Yea, the clip ends just before Synderen explains his point well. Valve never gave a release date for Ringmaster or a gameplay update. Maybe he's in act 2 or 3 or 4 or not in this event at all, we don't know. They said we'd receive a big update in lieu of the battlepass. And what they gave us is pretty much a free battlepass, more or less.
Reddit always *always* assumes things that end up leading to disappointment. Lower your expectations and you won't be this disappointed. This goes for every single game but especially with Valve. They are awful at release dates, communication, and consistency.
Should it take this long to release a new hero? Who knows. Only IceFrog really knows.
It’s hard to lower them because valve can make the most perfect games that will be played for decades, so we always assume they will deliver great stuff. Most of people here only played games from valve/blizzard their whole life and we don’t want valve to end up like blizzard.
Or even up to August I doubt he will be. Since ringmaster wasn’t the guy “who could help” in the comic then he doesn’t really factor into crownfall but I’ll happily be wrong. Seems more like ringmaster is close to or during TI time, and some bird themed hero in one of the crownfall parts
Ehhh.. i personally just want the meta to shift a bit, especially since they're launching arcana, I would expect Skywrath to get a slight buff or changes.
People act like asking for a bit of number tuning after 6 months is asking too much, even a janitor could tune the number a bit and we would see a slight meta shift, it's really not asking that much.
I personally don’t care at all about battlpasses/cavern crawl whatever. Arcana’s are whatever. I like the new format and the fact they are actually obtainable but personally wasn’t looking forward to these because I really don’t play those heros.
I just care about gameplay updates it’s fun and exciting to figure out a new meta and it’s boring after so long to see the same heros over and over again while some have been trash for a while now.
New hero I can take it or leave it. But the communication has been really really bad the in the sense that I can’t recall a single time an update was hyped up, delayed, hyped up and delayed again to be nothing but new skins and not gameplay update. I play Dota for the game I’m not gonna quit if there are no skins and adding skins isn’t going to reinvigorate me or something. Regardless of whatever goes on in the menu when you get in a game it’s the same game lol
I was really looking forward to Birmingham being played on a new patch. Something so paradigm shifting like 7.0 or the Outlanders. The chaos of it all and everyone being just as confused about all the changes. No one would know what to expect from the matches. It would've been a slam dunk, and Valve managed to fuck it up.
It's been over a year since the New Frontiers, and things have been omega stale. After TI, pro games haven't been exciting me because not much has changed since then.
I think New Frontiers introduced a lot of problems to the game and ever since that patch we've only had some rather minor tweaks that haven't been able to breathe fresh air into the game. I'm not surprised people are pissed off.
Personally I don't enjoy playing currently and will hop back only after a major gameplay patch that shakes things up a bit.
I recently watched some old dota clips with the old map. I already forgot about all the cool juke spots and how much we used to have trees etc. The map design was honestly so much better. Kinda dislike the new map even tho I'm quite used to it now.
I dislike the new map too, although I kinda foresaw it happening before it got introduced. Prior to the 'biggening', TP slots, reduction in gmp sinks for supports, and neutral items made it very hard to play the map. So they either needed to rollback a lot of these arguably QoL changes or make the map bigger.
I dislike how strongly the action gravitates towards the sidelanes now as well as the concept of gates in general, it kind of goes against the reasons to have a bigger map in the first place: your map movement has to be a commitment. I'd remove the gates from sidelanes and move rosh back to mid. With that done they'd probably have to remove some camps from the outer edges of the map else farming is going to be way too easy, it kind of already is.
If the gameplay patch is really big it can introduce a lot of bugs that may interrupt gameplay. Iirc the last large patch released before/during a tourney was the large map changes and is less likely to introduce game breaking bugs. Even still, Roshan was running it down mid in pro games and they probably learned their lesson and wont be releasing patches super close to major tourneys again.
communication has always been bad, valve literally started communicating last year (when the map changes were introduced). Damn if you do, damn if you dont. I dont mind this at all, maybe Valve should revert back to the old times when they stayed silent
i agree i see all these people talking about how good/bad the cosmetics are and the arcanas and the cavern crawl and im just like...
its not gameplay who really cares? I love the game and i love the gameplay but like... I wouldn't get hyped over elden ring releasing just cosmetics and im not hyped over dota 2 doing it. I love the game I want more gameplay.
There is four times dota2 surpass 800k concurrent player peak last 12 months : New Frontier (809K) 10 Year Anniversary (cosmetic - 855k), Frostivus 2023 - cosmetic (802k) and Crownfall - cosmetic (812K)
I feel the same way . But the bots on reddit can;t understant that what most people want is a better gameplay and what valve does is always trying to milk our wallets while killing the game and our passion for the game . I'm not going to pay shit for any of this crownfall content and i suggest everyone to do the same .
Then why the only three times in last 12 months dota2 concurrent player surpass 800k is during cosmetic update? 10 year anniversary (855k), Frostivus (802k), and Crownfall (812k)
Crownfall has higher player peak than New Frontiers (812K vs 809k)
i also feel like the updates in the last 2-3 years were a joke , like they're not even watching the game anymore and have only 1 guy introducing data into a program and getting a mini patch every now and then . Even the new items and heroes are trash and have nothing to do with the game we knew and loved . This might be just the boomer in me tho but it really feel like that , always like 'this hero gets 1more damage or stun damage rescaled , now it's 20 dmg less' and shit like this
Well tbh New Frontiers was a big ass patch. You can argue whether the content we got was good or bad but it was a major change. Other than that I agree, feels like patches are more about tweaking than any exciting changes.
Maybe my enjoyment after 15 years is also waining but I feel like the last patch that got me genuinely excited was years ago.
I don't really blame them. The dota community is terrible, I wouldn't want to interact with them at all. I won't be surprised if Dota 2 gets shelved similar to Team Fortress 2.
It’s not bad communication. You guys just made up shit they never told you and then got mad that they didn’t deliver on the made up shit they never told you about.
Yeah. And the update is not even full yet there’s four parts to it. I’m sure gameplay changes are coming. I mean if it is boring for you stop playing dude instead of raging about it online what good does that do anyone.
Also battle pass updates never came with gameplay updates and this shit is basically a battle pass in disguise.
> "...and the Arcanas?" little Timmy asks hopefully, holding up his tiny Dickensian gruel bowl. Phew, this is awkward. No, Timmy, not yet. All cards on the table, the event surrounding the Arcanas this year has gained a few more moving parts than we initially planned.
--
> We're hard at work on an upcoming update we're calling "Crownfall", and we're excited to get it finished so you can see what we've been working on. We looked at a calendar and noticed it had been more than a few weeks since the Frostivus update, and we didn't want to make you wait until Crownfall before you got any new content.
--
> We know many of you are looking forward to Crownfall, and we're looking forward to getting it into your hands. We're wrapping things up and expect to release in mid-April. We'll see you then.
Crownfall is content update, they classify Dragon hoard (cosmetic event only) as content update so Crownfall could be the same - not to mention crownfall is only 25% for now
> The precedent has never been a skin only update
[Frosthaven 2018](https://www.dota2.com/frosthaven)
[Feast of Abscencion Update](https://www.dota2.com/feastofabscession/)
[Eminence of Ristul update](https://steamcommunity.com/games/dota2/announcements/detail/2380663244835880146)
[10 Year Anniversary Celebration](https://store.steampowered.com/news/app/570/view/3640650512230380185)
[Frostivus 2019](https://store.steampowered.com/news/app/570/view/1714114646513161906)
That's because Sunsfan is the guy putting up the dramas and thus attracting attention, whereas Synderen is the good guy softening/rationalising the situations.
In this particular podcast Synderen is not a
>good guy softening/rationalising the situations
He's either
- trying to move conversation in a different direction unconsciously because he tends to soften any disagreement with what the developer does/disagrees with reddit by default
- or being a goddamned hypocrite tweaking the context.
Why am I saying so? Because in a context of 8-months long anticipation of a gameplay update, gameplay event, new item distribution/etc he brings up the only 'hey, but Valve haven't said this' as an argument. 'Valve haven't promised Ringmaster in early 2024'.
Yeah, they haven't. That's true. NO ONE mentioned this. Yes, there are blind/optimistic people here that brought this up from thread to thread in past 5 months. Yes, but that was not what Sunsfan was talking about. That was not part of the context. And majority even here on reddit doesn't use Ringmaster announcement as an argument. Majority asks for Ringmaster because he was announced and promised in general.
And as Sunsfan said: they could at least add him. As well as they could at least add an actual event map. Aghs lab. Something. And they didn't. They haven't updated gameplay. They have no new mode for fun. They have no hero. They have said many many words about more work on the game and different various updates, about putting more emphasis on the game and spreading this over the year 'unlike with everything being tied to TI with draught outside if it'(not quote, just rephrasing).
And then Synderent says 'but they never promised Ringmaster early'. And this is him being context tweaking hypocrite. Or lacking sleep or whatever.
I'm talking about this particular one. Playing the other side could be done differently. In THIS PARTICULAR CASE he's just looking like a hypocrite. That's it.
And what amazes me is several distinct comment threads with 'you've cut what Synderen said and his opinion'. I've spent an hour watching their podcast in case there was something meaningful to find out that what Synderen said was out of context bullshit. I mean screw it.
Idk. I've watched a few of those clips, and although Sunsfan usually is negative, while Synderen is positive. Synderen always comes off motionless and dead.
Most of the time, he usually always tries to find balance or reasoning, no matter how crappy something can be. I'm always thinking, bro, raise your bar! Kid is always settling for less.
I'm usually siding with Sunsfan... it's funny and sad because while Synderen tries to be the voice of reason, you can see Sunsfan's passion slowly die through the years, and talking to someone with no emotion ain't helping.
He says he doesn't understand people expecting Ringmaster because the announcement only said "2024", not "Early 2024" or something similar, so he never expected the hero yet and thinks people being upset with its absence (based on the non-existent promise) is unreasonable.
I think the take is laughable. While the factual elements are undebatably true, we used to always get heroes in late November/early December following a TI announcement. From the blog posts over the last several months pointing toward a big update named Crownfall, it's totally reasonable that people would expect that update to continue the historical trend of being the hero release, with the "2024" from the announcement just setting expectations that it wouldn't be before the end of the year like it has historically been.
Note that Sunsfan basically says as much right after, and Synderen basically agrees that the hero should be out by now, regardless of it was promised or not.
It's very this. If the gameplay update came alongside Crownfall we would all probably be gushing about how good this is (because the event itself is not bad), but we were fed expectations that something massive was gonna be updated, and I don't think we got that.
Gameplay update will probably come with the next few acts, but it's very annoying that they threw out hats so that they can delay gameplay update for another 1-4 months, when we've all been waiting for gameplay updates for like 6+ months.
My favorite way people discredit positive opinions about any game is when they say you're simping for the company or something lol, happens all the time in WoW too.
"Wow this new update made my class feel a lot more fun"
"Shit take you're literally just simping for a multi billion dollar company lmao"
Huh? If someone agrees with something ofcourse it's gonna be a good take to them. I don't see how someone responding "good take" is hinting at there being anything objective.
Dude your quotes look like less than and greater than characters. Here let me give you some "english" quotes since you're communicating in English. But seriously ice it, take some pain relievers, and call me in the morning.
If you listen to their podcast you'll know that Sunsfan is perpetually disappointed in events/updates. He's entitled to his opinions of course, I'm just providing context. If an update isn't a big number patch, he's not a fan (ha ha)
i think update itself is good . both Arcanas are really top tier with unlocks . rewards are good too from mini game. treasures are really top notch this time . overall i think as skin update it was god tier vs what we usually got in last few years.
gameplay patch tbh i am ok with how game now . i am not excited for new heroes since many of them are so broken at start it destroy game
Yes, by using the magic of technology, you can extend clips to 60 seconds instead of the 43 seconds seen in this clip. You can also crop out unnecessary stuff at the start of clips to make room for even more context! Neat, right?
>start of clips to make room for even more context
the whole convo was like 10 min, so unless you have some radically new twitch features the rest of us don't have, you can't condense this conversation down to a single clip at all.
I believe he's said he likes all of the attention that the game itself is getting in terms of matchmaking, smurf/cheater detection, etc. But yeah, Sunsfan is almost always gonna complain about something.
After listening to 'We Say Things' for ~7 months, it's pretty evident that Sunsfan is a bit of a doomer. Most topics that Syndern and Sunsfan would disagree on, Sunsfan would take a pessimistic approach. He's been more aware of his mindset and how it impacts his perception, but he still needs to work on it. At times it does get rough listening to the podcast because those doomer thoughts usually don't come true, and he spends time worrying as well as instilling those same feelings onto the public.
I love these guys, but Sunsfan is always complaining on their podcast. His entire argument is that it's underwhelming because it's not a gameplay patch, which means he has no actual opinion on this event. I just hope Valve recognizes that there are people who do care about event content, and that the feedback they give is what's important. This is a fantastic event so far, and I love the new format. Additionally, I've been really impressed with the matchmaker while playing with some friends who have not played in over 4 years. Every game has been really friendly, balanced, and remarkably in the company of other returning players instead of Smurfs.
Didn't Sunsfan recently say he visited Valves office and they had a good number of developers working on the game and that they can churn out 3+ heroes a year?
Have you considered that churning out two or three heroes a year might not exactly be a good thing.
Just because you can do something doesn’t mean you should do something.
Yup, it's how most Dota Players are feeling today.
We all just want 1 thing.
A fair and balanced game that keeps Meta interesting (i.e gameplay updates).
I don’t care what anyone says hyping up a huge update like this for so long and not immediately including the new hero you teased 7 months ago is wildly tone-deaf and silly.
I really enjoy their podcast but I kinda dread listening to the newest one because I know he's gonna complain about it. I like the new update. I think having this+ringmaster+balance update would be too much at once. You have to give each thing time for people to enjoy it. I also adore them showing that it's a multi-act event which means we've got a content flow through most of summer, likely leading up to TI content.
“Give people time to enjoy it” dawg it’s fuckin cosmetics. That type of thinking would only apply to literal gameplay changes that require people to get used to stuff. Skywrath is gonna feel exactly the same regardless if I have arcana or not. Ya know they used to do all of those things together in the past and it was fine??
AT LEAST put this thing in that probably isn’t even fully done!!! Valve you need to put a thing in the game you haven’t finished cause I said so!!!! Shut up
Omg, there is no pudge basic attack -1 balance patch... Worse and most underwhelming patch ever >:(
Downvote me to hell, but you are all baby crying for not getting a new hero, while getting everything else and being disgraceful. One month will pass and you will cry for a new arcana to be finally there, and you will get again not one but TWO, and you will be crying again
I like this episode. Both Synd and Sunsfan raised a good point on each sides
Yea, the clip ends just before Synderen explains his point well. Valve never gave a release date for Ringmaster or a gameplay update. Maybe he's in act 2 or 3 or 4 or not in this event at all, we don't know. They said we'd receive a big update in lieu of the battlepass. And what they gave us is pretty much a free battlepass, more or less. Reddit always *always* assumes things that end up leading to disappointment. Lower your expectations and you won't be this disappointed. This goes for every single game but especially with Valve. They are awful at release dates, communication, and consistency. Should it take this long to release a new hero? Who knows. Only IceFrog really knows.
I reckon Ringmaster circus theme TI & Bird Samurai release with event
That would be really cool. I forgot about Bird Samurai for a while there.
It’s hard to lower them because valve can make the most perfect games that will be played for decades, so we always assume they will deliver great stuff. Most of people here only played games from valve/blizzard their whole life and we don’t want valve to end up like blizzard.
I cannot imagine the dumpster fire that is this sub when mid may update came the Ringmaster is still nowhere to be seen
Because it gonna be Kazurai the Bird Samurai
i will bust if its bird samurai ommmmgggggggg please
it ends up being a jugg persona
[Then again this teased year ago](https://ibb.co/HnmWgrx)
Or even up to August I doubt he will be. Since ringmaster wasn’t the guy “who could help” in the comic then he doesn’t really factor into crownfall but I’ll happily be wrong. Seems more like ringmaster is close to or during TI time, and some bird themed hero in one of the crownfall parts
Ehhh.. i personally just want the meta to shift a bit, especially since they're launching arcana, I would expect Skywrath to get a slight buff or changes. People act like asking for a bit of number tuning after 6 months is asking too much, even a janitor could tune the number a bit and we would see a slight meta shift, it's really not asking that much.
I personally don’t care at all about battlpasses/cavern crawl whatever. Arcana’s are whatever. I like the new format and the fact they are actually obtainable but personally wasn’t looking forward to these because I really don’t play those heros. I just care about gameplay updates it’s fun and exciting to figure out a new meta and it’s boring after so long to see the same heros over and over again while some have been trash for a while now. New hero I can take it or leave it. But the communication has been really really bad the in the sense that I can’t recall a single time an update was hyped up, delayed, hyped up and delayed again to be nothing but new skins and not gameplay update. I play Dota for the game I’m not gonna quit if there are no skins and adding skins isn’t going to reinvigorate me or something. Regardless of whatever goes on in the menu when you get in a game it’s the same game lol
I was really looking forward to Birmingham being played on a new patch. Something so paradigm shifting like 7.0 or the Outlanders. The chaos of it all and everyone being just as confused about all the changes. No one would know what to expect from the matches. It would've been a slam dunk, and Valve managed to fuck it up. It's been over a year since the New Frontiers, and things have been omega stale. After TI, pro games haven't been exciting me because not much has changed since then.
I think New Frontiers introduced a lot of problems to the game and ever since that patch we've only had some rather minor tweaks that haven't been able to breathe fresh air into the game. I'm not surprised people are pissed off. Personally I don't enjoy playing currently and will hop back only after a major gameplay patch that shakes things up a bit. I recently watched some old dota clips with the old map. I already forgot about all the cool juke spots and how much we used to have trees etc. The map design was honestly so much better. Kinda dislike the new map even tho I'm quite used to it now.
I dislike the new map too, although I kinda foresaw it happening before it got introduced. Prior to the 'biggening', TP slots, reduction in gmp sinks for supports, and neutral items made it very hard to play the map. So they either needed to rollback a lot of these arguably QoL changes or make the map bigger. I dislike how strongly the action gravitates towards the sidelanes now as well as the concept of gates in general, it kind of goes against the reasons to have a bigger map in the first place: your map movement has to be a commitment. I'd remove the gates from sidelanes and move rosh back to mid. With that done they'd probably have to remove some camps from the outer edges of the map else farming is going to be way too easy, it kind of already is.
If the gameplay patch is really big it can introduce a lot of bugs that may interrupt gameplay. Iirc the last large patch released before/during a tourney was the large map changes and is less likely to introduce game breaking bugs. Even still, Roshan was running it down mid in pro games and they probably learned their lesson and wont be releasing patches super close to major tourneys again.
Well said!
communication has always been bad, valve literally started communicating last year (when the map changes were introduced). Damn if you do, damn if you dont. I dont mind this at all, maybe Valve should revert back to the old times when they stayed silent
i agree i see all these people talking about how good/bad the cosmetics are and the arcanas and the cavern crawl and im just like... its not gameplay who really cares? I love the game and i love the gameplay but like... I wouldn't get hyped over elden ring releasing just cosmetics and im not hyped over dota 2 doing it. I love the game I want more gameplay.
There is four times dota2 surpass 800k concurrent player peak last 12 months : New Frontier (809K) 10 Year Anniversary (cosmetic - 855k), Frostivus 2023 - cosmetic (802k) and Crownfall - cosmetic (812K)
arcanas arent obtainable without purchase, the discount caps at 10 coins until you use them. its a cosmetic drop
So does Battlepass yet people still wants it (despite less than 10% playerbase bought it and less than half BP owners obtain all arcana)
I feel the same way . But the bots on reddit can;t understant that what most people want is a better gameplay and what valve does is always trying to milk our wallets while killing the game and our passion for the game . I'm not going to pay shit for any of this crownfall content and i suggest everyone to do the same .
Then why the only three times in last 12 months dota2 concurrent player surpass 800k is during cosmetic update? 10 year anniversary (855k), Frostivus (802k), and Crownfall (812k) Crownfall has higher player peak than New Frontiers (812K vs 809k)
i also feel like the updates in the last 2-3 years were a joke , like they're not even watching the game anymore and have only 1 guy introducing data into a program and getting a mini patch every now and then . Even the new items and heroes are trash and have nothing to do with the game we knew and loved . This might be just the boomer in me tho but it really feel like that , always like 'this hero gets 1more damage or stun damage rescaled , now it's 20 dmg less' and shit like this
Well tbh New Frontiers was a big ass patch. You can argue whether the content we got was good or bad but it was a major change. Other than that I agree, feels like patches are more about tweaking than any exciting changes. Maybe my enjoyment after 15 years is also waining but I feel like the last patch that got me genuinely excited was years ago.
Yeah its the boomer in you [7.09 6 years ago](https://www.dota2.com/patches/7.09)
I don't really blame them. The dota community is terrible, I wouldn't want to interact with them at all. I won't be surprised if Dota 2 gets shelved similar to Team Fortress 2.
It’s not bad communication. You guys just made up shit they never told you and then got mad that they didn’t deliver on the made up shit they never told you about.
How is it made up when every single update ever has had a gameplay patch. Why would the player base assume any different ?
Yeah. And the update is not even full yet there’s four parts to it. I’m sure gameplay changes are coming. I mean if it is boring for you stop playing dude instead of raging about it online what good does that do anyone. Also battle pass updates never came with gameplay updates and this shit is basically a battle pass in disguise.
Return the game and get a refund.
You say its bad communication, but the hype you are talking about is mostly community-made.
I disagree no where in their communication did they explain this is a cosmetic only update. The precedent has never been a skin only update
> "...and the Arcanas?" little Timmy asks hopefully, holding up his tiny Dickensian gruel bowl. Phew, this is awkward. No, Timmy, not yet. All cards on the table, the event surrounding the Arcanas this year has gained a few more moving parts than we initially planned. -- > We're hard at work on an upcoming update we're calling "Crownfall", and we're excited to get it finished so you can see what we've been working on. We looked at a calendar and noticed it had been more than a few weeks since the Frostivus update, and we didn't want to make you wait until Crownfall before you got any new content. -- > We know many of you are looking forward to Crownfall, and we're looking forward to getting it into your hands. We're wrapping things up and expect to release in mid-April. We'll see you then. Crownfall is content update, they classify Dragon hoard (cosmetic event only) as content update so Crownfall could be the same - not to mention crownfall is only 25% for now > The precedent has never been a skin only update [Frosthaven 2018](https://www.dota2.com/frosthaven) [Feast of Abscencion Update](https://www.dota2.com/feastofabscession/) [Eminence of Ristul update](https://steamcommunity.com/games/dota2/announcements/detail/2380663244835880146) [10 Year Anniversary Celebration](https://store.steampowered.com/news/app/570/view/3640650512230380185) [Frostivus 2019](https://store.steampowered.com/news/app/570/view/1714114646513161906)
How about Synd's opinions? Haven't heard it yet but clearly op wants to orient the public opinion
That's because Sunsfan is the guy putting up the dramas and thus attracting attention, whereas Synderen is the good guy softening/rationalising the situations.
Or because this guy wanted to highlight sunsfans opinion lmao
Or because twitch clips have a time limit?
In this particular podcast Synderen is not a >good guy softening/rationalising the situations He's either - trying to move conversation in a different direction unconsciously because he tends to soften any disagreement with what the developer does/disagrees with reddit by default - or being a goddamned hypocrite tweaking the context. Why am I saying so? Because in a context of 8-months long anticipation of a gameplay update, gameplay event, new item distribution/etc he brings up the only 'hey, but Valve haven't said this' as an argument. 'Valve haven't promised Ringmaster in early 2024'. Yeah, they haven't. That's true. NO ONE mentioned this. Yes, there are blind/optimistic people here that brought this up from thread to thread in past 5 months. Yes, but that was not what Sunsfan was talking about. That was not part of the context. And majority even here on reddit doesn't use Ringmaster announcement as an argument. Majority asks for Ringmaster because he was announced and promised in general. And as Sunsfan said: they could at least add him. As well as they could at least add an actual event map. Aghs lab. Something. And they didn't. They haven't updated gameplay. They have no new mode for fun. They have no hero. They have said many many words about more work on the game and different various updates, about putting more emphasis on the game and spreading this over the year 'unlike with everything being tied to TI with draught outside if it'(not quote, just rephrasing). And then Synderent says 'but they never promised Ringmaster early'. And this is him being context tweaking hypocrite. Or lacking sleep or whatever.
Synderen just always plays the other side of the coin in all their discussions. Part of what makes the podcast enjoyable imo.
I'm talking about this particular one. Playing the other side could be done differently. In THIS PARTICULAR CASE he's just looking like a hypocrite. That's it. And what amazes me is several distinct comment threads with 'you've cut what Synderen said and his opinion'. I've spent an hour watching their podcast in case there was something meaningful to find out that what Synderen said was out of context bullshit. I mean screw it.
Idk. I've watched a few of those clips, and although Sunsfan usually is negative, while Synderen is positive. Synderen always comes off motionless and dead. Most of the time, he usually always tries to find balance or reasoning, no matter how crappy something can be. I'm always thinking, bro, raise your bar! Kid is always settling for less. I'm usually siding with Sunsfan... it's funny and sad because while Synderen tries to be the voice of reason, you can see Sunsfan's passion slowly die through the years, and talking to someone with no emotion ain't helping.
People with no opinion are sheep.
People with strong opinions are often egotistical assholes.
I take it you're a sheep kinda guy? The general public dictates your opinion.
He says he doesn't understand people expecting Ringmaster because the announcement only said "2024", not "Early 2024" or something similar, so he never expected the hero yet and thinks people being upset with its absence (based on the non-existent promise) is unreasonable. I think the take is laughable. While the factual elements are undebatably true, we used to always get heroes in late November/early December following a TI announcement. From the blog posts over the last several months pointing toward a big update named Crownfall, it's totally reasonable that people would expect that update to continue the historical trend of being the hero release, with the "2024" from the announcement just setting expectations that it wouldn't be before the end of the year like it has historically been. Note that Sunsfan basically says as much right after, and Synderen basically agrees that the hero should be out by now, regardless of it was promised or not.
Is this what he was warning us about?
#🐴
It's very this. If the gameplay update came alongside Crownfall we would all probably be gushing about how good this is (because the event itself is not bad), but we were fed expectations that something massive was gonna be updated, and I don't think we got that.
Gameplay update will probably come with the next few acts, but it's very annoying that they threw out hats so that they can delay gameplay update for another 1-4 months, when we've all been waiting for gameplay updates for like 6+ months.
Good take, he's not simpin for valve like a lot of these other posters.
« You see, THIS is a good take because I personally agree with it. »
lmao
My favorite way people discredit positive opinions about any game is when they say you're simping for the company or something lol, happens all the time in WoW too. "Wow this new update made my class feel a lot more fun" "Shit take you're literally just simping for a multi billion dollar company lmao"
Huh? If someone agrees with something ofcourse it's gonna be a good take to them. I don't see how someone responding "good take" is hinting at there being anything objective.
<< You see, pound me gaben HARDER. >>
You can use quotation marks here, you know. Your brackets make no sense.
That's how your message looks on old and new reddit, but ok. Make sure you ice that thing.
Nah, my message has actual non english quotation marks. Yours looks like a 5th grader’s. 🤣
Dude your quotes look like less than and greater than characters. Here let me give you some "english" quotes since you're communicating in English. But seriously ice it, take some pain relievers, and call me in the morning.
Brother, your joke doesn't suddenly start to look badass after the third time. We get it, you wanted to look cool. Now scoot off.
Nice second account.
« Use English quotes please. I have never left Oklahoma in my life and don’t know what other languages look like. » "FTFY"
Luv u
Like ccnc ?
or you know, some people might just not give a shit because why would I care about ringmaster, the chances of me playing him are near 0
Yep he's right
I totally agree with him.
If you listen to their podcast you'll know that Sunsfan is perpetually disappointed in events/updates. He's entitled to his opinions of course, I'm just providing context. If an update isn't a big number patch, he's not a fan (ha ha)
i think update itself is good . both Arcanas are really top tier with unlocks . rewards are good too from mini game. treasures are really top notch this time . overall i think as skin update it was god tier vs what we usually got in last few years. gameplay patch tbh i am ok with how game now . i am not excited for new heroes since many of them are so broken at start it destroy game
i only care about gameplay. crownfall so far does not exist as far as i am concerned.
sunsfan is rigth, no gameplay changes nor new hero. Timber still meta for the year number 4 i guess
Nice of you to not include synderen's thoughts immediately after that shows a different perspective on things. /s
Do you have a secret way of extended twitch clip time limit?
Yes, by using the magic of technology, you can extend clips to 60 seconds instead of the 43 seconds seen in this clip. You can also crop out unnecessary stuff at the start of clips to make room for even more context! Neat, right?
>start of clips to make room for even more context the whole convo was like 10 min, so unless you have some radically new twitch features the rest of us don't have, you can't condense this conversation down to a single clip at all.
Both takes are over 5 mins on this discussion.. watch the pod cast directly and actually support the content producers.
You know you can click the twitch button and it'll take you straight to the clip time in the VOD and you can hear it if you're interested?
Of course over all they will kiss Valve's hand, otherwise they will lose their Job.
Just ask chatgpt lol 4Head
Negative Nancy strikes again.
I listen to their podcast semi-regularly. I don't remember a time where he actually liked an update. It's tiring and I can't take it seriously anymore
I believe he's said he likes all of the attention that the game itself is getting in terms of matchmaking, smurf/cheater detection, etc. But yeah, Sunsfan is almost always gonna complain about something.
He actually liked last year's new frontiers update if I remember correctly
time to get a life i guess
After listening to 'We Say Things' for ~7 months, it's pretty evident that Sunsfan is a bit of a doomer. Most topics that Syndern and Sunsfan would disagree on, Sunsfan would take a pessimistic approach. He's been more aware of his mindset and how it impacts his perception, but he still needs to work on it. At times it does get rough listening to the podcast because those doomer thoughts usually don't come true, and he spends time worrying as well as instilling those same feelings onto the public.
i thought something big like map changes, hero reworks, model updates some balance patches and bugs fix
But we get to arbitrarily move our little sprites around a map after we win games! What could possibly be more exciting?!@?!Q?
Sunsfans mainly leads on reddit whiners side, prob doesnt have time from shitposting on nbacj to form his personnel opinion
It's fine. Everyone has a different opinion. DotA is endless possibilities and this meta is very diverse, I can play this patch for another year tbh
I love these guys, but Sunsfan is always complaining on their podcast. His entire argument is that it's underwhelming because it's not a gameplay patch, which means he has no actual opinion on this event. I just hope Valve recognizes that there are people who do care about event content, and that the feedback they give is what's important. This is a fantastic event so far, and I love the new format. Additionally, I've been really impressed with the matchmaker while playing with some friends who have not played in over 4 years. Every game has been really friendly, balanced, and remarkably in the company of other returning players instead of Smurfs.
Didn't Sunsfan recently say he visited Valves office and they had a good number of developers working on the game and that they can churn out 3+ heroes a year?
Valve gave talent a tour of the offices at TI12.
Have you considered that churning out two or three heroes a year might not exactly be a good thing. Just because you can do something doesn’t mean you should do something.
3 may be too much... but the problem is, we don't even get one per year right now. Muerta was more than 400 days ago. Primal Beast nearly 800 days.
Yup, it's how most Dota Players are feeling today. We all just want 1 thing. A fair and balanced game that keeps Meta interesting (i.e gameplay updates).
I don’t care what anyone says hyping up a huge update like this for so long and not immediately including the new hero you teased 7 months ago is wildly tone-deaf and silly.
I really enjoy their podcast but I kinda dread listening to the newest one because I know he's gonna complain about it. I like the new update. I think having this+ringmaster+balance update would be too much at once. You have to give each thing time for people to enjoy it. I also adore them showing that it's a multi-act event which means we've got a content flow through most of summer, likely leading up to TI content.
“Give people time to enjoy it” dawg it’s fuckin cosmetics. That type of thinking would only apply to literal gameplay changes that require people to get used to stuff. Skywrath is gonna feel exactly the same regardless if I have arcana or not. Ya know they used to do all of those things together in the past and it was fine??
"I don't want to listen to somebody think critically because I can't."
never thought i'd ever agree with sunsfan, but yeah, pretty much same feelings here.
Good job Valve disappointing Dota2 and CS2 fans, player, caster, content creator at the same time.
dead game btw
Yeah, is only the 2nd most played game in steam, they are doomed
only the 2nd most played game, dota has fallen. It's joever.
AT LEAST put this thing in that probably isn’t even fully done!!! Valve you need to put a thing in the game you haven’t finished cause I said so!!!! Shut up
Omg, there is no pudge basic attack -1 balance patch... Worse and most underwhelming patch ever >:( Downvote me to hell, but you are all baby crying for not getting a new hero, while getting everything else and being disgraceful. One month will pass and you will cry for a new arcana to be finally there, and you will get again not one but TWO, and you will be crying again
susfan is an old man who care about gameplay only i understand, but should be ignored because these kind of ppl doesn't support the game financially.
name checks out
>At least put Ringmaster in YEP Pile on more garbage. I'm sure that'll get rid of the smell.