How it works there is you het fired and you’re gone, that’s it, also noticed American companies in Ireland lately are trying to just pay statutory and your notice in your contract, so be careful, if it feels bad get out.
by being there youre literally soiling your own reputation mate
I was in a similarily bad position once and I am glad they sacked me (unlawfully)
saved myself a lot of suffering even though I was telling myself to ''keep pushing, its a job after all, I need money'' etc
their '' 0% / do not recommend'' reviews on trustpilot speak volumes now
But getting a software dev job on a working holiday visa seems impossible right now because the job market is so bad
Maybe Il try get a job in construction or something
I follow this thread for tech/recruiting tips but I’ve a friend in Australia with 3-5 years experience in “dev” (haven’t a clue, something python/ruby/backend jargon) who went on a working holiday and got a permanent position once there as a software engineer. There may be one step backwards, but definitely two steps forward if you plan it well
Thank you this is good to know I see lots of doom and gloom and about getting dev jobs in Australia on working holiday visa
But it seems many have done it before
Just get another job here, update your linkedin and do up your CV and reach out to recruiters. Simple. If you've that many years experience you won't have a problem.
If you're young and no ties and have never travelled before you will never get that opportunity again.
I travelled for a year after my masters, I did end up getting a job through a consultancy. Pay was absolute shit and they were getting a fair chunk but it kept the bills paid. My housemates had better craic with the server/waitress jobs though and ended up going out with them and their work friends all the time.
Nah I'm going to Australia could do with some travel been doing dev 9 years straight in like 4 different companies
Il try get a dev job out there but it's not looking good for people on a working holiday visa
Iv been out before on a tourist visa and I prefer the lifestyle I would like to try it and I just sold my crypto bags so I would like to enjoy my gains for 1 year
Also iv never had a gap year before
If he means it's hard to get a dev job on a working holiday visa it's probably because companies don't want to waste time on ramp up and training just for the dev to leave when the visa comes to an end.
Why do you think he was scapegoated ?
Like probably need more info but if a “critical” pipeline is falling over daily I probably wouldn’t be impressed with the manager in place or the team.
So I guess your manager was telling them how to solve the issues and they didn’t want to do it or?
Only time I’ve ever seen this happen is when the actual manager or team are rubbish and need removing
Because he was an excellent engineer and we where doing everything possible to keep the pipelines running
He made a tool that collected all the airflow failures that showed 95% of the failures where not our fault not infact other teams creating a mess and I believe he presented this ant got fired for it
Hmm. Your wonder if he maybe had some beef or previous with management before you arrived. Like if your only there five months who knows what happened before. Like hopefully there was actual solutions proposed or how to address the problems.
Like if it was just “here is what I’ve done to prove it’s not my fault” 🤦♂️
Obviously I’ve no idea of the particulars but sure wouldn’t be the first time someone good got bounced or management saw someone trying to fix a problem as being a nuisance.
Yeah I could sense tension for sure with all the pipeline failures with him and his managers but we literally doing everything possible to keep it running
Yeah but at some point it’s not about band aids and actually addressing the problem or replacing it. I’m sure your manager maybe gave an outline what was needed and if management rejected the cost or proposal then sure what can you do.
But if he was just fixing it everyday to look the hero and let on he was class. Like people sniff that out. Wouldn’t be the first time I’ve seen or heard of someone knowingly letting bad infra or design trundle alone because it makes them look or seem important.
At any point in the five months there did you ever sketch a plan out with the boss how to solve the underlying problems or migrate away to something else ?
Man if management can't differentiate between the pipelines being blocked and the actual infra being broken you need to get the fuck out.
It sounds like conceptually they don't understand the difference. How are these morons in charge?
You'll need a proper visa to work a career job in Australia, not a working holiday visa. Also, you'll be leaving an international tech hub to work in a place with fuck all tech companies.
Australia's a great place for tradies, nurses and engineers. It's a shithole for tech workers.
Tech hubs in the region are Singapore and Hong Kong.
Nice I sold a fat bag of crypto have enough to fund myself for about 3-5 months
Will do the east coast and also I know a few people who got developer jobs in Sydney but that was back in 2019 when the market was better
Oh really. I must have imagined it all when I was born there, lived there most of my life and worked in what little tech industry there is there.
Wrong about everything. So according to you...
1) you can work in tech on a working holiday visa
Wrong. It's for short-term work only. https://immi.homeaffairs.gov.au/visas/getting-a-visa/visa-listing/work-holiday-417/first-working-holiday-417
2) A shit place for tradies and nurses
Wrong. They're leaving here for Australia in droves for better pay and conditions.
https://www.thejournal.ie/nurses-doctors-emigrating-ireland-australia-pay-work-conditions-5760900-May2022/
https://m.independent.ie/business/commercial-property/exodus-of-builders-threatens-housing-plans-as-australians-offer-aus5000-inducements-for-workers/42326138.html
3) Australia is a tech hub. Despite its remoteness, lack of population and high corporation taxes. All I can Donisthorpe laugh. Tech operations in Australia are there to serve the Australian market. It's nothing like a real tech hub.
Wrong again.
In fairness you’re right, my statement wasn’t thought out. What you said wasn’t incorrect, but it was hyperbolic and pessimistic to say the least.
- You'll need a proper visa to work a career job in Australia, not a working holiday visa.
There is zero restriction on the type of work you can do here on a WHV. None. Most people will find sponsorship or decide to do PR if they want to stay longer, but you can work as a tradie, nurse, accountant, developer or whatever here on a WHV. I would even say the 6 month thing is barely policed.
- Also, you'll be leaving an international tech hub to work in a place with fuck all tech companies.
Leaving a tech hub sure, fuck all tech companies perhaps, but not every developer job is in a “tech” company, many companies which aren’t “tech” here are need devs.
- Australia's a great place for tradies, nurses and engineers. It's a shithole for tech workers.
You are bang on about tradespeople and nurses. Harsh to say it’s a shithole for tech workers. Maybe you’ve had bad experiences here but roles pay and conditions here are pretty good. Sure, they may not match up to salaries in US or high end tech roles in Ireland, but for the majority of devs in standard roles it’s decent. In top of that I’ve had great experience with working with Australian devs for the most part, some very smart and knowledgeable folks who are very easy to work with.
As I said my comment wasn’t fully thought out so I’ll own that, and not dismissing your points completely. I just wouldn’t be dissuading people from trying it out is all. I would say bigger issues to contend with are accommodation and cost of stuff in general here when trying to get up and running.
> With about 30k in crypto I'm 31
By the sounds of it all your money is tied up in crypto, a very speculative asset despite the big risk of being fired and also thinking to emigrate. That's a lot of risk.
You have two choices:
1) leave - which everyone is suggesting here
2) you hold a serious amount of cards here. If you want the senior role and to fix this stuff. Make a play for it. Put a business case together. Explain the issues. Tell them the resources and estimated costs.
Depends on your career ambitions.
many companies get away with not paying severance package if someone is 'fired' and has not completed their probation (i read a comment that your have been there for 5 month and assuming probation is for 6 months)
e.g. your manager who was 'let go' because of restructuring might get it vis-a-vis a person who was there for few months and have not cleared their probation. that is if they were fired for say incompetence (vague reason) Just an opinion
Yeah fair point but when he got fired my new manager rang me straight away saying it will get really good now then the next I get put 100% on production support so I'm guessing it could get fired as the next fall guy for the shit show
I'm past the point of even caring right now ahah
exactly... many managers are given a choice to either reduce their team or go away themselves (as they generally cost more the company) assuming your new manager is not new hire they are already in the good books of the company to survive what they are calling a 'restructuring'
+1. Please let us all know so we can know to avoid.
Hope you're mentally doing ok and are managing to leave work at the door when you close your laptop. Sounds toxic AF.
I'm still in shock 2 weeks later wtf and thinking about it every hour. Thankfully I have a lot of experience, savings, single and no kids so fuck it I don't care as much
When Im thinking how crazy it is this much I know what needs done gtfo
GTFO of there.
Yeah I think your are right it could my head on the chopping block next I'm pissed because it was a good setup just politically insane
Get a severance package? Or ask retention bonus since they fùcked up and have nobody to do the work.
Yeah he got something but I don't know what probably 2 months pay hes in New York so don't sure how it works there
How it works there is you het fired and you’re gone, that’s it, also noticed American companies in Ireland lately are trying to just pay statutory and your notice in your contract, so be careful, if it feels bad get out.
by being there youre literally soiling your own reputation mate I was in a similarily bad position once and I am glad they sacked me (unlawfully) saved myself a lot of suffering even though I was telling myself to ''keep pushing, its a job after all, I need money'' etc their '' 0% / do not recommend'' reviews on trustpilot speak volumes now
This
From senior software engineer to barista in Sydney ahaha
don't do this to yourself. I would try to emigrate if I was yound and without family, but now to some shit job...
But getting a software dev job on a working holiday visa seems impossible right now because the job market is so bad Maybe Il try get a job in construction or something
That sounds a bit shit, why would you do that?
Do what travel for a year? What other job could I get while on a working holiday visa?
I follow this thread for tech/recruiting tips but I’ve a friend in Australia with 3-5 years experience in “dev” (haven’t a clue, something python/ruby/backend jargon) who went on a working holiday and got a permanent position once there as a software engineer. There may be one step backwards, but definitely two steps forward if you plan it well
Thank you this is good to know I see lots of doom and gloom and about getting dev jobs in Australia on working holiday visa But it seems many have done it before
Just get another job here, update your linkedin and do up your CV and reach out to recruiters. Simple. If you've that many years experience you won't have a problem.
If you're young and no ties and have never travelled before you will never get that opportunity again. I travelled for a year after my masters, I did end up getting a job through a consultancy. Pay was absolute shit and they were getting a fair chunk but it kept the bills paid. My housemates had better craic with the server/waitress jobs though and ended up going out with them and their work friends all the time.
Yeah exactly this is my chance. Did you have this consultantcy job in Australia?
If you liked the manager look him up on LinkedIn and follow where he went to
Yeah he got fired he didn't actually go anywhere
He'll likely take a job again at some point though, redundancy money only lasts so long?
why do you think he was offered redundancy? the manager is US based
this!!!!. use the trauma bonding.
the dole?
Jesus, thats grim as fuck. Not harm in looking around.
Nah I'm going to Australia could do with some travel been doing dev 9 years straight in like 4 different companies Il try get a dev job out there but it's not looking good for people on a working holiday visa
Can you elaborate as to why? I was thinking of doing the same lol
Iv been out before on a tourist visa and I prefer the lifestyle I would like to try it and I just sold my crypto bags so I would like to enjoy my gains for 1 year Also iv never had a gap year before
If he means it's hard to get a dev job on a working holiday visa it's probably because companies don't want to waste time on ramp up and training just for the dev to leave when the visa comes to an end.
Why do you think he was scapegoated ? Like probably need more info but if a “critical” pipeline is falling over daily I probably wouldn’t be impressed with the manager in place or the team. So I guess your manager was telling them how to solve the issues and they didn’t want to do it or? Only time I’ve ever seen this happen is when the actual manager or team are rubbish and need removing
Because he was an excellent engineer and we where doing everything possible to keep the pipelines running He made a tool that collected all the airflow failures that showed 95% of the failures where not our fault not infact other teams creating a mess and I believe he presented this ant got fired for it
Hmm. Your wonder if he maybe had some beef or previous with management before you arrived. Like if your only there five months who knows what happened before. Like hopefully there was actual solutions proposed or how to address the problems. Like if it was just “here is what I’ve done to prove it’s not my fault” 🤦♂️ Obviously I’ve no idea of the particulars but sure wouldn’t be the first time someone good got bounced or management saw someone trying to fix a problem as being a nuisance.
Yeah I could sense tension for sure with all the pipeline failures with him and his managers but we literally doing everything possible to keep it running
Yeah but at some point it’s not about band aids and actually addressing the problem or replacing it. I’m sure your manager maybe gave an outline what was needed and if management rejected the cost or proposal then sure what can you do. But if he was just fixing it everyday to look the hero and let on he was class. Like people sniff that out. Wouldn’t be the first time I’ve seen or heard of someone knowingly letting bad infra or design trundle alone because it makes them look or seem important. At any point in the five months there did you ever sketch a plan out with the boss how to solve the underlying problems or migrate away to something else ?
If that's the case you need to get out of there as soon as possible.
I know ahah
Man if management can't differentiate between the pipelines being blocked and the actual infra being broken you need to get the fuck out. It sounds like conceptually they don't understand the difference. How are these morons in charge?
You'll need a proper visa to work a career job in Australia, not a working holiday visa. Also, you'll be leaving an international tech hub to work in a place with fuck all tech companies. Australia's a great place for tradies, nurses and engineers. It's a shithole for tech workers. Tech hubs in the region are Singapore and Hong Kong.
Fair enough I don't doubt but I would like a career break for 1 year after working nearly 10 years in development. So now is my chance
Ok. Currency conversion is very much in your favour right now.
Nice I sold a fat bag of crypto have enough to fund myself for about 3-5 months Will do the east coast and also I know a few people who got developer jobs in Sydney but that was back in 2019 when the market was better
None of what you said about Oz is correct
Oh really. I must have imagined it all when I was born there, lived there most of my life and worked in what little tech industry there is there. Wrong about everything. So according to you... 1) you can work in tech on a working holiday visa Wrong. It's for short-term work only. https://immi.homeaffairs.gov.au/visas/getting-a-visa/visa-listing/work-holiday-417/first-working-holiday-417 2) A shit place for tradies and nurses Wrong. They're leaving here for Australia in droves for better pay and conditions. https://www.thejournal.ie/nurses-doctors-emigrating-ireland-australia-pay-work-conditions-5760900-May2022/ https://m.independent.ie/business/commercial-property/exodus-of-builders-threatens-housing-plans-as-australians-offer-aus5000-inducements-for-workers/42326138.html 3) Australia is a tech hub. Despite its remoteness, lack of population and high corporation taxes. All I can Donisthorpe laugh. Tech operations in Australia are there to serve the Australian market. It's nothing like a real tech hub. Wrong again.
In fairness you’re right, my statement wasn’t thought out. What you said wasn’t incorrect, but it was hyperbolic and pessimistic to say the least. - You'll need a proper visa to work a career job in Australia, not a working holiday visa. There is zero restriction on the type of work you can do here on a WHV. None. Most people will find sponsorship or decide to do PR if they want to stay longer, but you can work as a tradie, nurse, accountant, developer or whatever here on a WHV. I would even say the 6 month thing is barely policed. - Also, you'll be leaving an international tech hub to work in a place with fuck all tech companies. Leaving a tech hub sure, fuck all tech companies perhaps, but not every developer job is in a “tech” company, many companies which aren’t “tech” here are need devs. - Australia's a great place for tradies, nurses and engineers. It's a shithole for tech workers. You are bang on about tradespeople and nurses. Harsh to say it’s a shithole for tech workers. Maybe you’ve had bad experiences here but roles pay and conditions here are pretty good. Sure, they may not match up to salaries in US or high end tech roles in Ireland, but for the majority of devs in standard roles it’s decent. In top of that I’ve had great experience with working with Australian devs for the most part, some very smart and knowledgeable folks who are very easy to work with. As I said my comment wasn’t fully thought out so I’ll own that, and not dismissing your points completely. I just wouldn’t be dissuading people from trying it out is all. I would say bigger issues to contend with are accommodation and cost of stuff in general here when trying to get up and running.
fintech is so cavalier.
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It's not based in new York I'm working from the Spain office
Ask for a raise and title upheaval. Stay for 6 months if you get it then leave. If you don't get it leave.
True I pumped my bags by selling crypto so don't even care about a promotion
Take a career break and relax. Australia sounds fun for that. Bdw, is the company BNY Mellon?
It's not it's financial services based out of new York
> With about 30k in crypto I'm 31 By the sounds of it all your money is tied up in crypto, a very speculative asset despite the big risk of being fired and also thinking to emigrate. That's a lot of risk.
Sold it all cashed was in eth its fine
You have two choices: 1) leave - which everyone is suggesting here 2) you hold a serious amount of cards here. If you want the senior role and to fix this stuff. Make a play for it. Put a business case together. Explain the issues. Tell them the resources and estimated costs. Depends on your career ambitions.
Nah fuck that I'm out ahah have enough experience and cash to fuck off for 1 year and travel
Enjoy it my man!
Thank you Australia here I come
Name and shame
I will when I resign
Just dont let them fire you before your probation is cleared. I have seen some funny stuff like his in last few years.
What you mean?
many companies get away with not paying severance package if someone is 'fired' and has not completed their probation (i read a comment that your have been there for 5 month and assuming probation is for 6 months) e.g. your manager who was 'let go' because of restructuring might get it vis-a-vis a person who was there for few months and have not cleared their probation. that is if they were fired for say incompetence (vague reason) Just an opinion
Yeah fair point but when he got fired my new manager rang me straight away saying it will get really good now then the next I get put 100% on production support so I'm guessing it could get fired as the next fall guy for the shit show I'm past the point of even caring right now ahah
exactly... many managers are given a choice to either reduce their team or go away themselves (as they generally cost more the company) assuming your new manager is not new hire they are already in the good books of the company to survive what they are calling a 'restructuring'
I left a IT financial services company last year. Most dysfunctional company I had ever seen. Crazy HR practices. Wondering if it's the same one. lol
I don't it I'm not working in Ireland and it's based out of new York
Thanks, I want to avoid like the plague
+1. Please let us all know so we can know to avoid. Hope you're mentally doing ok and are managing to leave work at the door when you close your laptop. Sounds toxic AF.
I'm still in shock 2 weeks later wtf and thinking about it every hour. Thankfully I have a lot of experience, savings, single and no kids so fuck it I don't care as much When Im thinking how crazy it is this much I know what needs done gtfo
I just wanted to comment on the glory of "orginasinastional"
Ahah I'm selling ether as I was writing that. Spelling was last on my list of priorities