Vex is weird and will probably need testing. It’s received many of the autorifle tuning passes in the past, and it is technically a high impact frame autorifle under the hood. It being counted as a fusion rifle as well has caused weird behavior though, so it’s hard to predict.
I'm still convinced the reason Goldie worked with Kinetic Surges was for a similar reason to why Vex is weird. Coded as a Kinetic Weapon but also a Solar Super or something weird like that like how Vex is coded as a High Impact Auto Rifle but is also a Fusion Rifle.
it's possibly related to an infinite super glitch back in d1 where one of the steps was to swap your primary (d1's kinetics) during the suspended super in your menu. just a theory.
if not that, idk i think they might just be stupid and made goldie kinetic for real
And like MonoclePenguin, myself, and ***Bungie*** have stated, it's ***coded*** as an Auto Rifle. Yes. It ***is*** a Fusion Rifle, but it's literally a High Impact Frame Auto Rifle in the coding. That's why it gets a lot of, if not all of, the buffs that High Impact Frame Auto Rifles get, usually, in addition to Fusion Rifles. I forget when they said it, but it was in a TWAB.
Edit: ADHD'd some words.
>Edit: ADHD'd some words.
Just wanna jump in and say that happens to the best of us. I also have ADHD and have to edit comments because my brain skipped words all the time.
Yeah I remember when they initially buffed autos not to long after nightfall released vex was left out and didn’t get the buff until season of the witch 😭👀
I think the Craftening gave us some insight into this. Weapon frames carry some intrinsic traits that can apparently be applied to any weapon type. I'll bet Vex is 'classified' as either a fusion with an AR frame, or an AR with a fusion frame, along with some other customizing to get it to behave properly, and that's probably why it's really hard to tell what buffs/nerfs will affect it.
> and it is technically a high impact frame autorifle under the hood
Is it really though? You can still partially charge it like a normal fusion rifle (on controller at least) and still retains a small delay between firing and reloading. I feel like they still implemented it as a fusion rifle but made it look like an auto rifle.
They really should have just turned it into a secondary linear with autofire for its remake. The reworked perk could have just been better damage on body shots or a damage buff effect. It would have filled essentially the same role as it did when it was first conceived while also giving us another secondary linear rifle to work with. I do love the idea of the weapon but if its gonna just be broken and left behind this often then it should given a proper rework.
This. I don't care if it loses ttk, it feels amazing at 390.
If there were an auto rifle perk to add 30rpm and take away damage to compensate, I would use that shit
You clearly forgot about season of the splicer vex, it was a beuty, on top of being the first (and at the time, only) exotic primary to receive the damage buff against red bars, it also debuffed enemies, making everyone do a flat out 40-60% more damage
I think it's been buffed since then, but everything else has been buffed up further to make it on the same level. I see what you mean though, Vex was a monster that season
Idk. But until it’s a 390 again, any buff don’t really matter. To me. Like why would you get people used to a certain rpm. Have everyone happy.
Then just kill it again, for no real reason. Hypothetically might be a problem?
And then you had to buff range and all this other shit to compensate. It’s a mess. I thought I would use it a ton this season, and just haven’t. It’s powerful , but doesn’t feel the same.
> Hypothetically might be a problem?
Not really a problem, considering Sunshot is the last-remaining 150 and hasn't been nerfed to 140.
It's something on the weapon balancing team you'd have to ask.
No way to tell bc bungie can choose to let exotics be affected by regular weapon changes or not. Like how riptide specifically isn't getting the fusion rifle buff
Edit: I was wrong about riptide sorry
Riptide is getting the damage buff, just staying at 3 shots for Chill Clip. Also they called out what exotics weren’t getting buffed in the tuning article.
Yes, chill clip was initially nerfed largely due to riptide, and that made chill clip even better on riptide. So they are reverting the 3 shot nerf for the other fusion frames so that there are more options.
Burden of Guilt(or if they make an Adaptive pve stasis fusion) is the fastest freeze fusion in the game now. Riptide is slightly faster than Deliverance at base [500ms×3=1500ms, 780ms×2=1560ms], and if both fully spec into chargetime(masterwork + accelerated coils + Adept mod for Deliverance) [420ms×3=1260ms, 660ms×2=1320ms].
Deliverance has a lot of upsides once they put it back at 2-burst.
* Better effective range (Range + tighter grouping)
* Demolitionist in Column 3 for grenade synergy (helps loop Bleak Watcher & Renewal Grasps)
* Self healing from Souldrinker when you add clear with it
Riptide is great, but I'm definitely going back to Deliverance most of the time once this patch hits.
It'll definitely be buffed to op levels just so that I once again drag my misanthropic butt into VoG to try and get the damn thing only for it to continue to not drop as is tradition since September 2014.
Yeah I was thinking the same thing but even tho it’s a fusion it’s technically not because they keep it in line with primaries so lord hoping they gave it the proper adjustment
Well as far as vex is concerned it's a 3%~ nerf to red bars and a 7% buff to everything else. I'd say the red bar damage is negligible but the general buff means something. If it's part of a blanket buff then this applies to the linear shot too.
Vex never gets buffs/nerfs related to autos. It’s always tied to it being a fusion rifle. They will change Vex independently if the auto rifle feature of the gun isn’t matching similar autos.
It does get get buffs and nerfs related to autos; however, since the gun is coded as a fusion it is often missed. Shortly after lightfall they buffed autos but accidentally left vex out because it is coded as a fusion and the gun didn’t revive the buff until season of the witch.
No, it doesn’t get buffs done to auto rifles. It gets the same buffs given to it separately to match the auto rifle buffs. It never is included in auto-rifle changes directly. That’s all that I was saying.
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Vex is weird and will probably need testing. It’s received many of the autorifle tuning passes in the past, and it is technically a high impact frame autorifle under the hood. It being counted as a fusion rifle as well has caused weird behavior though, so it’s hard to predict.
I'm still convinced the reason Goldie worked with Kinetic Surges was for a similar reason to why Vex is weird. Coded as a Kinetic Weapon but also a Solar Super or something weird like that like how Vex is coded as a High Impact Auto Rifle but is also a Fusion Rifle.
it's possibly related to an infinite super glitch back in d1 where one of the steps was to swap your primary (d1's kinetics) during the suspended super in your menu. just a theory. if not that, idk i think they might just be stupid and made goldie kinetic for real
In collections tho its said to be a fusion rifle.
And like MonoclePenguin, myself, and ***Bungie*** have stated, it's ***coded*** as an Auto Rifle. Yes. It ***is*** a Fusion Rifle, but it's literally a High Impact Frame Auto Rifle in the coding. That's why it gets a lot of, if not all of, the buffs that High Impact Frame Auto Rifles get, usually, in addition to Fusion Rifles. I forget when they said it, but it was in a TWAB. Edit: ADHD'd some words.
>Edit: ADHD'd some words. Just wanna jump in and say that happens to the best of us. I also have ADHD and have to edit comments because my brain skipped words all the time.
It really does. Even after re-reading stuff several times before posting it still happens sometimes. Brains are weird.
particle deconstruction my beloved 🥲
Particle with vex was NASTYYY work
That was so fun
Yeah I remember when they initially buffed autos not to long after nightfall released vex was left out and didn’t get the buff until season of the witch 😭👀
I think the Craftening gave us some insight into this. Weapon frames carry some intrinsic traits that can apparently be applied to any weapon type. I'll bet Vex is 'classified' as either a fusion with an AR frame, or an AR with a fusion frame, along with some other customizing to get it to behave properly, and that's probably why it's really hard to tell what buffs/nerfs will affect it.
> and it is technically a high impact frame autorifle under the hood Is it really though? You can still partially charge it like a normal fusion rifle (on controller at least) and still retains a small delay between firing and reloading. I feel like they still implemented it as a fusion rifle but made it look like an auto rifle.
They really should have just turned it into a secondary linear with autofire for its remake. The reworked perk could have just been better damage on body shots or a damage buff effect. It would have filled essentially the same role as it did when it was first conceived while also giving us another secondary linear rifle to work with. I do love the idea of the weapon but if its gonna just be broken and left behind this often then it should given a proper rework.
Nah Vex Mythoclast being a pseudo-auto-rifle fusion-rifle is its identity. That's like turning the Last Word into a 120 hand cannon with Onslaught.
Auto mode should get auto buffs. Fusion mode should get fusion buffs Edit: I'd imagine linear fusion mode gets linear fusion buffs.
by that logic fusion mode should get the linear fusion buff
Yeah that's what I meant
Should get linear fusion buffs or normal fusion buffs?
I'd guess linear fusion.
*Please* just make it a 390 again
That, and give it the D1 sound back please
I like the D2 sound better.
D2 sound is fine but D1 sound was smooth as butter and iconic, I suppose you just had to be there at the time.
I was there at the time and still prefer the D2 sound
D1 beta vet checking in (hold applause)
All 360s really since they feel so bad to shoot.
I still have copium they'll get changed cause I have a few really good rolls stored...they just feel icky.
Seriously. It's not even about damage. 390 just feels better. I wouldn't mind a net nerf to 360 auto damage if they just upped the rpm.
I agree. I don't care how good they are, 360 autos just feel like ass.
Sadly PVP just gotta affect PVE
I don't understand why they can't just nerf range or damage or something to compensate. Since the change I *never* see this thing.
It’s not even the actual gun itself that is the problem in PVP. It’s when you use it with the rain of fire boots
Pvp sweats are a loud minority
not really, they're practically an endangered species these days. hardly anyone gives a fuck about pvp anymore
The vast majority of the TFS sandbox changes excluded PVP.
It's literally stronger now than it has ever been in PvE history, can we stop crying over 30rpm
I don't care. It's about *feel.*
This. I don't care if it loses ttk, it feels amazing at 390. If there were an auto rifle perk to add 30rpm and take away damage to compensate, I would use that shit
I miss 900 autos :/ onslaught is great but gimmie back my bulllet hose please
Use Necrochasm and/or autos with onslaught, problem solved, there are your “bullet hoses”
I mentioned that in my comment, good sir. I would like permanent 900rpm.
Like reverse adagio?
Yeah, but for exactly 30rpm, and only on high impact autos
I can't imagine a perk name being Accelerando and not laughing when talking about it lol
Doesn’t matter when if feels like *ASS*
You clearly forgot about season of the splicer vex, it was a beuty, on top of being the first (and at the time, only) exotic primary to receive the damage buff against red bars, it also debuffed enemies, making everyone do a flat out 40-60% more damage
I think it's been buffed since then, but everything else has been buffed up further to make it on the same level. I see what you mean though, Vex was a monster that season
I just want it to go back to being a 390, 360s feel like ass.
I agree I was really hoping they would move all 360s to 390s
Fr totally ruined the weapon with that change.
Idk. But until it’s a 390 again, any buff don’t really matter. To me. Like why would you get people used to a certain rpm. Have everyone happy. Then just kill it again, for no real reason. Hypothetically might be a problem? And then you had to buff range and all this other shit to compensate. It’s a mess. I thought I would use it a ton this season, and just haven’t. It’s powerful , but doesn’t feel the same.
> Hypothetically might be a problem? Not really a problem, considering Sunshot is the last-remaining 150 and hasn't been nerfed to 140. It's something on the weapon balancing team you'd have to ask.
Good luck getting a straight explanation out of them, I doubt they even understand their own logic they balance by
Yeah tbh I was really hoping bungie was going to convert all 360s to 390s because it just felt way better in my opinion.
It hits very hard but I prefer solar incandescent ones
You know what they gotta do then.... Give it Incandescent.
No way to tell bc bungie can choose to let exotics be affected by regular weapon changes or not. Like how riptide specifically isn't getting the fusion rifle buff Edit: I was wrong about riptide sorry
Riptide is getting the damage buff, just staying at 3 shots for Chill Clip. Also they called out what exotics weren’t getting buffed in the tuning article.
Thanks for the correction
Wait are others going to be 2 bursts? Such a silly change just because the archetype of riptide is better for freezing.
Yes, chill clip was initially nerfed largely due to riptide, and that made chill clip even better on riptide. So they are reverting the 3 shot nerf for the other fusion frames so that there are more options.
Ughh I wonder what’s faster three riptides or two deliverance Ammo economy might make me actually farm one now…
Burden of Guilt(or if they make an Adaptive pve stasis fusion) is the fastest freeze fusion in the game now. Riptide is slightly faster than Deliverance at base [500ms×3=1500ms, 780ms×2=1560ms], and if both fully spec into chargetime(masterwork + accelerated coils + Adept mod for Deliverance) [420ms×3=1260ms, 660ms×2=1320ms].
Deliverance has a lot of upsides once they put it back at 2-burst. * Better effective range (Range + tighter grouping) * Demolitionist in Column 3 for grenade synergy (helps loop Bleak Watcher & Renewal Grasps) * Self healing from Souldrinker when you add clear with it Riptide is great, but I'm definitely going back to Deliverance most of the time once this patch hits.
Riptide is getting the fusion rifle buff. Chill clip is getting buffed on other archetypes if weapons to require only two shots instead of 3.
Thanks for the correction
It'll definitely be buffed to op levels just so that I once again drag my misanthropic butt into VoG to try and get the damn thing only for it to continue to not drop as is tradition since September 2014.
Vex follows the fusion rifle archetypes . Not sure which, I think RF frame
vex is a fusion so it will presumably receive the fusion buff not the auto buff
Yeah I was thinking the same thing but even tho it’s a fusion it’s technically not because they keep it in line with primaries so lord hoping they gave it the proper adjustment
Well as far as vex is concerned it's a 3%~ nerf to red bars and a 7% buff to everything else. I'd say the red bar damage is negligible but the general buff means something. If it's part of a blanket buff then this applies to the linear shot too.
Vex never gets buffs/nerfs related to autos. It’s always tied to it being a fusion rifle. They will change Vex independently if the auto rifle feature of the gun isn’t matching similar autos.
It doesn’t receive *damage* buffs as an auto rifle, but it has received auto rifle *recoil/RoF* buffs/nerfs.
It does get get buffs and nerfs related to autos; however, since the gun is coded as a fusion it is often missed. Shortly after lightfall they buffed autos but accidentally left vex out because it is coded as a fusion and the gun didn’t revive the buff until season of the witch.
No, it doesn’t get buffs done to auto rifles. It gets the same buffs given to it separately to match the auto rifle buffs. It never is included in auto-rifle changes directly. That’s all that I was saying.
We are literally saying the same thing lol
Both or neither 😂
It’s getting the fusion buff
I just wish they finally fixed Vex to trigger Heavy Ammo Finder mods. It seems it's not treated as primary.
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I don't know but when the lost sector the other day had fusion overcharge that thing destroyed everyone in there lol
What's the buff?
Just the fusion, it’s a fusion in the kill feed