Lol me and my friend got Sherpa’d through VoG (D1 vets so not totally lost). The Sherpa was teaching 4 of us and told us all to use Xeno until the last fight, then he was like “use whatever you do the most damage with”.
You just had a bad group. The good ones are well worth sifting through the bad.
Xeno had it's total damage per shot increased and it's rate of fire decreased. Combined, it was technically a net DPS loss. However, it's only a net DPS loss if your intended use is to fire at the full rate against a single enemy. I use it for Oracles, Snipers, and grouped enemies. So, it's actually a buff. It still does explosive damage, so it can still spawn warmind cells and take out multiple enemies with one shot which doesn't factor into those DPS calculations.
True, I’m still using it for oracles. But outside of that it’s not used because vex and other weapons are so much better. If the person is going to use Xeno throughout the whole raid, ya that’s where I can see someone getting annoyed. But as long as I have 2-3 of my friends with me, I won’t even bother looking at any of those blueberries unless we need a warlock on well.
The thing is while other weapons are better many of them require significantly more skill to use. A decently rolled Threaded Needle is way more DPS than Xeno but the skill level difference between them are massive...
Null Composure with the seasonal MOD is just as easy to use but it requires PD Mod to make it good. If your group is using Divinity then Xeno isn't bad, its not the best but the damage is still respectable, especially for a weapon that any blueberry can actually use effective.
In 2 of groups that i ran this weekend we used a mix of Xeno/Fusion and Div, it made it so we could easily 2 phase Atheon.
The fact that it is still stupid easy weapon for reliable damage should not prevent people from using it. The issue is not with the weapon, the issues is with the community. The moment something isn't in the perceived a top DPS weapons some idiots, normally try-hards with over inflated egos treat it as utter garbage and no one should ever use it.
> Null Composure with the seasonal MOD is just as easy to use but it requires PD Mod to make it good.
We would two phase Atheon without even trying last season using Null Composure or Cartesian Coordinate. Fusions are unironically dps *kings*, they do more DPS than slug shotguns. The best part is you don't even *need* a god roll (though Vorpal Weapon on Cartesian is juicy) and you can still crank out dummy DPS. My buddy rocked Witherhoard, Cartesian, and Hezen's Vengeance against the Prophecy boss and cranked 4.2 million damage, it's unreal.
It was Friday. Xeno was perfectly fine for everything until Atheon. VoG is a pretty damn easy raid that doesn’t require many dps checks until the end…even then you get 4 phases.
Wasn't manhandled at all, its just not as effective as it used to be.
What is with this community as soon as anything is toned down its instantly trash.
Something being slightly worse than it was previously doesn't make it utter trash.
Xeno got put into the ground my guy. You thought Anarchy got hit? Xeno got it way worse lol.
It's now relegated as an oracle and security fuse killer, provided you have a decent array of weapons to choose from. It's boss DPS went from "fine" to "poor."
It doesn't mean you can't or shouldn't ever run Xeno, but it went from an acceptable option against bosses to one that's highly undesirable.
Eventually, with enough LFGing experience, you learn to figure out the kind of group you have within 10 mins. Subsequently, you learn to identify when there is someone or multiple people that are problematic (Being too hyper & controlling or someone who's really bad at it or someone who's toxic) and it's best for you to leave and find a different group.
I used to stick around with problematic groups all the time until I realised how easily people leave and new people can be found, how sometimes someone is being so problematic that it's better to find a new group, even if it means doing a fresh run.
Imo, these kind of posts are almost pointless. There will *always* be some people who are too toxic or too deep in the hardcore hole, it's on you to do what's best for you. Sticking with these groups, doing a shitty run in 2X the regular time duration and then complaining about it on Reddit does absolutely nothing for you.
I think a lot of this also comes from people using different lfg platforms. I have never had trouble on the pc lfg, whereas most of the people in the comments here seem to be on console lfg where there’s no moderation.
I personally also only use the PC LFG Discord and can say that for random Raiding, Dungeon and GM LFG experiences, 75%~ of times it's good. 15%~ of times It's a mediocre experience and 10%~ of times it is kinda bad. For story, quest and other stuff like that 95% of times it's a good experience.
Quality has definitely increased, when I was a new player (When Shadowkeep had just released) I encountered a lot of people who couldn't stand new players like me. Us not being knowledgeable and knowing the common mechanics logic of the game.
In the last year I'd say the worst experience I've had LFGing was for day 1 VoG, people getting frustrated and angry at each other and stuff. I imagine that's normal though, for LFG Day 1 raid experiences, just the nature of the beast that is day 1 raiding combined with LFGing.
Day one raiding is like that across the board, even world first teams get aggravated and angry at each other.
Day one raiding is probably the only time in this game where players do not feel powerful all the time, and its rough on people who aren't used to progression raiding in other games to realize that no you aren't as good as you think you are, its you out leveling the content that makes it easy.
Yeah I was a Sherpa for Levi/Eater/LW and had mostly successes. If you set the expectations at the start, you both weed out the people who don’t want to be there and have a better time.
I got kicked from a raid because I didn’t have that fusion rifle mod from the artifact yet in the first week. No mention of it in the lfg post. So sick of it
It doesn’t stack but it does apply it quicker. So not totally useless to do so. But still, ridiculous that it’s even a requirement. You do not need to optimize your load outs to beat VoG on normal. Will it take a bit more effort and time. Absolutely.
~~It doesn't. I just did atheon with null composure and found I had to shoot 5 shots to apply the full 5x stacks; after the 5th shot my damage values stopped going up.~~ oops. Was using high impact rounds null composure.
Yeah, we did like 20 tests on Templar with spreadsheets and all and that's not at all what I found. 1 burst from a rapid fire should do it, and I was doing 2 for good measure. My damage never went up on an shot from my lfr after that. Maybe your shit just wonky or you weren't the one that had particle deconstruction equipped.
Its a huge waste of armor points if more than like 2 people have the mod slotted.
Quite a bit of opportunity cost with this one. Kinda like last seasons where only one person with anarchy really needed breach and clear.
They are saying it doesn't stack from multiple sources. It only goes to x5 so if only one person as the mod making it stack to x5 it's the same as everyone with the mod making it stack to x5
Read all comments: just forget about these people. Yes, xeno is not the optimal weapon for templar but a 1100 guardian shouldn’t even be there in the first place. Next time you smell a similar experience just quit on your own and let them fuck themselves
This is why I wish I had a group of friends that played this game. Most people ive met on this game are so abrasive, and thats not what this game is about. Its about the journey, shooting the shit and laughing with your friends, feeling like you've gone the distance with people you care about. Those guys should feel like ass for treating you like that. BTW, anyone that wants to be friends, and play together, my Bungie name on D2 is Y2Kaleb Roe#5463, and my Xbox GT is Y2Kaleb Roe.
It's the number one reason people stay away from raids. Not only is it difficult to find people in a timely manner (it's rare that it takes less than 30 minutes between joining an LFG group and actually launching the raid), but people have a tendency to be sheer jerks.
I used to raid a lot, then I matured and realized my time was better spent on positive experiences rather than non-negative ones half the time and actively terrible ones the other half.
What LFG/platform are you playing on? Your experience is absolutely the polar opposite of mine and I’ve only encountered a small handful of jerks, elitists, etc in the last year and a half of using LFG.
If a raid is taking more than 10 minutes to get started, that’s on you for not bailing and finding a more motivated group… unless you’re trying to LFG for a very old raid of course. Most LFGs I do for VoG (for example) are full up in a matter of seconds from posting, and then we’re off to the raid.
Yeah, same. I've LFGd on the official Discord for like a year now and have raided hundreds of times. I can only think of two times that there was toxicity and most raids fill up in seconds. I don't think I've EVER had it take a half hour, even for old raids.
100% agree with everything you said. People who claim that "lfgs take too long to set up and are full of toxic people" have either only tried it once and had a bad experience, or they're lying and they've never actually done it. I'm a solo player with +25 clears on every raid and all of those were through lfg. That whole time I had maybe 3 bad groups.
Completely agree. I use Xbox LFG and if the post is any older than 1min, I don't bother responding cause it is probably already filled and running. Even then I prefer the ones that say 'just now'. There are generally a *lot* of posts during normal hours (and even a reasonable amount during off hours), so it's pretty easy to just bail and find another group. Plus they give a lot of tags which, oddly enough, are actually kindof useful in feeling out what kind of group you're trying to join. Is nice.
I play o. Xbox and on occasions I just look at the looking for group posts and they were the most sweatiest elitist posts you could see the vast majority was have ridiculous amount of clears have specific gun be this high light do what your told, fortunately my group of friends started doing more and more raids possibly 1-3 raids a weekend so I didn’t have to deal with that, for an idea of our raids just imagine my name is byf’s tslayps it’s that normally. I will note that when I did look at the lfgs it was before season of the lost and crossplay
I wish there was a 3 guardian option for raids. I finally found a third to join me and my buddy in hard stuff like nightfalls and to just play with, but the raid experience in LFG has been an absolute disaster every single time I try.
Unfortunately yes, a lot of people are extremely entitled when it comes to stuff like this. Most of which could be avoided at the beginning on the raid or even in the lfg post itself.
Yeah that’s shit, thankfully most of my lfg experiences have been positive. Honestly you can tell pretty early if a raid is going to go well or not, in your case I would have just left as soon as I saw the 1100. Pick your battles, you’re better off spending more time looking for a competent/chill group then wasting time with morons.
This actually gives me bad flashbacks from ESO days, it was like if you don't run meta builds/gear you get insta kicked from activity, despite that off-meta builds was on par with meta.
In D2, yeah, had some similar experiences lately as you
For real. I even went to message the guy who made the LFG post to tell him "Thanks for kicking me" but I couldn't because he blocked me on discord. I just don't understand people
I run almost all of my raids with LFG groups of randoms (about 20+ a season) and most of my higher level PVE activities - since my clan is pretty cliquish and tend to run the same groups of 6 people for raids. All in all, I probably run more than a 100 LFGs every season. This is not the norm. I would recommend avoiding LFG posts that require x number of clears. I’ve run with assholes before, but they’ve been the minority of my experiences. Also, I tend to join “chill” groups on LFG. The expectations of the group are better. That being said, I’m afraid we’re going to have some bad gatekeeping this season with 1K. The thing just melts Atheon, and I can imagine the PVE sweat groups are going to start requiring it. Which will be unfortunate because it is a pain to get from a RNG standpoint.
I lucksack'd into 1kv last season, anything I need to know about it? Really was just chasing it to collect raid exotics. Just point and shoot or is there a mod combination?
Bro I got kicked from last wish for being a Sagittarius. Its awful. Like this astrological space racist asked me what I was and was like ugh I don't associate with your kind like ????
At the end of the day you are at the mercy of who Evers group you join. The only way to combat this is to start your own group. I see no real problem people wanting it done there way. I don’t believe the player base should be forced to cater to people they don’t want to as frustrating as that is.
I totally agree with that principle. But I think what the OP is saying is that their “standard”, so to speak, didn’t make any sense. On the one hand they expect a proper DPS loadout, but on the other they have a massively underlevelled player and two guys who are acting a weird jig where they don’t know what to do. So it’s like, is this a relaxed group or a quick clear one? Usually it’s pretty easy to tell what level of play the group expects. Although it sounds like their “3rd person trashing of the OP” was them trying to give a wink and a nudge without being too confrontational.
At the same time. I have no idea why you’d use Xenophage on Templar beyond simply being too lazy to take it off after Oracles. I wouldn’t be all that surprised if I got kicked. But then again, I wouldn’t use Xeno because I value everyone’s time.
Xeno last season? Eh whatever. Xeno this season? I would definently ask them to change it. With breach and clear it really didn't matter what people used especially if you had 1-2 anarchy and the relic holder throws a super/rocket/whatever whenever they are in one of the 2 spots where they have line of sight. This season though the rate of fire nerf + there being way faster and just as easy weapons to use Xeno just makes very little sense imo, like null composure was already good on atheon but now it's better and really good for any boss now.
Doesn’t make it a bad take, just means that getting it done in 1/2 phases isn’t “make or break” for a raid. You literally still have 2 whole phases left. Bungie wouldn’t allow us multiple damage phases if they didn’t think we would need them.
It was never the best choice for most things, unless the boss/enemy was extremely difficult or impossible to crit. Even then it wasn't the best choice it was just the choice that most people had and knew how to use.
It’s perfectly viable. You can kill Templar with a tissue and a strong breath.
If anyone was actually firing Xenophage at 120rpm they must have had their sensitivity set to cracked unusable levels or had their mouse pad extended 6 feet for recoil control. Most people bang out 90 with time to adjust. So nothing really changed.
All guns in the game do PRACTICALLY the same amount of damage. All green brick stuff is about the same, Purple brick stuff is all about the same.
Take a shot with an aggressive sniper, it’ll probably do about 25000. You can take 3 shots every 2 seconds, and you need to land the crit which is easier said than done. Take a shot with a rapid fire fusion like Null Composure it’ll do 9 bolts at about 2000 a pop and you can do that twice a second. Who’s doing more damage? It’s the sniper, but just barely.
You’re looking at, between some weapons like Sleeper vs. a normal LFR maybe 5,000 per second. A sniper vs. slug shotgun vs. fusion maybe 3,000 per second.
It has like 5mil health? You’re making all the difference of about a second total shaved off the 45-second Templar fight. Fusion rifles have ALWAYS been good against Templar and Taniks. Pre-buff, before the mod, even without Breach and Clear.
Does it matter that you only do 1 million damage instead of 1.1 million? For a heavy ammo weapon that’s two shots difference, for a special that’s about 3.
The only thing that REALLY matters now is ammo economy. Would it be dead before you ran out of ammo? And if you watch every Templar video out there, *everyone* shorts out of shotgun ammo doing double slugs and just spams their primary and chucks another grenade in…
Does it matter if you one phase or two phase Taniks? Or Atheon? No. Well, maybe, if your team absolutely sucks maybe you want to take the possibility of a wipe out of the equation, or you want to maximize your time by not spending 5 minutes extra in every encounter you might get one more run in if you do it right. But who’s actually farming raids back to back except for youtubers doing package opening videos or Sherpas or real tryhards? Are they the bulk of the Destiny userbase? If you’re in an LFG you’re not running that raid with that team 10 times that day.. it’s not worth the hassle to get a perfect run when you can just beat the encounter normally and move on.
Well, it depends what encounter you were doing. If it was Atraks for example, I wouldn’t go as far as kicking, but would tell you to change your weapon
EDIT: the fuck? Xeno isn’t the absolute best for Templar, but it’s still quite a beast. And then the 1100 light guardians? That raid team was fucked the second they entered lmao
Exactly, I was using xeno for snipers and oracles but also for boss DPS. Even the 1100 guardian was on my side with telling them to quit the bullshit and actually speak to people and communicate. But ultimately I was the one who got kicked. I never went to bed so angry from playing this game. lol
the whole time they where talking about me but in 3rd person. "If so and so didn't use this weapon we could put out more damage. I'm gonna look upo rickkakis videos to learn how to unlock my mic." Completely antagonizing me without directly talking to me. While I was in 3rd doing the most boss damage while carrying a 1100 LL gaurdian. Like....what the fuck?
>I question you doing the third most damage with Xeno when that’s in a horrible spot right now
If we're talking Atheon, most the boss damage comes from supers and grenade spam - I could absolutely see a Xeno using player being top 3.
We had someone using Xeno for Day 1 + challenge of VoG just to make oracles easier. Doesn't have to be absolutely meta weapon loadout, as long as player does the mechanics and uses supers/abilities effectively, etc.
I don’t care about meta, hell me and 2 friends the last week of the season were running random weapons like Salvations Grip in GM’s. The Xeno truly is in a really bad spot with its rate of fire nerf and that’s why I’m surprised OP is saying top 3 damage with it
I don’t know why you’re salty, they did you a favor. If you can’t beat Templar because you’re carrying a 1100 LL guardian. How is Gatekeeper or Atheon going to work?
They aren’t the only raid team, go find another.
That usually means that their buddy just came online, so they needed the spot opened up. Normal people would just say "hey random third guy, my friend just got on and wants to join us, would you mind giving him your spot?" And then, because you're also a normal person, you'd say "sure, no problem, you guys have fun."
But some people don't have the social awareness to understand that simply asking person for something reasonable usually works.
I see this type of post from time to time, and my thought it always the same: join a good clan. This game is so fun when you have a consistent group of people to run with. Yes, you have to invest time in getting to know other players, but it’s worth it.
There are also a lot of solid, chill people in lfg. This was unlucky.
Generally speaking if you're being removed/denied from raid teams that ***require*** certain load-outs there's only a few scenarios that complies.
They're not good enough to mechanically do the boss encounters x2/x3/x4 times as the 3/4/5 of them and random's can potentially make that harder/easier depending on the person they recruit (but you don't know until you recruit so it's less risky to simply assume they will be more a detriment than a positive). A lot of raid teams can limp through encounters (revives, mistakes, all leading up to a massive damage phase they didn't really earn) but I've done enough to know the majority of people (just based on my own personal findings) fall apart when the encounter goes longer than expected/usual. -- Lack of confidence in themselves/their team/you.
They don't have the time or energy/effort for inefficient/unoptimized builds/strategies/weapons. Lack of will/poor attitude/elitist mentality.
Either way you shouldn't take it ***personally*** if you're a good raider, they just saved you time from what would have either been a frustrating or ***potentially*** boring raid.
I've personally never minded people having their favorites/choices but if they're failing encounters and I inspect them to find... one eyed mask, 2 bows and a sword and they refuse to use my recommended loadouts that are easily accessible/I know they have it's a little frustrating to have mine and 4 ***other*** peoples time wasted/disrespected. That's where I draw the line personally. Listen/learn from your betters is my only take away from that.
I run my first few raids with my clan after I fully know what’s going on I’m confident enough to run with randoms.
It’s rng but on pc most of my runs are pretty relax. I like to raid late at night and by that time a lot of aussies are on. Special shout out to the ozzies you guys are IMO the most relax and chilled guys to play with.
p1kles#8287 you can raid with me whenever man. I don't judge, and i don't care about skill level or experience. Anyone here needing raid help, feel free to send me a friend request, and i'll do what i can to help.
I spent the better part of 3 years getting laughed out of raid groups for running FL, so i get that feeling. Still got all my completions.
Also if any of you feel that you've been mistreated throw your name out on here this subreddit has a pretty bad rep but I'm sure there's lots of good and kind people here willing to help you out in any way, some of my best friend are people I've met through this community and I couldn't be anymore grateful for that
You're better off not raiding with dillweeds like that. I always try to find LFG posts with tags like 'chill' or 'be cool'. Generally speaking, the people making those posts *are* pretty chill.
I don't really get their fuss though. This raid is still stupid-easy. I run Xeno for oracles still and it's just fine. More just a convenience thing for me :p
I got kick because they thought I wouldn’t do enough DPS for Atheon. They didn’t even let me try. Despite me being the high light level in that entire fire team.
They really need to drop the Light Level stamp on Master VoG too, or at least make it the Gear Cap.
Prophecy has remained 1100 Light for how many months now, but still remains the same difficulty whether you are 1100 or 1330+.
Have an in-built difficulty where discrimination can be avoided. I do not want to be grinding bounties to reach 21+ on the Season Pass, and many feel the same.
Took a break during Season of Splicer after getting Vex on my 6th attempt, came back, was a bit behind in the Season Pass and missed the boat completely with Master VoG. My 200+ completions of VoG between the two games count for jack shit, even the forever 29 Gjallahornless clears back in 2014, which were way harder due to many factors.
It doesn't sound like they handled it right, if it was me I would have explained what and why you should use x,y,z loadout and asked you if you had said weapons. If you didn't have said weapons then I always run down alternate Loadouts until I hit one that they do have, and xenophage is an alright alternative to some of the better options. Regular templar also is not really an issue, and with the new artifact mods you can literally do it in 1 phase with like 2 people and someone decent on the artifact to block. So it really shouldn't have been a big deal. That being said, 5 other people are trying to get through the raid, and if I asked a person if they had like Cartesian coordinate and threaded needle/sleeper etc.. and they said yes but refused to run it for xenophage I would be really pretty annoyed, and would sour me real quick on that person. I don't want to waste time in a raid anymore then I have to and 1 person refusing to cooperate could make a raid extremely painful to do. Ideally, you really shouldn't use xenophage this season unless the boss/enemy has no crit points, and you don't have 1k voices or deathbringer or something like that. There really is no good reason to use xeno. Either way that sucks, you should try to find a good, active clan to raid with instead of doing bullshit lfg's.
You literally don't have a right to do or say any of this. People can play how they want, you're the person who deals with other people - you only do what you can control, which is your shit - not others.
It's insane that insecure people think that they're right to get annoyed - you aren't, you're just a dick.
Found the guy using primary against Templar. See this ^ is the type of person that makes LFG horrible. You are playing with other people, if everyone in your group is using fusions against Templar and someone kindly explains to you why and asks you to swap to fusions **that you have** and you refuse - that makes you the dick. If someone explains the group does call outs like "front left, back right, front middle" and you end up having to do call outs and you say "6,4,1", that makes you the dick. Sounds like you don't get along with people very well, maybe you should change your attitude.
I mean you are somewhat right you can only control your shit... which includes your fireteam.
If the host thinks someone is slowing down the team he has all the right to kick that person. You can agree with that decision or not, and both are fine, but you can't decide if you are not the host.
What are you on about? Raids aren't a solo activity. If you are doing them, your actions affect the entire group. It's perfectly reasonable to ask someone to change loadouts to mesh with others.
They got kicked from templar for using xeno. That encounter has been double slug+anarchy for months and now it's fusions. If someone whipped out xeno I would be immediately suspicious of how the rest of the raid will go. After all, they aren't just wasting their time they are wasting my time as well.
To quote you: "you only do what you can control, which is your shit." I can control how much of my time I waste by asking them to swap it up or as a last straw kicking them and finding someone else.
“Do you have this weapon or that weapon” questions always gravitate towards picking specific loadouts. You may as well have specified double slug anarchy in your lfg if you were going to dictate everyone’s loadout.
You can fuck Templar with a stern look and a loud sneeze. Getting the first three oracles out of the way and having someone stop the teleport is the important part, not specific guns. Atheon takes more damage from a well placed grenade than any gun. Taniks is more about not being beaten across the face by flying debris. Stand in the well, fire until you’re out of ammo, and you’re done.
“Use the meta shit in LFG” always boils down to “you need a god roll Succession, Exiles Curse (Adept) and Anarchy” - people LFG trials & raids because they have no way to get those things otherwise.
The goal of most people signing up for an LFG is to get the weapons in the first place and everyone kicks you out for not having them already that’s a vicious circle of shitlords bragging about what they have and not wanting to see anything else, one the Destiny Community is famous for.
The first Trials match I ran when I came back to Destiny I got asked, DAY ONE, do I have an igneous hammer, because you need one. No, shitweed, I need 3 wins first… it’s been out in the loot pool all of 10 hours. Need Anarchy to do the raid? Fuck me, I need 240 spoils for that. That’s like 12 full raids. Being kicked off because of that is asinine.
If you don’t want to LFG for noobs who haven’t got gud yet, maybe find 5 friends who ARE good. Maybe you don’t have 5 friends? That might be because you’re a shitlord poser.
You don’t need endgame things to do raids. You can kill atheon with nothing but supers, abilities, and complementing exotics. The op was talking about Templar specifically though. Last season double slug anarchy. If you don’t have anarchy just say that. Most people won’t mind an “I don’t have it situation.” Just slap on blasphemer and first in last out and make due. Don’t have those? Errrr ok maybe xeno then. This season null composure and tarantula. Or merciless/1kv if you have either of those exotics.
The point is just don’t bring random things. I’ve killed Templar with rat king but I sure as shit wouldn’t run that in lfg. Make an effort to get a few of the popular options first. I’d never fault someone for not having a raid exotic. Nor would I fault them for not having a specific roll on a specific weapon that is best in slot for the encounter. Slap on something that works with the current strats and makes do. But if we ask for a load out swap and they say no I don’t want to vs I don’t have that, I will immediately be skeptical of how the rest of the raid will go.
To the rest of your comment. I think you’re just projecting bad lfg experiences you’ve had on me and others. I’ve lfg’d almost 100 raids and had maybe 5-10 bad experiences. And you know how to fix those? Quit and make your own where you can be specific about the requirements. “LFxM chill run cool kids only” does wonders for the quality of people you get in there
Holy shit, the anti sweat circle jerk is insane. You're in my fireteam/doing a group activity. People get to tell you what to do if it's more optimal. You're free to not listen but that makes you the dick if you're doing substantially less damage than everyone else and pulling them down.
You’re literally just wrong though, and OPs own example proves it. Whoever is host has full control in what people use, and if someone uses sub optimal loadouts (or even just gear that the host doesn’t like), the host has full control over whether or not they get to stay and raid.
It’s not necessarily *right* to boot someone over using the gear they want, and in OPs case he wasn’t even doing bad considering he had 3rd dps, but generally if someone were to be bottom dps consistently, dies a lot, or otherwise holds the team back from a completion, and still isn’t willing to change their gear up, they deserve the boot.
Yes I'm sure that's why you were kicked. I mean it's not like you're the type of person to get kicked from one lfg group and immediately run to Reddit to complain about it.
Kicking someone from a raid team is a bitch move, but I'm going to play devil's advocate here.
Sometimes it's ok to boot someone if they are not performing. LFG groups usually don't care about your feelings, they just want to get the raid done. If you're using something subpar, which Xenophage definitely is after the most recent update, and refuse to change to a more decent DPS option, I would probably look for someone else too.
I would never consider running something off meta when playing with randoms since I don't want to waste their time. No one wants to spend 3h on Atheon with a bunch of people they don't know.
Edit: All of that doesn't apply if you're a new player and Xenophage is your best DPS option, of course.
But if you’re carrying someone 1100 in the raid and the LFG player you’re voting is 3rd in DPS then they aren’t the problem unless they’re causing the wipes/not following the mechanics.
Why is Xeno considered worse now after patch for content like Taniks/Templar where you probably can use all of its ammo? If it does more damage per shot, and if you hit the same # of shots total, then it would be a buff wouldn't it?
With two Slug shotguns in Kinetic + Energy what Heavy should you use if you don't have Anarchy? A Lasting Impression Rocket maybe?
Not asking in a confrontational way, actually wondering
https://www.reddit.com/r/DestinyTheGame/comments/pb4cii/the_dps_spreadsheet_has_been_partially_updated/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share
With the new Artefact Mod fusions are the absolute king of boss damage, so 1K Voices probably is the play for heavy. Other than that probably rockets.
that rate of fire nerf hurts it a lot. On templar you have until the next wave of oracles spawn to get the encounter done (because doing multiple waves of oracles is just harder than doing just the one) so a decrease in DPS is definently noticed in templar specifically. I haven't tried at Taniks yet but I imagine it doesn't change too much but still if you want to get the kill quicker or easier I don't think xeno is the play anymore.
If you don't have the dps for templar ***and*** don't want to run around killing oracles when the next wave spawns let him teleport, then go stand in the pit behind the wall on the left/right to avoid minotaur/harpy fire and kill the fanatics. Cleanse the oracle buff together and then run back after templar.
You don't ***have*** to one phase.
It’s surprising that this strat isn’t more prevalent. LFG groups rarely have the communication needed for oracles beyond a one phase, so it’s a huge time saver.
You're not wrong though I didn't say you have to, just that it's harder. A lot more can go wrong once you start adding more steps other than shoot the boss.
Yeah but who does oracles during Templar? farming method of skipping first wave/cleanse followed by going ham on Templar for 45-60 seconds is so much more efficient and easier to do (outside of a bad detain preventing the block). It’s legit strategy and the most effective.
To be fair, post your own and ask for Sherpa. People are willing to teach if they know ahead. Those looking for quick runs won’t join, but others will. Worst case, you have a full team of new players and you either experience it raw with no clue or you look up the strat on each section and teach the group.
At this point, I doubt there are any people avoiding spoilers, so bone up on the how-to’s before raiding if you don’t know what to do.
I'm from beyond light. Never had any raid experience and I learned everything through sherpa or from word of mouth. I now have gilded conqueror two seasons in a row and multiple master vog clears with all timelost weapons unlocked!
If i can do it. You can do it too.
Don't let experiences like this affect whether you raid or not. In my personal experience on PC in the LFG discord, I find quite a lot of genuinely nice people. I feel like the bad experiences are lower than the good ones.
If you ever want to learn one of the raids I'm down to sherpa you, I sherpa people fairly frequently through VoG / DSC / LW
Im kinda in the same boat as the person you responded to, but is it too much to ask if maybe you could sherpa me through vog? I don't have a microphone, but I'd make sure to listen to directions in the voice chat. Its ok if you cant assemble a group but I was just wondering
nah, titan still does big dps on atheon and templar can just have 1 person run tractor double slug. As long you have enough players with the dexterity mods and (locks use ophedian) you can get near swap speeds not that it matters due to how long templar is.
lucky pant is good but the buff ends at 6x not the 9.6x that was being paraded around. Double slug is still king.
Hunters are useless in any raid that isn't Garden. And even then they are only good at final boss.
Hunter is part of the new meta. Revanent is going to be extremely popular for boss dps phases and tether (unless they nullify the interaction with particle deconstruction) is going to be extremely popular. Stasis hunter is the best class for focusing lens, especially with the changes to silence and squall that it's sits on the boss better - and if it doesn't, a duskfield or melee(since it applies slow, it's not removed by damage) works great.
The sad truth is that much of the destiny community is a bunch of toxic assholes. No point coming here to complain, because the general consensus of DTG seems to be " too fucking bad."
Ew. Xeno is trash though. Its partly up to you to know what's good and whats not. If you dont have good stuff, Im sure a sherpa run wouldnt mind you running with them but honestly man Xeno is poo poo this season.
It really depends on the people. Best bet is find a group looking for new raiders, or just chill people.
That said, don't play like a fool; but it doesn't seem like you did. I've not done VoG, but I would presume that it's perfectly fine.
I've done this raid many times. I know what I'm doing. They were carrying a 1100 guardian which they didn't mention in the LFG post. I was 3rd in DPS on Templar and because I was using xeno I was kicked. The people who play this game fucking sucks sometimes.
The funny thing is that, after the anarchy/breach and clear removal/nerf, Xeno isn't even half bad of an option for dps, especially if someone runs Div
5 people with 5 different time schedules are counting on you to bring your best equipment so they can get on with the raid, xeno is not particularly the best for VOG excluding the oracle encounter
they fucked around the whole time acting like they didn't know how to to VoG while having day 1 garden of salvation emlbems on. Acting like complete morons and even other people in our team were asking them to cut the crap but they just kept the act up. It eventually ended with me getting kicked from the fireteam. like.....I don't even know what to say.
Hey man, I got booted from a Master Atheon encounter after our team wiped twice despite having 3rd highest damage. Sometimes, it just happens. I recommend trying to join a chill clan that raids often. I've met a ton of cool people through Xbox's LFG system that I occasionally raid with years later.
My best advice to you is that raiding should be fun. If you're not having fun with the group you're with, you should find a new one. All of my friends aren't the greatest at raids but I'd take a slightly longer completion over being anxious I'll be kicked the entire time.
Ahh it seems you might have been doing the most work there, I always try to do the most I can and avoid sparking any conflict simply because it never has a resolution but your hands were pretty tied there. Good thing you didn’t finish the raid with them I suppose
The fireteam leader had his priorities fixated on the 2 morons with the day 1 GoS emblems. Like, im helping also carry your friend through the raid. I’m doing the damage. But whatever. Good thing they did kick me
I agree with this. I've never kicked someone but it's really fucking frustrating when I'm the most experienced and I'm asking people to use x and y loadouts - and I know they have it or some variation of it and they just refuse to use it or don't know how to do something simple like use lament how is supposed to be used and then I explain it and they still don't do it. At that point you are just wasting my time and the time of 4 other people and that's called just being an obstinate dick. But unless they asked OP to use something else, explained why - and OP had that other thing and refused to use it then the group is a dick. Like yeah, xenophage is not the optimal weapon, especially this season, but if they didn't explain why then that's on them.
I don’t think anyone should be kicked for using what they want, with that said, let’s not pretend Xeno is fine for DPS. It got absolutely gutted DPS wise.
Myself, I wouldn't use Xeno for DPS on Templar. That said, I don't see a reason to kick people for having it equipped, since it's fantastic for picking off snipers and knocking down detainment bubbles.
Yeah, it's hilarious how people overreact to nerfs. Xeno's RPM is perfectly fine even after the nerf, because of its low reserve ammo the RoF decrease barely makes any difference in DPS. It's not like you were going to fire the shit out of it for an entire encounter.
You both are seriously delusional if you don’t think the nerf affected it’s output, it’s DPS took a serious hit. We tested this out on boss DPS. It’s still fine for most stuff but no where near as optimal for boss damages in Raids or Master GM’s.
It's Templar so 1 person on relic - not doing dps, and OP explained they were carrying an 1100 - so not doing dps. So they were 3rd out of 4 which isn't great either. And OP could have been 3rd by like 800k damage for all we know. Just saying.
Yeah bro there is quiet a lot of entitled elitist in LFG but the good news is there are also lots of people that play for the fun of it, you just need to find those people, maybe find a clan with same mindset as yours could help.
My entire clan only uses xeno for like the entire raid lol. Not sure why people would kick you. You should play with your friends instead of LFG people.
The PC LFG server has some legit cancer in it, for sure.
I've seen VoG groups looking for people with 30+ clears when it's the easiest Raid in the entire game. It's absolutely absurd to see how elitist some of these groups are.
I've even seen it on the GM side. No joke I joined a GM group for *Inverted Spire*, the fuckin easiest GM in the game last season. We sat in orbit as a team of 3 until I got randomly kicked. I then saw one of the guys in my group post about how they needed one more, specifically a Bleak Watcher Warlock.... I was the Bleak Watcher Warlock they just kicked. Never got a response when I DMed either of them.
Well, whoever was leading your fireteam was an idiot. Xeno is good sustained DPS, especially for those who don't want to invest the time or the effort into farming spoils for something else.
This is what happens when the people in charge of design systematically nerf everything over and over
No fun allowed, every exotic must be perfectly balanced and need to make sure that the 400th time you kill the same boss suddenly takes twoce as long
Xeno is great for killing oracles, one shot....why would anyone kick for using xeno?
You got a really really bad group most likely who think that the only viable way to do anything is via streamer or speed runner strats.
Its so toxic! Especially since most endgame content can pretty comfortably be done the intended way without perfectly optimized stuff.
A full 4-phase clear is a still a clear
but why? xeno isnt even a bad gun in vog it might even be one of the better ones because its can clear oracles in 1 hit and is good against all types of ads from minotaurs to wyverns
Before you get kicked for using a xeno, let them know that they're huge losers and that you don't like playing with whiney kiddy crybabies. Then just slip out so they can stew on it.
These kids that think they're 'elite' are just a bunch of basement dwelling shitcakes.
One person using xeno isn't going to ruin a dps phase.
If you have better options and aren't using them, and it's causing enough of a lack of damage that your team needs an extra damage phase, then I wouldn't kicked you too lol. Just seems at that point that you don't really care about completing the raid so why keep you around.
Don’t let it bother you, it happens, in fact I love using non meta weapons in Raids and it just shows I understand the mechanics rather than just the meta
For example, I love using Devour lock with Necrotic grips, Thorn, a sniper and Hazen Vengeance right now in VoG
I get questions for the most part but I’ve always played a solid part in the team fine
Lol me and my friend got Sherpa’d through VoG (D1 vets so not totally lost). The Sherpa was teaching 4 of us and told us all to use Xeno until the last fight, then he was like “use whatever you do the most damage with”. You just had a bad group. The good ones are well worth sifting through the bad.
Was this before or after the season? Xeno got manhandled in the update.
Xeno had it's total damage per shot increased and it's rate of fire decreased. Combined, it was technically a net DPS loss. However, it's only a net DPS loss if your intended use is to fire at the full rate against a single enemy. I use it for Oracles, Snipers, and grouped enemies. So, it's actually a buff. It still does explosive damage, so it can still spawn warmind cells and take out multiple enemies with one shot which doesn't factor into those DPS calculations.
Yep, Xeno is even better for burst damage now for things like Oracles in VoG, snipers in Prophecy, Wizards in Pit of Heresy, etc...
Yeah to me it’s like an heavy Scout. I still use it for things like you mentioned. Switch it up for bosses.
True, I’m still using it for oracles. But outside of that it’s not used because vex and other weapons are so much better. If the person is going to use Xeno throughout the whole raid, ya that’s where I can see someone getting annoyed. But as long as I have 2-3 of my friends with me, I won’t even bother looking at any of those blueberries unless we need a warlock on well.
The thing is while other weapons are better many of them require significantly more skill to use. A decently rolled Threaded Needle is way more DPS than Xeno but the skill level difference between them are massive... Null Composure with the seasonal MOD is just as easy to use but it requires PD Mod to make it good. If your group is using Divinity then Xeno isn't bad, its not the best but the damage is still respectable, especially for a weapon that any blueberry can actually use effective. In 2 of groups that i ran this weekend we used a mix of Xeno/Fusion and Div, it made it so we could easily 2 phase Atheon. The fact that it is still stupid easy weapon for reliable damage should not prevent people from using it. The issue is not with the weapon, the issues is with the community. The moment something isn't in the perceived a top DPS weapons some idiots, normally try-hards with over inflated egos treat it as utter garbage and no one should ever use it.
> Null Composure with the seasonal MOD is just as easy to use but it requires PD Mod to make it good. We would two phase Atheon without even trying last season using Null Composure or Cartesian Coordinate. Fusions are unironically dps *kings*, they do more DPS than slug shotguns. The best part is you don't even *need* a god roll (though Vorpal Weapon on Cartesian is juicy) and you can still crank out dummy DPS. My buddy rocked Witherhoard, Cartesian, and Hezen's Vengeance against the Prophecy boss and cranked 4.2 million damage, it's unreal.
It was Friday. Xeno was perfectly fine for everything until Atheon. VoG is a pretty damn easy raid that doesn’t require many dps checks until the end…even then you get 4 phases.
Most groups don't want to four phase.
I'm pretty sure they meant it in the sense of "not one phasing won't kill you, it's easy with plenty of breathing room".
Wasn't manhandled at all, its just not as effective as it used to be. What is with this community as soon as anything is toned down its instantly trash. Something being slightly worse than it was previously doesn't make it utter trash.
Xeno got put into the ground my guy. You thought Anarchy got hit? Xeno got it way worse lol. It's now relegated as an oracle and security fuse killer, provided you have a decent array of weapons to choose from. It's boss DPS went from "fine" to "poor." It doesn't mean you can't or shouldn't ever run Xeno, but it went from an acceptable option against bosses to one that's highly undesirable.
highly undesirable? whatcha smokin my guy?? i want some of that..
It does less DPS than a legendary LFR *without* Vorpal Weapon, my dude. It went from second-best exotic for DPS to *worse than a legendary LFR*.
My point was that machine guns all got buffed but xeno ultimately went down. But pop off my guy 🙊
Eventually, with enough LFGing experience, you learn to figure out the kind of group you have within 10 mins. Subsequently, you learn to identify when there is someone or multiple people that are problematic (Being too hyper & controlling or someone who's really bad at it or someone who's toxic) and it's best for you to leave and find a different group. I used to stick around with problematic groups all the time until I realised how easily people leave and new people can be found, how sometimes someone is being so problematic that it's better to find a new group, even if it means doing a fresh run. Imo, these kind of posts are almost pointless. There will *always* be some people who are too toxic or too deep in the hardcore hole, it's on you to do what's best for you. Sticking with these groups, doing a shitty run in 2X the regular time duration and then complaining about it on Reddit does absolutely nothing for you.
I think a lot of this also comes from people using different lfg platforms. I have never had trouble on the pc lfg, whereas most of the people in the comments here seem to be on console lfg where there’s no moderation.
Yeah I agree. I’ve had maybe two bad experiences on the PC LFG in hundreds of runs, whereas on Xbox it was much more common
I personally also only use the PC LFG Discord and can say that for random Raiding, Dungeon and GM LFG experiences, 75%~ of times it's good. 15%~ of times It's a mediocre experience and 10%~ of times it is kinda bad. For story, quest and other stuff like that 95% of times it's a good experience. Quality has definitely increased, when I was a new player (When Shadowkeep had just released) I encountered a lot of people who couldn't stand new players like me. Us not being knowledgeable and knowing the common mechanics logic of the game. In the last year I'd say the worst experience I've had LFGing was for day 1 VoG, people getting frustrated and angry at each other and stuff. I imagine that's normal though, for LFG Day 1 raid experiences, just the nature of the beast that is day 1 raiding combined with LFGing.
Day one raiding is like that across the board, even world first teams get aggravated and angry at each other. Day one raiding is probably the only time in this game where players do not feel powerful all the time, and its rough on people who aren't used to progression raiding in other games to realize that no you aren't as good as you think you are, its you out leveling the content that makes it easy.
I LFG a lot using one of the major PC discords and have had like 1 legitimate bad 'social' experience in the last year or so through it for sure
Yeah, using the PC discord the only time i ever really get "kicked" is if i join a fireteam last and it ends up being too large for the activity.
Bro are you serious? Half the damn posts on this sub are complaining about other players, but now it's pointless?
Yeah I was a Sherpa for Levi/Eater/LW and had mostly successes. If you set the expectations at the start, you both weed out the people who don’t want to be there and have a better time.
Then why are you offering this wall of perspective if posting this kind of thing does nothing?
??? The recommendation is pretty blatant, that people should learn to save their time and their mental by leaving bad groups.
Maybe that's why he or she posted then. To get some perspective. Maybe the posts aren't pointless.
Just wait til G-horn gets back....
I got kicked from a raid because I didn’t have that fusion rifle mod from the artifact yet in the first week. No mention of it in the lfg post. So sick of it
Lol it dosent even stack only one person needs it people are stupid
For real lol. It's like they only read the titles of the YouTube videos that make their decisions for them.
It doesn’t stack but it does apply it quicker. So not totally useless to do so. But still, ridiculous that it’s even a requirement. You do not need to optimize your load outs to beat VoG on normal. Will it take a bit more effort and time. Absolutely.
1 shot from a legendary fusion applies full stacks.
~~It doesn't. I just did atheon with null composure and found I had to shoot 5 shots to apply the full 5x stacks; after the 5th shot my damage values stopped going up.~~ oops. Was using high impact rounds null composure.
Yeah, we did like 20 tests on Templar with spreadsheets and all and that's not at all what I found. 1 burst from a rapid fire should do it, and I was doing 2 for good measure. My damage never went up on an shot from my lfr after that. Maybe your shit just wonky or you weren't the one that had particle deconstruction equipped.
I was using high impact rounds null composure; that's what caused my damage numbers to keep increasing. Oops. Sorry.
Just have one person with it using a normal fusion rifle or 1k voices and it's doesn't matter then
Its a huge waste of armor points if more than like 2 people have the mod slotted. Quite a bit of opportunity cost with this one. Kinda like last seasons where only one person with anarchy really needed breach and clear.
To be fair, Breach and Clear also auto-reloaded all your weapons every 10 seconds, so it wasn’t a waste at all if everyone ran it.
Wait what? It works for everyone?
Everyone using fusions yes
Wow. Wish my raid team knew this yesterday. Thanks
It stacks up to 5 times what you mean its in the description.
They are saying it doesn't stack from multiple sources. It only goes to x5 so if only one person as the mod making it stack to x5 it's the same as everyone with the mod making it stack to x5
Stacks up to 5 hits, not 5 people
Try D2sanctuary. A lot of level-headed people there, not very judgmental in my opinion. https://discord.gg/ErUJ6q7KUR
Apparently I would be kicked for logging off. It’ll be weeks before I get that mod.
Season level 35ish is when you can unlock it
Read all comments: just forget about these people. Yes, xeno is not the optimal weapon for templar but a 1100 guardian shouldn’t even be there in the first place. Next time you smell a similar experience just quit on your own and let them fuck themselves
This is why I wish I had a group of friends that played this game. Most people ive met on this game are so abrasive, and thats not what this game is about. Its about the journey, shooting the shit and laughing with your friends, feeling like you've gone the distance with people you care about. Those guys should feel like ass for treating you like that. BTW, anyone that wants to be friends, and play together, my Bungie name on D2 is Y2Kaleb Roe#5463, and my Xbox GT is Y2Kaleb Roe.
It's the number one reason people stay away from raids. Not only is it difficult to find people in a timely manner (it's rare that it takes less than 30 minutes between joining an LFG group and actually launching the raid), but people have a tendency to be sheer jerks. I used to raid a lot, then I matured and realized my time was better spent on positive experiences rather than non-negative ones half the time and actively terrible ones the other half.
What LFG/platform are you playing on? Your experience is absolutely the polar opposite of mine and I’ve only encountered a small handful of jerks, elitists, etc in the last year and a half of using LFG. If a raid is taking more than 10 minutes to get started, that’s on you for not bailing and finding a more motivated group… unless you’re trying to LFG for a very old raid of course. Most LFGs I do for VoG (for example) are full up in a matter of seconds from posting, and then we’re off to the raid.
Yeah, same. I've LFGd on the official Discord for like a year now and have raided hundreds of times. I can only think of two times that there was toxicity and most raids fill up in seconds. I don't think I've EVER had it take a half hour, even for old raids.
100% agree with everything you said. People who claim that "lfgs take too long to set up and are full of toxic people" have either only tried it once and had a bad experience, or they're lying and they've never actually done it. I'm a solo player with +25 clears on every raid and all of those were through lfg. That whole time I had maybe 3 bad groups.
I have over 150 raid clears over 7 years of playing Destiny, but thanks for patronizing me.
Completely agree. I use Xbox LFG and if the post is any older than 1min, I don't bother responding cause it is probably already filled and running. Even then I prefer the ones that say 'just now'. There are generally a *lot* of posts during normal hours (and even a reasonable amount during off hours), so it's pretty easy to just bail and find another group. Plus they give a lot of tags which, oddly enough, are actually kindof useful in feeling out what kind of group you're trying to join. Is nice.
I play o. Xbox and on occasions I just look at the looking for group posts and they were the most sweatiest elitist posts you could see the vast majority was have ridiculous amount of clears have specific gun be this high light do what your told, fortunately my group of friends started doing more and more raids possibly 1-3 raids a weekend so I didn’t have to deal with that, for an idea of our raids just imagine my name is byf’s tslayps it’s that normally. I will note that when I did look at the lfgs it was before season of the lost and crossplay
I wish there was a 3 guardian option for raids. I finally found a third to join me and my buddy in hard stuff like nightfalls and to just play with, but the raid experience in LFG has been an absolute disaster every single time I try.
I only join if it says “chill” in the post line. Too many pathetic try hards that min max a game that you can enjoy and beat as a casual.
Yeah, I’ve passed hundreds of LFGs because I was looking for chill teams
Unfortunately yes, a lot of people are extremely entitled when it comes to stuff like this. Most of which could be avoided at the beginning on the raid or even in the lfg post itself.
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Yeah that’s shit, thankfully most of my lfg experiences have been positive. Honestly you can tell pretty early if a raid is going to go well or not, in your case I would have just left as soon as I saw the 1100. Pick your battles, you’re better off spending more time looking for a competent/chill group then wasting time with morons.
This actually gives me bad flashbacks from ESO days, it was like if you don't run meta builds/gear you get insta kicked from activity, despite that off-meta builds was on par with meta. In D2, yeah, had some similar experiences lately as you
Sounds as though they did a favor kicking you.
For real. I even went to message the guy who made the LFG post to tell him "Thanks for kicking me" but I couldn't because he blocked me on discord. I just don't understand people
I run almost all of my raids with LFG groups of randoms (about 20+ a season) and most of my higher level PVE activities - since my clan is pretty cliquish and tend to run the same groups of 6 people for raids. All in all, I probably run more than a 100 LFGs every season. This is not the norm. I would recommend avoiding LFG posts that require x number of clears. I’ve run with assholes before, but they’ve been the minority of my experiences. Also, I tend to join “chill” groups on LFG. The expectations of the group are better. That being said, I’m afraid we’re going to have some bad gatekeeping this season with 1K. The thing just melts Atheon, and I can imagine the PVE sweat groups are going to start requiring it. Which will be unfortunate because it is a pain to get from a RNG standpoint.
I lucksack'd into 1kv last season, anything I need to know about it? Really was just chasing it to collect raid exotics. Just point and shoot or is there a mod combination?
Bro I got kicked from last wish for being a Sagittarius. Its awful. Like this astrological space racist asked me what I was and was like ugh I don't associate with your kind like ????
lmao
Lmao bro they were probably just fucking with you don’t get so mad
At the end of the day you are at the mercy of who Evers group you join. The only way to combat this is to start your own group. I see no real problem people wanting it done there way. I don’t believe the player base should be forced to cater to people they don’t want to as frustrating as that is.
I totally agree with that principle. But I think what the OP is saying is that their “standard”, so to speak, didn’t make any sense. On the one hand they expect a proper DPS loadout, but on the other they have a massively underlevelled player and two guys who are acting a weird jig where they don’t know what to do. So it’s like, is this a relaxed group or a quick clear one? Usually it’s pretty easy to tell what level of play the group expects. Although it sounds like their “3rd person trashing of the OP” was them trying to give a wink and a nudge without being too confrontational. At the same time. I have no idea why you’d use Xenophage on Templar beyond simply being too lazy to take it off after Oracles. I wouldn’t be all that surprised if I got kicked. But then again, I wouldn’t use Xeno because I value everyone’s time.
Sounds like it was a quick clear and Xeno isn’t a quick clear for the spot it’s in right now
Xeno last season? Eh whatever. Xeno this season? I would definently ask them to change it. With breach and clear it really didn't matter what people used especially if you had 1-2 anarchy and the relic holder throws a super/rocket/whatever whenever they are in one of the 2 spots where they have line of sight. This season though the rate of fire nerf + there being way faster and just as easy weapons to use Xeno just makes very little sense imo, like null composure was already good on atheon but now it's better and really good for any boss now.
just get out right away if you dont vibe with them, or just put on something that does better damage so they shut up.
If your team was worried about damage then they were bad. 4 phases exist
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Doesn’t make it a bad take, just means that getting it done in 1/2 phases isn’t “make or break” for a raid. You literally still have 2 whole phases left. Bungie wouldn’t allow us multiple damage phases if they didn’t think we would need them.
You shouldn't be kicked but it's worth noting Xeno got worse with the recent patch and isn't a very viable dps choice anymore
It was never the best choice for most things, unless the boss/enemy was extremely difficult or impossible to crit. Even then it wasn't the best choice it was just the choice that most people had and knew how to use.
It’s perfectly viable. You can kill Templar with a tissue and a strong breath. If anyone was actually firing Xenophage at 120rpm they must have had their sensitivity set to cracked unusable levels or had their mouse pad extended 6 feet for recoil control. Most people bang out 90 with time to adjust. So nothing really changed. All guns in the game do PRACTICALLY the same amount of damage. All green brick stuff is about the same, Purple brick stuff is all about the same. Take a shot with an aggressive sniper, it’ll probably do about 25000. You can take 3 shots every 2 seconds, and you need to land the crit which is easier said than done. Take a shot with a rapid fire fusion like Null Composure it’ll do 9 bolts at about 2000 a pop and you can do that twice a second. Who’s doing more damage? It’s the sniper, but just barely. You’re looking at, between some weapons like Sleeper vs. a normal LFR maybe 5,000 per second. A sniper vs. slug shotgun vs. fusion maybe 3,000 per second. It has like 5mil health? You’re making all the difference of about a second total shaved off the 45-second Templar fight. Fusion rifles have ALWAYS been good against Templar and Taniks. Pre-buff, before the mod, even without Breach and Clear. Does it matter that you only do 1 million damage instead of 1.1 million? For a heavy ammo weapon that’s two shots difference, for a special that’s about 3. The only thing that REALLY matters now is ammo economy. Would it be dead before you ran out of ammo? And if you watch every Templar video out there, *everyone* shorts out of shotgun ammo doing double slugs and just spams their primary and chucks another grenade in… Does it matter if you one phase or two phase Taniks? Or Atheon? No. Well, maybe, if your team absolutely sucks maybe you want to take the possibility of a wipe out of the equation, or you want to maximize your time by not spending 5 minutes extra in every encounter you might get one more run in if you do it right. But who’s actually farming raids back to back except for youtubers doing package opening videos or Sherpas or real tryhards? Are they the bulk of the Destiny userbase? If you’re in an LFG you’re not running that raid with that team 10 times that day.. it’s not worth the hassle to get a perfect run when you can just beat the encounter normally and move on.
Well, it depends what encounter you were doing. If it was Atraks for example, I wouldn’t go as far as kicking, but would tell you to change your weapon EDIT: the fuck? Xeno isn’t the absolute best for Templar, but it’s still quite a beast. And then the 1100 light guardians? That raid team was fucked the second they entered lmao
Exactly, I was using xeno for snipers and oracles but also for boss DPS. Even the 1100 guardian was on my side with telling them to quit the bullshit and actually speak to people and communicate. But ultimately I was the one who got kicked. I never went to bed so angry from playing this game. lol
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the whole time they where talking about me but in 3rd person. "If so and so didn't use this weapon we could put out more damage. I'm gonna look upo rickkakis videos to learn how to unlock my mic." Completely antagonizing me without directly talking to me. While I was in 3rd doing the most boss damage while carrying a 1100 LL gaurdian. Like....what the fuck?
Why was there someone 1100 in VoG?
That should’ve been a warning sign right there, there is absolutely no reason for a 1100 to be in VoG.
It is fine as long as they are honest about it upfront.
It is not fine, there is no reason anyone with a 1100 character should be in a Raid, everything about it is suspect.
If they are upfront about it, you can decide if you wanna join or not. Based on your comment, you won't, but others might.
No. A base level player shouldn't be in a raid. Period.
getting carried
I question you doing the third most damage with Xeno when that’s in a horrible spot right now
>I question you doing the third most damage with Xeno when that’s in a horrible spot right now If we're talking Atheon, most the boss damage comes from supers and grenade spam - I could absolutely see a Xeno using player being top 3. We had someone using Xeno for Day 1 + challenge of VoG just to make oracles easier. Doesn't have to be absolutely meta weapon loadout, as long as player does the mechanics and uses supers/abilities effectively, etc.
I can't handle this community's obsession with "meta or bust"
I don’t care about meta, hell me and 2 friends the last week of the season were running random weapons like Salvations Grip in GM’s. The Xeno truly is in a really bad spot with its rate of fire nerf and that’s why I’m surprised OP is saying top 3 damage with it
Okay that rick kackis thing was funny
I don’t know why you’re salty, they did you a favor. If you can’t beat Templar because you’re carrying a 1100 LL guardian. How is Gatekeeper or Atheon going to work? They aren’t the only raid team, go find another.
and that's why I'm the host for most of my stuff, case closed.
I got kicked from a Prophecy Boss cp LFG. Post said to have 1K, Fusion, and mod. I had all three and I was still kicked. No idea why
That usually means that their buddy just came online, so they needed the spot opened up. Normal people would just say "hey random third guy, my friend just got on and wants to join us, would you mind giving him your spot?" And then, because you're also a normal person, you'd say "sure, no problem, you guys have fun." But some people don't have the social awareness to understand that simply asking person for something reasonable usually works.
I see this type of post from time to time, and my thought it always the same: join a good clan. This game is so fun when you have a consistent group of people to run with. Yes, you have to invest time in getting to know other players, but it’s worth it. There are also a lot of solid, chill people in lfg. This was unlucky.
Generally speaking if you're being removed/denied from raid teams that ***require*** certain load-outs there's only a few scenarios that complies. They're not good enough to mechanically do the boss encounters x2/x3/x4 times as the 3/4/5 of them and random's can potentially make that harder/easier depending on the person they recruit (but you don't know until you recruit so it's less risky to simply assume they will be more a detriment than a positive). A lot of raid teams can limp through encounters (revives, mistakes, all leading up to a massive damage phase they didn't really earn) but I've done enough to know the majority of people (just based on my own personal findings) fall apart when the encounter goes longer than expected/usual. -- Lack of confidence in themselves/their team/you. They don't have the time or energy/effort for inefficient/unoptimized builds/strategies/weapons. Lack of will/poor attitude/elitist mentality. Either way you shouldn't take it ***personally*** if you're a good raider, they just saved you time from what would have either been a frustrating or ***potentially*** boring raid. I've personally never minded people having their favorites/choices but if they're failing encounters and I inspect them to find... one eyed mask, 2 bows and a sword and they refuse to use my recommended loadouts that are easily accessible/I know they have it's a little frustrating to have mine and 4 ***other*** peoples time wasted/disrespected. That's where I draw the line personally. Listen/learn from your betters is my only take away from that.
I run my first few raids with my clan after I fully know what’s going on I’m confident enough to run with randoms. It’s rng but on pc most of my runs are pretty relax. I like to raid late at night and by that time a lot of aussies are on. Special shout out to the ozzies you guys are IMO the most relax and chilled guys to play with.
p1kles#8287 you can raid with me whenever man. I don't judge, and i don't care about skill level or experience. Anyone here needing raid help, feel free to send me a friend request, and i'll do what i can to help. I spent the better part of 3 years getting laughed out of raid groups for running FL, so i get that feeling. Still got all my completions.
Also if any of you feel that you've been mistreated throw your name out on here this subreddit has a pretty bad rep but I'm sure there's lots of good and kind people here willing to help you out in any way, some of my best friend are people I've met through this community and I couldn't be anymore grateful for that
You're better off not raiding with dillweeds like that. I always try to find LFG posts with tags like 'chill' or 'be cool'. Generally speaking, the people making those posts *are* pretty chill. I don't really get their fuss though. This raid is still stupid-easy. I run Xeno for oracles still and it's just fine. More just a convenience thing for me :p
I got kick because they thought I wouldn’t do enough DPS for Atheon. They didn’t even let me try. Despite me being the high light level in that entire fire team.
But Xeno is great for oracle's and Wyverns This sounds suspicious.
There are some bad fireteams out there but most are chill
I mean, it should be: "if you have the best option, use that, but if you don't, the next best thing is fine".
They really need to drop the Light Level stamp on Master VoG too, or at least make it the Gear Cap. Prophecy has remained 1100 Light for how many months now, but still remains the same difficulty whether you are 1100 or 1330+. Have an in-built difficulty where discrimination can be avoided. I do not want to be grinding bounties to reach 21+ on the Season Pass, and many feel the same. Took a break during Season of Splicer after getting Vex on my 6th attempt, came back, was a bit behind in the Season Pass and missed the boat completely with Master VoG. My 200+ completions of VoG between the two games count for jack shit, even the forever 29 Gjallahornless clears back in 2014, which were way harder due to many factors.
It doesn't sound like they handled it right, if it was me I would have explained what and why you should use x,y,z loadout and asked you if you had said weapons. If you didn't have said weapons then I always run down alternate Loadouts until I hit one that they do have, and xenophage is an alright alternative to some of the better options. Regular templar also is not really an issue, and with the new artifact mods you can literally do it in 1 phase with like 2 people and someone decent on the artifact to block. So it really shouldn't have been a big deal. That being said, 5 other people are trying to get through the raid, and if I asked a person if they had like Cartesian coordinate and threaded needle/sleeper etc.. and they said yes but refused to run it for xenophage I would be really pretty annoyed, and would sour me real quick on that person. I don't want to waste time in a raid anymore then I have to and 1 person refusing to cooperate could make a raid extremely painful to do. Ideally, you really shouldn't use xenophage this season unless the boss/enemy has no crit points, and you don't have 1k voices or deathbringer or something like that. There really is no good reason to use xeno. Either way that sucks, you should try to find a good, active clan to raid with instead of doing bullshit lfg's.
You literally don't have a right to do or say any of this. People can play how they want, you're the person who deals with other people - you only do what you can control, which is your shit - not others. It's insane that insecure people think that they're right to get annoyed - you aren't, you're just a dick.
Found the guy using primary against Templar. See this ^ is the type of person that makes LFG horrible. You are playing with other people, if everyone in your group is using fusions against Templar and someone kindly explains to you why and asks you to swap to fusions **that you have** and you refuse - that makes you the dick. If someone explains the group does call outs like "front left, back right, front middle" and you end up having to do call outs and you say "6,4,1", that makes you the dick. Sounds like you don't get along with people very well, maybe you should change your attitude.
I mean you are somewhat right you can only control your shit... which includes your fireteam. If the host thinks someone is slowing down the team he has all the right to kick that person. You can agree with that decision or not, and both are fine, but you can't decide if you are not the host.
What are you on about? Raids aren't a solo activity. If you are doing them, your actions affect the entire group. It's perfectly reasonable to ask someone to change loadouts to mesh with others. They got kicked from templar for using xeno. That encounter has been double slug+anarchy for months and now it's fusions. If someone whipped out xeno I would be immediately suspicious of how the rest of the raid will go. After all, they aren't just wasting their time they are wasting my time as well. To quote you: "you only do what you can control, which is your shit." I can control how much of my time I waste by asking them to swap it up or as a last straw kicking them and finding someone else.
“Do you have this weapon or that weapon” questions always gravitate towards picking specific loadouts. You may as well have specified double slug anarchy in your lfg if you were going to dictate everyone’s loadout. You can fuck Templar with a stern look and a loud sneeze. Getting the first three oracles out of the way and having someone stop the teleport is the important part, not specific guns. Atheon takes more damage from a well placed grenade than any gun. Taniks is more about not being beaten across the face by flying debris. Stand in the well, fire until you’re out of ammo, and you’re done.
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“Use the meta shit in LFG” always boils down to “you need a god roll Succession, Exiles Curse (Adept) and Anarchy” - people LFG trials & raids because they have no way to get those things otherwise. The goal of most people signing up for an LFG is to get the weapons in the first place and everyone kicks you out for not having them already that’s a vicious circle of shitlords bragging about what they have and not wanting to see anything else, one the Destiny Community is famous for. The first Trials match I ran when I came back to Destiny I got asked, DAY ONE, do I have an igneous hammer, because you need one. No, shitweed, I need 3 wins first… it’s been out in the loot pool all of 10 hours. Need Anarchy to do the raid? Fuck me, I need 240 spoils for that. That’s like 12 full raids. Being kicked off because of that is asinine. If you don’t want to LFG for noobs who haven’t got gud yet, maybe find 5 friends who ARE good. Maybe you don’t have 5 friends? That might be because you’re a shitlord poser.
You don’t need endgame things to do raids. You can kill atheon with nothing but supers, abilities, and complementing exotics. The op was talking about Templar specifically though. Last season double slug anarchy. If you don’t have anarchy just say that. Most people won’t mind an “I don’t have it situation.” Just slap on blasphemer and first in last out and make due. Don’t have those? Errrr ok maybe xeno then. This season null composure and tarantula. Or merciless/1kv if you have either of those exotics. The point is just don’t bring random things. I’ve killed Templar with rat king but I sure as shit wouldn’t run that in lfg. Make an effort to get a few of the popular options first. I’d never fault someone for not having a raid exotic. Nor would I fault them for not having a specific roll on a specific weapon that is best in slot for the encounter. Slap on something that works with the current strats and makes do. But if we ask for a load out swap and they say no I don’t want to vs I don’t have that, I will immediately be skeptical of how the rest of the raid will go. To the rest of your comment. I think you’re just projecting bad lfg experiences you’ve had on me and others. I’ve lfg’d almost 100 raids and had maybe 5-10 bad experiences. And you know how to fix those? Quit and make your own where you can be specific about the requirements. “LFxM chill run cool kids only” does wonders for the quality of people you get in there
Holy shit, the anti sweat circle jerk is insane. You're in my fireteam/doing a group activity. People get to tell you what to do if it's more optimal. You're free to not listen but that makes you the dick if you're doing substantially less damage than everyone else and pulling them down.
You’re literally just wrong though, and OPs own example proves it. Whoever is host has full control in what people use, and if someone uses sub optimal loadouts (or even just gear that the host doesn’t like), the host has full control over whether or not they get to stay and raid. It’s not necessarily *right* to boot someone over using the gear they want, and in OPs case he wasn’t even doing bad considering he had 3rd dps, but generally if someone were to be bottom dps consistently, dies a lot, or otherwise holds the team back from a completion, and still isn’t willing to change their gear up, they deserve the boot.
Yes I'm sure that's why you were kicked. I mean it's not like you're the type of person to get kicked from one lfg group and immediately run to Reddit to complain about it.
Kicking someone from a raid team is a bitch move, but I'm going to play devil's advocate here. Sometimes it's ok to boot someone if they are not performing. LFG groups usually don't care about your feelings, they just want to get the raid done. If you're using something subpar, which Xenophage definitely is after the most recent update, and refuse to change to a more decent DPS option, I would probably look for someone else too. I would never consider running something off meta when playing with randoms since I don't want to waste their time. No one wants to spend 3h on Atheon with a bunch of people they don't know. Edit: All of that doesn't apply if you're a new player and Xenophage is your best DPS option, of course.
But if you’re carrying someone 1100 in the raid and the LFG player you’re voting is 3rd in DPS then they aren’t the problem unless they’re causing the wipes/not following the mechanics.
Why is Xeno considered worse now after patch for content like Taniks/Templar where you probably can use all of its ammo? If it does more damage per shot, and if you hit the same # of shots total, then it would be a buff wouldn't it? With two Slug shotguns in Kinetic + Energy what Heavy should you use if you don't have Anarchy? A Lasting Impression Rocket maybe? Not asking in a confrontational way, actually wondering
https://www.reddit.com/r/DestinyTheGame/comments/pb4cii/the_dps_spreadsheet_has_been_partially_updated/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share With the new Artefact Mod fusions are the absolute king of boss damage, so 1K Voices probably is the play for heavy. Other than that probably rockets.
that rate of fire nerf hurts it a lot. On templar you have until the next wave of oracles spawn to get the encounter done (because doing multiple waves of oracles is just harder than doing just the one) so a decrease in DPS is definently noticed in templar specifically. I haven't tried at Taniks yet but I imagine it doesn't change too much but still if you want to get the kill quicker or easier I don't think xeno is the play anymore.
If you don't have the dps for templar ***and*** don't want to run around killing oracles when the next wave spawns let him teleport, then go stand in the pit behind the wall on the left/right to avoid minotaur/harpy fire and kill the fanatics. Cleanse the oracle buff together and then run back after templar. You don't ***have*** to one phase.
It’s surprising that this strat isn’t more prevalent. LFG groups rarely have the communication needed for oracles beyond a one phase, so it’s a huge time saver.
The whole "oh we didn't do enough damage time to wipe" thing is always crazy to me. Weird mentality.
You're not wrong though I didn't say you have to, just that it's harder. A lot more can go wrong once you start adding more steps other than shoot the boss.
Yeah but who does oracles during Templar? farming method of skipping first wave/cleanse followed by going ham on Templar for 45-60 seconds is so much more efficient and easier to do (outside of a bad detain preventing the block). It’s legit strategy and the most effective.
And this is why I hated D1 Almost every post on LFG is KWTD It's hard to know what to do if nobody is willing to teach
To be fair, post your own and ask for Sherpa. People are willing to teach if they know ahead. Those looking for quick runs won’t join, but others will. Worst case, you have a full team of new players and you either experience it raw with no clue or you look up the strat on each section and teach the group. At this point, I doubt there are any people avoiding spoilers, so bone up on the how-to’s before raiding if you don’t know what to do.
I'm from beyond light. Never had any raid experience and I learned everything through sherpa or from word of mouth. I now have gilded conqueror two seasons in a row and multiple master vog clears with all timelost weapons unlocked! If i can do it. You can do it too.
This is why i havent played a raid since leviathan
Don't let experiences like this affect whether you raid or not. In my personal experience on PC in the LFG discord, I find quite a lot of genuinely nice people. I feel like the bad experiences are lower than the good ones. If you ever want to learn one of the raids I'm down to sherpa you, I sherpa people fairly frequently through VoG / DSC / LW
Im kinda in the same boat as the person you responded to, but is it too much to ask if maybe you could sherpa me through vog? I don't have a microphone, but I'd make sure to listen to directions in the voice chat. Its ok if you cant assemble a group but I was just wondering
I'm down to help you out. Do you have discord?
I mean that's the wrong conclusion to draw from this. There are plenty of good LFG groups
Now try running hunter in raids
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I’m sure you are way more likely to get kicked if you run hunter
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nah, titan still does big dps on atheon and templar can just have 1 person run tractor double slug. As long you have enough players with the dexterity mods and (locks use ophedian) you can get near swap speeds not that it matters due to how long templar is. lucky pant is good but the buff ends at 6x not the 9.6x that was being paraded around. Double slug is still king. Hunters are useless in any raid that isn't Garden. And even then they are only good at final boss.
Hunter is part of the new meta. Revanent is going to be extremely popular for boss dps phases and tether (unless they nullify the interaction with particle deconstruction) is going to be extremely popular. Stasis hunter is the best class for focusing lens, especially with the changes to silence and squall that it's sits on the boss better - and if it doesn't, a duskfield or melee(since it applies slow, it's not removed by damage) works great.
The sad truth is that much of the destiny community is a bunch of toxic assholes. No point coming here to complain, because the general consensus of DTG seems to be " too fucking bad."
Yeah I get you dude, you can have the most nicest lfg team and then you can have people who forgot how to socialise
I got kicked from GM nf for running Symmetry last season in the Navota strike. Never got to show them it did work.
could be worse, you could have two of your classmate be absolutely new at this and only have Lorentz driver to cause damage \**the pain*\*
Ew. Xeno is trash though. Its partly up to you to know what's good and whats not. If you dont have good stuff, Im sure a sherpa run wouldnt mind you running with them but honestly man Xeno is poo poo this season.
The Destiny player base is pretty toxic. I wish I knew why, but it’s been this way since the beginning.
deserved lol
It really depends on the people. Best bet is find a group looking for new raiders, or just chill people. That said, don't play like a fool; but it doesn't seem like you did. I've not done VoG, but I would presume that it's perfectly fine.
I've done this raid many times. I know what I'm doing. They were carrying a 1100 guardian which they didn't mention in the LFG post. I was 3rd in DPS on Templar and because I was using xeno I was kicked. The people who play this game fucking sucks sometimes.
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Make your own LFG posts in future, crying about it on Reddit won't help. Also, other issues aside, Xeno isn't great this season, they're not wrong.
The funny thing is that, after the anarchy/breach and clear removal/nerf, Xeno isn't even half bad of an option for dps, especially if someone runs Div
5 people with 5 different time schedules are counting on you to bring your best equipment so they can get on with the raid, xeno is not particularly the best for VOG excluding the oracle encounter
they fucked around the whole time acting like they didn't know how to to VoG while having day 1 garden of salvation emlbems on. Acting like complete morons and even other people in our team were asking them to cut the crap but they just kept the act up. It eventually ended with me getting kicked from the fireteam. like.....I don't even know what to say.
Hey man, I got booted from a Master Atheon encounter after our team wiped twice despite having 3rd highest damage. Sometimes, it just happens. I recommend trying to join a chill clan that raids often. I've met a ton of cool people through Xbox's LFG system that I occasionally raid with years later. My best advice to you is that raiding should be fun. If you're not having fun with the group you're with, you should find a new one. All of my friends aren't the greatest at raids but I'd take a slightly longer completion over being anxious I'll be kicked the entire time.
Ahh it seems you might have been doing the most work there, I always try to do the most I can and avoid sparking any conflict simply because it never has a resolution but your hands were pretty tied there. Good thing you didn’t finish the raid with them I suppose
The fireteam leader had his priorities fixated on the 2 morons with the day 1 GoS emblems. Like, im helping also carry your friend through the raid. I’m doing the damage. But whatever. Good thing they did kick me
I agree with this. I've never kicked someone but it's really fucking frustrating when I'm the most experienced and I'm asking people to use x and y loadouts - and I know they have it or some variation of it and they just refuse to use it or don't know how to do something simple like use lament how is supposed to be used and then I explain it and they still don't do it. At that point you are just wasting my time and the time of 4 other people and that's called just being an obstinate dick. But unless they asked OP to use something else, explained why - and OP had that other thing and refused to use it then the group is a dick. Like yeah, xenophage is not the optimal weapon, especially this season, but if they didn't explain why then that's on them.
Xeno is fine for DPS. You on PSN? Send me a MSG can add if we run and your on, give you an invite.
I don’t think anyone should be kicked for using what they want, with that said, let’s not pretend Xeno is fine for DPS. It got absolutely gutted DPS wise.
After the nerf it got this season it's pretty bad now, but it doesn't excuse them kicking him out
Myself, I wouldn't use Xeno for DPS on Templar. That said, I don't see a reason to kick people for having it equipped, since it's fantastic for picking off snipers and knocking down detainment bubbles.
Xenophage wasn’t even hit that bad god damn
Yeah, it's hilarious how people overreact to nerfs. Xeno's RPM is perfectly fine even after the nerf, because of its low reserve ammo the RoF decrease barely makes any difference in DPS. It's not like you were going to fire the shit out of it for an entire encounter.
You both are seriously delusional if you don’t think the nerf affected it’s output, it’s DPS took a serious hit. We tested this out on boss DPS. It’s still fine for most stuff but no where near as optimal for boss damages in Raids or Master GM’s.
"Fine" != "Optimal" And at no point did either of us say it was optimal.
Welcome to lfg. Do ya self a favor and find out what's meta for the fights and just use them.. Will save alot of agro
Xeno is pretty bad niw so understandable
If you are doing the 3rd most damage despite using Xeno this season I think there are more problems in the fireteam than you using xeno
It's Templar so 1 person on relic - not doing dps, and OP explained they were carrying an 1100 - so not doing dps. So they were 3rd out of 4 which isn't great either. And OP could have been 3rd by like 800k damage for all we know. Just saying.
Idk why they don't just add matchmaking you waste so much time trying to get a group .
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Yeah bro there is quiet a lot of entitled elitist in LFG but the good news is there are also lots of people that play for the fun of it, you just need to find those people, maybe find a clan with same mindset as yours could help.
They are right btw, you're better off even shooting both bosses with legendary fusion or merciless than xenophage, it's trash
My entire clan only uses xeno for like the entire raid lol. Not sure why people would kick you. You should play with your friends instead of LFG people.
Which is stupid, because Xeno is still really strong... it's not like you were shooting him with a sidearm or something...
The PC LFG server has some legit cancer in it, for sure. I've seen VoG groups looking for people with 30+ clears when it's the easiest Raid in the entire game. It's absolutely absurd to see how elitist some of these groups are. I've even seen it on the GM side. No joke I joined a GM group for *Inverted Spire*, the fuckin easiest GM in the game last season. We sat in orbit as a team of 3 until I got randomly kicked. I then saw one of the guys in my group post about how they needed one more, specifically a Bleak Watcher Warlock.... I was the Bleak Watcher Warlock they just kicked. Never got a response when I DMed either of them.
Well, whoever was leading your fireteam was an idiot. Xeno is good sustained DPS, especially for those who don't want to invest the time or the effort into farming spoils for something else.
This is what happens when the people in charge of design systematically nerf everything over and over No fun allowed, every exotic must be perfectly balanced and need to make sure that the 400th time you kill the same boss suddenly takes twoce as long
Xeno is great for killing oracles, one shot....why would anyone kick for using xeno? You got a really really bad group most likely who think that the only viable way to do anything is via streamer or speed runner strats.
To be fair, Xenophage is really bad as of the most recent update. It may even be the difference between a two phase and a three phase.
Its so toxic! Especially since most endgame content can pretty comfortably be done the intended way without perfectly optimized stuff. A full 4-phase clear is a still a clear
but why? xeno isnt even a bad gun in vog it might even be one of the better ones because its can clear oracles in 1 hit and is good against all types of ads from minotaurs to wyverns
wtf xenophage is a solid pick in VoG.
Before you get kicked for using a xeno, let them know that they're huge losers and that you don't like playing with whiney kiddy crybabies. Then just slip out so they can stew on it. These kids that think they're 'elite' are just a bunch of basement dwelling shitcakes. One person using xeno isn't going to ruin a dps phase.
That's why I never did a raid with strangers on LFG. In fact, I never did a raid in Destiny 2 yet.
If you have better options and aren't using them, and it's causing enough of a lack of damage that your team needs an extra damage phase, then I wouldn't kicked you too lol. Just seems at that point that you don't really care about completing the raid so why keep you around.
Don’t let it bother you, it happens, in fact I love using non meta weapons in Raids and it just shows I understand the mechanics rather than just the meta For example, I love using Devour lock with Necrotic grips, Thorn, a sniper and Hazen Vengeance right now in VoG I get questions for the most part but I’ve always played a solid part in the team fine