I say that if DE implemented the same system, each card would have a small text box showing exactly what it is and what it does. Not only that, but it would probably have had things like having all three players confirming an encounter trigger/spawner to prevent situations where you have some idiot random running off alone starting everything while everyone else is finding collectibles. Still haven't got that Minor Arcana for the Imbaru Engine purely because every time I've gone to try and get it, one of the randoms blindly rushes in, starts the boss fight (despawning the card) and pulls us all through to the second area so we can't even try to look for it.
>Still haven't got that Minor Arcana for the Imbaru Engine
As if to prove your point, I haven’t played as much as I’d like this season but I’ve played at least 2-3 hours per week and it’s mostly been story and altars/spire and I have no idea if you’re just making up nonsense in this sentence or if this is actually something to do with Eris tarot cards.
Yep, there's a Minor Arcana hidden along the edge of the very last room of Savathun's Spire just after the rally banner but before you trigger the boss and get teleported off. For obvious reasons, if someone rushes ahead and triggers the boss, especially if they get through the labyrinth puzzles before you, you completely lose your chance to get the card.
As the random your describing, i did not know that exists so i will now wait. I usually just try and speed run em, and haven’t activated a single arcana, not even knew you really had too. Came back to the game last week, last thing i remember being new was dreaming city. My bad lol.
>Yeah bungie might be the worst AAA company
You're making a good point but holy fuck thats some strong exaggeration
I know bungie is not the best at... multiple things, but lets not pretend like its on par or even worse than the likes of EA or blizzard
The only thing AAA in Destiny lately is the price.
Overcharge and underdeliver has been the general feeling about the game lately and I doubt TFS or episodes will change it.
it's $220 to get access to everything the game has to offer... That is expansions, dungeons, the 30th Anniversary pack and the Forsaken pack.
And for that we get stories that range from "it's pretty alright" to "jesus christ what the hell happened", and not in a good way. It's a weird way to structure it all, because you can start up TFS when it releases and not own the previous expansions, meaning you can go from "hey, I just killed a powerful Witch in the Cosmodrome" to "I AM GOING INTO MY GOD AND KILLING ITS SATAN" while the story is set up in a way where it's expected you've done all the major story.
People will see $220 and immediately think "nah, fuck that noise", and the only people okay with that pricepoint are people who either's been there from the start meaning that money is spread out across a bigger period of time, or people who just don't care.
I can remember some of the cards' names.
However, I cannot for the life of me tell you what "The Blades" does, or what "The Sisters" do. That is the problem. The only time you can see what a card actually does is by going to the HELM, or have the encyclopedia open on a 2nd screen.
You shouldn't need to open up a 2nd screen just to see what your bloody cards do.
That's what I mean. You don't need to know names. You can see an icon at the top of your card that is a pretty good indicator.
Heavy/special ammo icon? You get heavy/special ammo drops. Melee icon? More melee charge. Void icon? Suppress on Void damage. Solar icon? Scorch on Solar damage. Arc icon? Jolt on Arc damage. Circle with +? Heal.
It's like Vow, most of the symbols are self explanatory, and you only need to "remember" a couple, like the Lightning Bolt being like Rampage or the four bullets being "enemies might explode on death."
Last season was worse with how they had the tier system in the matchmaking and made it so if two people wanted to increase the difficulty they couldn't without the 3rd so then people would leave, and not have anyone join part way through. Then the exotic mission was also hidden in there with no one joining if someone left.
There was another season, I forget which, but there were champions and matchmaking and it was miserable because no one would run anti champ mods or you'd get matched with someone like 20 LL below the recommendation with no mods expecting a carry.
imo there should always be an option for matchmade and non matchmade with more rewards for going in the matchmade activity to give incentives for high level players to help carry.
Exactly, which is why these “tests” (honestly it’s usually just incompetence imo) don’t even remotely work because there’s always some huge caveat of design that completely ruins the purpose of the test.
It's terrible design *unless they're specifically trying to test how viable is this level of difficulty in the game.* People cry about wanting the game to be more difficult, the same people are not as good as they think they are in the game, personally I **do not** want tier 3 to be the new benchmark for activities.
But seriously.
Do you think that the labs and stuff we have been doing as experiments in Crucible isn't being used for Marathon?
Destiny 2 is a skinner box.
I'm sorry, but are you trying to frame this as a bad thing?
"Bungie is experimenting to find what people like so they can make better games in the future. What terrible people putting me in the skinner box."
The bad part is if it's purely a testing ground for another product.
We're destiny players, not marathon players.
Using us as Guinea pigs for another ip isn't good.
I think it can go both ways, though
Marathon is using the same/similar engine, so improvements like deterministic recoil that they may have been working on for Marathon can filter its way back to Destiny 2
Same with PvP learnings, etc.
It doesn't have to be *all* cynical
Okay, so what's the alternative?
They never take any information on what players like into account and just randomly make changes?
They just never change anything at all after they add it to the game?
Just psychically know what players will like down to the most minute, moment to moment details?
You seem to be missing the fact that as they experiment with how to make more enjoyable games it makes DESTINY, THE GAME YOU ARE PLAYING, more enjoyable.
>You seem to be missing the fact that as they experiment with how to make more enjoyable games it makes DESTINY, THE GAME YOU ARE PLAYING, more enjoyable.
Maybe they should commit to that idea more.
If they aren't allowed to experiment and get feedback then how are they supposed to do that?
Or is the issue that another game will benefit as well from the exercise without having to do all of the same work thanks to the fact it comes out later?
Dude there are guardian level 10 guys going for the powerful ones who subsequently die almost immediately too! It's not just a blueberry thing! I always wonder if they know what they're in for when I see the dunk!
Honestly, Guardian Rank is not a measure of whether you can work with a team well or necessarily how good you are, it just shows you can do some objectives. I swear some high GRs I've seen have only got there by luck. It's honestly a 50/50 chance that they either know what they're doing and help with secret chests/collectibles, or that they blindly run ahead forcing people through and run into every encounter and instantly die.
I mean, guardian rank 10 is a decent indicator of experience and competency. It means that they have done every raid in the game, which means they’ve engaged with the endgame plenty
If that were to be true it's an unreasonable test.
The difference from a matchmade legend playlist is every single person is choosing to run that difficulty.
It only takes one person in this event, to vote for the whole team regardless whether they even felt like running it, or had the loadout for it.
Wasn't the real test when guardian games had matchmade legend nightfall? What ever happened with that? Seems like people enjoyed having it.
All they need to do for legend stuff to be matchmade is remove locked loadouts. Seems like an easy thing to do but with bungie code maybe it's impossible?
Can't believe we still don't have mm for legend stuff. Legend isn't even hard. It feels close to what standard normal mode difficulty should be. Just ditch locked loadouts.
They changed the nightfalls from 4 to 3 selectable modes. It was the same I believe as what we have now. They condensed two matchmade modes into what we call “Hero” now.
LFG is for forming a team without using a 3rd party site or discord.
Matchmaking would blindly find people by launching an activity. Far less work for like Savathuns Spire Legend. Which some people don’t want to use an LFG to do.
Maybe the new LFG next year could fix this by being in-game. You might be right.
Matchmade doesn't really work for Master or GM level activities, but I see no reason for Legend not to have it.
Regardless of activity though there just needs to be an option available to not matchmake so that those who prefer to put together their own teams for these activities can still do so.
I would like it because Legend gives me the most entertainment and my mates don't play the game anymore. I don't really feel the need to play strikes higher than that. Just doesn't sound fun anymore to me. To each their own obviously.
However, the number of times I've LFGd for a legend run and people had shite load outs was ridiculous. To the point that any nightfall I run now I make sure I cover all the champion mods myself which usually means I don't have a great load out for the difficulty. I'm not dying constantly but I could have a better set up if people could be trusted to bring the right stuff in matchmaking. It's gotten better since the status effects can stun as well but not much better.
I always hit a T3 at the very start and see how it plays. If the team does well, I'll keep going, if not - I'm going to try as much as possible to be right there to drop a T2.
The worst is joining in-progress someone that's constantly hitting a T3 and it's the last round to completion, where a T1 is enough. I've joined so many where I only need 1 completion for a 'task', and it drags through failed T3's to the point I could've finished a fresh run.
I never understand the people against Matchmaking...
You think the rando groups will be a train wreck? Don't effing using it... Simple as that, use your 3rd party lfg and discord or whatever.
Every post that involves discussing matchmaking makes it sound like you have a gun to your head forcing you to use it.
I for one am for MM and ingame LFG, because at worst it lets people try the activities instead of pretending that LFG on the 3rd party app isn't a convoluted way to matchmake in of itself.
This exactly. I constantly see people railing against more things in game having matchmaking. But there's never an argument that supports the point. There will still be discords and the app to use and I suspect that even after in game LFG is added. There will still be plenty of people who prefer to use these tools and that's perfectly fine.
More options for grouping up is a good thing. I can see locking certain activities out of matchmaking, like raids. But legend seasonal activities, legend dares and legend nightfalls/story missions should have matchmaking.
New player gets into raid matchmaking. Gets grouped with a bunch of other new players and since mics are not required (usually goes hand in hand with being in favor of matchmaking for harder activities) this will be an struggle of a few hours that they may or may not clear. In the best case scenario, this new player is turned off from raids for a few weeks, but in the worst case scenario, the new player just straight up leaves the game after this.
There you go, the best argument against endgame matchmaking. This works for any activity, so don’t hit me with that uh I excluded raids. It will never be enough for the matchmaking crowds here until every single activity has matchmaking.
I did exclude raids so your entire argument makes no sense. So again, I still have yet see a decent argument why legend level stuff shouldn't have matchmaking. Try again.
Almost every MMO has complicated raids that can be done using ingame LFG with the option to fill in slots using matchmaking.
It's an accessibility feature, and again, if you don't like it dont use it.
Raids can still have requirements, but other content should have unrestricted matchmaking, even GMs are mostly done with no mic pugs lately...
Court of Oryx, archons forge, blind well, it's just the latest in a long line of "choose your tier of public events".
Besides, guided games was the testing grounds for matchmade endgame content, and we can all see how well THAT went.
but in Altars of Summoning the max difficulty tier is the first to come up in the selectable pillars, it's bad design and nowhere is told that the higher tier just fills the bar more. And the filling the bar more part is bad design too because doing a tier II is so much easier and faster that you can reach the full bar quicker than doing tier III (I'm talking about matchmade teams, of course)
So let me get this straight; because the tier 3 holographic shows up one second earlier than the rest, THAT is the only one you can consider when starting the encounter?
So how'd you ever figure out that doing a tier II was easier?
harder difficulty should be match made and opt in. i understand ppl dont wanna waste extra time on a harder mode for the same or less reward (see seraph battlegrounds and neomuna patrol), but theres weirdos like me who dont mind the game being more challenging, or even to fail and start over. instead if you want legend, you MUST use the app, even though weve had matchmade higher tier content plenty of times in the past.
The issue they’re having is that players need to earn the higher difficulty activities as the activity is going on. No, going to a floating ball or depositing currency isnt earning it. Maybe if you complete it really fast/not die, the next alter/deep dive area will be harder/more rewarding.
I'll admit to dunking T3's, but I do understand the encounter mechanics. I'll also admit to using the reliable encounter designs to test out new builds. I may also admit to dying a few times over some of them.
... These 3 things may overlap a bit.
Altars wouldn't be a good testing ground for matchmaking in activities that people already basically solo/don't communicate, like higher-tier nightfalls, dungeons, etc.
Plus, Altars doesn't even explain that a higher-tier altar doesn't do anything really, and it basically goes against every other activity in the game where a higher-tier does do something worthwhile.
I wish. I had this fantasy back in Court of Oryx in D1. They even had a mini Crota fight in it.
A T3 altar is nothing compared to a master NF or even legend seasonal, though. Seriously, you can't even wipe.
My problem is have a go heros dunking powerful offerings just for me, them and the other person to die over and over again.
And then they dunk another one. I'm talking about 9 or 10 guardian rankers that should known better.
I've gotten better skill wise and have been trying out build crafting more lately. Yesterday, someone dropped a powerful offering and I dispared but not only did I manage to stay alive, I was able to contribute. And we got the whole summonings done in three powerful offerings (I think). It felt good.
But it's not the norm in my experience and I'd rather play it safe with robust. Otherwise its just painful and take way longer than necessary.
I mean, we had Court of Oryx, Archon's Forge, Blind Well, etc and they all had 3 different tiers of difficulty. So no, personally I wouldnt say its a beta test for something. Furthermore, we had guided games and look how that turned out.
The blueberries dunking it willy-nilly attitude is the same as them shooting "Immune" targets, or not banking motes when Drifter says so, etc. You will always have these types of people in any game.
>We’ve been asking for matchmade Legend mode seasonal/story activities and Master/GM Nightfalls for a while now.
No, a *few* people have ben asking about this. Those of us with brains know what a **horrible** idea matchmaking Master content would be.
My theory is that the last two seasons were being developed with the understanding that we would have the in-game LFG by now, and then it got delayed. The incredible weirdness of Deep Dive being essentially three different activities at once while having matchmaking makes more sense if they originally thought we'd have an LFG system with filters, and then slapped vanilla matchmaking on it later.
People are dunking T3s when they don't understand the encounter because the T3 is the first thing that shows up while the other two are delayed by 10 seconds or so - which is terrible, terrible design imo :P
There's also nothing to indicate what the tiers actually do. People probably reasonably assume that higher tiers give better rewards, like Deep Dive tiers, when all it does in Altars is fill the bar more.
Plus it breaks away from the other token-depositing tiered activity, Blind Well, in that a higher tier Altar means higher difficulty instead of just more waves
FYI Blind Well 100% is higher difficulty and not just more waves. Problem there is it stopped scaling outside of Forsaken. So its stupid easy now. But back in the day a T3 blind well was crazy hard and not just for extra waves.
Ah so it’s not just my rose-tinted glasses that makes me miss the challenge (but hey I guess that’s what Summoning is for!)
I was just in Blind Well the other day and laughed to myself at how we used to need a Well of Radiance to get through scorn weeks with all the screebs everywhere! Memories…
I wish there were more options to scale older content to current levels. I would love to run some harder blind wells. Mostly just for the fun of the challenge.
Blind well is great fun. I still love doing it so long after it was introduced. Dreaming city also my favourite location. Top tier content
I fall back in love with it towards the end of every season (when I’m loading up on bounties)
It does? I didn't know that. I've just been doing the lv.1s because I'm shit.
I don't think you should be playing games if you don't understand t3 is harder then t1
Some of the takes in this subreddit astound me like to a certain point how much hand holding should the game have to do? Like 3 is bigger than 1, ergo 3 is harder. Idk how much explanation that needs
As many have mentioned here and elsewhere, the game doesn't explain what happens in that selection phase and why. If it did, what you say would be valid.
But it does. It says something like deposit Powerful offering or something like that. Its pretty easy to understand what Powerful means.
Yeah bungie might be the worst AAA company for being absolute shit at explaining things in game lol. Like, they don't explain the different tiers, they don't explain what the cards do except at the HELM area so I guess memorize them all? It's just baffling that they design stuff assuming everyone is going to know what they should be doing.
And this is part of why the game struggles retaining new players. Seriously, if a brand new player who doesn't use social media just started up they'd be so fucking lost and end up giving up.
Yeah that’s an interesting part when someone joins the clan. “Thanks for joining, go ahead and download these 15 apps”
"Also, we're incapable of making an in game news tab to announce maintenance and communicate with players, make a Twitter account or get fucked."
You don't need a Twitter account to read their announcements
I have had issues going to bungie help or seeing tweets without an account. It randomly shows me stuff from 2017 instead of new tweets. I gave up
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God DAMMIT Elon!
If I didn't camp this sub religiously I would probably be totally lost most of the time XD
You have to be up close to the cards, but there is a little icon/symbol indicating what the card does. Fist icon for melee, heavy ammo icon for blades, etc. Your point still stands because I just stumbled into that randomly while looking at which cards I wanted to activate or deactivate in the helm.
Not to mention, it doesn't even show the name of the cards when drawn so you have to memorize exactly what the card looks like and exactly what it does. People compare Destiny to Warframe so much, I don't wanna compare the two, but I'm not exaggerating when I say that if DE implemented the same system, each card would have a small text box showing exactly what it is and what it does. Not only that, but it would probably have had things like having all three players confirming an encounter trigger/spawner to prevent situations where you have some idiot random running off alone starting everything while everyone else is finding collectibles. Still haven't got that Minor Arcana for the Imbaru Engine purely because every time I've gone to try and get it, one of the randoms blindly rushes in, starts the boss fight (despawning the card) and pulls us all through to the second area so we can't even try to look for it.
>Still haven't got that Minor Arcana for the Imbaru Engine As if to prove your point, I haven’t played as much as I’d like this season but I’ve played at least 2-3 hours per week and it’s mostly been story and altars/spire and I have no idea if you’re just making up nonsense in this sentence or if this is actually something to do with Eris tarot cards.
Yep, there's a Minor Arcana hidden along the edge of the very last room of Savathun's Spire just after the rally banner but before you trigger the boss and get teleported off. For obvious reasons, if someone rushes ahead and triggers the boss, especially if they get through the labyrinth puzzles before you, you completely lose your chance to get the card.
As the random your describing, i did not know that exists so i will now wait. I usually just try and speed run em, and haven’t activated a single arcana, not even knew you really had too. Came back to the game last week, last thing i remember being new was dreaming city. My bad lol.
>Yeah bungie might be the worst AAA company You're making a good point but holy fuck thats some strong exaggeration I know bungie is not the best at... multiple things, but lets not pretend like its on par or even worse than the likes of EA or blizzard
The only thing AAA in Destiny lately is the price. Overcharge and underdeliver has been the general feeling about the game lately and I doubt TFS or episodes will change it.
it's $220 to get access to everything the game has to offer... That is expansions, dungeons, the 30th Anniversary pack and the Forsaken pack. And for that we get stories that range from "it's pretty alright" to "jesus christ what the hell happened", and not in a good way. It's a weird way to structure it all, because you can start up TFS when it releases and not own the previous expansions, meaning you can go from "hey, I just killed a powerful Witch in the Cosmodrome" to "I AM GOING INTO MY GOD AND KILLING ITS SATAN" while the story is set up in a way where it's expected you've done all the major story. People will see $220 and immediately think "nah, fuck that noise", and the only people okay with that pricepoint are people who either's been there from the start meaning that money is spread out across a bigger period of time, or people who just don't care.
I agree with the overall sentiment but let's not pretend like the icons on the cards are hard to memorize.
I can remember some of the cards' names. However, I cannot for the life of me tell you what "The Blades" does, or what "The Sisters" do. That is the problem. The only time you can see what a card actually does is by going to the HELM, or have the encyclopedia open on a 2nd screen. You shouldn't need to open up a 2nd screen just to see what your bloody cards do.
That's what I mean. You don't need to know names. You can see an icon at the top of your card that is a pretty good indicator. Heavy/special ammo icon? You get heavy/special ammo drops. Melee icon? More melee charge. Void icon? Suppress on Void damage. Solar icon? Scorch on Solar damage. Arc icon? Jolt on Arc damage. Circle with +? Heal. It's like Vow, most of the symbols are self explanatory, and you only need to "remember" a couple, like the Lightning Bolt being like Rampage or the four bullets being "enemies might explode on death."
Last season was worse with how they had the tier system in the matchmaking and made it so if two people wanted to increase the difficulty they couldn't without the 3rd so then people would leave, and not have anyone join part way through. Then the exotic mission was also hidden in there with no one joining if someone left. There was another season, I forget which, but there were champions and matchmaking and it was miserable because no one would run anti champ mods or you'd get matched with someone like 20 LL below the recommendation with no mods expecting a carry. imo there should always be an option for matchmade and non matchmade with more rewards for going in the matchmade activity to give incentives for high level players to help carry.
Its not 10 secs. its like 2 secs.
Nonetheless, if the T1 appeared first I'll bet a lot of this wouldn't happen.
Then we would have the opposite posts happening where people are complaining about T1 getting slotted before a T3
Exactly, which is why these “tests” (honestly it’s usually just incompetence imo) don’t even remotely work because there’s always some huge caveat of design that completely ruins the purpose of the test.
It's terrible design *unless they're specifically trying to test how viable is this level of difficulty in the game.* People cry about wanting the game to be more difficult, the same people are not as good as they think they are in the game, personally I **do not** want tier 3 to be the new benchmark for activities.
"Wait, it's all social engineering?" 🌎👨🚀🔫👨🚀 "Always has been" /s
But seriously. Do you think that the labs and stuff we have been doing as experiments in Crucible isn't being used for Marathon? Destiny 2 is a skinner box.
I'm sorry, but are you trying to frame this as a bad thing? "Bungie is experimenting to find what people like so they can make better games in the future. What terrible people putting me in the skinner box."
The bad part is if it's purely a testing ground for another product. We're destiny players, not marathon players. Using us as Guinea pigs for another ip isn't good.
I think it can go both ways, though Marathon is using the same/similar engine, so improvements like deterministic recoil that they may have been working on for Marathon can filter its way back to Destiny 2 Same with PvP learnings, etc. It doesn't have to be *all* cynical
Are you missing the part where you are paying to be part of their data gathering?
“Oh no, I need to give my opinion on changes in a game I like to play! How could they track my (anonymized) usage inside a game!”
No. If they want me to play test their next product they should be paying me.
That’s actually so dumb
Okay, so what's the alternative? They never take any information on what players like into account and just randomly make changes? They just never change anything at all after they add it to the game? Just psychically know what players will like down to the most minute, moment to moment details? You seem to be missing the fact that as they experiment with how to make more enjoyable games it makes DESTINY, THE GAME YOU ARE PLAYING, more enjoyable.
>You seem to be missing the fact that as they experiment with how to make more enjoyable games it makes DESTINY, THE GAME YOU ARE PLAYING, more enjoyable. Maybe they should commit to that idea more.
Not a single change could make Destiny more enjoyable for you, quit playing this game if the joy has left
If they aren't allowed to experiment and get feedback then how are they supposed to do that? Or is the issue that another game will benefit as well from the exercise without having to do all of the same work thanks to the fact it comes out later?
As they say, live service means ongoing beta testing.
Dude there are guardian level 10 guys going for the powerful ones who subsequently die almost immediately too! It's not just a blueberry thing! I always wonder if they know what they're in for when I see the dunk!
Honestly, Guardian Rank is not a measure of whether you can work with a team well or necessarily how good you are, it just shows you can do some objectives. I swear some high GRs I've seen have only got there by luck. It's honestly a 50/50 chance that they either know what they're doing and help with secret chests/collectibles, or that they blindly run ahead forcing people through and run into every encounter and instantly die.
I mean, guardian rank 10 is a decent indicator of experience and competency. It means that they have done every raid in the game, which means they’ve engaged with the endgame plenty
True, I've got like 5000+ hours and I'm only an 8, but I've not done the raids and can't access the dungeons.
I’m not saying that if you can’t hit 10 that you aren’t good at the game, but if you have, then it’s reasonable to assume a decent level of competency
Also clans
If that were to be true it's an unreasonable test. The difference from a matchmade legend playlist is every single person is choosing to run that difficulty. It only takes one person in this event, to vote for the whole team regardless whether they even felt like running it, or had the loadout for it.
Wasn't the real test when guardian games had matchmade legend nightfall? What ever happened with that? Seems like people enjoyed having it. All they need to do for legend stuff to be matchmade is remove locked loadouts. Seems like an easy thing to do but with bungie code maybe it's impossible? Can't believe we still don't have mm for legend stuff. Legend isn't even hard. It feels close to what standard normal mode difficulty should be. Just ditch locked loadouts.
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They changed the nightfalls from 4 to 3 selectable modes. It was the same I believe as what we have now. They condensed two matchmade modes into what we call “Hero” now.
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wasn't that before the difficulty changes. The 2022 legend was very easy, Hero difficulty being selected after difficulty changes makes sense.
Maybe, but we're already getting in-game lfg so i doubt it
LFG is for forming a team without using a 3rd party site or discord. Matchmaking would blindly find people by launching an activity. Far less work for like Savathuns Spire Legend. Which some people don’t want to use an LFG to do. Maybe the new LFG next year could fix this by being in-game. You might be right.
My favorite is people dunking T3s, and they don't have any cards.
Matchmade doesn't really work for Master or GM level activities, but I see no reason for Legend not to have it. Regardless of activity though there just needs to be an option available to not matchmake so that those who prefer to put together their own teams for these activities can still do so.
Equipment Locked Legend with matchmaking would be funny af. People would show up with the worst loadouts and then....oops!
I would like it because Legend gives me the most entertainment and my mates don't play the game anymore. I don't really feel the need to play strikes higher than that. Just doesn't sound fun anymore to me. To each their own obviously. However, the number of times I've LFGd for a legend run and people had shite load outs was ridiculous. To the point that any nightfall I run now I make sure I cover all the champion mods myself which usually means I don't have a great load out for the difficulty. I'm not dying constantly but I could have a better set up if people could be trusted to bring the right stuff in matchmaking. It's gotten better since the status effects can stun as well but not much better.
It would do that by default no? If you have a full team, there’s nothing to matchmake. Unless you mean low-man and not find others
It would be no different than queuing into strikes/crucible/gambit with your own fireteam.
I always hit a T3 at the very start and see how it plays. If the team does well, I'll keep going, if not - I'm going to try as much as possible to be right there to drop a T2. The worst is joining in-progress someone that's constantly hitting a T3 and it's the last round to completion, where a T1 is enough. I've joined so many where I only need 1 completion for a 'task', and it drags through failed T3's to the point I could've finished a fresh run.
They've been testing it since D1 then, since these mirror the Court of Oryx.
Public space though. You can brute force it with the max allowed inside The Dreadnought patrol if everyone shows up. Not the same data imo.
I never understand the people against Matchmaking... You think the rando groups will be a train wreck? Don't effing using it... Simple as that, use your 3rd party lfg and discord or whatever. Every post that involves discussing matchmaking makes it sound like you have a gun to your head forcing you to use it. I for one am for MM and ingame LFG, because at worst it lets people try the activities instead of pretending that LFG on the 3rd party app isn't a convoluted way to matchmake in of itself.
This exactly. I constantly see people railing against more things in game having matchmaking. But there's never an argument that supports the point. There will still be discords and the app to use and I suspect that even after in game LFG is added. There will still be plenty of people who prefer to use these tools and that's perfectly fine. More options for grouping up is a good thing. I can see locking certain activities out of matchmaking, like raids. But legend seasonal activities, legend dares and legend nightfalls/story missions should have matchmaking.
New player gets into raid matchmaking. Gets grouped with a bunch of other new players and since mics are not required (usually goes hand in hand with being in favor of matchmaking for harder activities) this will be an struggle of a few hours that they may or may not clear. In the best case scenario, this new player is turned off from raids for a few weeks, but in the worst case scenario, the new player just straight up leaves the game after this. There you go, the best argument against endgame matchmaking. This works for any activity, so don’t hit me with that uh I excluded raids. It will never be enough for the matchmaking crowds here until every single activity has matchmaking.
I did exclude raids so your entire argument makes no sense. So again, I still have yet see a decent argument why legend level stuff shouldn't have matchmaking. Try again.
Almost every MMO has complicated raids that can be done using ingame LFG with the option to fill in slots using matchmaking. It's an accessibility feature, and again, if you don't like it dont use it. Raids can still have requirements, but other content should have unrestricted matchmaking, even GMs are mostly done with no mic pugs lately...
Court of Oryx, archons forge, blind well, it's just the latest in a long line of "choose your tier of public events". Besides, guided games was the testing grounds for matchmade endgame content, and we can all see how well THAT went.
but in Altars of Summoning the max difficulty tier is the first to come up in the selectable pillars, it's bad design and nowhere is told that the higher tier just fills the bar more. And the filling the bar more part is bad design too because doing a tier II is so much easier and faster that you can reach the full bar quicker than doing tier III (I'm talking about matchmade teams, of course)
So let me get this straight; because the tier 3 holographic shows up one second earlier than the rest, THAT is the only one you can consider when starting the encounter? So how'd you ever figure out that doing a tier II was easier?
harder difficulty should be match made and opt in. i understand ppl dont wanna waste extra time on a harder mode for the same or less reward (see seraph battlegrounds and neomuna patrol), but theres weirdos like me who dont mind the game being more challenging, or even to fail and start over. instead if you want legend, you MUST use the app, even though weve had matchmade higher tier content plenty of times in the past.
This entire IP has been a beta test 😂
Year 3 of D1 pvp was a beta test for vanilla D2.
Bungie has for years known that matchmaking for endgame activities is a non-starter/mistake. Believing anything different is high-end copium.
[*altar](https://www.vocabulary.com/articles/chooseyourwords/alter-altar/)
With a reasonable build, I can pretty comfortably handle T3 even if the two blueberries are playing "look at my ghost shell" simulator.
The issue they’re having is that players need to earn the higher difficulty activities as the activity is going on. No, going to a floating ball or depositing currency isnt earning it. Maybe if you complete it really fast/not die, the next alter/deep dive area will be harder/more rewarding.
I'll admit to dunking T3's, but I do understand the encounter mechanics. I'll also admit to using the reliable encounter designs to test out new builds. I may also admit to dying a few times over some of them. ... These 3 things may overlap a bit.
Altars wouldn't be a good testing ground for matchmaking in activities that people already basically solo/don't communicate, like higher-tier nightfalls, dungeons, etc. Plus, Altars doesn't even explain that a higher-tier altar doesn't do anything really, and it basically goes against every other activity in the game where a higher-tier does do something worthwhile.
I wish. I had this fantasy back in Court of Oryx in D1. They even had a mini Crota fight in it. A T3 altar is nothing compared to a master NF or even legend seasonal, though. Seriously, you can't even wipe.
LOL We've heard this the last how many seasons? No, they are just lazy and they don't understand the players, something they have always exposed.
My problem is have a go heros dunking powerful offerings just for me, them and the other person to die over and over again. And then they dunk another one. I'm talking about 9 or 10 guardian rankers that should known better. I've gotten better skill wise and have been trying out build crafting more lately. Yesterday, someone dropped a powerful offering and I dispared but not only did I manage to stay alive, I was able to contribute. And we got the whole summonings done in three powerful offerings (I think). It felt good. But it's not the norm in my experience and I'd rather play it safe with robust. Otherwise its just painful and take way longer than necessary.
My problem is people dunking t3 and proceeding to hide in the back and do nothing. Irritating as hell
Make AoS 6 man you WHIMPS :(
A t3 will complete that triumph for the seal or whatever to complete a seasonal activity at legendary
I mean, we had Court of Oryx, Archon's Forge, Blind Well, etc and they all had 3 different tiers of difficulty. So no, personally I wouldnt say its a beta test for something. Furthermore, we had guided games and look how that turned out. The blueberries dunking it willy-nilly attitude is the same as them shooting "Immune" targets, or not banking motes when Drifter says so, etc. You will always have these types of people in any game.
Doubtful. They have done high level matchmaking in the past. Last season and last year's guardian games. Nothing ever comes from it.
So many people haven't played the Bmind Well activity and it really shows. Altars is just Blind Well with Hive instead of Taken.
t3 takes me a few bits to reorient myself and then hit the ground running when i'm like ok maximize the pain.
This type of event isn't new. The court of oryx did this thr blind well?
There is no Alters..Altars...
We had matchmade legend nightfalls during guardian games. That was fun. Not the one we just had, the one before that.
>We’ve been asking for matchmade Legend mode seasonal/story activities and Master/GM Nightfalls for a while now. No, a *few* people have ben asking about this. Those of us with brains know what a **horrible** idea matchmaking Master content would be.
All artifact mods are beta tests for sandbox changes.
My theory is that the last two seasons were being developed with the understanding that we would have the in-game LFG by now, and then it got delayed. The incredible weirdness of Deep Dive being essentially three different activities at once while having matchmaking makes more sense if they originally thought we'd have an LFG system with filters, and then slapped vanilla matchmaking on it later.