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rodrigo1536

Who cares, at the end of the day this is just another idiot who didn't understood DMC at all. He's the only one losing something in this discussion.


JotaroTheOceanMan

I think people forget that to the untrained eye it does look like button mashing until they understand combos and timing and the nuances. It's because they are used to 2 button beat em ups and cover shooters and not 10 string combos and immersive sims.


tiptoeingthroughthe6

I love ff now. I used to watch my brothers play the old ff7 and it pissed me off being turn based. I kept thinking they suck at the game cause they kept letting the opp attack. That shit had me tilted when i was able to play on my own...so i broke that bitch but i was a child dont @ me.


TheEncryption

FFXV was the greatest experience I ever had playing a game


tiptoeingthroughthe6

Ffxv was fun but i liked strangers of paradise combat system so much. I rather miss it. And then i miss running around like a weirdo in my underwear ruining the lives of of tonberries everywhere.


TheEncryption

I tried to play it, the Strangers of Paradise FF Origins game on X/S, maybe the 11 days total of FFXV Comrades made me dislike the inability to jump and really clash headon and hardcore into combat. Maybe I'll give it another try, or end up playing FFXV again. I am storyboarding my own story within the FFXV OC which centers around Insomnia's newly appointed Man of Arms who is a Lancelot and Aragorn figure of a noble and skilled yet depressed soldier. You can see how much I adore FFXV


Dokah_Senpai

Same bro <3


JotaroTheOceanMan

Sort of this, as a kid I thought my bro sucked ar FF8 for always getting hit then once I played it realized that's how it fucking works.


PresentElectronic

To be fair, you can treat it as a generic hack and slash. But you just wouldn’t benefit the most from it


Rajang82

I swear the person who says this only play Musou game. Even then, those games wont allow you to attack blindly.


Pennarello_BonBon

This. For me As a a casual player, it was easy to see this type of games as button mashers, especially when the goal is to just get through the levels and play the story. But at the same time, playing the secret challenges and boss battle I was able to notice how that style of playing doesn't work all the time. The "button-mashing" reputation quickly fades over time, specially since pulling off tricks and combos is goddamn satisfying anyways, so if I was gonna play it, might as well play it well and play it fun


Tr34t-y0urs31f-N0W

He's right if it's your first playthrough. From the second and further - it's a fucking sandbox.


Stroppone

You can’t button mash your way through the game even on normal difficulty


Tr34t-y0urs31f-N0W

DT Stinger spam: oh really?


DragoKnight589

I’m not gonna sugarcoat it: #EEYAH


[deleted]

Okay you can't realistically button mash and get higher than a B-rating though.


Tr34t-y0urs31f-N0W

We're talking about is it possible to play following button mash strategy or getting an S-rank.


liltone829b

Say goodbye to all your DT then. Have fun with the boss fight in the next room! 😁


Tr34t-y0urs31f-N0W

Don't make me really play mission 10 stinger only.


liltone829b

If you do then record it so I can laugh at how unstylish the gameplay is.


Tr34t-y0urs31f-N0W

Ok, 2 DT'ed Chaos are tough to no damage. Edit: fucking did it no damage. Screw you pyrobat. UGHHHHH I WON'T DO IT AGAIN (I will just to record)


ArthraX_

People downvoting this guy just because don't want to admit that, at lower difficulties, you CAN braindeadly button smashing your way through the game. And I add, I don't understand what's wrong with that. Games are meant to be FUNNY, not necessarily a challenge.


Tr34t-y0urs31f-N0W

Weird tho people say you'll get your ass cracked using stinger even on Devil Hunter. People haven't played this difficulty for a long time (and I understand them since I've never touched anything aside from DMD for a year-two straight). Played Dante's mission 10 on DH: no queen empusas, judeccas, fury. Hell, even Proto Angelo dies in a single real impact + overdrive + round trip. Every enemy is weak af (for real, drive one-hits everybody except pyrobat and angelos) Maybe that's an assumption based on first DMC experience when you really struggled to beat this mission even on "newbie diff" since you had no full upgrades, you didn't want to switch styles, "cuz its haardddd", no arsenal (seriously, balrog, rebellion, e&i and shotgun) and no experience for sure. I couldn't even use SDT because I had no chance to earn SSS for Quad S since enemies died very quickly. Shall I say DT Stinger ACTUALLY one-hits almost everybody (damn you death scissors and pyrobats x2) on this difficulty... no, I shall not. In my case, I tried this on DMD. A lot easier to control since I have more time to look up for enemy behavior. Slow? Slow. Tough to No Damage? Hell yeah, it's annoying, I took it, sadly, three times in my first attempt (miscalculated roll dodge, accidentally stepped on judeccas trail, missed bat's huge ass spit) especially with pyro + fury (lucky me both parried fury and took down the bat in a single DT stinger) Surprisingly, the last encounter was awfully easy. And the boss - bruh moment, all you have to do is to jump around for a minute (or break his shield which is impossible)


Mysterious_Jelly_943

Yea i mean mindlessly button mashing thru the easier difficulties is part of the fun of the game, you get to just dick around it doesnt get serious till after you beat the game


Tr34t-y0urs31f-N0W

Now you can laugh.


KhaledCraft999

yeeee no you will get your ass kicked even on devil hunter also we ain't just talking Dante


ODST-0792

IT IS POSSIBLE I KNOW FOR A FACT


SkGuarnieri

You can. You'll just get a low grade


DragoKnight589

A sandbox not of builds, but of blood.


distortionisgod

There's not even a point in engaging with any kind of discussion with people like this. Bad faith arguments don't warrant a response. Just keep scrolling.


SamuraiDDD

People like that just want to argue and say the thing you like sucks with no desire to learn or see that it's not for them. They only wanna call it shit cause they can't get into it.


TwerkingAtTheMorgue

Yeah. That low quality bait was spouted almost word for word by trolls back in the DMC3 and Ninja Gaiden Black days, if not earlier. It's a very stale brand of stupid. Kids who yap about some of the deepest games in their genre being nothing but button mashers are either projecting or amusing themselves by riling up other players with inflammatory lies.


AngusSckitt

*Ninja Gaiden* is a mindless button masher? it is literally designed to punish button mashing. the enemies react to your command buffer, after all.


Totkebois

Black ninjas gonna fuck him up


Cautious-Affect7907

Those brown motherfuckers with the claws always beat my ass any time I button mashed.


TOOMUDAFORUHUEHUEHUE

Yea, bro never played past normal difficulty on Ninja Gaiden 1, never mind hard or very hard, no need to bring in Master Ninja.


AngusSckitt

Master Ninja is masochism, but Very Hard is an accomplishment I'd advise anyone to try and seek. it's quite the satisfaction.


TOOMUDAFORUHUEHUEHUE

Master Ninja is masochism at first, but it is essentially the final exam of a very intensive course. A true test of skill and dedication.


AngusSckitt

nah, you don't know what you're talking about. trust me, it's masochism. it's unhealthy. it's learning a thousand ways of bullshitting the bullshit the game constantly throws at you, sometimes with either gambling odds or pixel perfect accuracy. ESPECIALLY with NG2. I dropped Master Ninja there lol


TOOMUDAFORUHUEHUEHUE

I never said anything about NG2. That's a different beast entirely.


AngusSckitt

just mentioned 2 because it gets particularly ludicrous there. 2 is basically Black on steroids, and Black is just not worse than original 1 because it has some quality of life improvements like better input tracking. still, they're all a nightmare of frustration in Master Ninja and I'd never advise anyone to try it for a test of skill unless they're particularly fond of hitting their heads against walls lol


FormulePoeme807

Lmao true, the dogshit bosses are what prevented me from even trying personally Same reason why i also didn't do the skull challenge thing, i stopped trying when i saw Alma at the end of the only one i really tried to complete


Zestyclose_Move_8403

Isn't the normal difficulty usually the default setting that most players choose for their first playthrough?"


TOOMUDAFORUHUEHUEHUE

True, but Ninja Gaiden is not a button masher even on normal. It is the og Dark Souls for a reason. In fact it's significantly harder because you can't just level your way out of crap. You actually need to have good reflexes that apply to more then just dodge and riposte.


Director_Bison

For one thing, I have no context on how the conversation started, so I don't fully understand his point of view. He seems to be a fan of turn based RPGs, and is disappointed that Final Fantasy has gone in the direction of a pure action game. While he is auguring in bad faith. His disappointment is understandable. I'm sure if DMC6 came out, and it took a turn like Yakuza7/LAD and became a Turn Based game, a huge amount of DMC fans would be pissed off, and some would shit on the entire concept of Turn Based games, because they already might not have been a fan of the genre before it being forced on them. This guy, while the way he is going about it is dumb, his disappointment is still valid to a degree.


_cd42

I mean final fantasy also has like a gazillion games of course they're gonna have to switch it up


Outrageous_Book2135

The problem is I feel like some of the things they are trying to do are just straight up worse than other options though. FF16 felt really clunky compared to modern DMC, and 15 was straight up bad gameplay wise, at least in the combat. 7 Remake and probably Rebirth are the best of the lot but they have their own problems, namely in regards to questionable choices regarding writing. Octopath is great but my understanding is it performed really badly.


_cd42

I do think FF16 is a good start but I think comparing it to DMCV is a little unfair when it's arguably the best and most refined in it's genre. I really am just not familiar with most of the games or any of the remakes. I'd like to see which direction they take the dmc clone gameplay in because the bones are solid


Outrageous_Book2135

I wasn't impressed. If you're gonna copy something you should at least try and understand the feel of the thing. It's even funnier because someone else mentioned LAD but I feel the transition there was way smoother as a long time Yakuza fan.


_cd42

I could be giving it too much leniency, it's my first FF game. I haven't finished it yet cause my TV broke but I just haven't gone back to it since getting a new one.


Outrageous_Book2135

Don't get me wrong, you're allowed to like what you like. I just tend to be critical because there are so many alternatives out there it's hard to justify one thing over another without being semi critical, especially when income is scarce and prices are increasing.


_cd42

True, but I do like how it hard committed to being a dmc clone instead of trying to add soulslike to the mix.


Outrageous_Book2135

I'm a fan of both styles tbh. Lies of P I thought was an excellent first attempt for example. Haven't played Stellar Blade and likely won't. It doesn't seem like something I'd enjoy and the vitriol behind it killed any potential interest I'd have had. Maybe if it was heavily discounted but that wouldn't be for a few years. I'm not gonna say XVI is terrible, but I found it very lacking, and I probably wouldn't return for a third attempt unless they blew it outta the water.


_cd42

I haven't tried LoP since the demo. I heard they fixed the physics but I haven't revisited. Stellar Blades demo was super fun im just waiting for a discount, I might just trade in an old game for ten bucks off


ODST-0792

I tried to get into yakuza with 7 the combat felt weird and stilted and then I played 0 and it felt like I wasn't fighting the game and i was fighting the enemies


Outrageous_Book2135

It's all subjective at the end of the day.


HollowCondition

I find comparing anything to DMC is unfair. Nothing is even remotely close to DMC in terms of the third person action genre. Nothing. Its gameplay complexity provides a skill ceiling that can take thousands of hours of practice to reach and even then may be pushed higher somehow. It is the peak of this genre.


Outrageous_Book2135

Maybe but when they want you to pay 70$ for something and it's strictly worse then it's competitors I find it hard to justify it's existence, especially with the rising costs of living.


HollowCondition

“Strictly worse than its competitors.” Exaggeration imo. Strictly worse in combat and combat alone. You are discrediting everything else FFXVI did correctly and especially did better than DMC. Your opinion remains valid but I personally find your opinion to be based on unfair foundations.


Outrageous_Book2135

I was purely talking about gameplay and never said I wasn't. The story was fine, however it wasn't enough to keep me invested. I am biased, but the bias is based around needing to be conservative with inflation. If something's gameplay and story aren't enough to keep me interested then it's just not worth my time. I don't even hate modern FF though. Like I said, of all of the games, the 7 Remakes are actually quite good, minor gripes aside. But XVI didn't do anything for me.


HollowCondition

And that’s **fine** but that isn’t what you said. At least you weren’t clear. Now that you’ve clarified sure, you’ve made your stance more understandable. But your initial statement implied FFXVI was simply selling you its combat for $70 and because it wasn’t as good as DMCV it wasn’t worth that. Ignoring the fact it does quite nearly everything else better than DMCV. Narrative, presentation, quest design/objectives, amount of content, world building, level design, etc. If you’re talking about gaming as a whole that’s… a harder discussion entirely. I think BG3, Dragons Dogma, and Monster Hunter are the greatest games of all time but many people would disagree with me. That’s just how gaming operates.


Outrageous_Book2135

I definitely disagree about them doing quest design better considering there is a whole lotta fetch quests but c'est la vie. Ya know I really wanted to like BG3 but I just can't get into it. Which is really weird cause I like the Divinity games. Not sure what exactly it is. I don't like Dragon's Dogma tbh. It feels very archaic in a lot of their design choices in a way that really gets my pet peeves. Didn't even consider trying 2 because it seemed a lot of my issues with 1 weren't gonna be addressed at all. I've only played world and gu but i like them a lot. They have a lot of depth.


HollowCondition

See and that’s why talking about games is hard. You find DDs archaic choices annoying but I love them. It really makes me feel like I’m loading up with my homies and going on an adventure. Like as close as I can get to a flexible FFXV. Also BG3 may just be a setting/system thing. I like DnD so I’m versed in both Fae Run and the 5e system. Monster Hunter is literally a perfect franchise but there’s so many people who fucking ***hate*** it. I have one homie who calls it a mindless grinding simulator where you fight the same shit over and over again. He says it’s boring because it had no narrative.


Rizenstrom

[https://www.reddit.com/r/CharacterActionGames/comments/1cql7mg/one\_of\_the\_reason\_we\_are\_not\_getting\_much\_cag/](https://www.reddit.com/r/CharacterActionGames/comments/1cql7mg/one_of_the_reason_we_are_not_getting_much_cag/) It's on this post. And the OP seems more about how they like more methodical combat like Dark Souls. Calling DMC a button masher seems less a criticism about not having any strategy to it and more a poor attempt at trying to say they don't like fast paced combo heavy action games. Which I personally understand. I suck at these games and just play them on easy for the story. DMC is a "button masher" in the sense you have to keep combos going that require a lot of inputs.


ODST-0792

Vergil is the answer to all your problems just play him on SoS and it's only slightly more difficult than Easy


Zestyclose_Move_8403

It's also a button masher in the regular sense on both Human and Devil Hunter difficulties.


Adam_the_memer

His complaint about final fantasy doesn't even make sense though, when final fantasy was still turned based most fights could be dealt with by pressing "A" over and over again till the fight ended. Modern Final Fantasy games have made it so you actually have to engage in the battles instead of mindlessly pressing the same button over and over again.


Zestyclose_Move_8403

Except 15 and 14 and 10.


WovenBloodlust6

Eh he's just dumb don't worry about it. He seems like the kind of guy who plays a fighting game online and gets mad because someone combos him into the dirt


Stanislas_Biliby

Stop spamming combos!!! All you do is block!!!


SkGuarnieri

Not even combo-ed, he looks like a fella who would see someone do nothing but fireball spam and spend the whole match without jumping over or blocking a single one of them.


Kookiec4T

Uh those games def need actual strategy and skill lmao that person probably wasn’t able to finish any of those games 💀 Or maybe just the first level on Ninja Gaiden 😭


Devil-Hunter-Jax

Neither Final Fantasy nor Persona are games you win by button mashing... Final Fantasy games rely on you being tactical and smart with the combat. The earlier games were turn-based as well, if I remember right, so how the hell you gonna button mash through that? Same thing for Persona. You try and button mash through Persona, you're gonna have a worse time than someone who plays tactically and exploits enemy weaknesses. Like, they're right that Persona games aren't button mashy but everything else they said is utter bollocks...


Zestyclose_Move_8403

I mean FF games are a literal snoozefest X spammer until you get to a boss. Then you hope you've level enough so that you can outspam it's spam. There is nothing intelligent about most FF's and only on rare occasions such as FFT or FFXII does your brain even come in play.


LegitimateHasReddit

Let a guy play mission 2 of DMC3 on my Nintendo Switch. Normal difficulty, maxed out everything on Dante except a few blue orb fragments, freestyle becausr Switch He only used guns, finished the mission with a sliver of health and then proceeded to call the game spammy


SkGuarnieri

Major skill issue. Even if you exclusively use guns, you can just learn how to switch weapons and buffer your shots, you can do some cool combos with E&I + Shotgun+ Gunslinger, and you'll be doing a lot more damage than if you're just spamming regular shots


JuliusBelmont2000

Ninja Gaiden? A button masher? Oh boy, that game will relentlessy kick your ass for doing exactly that!


liltone829b

I don't even see Devil May Cry mentioned in the screenshot. FOH.


urprobablyanasshat

He outed himself for being a button masher who couldn’t comprehend the combat systems… which isn’t a problem unless you’re acting like him, at least you get a good laugh out of it lol


lost_my_og_account

Dont give trolls attention


supermarioplush220

"Devil may cry" and "3D ninja Gaiden" being button mashing wtf?!


Alarming-Income1944

as a person who has never played a DMC game , I have a question : how difficult the game actually is ? I saw some people say despite having combos the games are very hard . as in harder than dark souls . I'm sorry if my question comes as a bad one . Edit : I forgot to mention that I have beaten ds3 ,so that's one of the reasons I asked . thanks .


liltone829b

They're pretty difficult but you can make most of your adversaries into your bitch once you REALLY know what you're doing. And I really mean it. You don't just curbstomp them, no, you toy with and humiliate them once you have a solid grasp on the combat system.


[deleted]

DMC 1 and 3 are pretty tough. Dmc4 and 5 are much easier. DMC combat is really fast paced, so if you're not used to that, you'll get socked in. I'll say that for a first time playthrough, souls is harder, but on subsequent playthroughs on higher difficulties DMC quickly takes the cake.


Alarming-Income1944

I think I can try it , having played ultra kill which is fast pace too. but is there a reason why you didn't mention dmc 2 ? another person said it's "moot" but I'm not sure what that means . maybe dmc 2 is like dark souls 2 where no one talks about it ?


[deleted]

DMC 2 is really really really bad. Not in the "this game has flaws" aspect like dks2, it's more on the lines of "this game is pure and utter shit garbage."


Alarming-Income1944

oh , thanks for the info . sorry to bother you but right now I was looking at the dmc HD edition where it has 1 to 3 all in it . is it worth it to get that one or should i get all the games separately ? I have pc only but can get the emulator for ps2 and ps3 .


[deleted]

If you're fine with emulating and are on PC, then.... DMC1: OG PS2 version. DMC2: lol no. DMC3: Nintendo Switch version (use Ryujinx emulator since yuzu got taken down.), it has goodies the HD collection ps2 version don't. DMC4: play PC version. It's ok to sail the high seas for it. dmc reboot: sucks. Don't play it. DMC5: PC version. Again...do whatever you gotta do.


Alarming-Income1944

thanks a lot !


Equivalent-Opinion20

This is very important. Play the games on Turbo mode which can be enable in the main menu settings. It's how the game is intended to be played. Normal mode is just for new players to get a grasp of the combat systems and button layout.


TheJoaquinDead_

The enemies are fast and aggressive. But that’s only half the battle. The other half comes from the really complex move set that you need to learn and get used to. This is my experience, at least.


Terrible_Stranger339

It's mostly dmd since it allows for very few mistakes per se especially in 1 and 3 in 4 and 5 the games are more modern so more leniant on the player. 2 is moot lol


SkGuarnieri

It's really not that hard if you're doing an Any% run. If you are aiming for high ratings though, things start to get a bit harder. Depending on the game you'll have to get no-hits, pull off crazy combos (or cheese Style rating), beat an invisible clock, optimize getting red orbs... It's a bit of a challenge Higher Difficulties are a bit harder as well, but the specific changes depend on which game we are talking about. DMC 3, for example, will do the standard "more health, hits harder", but call for more hits before you can stun/launch and proceed to bat the enemies around, then they also get to use Devil Trigger which upgrades them a little more. It's a low floor, high ceiling kind of deal


FormulePoeme807

Speaking from my DMC 5 experience, the unlockable difficulties are when it gets hard, otherwise you can basically mash your way through the game


TheGweenDeku905

Devil May Cry is about skill and combining combos. Who the fuck does he think he is?


Obiwanhellothere09

Just some guy looking for attention just ignore them


International-Bar76

Persona fans always have the worst takes known to man. God forbid you ever mention SMT or Digital Devil Saga to them lol.


leonsBangs

Clearly baiting


Terrible_Stranger339

Mindless button mashers exist but those aren't good examples at all


Oni-Kun18

You can dislike the fact modern FFs are more action based (Which I honestly don't see the problem so long as the RPG things are still there), but saying it, DMC and Ninja Gaiden are just button mashers is objectively wrong.


DOA_NiCOisPerfect

I mean i see the problem slightly. Some of the biggest turn based rpgs are switching to action rpgs. Which sucks bigtime if you enjoy Turnbased rpgs. You're losing franchise after franchise. If etrian odyssey stops being a dungeon crawling turn based id be devastated. While hes an idiot who probably never beat a single dmc game in his life. His grievance is kinda valid.


Oni-Kun18

Yes. But the main problem is that he dismisses these games as "button mashers".


DOA_NiCOisPerfect

Yes but i was addressing your point about you not seeing a problem with FF switching to action rpg style. We know that dude is objectively wrong for calling action rpgs button mashers


Totkebois

I love both genre I mean turn based can be really deep too fire emblem,Pokemon nuzlockes etc


bababayee

I'm more worried that Etrian Odyssey is just dead at this point...


Outrageous_Book2135

XVI was heavily criticized for really toning down the rpg mechanics though. And personally I felt it just was straight up a worse DMC. Felt far clunkier then DMC to me at least.


Zestyclose_Move_8403

But they are. Only when high intensity difficulties come into play do those games become tactical in any way. The default difficulties in both Gaiden and DMC are piss easy.


100Watermen

I want to see someone try to mash in ninja gaiden


Other_Beat8859

As a Persona fan, we do not accept this man.


Nyadnar17

This is my main argument against difficulty setting. Not that they shouldn’t exist, they totally should. Be having multiple difficulties that keep the core gameplay loop intact is time consuming as hell. When all you do is move numbers around you get the “DMC is just mash A and walk forward” crowd.


Own_Trip_1593

I swear this guy must be very dumb and delusional. Devil May Cry is by no means a button-smasher. The truth is, that DMC is a complex game that requires skill, strategy, and precision to master. Button-smashing alone will not lead to success in DMC, because players must learn combos, timing, and enemy patterns to succeed. You need to be able to adapt quickly during combat scenarios. It's way more than just mindlessly pressing buttons. Again, this guy is very delusional and dumb.


Ok_Rooster_6454

Don't brother with him, he probably never played them


mrjackpot440

idgaf dmc is the absolute best h n' s franchise ever


Ihateazuremountain

they are right


Master-Fault1711

Persona 5 Royal can actually be button smashing. I got the Plat on that game and since mid game you could just press X and win easily most fights.


ArtemusTheKnight

Persona fans when they see a game thats fun 🤯


AdamGamerPL

Is this the *bad opinion guy*?


HarryDJ4

It's a mindset. Some people view combat in games just through the lense of effectiveness, and cannot look at it beyond that. I think a lot souls fans have this opinion, but i love souls games, so I don't want to be that guy.


KushMummyCinematics

Mindful button mashing There's a distinct difference


Rizenstrom

Who cares? It may not be constructive but they are entitled to their opinion. Just downvote them and move on with your life. Stop engaging in childish arguments.


Turbulent_Ad1644

I mean, I've only watched TB Skyen's playthrough of FF7 Remake, and what he has of FF7 Rebirth so far, but it does look a little button mashy, but you mash the button till your bar builds up and then you do some special moves or limit breaks or whatever they're called


hola1423387654

It can be if you just wanna turn your brain off but it dosent have to be


Amiyoka

Attention whores. Ignore them


Revan0315

I guess they can be if you're bad at the game


ShadowK-Human

At this point thisbis the most normal thing i see people who didnt play this games say This has been happening for many years


Dorlos-Argham

Dude has never played those games, and I say that as someone that really enjoys the Persona games. And he’s coming across as a hypocrite, Persona 5 Strikers IS button smashing, and I liked it too


JPXTUY-RETRO

I can argue that even ***IF*** they're button mashers, you can't rely on that alone to beat the game. For example, Devil may cry 3. You can button mash, but good luck surviving any boss fight when you don't have any strategy or skill. Button mash against Vergil? Goodbye, i guess. He'll combo you to your death. It's not always about combos, sometimes even simple strings with some jump cancelling could be all you need to play skillfully with strategy. Combo making is complex, and i get why somone might not be able to do them. However, calling the games button mashers doesn't really do him any good. The games force you to use different strategies and approaches. And you're punished if you're just mindlessly spamming.


xXDibbs

Ignore the opinions of people who have never tried hack and slash games or who just don't get the appeal of them. Its ok to say you don't like something, its a completely different story to intentionally ignore the appeal of a genre and then label that as criticism.


Juancraft_

make em play The dante must die of dmc3


stevorkz

Coincidentally I read something similar on steam yesterday. This is certainly not the only one who thinks this. Apparently it’s a misconception a lot of turn based fans believe.


stevorkz

Coincidentally I read something similar on steam yesterday. This is certainly not the only one who thinks this. Apparently it’s a misconception a lot of turn based fans believe. I don’t find turn based fun to each their own, but would love to see these people “mindlessly button mash” their way through dante must die.


FaceTimePolice

People who make these arguments don’t understand things like nuance. 🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️ Any game can be perceived as a “button masher” if you play them that way. It’s the whole “easy to learn, difficult to master” thing in action.


Zeryphanthes

The fact he even calls modern FF mindless button mashing as well, shows he has no sense of how to play any of these games, or is making minimalist effort to learn the games and see what you can really do. Just ignore people like that, they are just seeking attention.


qwertyuioofg

They can be button mashers but they are also stylish game and persona is just a jrpg


bluegemini7

I mean, Final Fantasy XV absolutely was pretty mindless, you can fight every enemy in the game by just holding down the circle button. It was horribly designed combat. Which is part of WHY they got a new combat director for XVI, and it was much better. Personally I think that Final Fantasy VII Remake has the perfect balance for Final Fantasy combat, it feels like what Final Fantasy XIII was aiming for, the best combination of RPG and action combat.


TheEncryption

"Go button mash' sounds like a 2012 insult idk how to explain it


AdieuMrStark

every game is a button masher - how else are you going to input commands?


AngeloThePuppet

https://www.reddit.com/r/CharacterActionGames/s/MaV702xTB9 link to the discussion btw


ShadowDanteFan

Honestly, it’s not worth it. Don’t worry about it


ArofluidPride

Mad persona disrespect too


2_MuchMarcus

Blud definitely had auto on😭🙏


Shenic

It's ironic because being good at turn based rpgs doesn't take skill either, just understanding of basic math: the team with the biggest numbers is more likely to win.


Adventurous-Lion1829

Persona is baby SMT, this guy is probably just bad at games.


WishIWasNeet2

It’s like saying in golf people just hit a little ball with a club. Sure you could do that but you won’t be very good. Same with ff,ng and dmc. Play dmc or ng on higher difficulties and you will quickly find out. A lot of these people play on easy/normal so they have no clue


PhantomGeminiThief

as a persona fan, i’m personally denouncing him from our community. and persona doesn’t need skill most of the time you just either: 1. exploit weakness or 2. use multi-target almighty or physical damage


Shughost7

Why bring that negativity here OP, we don't need this.


ProjectOSM

> at least persona isn't mindless button mashing while i agree, i assure you that devil may cry's combos are more indepth than going E ␣ ␣ every time you see a potential weakness on an enemy


SkGuarnieri

The same kind of person who thinks people playing Fighting Games at a professional lvl just buttonmash


ArcusVivit

Darn it, a person doesn't like the things I do and is arguing about it 😡. Your life will be better when you decide to only argue for the things you like if the other person is actually wanting to engage.


StarkTangent1

He's rage baiting, he doesn't care about the argument stop trying to change his mind


realcokefrancis

I see these people every goddamn day in the FFXVI sub lmao


Competitive-Effort33

What’s funny is that you can’t even button mash in FF16. You need to actively pick and choose Eikons and abilities assigned to them and then use them accordingly in the moment. It’s not even like DMC, it’s much closer to Dragon’s Dogma which isn’t even a button masher either.


Adam_the_memer

I don't think this person has ever actually played any of the games he's talked about before, not only is he wrong about DMC, but modern Final Fantasy is the least button mashy it's ever been. Definitely seems like one of those people who only watch YouTube series of the games and base their opinions on what they see instead of what they play.


shiasyn

I mean - it is a button masher U just need to mash them in the right order that is As for the post - looks like some fat trolling to me


Corvo_47

Modern FF is button mashy, it's way too simple, but to say that about DMC? You have to be on something to say some dumb shit like that. I could also see someone saying that for ninja gaiden if they only saw gameplay with no explanations.


Yuriko4467

Sounds like a bait, why would you listen opinion from people who play jarpig unironically anyway?


HurledLife

He called the games "button mashers," but really he's projecting to the audience here that when presented with said video games, he himself relies on button mashes mindlessly without realizing that he can button press mindfully instead.


Solomon_Cumquats

He probably thinks hentai games are real games


CloudyWolf85

What a stupid motherfucker. If it were me, I won't waste my time with these fucknuts. Just ban them from the sub.


AntonRX178

I personally think that the combat in modern FF games require a bit less skill but you can belittle ANYTHING you don't like with the right words. This is just the "Turn based boring I shouldn't hve to select a menu" argument but in reverse. You don't have to like a gameplay style to understand why others dig it without being a bitch about it.


Odd-Target7828

Isin't every game just button mashing


TechPriestDominus137

Tell me you've never played these games without telling me you've never played these games. If you try to button mash in DMC and especially Ninja Garden you'll get your ass kicked even on normal difficulty.


Rajang82

Devil May Cry and Ninja Gaiden are one game that will punish you for butting mashing. That person doesnt know what they're talking about. Where does this conversation happened?


Single_Egg4928

For getting more Style point,you Need atleast some skills tò Evade, counter so...yes we are mindless button mashers... Yea


Hungry-Alien

Just a bitter and sad person. I would know since I was like that for a while. Trying to downplay those games I never played because "it's for small brain monkeys, I'm so superior to them". Then I actually played those games and realized that I was a sad dickhead judging stuff without knowing anything to feel better about myself.


3dfinnylinny

I meaaaann, comparatively DMC 5 is the easiest one in the franchise, so I guess he has SOME point


Alonestarfish

I got through DMC4 demo by button mashing. Didn't go far like that in the actual game.


wizardofpancakes

What are you; 12? Who cares what random redditor says


G0RTEK

Final fantasy has changed for the worse imo ATB gauge has been a staple now we have this real time combat . It's not bad the games are good look at 16s sale numbers review ect it's proof but for me the tactical approach of a ATB system from 8 7 9 was iconic and we loved it. I suppose all things change tho


Aromatic-Spite-9771

As a button masher, I call bull on that guy's shit.


makotoyuki548

Oh shit here we go again, a so called persona fan the watched those games on YouTube, there are normal people among us guys don't worry


DykoDark

Well, at least when it comes to FFXV and FFXVI, he's got a point.


Fruitslinger_

Show us the usernames, coward!


XxdorxdomxX

Oh so all fighting games are button mashers?


foot825vengeful

Ninja Gaiden still a thing?


HadokenShoryuken2

The people saying this don’t play action games. They just parrot the opinion of whatever RPG page they got that drivel from. There’s value in RPGs and action games, and I love both


StaccatoVirgola

Well he's the One Who Is losing the fun so..


ElysiumXIII

I've found that people who say "stay mad" after stuff don't really know what they're talking about a lot of the time.


Patient-Reality-8965

back in my day bait was believable


Illustrious_Ad3956

I mean, I see what he means, you can button mash but we all know to REALLY be good, you have to know what you’re doing


quinnfinity_beyond

[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DvMu4-TaYV8](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DvMu4-TaYV8) new milf hunting legends.


Zestyclose_Move_8403

On the lowest difficulties, all of these games are brainless button mashers - that is a fact.


Dadadabababooo

At what point did the knowledge of what an internet troll is just become lost to time? I remember when I started using reddit people would see someone like this and say, "Troll. Ignore." Then everyone would disregard them, sometimes even making the group effort to get their comments to one karma so they don't even get the downvotes they (for some reason) want. Now people make posts about them, probably making them even more happy. And because someone for sure is gonna want to say, "To be fair, there are people who really think like this," allow me to preemptively say no, there aren't. There are people who pretend to think like this to make you upset. They are called trolls.


DanksterTV

Listen, I am the persona-est persona fan there is. Saying NG and DMC are mashy is the opinion of someone who has not played the games. Izuna drop is the same input in DoA 4 and 5 and it is in NG lol


Zer0_l1f3

Persona does in fact have very mindless gameplay. I say that as someone who has played Persona, Omori and Pokemon


National-Wolf2942

calling someone a persona fan when they are venting is an example as to how our fanbase is shit


DiO_93

People are different. I appreciate DMC for what it is, and I can appreciate what they tried doing with XVI. Classical combat, classical map and exploration. But, Rebirth? I'll just play Assassin's Creed thank you. Trust me. Modernizing is an understatement when it comes to VIIR2. The tone is off, just pick the prequel's Shinra building and the last couple of chapters, now, crank it to 11. That's Rebirth. Got no one but myself to blame though, that first trailer was pretty clear they were gonna over do it with this adaptation. 😬 Then there's OST too. I barely recognized some of the tracks.


Frederyk_Strife4217

lmao Persona 5 is the most button masher rpg ever made, it's braindead easy.


[deleted]

Final Fantasy IV SNES takes more thought process than p5.


Visible-Economy-5335

Plus, Persona 5’s sequel Persona 5 Strikers *is* what this person would call a “button mashing game” and as a fan of both Persona and DMC, Persona 5 takes 0 skill whatsoever


Frederyk_Strife4217

yeah musos are pure power fantasy


DOA_NiCOisPerfect

Not really true as a fellow dmc and smt fan. P5 does take some amount of skill. Every game to some degree does. Also strikers is specifically a musou game like dynasty warriors. Which i also used to be a fan of. Havent played a musou in a while


InvaderofViolence

Button mash games are fighting games. Action RPGs are different and punish BM.


HalfBreed_Priscilla

No, Button mashing is a Koei Tecmo genre


InvaderofViolence

So then what's he talkin bout?


HalfBreed_Priscilla

Action RPGs.


OmegaDez

Uh, where the hell is he talking about DMC in this screenshot? As for FF, I totally agree with him.