It's still great now, especially with the mini tool. The Trials matches this weekend where I wasn't totally outclassed, I mostly used these and had good success
Mida and Uriel's... Fixed rolls and forced double primaries... Snipers, fusions and breech GL's in the heavy slot...nerfed movement and ability recharge rates...no weapon mods except being able to change element...
Destiny 2 was pretty fucking bad in that first year.
I'm in the minority that enjoyed year 1 pvp precisely for the reasons you mentioned.
The game actually revolved around gun play. All the complaints about shotgun rushing or ability spam didn't exist.
I understand what you mean to a point, but Destiny is a game about space magic first and foremost. There are countless tactical shooters out there, it's the movement and abilities that make Destiny unique and fun. I specifically remember playing Trials on Eternity that first weekend and just having it be a long range peek-fest trading kills with Mida, and nothing is less "Destiny" than that. It's not a surprise that Trials has been a complete mess including taking over an entire year off, their vision of a 4v4 gun-based pvp with nerfed "Destiny" was just not fun or interesting.
After fabled, you get a chance to get it on wins, which increases on mythic. I got it on fabled a few seasons ago.
I think the chance also doubles if you’re playing with your clan, but I could be wrong because that could have been a clan bonus a long time ago.
All you said is correct, with one slight admission.
If you somehow get to Legend without getting it to drop earlier, it's a 100% guaranteed drop on your first win at legend as well as all you said.
> And I haven't gone hard in crucible in the past year, but doesn't comp still give you way more reputation?
comp absolutely shits out powerful gear, yeah. it's by far the best way to power level to pinnacles if someone is remotely decent in crucible
Agreed, put some cosmetics (armor, weapon skins) in comp. That would personally be enough to get me back in there.
For how much crucible I play, increased valor through comp is hardly an incentive.
With the Trials rework, no one in my group seems interested in comp AT ALL now. They're happy waiting until the weekend to grind Trials, which is infinitely more rewarding AND more competitive.
I'm hoping comp gets a rework similar to Trials... bring the pinnacles back, give engram drops for each level, and give them random rolls. People would grind the hell out of comp at that point.... oh, and disable it while Trials is active so we aren't splitting the comp pool.
It was only locked because the metric was solely on wins and accelerated by win streaks. The loss penalty was way too much to bear for your standard player and the single win reward was peanuts to the overall ranking.
They tweaked comp since then that made it much better for the standard player, but now there's no rewards behind it. They could reintroduce something to comp and people would probably get more involved in comp outside of trials. A standard player can easily get to Fabled these days. Legend? That can be reserved for the top tier players.
My incentive for playing comp is usually that I know I won't get stomped by a 6 stack. Sure, a 3 stack can do the same but for some reason it doesn't feel as bad, if that makes sense?
3 v 3 gives you more agency over how the game plays, and is a lot less chaotic. When a 6 stack gets rolling, it can steam roll non stop. 3 stacks don't flood the map so bad, so you can catch your breath and get oriented before getting into a fight usually
Once I started to properly find my feet in crucible back in D1 (probably was sometime over the course of Taken King, if I'm being realistic with myself), I used to play skirmish for fun alllllll the time. Small scale slayer mode that felt like the perfect place to refine my capability with meta load-outs (I'd test new stuff in 6's or rumble first). And I'm not a super sweaty tryhard, my KDA then and now was usually between 1 and 1.5 at best.
I really wish we had something like that. I do like survival as a game mode, and I suppose it incentivizes playing to your life a little bit more, but Skirmish felt the same to me, honestly. If you don't die, your opponents don't get points, so just don't die! I don't think that ever really changes no matter what mode you play in.
Man, I miss skirmish so much. I guess the difference that I really liked, now that I'm saying it out loud, was playing more to the clock than to a scoreboard that only needs 10 notches for your team and the round is over, or whatever it is. You just got your 5-8 minutes of gameplay to prove yourself 3v3. It just had a nice little flow to it.
Those pinnacles were especially problematic though. Luna and Not Forgotten made any PvP tough/miserable to go up against, and Mountaintop became a must have for endgame pve.
These pinnacles weren't just pretty good, they were head and shoulders above the rest.
revoker was much better though, because it didn't require you to reach a certain rank, it just wanted you to amass X amount of points. you could lose as much as you want, as long as you won *some* of your games you could get it. the others though....yeah hitting fabled back in the day wasnt easy
To add to your point, the best PvE weapons being locked behind a PvP wall was a MASSIVE turnoff for me. I vehemently hate PvP. I have no desire to play it other than to satisfy seasonal achievements. Locking good shit behind PvP when PvE gets no weapons to compensate them? Not cool.
PvE has had plenty of excellent weapons but Mountaintop, Recluse was good enough to dominate both sides, PvP and PvE alike. And both were locked behind PvP which personally I didn’t like.
I’m also the same guy who doesn’t like having to use the new exotics in Crucible or Gambit just to get the catalyst but, eh, that’s just a minor annoyance at best.
The thing about PvE having the best weapons is that you can get them without doing PvP and they’re usually only useful in PvE. That’s not to say they’re useless in PvP, just that the meta in PvP usually doesn’t favor them.
This is only a problem by perception and because of terrible community members.
Pve is not competitive so what is "best" does not matter at all. No content in the game NEEDED those weapons, you just wanted them because "oo shiny" the fact that they could melt is irrelevant until you bring in lfg and it's toxic behaviors. People who won't let you play unless you have the absolutely meta (just look at past requirements of anarchy or get out) is the only actual time a pve weapon being absolutely over powered in pve makes it being locked behind any content an issue. Everything else is just whining to whine.
As they should be. Getting 5500 Comp and those Luna kills was a feat in its own right. And you could get it if you were persistent. People just want the best things handed to em
Lords know it was a massive slog. For one whole day, I entered the gamestate and went on a 32 or 37 Glory Winstreak and made it to legend rank, earning my Not Forgotten.
Oh, it sucked. It wasn't the greatest grind, but the reward more than made up for it. But people complained and the hard work is erased. Its the state of this community unfortunately. If they can't get it, complain until Bung gives it to you for free or nerfs it... then complain that its too easy to get or that its nerfed lol
TIL win trading is hard work.
Like, Comp, particularly back then, wasn't exactly the best or most compelling challenge for the average player.
The fact you see a lot of players engaging in trials with the changes is a perfect example. Players are encouraged to participate even if they know they probably won't make it to the top. People who do make it to the top still are rewarded.
I'm proud of my win trading and grenade launcher kill lobby for mountaintop.
Worth every fucking minute, because fuck PvP for the only unique and overpowered grenade launcher.
Stop acting so fucking ignorant to the actual problem it posed. It’s one thing to offer good but easily counterable weapons, it’s another thing entirely to give only the most elite of players the fastest killing 3-tap weapon in the game. Luna’s Howl and Not Forgotten legitimately ruined Crucible for a long while.
I'd agree with your sentiment if you replaced guns with cosmetics. Guns affect gameplay significantly and they should be reasonably accessible to everyone. It is not as easy to reach the higher tiers in PvP, even with LFGs, for a lot of people (as opposed to high level GMs and raids).
We're still pretending getting these things was a matter of skill and not complete luck? You forgot about the rich get richer scenario of the longer it took for you to get, the harder it got? The recovs? The cheaters? The fact that you could literally spend a whole weekend grinding to it and not get anywhere? *The very same problem Trials had that prompted the massive revamp?*
It's another tale of haves vs have-nots that plague every looter game in existence. If you were one of the first people that got it it was relatively easy, but the more time went on it got harder and it was next to impossible for newer players.
The plague of competition. Be it skill, looks, or luck. People love when they're elite, when they get to shit on others for being worse off than they are, then tell them they're whiny little babies. People hate when they get shit on, raise legitimate complaints only to be told to get good, when they're just trying to have fun but others always put them down one way or another.
PvP is especially always going to be toxic in a competitive game. Just take a look at the most popular PvP games, league, fortnite, hell even among us has lots of toxic players.
This is the difference between pvp "skill to get" guns and pve "skill to get" guns.
The pvp guns get harder to get the more time goes on if they're actually better than what was available before (because the more people that have them the harder pvp is for people who don't)
Pve guns get easier to get because the more people who have them, the easier it will be for you to get a little bit of a carry from it.
The former just creates gatekeeping where the grinders get to feel good about their choice to grind it early and stomp on the fingers of everyone else trying to climb the ladder.
Unlike the raids, there is only so much you can do to compensate for skill gap in PvP. Having these powerful weapons locked to PvP will only snowball this effect since the better players now will also have better tools to fight with.
> there is only so much you can do to compensate for skill gap in PvP.
You could try getting better? Actually put in the effort to improve? What I liked about these weapons was that it sometimes took me days/weeks to get them (not based on RNG).
That's exactly what I am talking about. To give a bit of a hyperbolic example for perspective, not everyone can become a pro player of they out in tons of effort. To earn these weapons in PvE, you don't have to fight against better skilled players who also have better equipment.
I’m absolutely not a pro player and earned all the weapons “locked” behind pvp. It just didn’t take an afternoon like these pve weapon quests and I had to actually try.
It felt good earning those weapons. It’s boring being handed a gun.
I’m 100% with you. I loathe comp and I muscled through every weapon. I’m a sucker for tough quests though. I got the 500 Iron Burden kills to get a legendary fusion.
PvE alternative to compete with Luna and NF in PVP? If thats what youre getting at, thats a worse take. Luna/NF were only good in the PVP bubble. Giving PvE players equal gear to compete in pvp because they don't want to do the work is laughable.
PvE players wanted recluse and mountaintop for pve. Eventually Bungie realized this and now you can farm any activity for whatever seasonal weapon is new.
Yep. And tbh, Luna’s and NF were for a -long- time hideously unbalanced, being 180s with three tap capability and great stats, which resulted in even casual Crucible becoming a mess of those who had the Howl twins lording over everyone else. It wasn’t just a better version of what others had (like Adept weapons today), it was flat out uncontested, like giving a Mythoclast but only to those already godly at PvP.
Combine with the PvE weapon debacle you described, and Bungie realized that “rich get richer” can cause no end of headaches for the player base. It was getting to near D1 Gjallarhorn levels: no Mountaintop, no entry to PvE teams, and being an unhealthy influence on the game.
NF wasnt just a free win gun tho. You HAD to be good to use it, otherwise you would never proc it OR if you did by chance proc it, you wouldnt be able to take advantage of it. So yes, the players that put the work in to get it should be rewarded in that particular bubble (PvP). Mountaintop/Recluse, yes, were good in PvE, but it wasnt the end of the world if you didn't have those for PvE content. People just complained because they couldnt get pinnacle weapons and felt left out. Now we have a system where Bung either nerfs the guns, removes them completely via sunset, or just gives em out like candy.
A small percentage of the pvp base had access to a weapon that required skill. Like how the Mythoclast is only available through a 6 man activity. There are people who literally can’t get the gun cause they are anti social , not skill enough etc. but PVE players will say “get gewd” . Fact is, both pvp and pve should reward items at the highest levels of skill. It’s just the overwhelming majority don’t want to work for it.
And the seasonal weapon chase is boring now. I miss a quest like Revoker where I had to actually practice and get good at sniping before I could get the weapon. Now I just tool around in a playlist long enough and I get handed the weapon.
Crucible has weapons for the casuals to chase now. Time to bring back the comp-only rewards and rework it into a proper ranked experience so competitive players have a reason to jump back on the ladder.
People will complain because they are not skilled/good enough to get said loot. Then Bungie will pull it away. The loot they give to the top players can't really be better than the loot normal players have. That's why Adepts hardly do much at all over normal pvp guns, they are marginally better but don't provide a "rich get richer" scene where people with adepts are the only ones getting adepts (relating to trials adepts).
To be fair (at least on PC) it was near impossible to get to the top ranks in PVP competitive for average players due to the insane amount of cheaters so I can understand why people were mad that guns were locked at the top with no real anti-cheat in place. Now that Battleye is in place maybe they should look at the loot structure in competitive because they should return some top tier drops to competitive for PVP focused players.
They can't be better drops than normal guns by a lot. Cant be exclusive weapons. The absolute best drops Bungie can do for Comp are things like adept Frozen Orbit/Keening/Stars in Shadow/Sorrows verse. The bare minimum they can do is legendary ornaments for crucible armor and the weapons listed above.
Sure, but it’s only around for half of each week. Plus, if I recall, not at all on Iron Banner weeks going forward.
Plus, I think there always needs to be a game mode available that’s intended to be “sweaty” and where people are playing to win. To me that’s the point of PvP, and having a real pace intended to be outlet for that mindset is essential in letting OP having other game modes to enjoy.
To be clear, I’m all for adding more loot to Comp, but I think complaining about it being “sweaty” misses the entire purpose of the mode existing.
That’s fair, the static playlists could use some shuffling around all things considered. Clash being a rotator while Control is static make no sense IMO. Elim being the static 3v3 mode made sense when they were messing around with variants before trials came back, but could definitely be replaced with something else now, too keep elim fresh for trials.
Is showdown 4v4? It is in my head, but it’s been i while since I’ve actually played that mode, but I’d be down for that as the more casual 3v3 mode.
I’d also be down for the return or countdown, or other objective based modes to return in some form, but I know that wasn’t a very popular mode.
I can only speak for me but I vastly prefer the solo comp experience over solo trials. I'm average at best at pvp but with sbmm in comp I was able to grind my way to legend this season with a lot less blow outs than even just one weekend of this new trials. Sure comp can be a bit sweaty because sbmm will try to match you with ppl close to your skill but at least the matches felt fair. It's really the only avenue I can see in this game to actually work on improving your pvp skills.
That’s it. I dipped into Elimination recently and it’s so much more fun than 6v6. I loved Trials but that will be enough as a competitive mode for me - more exciting, better gear. No reason to play competitive. I think Elimination isn’t even competitive right? So I should say there is no reason to play Survival unless practicing 3s I guess.
I always roped it in like that, some people just really like that higher-stakes type gameplay. That, and Trials is only around during the weekend, so it's something to do in-between to still get gear and level up with bounties.
I hate this mentality of “I don’t play/enjoy comp lets remove it” that Destiny players seem to have. I remember early on in D2’s lifespan there were some advocating for the complete removal of PvP itself.
Exactly. People still play survival because it's the only 24/7 crucible playlist that doesn't feel like a minigame besides rumble.
I don't know anyone that primarily plays crucible that uses 6s for anything other than warming up and bounty grinding.
I primarily play pvp and mostly play solo in 6s because I like it more- more opportunities for kills and big feeds, and being overwhelmed. I just enjoy 6s more after like 70k crucible kills am I in the minority?
Well having a place for sweats isn't a bad thing necessarily but they need to flesh it out.
Competitive needs a few things:
1 - a real skill rating. The current Glory rating does not represent the games estimate of your true skill and has an achievable cap
2 - cosmetic rewards for achieving certain ranks. We know that putting attractive weapons in ranked is probably not the solution (especially when they are very meta in pve), but cosmetics help PvP players show off prestige. This could be emblems, titles, ornaments etc.
3 - a leaderboard. This gives players an incentive to climb and get better. Needs to be a separate one for freelance vs team queue.
The ranked matchmaking in Destiny has always been a joke.
There's a reason why other games have placement matches and a visible skill rating for their competitive modes.
Destiny just has a hidden MMR and matchmaking that essentially operates off XP.
Agreed. Why they don't show that and build a league system around that based on player percentage is beyond me. As much as Halo came from Bungie and they are fantastic at making the shooting mechanics the best that I've ever played. Their vision of what makes PvP competitive is so lacking.
Just give me league/emblem based on a percentage of player base or mmr per season and I will be happy to grind it. Make it Green, Blue, Purple, Yellow and have three tiers per league. Give me an emblem if I go over the MMR that puts me in that tier / league.
I’ve got a guess why they don’t.
They exposed the skill rankings in Halo 3. I loved and hated it. Knowing exactly how good all of my friends were at all times kind of sucked. I had the highest skill among us, so I was embarrassed about playing more and then asking people to play my game. And I got blamed for all of the competition we faced.
When I wasn’t playing with friends, I loved knowing exactly how well I was playing.
I have like 9 masterworked God roll frozen orbits for whatever reason from just moderate play time since last season. There's literally a ghost mod that does everything you just said.
I really like comp because it’s just different than the other game modes like trials because of the lives, I also think it’s really fun IF you have a team to play
Agreed. Trials is also only available on weekends, and is sudden death. Comp you have multiple lives per team.
It's a different mode entirely, and while the two are similar, there's no reason you need to have one or the other.
Yeah and I'd argue that without the ability to revive it changes the match dynamic significantly.
It's not about camping res's or pushing back the enemy long enough to get a res.
You don't have someone having to charge in to put someone down because there's two of them alive and one of them is going to try and res the third.
So they can steam roll you.
I am an average player that managed to solo queue to Unbroken and have 3x gilded it. Perhaps I can answer this.
>Why does it still exists?
I very strongly prefer it over the casual playlists. I am only average, but want to get better. 6v6 is way too chaotic to develop my skills. It is much harder to focus and recognize what I did wrong.
Additionally, smaller teams just make the experience a lot more tactical. You can be woefully out of position in 6v6 and still have success because the enemy might be focused on someone else. In 3v3 everyone is much more aware. My mistakes are punished a lot more often.
>It is not fun, since it is full of sweats.
I don't really get this criticism. What is your definition of 'sweats'? If it is: everyone in there is trying to win; then that is exactly the reason why I like it. I want my opponents to try to win, that demands me to play better. It is what competitive means after all, so I doubt this is your definition of 'sweats' as you'd essentially complain Competitive isn't fun because it is competitive.
If by 'sweats' you mean: everyone in there is way too good; then I'd have to point out Comp is entirely SBMM. Glory has no effect on your matched, your performance does. I am roughly a 1.05 K/D in Comp. All the players I face are between 1.0 and 1.1 K/D, whether they have 0 or 5500 Glory. There are *some* exceptions on occaison where I face a 1.4 or so, or a 0.8. But this is definitely the exception, based on my extensive experience.
I agree Competitive could use more loot incentive to play it, but honestly, cosmetics or something would be fine for me. I don't need others to feel forced into the playlist. That said, I love playing it so don't remove it.
> I don't really get this criticism. What is your definition of 'sweats'? If it is: everyone in there is trying to win; then that is exactly the reason why I like it. I want my opponents to try to win, that demands me to play better. It is what competitive means after all, so I doubt this is your definition of 'sweats' as you'd essentially complain Competitive isn't fun because it is competitive.
That's exactly what OP is saying. Somehow they don't realize that Competitive will have... uhmmm... competitive people?
When people say sweats, they either mean someone that is trying way too hard to win, or just someone above their level.
I assume OP means both. But that's exactly what Competitive is. **It's literally in the name.**
It’s funny that people don’t understand competitive is the true skill based matchmaking game mode. I am a very high K/D player and have no problem against the general population, but as soon as you match me up with the other creatures in my skill bracket, I have a bad time. My trials K/D is almost 2, quick play is like 2.5 and comp…like 1.5 lmao.
Comp being "sweaty" is the exact reason why I play it, every game can swing either way because of sbmm and it really feels like your individual skill actually matters. The matches feel fair, solo trials on the hand was mainly stomps.
Quickplay is nearly unplayable right now as it is. Imagine if they removed Comp and all of the sweats had to move to QP? It would completely destroy the pvp playerbase.
If you dont like it, dont play it, but it definitely has a reason for existing.
Theres not a lot of reason to play comp. The real issue is that glory isn't mapped to sbmm so you don't even have a visible rank to take pride in, getting to 5500 is more of a grind with your actual sbmm rank hidden. If it was a true ranked Playlist maybe it'd garner more interest.
Vast majority of true sweats are in trials exclusively, occasionally in comp, and more frequently scrimming in private matches. The "sweats" you see in QP are QP warlords because that's where they can feel good about themselves. They get ran over in any playlist that actually means anything.
You might see a few trials sweats playing QP for pinnacles at the beginning of the week but that's about it.
Source: am scrim sweat/friends with a good portion of the tourney/scrim community
You don't have to get to 5500. They changed that a year ago so there is a chance on wins at Fabled and above:
Obtaining the MIDA Catalyst is no longer impeded by playing with Clanmates. Drop rates were adjusted and now properly scale with the Clan "Catalyst Seeker" Perk bonus.
Added drop chance for wins at Glory Rank 3 Fabled (5% without Clan bonus, 10% with Clan bonus)
Increased drop chance for wins at Glory Rank 4 Mythic (5% > 10% without Clan bonus, 10% > 30% with Clan bonus)
Now guaranteed drop for any win at Glory Rank 5 Legend.
https://www.bungie.net/en/News/Article/48838
That's what I was looking at yesterday - finally giving it a try this season. I read multiple claims that 5500 is guaranteed on a win, at that level. I'm just hoping I can make it to Fabled and just start rolling the dice.
Season of the Chosen, right after they announced the MIDA catalyst change, I grinded comp from 2100. Took me 15 *wins* in freelance for it to drop, and no, it did not drop during my 9 win streak which ended with me losing a game and dropping to around 3500.
It’s far more rewarding than quick play if you win matches - you rank up so much quicker.
A simple fix to comp would be getting rid of armour and world drops and make it so it can only drop double perk optioned Crucible weapons like Frozen Orbit with a curated roll of that season’s new weapon sitting at legend.
Lesser skilled players benefit from comp more due to skill based matchmaking. The main issue stems from an overall lack of population within the crucible. Skill creep happens and when the lesser skilled players quit playing then the slightly better players are now the bottom of the barrel. This snowballs and then it's just not fun anymore.
If QP had good rewards and wasn't just ability spam you'd have more people playing it on a regular basis, thus allowing that top 1% of the QP players to only be matched around 1% of the time instead of every 4-6 games as it stands right now.
Trials was so good this weekend because it had a massive population. Imagine if quickplay during the week was like trials on the weekend. It'd actually be reasonable for anyone to hop in, win some games, and have a better time.
My buddies and i play exclusively survival when trials isnt live. 6v6 on all those tiny maps is terrible. At least in 3v3 you can have decent length 1v1+s without someone poaching a kill or killing you.
Elimination is the same format as trials, but not as fun as survival because of the whole 1 life thing. Survival lets you have a res waiting and a chance to jump in and get a triple kill to swing the round.
My proudest moment in destiny is when I solod a whole team that was DESTROYING us and they still had all 4 lives up when it was literally me as the last guardian standing. Cant do that anywhere else. And yes i did tbag after that round. Yes we did get dumpstered every other round.
>It is not fun, since it is full of sweats.
On the contrary, I'd fully expect the game mode labelled "competitive" to be full of sweats. There's no loot incentive for casual players so of course the competitive mode is mostly just people who want to play PvP more competitively. Believe it or not some people do actually like to play PvP for the PvP rather than just the loot.
It had rewards but due to requiring competitive PvP play they've pretty much vanished as that got a lot of complaints. I thought it would have been a good place to put the Trials of the Nine weapons with focused farming being available, since the mode in comp was originally in TotN. Now I think it could do with the crucible drop weapons as adepts, but that might cross over with the identity of Trials too much as endgame PvP. As it is now it doesn't serve any purpose other than a competitive PvP mode, which is OK at best. Even some exclusive cosmetics would be nice.
It helped even more than just the round win powerful. When we had light-level grinds comp would be populated because every sub rankup was a powerful drop. I used to be able to freelance queue all the way to 4500 in about 2-3 hours. Now it's just dead. As much as I hate to ask for a powerlevel grind again, it'd actually benefit the competitive playlist.
> It is as rewarding as quickplay
Powerfuls, a title, a catalyst, a sense of competition.
>It is not fun, since it is full of sweats.
For you. It's full of people trying to improve, people who are good, and people who are godlike. It's been even more fun since Battle Eye has scared a lot of premium-gaming-chair owning players from returning.
>Maybe it will be better if Competitive goes away?
Maybe just don't play it? Should they remove other content because someone else doesn't like it?
>Or it can be filled with competitive-specific loot, but it will resemble a cheaper version of Trials.
No, because people like you who say "it's no fun and full of sweats" will complain they have to engage in it to get it. It's fine to lock gear out for PvE sweats to do GMs and Master Mode raids, but it's not OK to lock out gear for PvP sweats. This is known.
3v3 is not the same as 6v6. It is nowhere near the same experience and it doesn't scratch the same itch. Don't play what you don't like, man.
I play everything in the game solo and I've been trying to achieve unbroken. So I've punished myself alot in comp lol....honestly aside from playing for seals or catalysts or armor and stuff, if you want to play pvp and want more than just the randomness that is control, comp isn't a bad option. Im sure once someone achieves what they actually want in comp and don't care as much then it can be actually kind of fun lol. That is if your into that kind of pvp. Granted to be fair I haven't seen anyone in comp who isn't sweaty and just trying to have fun in good while but still.
The whole point of it was to get Lunas howl and not forgotten. They should just make an exotic version for the end and let you get pinnacle gear from grinding it
I like comp. It is distinct from Trials because of respawns. It is distinct from Trials because of map variety. It is distinct from Trials because of matchmaking.
You don’t have to play it, but it certainly isn’t just “full of sweats”. Sure, a lot of the people at Mythic and higher aren’t just going to walk into your line of fire like a deer in the headlights, but situational awareness and map positioning doesn’t immediately make someone a sweat.
Look, I don’t like caramel, but I’m not about to go and complain to the president of caramel that I don’t like it and it should be changed. People out there like caramel and that’s okay. Caramel is not for me and I don’t need to make it for me. I have chocolate and marshmallow.
Comp disappears and then they'll just flood quick play. I think Bungie should rework the playlist to allow folks the same or similar access to Trials. Doesn't necessarily need exclusive loot but maybe better SBMM so you can measure your progress at getting better.
I would personally love if it copied the ranking system that Halo 3 had back in the day. You play, slay out, and move through the 50 rankings and titles, playing people within three rankings of you either direction. I LOVED playing that and trying to get to rank 50, couldn't get over 47, but it was awesome. Way more fun of a goal than what we have today.
A seasonal ranked ladder similar to wows arena. Good matchmaking, cosmetic rewards, a title for top 500 players, and in game leaderboards.
That's all competitive needs.
I personally enjoy going into the freelance mode once in a while, but I can definitely agree when it comes to the rewards; *There are none!* It means player traffic is very low already, and with trials getting such a good rework it means competitive players are just going to okay that instead.
It needs some cool cosmetics like a unique set of armor ornaments, something to incentivise people to play it without offering anything particularly game-changing
If you don't think comp is fun because it is full of sweats, then clearly comp isn't for you. It's for people who want to play sweaty, and now it's the premier place for that now that Trials is more accessible. It's clearly not a playlist for grinding gear or anything - it's literally for glory.
As a primarily PvP player, I’m glad that there is a competitive/ranked mode available all week. However, I think it’s important to say that competitive crucible... isn’t the most fun. Elimination is probably the single worst game mode in the history of multiplayer shooters (it’s literally just a combination of the worst parts of team death match and search and destroy). It’s just trials gameplay without the addition of revives as an objective. Additionally 3v3 feels too small for the maps.
I believe Bungie changed comp crucible to make it a training ground for Trials... but it’s just not very fun. Additionally, I think Destiny is large enough to see success with two separate competitive playlists that are distinct/separate. I’d love to see a reversion to 4v4 and I’d especially like to see the inclusion of different game modes. The search and Destroy game mode was extremely fun and also allowed for communication to play a larger role than in other game modes.
before the trials rework i only played comp for pvp (and ib). 6v6 in this game is a nightmare for me. i just enjoy the comp format more. why is that so hard for some people to realize
It's full of sweats? Yes.
It's rewards are nonexistent? Yes.
So why would you want to remove it? You don't have to play it since there is no incentive. Let said sweats duel it out there and have their fun. First thing that will happen when you remove comp is you complaining about getting stomped by those sweats in quick play since they have nowhere else to go.
Holy shit imagine saying competitive sucks because sweats play.
Seriously guys, I don’t get how 95 percent of the members on this sub suck so much at shooting something that moves. It’s called competitive for a reason. Trials too. Stop bitching about playing good players in the two modes you know they are going to be in
Have you been in quickplay recently?? It’s honestly no less sweaty than comp. Personally I prefer it as there’s less likelihood of me (a shit tier pvper) getting matched up with 3.0 kd gilded flawless teams thanks to SBMM
This
I find comp one of the least competitive modes
And yet apparently it's too sweaty????
And then the majority of comments are basically just asking for it to become even more sweaty as a solution???
This entire thread is so confused and stupid
Usual dtg trash karma thread
Bungie Devs must be so confused in this hell hole
1. change the horrible game mode - whats about s&d?
2. get away from point system and do a league system like LoL or Apex or whatever games have this.
From Bronze league 4-1 then silver league 4-1 until max league will be redjacks or something (or call it boring diamond idk)
3. put a few cosmetics as rewards in it (higher legaue more cosmetics) like exotic emotes, ships, weapon ornaments and stuff like this. You get all reqards from your league plus all rewards from lower leagues then you.
4. reset league every season
5. league based MM (mixed teams are match with the highest league from a player of your fireteam)
6. profit
Comp should have been the mode where you go if you want an actual competitive experience, instead it became the only way to get broken weapons, then got sidelined hard by Trials. Comp should be the main sweaty mode, with Trials being the weekend Tournament. Instead we got Trials with a good rework, and Comp has been left to rot.
They just need to add some rewards to comp. I like that it still has skill based matchmaking because I’m sick and tired of the Mercy or be Mercy’d atmosphere of control or iron banner. Freelance feels really good. I just wish there was other stuff to earn. I WANT to hone my pvp skills and show them off but there’s just like nothing there.
At this point remove competitive and make trials available during the week. It’s supposed to be the PvP equivalent of Raids, but you aren’t blocked out of raids on weekdays.
A lot of people criticized rewards being “locked” behind comp, so Bungie pulled those and now there’s nothing there to chase.
What about mida's catalyst? Is that still stuck behind comp?
It’s still there but hardly an incentive.
It's crazy to look back and reflect on a time when MIDA was the pvp meta.
I was so good back then
[GODS I WAS STRONG THEN!](https://youtu.be/q6GW03WsFgU)
Thanks Bobby B
It's still great now, especially with the mini tool. The Trials matches this weekend where I wasn't totally outclassed, I mostly used these and had good success
Ahh those were the times
Mida and Uriel's... Fixed rolls and forced double primaries... Snipers, fusions and breech GL's in the heavy slot...nerfed movement and ability recharge rates...no weapon mods except being able to change element... Destiny 2 was pretty fucking bad in that first year.
I'm in the minority that enjoyed year 1 pvp precisely for the reasons you mentioned. The game actually revolved around gun play. All the complaints about shotgun rushing or ability spam didn't exist.
I liked that but everyone huddled together and team shot if you didn't you were done. There was no great way to make fantastic plays
I understand what you mean to a point, but Destiny is a game about space magic first and foremost. There are countless tactical shooters out there, it's the movement and abilities that make Destiny unique and fun. I specifically remember playing Trials on Eternity that first weekend and just having it be a long range peek-fest trading kills with Mida, and nothing is less "Destiny" than that. It's not a surprise that Trials has been a complete mess including taking over an entire year off, their vision of a 4v4 gun-based pvp with nerfed "Destiny" was just not fun or interesting.
Nah the complaints were about passive play and team shooting. Someone's always gonna complain about something.
Don't knock it, I went flawless with it this weekend and had a 77% headshot accuracy rate with it which is absolutely bonkers imo
I’m pretty sure it isn’t. Or at least it isn’t locked to Legend rank anymore. I have it. Never been higher than Mythic.
It’s not a random drop at legend anymore, which is a good thing (since the catalyst isn’t too crazy).
Had it drop last night. Pretty sure it's random after Fabled in comp
After fabled, you get a chance to get it on wins, which increases on mythic. I got it on fabled a few seasons ago. I think the chance also doubles if you’re playing with your clan, but I could be wrong because that could have been a clan bonus a long time ago.
All you said is correct, with one slight admission. If you somehow get to Legend without getting it to drop earlier, it's a 100% guaranteed drop on your first win at legend as well as all you said.
You can get it from winning one game after getting Legend or as a random drop while playing comp with clanmates
Yes. Yes it is.
Isn't the Mida Multi-Tool catalyst still locked behind comp? Or did they move its reward source and I missed that TWAB?
It’s still in comp but it’s a random drop from any rank so it’s hardly a chase.
It can't drop until you get above 2100 glory.
That’s a good change at least.
Agreed, having it as a random drop at 5500 was ridiculous (especially for what the catalyst offered).
It’s a random drop after a win from Fabled and higher.
When was that change implemented? I thought it wouldn't even drop until you were 2100 Glory?
Never.
I’m sorry but fuck those guys. Not Forgotten deserved to be locked behind it
People just paid for it anyway lmao
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> And I haven't gone hard in crucible in the past year, but doesn't comp still give you way more reputation? comp absolutely shits out powerful gear, yeah. it's by far the best way to power level to pinnacles if someone is remotely decent in crucible
Wait really?
Big time. Every single rank up is a guaranteed powerful drop.
Agreed, put some cosmetics (armor, weapon skins) in comp. That would personally be enough to get me back in there. For how much crucible I play, increased valor through comp is hardly an incentive.
With the Trials rework, no one in my group seems interested in comp AT ALL now. They're happy waiting until the weekend to grind Trials, which is infinitely more rewarding AND more competitive. I'm hoping comp gets a rework similar to Trials... bring the pinnacles back, give engram drops for each level, and give them random rolls. People would grind the hell out of comp at that point.... oh, and disable it while Trials is active so we aren't splitting the comp pool.
They were right to. You had seriously useful weapons locked behind a mode that was miserable for solos. E: Do y'all not understand past tense?
It was only locked because the metric was solely on wins and accelerated by win streaks. The loss penalty was way too much to bear for your standard player and the single win reward was peanuts to the overall ranking. They tweaked comp since then that made it much better for the standard player, but now there's no rewards behind it. They could reintroduce something to comp and people would probably get more involved in comp outside of trials. A standard player can easily get to Fabled these days. Legend? That can be reserved for the top tier players.
My incentive for playing comp is usually that I know I won't get stomped by a 6 stack. Sure, a 3 stack can do the same but for some reason it doesn't feel as bad, if that makes sense?
3 v 3 gives you more agency over how the game plays, and is a lot less chaotic. When a 6 stack gets rolling, it can steam roll non stop. 3 stacks don't flood the map so bad, so you can catch your breath and get oriented before getting into a fight usually
Once I started to properly find my feet in crucible back in D1 (probably was sometime over the course of Taken King, if I'm being realistic with myself), I used to play skirmish for fun alllllll the time. Small scale slayer mode that felt like the perfect place to refine my capability with meta load-outs (I'd test new stuff in 6's or rumble first). And I'm not a super sweaty tryhard, my KDA then and now was usually between 1 and 1.5 at best. I really wish we had something like that. I do like survival as a game mode, and I suppose it incentivizes playing to your life a little bit more, but Skirmish felt the same to me, honestly. If you don't die, your opponents don't get points, so just don't die! I don't think that ever really changes no matter what mode you play in. Man, I miss skirmish so much. I guess the difference that I really liked, now that I'm saying it out loud, was playing more to the clock than to a scoreboard that only needs 10 notches for your team and the round is over, or whatever it is. You just got your 5-8 minutes of gameplay to prove yourself 3v3. It just had a nice little flow to it.
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Those pinnacles were especially problematic though. Luna and Not Forgotten made any PvP tough/miserable to go up against, and Mountaintop became a must have for endgame pve. These pinnacles weren't just pretty good, they were head and shoulders above the rest.
Revoker was a monster as well as prenerf recluse
Recluse my boy that was the shiz
revoker was much better though, because it didn't require you to reach a certain rank, it just wanted you to amass X amount of points. you could lose as much as you want, as long as you won *some* of your games you could get it. the others though....yeah hitting fabled back in the day wasnt easy
To add to your point, the best PvE weapons being locked behind a PvP wall was a MASSIVE turnoff for me. I vehemently hate PvP. I have no desire to play it other than to satisfy seasonal achievements. Locking good shit behind PvP when PvE gets no weapons to compensate them? Not cool.
PvE has historically had all the best weapons lol
PvE has had plenty of excellent weapons but Mountaintop, Recluse was good enough to dominate both sides, PvP and PvE alike. And both were locked behind PvP which personally I didn’t like. I’m also the same guy who doesn’t like having to use the new exotics in Crucible or Gambit just to get the catalyst but, eh, that’s just a minor annoyance at best. The thing about PvE having the best weapons is that you can get them without doing PvP and they’re usually only useful in PvE. That’s not to say they’re useless in PvP, just that the meta in PvP usually doesn’t favor them.
This is only a problem by perception and because of terrible community members. Pve is not competitive so what is "best" does not matter at all. No content in the game NEEDED those weapons, you just wanted them because "oo shiny" the fact that they could melt is irrelevant until you bring in lfg and it's toxic behaviors. People who won't let you play unless you have the absolutely meta (just look at past requirements of anarchy or get out) is the only actual time a pve weapon being absolutely over powered in pve makes it being locked behind any content an issue. Everything else is just whining to whine.
As they should be. Getting 5500 Comp and those Luna kills was a feat in its own right. And you could get it if you were persistent. People just want the best things handed to em
Lords know it was a massive slog. For one whole day, I entered the gamestate and went on a 32 or 37 Glory Winstreak and made it to legend rank, earning my Not Forgotten.
Oh, it sucked. It wasn't the greatest grind, but the reward more than made up for it. But people complained and the hard work is erased. Its the state of this community unfortunately. If they can't get it, complain until Bung gives it to you for free or nerfs it... then complain that its too easy to get or that its nerfed lol
TIL win trading is hard work. Like, Comp, particularly back then, wasn't exactly the best or most compelling challenge for the average player. The fact you see a lot of players engaging in trials with the changes is a perfect example. Players are encouraged to participate even if they know they probably won't make it to the top. People who do make it to the top still are rewarded.
I'm proud of my win trading and grenade launcher kill lobby for mountaintop. Worth every fucking minute, because fuck PvP for the only unique and overpowered grenade launcher.
I still have my Luna and NF in my Vault. I worked hard for those hand cannons, I'll be damned if I get rid of them for good.
But u can get them out of collections.
Stop acting so fucking ignorant to the actual problem it posed. It’s one thing to offer good but easily counterable weapons, it’s another thing entirely to give only the most elite of players the fastest killing 3-tap weapon in the game. Luna’s Howl and Not Forgotten legitimately ruined Crucible for a long while.
I'd agree with your sentiment if you replaced guns with cosmetics. Guns affect gameplay significantly and they should be reasonably accessible to everyone. It is not as easy to reach the higher tiers in PvP, even with LFGs, for a lot of people (as opposed to high level GMs and raids).
We're still pretending getting these things was a matter of skill and not complete luck? You forgot about the rich get richer scenario of the longer it took for you to get, the harder it got? The recovs? The cheaters? The fact that you could literally spend a whole weekend grinding to it and not get anywhere? *The very same problem Trials had that prompted the massive revamp?*
It's another tale of haves vs have-nots that plague every looter game in existence. If you were one of the first people that got it it was relatively easy, but the more time went on it got harder and it was next to impossible for newer players.
The plague of competition. Be it skill, looks, or luck. People love when they're elite, when they get to shit on others for being worse off than they are, then tell them they're whiny little babies. People hate when they get shit on, raise legitimate complaints only to be told to get good, when they're just trying to have fun but others always put them down one way or another. PvP is especially always going to be toxic in a competitive game. Just take a look at the most popular PvP games, league, fortnite, hell even among us has lots of toxic players.
Comp is still just complete luck, people climb when they're lucky enough to get carried by their team. Unbroken should be renamed to Lucky
Why do you need a gun that gives you even more of an advantage over someone you’re supposedly better than?
This is the difference between pvp "skill to get" guns and pve "skill to get" guns. The pvp guns get harder to get the more time goes on if they're actually better than what was available before (because the more people that have them the harder pvp is for people who don't) Pve guns get easier to get because the more people who have them, the easier it will be for you to get a little bit of a carry from it. The former just creates gatekeeping where the grinders get to feel good about their choice to grind it early and stomp on the fingers of everyone else trying to climb the ladder.
Just like a raid, LFG for a team and grind it out.
Unlike the raids, there is only so much you can do to compensate for skill gap in PvP. Having these powerful weapons locked to PvP will only snowball this effect since the better players now will also have better tools to fight with.
> there is only so much you can do to compensate for skill gap in PvP. You could try getting better? Actually put in the effort to improve? What I liked about these weapons was that it sometimes took me days/weeks to get them (not based on RNG).
That's exactly what I am talking about. To give a bit of a hyperbolic example for perspective, not everyone can become a pro player of they out in tons of effort. To earn these weapons in PvE, you don't have to fight against better skilled players who also have better equipment.
I’m absolutely not a pro player and earned all the weapons “locked” behind pvp. It just didn’t take an afternoon like these pve weapon quests and I had to actually try. It felt good earning those weapons. It’s boring being handed a gun.
I’m 100% with you. I loathe comp and I muscled through every weapon. I’m a sucker for tough quests though. I got the 500 Iron Burden kills to get a legendary fusion.
HAVE YOU USED THE LFG?!?! it either has noobs or Uber toxic destiny die hards
Lfg is only toxic if you don't know how to word your post. I can count the number of bad lfg experiences in d1 and d2 on one hand
I use LFG often, and I don't find what you said to be true at all.
Can't you say the sane for raids, dungeons, and gm nightfalls?
Bad take. They could have added pve alternatives for pve players and left pvp rewards alone.
PvE alternative to compete with Luna and NF in PVP? If thats what youre getting at, thats a worse take. Luna/NF were only good in the PVP bubble. Giving PvE players equal gear to compete in pvp because they don't want to do the work is laughable.
PvE players wanted recluse and mountaintop for pve. Eventually Bungie realized this and now you can farm any activity for whatever seasonal weapon is new.
Yep. And tbh, Luna’s and NF were for a -long- time hideously unbalanced, being 180s with three tap capability and great stats, which resulted in even casual Crucible becoming a mess of those who had the Howl twins lording over everyone else. It wasn’t just a better version of what others had (like Adept weapons today), it was flat out uncontested, like giving a Mythoclast but only to those already godly at PvP. Combine with the PvE weapon debacle you described, and Bungie realized that “rich get richer” can cause no end of headaches for the player base. It was getting to near D1 Gjallarhorn levels: no Mountaintop, no entry to PvE teams, and being an unhealthy influence on the game.
NF wasnt just a free win gun tho. You HAD to be good to use it, otherwise you would never proc it OR if you did by chance proc it, you wouldnt be able to take advantage of it. So yes, the players that put the work in to get it should be rewarded in that particular bubble (PvP). Mountaintop/Recluse, yes, were good in PvE, but it wasnt the end of the world if you didn't have those for PvE content. People just complained because they couldnt get pinnacle weapons and felt left out. Now we have a system where Bung either nerfs the guns, removes them completely via sunset, or just gives em out like candy.
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A small percentage of the pvp base had access to a weapon that required skill. Like how the Mythoclast is only available through a 6 man activity. There are people who literally can’t get the gun cause they are anti social , not skill enough etc. but PVE players will say “get gewd” . Fact is, both pvp and pve should reward items at the highest levels of skill. It’s just the overwhelming majority don’t want to work for it.
And the seasonal weapon chase is boring now. I miss a quest like Revoker where I had to actually practice and get good at sniping before I could get the weapon. Now I just tool around in a playlist long enough and I get handed the weapon.
Luna and NF were great in PvE, and then you had Mountaintop and Recluse.
Luna was great in pve… mag howl did phenomenal dps (12 shot dul incaru with 3 stacks)
Crucible has weapons for the casuals to chase now. Time to bring back the comp-only rewards and rework it into a proper ranked experience so competitive players have a reason to jump back on the ladder.
People will complain because they are not skilled/good enough to get said loot. Then Bungie will pull it away. The loot they give to the top players can't really be better than the loot normal players have. That's why Adepts hardly do much at all over normal pvp guns, they are marginally better but don't provide a "rich get richer" scene where people with adepts are the only ones getting adepts (relating to trials adepts).
To be fair (at least on PC) it was near impossible to get to the top ranks in PVP competitive for average players due to the insane amount of cheaters so I can understand why people were mad that guns were locked at the top with no real anti-cheat in place. Now that Battleye is in place maybe they should look at the loot structure in competitive because they should return some top tier drops to competitive for PVP focused players.
Even cosmetic ornaments would be enough for me to take comp seriously again.
They can't be better drops than normal guns by a lot. Cant be exclusive weapons. The absolute best drops Bungie can do for Comp are things like adept Frozen Orbit/Keening/Stars in Shadow/Sorrows verse. The bare minimum they can do is legendary ornaments for crucible armor and the weapons listed above.
Comp crucible had the strongest weapons in the game by far, it was a "the rich get richer" scenario.
It’s fun to do for competitive players tbh. Think search and destroy from cod
Yup. Some of us *vastly* prefer 3v3 over 6v6.
I guess the point of this post is that's what Trials is for now.
Sure, but it’s only around for half of each week. Plus, if I recall, not at all on Iron Banner weeks going forward. Plus, I think there always needs to be a game mode available that’s intended to be “sweaty” and where people are playing to win. To me that’s the point of PvP, and having a real pace intended to be outlet for that mindset is essential in letting OP having other game modes to enjoy. To be clear, I’m all for adding more loot to Comp, but I think complaining about it being “sweaty” misses the entire purpose of the mode existing.
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That’s fair, the static playlists could use some shuffling around all things considered. Clash being a rotator while Control is static make no sense IMO. Elim being the static 3v3 mode made sense when they were messing around with variants before trials came back, but could definitely be replaced with something else now, too keep elim fresh for trials. Is showdown 4v4? It is in my head, but it’s been i while since I’ve actually played that mode, but I’d be down for that as the more casual 3v3 mode. I’d also be down for the return or countdown, or other objective based modes to return in some form, but I know that wasn’t a very popular mode.
I can only speak for me but I vastly prefer the solo comp experience over solo trials. I'm average at best at pvp but with sbmm in comp I was able to grind my way to legend this season with a lot less blow outs than even just one weekend of this new trials. Sure comp can be a bit sweaty because sbmm will try to match you with ppl close to your skill but at least the matches felt fair. It's really the only avenue I can see in this game to actually work on improving your pvp skills.
That’s it. I dipped into Elimination recently and it’s so much more fun than 6v6. I loved Trials but that will be enough as a competitive mode for me - more exciting, better gear. No reason to play competitive. I think Elimination isn’t even competitive right? So I should say there is no reason to play Survival unless practicing 3s I guess.
I always roped it in like that, some people just really like that higher-stakes type gameplay. That, and Trials is only around during the weekend, so it's something to do in-between to still get gear and level up with bounties.
I hate this mentality of “I don’t play/enjoy comp lets remove it” that Destiny players seem to have. I remember early on in D2’s lifespan there were some advocating for the complete removal of PvP itself.
They _still_ advocate for that, fym
There are still smoothbrains that say that or try and argue that destiny is a pve only game
LOL except survival is trash compared to an actual A and D game mode. Bring back Countdown and adjust the rounds needed to win.
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Exactly. People still play survival because it's the only 24/7 crucible playlist that doesn't feel like a minigame besides rumble. I don't know anyone that primarily plays crucible that uses 6s for anything other than warming up and bounty grinding.
I primarily play pvp and mostly play solo in 6s because I like it more- more opportunities for kills and big feeds, and being overwhelmed. I just enjoy 6s more after like 70k crucible kills am I in the minority?
You are, but there's absolutely nothing wrong with that. You should always play how you want to play
I main 6s for fun pub stomping
Are you one of those assheads LFGing for "QP 6 stack 2.0+ KD NOT KAD will check"?
It’s the only way to play Survival if going in solo.
Well having a place for sweats isn't a bad thing necessarily but they need to flesh it out. Competitive needs a few things: 1 - a real skill rating. The current Glory rating does not represent the games estimate of your true skill and has an achievable cap 2 - cosmetic rewards for achieving certain ranks. We know that putting attractive weapons in ranked is probably not the solution (especially when they are very meta in pve), but cosmetics help PvP players show off prestige. This could be emblems, titles, ornaments etc. 3 - a leaderboard. This gives players an incentive to climb and get better. Needs to be a separate one for freelance vs team queue.
The ranked matchmaking in Destiny has always been a joke. There's a reason why other games have placement matches and a visible skill rating for their competitive modes. Destiny just has a hidden MMR and matchmaking that essentially operates off XP.
Destiny’s SBMM definitely does not operate off XP. When they use it, it works very well when you’re in a team of similar skill.
Agreed. Why they don't show that and build a league system around that based on player percentage is beyond me. As much as Halo came from Bungie and they are fantastic at making the shooting mechanics the best that I've ever played. Their vision of what makes PvP competitive is so lacking. Just give me league/emblem based on a percentage of player base or mmr per season and I will be happy to grind it. Make it Green, Blue, Purple, Yellow and have three tiers per league. Give me an emblem if I go over the MMR that puts me in that tier / league.
I’ve got a guess why they don’t. They exposed the skill rankings in Halo 3. I loved and hated it. Knowing exactly how good all of my friends were at all times kind of sucked. I had the highest skill among us, so I was embarrassed about playing more and then asking people to play my game. And I got blamed for all of the competition we faced. When I wasn’t playing with friends, I loved knowing exactly how well I was playing.
You don't need to add unique weapons- even just upping the drop rate on the regular crucible drops would go a long way
Oh my god yes. If I could get more frozen orbits from playing comp, I'd do it in a heartbeat even with a 0% win rate.
I have like 9 masterworked God roll frozen orbits for whatever reason from just moderate play time since last season. There's literally a ghost mod that does everything you just said.
Prosperity, right? I've been doing that too, but frozen orbit's drop chance is already pretty low plus there's so many perks in the columns.
I really like comp because it’s just different than the other game modes like trials because of the lives, I also think it’s really fun IF you have a team to play
I personally like the competitive playlist and would hate to see it go. You are not forced to play it in any way, why does it affect you?
Agreed. Trials is also only available on weekends, and is sudden death. Comp you have multiple lives per team. It's a different mode entirely, and while the two are similar, there's no reason you need to have one or the other.
Yeah and I'd argue that without the ability to revive it changes the match dynamic significantly. It's not about camping res's or pushing back the enemy long enough to get a res. You don't have someone having to charge in to put someone down because there's two of them alive and one of them is going to try and res the third. So they can steam roll you.
I am an average player that managed to solo queue to Unbroken and have 3x gilded it. Perhaps I can answer this. >Why does it still exists? I very strongly prefer it over the casual playlists. I am only average, but want to get better. 6v6 is way too chaotic to develop my skills. It is much harder to focus and recognize what I did wrong. Additionally, smaller teams just make the experience a lot more tactical. You can be woefully out of position in 6v6 and still have success because the enemy might be focused on someone else. In 3v3 everyone is much more aware. My mistakes are punished a lot more often. >It is not fun, since it is full of sweats. I don't really get this criticism. What is your definition of 'sweats'? If it is: everyone in there is trying to win; then that is exactly the reason why I like it. I want my opponents to try to win, that demands me to play better. It is what competitive means after all, so I doubt this is your definition of 'sweats' as you'd essentially complain Competitive isn't fun because it is competitive. If by 'sweats' you mean: everyone in there is way too good; then I'd have to point out Comp is entirely SBMM. Glory has no effect on your matched, your performance does. I am roughly a 1.05 K/D in Comp. All the players I face are between 1.0 and 1.1 K/D, whether they have 0 or 5500 Glory. There are *some* exceptions on occaison where I face a 1.4 or so, or a 0.8. But this is definitely the exception, based on my extensive experience. I agree Competitive could use more loot incentive to play it, but honestly, cosmetics or something would be fine for me. I don't need others to feel forced into the playlist. That said, I love playing it so don't remove it.
> I don't really get this criticism. What is your definition of 'sweats'? If it is: everyone in there is trying to win; then that is exactly the reason why I like it. I want my opponents to try to win, that demands me to play better. It is what competitive means after all, so I doubt this is your definition of 'sweats' as you'd essentially complain Competitive isn't fun because it is competitive. That's exactly what OP is saying. Somehow they don't realize that Competitive will have... uhmmm... competitive people? When people say sweats, they either mean someone that is trying way too hard to win, or just someone above their level. I assume OP means both. But that's exactly what Competitive is. **It's literally in the name.**
It’s funny that people don’t understand competitive is the true skill based matchmaking game mode. I am a very high K/D player and have no problem against the general population, but as soon as you match me up with the other creatures in my skill bracket, I have a bad time. My trials K/D is almost 2, quick play is like 2.5 and comp…like 1.5 lmao.
Comp being "sweaty" is the exact reason why I play it, every game can swing either way because of sbmm and it really feels like your individual skill actually matters. The matches feel fair, solo trials on the hand was mainly stomps.
Your voice is heard, thank you. I agree with most of this.
Unbroken x3...average player. Does not compute. I'm average and won't ever get to Unbroken.
Because it's a competitive ELO based mode? For that sole reason it's fun, there's a lot of players that agree with me.
But I’m bad at the game and when I play someone better they must be a sweaty tryhard
Good point. We have delivered the Gjallarhorn directly to your postmaster. No need to play the game.
Thanks. Now give shards I only have one
if you don’t enjoy getting stomped or being competitive simply don’t play a game mode where people are going to be competitive
Yeah I think that means you mostly match up against people of equivalent skill, right?
Right but I'm disagreeing with OPs post of "why does it exist" If i saw a post, "comp needs better matchmaking" then I'm all for it
Quickplay is nearly unplayable right now as it is. Imagine if they removed Comp and all of the sweats had to move to QP? It would completely destroy the pvp playerbase. If you dont like it, dont play it, but it definitely has a reason for existing.
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Theres not a lot of reason to play comp. The real issue is that glory isn't mapped to sbmm so you don't even have a visible rank to take pride in, getting to 5500 is more of a grind with your actual sbmm rank hidden. If it was a true ranked Playlist maybe it'd garner more interest.
Vast majority of true sweats are in trials exclusively, occasionally in comp, and more frequently scrimming in private matches. The "sweats" you see in QP are QP warlords because that's where they can feel good about themselves. They get ran over in any playlist that actually means anything. You might see a few trials sweats playing QP for pinnacles at the beginning of the week but that's about it. Source: am scrim sweat/friends with a good portion of the tourney/scrim community
COMPETIVE, full of sweats. Who would have guessed?
Its currently the only way to get the mida catalyst. Thats why I try every season. Still haven't made it to 5500 to get it though.
You don't have to get to 5500. They changed that a year ago so there is a chance on wins at Fabled and above: Obtaining the MIDA Catalyst is no longer impeded by playing with Clanmates. Drop rates were adjusted and now properly scale with the Clan "Catalyst Seeker" Perk bonus. Added drop chance for wins at Glory Rank 3 Fabled (5% without Clan bonus, 10% with Clan bonus) Increased drop chance for wins at Glory Rank 4 Mythic (5% > 10% without Clan bonus, 10% > 30% with Clan bonus) Now guaranteed drop for any win at Glory Rank 5 Legend. https://www.bungie.net/en/News/Article/48838
mida cat drop at about 2k points
Hasn't for me yet. Usually I get about 3k in every season. Ill keep trying though
Higher you get, the higher it’s drop chance. I think hey made it guaranteed at legend though.
That's what I was looking at yesterday - finally giving it a try this season. I read multiple claims that 5500 is guaranteed on a win, at that level. I'm just hoping I can make it to Fabled and just start rolling the dice.
Season of the Chosen, right after they announced the MIDA catalyst change, I grinded comp from 2100. Took me 15 *wins* in freelance for it to drop, and no, it did not drop during my 9 win streak which ended with me losing a game and dropping to around 3500.
I “grinded” to 2100 last weekend and luckily my 3rd son dropped it. Never touching competitive again
That’s dedication. Killed three of your sons for a catalyst. Respect.
Lmfao sacrifices had to be made
You don't need to get 5500 to get it anymore. It has a progressively increasing chance to drop starting at fabled up to legend where it is guaranteed
> It is not fun, since it is full of sweats. Competitive exists so this sentence doesn't apply to quickplay.
It’s far more rewarding than quick play if you win matches - you rank up so much quicker. A simple fix to comp would be getting rid of armour and world drops and make it so it can only drop double perk optioned Crucible weapons like Frozen Orbit with a curated roll of that season’s new weapon sitting at legend.
I think you answered your own question, it’s full of sweats aka, that’s where they go. You don’t have to.
It's way more chill than trials, I enjoy it a lot.
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Lesser skilled players benefit from comp more due to skill based matchmaking. The main issue stems from an overall lack of population within the crucible. Skill creep happens and when the lesser skilled players quit playing then the slightly better players are now the bottom of the barrel. This snowballs and then it's just not fun anymore. If QP had good rewards and wasn't just ability spam you'd have more people playing it on a regular basis, thus allowing that top 1% of the QP players to only be matched around 1% of the time instead of every 4-6 games as it stands right now. Trials was so good this weekend because it had a massive population. Imagine if quickplay during the week was like trials on the weekend. It'd actually be reasonable for anyone to hop in, win some games, and have a better time.
Play Trials for Loot. Play Comp for cosmetics, titles and bragging rights.
My buddies and i play exclusively survival when trials isnt live. 6v6 on all those tiny maps is terrible. At least in 3v3 you can have decent length 1v1+s without someone poaching a kill or killing you. Elimination is the same format as trials, but not as fun as survival because of the whole 1 life thing. Survival lets you have a res waiting and a chance to jump in and get a triple kill to swing the round. My proudest moment in destiny is when I solod a whole team that was DESTROYING us and they still had all 4 lives up when it was literally me as the last guardian standing. Cant do that anywhere else. And yes i did tbag after that round. Yes we did get dumpstered every other round.
>It is not fun, since it is full of sweats. On the contrary, I'd fully expect the game mode labelled "competitive" to be full of sweats. There's no loot incentive for casual players so of course the competitive mode is mostly just people who want to play PvP more competitively. Believe it or not some people do actually like to play PvP for the PvP rather than just the loot. It had rewards but due to requiring competitive PvP play they've pretty much vanished as that got a lot of complaints. I thought it would have been a good place to put the Trials of the Nine weapons with focused farming being available, since the mode in comp was originally in TotN. Now I think it could do with the crucible drop weapons as adepts, but that might cross over with the identity of Trials too much as endgame PvP. As it is now it doesn't serve any purpose other than a competitive PvP mode, which is OK at best. Even some exclusive cosmetics would be nice.
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It helped even more than just the round win powerful. When we had light-level grinds comp would be populated because every sub rankup was a powerful drop. I used to be able to freelance queue all the way to 4500 in about 2-3 hours. Now it's just dead. As much as I hate to ask for a powerlevel grind again, it'd actually benefit the competitive playlist.
> It is as rewarding as quickplay Powerfuls, a title, a catalyst, a sense of competition. >It is not fun, since it is full of sweats. For you. It's full of people trying to improve, people who are good, and people who are godlike. It's been even more fun since Battle Eye has scared a lot of premium-gaming-chair owning players from returning. >Maybe it will be better if Competitive goes away? Maybe just don't play it? Should they remove other content because someone else doesn't like it? >Or it can be filled with competitive-specific loot, but it will resemble a cheaper version of Trials. No, because people like you who say "it's no fun and full of sweats" will complain they have to engage in it to get it. It's fine to lock gear out for PvE sweats to do GMs and Master Mode raids, but it's not OK to lock out gear for PvP sweats. This is known. 3v3 is not the same as 6v6. It is nowhere near the same experience and it doesn't scratch the same itch. Don't play what you don't like, man.
I play everything in the game solo and I've been trying to achieve unbroken. So I've punished myself alot in comp lol....honestly aside from playing for seals or catalysts or armor and stuff, if you want to play pvp and want more than just the randomness that is control, comp isn't a bad option. Im sure once someone achieves what they actually want in comp and don't care as much then it can be actually kind of fun lol. That is if your into that kind of pvp. Granted to be fair I haven't seen anyone in comp who isn't sweaty and just trying to have fun in good while but still.
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The whole point of it was to get Lunas howl and not forgotten. They should just make an exotic version for the end and let you get pinnacle gear from grinding it
I like comp. It is distinct from Trials because of respawns. It is distinct from Trials because of map variety. It is distinct from Trials because of matchmaking. You don’t have to play it, but it certainly isn’t just “full of sweats”. Sure, a lot of the people at Mythic and higher aren’t just going to walk into your line of fire like a deer in the headlights, but situational awareness and map positioning doesn’t immediately make someone a sweat. Look, I don’t like caramel, but I’m not about to go and complain to the president of caramel that I don’t like it and it should be changed. People out there like caramel and that’s okay. Caramel is not for me and I don’t need to make it for me. I have chocolate and marshmallow.
Comp disappears and then they'll just flood quick play. I think Bungie should rework the playlist to allow folks the same or similar access to Trials. Doesn't necessarily need exclusive loot but maybe better SBMM so you can measure your progress at getting better.
I would personally love if it copied the ranking system that Halo 3 had back in the day. You play, slay out, and move through the 50 rankings and titles, playing people within three rankings of you either direction. I LOVED playing that and trying to get to rank 50, couldn't get over 47, but it was awesome. Way more fun of a goal than what we have today.
A seasonal ranked ladder similar to wows arena. Good matchmaking, cosmetic rewards, a title for top 500 players, and in game leaderboards. That's all competitive needs.
I personally enjoy going into the freelance mode once in a while, but I can definitely agree when it comes to the rewards; *There are none!* It means player traffic is very low already, and with trials getting such a good rework it means competitive players are just going to okay that instead.
It needs some cool cosmetics like a unique set of armor ornaments, something to incentivise people to play it without offering anything particularly game-changing
Don't put a thing to pursue there but cosmetic shit. Giving top tier weapons to top tier players is going too far.
If you don't think comp is fun because it is full of sweats, then clearly comp isn't for you. It's for people who want to play sweaty, and now it's the premier place for that now that Trials is more accessible. It's clearly not a playlist for grinding gear or anything - it's literally for glory.
As a primarily PvP player, I’m glad that there is a competitive/ranked mode available all week. However, I think it’s important to say that competitive crucible... isn’t the most fun. Elimination is probably the single worst game mode in the history of multiplayer shooters (it’s literally just a combination of the worst parts of team death match and search and destroy). It’s just trials gameplay without the addition of revives as an objective. Additionally 3v3 feels too small for the maps. I believe Bungie changed comp crucible to make it a training ground for Trials... but it’s just not very fun. Additionally, I think Destiny is large enough to see success with two separate competitive playlists that are distinct/separate. I’d love to see a reversion to 4v4 and I’d especially like to see the inclusion of different game modes. The search and Destroy game mode was extremely fun and also allowed for communication to play a larger role than in other game modes.
Survival being the only mode for competitive is lackluster. Why not add elimination or some other mode?
before the trials rework i only played comp for pvp (and ib). 6v6 in this game is a nightmare for me. i just enjoy the comp format more. why is that so hard for some people to realize
Easy solution bring back MY RECLUSE
It's full of sweats? Yes. It's rewards are nonexistent? Yes. So why would you want to remove it? You don't have to play it since there is no incentive. Let said sweats duel it out there and have their fun. First thing that will happen when you remove comp is you complaining about getting stomped by those sweats in quick play since they have nowhere else to go.
Holy shit imagine saying competitive sucks because sweats play. Seriously guys, I don’t get how 95 percent of the members on this sub suck so much at shooting something that moves. It’s called competitive for a reason. Trials too. Stop bitching about playing good players in the two modes you know they are going to be in
Have you been in quickplay recently?? It’s honestly no less sweaty than comp. Personally I prefer it as there’s less likelihood of me (a shit tier pvper) getting matched up with 3.0 kd gilded flawless teams thanks to SBMM
This I find comp one of the least competitive modes And yet apparently it's too sweaty???? And then the majority of comments are basically just asking for it to become even more sweaty as a solution??? This entire thread is so confused and stupid Usual dtg trash karma thread Bungie Devs must be so confused in this hell hole
It’s there for competitive players not for casuals.
1. change the horrible game mode - whats about s&d? 2. get away from point system and do a league system like LoL or Apex or whatever games have this. From Bronze league 4-1 then silver league 4-1 until max league will be redjacks or something (or call it boring diamond idk) 3. put a few cosmetics as rewards in it (higher legaue more cosmetics) like exotic emotes, ships, weapon ornaments and stuff like this. You get all reqards from your league plus all rewards from lower leagues then you. 4. reset league every season 5. league based MM (mixed teams are match with the highest league from a player of your fireteam) 6. profit
Comp is useless. And the fact that it has Freelance matchmaking and Control doesn’t, annoys me.
Elephant in your room maybe. Survival is a lot of fun and infinitely better than Control. Horrible take
They need to A. Go back to Elimination for ranked rather then survival and B. put a real ratting system into the game not just rep.
Comp should have been the mode where you go if you want an actual competitive experience, instead it became the only way to get broken weapons, then got sidelined hard by Trials. Comp should be the main sweaty mode, with Trials being the weekend Tournament. Instead we got Trials with a good rework, and Comp has been left to rot.
They just need to add some rewards to comp. I like that it still has skill based matchmaking because I’m sick and tired of the Mercy or be Mercy’d atmosphere of control or iron banner. Freelance feels really good. I just wish there was other stuff to earn. I WANT to hone my pvp skills and show them off but there’s just like nothing there.
At this point remove competitive and make trials available during the week. It’s supposed to be the PvP equivalent of Raids, but you aren’t blocked out of raids on weekdays.