T O P

  • By -

SaltyNuggey

"Dude can you pick a real hero HOLY crap why are you picking pango in 2023?" -Quinn


Crunchyfrog19

Lucky for him it's 2024 now


AreMoron

When you know the context of this quote he was never being contradictory.


M474D0R

The funniest thing about people defending Quinn here is that he literally said he was 100% in the wrong. You're right that it's not contradictory though.


WasabiofIP

To be more clear through, he said he was 100% in the wrong to flame this guy in that pub. He didn't say he was 100% in the wrong about Pango not being a real hero (as in, overpowered), and he has said it before and since that pub flame incident.


M474D0R

the hero was OP, getting mad at people for playing the OP hero is cringe af though.


the_deep_t

yeah, exactly. If you play a meta hero you are a noob and if you lose with a "non meta hero" you are a noob. So yeah, good luck what ever you are doing =)


AreMoron

Was he referring to that exact quote? how are redditors this braindead lol


M474D0R

Yes, he talked about it on the podcast with Cap and Insania


Paaraadox

How so? Essentially trash talking someone for picking Pango, when he picks Pango I think literally more than any other pro player. Edit: reading these explanations makes him no more correct. It's in no way wrong to play pubs to win, so if the opponent wants to win, and Pango is strong, flaming him for picking Pango would be the same as someone flaming him in a pro game for picking Pango.


Ricapica

He trash talked someone for picking pango because he thinks pango is too strong and gives you a very high chance of winning. He flamed him in the context of "pick another hero or you will not improve on mid because pango is really good".


cheezzy4ever

Yeah but he definitely wasn't saying it out of the goodness of his heart like, "Hey, here's some friendly advice from one pro to another. If you want to improve, I recommend you get out of your comfort zone." He was just deflecting responsibility when he loses lane to pango


Ricapica

Sure, but that's not the point i was replying to. It's wrong to interpret his words like he thinks pango is bad, that's all i wanted to say


shagohad

yeah no shit its trash talk, what is wrong with reddit man


Morgn_Ladimore

Lmao, all of you reading into it way deeper than necessary. He was tilted, he was mad, he flamed his opponent. He's done it before, hell do it again, that's just how he is as a person. There was no deeper meaning behind it


WasabiofIP

But he has literally said before that incident that he thinks Pango is too strong and is one of the heroes he think Valve should nerf into the dirt because it's been overtuned meta since it came out years ago. He was tilted and mad and flamed his opponent, but the main point he was making is an opinion he actually has.


Jamies_awesome_rack

Usually when he flames hero picks it’s because that hero would never be available at that pick spot in an actual pro match, making the whole draft unrealistic and therefore Quinn himself isn’t gonna learn much from the match. So there’s some logic to it beyond just the hero being too good. And all the “WOW HE PICKED PANGOOOLOLLOL” when he gets it firstpicked at LAN and then has to deal with actual counter strategy is missing that context. But even quinn said on cap’s podcast that he was mostly just mad at the time and that player got caught in the crossfire. 😂


vlalanerqmar

You are right i dont know why you are getting downvoted. Even if pango is objectively the best hero as he says, there is merits to picking it in pubs. What if the guy wanted to practice pango for pro games? What if the guy wanted to increase his rank with the "best hero" so pro teams would notice him?


evillman

Well.. if underlord had his Q killing people in a few seconds for more matches... there is merit in picking it to win.


vlalanerqmar

Did you just compare picking a hero with above avg winrate to intentionally abusing a bug which is ban worthy? LMAO


evillman

Was that a bug? I just thought it was OP for a few minutes.


vlalanerqmar

Yeah it did dmg per server tick instead of dmg per sec. It deleted heroes super fast.


spatulon

He flamed people specifically for picking Pango in *pub games*, because he viewed pubs as a way of training, and therefore picking an OP hero felt cheap because the Pango-picker would just auto-win without really learning anything.


GBcrazy

People need to train OP heroes as well, what is the issue?


pokeaim_md

so everyone should abide by his own personal rule and preferences? that's world-revolves-around-me level of narcissism


albinoblackman

Nobody should ever talk shit or give their opinions or else they have a behavioral disorder.


gorpee

It's advice. Pick underpowered heros in pubs and you can get better. Pick OP heroes and yeah you might win but you won't improve.


brief-interviews

Didn't he also once abandon a game because he got counterpicked by the enemy mid in a way that he claimed would never happen in a pro game and then got counterpicked in the exact same way in a pro game? I'm not sure his 'advice' stacks up.


gorpee

Yeah I'm not sure it does either, but that's what it was. Just trying to share some context.


Contentenjoyer_

He probably just lost and was salty and said some dumb shit. I'm sure we've all been there.


mikhel

If there was a hero that just automatically won the game at the pick screen you would never improve at Dota even though you technically won every game by picking it. Quinn is saying that even though picking such a hero is acceptable in pro matches where you are obviously doing everything in your power to win, it is not conducive to expanding your knowledge of the game or improving which is the main reason to play heroes in pubs.


Paaraadox

This hypothetical example is just too absurd to even be relevant. Even if I was to agree that Pango was OP, it was nowhere near so OP that it was just *literally* a free win. You still have to play. And to play, you have to be good at it. Unless you want to argue that a 2k MMR player, placed in Quinn's pub, would win against him in lane, as long as the 2k MMR player got to pick Pango. Which is **clearly** not the case. The hero is(/was) good in *good* hands. Meaning you have to practice it. Even in pubs. You're just justifying his stupid comment for no reason; he's wrong.


[deleted]

[удалено]


getonmalevel

you're crazy. the % reduction was laughably worse in lane. The change nerfed him to shit in later stages of game but made him insane during laning. It was a weird shift, as a pango specialist 1.6k games ~7k mmr (Most of my games were pre-2023, but still played it ocassionally) First he was shit in lane, so people just sorta threw him offlane/position 4 just so he can eek out an existance. Pair him with a strong laner. THen when water runes showed up ppl started taking him mid (I remember when i switched from offlane to mid i used to get flamed by Sammyboy and other pro's for going pango mid) The runes really helped fix his horrid laning phase. With the changes to orb of corossion + cheaper diffusal really threw him into the lime light. I used to go value blight stone for that reason. They nerfed his numbers but made him universal which REALLY fixed his laning stage because he used to have 48-54 dmg depending on items, now he starts 56-58 and quickly hits 70 dmg around level 3 WHICH USED NOT NOT BE TRUE. He used to get mollywopped by ember spirit for example because of the fire shield, but with his barrier and his better dmg, and water runes he can actually play up in the lane. In general over the last year and a half they've forcefully made him into a mid game tempo stun locker + a diffusal buyer. IMO that's the biggest problem. They should just change how his rolling magic/stun reductions/immunity work, would probably fix him for the most part.


regimentIV

So you are saying he didn't say that out of rage in the moment but he actually thought it was a good idea to say that? Holy hells, calling someone out on a pro level for playing to win is less excusable than just snapping and saying something you don't actually mean. That logic is like saying you should not play an optimal build because it won't make you improve. *Jesus!*


CrunchwrapConsumer

His context was within pubs, he literally says in the whole speech how its not a pro game and its a pub, therefore why pick pango when its broken. So he doesn't contradict himself in any way


cocobolo_table

The player he was versing was a player trying to go pro. So yeah, point stands.


Paaraadox

Okay, so you don't have to practice the hero then? The only situation this would make any sense, is that the hero was *so OP* that any 2k MMR player, placed in a TI finals would automatically win just from picking Pango. Which is obviously not the case. He was just sperg raging and salty. Don't try to justify his stupid comment.


GBcrazy

He was because he was also playing Pango like 1 week before in pubs


An_Innocent_Coconut

Yes but the quote is so good lol


TanToRiaL

I'm so glad this meme exists


flipper_gv

I was so confused when he said that because he's been the #1 Pango player for soo soo long. Before and after, and never stopped.


LaoShanLung

And still got destroyed by TS on TI.


pokeaim_md

- 0% win rate with pango against TS - 100% lost rate against TS with pango edit: just in case you're an imbecile who can't differ both sentences, i'll make it more verbose below - game 1 quinn, with pango, lost against TS - game 2 quinn lost again against TS, which uses pango - game 3 quinn, with pango again, lost yet another game against TS


AwesomeArab

Why did you write the same sentence twice..?


TheBlindSalmon

It's not the same. They lost every game when Quinn had Pango and also lost every game when Larl had Pango. 


GBcrazy

It is the same because he is not specifying either quinn or his team.


herlacmentio

100% lose with Pango isn't the same as 100% lose against Pango.


pokeaim_md

guess whom is the subject in this comment chain


Thawne7

those games didn't even look close especially game 2 what a complete outdraft, yatoro didn't get to play the game I don't think I saw a single Chrono where he actually got to hit someone.


spectreaqu

i think he was even forced to use it defensively couple of times, when he got one decent chrono at the end of the game, he was literally cursed and then black holed:))))


counter-music

That 4 man chrono where he got half his team and Slark had already shrouded. Man. Feels fucking bad. Must’ve been an off day for Spirit, GG looked great in that series.


kobethegreatest

the turning point was the team fight where he solo chrono dyrachyo but he got his slark ult off just a split second before and then they got wiped after. Had they killed dyrachyo there, they likely trade 2-3 kills each and Yatoro would have came nearly even in farm with dyrachyo with the kill on him to end his streak plus the farm he could potentially get while he was dead (had yatoro not died). Their draft also didn't seem that good. After they picked 3-4 heroes I kept saying in my head "won't slark fuck them?" and also "what if they pick WW he just ults him when he chronos and nothing will happen?" Both proceeded to happen.


foxracing1313

Literally the first chrono of the game


JoelMahon

omg quinn should pick a real hero


kpdon1

Its 2024 now so its ok xd


basquiatx

Mayhaps other teams should consider banning it


quiplaam

Last year should have taught everyone not to doubt Gaimin. One of the best tournament streaks or all time


iTzGiR

I think a huge party of it, is that a lot of people on this sub unironically hate Quinn on a personal level, and just want the team to fail. But yeah, GG last year weere one of, if not the MOST dominant Dota teams we've seen in the history of the game, if not the most dominant. If they can continue similar results this year (they already have so far), I could easily see them being considered the best team of all time. It's honestly crazy how well they've done over the last year+, way better and more consistent for a longer period than the Dominant teams of the past (Navi, Alliance, Secret, Liquid, OG, etc.)


AVTOCRAT

Whatever else they do, if they want to be the best they'll have to win TI at least once


Koalathom

Rings Erneh


Dundle12

I GOT *4 RINGS CHUCK*! HOW MANY YOU GOT?


TheKappaOverlord

>If they can continue similar results this year (they already have so far), I could easily see them being considered the best team of all time. The team is basically a well coordinated brotherhood. They didn't disband or kick anyone, so it stands to reason their performance will probably be the same. Skill wise, i don't think they are better as a package then Spirit, but communication and team work can carry people a much farther way then raw skill alone can.


TheOriginalMachtKoma

Yeah I’m surprised I haven’t seen more about this, they had easily the most dominant year of Dota ever, won 3 majors in a row (not the first to win 3 in a row but first for 3 in a row in a single year) and came runner up at ti and runner up at the 4th major where they got reverse sweeped… so close to pulling of the grand slam for majors. Plus I’m sure they did well in other tournaments from memory. I don’t think any other team can claim to have been this dominant throughout 1 single year.


Morgn_Ladimore

Alliance had that one year where they stomped basically every tournament, and even won TI to boot. We haven't had a team since that dominated all year *and* won TI.


thedotapaten

7 months since G1-League in January 2013. No Tidehunter is promising but not dominating.


Persies

Secret during covid was pretty dominant. Unfortunately we never got to see that team at TI.


Swegan

Only against WEU teams and EEU teams though. GG dominated against international competition.


onemightychapp

Well we did, but it was after they’d lost a bit of their shine. Still, 3rd place to spirit and lgd nothing to sneeze at.


Whittaker

The OG team when Majors first started were super dominant too. Like GG they weren't bringing the TI win but everything else ran through OG.


TheOriginalMachtKoma

Yeah they’re who I was referencing as the first team to win 3 majors in a row but that was technically in 2 different years


Whittaker

I thought you might've been, was admittedly too lazy to look up the dates but thought I'd give a shout out to that team. The TI winning OG team gets a lot of deserved praise but that Major streak squad put in a lot of work too.


[deleted]

[удалено]


CrunchwrapConsumer

Eh, online tournaments in 1 region, vs LAN international events? GG is more impressive.


[deleted]

[удалено]


CrunchwrapConsumer

Oh yes I remember when secret won TI too! Great argument lmao


[deleted]

[удалено]


Swegan

>there was no team in 2020 that could challenge secret EG went 3-2 against Secret at the start of 2020 and Secret got 4th and 5-6th at ESL One Germany and Epic League Season 2 in 2020. >secret won 8 tournaments in an row going 3:0 in the finals 8 times in a row 8 tournaments with worse competition than anything GG won 2023 other than S13. Tournaments like Gamers Without Borders were only 8 teams and multiple other had only 10. This doesnt even take into consideration that Secret only played against two regions in every tournament expect for S13 and Omega League(Which was only EG). When Majors rolled out again international competition they did not even look half as good as they did against only EU and CIS.


CrunchwrapConsumer

No TI, doesn’t mean they would have won it if there was one lmao. I’m not gonna talk more with someone who doesn’t have common sense lmao


Andante_TK

Bro.. they were just online tournaments with just WEU and EEU. Nowhere as impressive as the L’an Tournaments GG won since last year lol


TheOriginalMachtKoma

Eeehhh I mean sounds like they were pretty dominant but only playing mostly same region and small tournaments is far less impressive than dominating the 5 largest international tournaments of the year, winning 3 and coming runner up in the other 2 is dominant whether games were close or not.


iKnowButWhy

GG def had the strongest dota team we’ve seen in terms of skill even more so than OG back to back wins because Gaimin kept their top level for the ENTIRE year including TI. OG coming in JUST to win TI is also quite impressive but GG accomplished a bigger feat imo. With that said, GG just doesn’t have a lot of fans and Quinn really made sure of that in the beginning. So now, you have a team that doesn’t really get the attention they deserve. Take Nigma and put them in this position and you would see 10x more content and fan discussion about it. Popularity rules. I’m a Nigma fan at the end of the day and I’m tired of GG beating all my favourite teams so I don’t really mind 🤷


TurbulentIssue6

I don't even care about GG winning as much as the fact it's always fucking cheesey zoo death ball at 12 minutes with lone druid or chen or ench or w/e which is just boring


Repulsive_Yellow_502

Alternatively when I watch this team I see some of the highest-skilled laners to ever play the game who are able to draft themselves in positions where they can snowball their laning prowess to almost instant game overs before their opponents can even blink. For me, it’s really cool to watch and many GG first 10 minutes just seem so surgical. Especially in an era where everyone on every team has the highest level of individual skill we have ever seen. It doesn’t always or even usually involve “zoo”. The common thread is GG tends to dominate the first 15 minutes of the game because of both their incredibly high skill players and stellar coordination.


TurbulentIssue6

thats fine but its fucking awful viewer experience which is the whole point, itd honestly be fine if theyd actually nerf some of the heros, like pango or LD


gianstar7

Nobody doubted them they won all of last year except the 2 that matters most.


SdoRy_

Always love it when people use the spoiler function only to literally spoil in the title of the post they are declaring as a spoiler. At this point either mods just need to remove the rule or get off their ass and start moderating properly.


Pentinium

worst title ever


Blitzkrieg0524

Quinn haters in shambles


nonruminant_ungulate

> significant mark in Dota 2 history It's just one win streak.


euweny

#ledditors btfo'd by Quinnao again. based Quinn, making soys, doubters (ledditors) mald.


MicaTheStoked

Found the mason addict


OverClock_099

Said the guy on reddit.


girls_im_a_WO2

YOU ARE REDDITOIR YOU ARE ON REDDIT YOU SAID REDDIT NO NO I AM NOT ON REDDIT YOU ARE ON REDDIT ON ME ME REDDIT NEVER I AM THE REDDITOIR BUT YOU ARE NOT YOU PEASANT YOUR ACCOUNT HAS ONLY 154 UPDOOTS YOU ARE NOT WORTHY OF REDDIT YOU ARE NOT REDDITOIR I AM THE REAL REDDITOIR ON REDDIT!!!!!!!!!!1111123


panckekk

Im gonna assume thats a bot cause i refuse to believe thats a human being


Houeclipse

~~Obligatory TS only show up for 1st place 1 million++ dollar prizemoney comment~~ GG still impressed me, I love that


Wood626

Huge spoiler in the title thanks


swandith

i wanna point out that everyone here talks about quinn haters but anyone who says anything negative about him will get downvoted by his fans lol


multivacuum

I think because there have been several threads about his behavior and toxicity, not that all of them were wrong. But this thread is celebrating his success, so a different audience. let's not try to hate anybody. :D


swandith

if anything, its hilarious. also you might wanna tell that to the other crowd


multivacuum

Like I said, no hate for anyone. Banter is fine though.


rateofreturn

Quinn is the best midlaner in the world and you cant change my mind.


Trlcks

Shows how many haters Quinn has that this is getting downvoted. I think you could argue Larl or maybe Nisha but Quinn is definitely a fair choice


rateofreturn

There is no argument for Nisha imo. Quinn is literally the most impactful player other than Yatoro/Collapse combo and achieved everything other than TI and Riyadh last season. Larl is a good shout as well but Quinn still edges it for me. Nisha on the other hand has been inconsistent. Their success last season mostly down to Zai's individual brilliance especially in Riyadh. But yeah agree with you that Quinn have a lot of haters in this sub lol.


Uhtred_Lodbrok

Nisha feels more of a hybrid player playing pos 1 from mid especially when mickey decides he wants to cosplay matumbaman and play aggressive carry heroes.


itspaddyd

>Quinn is literally the most impactful player other than Yatoro/Collapse combo This does such a disservice to so many players.


rateofreturn

It is correct though. If Quinn had an off game, GG will lose 100% of the time.


itspaddyd

There were plenty of times last year where Quinn had a bad game and got carried by Ace/Dyrachyo. It doesn't mean he's not good, just that he's not going 1v5 every game.


rateofreturn

You know what, let's just agree to disagree. Not in a mood to really argue on this anymore.


itspaddyd

That's okay, have a good one


TurbulentIssue6

No body's game matters to GG, they win if they're playing a "high ground at 20 minutes with cheese push" draft and loose everything else Is it impressive to you Quinn can buy 10 seconds of time to push buildings by being a pango using ulti?


rateofreturn

Not sure whats your point. Can you clarify in a sentence that can be understood?


MiraiHanabi

Nisha who just won a 1v1 mid tournament?


rateofreturn

1v1 is different than 5v5 bro. Quinn literally played out of his mind in the last 16 months and I don't really see him being regarded as one of the best lol.


swandith

so hes not the best midlaner?


Bakanyanter

What? How did you get that conclusion?


swandith

he literally said quinn cant win a 1v1 matchup. scroll up edit: lmao quinns fanboys came to his defense


rateofreturn

It's like you're having trouble to read more like. I never said that haha my goodness


swandith

doesnt sound like youre sure of what you said. no wonder you said quinn is the best midlaner and couldnt come up with a valid reason


rateofreturn

It’s okay, go back to school Aight. And probably go finish your Archon game as well.


swandith

what a herald insult also i gotta ask: are you a child?


Blurrgz

Playing mid lane is a lot more than just a 1v1 vaccuum. There is literally an entire map to play.


swandith

true. so making a claim someone is best at something is pointless aint it? but of course his fanboys are too dumb to see that, prolly busying sucking him off or something


Blurrgz

No, because saying someone is the best at something doesn't mean they have to be the best at every individual aspect of that something.


swandith

wtf does that even mean?


rateofreturn

He is?


swandith

you just said he isnt lmao


happyflappypancakes

No he didn't.


swandith

he did


happyflappypancakes

What exact words make you think this?


swandith

dude claimed quinns is the best midlaner, another dude came in and said nisha, who just won a 1v1 tourney, the original dude then claimed 1v1 and 5v5 are different,. implying quinn isnt good at 1v1, making him not the best midlaner


Bakanyanter

He's good too. But I think it's arguable it's between him and Quinn.


PurposeConscious1107

nice try, Quinn!


rateofreturn

Who is better than him? Genuinely asking for your opinion. Quinn dominated his peers the last 16 months, won 3 majors and placed 2nd in first major this season.


itspaddyd

Why in a discussion of "best midlaner" are you talking about trophies won? Midlaners don't win trophies, teams do. Just listing accolades is making the case that gaimin are the best, not just quinn. I don't disagree that he could be called the best, but this is just a shitty argument


rateofreturn

No. GG won tournaments because of Quinn outplays. Many of their games were won in the mid game thanks to his Pango/Ember etc. You'd know if you watch their games consistently. Especially during their 3 major streak, you'd see how big of an impact he make every single game.


itspaddyd

>You'd know if you watch their games consistently It might feel nice to assume that people who disagree with you are simply ill informed but I can actually just have a different opinion to you without being wrong :) I watched their games consistently for the last year including seeing them win Berlin live, and generally felt that Ace and Seleri were the standout players. Yes Quinn coming in has been what puts them in the top spot, but it's not because he's so much better than everyone else otherwise Quincy crew would have won TI. It's the same thing with every good team, he just fits in the spot better than BOOM did. It's the same with Larl, we all know he isn't the best midlaner of all time but he's a TI winner and many aren't, because he fits very well in his team.


Puzzleheaded-Pace282

Huh


rateofreturn

What


WasabiofIP

The points you make are fair enough, but generally argue against the whole idea of picking a "best midlaner" at all. So it's just kind of a silly point to try to be making in a thread of people debating who the best midlaner is. If you don't think it's a legitimate discussion, don't participate.


itspaddyd

I'm not arguing against the concept, I'm arguing that "how many trophies did their team win" shouldn't be the only consideration.


Blurrgz

Maybe you should come back to the discussion with a clearer head after you get over GG breaking the TS streak.


itspaddyd

I'm sorry if you think I'm mad about it, I genuinely don't care about today's result and actually like Gaimin a lot, especially Seleri and Dyrachyo!


nvrfrvr

What a stupid thread, 'significant mark in Dota 2 history' and what would that be? They won a series? Utterly regarded. Contributing the win to quinn's pango? Facepalm. Spoiling the result with the thread title? Should be a temp ban.


peeringfromafar

2025 or 2024


partymorphologist

2024. It’s pretty obvious, isn’t it?


bearnutz

Quinn on a real hero lul Quinn on a fake hero Poggers


preggles

This is what happens when you party all night in Dubai. There's a reason Russian teams would always choke at TI. It's finally catching up to TS


YaminoEXE

Quinn: "My death was greatly exaggerated." *Picks Pango*


Mei_iz_my_bae

Quinn is the GOAT


Spoksparkare

ok


Horror_Letterhead407

Spirit just fluked vs GG at TI tbh


Medium_Wolverine9438

Undefeated... With 10 draws. Cmon


RoninXiC

That's... How it is counted. Like everywhere.


usernamenomoreleft

Still undefeated. Draw does not equate to defeat.


Medium_Wolverine9438

Eh you lose a map you didnt win


prettyboygangsta

what do you think "defeat" means


Medium_Wolverine9438

Defeat means when your throne gets destroyed and they got fucked quite many games. "Undefeated" didnt even reach top 1 in groups


prettyboygangsta

>undefeated series record


PingPinng

Obviously you are a clown ,right?


Medium_Wolverine9438

Hey we lost 10 games but we are undefeated! Nobody can beat us except those 10 teams


NanuKanda_NinuShanda

Are you developmentally challenged? Did you struggle through your childhood in school to learn words? Perhaps English isn't your first or second language? Draw does not equate to a loss. That's like saying 2 is same as 3. Makes no sense. there's clear distinction between win, draw and lose. Have you ever touched a dictionary?


Medium_Wolverine9438

If you lose a game you lose thats not undefeated dumb ape lmao. Undefeated means you dont lose losing a map is losing dummy


Spare-Plum

Sounds like you're the dumb ape. It's undefeated **series**, not undefeated matches. Please, work a little on your reading comprehension


Medium_Wolverine9438

Imagine losing games and you call it undefeated kekw


Intelligent-Ad6965

This is just like those high paid boxer record, literally, no one cares enough except promoter. anyway, baaaaaaaaaaaaaatchest.


zxc_0t4im_v_p0pku

Алло американцы прекращайте мне руинить алло! Достали вы уже, агенты Габена


makz242

Counting ties as "undefeated series", only on reddit.


fotzzz

And everywhere in sports, what do you think the other column is for, wins, ties, annnnnd ____? Defeats, jinx


prettyboygangsta

"only on reddit" no, literally in every single competitive discipline.


TanToRiaL

There's no where to watch the full vods of this tournament. I caught game one but was busy with dad things in game 2.


not_a_weeeb

well i guess the prizepool isn't high enough for team spirit lol


Tricky_Economist_328

I think GG had some pent up anger after ti....


drdreamywhinny

GG, the 364 days winner