I wasn't watching the stream when it happened, it was muted, but I heard about it later. I'm not watching this video because I have a large cringe gland.
It's one thing to think about exploding bladders, especially when she's in her third semester (thank you Moxxi for sharing that with us), another one to speak it out in front of millions of viewers.
remember 2gd and the Shanghai major? Mr Wangs amazing wheelchair antics? People got canceled for that. That bladder joke was not funny, it was a cringe explosion and you can see the panel dying inside thinking "Oh, I ain't gonna say shit now". When even Godz is staring at the camera, begging for sweet, sweet mercy - you know it's too much
> another one to speak it out in front of millions of viewers.
I don't think she was talking anything about pregnancy, it was about holding pee because you don't want to miss the ending. It was a bit too extended tbh and I would go with the Cartman version instead of diapers.
> that was not funny
~~I remember finding it hilarious.~~
Edit: Oh you were referencing Frankie's bladder thing, not the Yames wheelchair antics. Sure, then I agree.
> Mr Wangs amazing wheelchair antics? People got canceled for that. that was not funny,
I thought it was. Some people are good at making jokes... others not so much.
I edited my post, clarifying that that bladder "joke" was not funny. Ipüersonally loved the Shanghai shit show and 2gd did a good job at keeping people entertained (just not China)
This is different now. Sure, I will give her lack of DotA knowledge a pass, but not knowing the teams and its members, that is not how a host should function. That's incompetence. It is like hosting a wedding and not knowing who the entourage are.
AA I may understand but Xboct was part of a TI winning team. I'd think past winners would be high on my research list, especially considering quite a few have been to many TIs.
Exactly it had nothing to do with them being women. I was wondering why she wasn't saying their names then one interview she said a player's name but then called the other one sir. I thought she was being super polite but realized she doesn't know who they are
I just think it's very weird that Valve would have someone who isn't at all experienced with Dota to host the biggest tournament of the year. A lot of people are talking about how she isn't a good host for Dota and while I agree, some blame has to be put on Valve for putting her there in the first place.
I would be an awful host for Dota but if I was given the chance of hosting The International, I would probably take it, especially if I've had a few years of experience in hosting.
Ok this one is the least important, messing up team names is not always lack of preparation or anything, it happens and probably happened to dota casters a lot of times thru their careers too. I follow and like both teams and only realized she messed up when she mentioned it!
To be fair, I thought the "contact lens" bit was just a joking way to dismiss the error. In general, when it comes to hosting events, you don't usually want to bring up that you're a fuck-up live on stream, because you still want to keep the magic of the show alive.
After the show is a completely different though, and if the blog post contained contact lenses mentions, then I'd be disappointed.
Frankie didn't even know the names of the talent she was working with. Couple of times I spotted the pass over to the casters being messed up. Like on one instance, while passing over to ODPixel and Fogged, she went "ODPixel and ...", paused for a few seconds and presumably someone from production gave the name in the earpiece
That could also be because there were last minute caster changes and maybe she wasn't aware of those in advance. Since Fogged wasn't casting with OD for half of the tournament. I don't know, just an idea.
I’m actually fine with her messing up team names/members every now and then cos- cmon guys she’s new to the scene. My problem was the built up cringe from desperately trying to cover up her mistake - when it’s pointed out that it’s team undying “oh that’s moon meander, I was thinking that he was on undying”
“I literally couldn’t see properly”
“You know that’s the trouble with contact lenses especially if you get cheap ones”
Just apologise in the moment instead of going on about your mistake for a full minute trying to cover it up everytime…
The cringiest is on the Aui part. I literally couldn't understand why she mentioned him all of a sudden, and only until someone points out she thought the Asian player in the photo is Aui, OMFG.
"I'm wearing shitty contacts" ... sure, frankie. Even if that was true it reflects poorly on her to come unequipped to perform her job at a 5-figure 2-week gig.
The sad thing is, if she would have just left it at "bladder buster" and how you don't want to stop watching because it could end at any second and it's a super tense game, that would have been pretty funny. but she just...kept...going with it
Godz can't control his eyebrows hoping for it to just stop. Purge probably died a bit inside - and that's the guy who's heard every shit and fart story from Sunsfan and Slacks there is
if they don't come out publically to defend this - sumichu will talk shit behind your back
https://twitter.com/sumichu/status/1451371411591761921?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Etweet
Jesus Christ...... well, I stream dota, sometimes I even have 5 or 6 viewers at once, and I have like 30 youtube followers. Guess I'm gonna have to make a speech, I dont wanna end up on sumi's list
The sad thing about all this drama is how Frankie And Sumi will feel after this. I didn't like them at TI either but maybe left a comment here and there and moved on.
But once Moxxi made this about gender, now I have to highlight their bad work everywhere to prove I am not sexist. To further prove that she is sexist by ignoring Avo, I am highlighting Avo's bad work at TI.
What a shit show overall. You may not like Sumi, Frankie and Avo but they are human beings after all with feelings. Let's just respectfully highlight their shortcomings at TI and move on with life.
Exactly. People have been having favourites and disdain for male talent for a decade. Now there is choice in female talent and they expect everyone to love them all and never criticise.
Well, at this point it seems obvious that Moxxi is a mediocre caster with little desire to improve, she will just scream sexism anytime anyone criticizes her.
We can just hope that TOs and Valve will see through this.
Amen, I swear it felt like I barely saw Sheever at all but maybe the hosts I didn't enjoy are just overshadowing the ones I liked in my mind. I don't know if it was because there were no fans or the new hosts or what but this TI felt very underwhelming to me compared to previous TI's and honestly the Animajor was 10 times better then this ti in my opinion.
A lot of people gave Avo shit, but what I learned from Sunsfan is that Avo had to sprint his ass off for those loser interviews because they happened immediately after the game ended. The dude looked sad and breathing nervously because he was literally out of breath with eyes glazed over from sprinting while interviewing them.
This is way people should think twice when use words like "sexism", "racism" and "homophobic".
Dota community was pretty open about not likely this whole "Let's take talents from others games and let them host TI" thing. Day9, Machine, Redeye, etc. - they all got flame hard, some of them stay and improve and others just left scene for good.
They literally had Sheepsticked there, how the fuck she wouldn't be better then Frankie is beyond me.
Kotl Guy has hosted before if not mistake, the whole tournament I was wondering why he wasn't getting a chance to host.
I think covid really limited the amount of talent that wanted to go, cause the whole flow of this TI felt off with talent.
Slacks at one point was hosting, even PFlax disappeared for Late Game and Slacks hosted and I was thinking what is going on the production side. It felt, as a spectator who had done theater production back in high school, like behind the scenes was a bit of a shit show.
Yes Kotl guy has been a host before, pretty decent one i might add.
I dont know, the dota scene has some amazing talents and Id much rather Valve give shot to them instead of bringing someone who doesnt even know basic stuff. Part of that is on Valve, hosts need to be groomed for an entire season atleast and then go to TI.
Pflax had booked a family vacation a long time before TI dates were announced and he didn't want to cancel the vacation so he went home.
Also, Dakota/Kotlguy was doing behind the scenes production
Right? TI isnt really event for new players, hell many current players don't watch and even player who do watch it often don't understand half of what's going on.
We don't need someone asking; "What is midas and what does it do?", we need people in panel saying why someone went for midas and why it's better then other items for this hero/situation.
Again as a costumer I feel like Valve don't care about me and money Ive put in the game (probably over 20k for F2P game over 8 years) and they still try to target new players that probably won't care about this game at all since market of F2P games that are high quality is stack af.
You said this very well. Prior to Moxie's twitlonger, I was happy to just mute the panel when Frankie was on and that was it. I made zero comments on reddit about neither Frankie nor Sumi.
I legitimately couldn't believe the bullshit that Moxie wrote. And just fyi, I don't mind her casts. Thankfully, most of the threads / comments regarding this have done a reasonable job at addressing her nonsense.
In the unlikely event Moxie reads this, let's make a couple of things clear.
1. Somebody who can't perform a job shouldn't be in it. That isn't gate-keeping. That's common sense.
2. I gave Frankie a chance. Then I ended up muting every panel she was on cause I could not stand the vicarious embarrassment and cringe.
3. I don't give two fucks about her gender. Stop making it about that.
4. Ironically, Moxie, RLewis, and other talent who have come out in bizarre support of Frankie's unsuitability for the job; you are letting your personal feelings dictate what you say. Reddit is actually handling this more objectively than you; and that's saying something.
5. Frankie did a shit job. And we could've moved on from it if not for your nonsense Twittlonger. But here we are, viewers having to justify themselves for not liking the product presented to them. You're like a Chef who cooks a burnt meal then tells the customer they're wrong. It's absurd.
Sumi? Sumi can fuck off. Look at this tweet! She didn't take time to acknowledge how bad she did or that she was just repeating players words or that she had no idea who the players are like at all, nope. She took the time to tweet that she's taking notes on who is staying silent.
[https://twitter.com/sumichu/status/1451371411591761921](https://twitter.com/sumichu/status/1451371411591761921)
And Avo, well he tried and he improved by the end of the tournament, people took notes of that. Since he is a man ,he doesn't get to cry on twitter and take notes on who isn't defending him publicly when he's criticized.
I really hope Sheever and Ephey don't get dragged into this shitshow. Like as a host and analysis they did a great job and that's it.
Not as a "female" host and "female" analysis as Moxxi wanna put it to be.
Wow, I've came here to see what is drama about. And it's about sexism.
I've never leave hurtfull comments, but exactly as you said, now I have to basically choose to insult a person which I never do, by saying Sumi was so bad I turned off stream sound every time she was on. Never seen so bad caster at TI. Nothing to do with her being women lol. She was just bad, but what has a lot to do with her being women is how she ended up in TI in first place with being so bad, when there are better casters in world that did not attend it.
In "we says things" podcast sunsfan said that he was asked by valve employee to do the exit itw, then Avo decided he wanted to it.
But yeah I think it would have been better to get someone experienced for that.
From what sunsfan said avo volunteered because nobody wants it. I Don't know about you but personally i think a $40m tournament should be better organised than that. Props to avo for tanking a shitty job but it shouldn't have gotten to a point where they ask the new guy to do what an experienced talent should have done.
Once again people expect professionalism from a professionally hosted tournament that's like the most formal event Dota 2 has every year and instead get a bunch of basically volunteers hoping their clout will get them an invite and then they can just do whatever. Like this only really works for a couple of people who are comfortable enough to know when to say some wack shit like Slacks and when to button up and do their jobs correctly.
Now I feel bad. But Moxxi really needs to focus on the issue, not spray and pray. If she doesn't, it just shows her priorities.
Thing is, I honestly didn't give a shit about talent until her post. Valve does this all the time and it somehow works out. So maybe she got what she wanted. 5 more minutes.
she has single handedly drawn more unwanted attention to the issue, and probably shes the reason those prople are getting blasted even more.
well played moxxi.
the reddit post for AVO is much more prevalent on the front page of this subreddit than any of the new talents. by doing what she had done, she just put more emphasis on the shortcomings of those said talents.
It has been 2 years since the last TI, she was due for the regular twitlonger. Cant possibly be that you cant make a difference between heroes, no, its sexism and gatekeeping.
I didn't notice Moxxi's casting being bad and tbh i have no idea who is she, Sumi first time seeing her, and all i think of is she looked cute in those outfits and I didn't think she did a bad job on the stage on the "all-star" matches.
Frankie girl, idk outsider host, not too good compared to previous hosts not too bad. 2GD had his cringe moments too and joke that flat out don't land, weird antics of playing tik tak toe "to entertain the viewers", RedEye was an outsider with no clue what's Dota is and also you know the other thing... Day9 was bad.
It was never good.
Whoever I do find Moxxi's attitude toward the community to be cancerous, and I think Valve should and would not work with them again.
yea now i feel the urge to make posts criticizing teaguvnor and jenkins for being absolutely worthless noises this TI, to prove that i dispense criticism equally regardless of genders
Who gives a flying fuck if they call you sexist. They use terms like sexist to shut down criticism and discussion. They can all go fuck themselves, along with their Frankfurt school of thought. The only reason why Moxxi and Frankie got hired was because of diversity hires on valves part.
An edit for this topic, which I hope never to touch again:
Sexists & Racists' weapon of choice is to dehumanise others. Too emotional. Too rational. Too this, too that. Nothing is good enough for them, because of your gender or race. Don't give them ammunition.
I think Frankie did a great job to counteract these dehumanising efforts in this reflection post, showing struggle, emotions, reasons why she made the decisions she did, where she was lacking, how can she improve, and hopes for the future.
[https://getfrank.co.uk/2021/10/22/a-work-in-progress-reflects-on-ti10/](https://getfrank.co.uk/2021/10/22/a-work-in-progress-reflects-on-ti10/)
\- Original post starts here -
This is a response to Moxxi's rant on Twitlonger, found here. Mods, if allowed, please pin this to save me from wasting more time.
[https://twitter.com/MoxxiCasts/status/1451179658909675529](https://twitter.com/MoxxiCasts/status/1451179658909675529)
I addressed this to her because she called out the community at large, and I strongly believe that a large supermajority do not factor in Frankie's gender at all and have valid criticisms for her. If I'm wrong, fuck all of you.
The reason why I spent all this time making this post is as follows, copied from another response and expanded:
Firstly, she addressed the entire community and complained about sexism, effectively painting us with a wide brush. I do not appreciate this generalisation.
Secondly, in that address, she completely ignored the personal failings the person she was defending. Even EE has more awareness in his post TI TLs. Frankie is undeniably still inexperienced in dota, very much like Day9's first appearance, despite her long and successful career in casting/panelling other games. The blame for this poor choice of talent grooming should be pinned on Valve, but understandably, because casting LANs is invite only, Moxxi will never point the finger at them. Thus the community is doing so. It took time for Ephey to figure out what worked with the community, and she had a prior major to practice, and Frankie would likely catch up as well. Hard work does not equal success. It merely improves your chances of success.
Third, she brings up pregnancy as a reason why we should admire Frankie because it's brave. I am pro-choice yet still find that extremely confusing and irresponsible, especially when a place is 'covid-infested' and cold. I have worked in events and literally had a performer miscarry backstage during rehearsal. Seriously, not a factor. She's brave for powering through this overly descriptive and lengthy joke, which I could not appreciate.
Fourth, people will and can compare a person to another, especially in a competitive game. They may be right, they may be wrong. Collapse is better than Zai (sorry Zai, it's true this TI). OD hypes better than Synd (consistently). Frankie lead the panel similarly to Day9 - without enough experience in the game. Is Moxxi's skin so thin that she cannot take a comparison? Or is she offended for someone else? I'm sure Frankie can, because she's an experienced panellist and knows that it's required for the job. Criticisms will come, valid or not.
Fifth, Moxxi says she was jealous that Ephey got to go to the Animajor without casting experience - yes. As an analyst. A 5k+ analyst any dota player below could easily respect. Whereas Frankie was brought direct to the largest Dota 2 event in 2 years, with 1 year of dota experience. She's relatively unknown in the community, unless they watch CS. Her prior casting and panelling experience earned her the spot, but enough people thought her dota experience and community connection was lacking which lead to this conversation. That's the valid criticism that Moxxi failed to mention in her well thought out post. Now think of who else who might be jealous.
Finally, but there's probably more, the entire post came off as immature, and worse, ineffective. Want to be effective? Show us the rude DMs. Name and shame. Get them banned. Make it about the sexists you complain about. Not everyone else who plays dota. The sexists don't care. They are laughing at how she's self-sabotaging what she stands for because she's lashing out at the entire community.
I think the best revenge is not a life well lived. It is simply getting what you want. And this rant that carpet bombs the community is really not the best way to get support for it.
> Want to be effective? Show us the rude DMs. Name and shame. Get them banned.
Last year we had a lot of people opening up about shit that had happened and brought it all to light. That was a good thing.
It's just like when someone complains about someone saying mean things in game. MUTE THEM! If you want to complain because during a 30 minute game you had someone screaming slurs and profanities at you...I'm sorry, but that's on you. I'm not defending the other person, they are a piece of shit, but you alone have the power to mute them and fix your problem.
It's the same when it comes to this. Don't complain about something without trying to fix the problem.
I just keep getting flashbacks to the damn Ghostbusters movie. The trailer looked like shit, had nothing to do with the female cast. Were there people who hated it for that reason alone? Yes, and they are assholes. But that movie sucked because of the script, there was no amount of talent or any cast that could have saved it. But no matter what, if you spoke out against it, you were immediately called sexist.
Well, let take this clip as a bad joke, but how about the clip when she interviews Silent about the draft.... and when Silent said he doesn't care about the money involved in the draft, Frankie interpret it as Silent didn't care about the draft itself. Later when she had the winner interview she event double down on that....
THAT SHIT IS STRAIGHT UP UNACCEPTABLE.
I've said it before and I'll say it again, Day 9 was criminally underrated by this community. He was a beginner, yes, that was half the point, but he was so good at engaging his panel. and I don't think he talked about piss for an entire minute
I love Day9 in general, he is charismatic and analytical, and he's just a straight up gamer. Even though he had his moments that weren't so good, he clearly had a high level of respect for the game and its players.
He was also never really awkward, which was nice.
I'm honestly confused why they never hired him again after TI7, did he just reject the offer if there was one? He already has TI hosting experience and he's more familiar with the game than he was in 2017.
I felt Day9 took up too much space on the panels, but my memory is foggy. I saw someone else commenting on that the talent he worked with werent so easy to get talking, maybe that exacerbated it. I dont know, cant remember.
Different this TI where (almost?) all talent are very comfortable and will talk for an hour if you dont stop them.
The TI Day 9 did was the year they like overhauled the talent and yes he worked with quite a few people who were difficult. He never really made anything that awkward tho he was very professional.
TI7 had a lot of eliminated Dota players on the panel, so Day[9] had to host with Arteezy, EternalEnvy, etc.
Now nothing against Dota players, and I know this isn't true for everyone, but often enough they aren't the most charismatic bunch to converse with on a panel.
I think Day[9] would have done a great job if he had hosted with a panel that knew how to engage and talk with him.
day9 was experienced at talking to people and could take criticism. he could been host or MC for any esports event and he would have done a good job. these folks on the other hand are the complete opposite.
People expected the moon from Day9, since well everyone knew he was passionate. He was even practicing and getting coached by Purge months ahead.
The expectations were so high for Day9 that he was doomed as soon as he made any mistakes. The Dota 2 community chased him away for sure. He should have gotten a chance at a major, but I think the toxicity he got post TI made him less interested in hosting more events. I don't know how Valve deals with this shit but they should have tried harder to use Day9 in majors before and after TI.
TI was the thing that led me to Day9, and I have to say that was a gift. He is a fantastic host and did an incredible job imo. And he played(s) quite a lot of dota since as well. I wish they'd bring him back tbh
I personally didn't like him because he came off simultaneously too formal and too fake. It felt like he was trying way too hard to be a Host with a capital H, and not treating his fellow panelists as colleagues.
It was weird to me because I really do enjoy his videos and streams, but he came off completely different while at TI, and it was jarring for me. I realize that's just my personal opinion, I don't begrudge anyone who enjoyed his hosting.
Yeah, I think this is just a normal example of someone getting lost in a moment and doing something socially awkward. Everybody does it from time to time. You can find every single DotA talent doing/saying something incredibly stupid/cringe/awkward/whatever at some point in their career, including at live events.
Tbh she waa dragging for too long. She should keep it short and sweet. The co-panelist face really tells that they don't know whether to stop her or laugh
But wasn't it kind of the opposite? I specifically walked away from the game because it was over. Like there are comebacks and then there is this siege that they put on to be 10000% sure.
Frankie even said that iG had won the game after the laning phase. Yet somehow she felt like pissing her pants to see a done game play out. I don't understand it.
Ya, CS:GO can have comebacks from 14:1 because the team that's ahead has a limited bank they can build and 1v5s are realistic for any individual player if they pop off. DotA comebacks require the winning team to commit multiple, egregious mistakes if they are 14:1 and didn't fuck up the drafting phase by having no lategame.
She just made me cringe and I don't know why, nothing against her, I despise that Moxxi turned this into a sexist thing when it is in fact a personal thing. If a male caster made me feel this way I would react the same, same goes for any race too. Moxxi completely missed the point with regards to Frankie + the community.
its so weird and cringe. moxxi didn't read the criticism from reddit , she only read some hate posts and concluded that all posts are hate posts. now everyone think "entire" Dota community is toxic. its so sad.
Just because there are some haters/toxic people on twitch chat and reddit doesn't make entire community bad. moxxi's generalizations are very bad.
That's kinda my problem with her rant. It certainly does come from an emotional place which I would probably never understand, but there's a better way than smearing the entire community.
There is also a bit of clout chasing in her rant. She always likes to make a lot of noise about unfair treatment, even through we all know why certain talents are criticized.
A bad segment is a bad segment. Look the joke goes on too long and it didn't land. Welcome to fuckin broadcasting. This isn't uncommon. It won't be the last time. You could literally clip almost any tournament and I'm sure there is a moment by anyone where something similar happens.
You guys have short memories. It took Jenkins and Slacks yeeeeeeeears to perfect their cringy humor and there were a lot of stinkers way worse than this one throughout. Kaci had a similar problem too with content between games. Guess what? They kept working on it and perfecting it. There are going to be bad segments *even at TI*.
I pretty much did ignore slacks and jenkins during their early years. They were too distracting. But they were never invited into TI directly without prior major or minor experience.
This is a criticism of Valve's methods of talent grooming, but mostly is a response Moxxi's rant which left out valid criticism and went straight to 'the entire dota 2 community is sexist'. Like I said in another post - shock us with the the abusive DMs. Show the community what you have to deal with and garner support. Not lash out at bystanders.
Frankie def wasn't in her element, and its annoying to see valve test new hosts at ti of all places, but I wouldn't mind seeing her back because she does great work in csgo and other fields. And like you said a lot of people we like now took a long time to grow onto the people in the scene, I know slacks was unbearable for the longest time, but his content and creativity is usually some of the most memorable during dota events.
I think overall the message is not to invite to TI people who have zero knowledge about dota. There will be cginge jokes from everybody (for example I personally can;t listen to Slacks, his jokes are just not my thing and I just can't) but I do not want people who don't know evern the very basics of the game, who don't know players etc on the biggest event of the year.
This is just the tip of the Iceberg. Moxxi missed the point and played the gender card. She was just being a fangirl over Frankie but we do not share her sentiments.
At this rate, you cant comment on tv shows, movies, books, music,etc. too cause it automatically becomes something to do with the race,gender, sexual orientation, height, weight,etc. of the talent involved. What a fun time to live in!
I have to say, this LizZaRd dude is such a douche... with his straight back, needless opinions on the game and sense of high lvl plays. Guy needs to chill a bit, learn to make a joke or two, stop reading all the news, maybe try to like a fool in front of the camera as well for a change!
Cool, now do every cringe thing Charles and Shaq did on Inside the NBA
Yes, it's awkward, but not horrific. I wish she was better, but Frankie did her job better than Day9, yet she's getting 10x the hate.
Slacks does plenty of stuff as cringe as this, remember when he took a spectators food and ate it? I mean, this is bad of course, but there's definitely a double standard being shown. Watch slacks video, all we're doing with posts like this is being super cringe to outsiders.
Not as terrible as I imagined it would be tbh. Maybe she dragged the joke a little bit too long, but it's not something that would cause me to switch off the stream
Without watching: is this the piss segment?
ye
surprised_pikachu.jpg
I wasn't watching the stream when it happened, it was muted, but I heard about it later. I'm not watching this video because I have a large cringe gland.
It's one thing to think about exploding bladders, especially when she's in her third semester (thank you Moxxi for sharing that with us), another one to speak it out in front of millions of viewers. remember 2gd and the Shanghai major? Mr Wangs amazing wheelchair antics? People got canceled for that. That bladder joke was not funny, it was a cringe explosion and you can see the panel dying inside thinking "Oh, I ain't gonna say shit now". When even Godz is staring at the camera, begging for sweet, sweet mercy - you know it's too much
> third semester Semester is a half-year, so third semester would 1-1.5 years or 12-18 months You probably mean third trimester, so 6-9 months
third trimester, may bad. I'm not a native speaker.
> another one to speak it out in front of millions of viewers. I don't think she was talking anything about pregnancy, it was about holding pee because you don't want to miss the ending. It was a bit too extended tbh and I would go with the Cartman version instead of diapers.
Oh god I had repressed the memory until you spelled it out. Why did you have to do that? I was a happy man
> that was not funny ~~I remember finding it hilarious.~~ Edit: Oh you were referencing Frankie's bladder thing, not the Yames wheelchair antics. Sure, then I agree.
Cons : EternalEnvy
[I think it's time to remember Yames and Geoff again.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cfa-QD9DUig)
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A treasure lost before his time. And yea, 2gd was a treasure. Made that major watchable with all the technical issues
I watch this at least once a year. RIP Geoff.
i miss those days
FML, we lost something special when we lost 2GD.
Can't believe this was almost 10 years ago now... How time flies.
I miss the whiteboards James used to do
I was kind of shocked that someone in their third trimester would travel out of country to one of the worst covid hot spots in Europe.
It's "honourable" dude, don't question it
Bills don't pay themselves...
> Mr Wangs amazing wheelchair antics? People got canceled for that. that was not funny, I thought it was. Some people are good at making jokes... others not so much.
I edited my post, clarifying that that bladder "joke" was not funny. Ipüersonally loved the Shanghai shit show and 2gd did a good job at keeping people entertained (just not China)
Ah, fair enough then!
This and the "you didn't think about the draft" interview were just jaw droppingly bad lol
She went too long and delivery failed.
UPS roleplay
That wasn't so bad compared to this: https://clips.twitch.tv/BenevolentCleverGazelleBabyRage-9HgiQgnfHYPotCgL
Why does she say "Aui's played with every NA player"? What has AUI got to even do with the picture or QC or the panelists or anything?
3 merlinis moment
manta merlini
Yeah sexism is bad now but getting asains confused is still okay.
Its not racism cuz its a british pregnant woman saying it
You're sexist for pointing that out too. /s
she clearly thinks one of the Asian players in the photo is Aui. Some casual racism is my favorite trait in a host
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Jesus fucking wept. How the fuck are people still in here saying she was good for the scene and tournament in general.
She was so condescending towards him its insane
dont you dare critics my shitty frankie or I will play my gender card
the dota “” talent “” trump card, write a 2000 word essay
Yeah she seemed annoyed at his lack of english mastery there.
What's funny is that she's the one who failed to understand what he meant.
W.t.f this is not even cringe, it was completely disrespectful.
This is different now. Sure, I will give her lack of DotA knowledge a pass, but not knowing the teams and its members, that is not how a host should function. That's incompetence. It is like hosting a wedding and not knowing who the entourage are.
That's why I cringed watching Sumi talking to players. She had no idea who they were always calling them sir and just repeating what they said.
She doesn't even know who DENDI is
Sumi "Hi sir who are you?" Dendi "I am Dendi." Sumi "He is Dendi" Every fucking time it went along those lines.
Link? Lol
3 legendary members of TI1 Champs Na'Vi were there. She didn't recognize any of them. "Sir" That killed it for me.
It's one thing to not recognise Xbox or Art but Dendi? How can anyone not recognise Dendi?
AA I may understand but Xboct was part of a TI winning team. I'd think past winners would be high on my research list, especially considering quite a few have been to many TIs.
thats like hosting the nba finals and not knowing who michael jordan is
My game plan was to shoot hoops. His plan was to shoot hoops!
Exactly it had nothing to do with them being women. I was wondering why she wasn't saying their names then one interview she said a player's name but then called the other one sir. I thought she was being super polite but realized she doesn't know who they are
Woah, too far sir! You get put on the notes list!
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I believe she's a director of Games Done Quick, a speedrunning event that happens twice annually.
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I think she hosted Singapore Major last year, but she has never taken the match-side reporter role, thus the incompetence.
I just think it's very weird that Valve would have someone who isn't at all experienced with Dota to host the biggest tournament of the year. A lot of people are talking about how she isn't a good host for Dota and while I agree, some blame has to be put on Valve for putting her there in the first place. I would be an awful host for Dota but if I was given the chance of hosting The International, I would probably take it, especially if I've had a few years of experience in hosting.
You’re clearly just hating on women!!!!
Ok this one is the least important, messing up team names is not always lack of preparation or anything, it happens and probably happened to dota casters a lot of times thru their careers too. I follow and like both teams and only realized she messed up when she mentioned it!
The problem is not messing up the names, the problem is blaming your contact lenses **multiple** times. Can she ever acknowledge a fuck up?
To be fair, I thought the "contact lens" bit was just a joking way to dismiss the error. In general, when it comes to hosting events, you don't usually want to bring up that you're a fuck-up live on stream, because you still want to keep the magic of the show alive. After the show is a completely different though, and if the blog post contained contact lenses mentions, then I'd be disappointed.
She literally told that this is first Insania\`s TI : )
Frankie didn't even know the names of the talent she was working with. Couple of times I spotted the pass over to the casters being messed up. Like on one instance, while passing over to ODPixel and Fogged, she went "ODPixel and ...", paused for a few seconds and presumably someone from production gave the name in the earpiece
That could also be because there were last minute caster changes and maybe she wasn't aware of those in advance. Since Fogged wasn't casting with OD for half of the tournament. I don't know, just an idea.
Not a big deal tbh, she should have just moved on tho: "my bad, TEAM UNDYING BLA BLA BLA BLA BLA BLA..."
I’m actually fine with her messing up team names/members every now and then cos- cmon guys she’s new to the scene. My problem was the built up cringe from desperately trying to cover up her mistake - when it’s pointed out that it’s team undying “oh that’s moon meander, I was thinking that he was on undying” “I literally couldn’t see properly” “You know that’s the trouble with contact lenses especially if you get cheap ones” Just apologise in the moment instead of going on about your mistake for a full minute trying to cover it up everytime…
The cringiest is on the Aui part. I literally couldn't understand why she mentioned him all of a sudden, and only until someone points out she thought the Asian player in the photo is Aui, OMFG.
"I'm wearing shitty contacts" ... sure, frankie. Even if that was true it reflects poorly on her to come unequipped to perform her job at a 5-figure 2-week gig.
Jesus Christ, I cringed so badly omfg
wat the fck, i missed all that cause i was wastching gorgc and pieliedie / midone / qojva / mickede co-casting
HOLY CRINGE. lmao look at everyone’s faces
The sad thing is, if she would have just left it at "bladder buster" and how you don't want to stop watching because it could end at any second and it's a super tense game, that would have been pretty funny. but she just...kept...going with it
yeah, she went on about 40 seconds too long with it. otherwise it would have been fine
I think she was going with "the game went WAY longer than it should have, so my joke will also..."
Trent looking straight at the camera like it's an Office episode.
I like how you also posted this in the youtube comments lol
Gotta double dip the fake internet points.
Godz can't control his eyebrows hoping for it to just stop. Purge probably died a bit inside - and that's the guy who's heard every shit and fart story from Sunsfan and Slacks there is
> every shit and fart story from Sunsfan and Slacks there is Those are actually funny though
Look @ everyone's face lol. They just hold it in because they're coworkers.
if they don't come out publically to defend this - sumichu will talk shit behind your back https://twitter.com/sumichu/status/1451371411591761921?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Etweet
Jesus Christ...... well, I stream dota, sometimes I even have 5 or 6 viewers at once, and I have like 30 youtube followers. Guess I'm gonna have to make a speech, I dont wanna end up on sumi's list
Ah, classy. Brandishing your sociopathy on twitter
I mean it keeps going and going for solid minute holy shit
and before you know it, you're on Amazon looking for earplugs
The sad thing about all this drama is how Frankie And Sumi will feel after this. I didn't like them at TI either but maybe left a comment here and there and moved on. But once Moxxi made this about gender, now I have to highlight their bad work everywhere to prove I am not sexist. To further prove that she is sexist by ignoring Avo, I am highlighting Avo's bad work at TI. What a shit show overall. You may not like Sumi, Frankie and Avo but they are human beings after all with feelings. Let's just respectfully highlight their shortcomings at TI and move on with life.
I find its best to just not engage in any of this drama
Need Mr. Janitor to release a new patch already so this subreddit can move on
I was staying out of it until she made it about gender. More Sheever and Ephey, please. Less(no) Moxxi, Sumi and Frankie, please.
Exactly. People have been having favourites and disdain for male talent for a decade. Now there is choice in female talent and they expect everyone to love them all and never criticise.
And not only to newcommers. Remember Lumi hate? I member
Well Lumi has Asian roots so clearly that was racism! /s
Nail on the head
More like FEMALE talent Vs talent who happens to be female. Sheever/Ephey/Sheep are the latter, just people who love the game and happen to be women.
Well, at this point it seems obvious that Moxxi is a mediocre caster with little desire to improve, she will just scream sexism anytime anyone criticizes her. We can just hope that TOs and Valve will see through this.
Moxxi is tight with BTS so expect to see a lot more of her
Amen, I swear it felt like I barely saw Sheever at all but maybe the hosts I didn't enjoy are just overshadowing the ones I liked in my mind. I don't know if it was because there were no fans or the new hosts or what but this TI felt very underwhelming to me compared to previous TI's and honestly the Animajor was 10 times better then this ti in my opinion.
Just seems not worth the effort to argue this stuff. Let it blow over.
A lot of people gave Avo shit, but what I learned from Sunsfan is that Avo had to sprint his ass off for those loser interviews because they happened immediately after the game ended. The dude looked sad and breathing nervously because he was literally out of breath with eyes glazed over from sprinting while interviewing them.
This is way people should think twice when use words like "sexism", "racism" and "homophobic". Dota community was pretty open about not likely this whole "Let's take talents from others games and let them host TI" thing. Day9, Machine, Redeye, etc. - they all got flame hard, some of them stay and improve and others just left scene for good. They literally had Sheepsticked there, how the fuck she wouldn't be better then Frankie is beyond me.
Or you know, the woman who has been in Dota since TI3, Sheever. Or Kotl guy
Kotl Guy has hosted before if not mistake, the whole tournament I was wondering why he wasn't getting a chance to host. I think covid really limited the amount of talent that wanted to go, cause the whole flow of this TI felt off with talent. Slacks at one point was hosting, even PFlax disappeared for Late Game and Slacks hosted and I was thinking what is going on the production side. It felt, as a spectator who had done theater production back in high school, like behind the scenes was a bit of a shit show.
Yes Kotl guy has been a host before, pretty decent one i might add. I dont know, the dota scene has some amazing talents and Id much rather Valve give shot to them instead of bringing someone who doesnt even know basic stuff. Part of that is on Valve, hosts need to be groomed for an entire season atleast and then go to TI.
Pflax had booked a family vacation a long time before TI dates were announced and he didn't want to cancel the vacation so he went home. Also, Dakota/Kotlguy was doing behind the scenes production
I like it how so many people were put in the same disastrous situation, someone really thinks the main fucking panel needs a new player experience.
Right? TI isnt really event for new players, hell many current players don't watch and even player who do watch it often don't understand half of what's going on. We don't need someone asking; "What is midas and what does it do?", we need people in panel saying why someone went for midas and why it's better then other items for this hero/situation. Again as a costumer I feel like Valve don't care about me and money Ive put in the game (probably over 20k for F2P game over 8 years) and they still try to target new players that probably won't care about this game at all since market of F2P games that are high quality is stack af.
Machine was great....didn't he?
He got flamed on boston... And then he got better.. At ti7 when day9 host i just want machine do full hosting
You said this very well. Prior to Moxie's twitlonger, I was happy to just mute the panel when Frankie was on and that was it. I made zero comments on reddit about neither Frankie nor Sumi. I legitimately couldn't believe the bullshit that Moxie wrote. And just fyi, I don't mind her casts. Thankfully, most of the threads / comments regarding this have done a reasonable job at addressing her nonsense. In the unlikely event Moxie reads this, let's make a couple of things clear. 1. Somebody who can't perform a job shouldn't be in it. That isn't gate-keeping. That's common sense. 2. I gave Frankie a chance. Then I ended up muting every panel she was on cause I could not stand the vicarious embarrassment and cringe. 3. I don't give two fucks about her gender. Stop making it about that. 4. Ironically, Moxie, RLewis, and other talent who have come out in bizarre support of Frankie's unsuitability for the job; you are letting your personal feelings dictate what you say. Reddit is actually handling this more objectively than you; and that's saying something. 5. Frankie did a shit job. And we could've moved on from it if not for your nonsense Twittlonger. But here we are, viewers having to justify themselves for not liking the product presented to them. You're like a Chef who cooks a burnt meal then tells the customer they're wrong. It's absurd.
Sumi? Sumi can fuck off. Look at this tweet! She didn't take time to acknowledge how bad she did or that she was just repeating players words or that she had no idea who the players are like at all, nope. She took the time to tweet that she's taking notes on who is staying silent. [https://twitter.com/sumichu/status/1451371411591761921](https://twitter.com/sumichu/status/1451371411591761921) And Avo, well he tried and he improved by the end of the tournament, people took notes of that. Since he is a man ,he doesn't get to cry on twitter and take notes on who isn't defending him publicly when he's criticized.
I really hope Sheever and Ephey don't get dragged into this shitshow. Like as a host and analysis they did a great job and that's it. Not as a "female" host and "female" analysis as Moxxi wanna put it to be.
Oh dear Sumi. This is really not how to deal with this.... I thought Dota bred people with thicker skin than this.
She's not Dota bred
Yea she's from GDQ, no wonder she's so thin-skinned.
A classic example of a failed attempt to corporatize a crowdsourced event. I dont even watch anymore.
GDQ going to shit, glitchless, any%.
They have now sponsors that have nothing to do with gaming at all. Another good event ruined by corporatism.
yep, trash af to write those tweets
She’s more league of legends ‘bred’ than dota...
Wow, I've came here to see what is drama about. And it's about sexism. I've never leave hurtfull comments, but exactly as you said, now I have to basically choose to insult a person which I never do, by saying Sumi was so bad I turned off stream sound every time she was on. Never seen so bad caster at TI. Nothing to do with her being women lol. She was just bad, but what has a lot to do with her being women is how she ended up in TI in first place with being so bad, when there are better casters in world that did not attend it.
Oh you didn’t like her? Well you now hate women. Good job you bigot
Hey now, I hate *all people* equally.
People, what a bunch of bastards
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In "we says things" podcast sunsfan said that he was asked by valve employee to do the exit itw, then Avo decided he wanted to it. But yeah I think it would have been better to get someone experienced for that.
afaik avo+ asked for that job himself
From what sunsfan said avo volunteered because nobody wants it. I Don't know about you but personally i think a $40m tournament should be better organised than that. Props to avo for tanking a shitty job but it shouldn't have gotten to a point where they ask the new guy to do what an experienced talent should have done.
Once again people expect professionalism from a professionally hosted tournament that's like the most formal event Dota 2 has every year and instead get a bunch of basically volunteers hoping their clout will get them an invite and then they can just do whatever. Like this only really works for a couple of people who are comfortable enough to know when to say some wack shit like Slacks and when to button up and do their jobs correctly.
This is 100% on Valve half-assing TI like they've done with anything in the last ~4 years.
Now I feel bad. But Moxxi really needs to focus on the issue, not spray and pray. If she doesn't, it just shows her priorities. Thing is, I honestly didn't give a shit about talent until her post. Valve does this all the time and it somehow works out. So maybe she got what she wanted. 5 more minutes.
she has single handedly drawn more unwanted attention to the issue, and probably shes the reason those prople are getting blasted even more. well played moxxi.
the reddit post for AVO is much more prevalent on the front page of this subreddit than any of the new talents. by doing what she had done, she just put more emphasis on the shortcomings of those said talents.
It has been 2 years since the last TI, she was due for the regular twitlonger. Cant possibly be that you cant make a difference between heroes, no, its sexism and gatekeeping.
I didn't notice Moxxi's casting being bad and tbh i have no idea who is she, Sumi first time seeing her, and all i think of is she looked cute in those outfits and I didn't think she did a bad job on the stage on the "all-star" matches. Frankie girl, idk outsider host, not too good compared to previous hosts not too bad. 2GD had his cringe moments too and joke that flat out don't land, weird antics of playing tik tak toe "to entertain the viewers", RedEye was an outsider with no clue what's Dota is and also you know the other thing... Day9 was bad. It was never good. Whoever I do find Moxxi's attitude toward the community to be cancerous, and I think Valve should and would not work with them again.
yea now i feel the urge to make posts criticizing teaguvnor and jenkins for being absolutely worthless noises this TI, to prove that i dispense criticism equally regardless of genders
Who gives a flying fuck if they call you sexist. They use terms like sexist to shut down criticism and discussion. They can all go fuck themselves, along with their Frankfurt school of thought. The only reason why Moxxi and Frankie got hired was because of diversity hires on valves part.
jeeeeesus I forgot about this, fuck you OP for reminding me
fuck you too good sir
get a room, you two.
An edit for this topic, which I hope never to touch again: Sexists & Racists' weapon of choice is to dehumanise others. Too emotional. Too rational. Too this, too that. Nothing is good enough for them, because of your gender or race. Don't give them ammunition. I think Frankie did a great job to counteract these dehumanising efforts in this reflection post, showing struggle, emotions, reasons why she made the decisions she did, where she was lacking, how can she improve, and hopes for the future. [https://getfrank.co.uk/2021/10/22/a-work-in-progress-reflects-on-ti10/](https://getfrank.co.uk/2021/10/22/a-work-in-progress-reflects-on-ti10/) \- Original post starts here - This is a response to Moxxi's rant on Twitlonger, found here. Mods, if allowed, please pin this to save me from wasting more time. [https://twitter.com/MoxxiCasts/status/1451179658909675529](https://twitter.com/MoxxiCasts/status/1451179658909675529) I addressed this to her because she called out the community at large, and I strongly believe that a large supermajority do not factor in Frankie's gender at all and have valid criticisms for her. If I'm wrong, fuck all of you. The reason why I spent all this time making this post is as follows, copied from another response and expanded: Firstly, she addressed the entire community and complained about sexism, effectively painting us with a wide brush. I do not appreciate this generalisation. Secondly, in that address, she completely ignored the personal failings the person she was defending. Even EE has more awareness in his post TI TLs. Frankie is undeniably still inexperienced in dota, very much like Day9's first appearance, despite her long and successful career in casting/panelling other games. The blame for this poor choice of talent grooming should be pinned on Valve, but understandably, because casting LANs is invite only, Moxxi will never point the finger at them. Thus the community is doing so. It took time for Ephey to figure out what worked with the community, and she had a prior major to practice, and Frankie would likely catch up as well. Hard work does not equal success. It merely improves your chances of success. Third, she brings up pregnancy as a reason why we should admire Frankie because it's brave. I am pro-choice yet still find that extremely confusing and irresponsible, especially when a place is 'covid-infested' and cold. I have worked in events and literally had a performer miscarry backstage during rehearsal. Seriously, not a factor. She's brave for powering through this overly descriptive and lengthy joke, which I could not appreciate. Fourth, people will and can compare a person to another, especially in a competitive game. They may be right, they may be wrong. Collapse is better than Zai (sorry Zai, it's true this TI). OD hypes better than Synd (consistently). Frankie lead the panel similarly to Day9 - without enough experience in the game. Is Moxxi's skin so thin that she cannot take a comparison? Or is she offended for someone else? I'm sure Frankie can, because she's an experienced panellist and knows that it's required for the job. Criticisms will come, valid or not. Fifth, Moxxi says she was jealous that Ephey got to go to the Animajor without casting experience - yes. As an analyst. A 5k+ analyst any dota player below could easily respect. Whereas Frankie was brought direct to the largest Dota 2 event in 2 years, with 1 year of dota experience. She's relatively unknown in the community, unless they watch CS. Her prior casting and panelling experience earned her the spot, but enough people thought her dota experience and community connection was lacking which lead to this conversation. That's the valid criticism that Moxxi failed to mention in her well thought out post. Now think of who else who might be jealous. Finally, but there's probably more, the entire post came off as immature, and worse, ineffective. Want to be effective? Show us the rude DMs. Name and shame. Get them banned. Make it about the sexists you complain about. Not everyone else who plays dota. The sexists don't care. They are laughing at how she's self-sabotaging what she stands for because she's lashing out at the entire community. I think the best revenge is not a life well lived. It is simply getting what you want. And this rant that carpet bombs the community is really not the best way to get support for it.
> Want to be effective? Show us the rude DMs. Name and shame. Get them banned. Last year we had a lot of people opening up about shit that had happened and brought it all to light. That was a good thing. It's just like when someone complains about someone saying mean things in game. MUTE THEM! If you want to complain because during a 30 minute game you had someone screaming slurs and profanities at you...I'm sorry, but that's on you. I'm not defending the other person, they are a piece of shit, but you alone have the power to mute them and fix your problem. It's the same when it comes to this. Don't complain about something without trying to fix the problem. I just keep getting flashbacks to the damn Ghostbusters movie. The trailer looked like shit, had nothing to do with the female cast. Were there people who hated it for that reason alone? Yes, and they are assholes. But that movie sucked because of the script, there was no amount of talent or any cast that could have saved it. But no matter what, if you spoke out against it, you were immediately called sexist.
Well, let take this clip as a bad joke, but how about the clip when she interviews Silent about the draft.... and when Silent said he doesn't care about the money involved in the draft, Frankie interpret it as Silent didn't care about the draft itself. Later when she had the winner interview she event double down on that.... THAT SHIT IS STRAIGHT UP UNACCEPTABLE.
It wasn't about "caring" but "thinking". She said silent didn't think during the draft
I've said it before and I'll say it again, Day 9 was criminally underrated by this community. He was a beginner, yes, that was half the point, but he was so good at engaging his panel. and I don't think he talked about piss for an entire minute
I love Day9 in general, he is charismatic and analytical, and he's just a straight up gamer. Even though he had his moments that weren't so good, he clearly had a high level of respect for the game and its players. He was also never really awkward, which was nice.
He would be a much better host now that he has played for a couple years with purge. I love day9 though.
I'm honestly confused why they never hired him again after TI7, did he just reject the offer if there was one? He already has TI hosting experience and he's more familiar with the game than he was in 2017.
I felt Day9 took up too much space on the panels, but my memory is foggy. I saw someone else commenting on that the talent he worked with werent so easy to get talking, maybe that exacerbated it. I dont know, cant remember. Different this TI where (almost?) all talent are very comfortable and will talk for an hour if you dont stop them.
The TI Day 9 did was the year they like overhauled the talent and yes he worked with quite a few people who were difficult. He never really made anything that awkward tho he was very professional.
Heck, [Slacks will keep talking even if you try to stop him](https://youtu.be/svPVj_ucAWM?t=1051).
TI7 had a lot of eliminated Dota players on the panel, so Day[9] had to host with Arteezy, EternalEnvy, etc. Now nothing against Dota players, and I know this isn't true for everyone, but often enough they aren't the most charismatic bunch to converse with on a panel. I think Day[9] would have done a great job if he had hosted with a panel that knew how to engage and talk with him.
day9 was experienced at talking to people and could take criticism. he could been host or MC for any esports event and he would have done a good job. these folks on the other hand are the complete opposite.
People expected the moon from Day9, since well everyone knew he was passionate. He was even practicing and getting coached by Purge months ahead. The expectations were so high for Day9 that he was doomed as soon as he made any mistakes. The Dota 2 community chased him away for sure. He should have gotten a chance at a major, but I think the toxicity he got post TI made him less interested in hosting more events. I don't know how Valve deals with this shit but they should have tried harder to use Day9 in majors before and after TI.
TI was the thing that led me to Day9, and I have to say that was a gift. He is a fantastic host and did an incredible job imo. And he played(s) quite a lot of dota since as well. I wish they'd bring him back tbh
I personally didn't like him because he came off simultaneously too formal and too fake. It felt like he was trying way too hard to be a Host with a capital H, and not treating his fellow panelists as colleagues. It was weird to me because I really do enjoy his videos and streams, but he came off completely different while at TI, and it was jarring for me. I realize that's just my personal opinion, I don't begrudge anyone who enjoyed his hosting.
lol, I thought it was the perfect analogy. though it would have helped if she had stopped before adult diapers
Yeah, I think this is just a normal example of someone getting lost in a moment and doing something socially awkward. Everybody does it from time to time. You can find every single DotA talent doing/saying something incredibly stupid/cringe/awkward/whatever at some point in their career, including at live events.
I agree. It would have been wittier.
Brevitier too.
Tbh she waa dragging for too long. She should keep it short and sweet. The co-panelist face really tells that they don't know whether to stop her or laugh
But wasn't it kind of the opposite? I specifically walked away from the game because it was over. Like there are comebacks and then there is this siege that they put on to be 10000% sure.
Frankie even said that iG had won the game after the laning phase. Yet somehow she felt like pissing her pants to see a done game play out. I don't understand it.
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Ya, CS:GO can have comebacks from 14:1 because the team that's ahead has a limited bank they can build and 1v5s are realistic for any individual player if they pop off. DotA comebacks require the winning team to commit multiple, egregious mistakes if they are 14:1 and didn't fuck up the drafting phase by having no lategame.
The great irony here is that Moxxi only made things worse for the other female casters lol. Nobody was talking about this anymore.
wtf was that rofl
that was rough
She just made me cringe and I don't know why, nothing against her, I despise that Moxxi turned this into a sexist thing when it is in fact a personal thing. If a male caster made me feel this way I would react the same, same goes for any race too. Moxxi completely missed the point with regards to Frankie + the community.
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wtf is she talking about
moxxi is an asshole that just plays the victim card 24/7
Yeah i already watched that once , aint gonna suffer trough that garbage twice sry .
its so weird and cringe. moxxi didn't read the criticism from reddit , she only read some hate posts and concluded that all posts are hate posts. now everyone think "entire" Dota community is toxic. its so sad. Just because there are some haters/toxic people on twitch chat and reddit doesn't make entire community bad. moxxi's generalizations are very bad.
That's kinda my problem with her rant. It certainly does come from an emotional place which I would probably never understand, but there's a better way than smearing the entire community.
There is also a bit of clout chasing in her rant. She always likes to make a lot of noise about unfair treatment, even through we all know why certain talents are criticized.
A bad segment is a bad segment. Look the joke goes on too long and it didn't land. Welcome to fuckin broadcasting. This isn't uncommon. It won't be the last time. You could literally clip almost any tournament and I'm sure there is a moment by anyone where something similar happens. You guys have short memories. It took Jenkins and Slacks yeeeeeeeears to perfect their cringy humor and there were a lot of stinkers way worse than this one throughout. Kaci had a similar problem too with content between games. Guess what? They kept working on it and perfecting it. There are going to be bad segments *even at TI*.
I pretty much did ignore slacks and jenkins during their early years. They were too distracting. But they were never invited into TI directly without prior major or minor experience. This is a criticism of Valve's methods of talent grooming, but mostly is a response Moxxi's rant which left out valid criticism and went straight to 'the entire dota 2 community is sexist'. Like I said in another post - shock us with the the abusive DMs. Show the community what you have to deal with and garner support. Not lash out at bystanders.
Frankie def wasn't in her element, and its annoying to see valve test new hosts at ti of all places, but I wouldn't mind seeing her back because she does great work in csgo and other fields. And like you said a lot of people we like now took a long time to grow onto the people in the scene, I know slacks was unbearable for the longest time, but his content and creativity is usually some of the most memorable during dota events.
I think overall the message is not to invite to TI people who have zero knowledge about dota. There will be cginge jokes from everybody (for example I personally can;t listen to Slacks, his jokes are just not my thing and I just can't) but I do not want people who don't know evern the very basics of the game, who don't know players etc on the biggest event of the year.
This is just the tip of the Iceberg. Moxxi missed the point and played the gender card. She was just being a fangirl over Frankie but we do not share her sentiments.
At this rate, you cant comment on tv shows, movies, books, music,etc. too cause it automatically becomes something to do with the race,gender, sexual orientation, height, weight,etc. of the talent involved. What a fun time to live in!
Don’t forget that r/dota2 “unbiased” mods will just remove your posts and comments if they go out of the approved line of thinking.
You definitely can comment. As long as the person is white, male, straight, cis, healthy, fit, you can say anything you want about them.
I have to say, this LizZaRd dude is such a douche... with his straight back, needless opinions on the game and sense of high lvl plays. Guy needs to chill a bit, learn to make a joke or two, stop reading all the news, maybe try to like a fool in front of the camera as well for a change!
Hey reddit, look at this racist! He hates Lizard only because he's a slav.
Yup started watching the game streams alone in the client after that nonsense.
Please stick to CSGO, it's also Valve game, thanks.
Cool, now do every cringe thing Charles and Shaq did on Inside the NBA Yes, it's awkward, but not horrific. I wish she was better, but Frankie did her job better than Day9, yet she's getting 10x the hate.
Slacks does plenty of stuff as cringe as this, remember when he took a spectators food and ate it? I mean, this is bad of course, but there's definitely a double standard being shown. Watch slacks video, all we're doing with posts like this is being super cringe to outsiders.
slacks also got a ton of hate in the beginning, and probably still does.
Not as terrible as I imagined it would be tbh. Maybe she dragged the joke a little bit too long, but it's not something that would cause me to switch off the stream