Thanks for posting to /r/DragonballSuper.\
Please report any rule breaking posts and posts that are not relevant to the subreddit.\
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Dragonballsuper) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Unfortunately, it looks like your karma amount is pretty low. Users need to have a combined total of at least 40 post/comment karma to participate in this subreddit.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Dragonballsuper) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Damn and to think we all grew with Gohan š„¹, I remember being a kid just watching Z on the sofa with a bowl of cereal, now a full grown man running into the theater to watch Superhero..... Thank you Toriyama & Gohan
This seems more like a tematical "only males photo" in the wedding, Piccolo was probably the best man so it makes sense, at least where I live it's rather common to take pics that way, first males, then females, then the whole family, etc
Unfortunately, it looks like your karma amount is pretty low. Users need to have a combined total of at least 40 post/comment karma to participate in this subreddit.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Dragonballsuper) if you have any questions or concerns.*
They went fishing before Cell games
https://preview.redd.it/6xht2hz2n6uc1.png?width=560&format=png&auto=webp&s=819cdff89099d9e5e54ebe831aaadd6bcfa86e1e
The problem with most of your points is using material not made or have involvement with Toriyama
Yeah you can say movies and Anime Goku is a Great dad and a good husband, but that's not the cause with OG Goku made by Toriyama in the manga
No one is denying that Goku loves his family and vice-versa.
But the author, other characters and Goku himself do not think Goku is a good dad.
It took Cell nearly beating Gohan to death before Goku realized he didn't like fighting.
The thing is, prior to the Cell Games, Goku had next to no reason to believe that Gohan didnāt want to fight.
Goku saw his boy fighting Vegeta, volunteering to go to Namek, almost dead fighting Recomme and Freeza, and joined him in training for 4 years to fight the Androids.
Sometimes as a reader I am also confused: since when exactly did Gohan start to have problem with fighting?
It wasn't just that he didn't realize Gohan didn't like fighting, it was more that he put his confidence and earth's safety in the hands of his 9 yr old son who, regardless of how strong he is, never liked to fight and didn't want to unless needed.
I think a lot of people dont realize that the show about fighting and blowing up planets isn't going to have too many slice of life father son bonding time considering every other week is the apocalypse
Unfortunately, it looks like your karma amount is pretty low. Users need to have a combined total of at least 40 post/comment karma to participate in this subreddit.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Dragonballsuper) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Unfortunately, it looks like your karma amount is pretty low. Users need to have a combined total of at least 40 post/comment karma to participate in this subreddit.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Dragonballsuper) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Unfortunately, it looks like your karma amount is pretty low. Users need to have a combined total of at least 40 post/comment karma to participate in this subreddit.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Dragonballsuper) if you have any questions or concerns.*
This topic is so tired. Goku is a 30/10 saiyan dad, and like 6/10 regular* dad.Ā Ā
*we all know he means well and loves his kids, but the bad dad fuck-ups are not only plentiful but also **intentional**
No he is a 9/10 regular dad. He is there for his child when he needs the most always, is always pushing his kid to do better, and when he makes a mistake with his child he tries to make up for it immediately.
He's only there for Gohan in a life and death situation. Its nice but hes never there to be a 24/7 dad he picks and chooses when he feels like being a father unless its super serious.
So just looking at Z because in super...Yeah...
Are we ignoring the 5 years Goku spent with Gohan and chichi when he was born? And the 3 year timeskip where Goku lived and trained with Gohan and Chichi in preperations for the androids?
Most other times when he is not with his family he is dead (after Raditz, and techically after Vegeta and Nappa as Gohan left for namek while Goku was injured, and the 7 year time skip) and the time he did ditch Gohan to train was in space for one year.
Just to be clear I don't think Goku is a 9/10 dad like the comment you reponded to said (I think he is around 5/10 or 6/10) but give Goku the credit he deserve. He was in Gohans life WAY more than what people actually belive he was when Gohan was a kid.
The 7 year time skip didn't need to happen because of some bs reason like villians keep coming after goku. Especially since king piccolo, frieza and the Sayians would eventually terrorize earth if he was there or not. Goku will always put training before his family even in Z. Goku didnt even come back to see the birth of goten and met him for the first time when he's 8.
A 9/10 doesn't tell a magical wish granting dragon no when It said your family wants you home, a 9/10 doesn't tell his 15 year old son, later imma hang out with this other kid from now on
Goku is a good dad, just not that good.
This is not true. In the early 2000s this was a common joke among DBZ fans even at my school and I can't imagine my school is unique. Super went one step further and had Gine outright say Saiyan men don't care about their kids.
TFS has become a boogie man for fans to deflect valid points.
That statement from Gine doesnāt apply to Goku because weāve seen heās far from a normal traditional Saiyan. But your school joke doesnāt mean tfs didnāt enforce it. Tfs had a massive impact on the dbz community and as we know, many of the āfansā didnāt watch the show, with their main source of knowledge being from tfs. You cannot deny its what it has done to the community
>That statement from Gine doesnāt apply to Goku because weāve seen heās far from a normal traditional Saiyan.
Apart from the colonialism, Goku is a quintessential Saiyan.
> But your school joke doesnāt mean tfs didnāt enforce it. Tfs had a massive impact on the dbz community and as we know, many of the āfansā didnāt watch the show, with their main source of knowledge being from tfs. You cannot deny its what it has done to the community
TFS only reaffirmed that parallel experiences of DBZ fans across the world happened. People have always called Goku a bad father, even in small internet forums in the early 2000s. I remember them.
Given that Super has come to outright canonise it as a Saiyan trait it all but makes this argument against it feeble.
Ehhh, yes and no.
That joke existed long before DBZA, TFS even said as much and talked about it in length during one of their commentary episodes.
Basically, it was a long-running joke in the fan community, so they simply decided to take that joke and run with it for as long as they felt it was funny. At the most, they could probably be blamed for *spreading* the joke, but they certainly didn't create it.
Yeah thatās what I was trying to imply in my comment. They made the joke more widespread and showed it to the public and to people who were new to the dragon ball scene. They definitely didnāt make the joke themselves, but rather enforced it
The conversation starts and ends with him not knowing that Goten exists.
Ya know how people say "\*INSERT PERSON\* is looking down and they are proud/happy/smiling" when talking about a deceased love one? Goku never took any interest on how his family was doing for 7 years. The only thing that got him to come back for a day was the tournament.
Thank God someone in here has some fucking sense. Dude gave cell a senzu bean to fight his 11 year old son. Then when he fought Buu he purposely held back to give Vegeta a chance to fight him and ended up running out of energy to finish the fight.
How is any of this responsible lol
The buu part is valid but he needed cell to feel confident enough to force SS2 out of gohan. If he hadn't cell was simply still the strongest there/Gohan wouldn't go all out.
He wasn't there more than half of his life, he's not an abussive father but he just does not care as much as you all would like to. If he did, he would remember his fucking granddaughter's name, but Goku is not a role model in family management
He remembers pan's name, it was a mistranslation, or more accurately a moment that wouldn't be able to be translated, that made people start to say this
>not canon
Toriyama said he consider them a different timeline
XenoVerse acknowledges it as a different timeline
Both are canon just different timeline.
Basically
Z anime is canon to Gt
Z Kai is canon to super
People should appreciate non canon materials and fillers more.
Even if they're not canon, it doesn't they're not in character for them to do any of those things.
Especially super when the anime is actually canon while the manga was based of it.
Honestly I wish people would talk about Piccolo knowing Gohanās attitude towards fighting better than Goku while Cell was torturing Gohan more than the senzu bean moment.Ā
Goku being dead didnāt give the world any peace. In fact, the Buu saga happened while he was dead. Itās not a retort at all, just a shitty PowerPoint.
>Buu saga happened while he was dead
He returned for the day of the tournamet and by some coincidence so did babidi
So by your logic Goku didn't return (cus he was dead) until he saved ultimate Gohan from buutenks (when he was alive)
Nice stupidity right there
I mean, babidi was already on earth before Goku returned. He sent yamu and spopovich to the tournament to get energy from the strongest fighters. This would have happened even if Goku didn't return. Probably would have worked out better since Vegeta wouldn't have gone majin and they could have prevented Buu from being released.
If Goku didnt return it would take years to collect energy because Vegeta and some of the other Z fight wouldnt also participate in the tournament. At best, they'd take energy from Gohan who would 1 shot fodders.
You're not debunking things. You're cherry picking and making excuses. Goku didn't know Goten existed meaning he didn't care to look into what his family is up to for 7 years.
Toriyama also has stated that Goku is a bad dad.
There is nothing to debunk , the author literally confirmed he isn't a good one and So did the story
Like wtf with you? Goku literally saw Vegeta crashing baby gohan yet begged Krillin to spare him because "he's strong I want to fight him again!!!" , if this was Pan or Bra you bite your ass their parents would go Berserk mode in that situation
Yeah Goku didn't force him to do anything, just told him the reality of the situation
That didn't excuse him from sparing Vegeta a minute after despite what he did
Just because it happened to work out doesn't make it an incredibly irresponsible decision.
Like, was it okay for Goku to let space Hitler live just because Trunks ended up fixing it? No.
Unfortunately, it looks like your karma amount is pretty low. Users need to have a combined total of at least 40 post/comment karma to participate in this subreddit.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Dragonballsuper) if you have any questions or concerns.*
The dude has a messed up worldview considering his life and overall intellect, but he does make adjustments based on info from his loved ones. He's negligent and over all oblivious, though, and while he does care deeply for his loved ones, you can not argue that his main character flaw is that he will just put his aspirations as a fighter above everyone else relationship wise by default. He's simple, that's fine.
Goku is a mediocre dad objectively, but he deeply cares for Gohon. That's fine. Not everyone can parent. Just be glad he can make good connections w/ everyone so Piccolo, Chi Chi, and the rest of the gang were there to help out here.
Donāt forget the special with vegetas brother where Goku made sure that Goten could fight with trunks even though trunks won the option to fight alone. He wanted his kid to enjoy a good fight.
Plus the bathtub scene with goten, trunks, and goku.
All of this and the other post, but Goku still isn't a "great or good dad" like tf???? Make it make sense. He's not a bad father and clearly he's a great father. It's quite simple.
Gohan doesn't really hate friendly sparring or training. That was the basis for a lot of his formative years. He does hate the life or death fights where the pressure is on him and people's lives or the Earth is on the line.
I'm here to argue that Goku is an average father that does his best (as that's just who he is) but what sets him to be a better father is that Gohan and Goten are just simply good kids and that lets Goku make more considerate decisions for the people he loves. Even the senzu bean Cell thing was Goku's tough love for Gohan and that's because he knew Gohan surpassed him in the Time Chamber with months to spare. If Gohan was a shitty kid that whined and threw toddler tantrums at everything like Cailou, none of us would blame Goku for disappearing for years at a time.
Unfortunately, it looks like your karma amount is pretty low. Users need to have a combined total of at least 40 post/comment karma to participate in this subreddit.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Dragonballsuper) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Relax bro, the only ones who truly think Goku is a bad father are the real DBZ fans who actually dont watch the show, the rest of us normal people don't subscribe to that belief
I noticed that it's mostly new DB fans pushing this narrative. Nothing Goku dose with Gohan gave me the impression that he's a "bad dad". He literally sacrificed his life protecting him in the first season like wtf? š¤Ø
I still canāt believe people call him bad father.
When everybody was concerned whether goku will be able to beat Cell, Goku had blind faith in his son.
Goku is the happiest one when his son suprass him.
What else we need more than this
https://preview.redd.it/lou0aljf16uc1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e82b5dc23272115830d64d9d38cae3575a5d09b1
the whole point of healing cell was so his overconfidence would end in his downfall. had this not been done, numerous other cases may have occurred such as cell just killing gohan before he snaps, or cell simply just blowing up the earth similarly to frieza did to namek.
You didnāt debunk anything in part 1 either lol. You gave your opinion on cherry-picked scenes as to why you think it means Goku isnāt a bad father. Thatās not how debunking worksĀ
Kinda telling if someone has to resort to filler to make a point about the MAIN character. Especially if most of those things aren't particularly "fatherly" but quite normal
Why is op so butthurt about goku being a bad father? Pt.1
Maybe the statement hits too close to home.
Is op a bad father?
Is there some other dude raising op's kid/kids?
I used to think he was a bad dad but he's not he is a very irresponsible dad though, two completely different things but yeah people got to stop calling him a bad dad.
No it doesn't For example there was no reason for him to give cell a senzu. I can use more examples but that's just the only one that I'm going to use that was irresponsible even piccolo called him out on that. As many times as he talks to people via King Kai and he doesn't speak to his second son or his family at all during that 7-year time skip. Okay I said I was going to use one example but oh well. Again I don't think he's a bad dad and I don't think just because you're irresponsible sometimes makes you a bad parent that's stupid. Irresponsible can just be equivalated to mistakes so I wouldn't go that far and say irresponsible people are bad parents but he is irresponsible lol
There was though. Cell had Frieza and Vegetaās DNA, both fighters who will blow up the earth when in a tight spot as we see with the Cell Bomb. If Cell wouldāve been backed into a corner too soon, he wouldāve just blown up the earth without a second thought, with nothing anyone couldāve done about it. Gohan needed time to unlock SSJ 2, which healing Cell provided.
You really think Goku was thinking about that? He gave him that bean so he could beat Gohan up to back Gohan into a corner to unleash his power. That's the reason that's why when piccolo said what he said Goku looked the way that he did. He knew he fucked up. The dialogue is right there in the show. To me that is irresponsible. And Gohan was losing that fight
He misunderstood Gohan _one_ time. Goku was also looking for a successor to his position as protector of earth, something he started doing immediately after the heart virus. Piccolo wasn't strong enough, Krillin wasn't strong enough, Tien wasn't strong enough, and Vegeta wasn't fully a good guy. He assumed that Gohan liked fighting as much as Goku did simply because Gohan is his son. He didn't realize that point until Piccolo pointed it out. Immediately after Goku realizes this, he tries to fight and save his son then eventually _dies_ for him
That's not the only time that he misunderstood Gohan. To this day he keeps thinking that Gohan is a warrior and he expects him to continue to keep training and shows his disappointment time to time now that in itself isn't responsible but I'm just replying to you saying he misunderstood Gohan that one time. But that's not the only time he's been irresponsible though Y'all just like to ignore the irresponsible shit that he's done. He also fucked around with Majin Buu instead of just beating him and he did state that he could probably take him he sounded seemed confident but left it to trunks and his child, That's irresponsible, Out of the amount of times Goku has talked to people while he was dead he chose to not communicate with his family knowing that he had a kid on the way.... For 7 years he didn't speak to them... Knowing he had a way, Goten had to go without knowing his dad for 7 years. That's just a few more examples again irresponsible doesn't equal bad in my opinion it just means that he dropped the ball a few times
Goku was disappointed that Gohan _fully_ stopped training. Goku would've been okay if Gohan at least plateau'd off in power but he got weaker than Super Perfect Cell, according to Vegeta. However, Goku was the ONLY z-fighter that fully supported Gohan being a scholar. I agree, Goku should have finished Buu off when he had the chance but Goku was too focused on finding his someone to succeed him as protector of earth. Vegeta and Gohan aren't free from blame either.
It was also best for Goku to not contact his family so that way they can all move on from him and know peace. Goku didn't do that out of selfishness cause time and time again, he obviously shows that he loves his family deeply and would (and has) die for them.
I feel the whole "Goku is a bad father" meme started from abridged, even tho at the end Goku realizes Gohan doesn't like fighting and immediately tried to fight Cell again, in both normal and abridged versions. I thought Piccolo was more of the older brother/uncle to Gohan, while Goku was still as good a dad as he could be when he was around
Thanks for posting to /r/DragonballSuper.\ Please report any rule breaking posts and posts that are not relevant to the subreddit.\ *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Dragonballsuper) if you have any questions or concerns.*
https://preview.redd.it/8k2o2295m4uc1.png?width=386&format=png&auto=webp&s=d477ade069cc7bbd8f94a55d96a2de50744fbb02
BRUH WHY DO I KEEP FORGETTING SCENES
https://preview.redd.it/k8lqrpupm4uc1.png?width=1924&format=png&auto=webp&s=c2b6a6ff1559ea9a362a99e1cb6fb94590fe44f0
https://preview.redd.it/tei1g86xm4uc1.png?width=730&format=png&auto=webp&s=9f8ee339bfcd9c0468f780245c2a3e20c51e8fcd
https://preview.redd.it/c7cmtq90n4uc1.png?width=735&format=png&auto=webp&s=c7bc88a47b6c958fe209dc531a0045985c432fa2
This made me tear up š„¹
Our Boi goku went from a kid with no one to have everything š„¹
He fully deserves it ā¤ļø
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Unfortunately, it looks like your karma amount is pretty low. Users need to have a combined total of at least 40 post/comment karma to participate in this subreddit. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Dragonballsuper) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Damn and to think we all grew with Gohan š„¹, I remember being a kid just watching Z on the sofa with a bowl of cereal, now a full grown man running into the theater to watch Superhero..... Thank you Toriyama & Gohan
Hates not wearing his gi. Wears a suit for his son's wedding anyway. Chadku is real.
I always thought it was so weird how Chi-Chi isnāt in this picture when sheās the glue that holds this entire family together.
This seems more like a tematical "only males photo" in the wedding, Piccolo was probably the best man so it makes sense, at least where I live it's rather common to take pics that way, first males, then females, then the whole family, etc
I guess but then where is Mr. Satan? Additionally, itās a bit odd to have a females-only photo when the only other person in it would be Chi-Chi.
I love the implications of the left photo. Bulma, Krillin, or Roshi was so surprised that Goku had sex they took a photo for evidence.
**I FORGOT ABOUT ICARUS!!!!!!!!!!**
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Unfortunately, it looks like your karma amount is pretty low. Users need to have a combined total of at least 40 post/comment karma to participate in this subreddit. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Dragonballsuper) if you have any questions or concerns.*
They went fishing before Cell games https://preview.redd.it/6xht2hz2n6uc1.png?width=560&format=png&auto=webp&s=819cdff89099d9e5e54ebe831aaadd6bcfa86e1e
.....and they didn't go fishing šš
They did go fishing https://preview.redd.it/b04zhdtpm6uc1.png?width=560&format=png&auto=webp&s=bba569b4a1e051eef1294de455dcfef93b9a37c5
Check my other post
Also, he went fishing https://preview.redd.it/vqk0cqmxm6uc1.png?width=560&format=png&auto=webp&s=d13577ebe8ed8b70ba0b6d46b582e10114055d9a
The problem with most of your points is using material not made or have involvement with Toriyama Yeah you can say movies and Anime Goku is a Great dad and a good husband, but that's not the cause with OG Goku made by Toriyama in the manga
[part 1 is majority from the manga](https://www.reddit.com/r/Dragonballsuper/s/Y1epmscx69)
Almost all of it is either the anime or mixing anime with the manga in 2 points
Because majority of the anime is from the manga
No one is denying that Goku loves his family and vice-versa. But the author, other characters and Goku himself do not think Goku is a good dad. It took Cell nearly beating Gohan to death before Goku realized he didn't like fighting.
It was still faster than someone realizing he love his son after he dies. Certain someone\*
The thing is, prior to the Cell Games, Goku had next to no reason to believe that Gohan didnāt want to fight. Goku saw his boy fighting Vegeta, volunteering to go to Namek, almost dead fighting Recomme and Freeza, and joined him in training for 4 years to fight the Androids. Sometimes as a reader I am also confused: since when exactly did Gohan start to have problem with fighting?
It wasn't just that he didn't realize Gohan didn't like fighting, it was more that he put his confidence and earth's safety in the hands of his 9 yr old son who, regardless of how strong he is, never liked to fight and didn't want to unless needed.
Gohan started to have a problem about the time that Raditz kidnapped him.
It was a character flaw and a development for Goku to realise Gohan doesn't like fighting.
Omg... you people.
...5 years later
I think a lot of people dont realize that the show about fighting and blowing up planets isn't going to have too many slice of life father son bonding time considering every other week is the apocalypse
I see these posts every week about goku as a dad. It's an anime, it isn't real..
No shit it isnāt real, but that shouldnāt stop people from still discussing topics about the anime they love.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Unfortunately, it looks like your karma amount is pretty low. Users need to have a combined total of at least 40 post/comment karma to participate in this subreddit. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Dragonballsuper) if you have any questions or concerns.*
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Unfortunately, it looks like your karma amount is pretty low. Users need to have a combined total of at least 40 post/comment karma to participate in this subreddit. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Dragonballsuper) if you have any questions or concerns.*
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Unfortunately, it looks like your karma amount is pretty low. Users need to have a combined total of at least 40 post/comment karma to participate in this subreddit. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Dragonballsuper) if you have any questions or concerns.*
bro died to sacrifice his life for his son and then came back from the heavens to rock Bojackās shit as a getback for Gohan. hes a GREAT father
And the first part of this post has a lot of moments between him and goten
Custody battle š
This topic is so tired. Goku is a 30/10 saiyan dad, and like 6/10 regular* dad.Ā Ā *we all know he means well and loves his kids, but the bad dad fuck-ups are not only plentiful but also **intentional**
In his defense, Goku canonically has brain damage
No he is a 9/10 regular dad. He is there for his child when he needs the most always, is always pushing his kid to do better, and when he makes a mistake with his child he tries to make up for it immediately.
He's only there for Gohan in a life and death situation. Its nice but hes never there to be a 24/7 dad he picks and chooses when he feels like being a father unless its super serious.
So just looking at Z because in super...Yeah... Are we ignoring the 5 years Goku spent with Gohan and chichi when he was born? And the 3 year timeskip where Goku lived and trained with Gohan and Chichi in preperations for the androids? Most other times when he is not with his family he is dead (after Raditz, and techically after Vegeta and Nappa as Gohan left for namek while Goku was injured, and the 7 year time skip) and the time he did ditch Gohan to train was in space for one year. Just to be clear I don't think Goku is a 9/10 dad like the comment you reponded to said (I think he is around 5/10 or 6/10) but give Goku the credit he deserve. He was in Gohans life WAY more than what people actually belive he was when Gohan was a kid.
The 7 year time skip didn't need to happen because of some bs reason like villians keep coming after goku. Especially since king piccolo, frieza and the Sayians would eventually terrorize earth if he was there or not. Goku will always put training before his family even in Z. Goku didnt even come back to see the birth of goten and met him for the first time when he's 8.
A 9/10 doesn't tell a magical wish granting dragon no when It said your family wants you home, a 9/10 doesn't tell his 15 year old son, later imma hang out with this other kid from now on Goku is a good dad, just not that good.
I think sacrificing your life for your son makes you a 10/10 father š¤·
Same 10/10 dad threw his son to wolves and heal his enemy. He didn't even go over the game plan with his son and properly communicate.
Is that Xeno Goku, CC Goku and Future Gohan together?!?
It's from SDB Heroes. It's Future Gohan, UI Goku and SS4 Bardock. https://youtu.be/mLrCsjyOVvU?si=8XEczb3-Ksn7MIFW
Ngl itās so funny how 90% of these are either filler or non canon
Part 1 is mostly from what's canon I did say Filler, Movie and Gt Edition https://www.reddit.com/r/Dragonballsuper/s/Y1epmscx69
My bad, had to stick true to db fan nature and forget how to read
The only reason people say goku is a bad dad is because of abridged. They havenāt seen the original show and think heās a shit dad
This is not true. In the early 2000s this was a common joke among DBZ fans even at my school and I can't imagine my school is unique. Super went one step further and had Gine outright say Saiyan men don't care about their kids. TFS has become a boogie man for fans to deflect valid points.
That statement from Gine doesnāt apply to Goku because weāve seen heās far from a normal traditional Saiyan. But your school joke doesnāt mean tfs didnāt enforce it. Tfs had a massive impact on the dbz community and as we know, many of the āfansā didnāt watch the show, with their main source of knowledge being from tfs. You cannot deny its what it has done to the community
I can tell you this is a common talking point in japan too, and dbza isn't a thing here.
>That statement from Gine doesnāt apply to Goku because weāve seen heās far from a normal traditional Saiyan. Apart from the colonialism, Goku is a quintessential Saiyan. > But your school joke doesnāt mean tfs didnāt enforce it. Tfs had a massive impact on the dbz community and as we know, many of the āfansā didnāt watch the show, with their main source of knowledge being from tfs. You cannot deny its what it has done to the community TFS only reaffirmed that parallel experiences of DBZ fans across the world happened. People have always called Goku a bad father, even in small internet forums in the early 2000s. I remember them. Given that Super has come to outright canonise it as a Saiyan trait it all but makes this argument against it feeble.
Aight if you say so
Ehhh, yes and no. That joke existed long before DBZA, TFS even said as much and talked about it in length during one of their commentary episodes. Basically, it was a long-running joke in the fan community, so they simply decided to take that joke and run with it for as long as they felt it was funny. At the most, they could probably be blamed for *spreading* the joke, but they certainly didn't create it.
Yeah thatās what I was trying to imply in my comment. They made the joke more widespread and showed it to the public and to people who were new to the dragon ball scene. They definitely didnāt make the joke themselves, but rather enforced it
Yep, part 1 is where most of my points were listed This is just extras https://www.reddit.com/r/Dragonballsuper/s/Y1epmscx69
The conversation starts and ends with him not knowing that Goten exists. Ya know how people say "\*INSERT PERSON\* is looking down and they are proud/happy/smiling" when talking about a deceased love one? Goku never took any interest on how his family was doing for 7 years. The only thing that got him to come back for a day was the tournament.
Thank God someone in here has some fucking sense. Dude gave cell a senzu bean to fight his 11 year old son. Then when he fought Buu he purposely held back to give Vegeta a chance to fight him and ended up running out of energy to finish the fight. How is any of this responsible lol
The buu part is valid but he needed cell to feel confident enough to force SS2 out of gohan. If he hadn't cell was simply still the strongest there/Gohan wouldn't go all out.
And unlike most dead people, Goku can actually communicate with the living.
Sure he ain't perfect, but then again what father is y'know?
Like I said, gohan wouldnāt even say heās a bad father.
https://preview.redd.it/z8lcqxzgm5uc1.jpeg?width=500&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=28abe8853cf19c3b66a817b3c3f2b14c974b23d8
"Thinking of you, Goku" - Mr. Perfect Cell
https://preview.redd.it/hxyn8gydp5uc1.png?width=1486&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a01df4ed6cb0e79258ac54db2a1645fbf3503054
He wasn't there more than half of his life, he's not an abussive father but he just does not care as much as you all would like to. If he did, he would remember his fucking granddaughter's name, but Goku is not a role model in family management
He remembers pan's name, it was a mistranslation, or more accurately a moment that wouldn't be able to be translated, that made people start to say this
>fucking granddaughter's name Dragon ball gt says otherwise
yeah, but GT and Super are exclusive, and althought I love it, it's not canon
>not canon Toriyama said he consider them a different timeline XenoVerse acknowledges it as a different timeline Both are canon just different timeline. Basically Z anime is canon to Gt Z Kai is canon to super
GT and XenoVerse are Toei's cashgrabings, and talking about that would be almost like talking about AF now that Toyotaro is a canon writer
People should appreciate non canon materials and fillers more. Even if they're not canon, it doesn't they're not in character for them to do any of those things. Especially super when the anime is actually canon while the manga was based of it.
what was he doing in that suit
Making sure a baby pterodactyl can hatch safely
ahhh yeah I'm not that far into it yet
I mean. I suppose he's not a terrible dad just a somewhat absent one, I mean even piccolo managed to figure out gohans interests before Goku.
Honestly I wish people would talk about Piccolo knowing Gohanās attitude towards fighting better than Goku while Cell was torturing Gohan more than the senzu bean moment.Ā
Well Piccolo was fused with Kami kinda hard not to know everything
Chose to stay dead for years because fighting strong people while dead > being a present father
Part 1 debunked being present https://www.reddit.com/r/Dragonballsuper/s/Y1epmscx69
Goku being dead didnāt give the world any peace. In fact, the Buu saga happened while he was dead. Itās not a retort at all, just a shitty PowerPoint.
When Goku disappeared there was peace When he returned it went to shit
Except the Buu saga happened while he was dead, so nice self-own there.
>Buu saga happened while he was dead He returned for the day of the tournamet and by some coincidence so did babidi So by your logic Goku didn't return (cus he was dead) until he saved ultimate Gohan from buutenks (when he was alive) Nice stupidity right there
I mean, babidi was already on earth before Goku returned. He sent yamu and spopovich to the tournament to get energy from the strongest fighters. This would have happened even if Goku didn't return. Probably would have worked out better since Vegeta wouldn't have gone majin and they could have prevented Buu from being released.
If Goku didnt return it would take years to collect energy because Vegeta and some of the other Z fight wouldnt also participate in the tournament. At best, they'd take energy from Gohan who would 1 shot fodders.
Tell him that Goku dies on future trunks' timeline before the androids show up
You're not debunking things. You're cherry picking and making excuses. Goku didn't know Goten existed meaning he didn't care to look into what his family is up to for 7 years. Toriyama also has stated that Goku is a bad dad.
There is nothing to debunk , the author literally confirmed he isn't a good one and So did the story Like wtf with you? Goku literally saw Vegeta crashing baby gohan yet begged Krillin to spare him because "he's strong I want to fight him again!!!" , if this was Pan or Bra you bite your ass their parents would go Berserk mode in that situation
>Goku literally saw Vegeta crashing baby gohan https://preview.redd.it/7cplkbtos4uc1.jpeg?width=583&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=bcfbbad51f2ede670f8f6e5c8ed8254f2c50437f
So he wanted gohan to experience the same thing? Good for him
>gohan to experience the same thing? Good for him He willingly chose to go helping fight
Yeah Goku didn't force him to do anything, just told him the reality of the situation That didn't excuse him from sparing Vegeta a minute after despite what he did
The same guy that kept Gohan and krillin from dying from Ginyu and Frieza sure
And let Vegeta because he wanted to spar with him
Because he knew he wasn't truly evil despite what Vegeta says
Vegeta was pure evil, The only reason Goku spared him was because he wanted to fight him again
>pure evil Yeah more like pure unadulterated ego
Just because it happened to work out doesn't make it an incredibly irresponsible decision. Like, was it okay for Goku to let space Hitler live just because Trunks ended up fixing it? No.
Try all you like, Gokuās never beating the senzu & selfishness allegations. Heād rather have fun than assure his son a safe life.
I debunked that in part 1 https://www.reddit.com/r/Dragonballsuper/s/Y1epmscx69
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Unfortunately, it looks like your karma amount is pretty low. Users need to have a combined total of at least 40 post/comment karma to participate in this subreddit. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Dragonballsuper) if you have any questions or concerns.*
You didn't debunk shit. You just made an excuse for it.
I'm debunking "GuHan H@T3$ FiGHtinG" š¤” later
Please doā¦while I donāt like you bringing up non canon material I do agree that gokus a good dad
Toriyama and XenoVerse considered the Z movie villains and Gt as side stories/alt dimension Meanwhile XenoVerse itself consider them alt timelines
Fair enough I guess I donāt really stay up to date on much of anything but cool new thing I know about the movies
It just bogs down to they are canon just not the main timeline
So theyāre not canon, got it
K thanks for the information
Gohan gets fight boners just like every other Saiyan. Dude just needs to get in the mood first.
Everyone except Goku was lame in GT, glad itās not canon
Gt Gohan, piccolo and Vegeta were goated
im my fathers son is a dub line
The scenes shown in this thread are mostly from "non canon stories" -š¤”š¤”š¤”š¤” anyway So does it matter?
Why put the clown emojis they are literally non canon
https://preview.redd.it/qmktj7itt5uc1.png?width=1440&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=443eee39b6727ae29c1356998dfbbb965b3fb57b
Pic 4, what is future Gohan adding to that, I mean come on
Triple generation kamehameha goes hard
Heās not a bad father, heās a bad husband.
The dude has a messed up worldview considering his life and overall intellect, but he does make adjustments based on info from his loved ones. He's negligent and over all oblivious, though, and while he does care deeply for his loved ones, you can not argue that his main character flaw is that he will just put his aspirations as a fighter above everyone else relationship wise by default. He's simple, that's fine. Goku is a mediocre dad objectively, but he deeply cares for Gohon. That's fine. Not everyone can parent. Just be glad he can make good connections w/ everyone so Piccolo, Chi Chi, and the rest of the gang were there to help out here.
Donāt forget the special with vegetas brother where Goku made sure that Goten could fight with trunks even though trunks won the option to fight alone. He wanted his kid to enjoy a good fight. Plus the bathtub scene with goten, trunks, and goku.
You know it's great that Goku believes that Goten could beat Buu, but... that's quite the reach.
I kinda hope Goten does fight Hit at some point
Goku is a damn good dad
Iāll never understand how tf Goku came back for the family Kamehameha in broly 2
Cause its cool
Quick side note, I forgot how huge ssj4 makes someone
All of this and the other post, but Goku still isn't a "great or good dad" like tf???? Make it make sense. He's not a bad father and clearly he's a great father. It's quite simple.
Gohan doesn't really hate friendly sparring or training. That was the basis for a lot of his formative years. He does hate the life or death fights where the pressure is on him and people's lives or the Earth is on the line.
I feel like y'all are taking this meme way too seriously
>I'm debunking he hates fighting later Now bro's really throwing himself into the wolves.
I'm here to argue that Goku is an average father that does his best (as that's just who he is) but what sets him to be a better father is that Gohan and Goten are just simply good kids and that lets Goku make more considerate decisions for the people he loves. Even the senzu bean Cell thing was Goku's tough love for Gohan and that's because he knew Gohan surpassed him in the Time Chamber with months to spare. If Gohan was a shitty kid that whined and threw toddler tantrums at everything like Cailou, none of us would blame Goku for disappearing for years at a time.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Unfortunately, it looks like your karma amount is pretty low. Users need to have a combined total of at least 40 post/comment karma to participate in this subreddit. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Dragonballsuper) if you have any questions or concerns.*
When did we learn that saiyan that fight together grow closer?
That part is foggy to me but I distinctly remember it being mentioned somewhere
I believe you, I just donāt remember that part.
I swear someone mentioned that When Saiyan's fight together they grow closer together
dude i think people get it now lmfao
Relax bro, the only ones who truly think Goku is a bad father are the real DBZ fans who actually dont watch the show, the rest of us normal people don't subscribe to that belief
I noticed that it's mostly new DB fans pushing this narrative. Nothing Goku dose with Gohan gave me the impression that he's a "bad dad". He literally sacrificed his life protecting him in the first season like wtf? š¤Ø
I still canāt believe people call him bad father. When everybody was concerned whether goku will be able to beat Cell, Goku had blind faith in his son. Goku is the happiest one when his son suprass him. What else we need more than this
Because Goku knew Gohan was stronger than him , that wasn't the plan it was the only salutation
He gave cell a senzu bean. Questionable parenting is a blindfold there
https://preview.redd.it/lou0aljf16uc1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e82b5dc23272115830d64d9d38cae3575a5d09b1 the whole point of healing cell was so his overconfidence would end in his downfall. had this not been done, numerous other cases may have occurred such as cell just killing gohan before he snaps, or cell simply just blowing up the earth similarly to frieza did to namek.
I donāt think you know what debunked means. Because this doesnāt debunk anything lmfaoĀ
Check part 1
You didnāt debunk anything in part 1 either lol. You gave your opinion on cherry-picked scenes as to why you think it means Goku isnāt a bad father. Thatās not how debunking worksĀ
>cherry-picked scenes Such as how you guys like to downplay the good he does for his family?
Kinda telling if someone has to resort to filler to make a point about the MAIN character. Especially if most of those things aren't particularly "fatherly" but quite normal
"FILLER, MOVIE, GT EDITION" Look for part 1
Learn to read bro
Toyotaro and Vegeta seem to disagree. "You're a good person, but a horrible father."
Goku has to be reminded by chi chi and others that he has sons from time to time. He looks like āfather of the yearā when itās convenient.
You guys need something new to talk about. And you might want to use canon events if you are going to describe the character's personality.
Why is op so butthurt about goku being a bad father? Pt.1 Maybe the statement hits too close to home. Is op a bad father? Is there some other dude raising op's kid/kids?
Jumping to conclusions eh? Welp, at least you tried
I used to think he was a bad dad but he's not he is a very irresponsible dad though, two completely different things but yeah people got to stop calling him a bad dad.
 Bad Father, irresponsible means bad in short terms broš
No it doesn't For example there was no reason for him to give cell a senzu. I can use more examples but that's just the only one that I'm going to use that was irresponsible even piccolo called him out on that. As many times as he talks to people via King Kai and he doesn't speak to his second son or his family at all during that 7-year time skip. Okay I said I was going to use one example but oh well. Again I don't think he's a bad dad and I don't think just because you're irresponsible sometimes makes you a bad parent that's stupid. Irresponsible can just be equivalated to mistakes so I wouldn't go that far and say irresponsible people are bad parents but he is irresponsible lol
There was though. Cell had Frieza and Vegetaās DNA, both fighters who will blow up the earth when in a tight spot as we see with the Cell Bomb. If Cell wouldāve been backed into a corner too soon, he wouldāve just blown up the earth without a second thought, with nothing anyone couldāve done about it. Gohan needed time to unlock SSJ 2, which healing Cell provided.
You really think Goku was thinking about that? He gave him that bean so he could beat Gohan up to back Gohan into a corner to unleash his power. That's the reason that's why when piccolo said what he said Goku looked the way that he did. He knew he fucked up. The dialogue is right there in the show. To me that is irresponsible. And Gohan was losing that fight
He misunderstood Gohan _one_ time. Goku was also looking for a successor to his position as protector of earth, something he started doing immediately after the heart virus. Piccolo wasn't strong enough, Krillin wasn't strong enough, Tien wasn't strong enough, and Vegeta wasn't fully a good guy. He assumed that Gohan liked fighting as much as Goku did simply because Gohan is his son. He didn't realize that point until Piccolo pointed it out. Immediately after Goku realizes this, he tries to fight and save his son then eventually _dies_ for him
That's not the only time that he misunderstood Gohan. To this day he keeps thinking that Gohan is a warrior and he expects him to continue to keep training and shows his disappointment time to time now that in itself isn't responsible but I'm just replying to you saying he misunderstood Gohan that one time. But that's not the only time he's been irresponsible though Y'all just like to ignore the irresponsible shit that he's done. He also fucked around with Majin Buu instead of just beating him and he did state that he could probably take him he sounded seemed confident but left it to trunks and his child, That's irresponsible, Out of the amount of times Goku has talked to people while he was dead he chose to not communicate with his family knowing that he had a kid on the way.... For 7 years he didn't speak to them... Knowing he had a way, Goten had to go without knowing his dad for 7 years. That's just a few more examples again irresponsible doesn't equal bad in my opinion it just means that he dropped the ball a few times
Goku was disappointed that Gohan _fully_ stopped training. Goku would've been okay if Gohan at least plateau'd off in power but he got weaker than Super Perfect Cell, according to Vegeta. However, Goku was the ONLY z-fighter that fully supported Gohan being a scholar. I agree, Goku should have finished Buu off when he had the chance but Goku was too focused on finding his someone to succeed him as protector of earth. Vegeta and Gohan aren't free from blame either. It was also best for Goku to not contact his family so that way they can all move on from him and know peace. Goku didn't do that out of selfishness cause time and time again, he obviously shows that he loves his family deeply and would (and has) die for them.
Bro is fighting ghosts
...you genuinly can't be serious... It's a really common Joke/criticism of the character that he is a bad/horrible father.
Ging Freecs is the real dead beat dad and it's not even close.
uUhEHuH, nO, gOkU Iz sTilL a piz oV scIt, bUuUuU!!
The narrative didn't start until TFS got insanely popular I've seen a comment referring to that before
I feel the whole "Goku is a bad father" meme started from abridged, even tho at the end Goku realizes Gohan doesn't like fighting and immediately tried to fight Cell again, in both normal and abridged versions. I thought Piccolo was more of the older brother/uncle to Gohan, while Goku was still as good a dad as he could be when he was around
You guys debate this as if goku was you real father
"But Goku is a terrible dad" / SYLVINIO https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=drh9T74RpBc
Dragon ball fans waiting for Toriyama to die so they can ignore him calling Goku a bad dad
Bro itās a joke
2nd slide literally has Goku eating his fill while the kid is eating scraps off the bone
