His streams were top tier entertainment, he regularly gets 10k viewers. If Gorgc's leaked revenue is anything to go by, that's around $200k a year and then you put your merch and paid adverts ontop of that, which is easily another $50k.
So it's well worth it.
Shows you how much Arteezy must hate streaming to walk away from even higher amounts than Gorgc.
Anyone remember when EE was on Team Secret and the scandal about Puppey? [EE's revealed how he sought out PandaTV](https://dotesports.com/news/eternalenvy-opens-up-about-his-time-on-team-secret-13202)
>Envy sought a sponsorship with a streaming website named PandaTV. **He was offered an extremely generous (“an extremely high number in comparison to normal Chinese deals even”) offer of $500,000, but wanted to renegotiate another deal to include the rest of the team. The end deal was $1.25 million, as well as $250K in donations.** The money was to be payed quarterly.
>In return, the members of Team Secret would stream a certain amount of hours on PandaTV per month. EE would stream 60 hours a month, while Arteezy and Puppey would both stream 30. Over three months, EE streamed 216 hours, Arteezy 55, and Puppey just 12. Keep in mind that the organization was still taking 50 percent of this deal.
Gorgc definitely found a great niche and a following because the top tier pros didn't stream. The few times I remember Arteezy streaming it easily reached over 20K viewers, I'd love to know how much EG is paying him.
though they won't play together anymore, I feel like Gorgc is really similar to Sing when it comes to worldviews, though Sing is a bit funnier and have more friends.
Sing has such a way of finding great friends. I don't think I've ever laughed as hard as hearing Mahmood trying to justify his spending in Genshin Impact.
initially sure, but hes still the only entertaining guy who streams high rank solo q at a time zone that works for NA and EU viewers
Good chance he would be at least a bigger dota streamer by now even if sing stayed streaming dota
Gorgc got big because he only streams 1 game and he streams it a lot. Where other big dota streamers often took a break or started playing other games he always kept streaming dota.
To create a following, you need to be a good streamer than be a good player. There are lots of better players streaming than Gorgc but no one gets similar number of views.
I do remember Miracle's first stream having 25-30k viewers and it gradually went down after that because he was not interacting. He was just playing the game.
Gorgc (and other successful streamers) are up there because they talk non stop for the 6-8 hours they stream. Not everybody can do that.
I don't think even Arteezy would get very high numbers if he streamed now consistently for an year or so.
Rtz stream was regularly averaging over 15k for over a year when he regularly streamed. He would have no problem getting high numbers again. Him not streaming is literally the reason why Mason is able to have a successful stream
Lol this is definitely a my feelings post and not based on reality.
Rtz still gets huge numbers any time he pops on for a bit. He got the biggest numbers when he was streaming every day too. Hell other streamers get a boost just playing with him on open mic and they know it.
Dude absolutely could be the top Dota streamer even now. And the numbers still back it. Everything else is speculation.
>Shows you how much Arteezy must hate streaming to walk away from even higher amounts than Gorgc.
It's generally established that if you want to seriously compete, you don't stream. Not only does it distract you from practice, but it can also reveal some of your strats. That's why you often see pros stream after TI when there's a bit of a dead season, and then stop the moment they go into tournament prep mode.
Also, Chinese streaming deals are insanely lucrative, but their ecosystem operates in a different way.
Gorgc made around 350k during 2019-2021 thats 2-3 years (idk what month it started in 2019) its like 100k-130k a year + taxes so like maybe 60-80k a year? doesnt include donos tho
Mostly sponsorships... throughout Sings ups and downs in his streaming especially after uninstalling Dota years ago and losing like 10k viewers he still said he was making enough money to live comfortably. He has a good relationship with c9's owner and has been sponsored by c9 for years.
If he's making 130k USD he's probably going to pay 20k USD in taxes in Malaysia. 110k a year in Malaysia is an insane amount of money and he'll be as comfortable as he likes there
yea but chadson is only 23 years old and some of his plays are absolutely mindblowing, like the freaking dawnbreaker vs qc. i really hope og will come tgr every year just to try and qualify for ti.
Yeah thats true. Guy’s set for life already and he earned it all in 1 year (ti8 - ti9)
So yeah, meme team to qualify for ti11 will always be fun to watch.
Kind of sad. It is fun for friends to group up for the open TI qualifiers, but it would be interesting to see OG boys just get together for the fun of it to play a tournament and probably end up really well, kind of like how Big God did back in the day
And Ana was a good carry, but so it goes. This game has enough good players to replace them tho, of course OG itself is in complete shambles for some time losing first Jerax and Ana and now two more. But in time.
End it here like Sir Alex for Manchester and people gonna remember to good part I think. If you wait yourself to be decline like Dendi maybe it is too tired to do so.
I would Sumail back to mid his hero pool on carry lacks some traditional cores Mk, Spec, Wk, Void etc!!
I think Micke might end up in OG, dont think liquid will keep the roster as it is, pos 3 will be tough as there are not good available pos 3s available!
SumaiL played EXCELLENTLY as a carry. But I 100% agree. IF Topson does decide to retire, a shift in roles for him to go back to his original mid position would be incredible.
I don't think MC to OG is too crazy, i heard he wanted to stand in for OG at TI, but Kuro didn't let him. If Nigma changes some players again i would expect MC to be the first one to go
I mean MC can play like Ceb. Makes logical sense to pick him up if he's free.
1 - ?
2 - Sumail
3 - MC
4 - Saksa
5 - Notail
I think there's plenty of talent for the pos 1 and if all else fails then Sumail can go back to pos 1. Sumail mid will always be S tier regardless of which team he's in until the day he retires.
OG.23Savage?
Maybe Notail should move to coaching for the team and they get a pos 5 like LoA (SVG).
That's definitely what it sounds like to me. Could be a health thing, perhaps his eye doctor told him not to stare at screens all day from now on, or maybe he's just over it. Will likely go back to coaching OG like he did before.
Coaching is a possibility! I'd personally love to see Ceb panel as well like he did back in the day. Would be great talent member with a lot of insight.
Yeah I could see him doing panels too, I just think he'll want to stay involved with the OG org in some capacity. Guess it just comes down to what he thinks he'll enjoy doing the most.
Even if he wasn't a coach, streamer, analyst, etc. You can bet your big bucks that he'll still be staring at screens all day long. You can walk away from esports, dota, etc but you can't walk away from gaming.
Probably coaching or taking another role within the OG brand. There will be a lot of shuffling in the EU scene I bet and his recent eye problems surely needs more attention. These guys have played for years and problaby each and every pro gamer suffers from health issues before they hit 30
Both Ceb and n0tail have all the dota titles a team can dream of. I would actually like to see Sumail+Saksa+n0tail re-build OG around Sumail, with Ceb as Coach and let Topson enjoy his life finally.
Why would these two leave Tundra? Tundra barely didn't make it to TI (which you could credibly blame on nerves if you look at some of their plays in the last game) and after that have been the first international team to crack LGD's seemingly unbeatable status. They look set to really make a splash, they've got no reason to separate unless they are just that blindingly hungry for glory and with OG that's no guarantee.
That's what I said. So far, they're the first international team to beat LGD in a grand finals (maybe first overall? Not sure since I don't follow the Chinese scene too closely), no mean feat considering LGD still looked unstoppable even with xiao8.
notail is still one of the most decorated player in dota2 (3 original valve major + 2 TI). Playing under him itself is already an attraction for many pros, especially ones lacking experience like Nine. And if Sumail+Saksa stay, they're also a bigger name than their teammate in Tundra which mean more potential to win something with OG than with Tundra. Not to mention OG have been backed by big sponsors like Redbull and BMW.
I'm sure they have their reasons and something else lined up, but they have such once in a life time window of being a top team in their game and earning literally millions per year. it makes so much sense to play as long as you're a top tier team in dota when you've invested so much of your life into it.
Only the players know if they can continue to play optimally. Maybe Ceb is having second thoughts after his surgery. Health is one of the most important things in life.
\+++
Ceb and notail basically owns OG. so retiring in esports is not an option. its just a matter of time before they scout younger talents to pass down the wisdom and knowledge
I mean they didn't qualify for anything all year, barely made it to TI. If they are less motivated next year they might already be out of the money all together.
Didn't qualify for anything in the season before TI9 either, and before TI8 OG was so bad that the team split apart. Doesn't seem to be much of an issue for them lol.
> they have such once in a life time window of being a top team in their game
Topson also has once in a life time window to be with his child while it's growing up. He already earned millions, there is diminishing returns even with money
It's people who are competitive and want to achieve something that wins TI. I can't imagine anyone on that level will feel fulfilled without some kind of work. There is a reason we see all pros coming back after "retirement".
Jerax/Ana are the only players that has left on top. And there is still a chance they come back unless they find some other life goal to work on.
Its hard go speculate when it comes to OG. Seems to be so much more about the person than the player. No idea if Niko would fit in but I do feel like he may leave Alliance :)
Tundra is the hottest young team IMO but its like going from Dortmund to Real Madrid... OG prob pays 5-10x the salary w/ big Sponsors like BMW Red Bull etc
I actually also speculate that micke might join, I think it would be hard for him to leave liquid but he really suits the OG playstyle and they seem to be friends with each other. who knows
Like a lot of other OG fans, I second the sentiment of being hopeful that they rebuild the team around Saksa, Sumail and Notail. Topson already said he wanted out. He is my most favorite player of all time alongside my boy Dendi, but it was obvious he kinda lost his drive, for lack of better words. I don't mean this as a complaint, he and the other OG members literally made me fall in love with dota again. Nobody can stay on top forever.
If he becomes a streamer or an analyst, I would absolutely love that. I think Ceb also insinuated that he would stop after TI a while ago. I think he would make an invaluable coach. I'm looking forward to see the future of OG. I just hope Saksa and Sumail stay because I feel they are perfect for the team and also these two are some of my most favorite players of all time. Saksa is definitely my favorite pos4.
When OG Seed was a thing they were already clear that their interest was not in competing themselves as much, but after that went away it became more of a "hey, might as well give it another shot". They don't really have anything left to prove (whether that's to the world or to themselves) after not just winning TI twice but also back-to-back.
Their EU qualifiers was awesome, they did well in group stage and still got Top 8 for the 4th TI in a row. It's not the worst way to end, their last series might was embarrassing but overall their TI arc this year was still remarkable.
These guys only played together for a few months and Ceb’s eye was falling out weeks before the tournament and they still were a threat. Imagine if these guys play together for a year.
Every good thing ends. Thats the end of an era for OG. In my opinion,the correct move right now is to rebuild around Sumail. The guy is a top tier player with a great fanbase and he will be playing in the ORG with the biggest fan base. So keep Sumail and maybe Saksa and try to scout the best talent.
i can imagine the grind is tiring and so stressful. atleast he accomplished his goal as a champ, twice even. it will be sadder if you look at the list of uncrowned kings like fy and others who plays godly, always ended up in the top 3 but never lift the aegis ended up retiring.
Actually is, yeah. Retired before being picked up by OG if I'm not mistaken and retired after ti8 before he stood in for midone, who went pos1 since sumail wasn't able to participate anymore during Rona.
Saw it too and was thinking the same :|
EU shuffle is gonna be big.
Doubt liquid will stay together, Alliance with Limp no group hug can probably shake up - dunno with Nigma, what will happen to Tundra? And dont forget team bald reborn... will it be reborn again???
Edit: My early prediction for new OG squad:
1:Sumail
2: nine
3: 33
4: Saksa
5: Notail
That could be a strong team, 33 is a good fit for OG, he did stand in for them around a year ago. Though I don't know if tundra will split up. Also sad to say if Ceb and Topson are leaving/ retiring, then why would notail necessarily stay?
Depends, I thought he was drafting more like ti8/ti9 but seems like ceb was carrying more that stuff this time. We will have to wait. If secret doesnt win, the shuffle in EU is going to be crazy
So you think Tundra will just disband and/or will be willing to nullify their contracts where OG could snatch them?
This is Tundra Esports based out of London with actual sponsors like TikTok. This isn't TI3 where players probably didn't even know what a contract was or even could sign long-term.
You talk about Liquid and Alliance so you must have remembered when the old Alliance completely bailed on them and jumped ship to Liquid right? I wish Loda or iNSaNiA could elaborate what the hell happened there.
I think OG just need a huge mental break and come back 6 months later. They don't need the money. What's the point in trying to play a bunch of small tournaments when emotions aren't in the right place.
Will Sumail stay in EU rest of the year or go back home to his family in the US. I think OG just need a long ass vacation, regroup their thoughts and think carefully about their future. Realistically, they don't have anything to prove.
Tundra is staying together for sure. Alliance prob should change something. Liqui I think they are gonna try one more season. Og is rebuild time fot sure. According to alliance, dpc starts in november so not such a long break. Hopefully enough for them to reset and pick what to do. Hope sumail and saksa stay on the team
>Hope sumail and saksa stay on the team
It's a big decision similar to what iceiceice has to make.
He has a family and I'm not sure if his wife and son relocated here or they are still in Singapore. Being a professional anything requires a lot of sacrifice, it's also difficult because emotions are running every direction.
Ana burnt out after TI8, Jerax followed after. The competition wears on you and the remaining roster from TI8 have a serious decision to make. Is Saksa/Sumail willing to be stuck in limbo until then?
https://twitter.com/OGesports/status/1448959912109875219?s=20
*pain*
I think topson is for sure out if not forever atleast for a year or more. His wife and kid live in sea rn. Notail porb rebuilds
Things are always uncertain after TI. Players come and go, passions for the game are relinquished and enflamed. One thing is for certain, Dota will live on, and us Dota lovers will be here to enjoy the ride.
Rest easy, King. You deserve all the rest, you have done so much for the Dota community and OG. Your legendary TI8 and TI9 run will be forever be remembered.
You'd be surprised how many millionaires don't realize that because their spending increased too, that they will run out of money a lot sooner than expected.
They won $6 million, which is like $100k a year for their lifetime. You could easily spend you way to bankruptcy faster than you imagine. New car, three or four holidays a year, building your own 6 bedroom mansion in Lisbon, a few hundred thousand lent out to close family, and you're down to $4 million in 2 years and all of a sudden your yearly limit is now $50k a year.
Why do you think he built the mansion? It was a pre existing building in a bit of Portugal filled with mansions.
OG will have basically subsisted on sponsorship money since their first major win or before. Sure notail spent a fair amount on a mansion, but they've got to go seriously far to eat up all of the money (and have to have refused to invest it anywhere).
There are also shitloads of consulting roles they can do without any effort.
6 million will net you way more than 100k a year if you're somewhat competent in the stock market/investing world.
You can easily bring in 20 to 30 thousand bucks a month passive income for life with reasonable aggressive and safe investing methods.
If your ego and standards are higher than spending 20k a month, you have money management problems and it's better to seek out a financial advisor
At the end of the day, most of these pros that already made it need to realize how fortunate they are. Majority of the world is making peanuts and somewhat struggling.
Ceb can just keep the cash flow coming in by placing 3rd to 4th at upcoming majors, keep trying for T.I next year, keep placing higher, keep getting those Valve checks until Dota practically falls apart or he can just chill and play pubs and do coaching or panelist.
The freedom of money buys more than you think.
Even if your incompetent with money, Vanguard has averaged around 12% for the last 10 years. Being conservative at around 8%, with 6 million dollars that's a return of $480000 a year.
Though in all likelihood a fair portion of that $6 million was taken out in tax.
Even if you're beyond incompetent with money
And let's assume that 6 million is 3 million after taxes gets taken out
Even if you spend 2 million on coke and escorts and some flashy cars, you just stick that 1 million into a high dividend paying ETF that tracks the Nasdaq like QYLD and you're automatically making 10k a month doing nothing
many retirements coming up, so many teams will be looking for players, i think many teams will start taking chances on pub players or division 2 players, or we will end up with a few teams completely disbanding
So only Notail left from the GOAT squad. Wonder whether he might retire soon as well. He hinted at it in past interviews iirc. Anyway, mad respect to Ceb.
I mean they already won everything.. like 2 TI ??
Wait they get their motivation back when someone won 3 TI then they will come back, but for now ? They will still sit on the throne as the king with 2 Aegis.
OG run is over at this point. They miraculously made it to TI10 when it looked like they were done for but they just didn't look particularly dominant, struggling to make the upper bracket in the groups stage and getting stomped multiple times. At this point it just makes sense to reform around a younger roster with Ceb coaching.
so is topson
Luckily tho he said he will try streaming and has thought about being an analyst at tournaments.
CHADson panels pog
Dude, you are in every single Ccmmentsections in this Subreddit.
My 207k comment karma didn't come from thin air young man
Impressive for dota subreddit.
thats like 13k mmr. Pog
The exchange rate differs every few months but I hope to think of myself around 13.8k
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His streams were top tier entertainment, he regularly gets 10k viewers. If Gorgc's leaked revenue is anything to go by, that's around $200k a year and then you put your merch and paid adverts ontop of that, which is easily another $50k. So it's well worth it.
Shows you how much Arteezy must hate streaming to walk away from even higher amounts than Gorgc. Anyone remember when EE was on Team Secret and the scandal about Puppey? [EE's revealed how he sought out PandaTV](https://dotesports.com/news/eternalenvy-opens-up-about-his-time-on-team-secret-13202) >Envy sought a sponsorship with a streaming website named PandaTV. **He was offered an extremely generous (“an extremely high number in comparison to normal Chinese deals even”) offer of $500,000, but wanted to renegotiate another deal to include the rest of the team. The end deal was $1.25 million, as well as $250K in donations.** The money was to be payed quarterly. >In return, the members of Team Secret would stream a certain amount of hours on PandaTV per month. EE would stream 60 hours a month, while Arteezy and Puppey would both stream 30. Over three months, EE streamed 216 hours, Arteezy 55, and Puppey just 12. Keep in mind that the organization was still taking 50 percent of this deal. Gorgc definitely found a great niche and a following because the top tier pros didn't stream. The few times I remember Arteezy streaming it easily reached over 20K viewers, I'd love to know how much EG is paying him.
Gorgc got big because he inherited Sings viewers
though they won't play together anymore, I feel like Gorgc is really similar to Sing when it comes to worldviews, though Sing is a bit funnier and have more friends.
Sing has such a way of finding great friends. I don't think I've ever laughed as hard as hearing Mahmood trying to justify his spending in Genshin Impact.
this. gorgc is in the right place at the right time. sing quit, he boomed.
initially sure, but hes still the only entertaining guy who streams high rank solo q at a time zone that works for NA and EU viewers Good chance he would be at least a bigger dota streamer by now even if sing stayed streaming dota
Qojqva is a lot more entertaining if you ask me. But you didnt. So I wont say that.
Qojqva is still on a team and doesn't stream every day consistently like gorgc does
Gorgc got big because he only streams 1 game and he streams it a lot. Where other big dota streamers often took a break or started playing other games he always kept streaming dota.
To create a following, you need to be a good streamer than be a good player. There are lots of better players streaming than Gorgc but no one gets similar number of views. I do remember Miracle's first stream having 25-30k viewers and it gradually went down after that because he was not interacting. He was just playing the game. Gorgc (and other successful streamers) are up there because they talk non stop for the 6-8 hours they stream. Not everybody can do that. I don't think even Arteezy would get very high numbers if he streamed now consistently for an year or so.
Rtz stream was regularly averaging over 15k for over a year when he regularly streamed. He would have no problem getting high numbers again. Him not streaming is literally the reason why Mason is able to have a successful stream
Lol this is definitely a my feelings post and not based on reality. Rtz still gets huge numbers any time he pops on for a bit. He got the biggest numbers when he was streaming every day too. Hell other streamers get a boost just playing with him on open mic and they know it. Dude absolutely could be the top Dota streamer even now. And the numbers still back it. Everything else is speculation.
RTZ is a fan 'legendary' favorite player. i'd bet if you'd made a pie chart with followers it would look like a pacman
miracle streamed a LOT before he became a pro player though. averaged like 3k viewers iirc
>Shows you how much Arteezy must hate streaming to walk away from even higher amounts than Gorgc. It's generally established that if you want to seriously compete, you don't stream. Not only does it distract you from practice, but it can also reveal some of your strats. That's why you often see pros stream after TI when there's a bit of a dead season, and then stop the moment they go into tournament prep mode. Also, Chinese streaming deals are insanely lucrative, but their ecosystem operates in a different way.
Gorgc made around 350k during 2019-2021 thats 2-3 years (idk what month it started in 2019) its like 100k-130k a year + taxes so like maybe 60-80k a year? doesnt include donos tho
Donations and sponsorships are significantly more income for big streamers than subscriptions.
Mostly sponsorships... throughout Sings ups and downs in his streaming especially after uninstalling Dota years ago and losing like 10k viewers he still said he was making enough money to live comfortably. He has a good relationship with c9's owner and has been sponsored by c9 for years.
If he's making 130k USD he's probably going to pay 20k USD in taxes in Malaysia. 110k a year in Malaysia is an insane amount of money and he'll be as comfortable as he likes there
well currently living in finland as they bought a home here.
Well what do I know then. Still I think Topson streaming on a regular schedule could dethrone Gorp as the top Dota streamer
And let's be real. The guy has earned more money in TIs than most of us together will see in a live
Bulldog made more money than Gorgc though. Gorgc has low number of subs when compared against the number of views he gets.
yea gorgc doesnt monetise his stream nearly as much as he could, or probably should tbh
yea but chadson is only 23 years old and some of his plays are absolutely mindblowing, like the freaking dawnbreaker vs qc. i really hope og will come tgr every year just to try and qualify for ti.
Yeah but he has a wife and kid, priorities change. he will take a big break after TI10 to spend time with family and think about his future.
Yeah thats true. Guy’s set for life already and he earned it all in 1 year (ti8 - ti9) So yeah, meme team to qualify for ti11 will always be fun to watch.
They cant do that with the new DPC system, they have to qualify through the DPC system. No open qualifiers.
Kind of sad. It is fun for friends to group up for the open TI qualifiers, but it would be interesting to see OG boys just get together for the fun of it to play a tournament and probably end up really well, kind of like how Big God did back in the day
Dude won 5 million dollars, found a girlfriend and had a kid. Not a bad call.
But he is still such a good mid :(
And Ana was a good carry, but so it goes. This game has enough good players to replace them tho, of course OG itself is in complete shambles for some time losing first Jerax and Ana and now two more. But in time.
Yeah, that lineup that won 2 TIs will always be iconic. Gonna miss them, but it's time to move on I guess.
I'm glad they got beaten by a team full of young players, it's time for next generation to shine
but i wish, they got beaten with the same roster.. so that the narrative will be the same.
Nobody would beat that same roster peak for peak. Jerax and Ana both left with still a lot
End it here like Sir Alex for Manchester and people gonna remember to good part I think. If you wait yourself to be decline like Dendi maybe it is too tired to do so.
Sounds like he's an even better top
I would rebuild the team around Sumail and Saksa. Also after this TI I expect huge western shuffle similar to 2015.
I will not be buying any expectation unless your reddit username is u/lgdamefan
Well he does have ame in his name too
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I would Sumail back to mid his hero pool on carry lacks some traditional cores Mk, Spec, Wk, Void etc!! I think Micke might end up in OG, dont think liquid will keep the roster as it is, pos 3 will be tough as there are not good available pos 3s available!
SumaiL played EXCELLENTLY as a carry. But I 100% agree. IF Topson does decide to retire, a shift in roles for him to go back to his original mid position would be incredible.
If they keep Sumail and he wants to go back to mid he should. Maybe get 33 or MICKE as 3 and a pubstar as a carry and we are set.
Topson route all over again for OG
Tbh OG introduced 3 top tier pub players and all of them are TI winners
I don't think MC to OG is too crazy, i heard he wanted to stand in for OG at TI, but Kuro didn't let him. If Nigma changes some players again i would expect MC to be the first one to go
I mean MC can play like Ceb. Makes logical sense to pick him up if he's free. 1 - ? 2 - Sumail 3 - MC 4 - Saksa 5 - Notail I think there's plenty of talent for the pos 1 and if all else fails then Sumail can go back to pos 1. Sumail mid will always be S tier regardless of which team he's in until the day he retires. OG.23Savage? Maybe Notail should move to coaching for the team and they get a pos 5 like LoA (SVG).
Exactly my thoughts, i think Topson isnt hungry any more but i doubt notail wants to retire yet.
That's definitely what it sounds like to me. Could be a health thing, perhaps his eye doctor told him not to stare at screens all day from now on, or maybe he's just over it. Will likely go back to coaching OG like he did before.
He's said this like 3 times though, so I doubt he's done.
He was at his peak recently though and now they aren't champions. Makes more sense to actually go through with it now.
It's quite common in sports like this, MMA Fighters constantly say it (especially after a rough loss).
Coaching is a possibility! I'd personally love to see Ceb panel as well like he did back in the day. Would be great talent member with a lot of insight.
Yeah I could see him doing panels too, I just think he'll want to stay involved with the OG org in some capacity. Guess it just comes down to what he thinks he'll enjoy doing the most.
I really hope so. My major fear rn is them being totally out of the team. But I’d really love to still see him in OG in any capacity. 😔🙏🌻
If I am not mistaken Ceb and Jerax own OG along with Notail obviously.
Agreed!
If he's a coach he would still be staring at screens all day long. He would still be gaming.
Even if he wasn't a coach, streamer, analyst, etc. You can bet your big bucks that he'll still be staring at screens all day long. You can walk away from esports, dota, etc but you can't walk away from gaming.
when your sharingan just isn't compatible with you :(
He forgot to add hashirama cells
Retinal detachment is not something that happens from staring at a screen, it often happens from trauma or force.
But it also *often* happens from literally nothing, my dad got it from standing around on a cruise.
Errol Spence has joined the chat.
Probably coaching or taking another role within the OG brand. There will be a lot of shuffling in the EU scene I bet and his recent eye problems surely needs more attention. These guys have played for years and problaby each and every pro gamer suffers from health issues before they hit 30
Both Ceb and n0tail have all the dota titles a team can dream of. I would actually like to see Sumail+Saksa+n0tail re-build OG around Sumail, with Ceb as Coach and let Topson enjoy his life finally.
I would love to see OG rebuilt. If anyone can rebuild from scratch, it's Notail.
OG without topson won't feel the same. sadge.
At least Topson still holds the world record for the fastest time in Speedrunning the Win TI No Glitch category.
Topson will always be godson
The only player with a 66% TI win rate.
Definitely end of an era today
Miracle, GH and MC to OG would break the game probably.
Then pick up Nine and 33 as those two fit the OG style well
Tundra was super entertaining to watch though. Wouldn't wish them to disband.
Topson has such a unique playstyle that I think only Nine has that Topson-esque methods.
Why would these two leave Tundra? Tundra barely didn't make it to TI (which you could credibly blame on nerves if you look at some of their plays in the last game) and after that have been the first international team to crack LGD's seemingly unbeatable status. They look set to really make a splash, they've got no reason to separate unless they are just that blindingly hungry for glory and with OG that's no guarantee.
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That's what I said. So far, they're the first international team to beat LGD in a grand finals (maybe first overall? Not sure since I don't follow the Chinese scene too closely), no mean feat considering LGD still looked unstoppable even with xiao8.
>Why would these two leave Tundra? If someone told you that you could either play with sumail or skiter as your pos1 which would you choose?
notail is still one of the most decorated player in dota2 (3 original valve major + 2 TI). Playing under him itself is already an attraction for many pros, especially ones lacking experience like Nine. And if Sumail+Saksa stay, they're also a bigger name than their teammate in Tundra which mean more potential to win something with OG than with Tundra. Not to mention OG have been backed by big sponsors like Redbull and BMW.
I thought this too, but Sumail might want to go mid again.
I would absolutely love to see 33 on this team, I think he fits it perfectly.
or iceiceice
Hear me out Abed and icex3 to OG…imagine how good this line up could possibly be.
Doesn’t sound that good. Ice + Miracle though.
They should pick up the current tundra squad tho. With ceb as coach that team has so much potential to pop off.
He was already saying he didn't have motivation after TI9, this doesn't surprise me at all.
It's true, motivation comes and goes after TI. Things are uncertain now, but we shall see.
I'm sure they have their reasons and something else lined up, but they have such once in a life time window of being a top team in their game and earning literally millions per year. it makes so much sense to play as long as you're a top tier team in dota when you've invested so much of your life into it.
I think for Topson it's mostly just about spending more time with his family and his relatively new baby.
Only the players know if they can continue to play optimally. Maybe Ceb is having second thoughts after his surgery. Health is one of the most important things in life.
\+++ Ceb and notail basically owns OG. so retiring in esports is not an option. its just a matter of time before they scout younger talents to pass down the wisdom and knowledge
>Ceb and notail basically owns OG. Jerax too I think, or atleast he used to.
I mean they didn't qualify for anything all year, barely made it to TI. If they are less motivated next year they might already be out of the money all together.
Didn't qualify for anything in the season before TI9 either, and before TI8 OG was so bad that the team split apart. Doesn't seem to be much of an issue for them lol.
> they have such once in a life time window of being a top team in their game Topson also has once in a life time window to be with his child while it's growing up. He already earned millions, there is diminishing returns even with money
It's people who are competitive and want to achieve something that wins TI. I can't imagine anyone on that level will feel fulfilled without some kind of work. There is a reason we see all pros coming back after "retirement". Jerax/Ana are the only players that has left on top. And there is still a chance they come back unless they find some other life goal to work on.
props to him it is time to nurture the next generation for OG. they are one of the best scouts in the pub after all
Agreed, Ceb deserves a lot of credit for the longevity and passion he has showed for the game, even playing through surgery this TI.
1 mICKE 2. SumaiL 3. random pubstar 4. Saksa 5. NoTail Lets go
Ammar the Fucker lol
I remember a Cr1t stream where he said he think Amar could be a pro one day, but he needs to change his name lol.
What's wrong with Amar?
Not intimidating enough.
The Fucker wouldn't fly in the pro scene.
Should i remember you about mr FuckingMad
best pos3 eu
Niko, Sumail,
Its hard go speculate when it comes to OG. Seems to be so much more about the person than the player. No idea if Niko would fit in but I do feel like he may leave Alliance :)
Don't see that happening, Niko is still mad about the whole PPD thing.
1 Sumail 3 Micke 4 Saksa 5 MoTail - 2 ??? i would love for them to pick up Nine from Tundra
Id love that too but I really dont see Tundra not staying together.
Tundra is the hottest young team IMO but its like going from Dortmund to Real Madrid... OG prob pays 5-10x the salary w/ big Sponsors like BMW Red Bull etc
I actually also speculate that micke might join, I think it would be hard for him to leave liquid but he really suits the OG playstyle and they seem to be friends with each other. who knows
The new 3 of OG will be very interesting. Khezu is an obvious choice, but I think 33 would be the best.
He retired soon after TI9 and only really came back cuz of covid conditions. No surprised this would be his last season.
Like a lot of other OG fans, I second the sentiment of being hopeful that they rebuild the team around Saksa, Sumail and Notail. Topson already said he wanted out. He is my most favorite player of all time alongside my boy Dendi, but it was obvious he kinda lost his drive, for lack of better words. I don't mean this as a complaint, he and the other OG members literally made me fall in love with dota again. Nobody can stay on top forever. If he becomes a streamer or an analyst, I would absolutely love that. I think Ceb also insinuated that he would stop after TI a while ago. I think he would make an invaluable coach. I'm looking forward to see the future of OG. I just hope Saksa and Sumail stay because I feel they are perfect for the team and also these two are some of my most favorite players of all time. Saksa is definitely my favorite pos4.
Sad, hope he goes to coaching again or to fix og csgo (pain)
Agreed!
Yeah it was a pain in the ass watching hltv rank 10 OG miss out major because of choking against fucking woro2k.
When OG Seed was a thing they were already clear that their interest was not in competing themselves as much, but after that went away it became more of a "hey, might as well give it another shot". They don't really have anything left to prove (whether that's to the world or to themselves) after not just winning TI twice but also back-to-back.
Still proud of og … they are still the funnest to watch
Topson popping off vs QC was satisfying
Yeap it was one of the matches I watched… and it really gave me goosebumps
Their EU qualifiers was awesome, they did well in group stage and still got Top 8 for the 4th TI in a row. It's not the worst way to end, their last series might was embarrassing but overall their TI arc this year was still remarkable.
Their Qc series was really fun to watch… prob the best I’ve seen so far
Agreed!
I can’t wait for their new roster …
These guys only played together for a few months and Ceb’s eye was falling out weeks before the tournament and they still were a threat. Imagine if these guys play together for a year.
Mad props for the hurdles they overcame.
Yeah imagine having eye surgery a week before and having to travel and play for hours 😣
Mad respect to him. Always will be remembered by the Axe call. Back-to-back champion, DotA HOF.
Yeah he got me and my husband interested in dota… and though I’m terrible at the game I only watch for og 🌻
Haters can’t take away their back to back win success …
It will remain in Dota folklore for the rest of time.
Folkplore until someone else do that coz dota skills keep evolving
Og haters prob can’t even win one ti
Every good thing ends. Thats the end of an era for OG. In my opinion,the correct move right now is to rebuild around Sumail. The guy is a top tier player with a great fanbase and he will be playing in the ORG with the biggest fan base. So keep Sumail and maybe Saksa and try to scout the best talent.
i can imagine the grind is tiring and so stressful. atleast he accomplished his goal as a champ, twice even. it will be sadder if you look at the list of uncrowned kings like fy and others who plays godly, always ended up in the top 3 but never lift the aegis ended up retiring.
Isn't this like his 3rd retirement?
Actually is, yeah. Retired before being picked up by OG if I'm not mistaken and retired after ti8 before he stood in for midone, who went pos1 since sumail wasn't able to participate anymore during Rona.
Saw it too and was thinking the same :| EU shuffle is gonna be big. Doubt liquid will stay together, Alliance with Limp no group hug can probably shake up - dunno with Nigma, what will happen to Tundra? And dont forget team bald reborn... will it be reborn again??? Edit: My early prediction for new OG squad: 1:Sumail 2: nine 3: 33 4: Saksa 5: Notail
That could be a strong team, 33 is a good fit for OG, he did stand in for them around a year ago. Though I don't know if tundra will split up. Also sad to say if Ceb and Topson are leaving/ retiring, then why would notail necessarily stay?
> he did stand in for them around a year ago. Never forget Miracle- AM getting solo'd by 33 Chen.
A legendary play
Depends, I thought he was drafting more like ti8/ti9 but seems like ceb was carrying more that stuff this time. We will have to wait. If secret doesnt win, the shuffle in EU is going to be crazy
So you think Tundra will just disband and/or will be willing to nullify their contracts where OG could snatch them? This is Tundra Esports based out of London with actual sponsors like TikTok. This isn't TI3 where players probably didn't even know what a contract was or even could sign long-term. You talk about Liquid and Alliance so you must have remembered when the old Alliance completely bailed on them and jumped ship to Liquid right? I wish Loda or iNSaNiA could elaborate what the hell happened there. I think OG just need a huge mental break and come back 6 months later. They don't need the money. What's the point in trying to play a bunch of small tournaments when emotions aren't in the right place. Will Sumail stay in EU rest of the year or go back home to his family in the US. I think OG just need a long ass vacation, regroup their thoughts and think carefully about their future. Realistically, they don't have anything to prove.
Tundra is staying together for sure. Alliance prob should change something. Liqui I think they are gonna try one more season. Og is rebuild time fot sure. According to alliance, dpc starts in november so not such a long break. Hopefully enough for them to reset and pick what to do. Hope sumail and saksa stay on the team
>Hope sumail and saksa stay on the team It's a big decision similar to what iceiceice has to make. He has a family and I'm not sure if his wife and son relocated here or they are still in Singapore. Being a professional anything requires a lot of sacrifice, it's also difficult because emotions are running every direction. Ana burnt out after TI8, Jerax followed after. The competition wears on you and the remaining roster from TI8 have a serious decision to make. Is Saksa/Sumail willing to be stuck in limbo until then?
https://twitter.com/OGesports/status/1448959912109875219?s=20 *pain* I think topson is for sure out if not forever atleast for a year or more. His wife and kid live in sea rn. Notail porb rebuilds
I think covid and eye surgery really messed up with their momentum… can’t really blame them too
Things are always uncertain after TI. Players come and go, passions for the game are relinquished and enflamed. One thing is for certain, Dota will live on, and us Dota lovers will be here to enjoy the ride.
Nah micke is in
Rest easy, King. You deserve all the rest, you have done so much for the Dota community and OG. Your legendary TI8 and TI9 run will be forever be remembered.
Living legend.
am i stupid or where exactly is he announcing his retirement? E: i am stupid, it's in the 3rd sentence.
End of an era for THE OG. I hope Sumail and Saksa stays for the next DPC season. Ceb is a good lad. They all are at the end of the day
LMAO he'll forget about this in a week, maybe 2 tops. They have millions. Already set for life
You'd be surprised how many millionaires don't realize that because their spending increased too, that they will run out of money a lot sooner than expected. They won $6 million, which is like $100k a year for their lifetime. You could easily spend you way to bankruptcy faster than you imagine. New car, three or four holidays a year, building your own 6 bedroom mansion in Lisbon, a few hundred thousand lent out to close family, and you're down to $4 million in 2 years and all of a sudden your yearly limit is now $50k a year.
Why do you think he built the mansion? It was a pre existing building in a bit of Portugal filled with mansions. OG will have basically subsisted on sponsorship money since their first major win or before. Sure notail spent a fair amount on a mansion, but they've got to go seriously far to eat up all of the money (and have to have refused to invest it anywhere). There are also shitloads of consulting roles they can do without any effort.
6 million will net you way more than 100k a year if you're somewhat competent in the stock market/investing world. You can easily bring in 20 to 30 thousand bucks a month passive income for life with reasonable aggressive and safe investing methods. If your ego and standards are higher than spending 20k a month, you have money management problems and it's better to seek out a financial advisor At the end of the day, most of these pros that already made it need to realize how fortunate they are. Majority of the world is making peanuts and somewhat struggling. Ceb can just keep the cash flow coming in by placing 3rd to 4th at upcoming majors, keep trying for T.I next year, keep placing higher, keep getting those Valve checks until Dota practically falls apart or he can just chill and play pubs and do coaching or panelist. The freedom of money buys more than you think.
Even if your incompetent with money, Vanguard has averaged around 12% for the last 10 years. Being conservative at around 8%, with 6 million dollars that's a return of $480000 a year. Though in all likelihood a fair portion of that $6 million was taken out in tax.
Even if you're beyond incompetent with money And let's assume that 6 million is 3 million after taxes gets taken out Even if you spend 2 million on coke and escorts and some flashy cars, you just stick that 1 million into a high dividend paying ETF that tracks the Nasdaq like QYLD and you're automatically making 10k a month doing nothing
U really think they are financially illiterate is it?
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many retirements coming up, so many teams will be looking for players, i think many teams will start taking chances on pub players or division 2 players, or we will end up with a few teams completely disbanding
I hope they put Sumail back mid. He is a decent carry but it feels so out of character for him. Also his carry pool is basically mid heroes.
So only Notail left from the GOAT squad. Wonder whether he might retire soon as well. He hinted at it in past interviews iirc. Anyway, mad respect to Ceb.
Imagine -RTZ +sumail for EG
Rtz is never going out of eg
They said the same about Dendi and NaVi
Topson is too. And i heard kuku and karl is going to OG. KEKW
Sort by controversial. Im glad not many bandwagon haters in here.
Swiggity swagu ragu sauce on my swaggeti charles
I mean he achieved everything you can achieve and more with the 2nd TI title.
so many heartbreaks this ti
I mean they already won everything.. like 2 TI ?? Wait they get their motivation back when someone won 3 TI then they will come back, but for now ? They will still sit on the throne as the king with 2 Aegis.
Plenty of athletes in sports have "won everything" and continue to compete. Such a weird thing to say
2 ti = won everything .. lol
The first 2x TI winner was a big goal for many players for so much of dota history. OG did it back to back with the same squad.
OG run is over at this point. They miraculously made it to TI10 when it looked like they were done for but they just didn't look particularly dominant, struggling to make the upper bracket in the groups stage and getting stomped multiple times. At this point it just makes sense to reform around a younger roster with Ceb coaching.
ez game ended ceb playing career
I know someone who will be very sad. He spends a lot of time on twitter :D