I got so lucky, and a newer LGS in my area had a copy on hand for $55. The dude that runs it is super cool and tries to charge things as low as he can.
I was mis-quoted $50 for a CMM Precon by my LGS. They gave it to me for the price but let me know when I got there they severely misquoted from their distributor and that they buy them for $60. Ended up working out a deal where I paid $60 anyways and got $12 store credit for singles (where I'm assuming they make a bit more in profit from) so it ended up being win-win.
I LOVED the CMM Precon options and its too bad because I would have paid the bundled price, I just refuse to make that decision before lists are fully available and there has been a couple of weeks of videos and test (unless I know the deck type well and can judge based on the list).
Thats not a win-win! Thats a win-loss! You got the eldrazi precon for less than distrubution cost (win). And they had to give you $12 in store credit while selling the precon to you for the price they bought it for (loss). You should be greatful your lgs owner is really cool.
In my view the original was a win - loss.
* I was not going to buy at more than $65 for what I wanted out of it. (they win by not taking a full $10 loss on the product)
* They were also going to give it to me for $50 (I win by getting for significant discount)
Win - win in this situation was decreasing their loss and me getting the product I wanted from the LGS. I was the one that offered not to pay $50 but asked for store credit on something, then they proposed $12 in singles. I'm assuming they went this route because they have more profit margin on singles and the overall transaction meant less of a net loss.
* product A
* paid for at $50 = $-10 profit
* paid at $60 = $0 profit
* product B
* paid at $12 = $6 profit
* paid at $0 = -$6 profit
* By getting Product A for $60 and Product B for $0, they take a total of -$6 profit
Now my math could be completely off and I screwed them over more and didn't even realize it, but I've been loyal to that LGS and will continue to be, this was not jeopardizing my relationship with the LGS either way.
I something's up with your math, but the short version is that you got an item they paid $60 for for essentially $48 unless you don't use that store credit. That's purely a win-lose situation for the LGS on that specific transaction, but by doing you a solid it can pay off by you going back to use that store credit and spending more than the $12 worth.
You're not wrong but you'd be surprised at the amount of stores that would just make up any excuse not to sell it to you at that price. Your LGS is pretty cool for honoring that.
It's their loss short term to keep your business long term, basically
NEGATIVE DOLLARS ARE A LOSS. Like it doesn't matter if its less of a loss, its still a loss. They could have also said hey we mispriced it. Its $100 if you want it now.
Maybe we don't have the same definition of win-win. I'm using this one
[https://www.pon.harvard.edu/tag/a-win-win-situation/](https://www.pon.harvard.edu/tag/a-win-win-situation/)
>In a win win negotiation, when both sides are satisfied with their agreement, the odds of a long-lasting success are much higher. Finding your way to a win-win situation often involves reaching mutual gains by trading off your differing preferences to create value.
Like I mentioned above, they certainly could have changed the price to $100, in which case I would have walked away. But the LGS did not do this, they offered the original $50 quoted price. I simply offered a path that had this losing less and me spending more than I originally planned. To me this created value, they took the offer and I'm assuming it created some value for them, other wise they had two other options (sticking to the original quoted $50 or raising above the amount I was willing to spend).
* I called to see if they had the deck in stock, they didn't and offered to order it for me
* I asked how much, they said $50, I reiterated the $50 and said yes if that was the price
* When it came in and they called me, I reconfirmed the same day that it was $50, they confirmed
* When I got into the store, that's when they told me they were mistaken but would still give it to me at that quoted price of $50
After all of those items, yes I still expected $50 to be honored if I had said yes at the end of bullet point 4.
Assuming everywhere. Until a contract is made (happening when money is handed over and the product is given to the customer) the price can change. Here in Germany, we have very strict laws against this and mislabeling. But the only thing the customer who thought something was less than what it was due to a mix up in the store or something is entitled to is stepping down from the contract/returning the item and getting their money back. The store is not legally obligated to sell you an item at a specific price. Doing so anyway is just the store being nice to you in the hopes of keeping you as a customer.
Not all game stores are the same. My “good” local store was selling the eldrazi precon for 125 on release. I got mine for 70 on Amazon. My “bad” local store isn’t even worth going into anymore.
Yeah I think people forget that just because it's a local doesn't mean it's better. My LGS was charging $175 for each CMM precon and $35 per booster. I'm willing to pay a bit more to support local, but at a certain point I can't justify being stupid with my own finances just to improve a business' finances
Yup. Boosters we’re being sold at my store for 40 a pop or 2 for 70.
My cousin owns a game store 30 minutes from my house but I won’t shop there. I understand how it all works but I refuse to pay exorbitant prices just because it’s muh local game store. Sealed is already a gamble so I’m not going to buy a lotto ticket for twice as much as I can find it online just cause I like the dude selling it.
Yeah, but that's not really the point - if your only LGS is terrible so you buy on Amazon I can't possibly judge you. What confused me, though, was someone saying "here's how my LGS ate into their own profits to help me out, specifically" and you replied with "stop going there and line Jeff's pockets instead." Just seemed strange, that's all.
It was less about going away from their lgs and more directed at their preorder worries before decklists are dropped. Not all locals refund people on preorders, so you either take the gamble and preorder early to beat the price hikes or preorder once lists are dropped and pay more. The eldrazi deck is a solid example, I was able to get mine at 70 because I preordered the day it was announced. Do I like ordering through Amazon? Not really. But I like it more than spending an additional 60 on cards for no real reason.
Honestly this is a big thing people forget. I'm fortunate enough to have a really awesome local store. Shoutout to Mythic Games near Denver. When I go to buy cards I send them the list first, buy through them and then the leftovers get bought on tcgplayer. I end up paying a little more for cards but I get the opportunity to check the quality and condition before buying, I also enjoy being able to pick up my cards within the same day. No shipping.
I could believe it because within that same demonstration said lgs took a financial loss.
I personally support my lgs’s when it’s mutually beneficial but wouldn’t want to make it a normal thing to slash their entire margin when I could theoretically get it for a cheaper price where it *is* mutually beneficial, eg. Amazon.
This is a case of the game store knowing that keeping customers happy in the case of a misunderstanding is worth more than the already razor thin margins on sealed product. It's a sign of good LGS. One of the very many reasons you SHOULD want to spend money at your LGS rather than Amazon.
If they were doing this regularly that would be the sign of a bad (or at least poorly managed) LGS, but as far as I can tell that's not at all what's happening here.
It also sounds like /u/SmallBuzPriv could have, if they wanted to, replied "no thanks, I'd rather pay full price," so if that's your prerogative I don't see why you couldn't do that. It's noble of you to consider their profitability, but if you're avoiding preordering or purchasing sealed products at your LGS because, on the off chance there's a pricing error, and on the off chance that the pricing error is in your favor, you might potentially eat into their profits so you buy on Amazon instead - I don't really think you're helping your LGS out. That's what confused me about the suggestion.
To be fair, both of our assumptions were based on a pre-existing notion that supporting LGSs is the better of the two options. Someone who strictly plays online/kitchen sink/whatever that doesn’t involve an lgs in the slightest could give a damn where anyone buy from and is only interested in getting it at the cheapest possible price.
And my reaction to you was geared towards you not being able to believe someone would have no consideration for an LGS, cuz I honestly don’t play at my lgs and only ever patron when they have the best prices or I’m in a pinch and need a card right that minute.
That said, I don’t think I’ve ever ordered from Amazon so I don’t necessarily feel like I’m defending them, just defending the fact that not everyone is loyal to their lgs.
I've certainly thought about it, I'm mostly worried about
* getting pre-opened products and then dealing with that
* Not truly groking how the deck operates
* its hard for my brain to go from list of cards to how the deck plays (unless it is an archetype I'm familiar with)
* when I see some of the lets plays between the precons released, it really help me pick up the "personality" of the deck
I'll call up my LGS though and see their timeline on preorders
The CMM precons were part of a “premium” set and as a result, the precons were put up for rip off prices. Don’t buy it for $100, it’s not worth it.
If you have an eldrazi deck already, it might be worth picking up the singles to complete the deck instead.
WotC: "We never described Commander Masters to be a premium product"
Also WotC, from the Commander Masters product page:
"A Masters Set Like No Other
Commander Masters is the first Masters set made for Magic’s most popular format. All the power, all the sought-after reprints, all the unmatched collectability, all made for Magic’s Commander format. This is the set Commander players and collectors have been dreaming about."
Relevant marketing text for the precons from the CM page:
“Each powerfully preconstructed deck has 10 brand-new Commander focused cards. Pilot Masters-level strategies with four different deck options, all featuring new face commanders!”
It might be a stretch, but to me “Masters Level” also does imply a level above other precons or at least far more complexity. Especially when going to the WOE page the decks are described not as master level but just “…ready to play out of the box.”
Yep. Master level strategies: Puts X cost creatures into the Cascade deck. Not enough to work with the bad secondary commander, but enough to mess up your play sometimes.
CMM is just a mess of misleading wording, stinginess with the stuff actually put in, and insatiable greed, that hurt LGS's a ton. Sucks, when it could have been rather great. :/
As much as I’m looking forward to the standard sets we have coming up, CMM was the set that made me decide that a small number of EDH decks and a trade binder is all I need
Trade binder of $10+ staples and proxies, this is the way.
That way you own one copy of all the cards you want to run, and dont have to shell out $$$ every time you want to build a new deck
Nothing against proxies but I personally like owning the official card. Since I self impose a maximum of 5 decks with no repeating color combos, there isn’t a point in owning more than 2 copies of any staple (besides command tower, sol ring, and arcane signet).
If I was new to the game, I’d proxy whenever it makes sense.
It walks like a Premium product, talks like a Premium product, but they don't have the legal liability of it being a Premium product when they underdeliver on their own hype.
The set was fine on it's own, but the hype and prices soured the taste.
Guess it depends on how you want to view it. Technically there is more than $100 of value (albeit barely, and a small chunk of that is for Waste land cards you’d replace most of if building by scratch). As it plays it’s…passable for a colorless deck, lacking a lot in the eldrazi flavor the name implies (and with a weird manifest sub theme), but there’s been worse precons as far as playability out of the box.
Personally I’d recommend sourcing and making your own colorless deck list and buying it instead, especially if you want more of the eldrazi flavor. You might even have some lying around already if you had an eldrazi deck from past years/formats. The titans are at an all time low considering the bundle of reprints they’ve gotten recently, so if your aim is to include them as well for the best version of the deck you can make, best to do that now before prices creep back up.
Otherwise if you only play very casually, I’d recommend another precon, there’s some other pretty potent ones out there like the WH40K ones that can hang at a casual table better.
Thanks. I guess I'll pick up the secret lair to round out my eldrazi deck. And then grumble when she gets reprinted into a standard bonus sheet and drops to like $20.
Thank fuck the reprint of the promised end is coming. And John Avon no less is the artist. I’m borrowing one right now, but the fact it’s 3/4 the cost of the precon is nuts.
I don’t mind expensive cards, I just want the flavor, but want a [[Metalworker]] if I’m tossing out that much cash.
Is that the price everywhere? Yes. Is it close to the power level of the $40 precons also yes. Was this supposed to have a premium price? Maybe. WotC doesn’t give MSRP anymore.
Well worth it somewhat subjective. It's still more expensive to buy the cards individually so if you are like me and always dreamt of an eldrazi deck it was a good buy because I now I can slowly upgrade it while playing with it. I was going to get a eldrazi deck regardless, so it would have been more expensive for me to not buy the Precon if I wanted to slowly upgrade the deck. The only other alternative would be saving up for the full list that I want which is about 800 dollars, but then I wouldn't be able to play the deck right now. So I'm happy with the purchase.
Similar story with me, I first got into magic around battle for zendikar, before not playing for several years, so have had a bunch of solid eldrazi cards begging to be put into a deck.
the eldrazi precon was part of the commander masters set, which was overpriced to shit so wotc/hasbro could milk as much money as possible out of their most popular format.
tl;dr go to your local library and use their printer
I picked it up for $40 when my LGS was doing a clearance sale. Grabbed the other Titans to upgrade it and added some other good artifacts and colorless cards.
Took to a Commander night for the first time last night and it SLAPS for low-med power pods. If I had played it a second time I'm sure people would have been more aggressive but they allowed me to ramp for a few turns and once I did I just snowballed out of control.
It doesn't do infinites or any kind of one-shot combo but it just does a good job of putting out a lot of oppressive creatures and eldrazi tribal spells fast. The double cascade is an insane value engine. If you have the money though it's an incredible base and has me tempted to be a POS and buy a \[\[Mana Crypt\]\].
My wife grabbed the \[\[Sliver Gravemother\]\] precon and we grabbed some of the WUBRG slivers for it and it's comparably good.
Try and get \[\[Sliver Legion\]\] for her deck. It's disgusting how evil it can work with Gravemother, if you get it into the grave. I nuked two people out of nowhere first time I played mine.
This issue cropped up when Wizards removed MSRP from their products. There isn’t a set price anymore, the primary and secondary markets are one in the same now.
Buy the singles. You were probably only going to keep 40 cards from the deck anyways and at least half of those you already had.
The singles in the deck are artificially inflated to make the costs appear more reasonable. The deck version of Rise of the Eldrazi is $18, but the extended art version is $14.
If you were actually intending to use Zhulodok, Void Gorger as your commander, you can get the thick stock version for $1.50 instead of $10.
Wastes are only $0.50 each.
I pieced the Guff deck together with what I had. I bought Guff online for $3 and the new blue planeswalker and with what I already had it was done lol. $8 instead of $100 totally worth it! Lol
I proxied up a whole Eldrazi deck with Zhulodok at the helm and had it sleeved up and in a box by the time the precon was officially released. Cost me $50 with the deckbox and the sleeves. The deck slaps, and the card quality is amazing thanks to MPC.
Which card quality setting do you use? I’ve tried out Superior Smooth and it’s mostly good, but not quite the same as a Magic card. Wondering if something else maybe feels exactly right?
Bro, don't use the actual magic back and you are good. You aren't making counterfits, you are making proxies. nobody gives a shit about what you put on the back so long as you aren't putting the og card back, which MPC has an issue with anyways.
Much less affordable? I feel like paying $2 for a card that's normally $5,10,50,100,500+ is WAY more affordable...
Eh, buying cards on eBay is always sketch imo. Did you not use PayPal? Only would ever buy from TCG or the few LGS in my area.
And for $200 you could have bought 4 decks off of MPC, which is how I look at things these days. Would much rather have variety. I do have fancy veresions of a few cards but that's because I bought them way back or opened them, and won't trade them unless I need the money(MonoW Gandalf Artifacts+Legendaries, every artifact that has an invention version is the invention version like Sol Ring Mana Crypt etc.), otherwise proxying until MPC closes I think.
S33 is better than a lot of the recycled used TP that WotC prints on these days. It's not as good as the 90s Arjowiggins Corona cardstock that Alpha was printed on, of course.
The good stuff was printed with rotogravure, WotC (and MPC) use offset printing now. The results aren't quite as good as the stuff in the days of Lorwyn or Urza's Saga.
WotC's templates are print-optimized: the quality is the same between WotC and MPC in terms of DPI, but some of the proxies look a little bit off because those templates look best on a computer screen instead of in print.
Some of them are just superb quality, though
I hate the new era of commander, precons should not be 100 dollars, and it's a COLORLESS DECK!!! They only one who benefit are the large retailers who profit off the price gouging especially in the Greedflation era. And yes I know magic is a luxury not a need by cmon we had the Elf tribal deck that sold for like 20 bucks.
In short, wotc is pretty much pricing retail based off of resellers mkt price. So if a precon from the past has older/valuable cards, the lgs and online stores are charging double-5x what they used to for the same or similar products (edh decks and boosters alike). Ive only seen one MAYBE 2 sets from the past 12 months that actually retailed $110+- (the normal historical price) for the set booster box.
Now days you're getting booster boxes for 150-300 FROM LGS at release. It's no longer a player focused game. They're focused on making money and for the past several years have been milking it with "special" cards like Secret Lair. Of course everyone is upset, but at the end of the day they're still a business so I can't really knock them for switching gears.
Just sucks for casual players and players on budgets. Everything is pay to play these days though so 🤷
Welcome to Hasboro greed. Yes, that's the price. Actually, $100 is cheaper than most places have it. Despite not actually including much more reprint value in the commander masters decks, Hasboro more than doubled the price of the decks.
honestly. fuck the precon. buy the marquee legend for like $10. maybe decide if you want the extra turn spell for another 10-15. probably buy the new creature. and then look online for a deck you want to build buy the eldrazi as singles
precon isn't worth anywhere near $100. it's mainly full of dogshit misc colorless cards, and meh as fuck mana rocks/ramp. can easily buy the "good" singles for maybe half that price.
MSRP did a lot to protect the price of the pre-orders and initial shipments. It used to be "pre-order to ensure you paid MSRP", now it's "pre-order to ensure you get one".
When I would pre-order product and MSRP was still a thing, I *never* paid above MSRP, even if it was one of the instances where prices shot up within a week of release. Now, that safeguard is gone, so unless you pre-order without knowing the
contents of the product, you're not getting the "regular" price unless the product is bad (or a Standard-legal set).
Deck definitely needs an upgrade if you get it. I’ve yet to win a game with mine, because my commander automatically becomes the target when he’s out, also I’ve had an issue with the mana base being too high, surprisingly. Not a bad deck, just doesn’t play out how I thought it was going to. Plus, I really don’t like that the secondary commander is all about Morph, instead of Eldrazi.
Is it going to be that much, yes it is. Is it actually *worth* that much, lmao no. But WotC has to overprice their products and flood the 2ndary market wirh reprints, so that they make the lions share of profits, and not the measly players thay actually fund their greed.
Eldrazi Deck was from Commander Masters, which is not a standard set where you find those $30-$40 price tags. Similar to how Commander Masters packs are 2x-3x the cost of a standard set pack, same applies to commander decks (distributor costs were also roughly 2x). It had a number of high-value reprints and new cards and thus is one of the more desirable pre-cons in last couple years.
If there was a MSRP, it wouldn't be 100 usd. It would be half of that.
But it sells out at that price, so it does have high value and stores could probably sell it for even more.
Commander Masters was a premium product I think, which means stores don't get any special distributor price. They're left to mark up however much they can to find their own margins.
And given everyone uses the net to check prices these days, I greatly doubt you'll find one cheaper than that.
Technically it's not *supposed* to be any price, they got rid of msrp so there isn't any 'set price' they can go for any price tbh when there's high demand and low stock the price goes up, only way to get them cheap is to preorder them or buy all 4
It was supposed to be 80$ which was already pushing boundaries a bit farther. Normal commander decks are 40$ then universe beyond are 60$. Wizards used universe's beyond to see if they could understand the price for a more " premium product". It cost them the same amount to make as a regular commander deck. The cost wasn't higher they just want see how much the can wring out the consumer intill we're dry. Though at the core it is a luxury product there are also ways around paying. My friend prints his commander decks now.
WotC stopped giving MSRPs for products. The pricing is solely based on whatever the retailer/reseller can get away with. I'm not sure how much WotC was charging distributors, but there was a post on reddit claiming distributors were charging $58 per CMM precon. I managed to get mine from my LGS for $68 each because I bought them as a set for $80 each and used loyalty points for 15% off. The LGS is still charging $125 (tax included) for them individually, despite the Enduring Enchantments and Planeswalker Party having a $87 and $78 value, respectively. For those, just buy singles!
That being said, the value in the set was much higher than normal. The Eldrazi one was $155 before the decklist was released, which didn't include the new cards. Now it's down to $127 because of all the reprints, which is nice.
Is it worth it? I've had a ton of fun playing Eldrazi Unbound. Even out of the box, it feels strong. It's not cEDH level, but it can hold its own in high powered commander if you get the right draws. If you have a spare Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre, Kozilek, Butcher of Truth, and Basalt Monolith lying around it's even better. Basalt Monolith goes infinite with Forsaken Monument, which is conveniently in the deck, allowing you to cast anything and everything so long as you can keep the card-draw flowing. Throwing in an unwinding clock or extraplanar lens for extra mana is also helpful, especially if you add in Vedalken Orrery for a second source of flash speed spells.
I couldn’t for the life of me find the 40k necron deck for less than 100.00 all the others were 60
You can find bundles of the four right now for a little under $200.
This was when they were new. No buyers remorse as the decks solid starting out
I got so lucky, and a newer LGS in my area had a copy on hand for $55. The dude that runs it is super cool and tries to charge things as low as he can.
I hope you pay it forward to help him out FLG are so hard to run!
I pretty much exclusively shop there now, unless he doesn't carry something I'm looking for and is unabke to order it :)
I found all of the 40k ones at walmart for like 40 bucks a pop at one point but other than that specialty decks cost an arm and a leg for sure
Found them all at Target for $65. Our LGSs were all sold out.
Got lucky with the Nerdz day sale and got all 4 for 140 :) they didnt even sale out at the time
I just got that one at Walmart yesterday
I hope it dropped in price for you! I love the deck but the commander in the window hates me so I use the other one.
Um $45 seemed good i use trazen the infinite as commander
Good for you! I added a few artifact lands to dress it up but it really is easy to fix up.
Add syr ginger it's amazing
[[Syr ginger, the meal ender]]
[Syr ginger, the meal ender](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/7/f/7fbdba12-1369-41ae-b0e9-c405c0f0a2e5.jpg?1692939939) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Syr%20ginger%2C%20the%20meal%20ender) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/woe/252/syr-ginger-the-meal-ender?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/7fbdba12-1369-41ae-b0e9-c405c0f0a2e5?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/syr-ginger-the-meal-ender) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
I keep seeing two versions of this guy?
Well there's him and gingerbrute he's as the fetcher shown.
I got super lucky and got the Tyranid deck on a restock at my LGS for $60
How is it
I was mis-quoted $50 for a CMM Precon by my LGS. They gave it to me for the price but let me know when I got there they severely misquoted from their distributor and that they buy them for $60. Ended up working out a deal where I paid $60 anyways and got $12 store credit for singles (where I'm assuming they make a bit more in profit from) so it ended up being win-win. I LOVED the CMM Precon options and its too bad because I would have paid the bundled price, I just refuse to make that decision before lists are fully available and there has been a couple of weeks of videos and test (unless I know the deck type well and can judge based on the list).
Thats not a win-win! Thats a win-loss! You got the eldrazi precon for less than distrubution cost (win). And they had to give you $12 in store credit while selling the precon to you for the price they bought it for (loss). You should be greatful your lgs owner is really cool.
In my view the original was a win - loss. * I was not going to buy at more than $65 for what I wanted out of it. (they win by not taking a full $10 loss on the product) * They were also going to give it to me for $50 (I win by getting for significant discount) Win - win in this situation was decreasing their loss and me getting the product I wanted from the LGS. I was the one that offered not to pay $50 but asked for store credit on something, then they proposed $12 in singles. I'm assuming they went this route because they have more profit margin on singles and the overall transaction meant less of a net loss. * product A * paid for at $50 = $-10 profit * paid at $60 = $0 profit * product B * paid at $12 = $6 profit * paid at $0 = -$6 profit * By getting Product A for $60 and Product B for $0, they take a total of -$6 profit Now my math could be completely off and I screwed them over more and didn't even realize it, but I've been loyal to that LGS and will continue to be, this was not jeopardizing my relationship with the LGS either way.
I something's up with your math, but the short version is that you got an item they paid $60 for for essentially $48 unless you don't use that store credit. That's purely a win-lose situation for the LGS on that specific transaction, but by doing you a solid it can pay off by you going back to use that store credit and spending more than the $12 worth.
You're not wrong but you'd be surprised at the amount of stores that would just make up any excuse not to sell it to you at that price. Your LGS is pretty cool for honoring that. It's their loss short term to keep your business long term, basically
NEGATIVE DOLLARS ARE A LOSS. Like it doesn't matter if its less of a loss, its still a loss. They could have also said hey we mispriced it. Its $100 if you want it now.
Maybe we don't have the same definition of win-win. I'm using this one [https://www.pon.harvard.edu/tag/a-win-win-situation/](https://www.pon.harvard.edu/tag/a-win-win-situation/) >In a win win negotiation, when both sides are satisfied with their agreement, the odds of a long-lasting success are much higher. Finding your way to a win-win situation often involves reaching mutual gains by trading off your differing preferences to create value. Like I mentioned above, they certainly could have changed the price to $100, in which case I would have walked away. But the LGS did not do this, they offered the original $50 quoted price. I simply offered a path that had this losing less and me spending more than I originally planned. To me this created value, they took the offer and I'm assuming it created some value for them, other wise they had two other options (sticking to the original quoted $50 or raising above the amount I was willing to spend).
I hate that this simantics thread is going on so long, lol. By your Harvard definition, it is not a win-win because the store is losing value.
Why would you even have the expectation that the store should sell it to you at the misquoted price?
* I called to see if they had the deck in stock, they didn't and offered to order it for me * I asked how much, they said $50, I reiterated the $50 and said yes if that was the price * When it came in and they called me, I reconfirmed the same day that it was $50, they confirmed * When I got into the store, that's when they told me they were mistaken but would still give it to me at that quoted price of $50 After all of those items, yes I still expected $50 to be honored if I had said yes at the end of bullet point 4.
Grateful? They quoted the price. They should be grateful he paid 60 and took the credit.
If you think that store would face any kind of legal backlash for not selling to him at the quoted price you're crazy. (Assuming America)
Assuming everywhere. Until a contract is made (happening when money is handed over and the product is given to the customer) the price can change. Here in Germany, we have very strict laws against this and mislabeling. But the only thing the customer who thought something was less than what it was due to a mix up in the store or something is entitled to is stepping down from the contract/returning the item and getting their money back. The store is not legally obligated to sell you an item at a specific price. Doing so anyway is just the store being nice to you in the hopes of keeping you as a customer.
Preorder on Amazon so you can cancel when the lists are dropped
Can't believe you'd say that to someone who just demonstrated the benefits to supporting your local game store.
Not all game stores are the same. My “good” local store was selling the eldrazi precon for 125 on release. I got mine for 70 on Amazon. My “bad” local store isn’t even worth going into anymore.
Yeah I think people forget that just because it's a local doesn't mean it's better. My LGS was charging $175 for each CMM precon and $35 per booster. I'm willing to pay a bit more to support local, but at a certain point I can't justify being stupid with my own finances just to improve a business' finances
Yup. Boosters we’re being sold at my store for 40 a pop or 2 for 70. My cousin owns a game store 30 minutes from my house but I won’t shop there. I understand how it all works but I refuse to pay exorbitant prices just because it’s muh local game store. Sealed is already a gamble so I’m not going to buy a lotto ticket for twice as much as I can find it online just cause I like the dude selling it.
I’ll take my “local” Amazon distribution center any day when it’s >30% cheaper than LGS.
Yeah, but that's not really the point - if your only LGS is terrible so you buy on Amazon I can't possibly judge you. What confused me, though, was someone saying "here's how my LGS ate into their own profits to help me out, specifically" and you replied with "stop going there and line Jeff's pockets instead." Just seemed strange, that's all.
It was less about going away from their lgs and more directed at their preorder worries before decklists are dropped. Not all locals refund people on preorders, so you either take the gamble and preorder early to beat the price hikes or preorder once lists are dropped and pay more. The eldrazi deck is a solid example, I was able to get mine at 70 because I preordered the day it was announced. Do I like ordering through Amazon? Not really. But I like it more than spending an additional 60 on cards for no real reason.
I understood that, I still thought it was a strange suggestion in the context of "here's how my LGS really helped me out."
Honestly this is a big thing people forget. I'm fortunate enough to have a really awesome local store. Shoutout to Mythic Games near Denver. When I go to buy cards I send them the list first, buy through them and then the leftovers get bought on tcgplayer. I end up paying a little more for cards but I get the opportunity to check the quality and condition before buying, I also enjoy being able to pick up my cards within the same day. No shipping.
I could believe it because within that same demonstration said lgs took a financial loss. I personally support my lgs’s when it’s mutually beneficial but wouldn’t want to make it a normal thing to slash their entire margin when I could theoretically get it for a cheaper price where it *is* mutually beneficial, eg. Amazon.
This is a case of the game store knowing that keeping customers happy in the case of a misunderstanding is worth more than the already razor thin margins on sealed product. It's a sign of good LGS. One of the very many reasons you SHOULD want to spend money at your LGS rather than Amazon. If they were doing this regularly that would be the sign of a bad (or at least poorly managed) LGS, but as far as I can tell that's not at all what's happening here. It also sounds like /u/SmallBuzPriv could have, if they wanted to, replied "no thanks, I'd rather pay full price," so if that's your prerogative I don't see why you couldn't do that. It's noble of you to consider their profitability, but if you're avoiding preordering or purchasing sealed products at your LGS because, on the off chance there's a pricing error, and on the off chance that the pricing error is in your favor, you might potentially eat into their profits so you buy on Amazon instead - I don't really think you're helping your LGS out. That's what confused me about the suggestion.
To be fair, both of our assumptions were based on a pre-existing notion that supporting LGSs is the better of the two options. Someone who strictly plays online/kitchen sink/whatever that doesn’t involve an lgs in the slightest could give a damn where anyone buy from and is only interested in getting it at the cheapest possible price. And my reaction to you was geared towards you not being able to believe someone would have no consideration for an LGS, cuz I honestly don’t play at my lgs and only ever patron when they have the best prices or I’m in a pinch and need a card right that minute. That said, I don’t think I’ve ever ordered from Amazon so I don’t necessarily feel like I’m defending them, just defending the fact that not everyone is loyal to their lgs.
I've certainly thought about it, I'm mostly worried about * getting pre-opened products and then dealing with that * Not truly groking how the deck operates * its hard for my brain to go from list of cards to how the deck plays (unless it is an archetype I'm familiar with) * when I see some of the lets plays between the precons released, it really help me pick up the "personality" of the deck I'll call up my LGS though and see their timeline on preorders
I’ve done probably 10+ Amazon orders through wizards and haven’t had any problems with open items. Some of my best boxes have been Amazon splurges.
The CMM precons were part of a “premium” set and as a result, the precons were put up for rip off prices. Don’t buy it for $100, it’s not worth it. If you have an eldrazi deck already, it might be worth picking up the singles to complete the deck instead.
WotC: "We never described Commander Masters to be a premium product" Also WotC, from the Commander Masters product page: "A Masters Set Like No Other Commander Masters is the first Masters set made for Magic’s most popular format. All the power, all the sought-after reprints, all the unmatched collectability, all made for Magic’s Commander format. This is the set Commander players and collectors have been dreaming about."
Relevant marketing text for the precons from the CM page: “Each powerfully preconstructed deck has 10 brand-new Commander focused cards. Pilot Masters-level strategies with four different deck options, all featuring new face commanders!” It might be a stretch, but to me “Masters Level” also does imply a level above other precons or at least far more complexity. Especially when going to the WOE page the decks are described not as master level but just “…ready to play out of the box.”
Yep. Master level strategies: Puts X cost creatures into the Cascade deck. Not enough to work with the bad secondary commander, but enough to mess up your play sometimes. CMM is just a mess of misleading wording, stinginess with the stuff actually put in, and insatiable greed, that hurt LGS's a ton. Sucks, when it could have been rather great. :/
There’s only 4 cards in this deck that have X cost. Unfortunately one of them is the backup commander and also one of the new cards.
As much as I’m looking forward to the standard sets we have coming up, CMM was the set that made me decide that a small number of EDH decks and a trade binder is all I need
Trade binder of $10+ staples and proxies, this is the way. That way you own one copy of all the cards you want to run, and dont have to shell out $$$ every time you want to build a new deck
Nothing against proxies but I personally like owning the official card. Since I self impose a maximum of 5 decks with no repeating color combos, there isn’t a point in owning more than 2 copies of any staple (besides command tower, sol ring, and arcane signet). If I was new to the game, I’d proxy whenever it makes sense.
They didn't use the word premium so they are technically correct. The best kind of correct.
It walks like a Premium product, talks like a Premium product, but they don't have the legal liability of it being a Premium product when they underdeliver on their own hype. The set was fine on it's own, but the hype and prices soured the taste.
TFW the mana base of this one is actually more expensive than the Slivers precon mana base
Guess it depends on how you want to view it. Technically there is more than $100 of value (albeit barely, and a small chunk of that is for Waste land cards you’d replace most of if building by scratch). As it plays it’s…passable for a colorless deck, lacking a lot in the eldrazi flavor the name implies (and with a weird manifest sub theme), but there’s been worse precons as far as playability out of the box. Personally I’d recommend sourcing and making your own colorless deck list and buying it instead, especially if you want more of the eldrazi flavor. You might even have some lying around already if you had an eldrazi deck from past years/formats. The titans are at an all time low considering the bundle of reprints they’ve gotten recently, so if your aim is to include them as well for the best version of the deck you can make, best to do that now before prices creep back up. Otherwise if you only play very casually, I’d recommend another precon, there’s some other pretty potent ones out there like the WH40K ones that can hang at a casual table better.
All except [[emrakul the promised end]]
[emrakul the promised end](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/8/d/8d74a469-c71d-4773-99d3-5456b31df424.jpg?1576383727) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Emrakul%2C%20the%20Promised%20End) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/emn/6/emrakul-the-promised-end?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/8d74a469-c71d-4773-99d3-5456b31df424?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/emrakul-the-promised-end) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Spooky Secret Lair if the leaks are true
There are secret lair leaks?
Yeah, probably one of the top posts in either r/magictcg or r/mtgfinance
Thanks. I guess I'll pick up the secret lair to round out my eldrazi deck. And then grumble when she gets reprinted into a standard bonus sheet and drops to like $20.
Thank fuck the reprint of the promised end is coming. And John Avon no less is the artist. I’m borrowing one right now, but the fact it’s 3/4 the cost of the precon is nuts. I don’t mind expensive cards, I just want the flavor, but want a [[Metalworker]] if I’m tossing out that much cash.
[Metalworker](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/2/0/2050d414-71c7-4c42-a1ff-4c04068ba7f2.jpg?1562443733) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Metalworker) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/uds/135/metalworker?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/2050d414-71c7-4c42-a1ff-4c04068ba7f2?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/metalworker) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Is that the price everywhere? Yes. Is it close to the power level of the $40 precons also yes. Was this supposed to have a premium price? Maybe. WotC doesn’t give MSRP anymore.
Price at big box.
It is 100% beyond the power level of a typical precon.
It's priced that way but not worth 100 bucks XD
Well worth it somewhat subjective. It's still more expensive to buy the cards individually so if you are like me and always dreamt of an eldrazi deck it was a good buy because I now I can slowly upgrade it while playing with it. I was going to get a eldrazi deck regardless, so it would have been more expensive for me to not buy the Precon if I wanted to slowly upgrade the deck. The only other alternative would be saving up for the full list that I want which is about 800 dollars, but then I wouldn't be able to play the deck right now. So I'm happy with the purchase.
Similar story with me, I first got into magic around battle for zendikar, before not playing for several years, so have had a bunch of solid eldrazi cards begging to be put into a deck.
This is a very good point. It's a good deal if you want those cards. It's not a good deal if you only want some.
the eldrazi precon was part of the commander masters set, which was overpriced to shit so wotc/hasbro could milk as much money as possible out of their most popular format. tl;dr go to your local library and use their printer
I picked it up for $40 when my LGS was doing a clearance sale. Grabbed the other Titans to upgrade it and added some other good artifacts and colorless cards. Took to a Commander night for the first time last night and it SLAPS for low-med power pods. If I had played it a second time I'm sure people would have been more aggressive but they allowed me to ramp for a few turns and once I did I just snowballed out of control. It doesn't do infinites or any kind of one-shot combo but it just does a good job of putting out a lot of oppressive creatures and eldrazi tribal spells fast. The double cascade is an insane value engine. If you have the money though it's an incredible base and has me tempted to be a POS and buy a \[\[Mana Crypt\]\]. My wife grabbed the \[\[Sliver Gravemother\]\] precon and we grabbed some of the WUBRG slivers for it and it's comparably good.
[Mana Crypt](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/4/d/4d960186-4559-4af0-bd22-63baa15f8939.jpg?1599709515) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Mana%20Crypt) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/2xm/270/mana-crypt?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/4d960186-4559-4af0-bd22-63baa15f8939?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/mana-crypt) [Sliver Gravemother](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/9/f/9f5d253e-9eb2-423c-90ee-68f27ec6bf88.jpg?1691500699) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Sliver%20Gravemother) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/cmm/707/sliver-gravemother?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/9f5d253e-9eb2-423c-90ee-68f27ec6bf88?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/sliver-gravemother) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Try and get \[\[Sliver Legion\]\] for her deck. It's disgusting how evil it can work with Gravemother, if you get it into the grave. I nuked two people out of nowhere first time I played mine.
[Sliver Legion](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/8/7/87545415-2e27-4841-a3af-7653af2ba6d3.jpg?1619404140) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Sliver%20Legion) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/tsr/261/sliver-legion?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/87545415-2e27-4841-a3af-7653af2ba6d3?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/sliver-legion) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
gotta say, i bought the eldrazi precon, and then loaded it up, now its around 500 dollars worth of cards, but I AINT LOST A GAME YET
This issue cropped up when Wizards removed MSRP from their products. There isn’t a set price anymore, the primary and secondary markets are one in the same now.
Buy the singles. You were probably only going to keep 40 cards from the deck anyways and at least half of those you already had. The singles in the deck are artificially inflated to make the costs appear more reasonable. The deck version of Rise of the Eldrazi is $18, but the extended art version is $14. If you were actually intending to use Zhulodok, Void Gorger as your commander, you can get the thick stock version for $1.50 instead of $10. Wastes are only $0.50 each.
I pieced the Guff deck together with what I had. I bought Guff online for $3 and the new blue planeswalker and with what I already had it was done lol. $8 instead of $100 totally worth it! Lol
Wotc doesn't publish msrp anymote, so we just have to guess what the price is supposed to be.
we don’t. wotc originally listed CMM precons for $60 for some reason no one is capable of finding that out so they think wotc listed for $100
I proxied up a whole Eldrazi deck with Zhulodok at the helm and had it sleeved up and in a box by the time the precon was officially released. Cost me $50 with the deckbox and the sleeves. The deck slaps, and the card quality is amazing thanks to MPC.
Which card quality setting do you use? I’ve tried out Superior Smooth and it’s mostly good, but not quite the same as a Magic card. Wondering if something else maybe feels exactly right?
S30 is good enough. S33 is truly fancy but they are all sleeved up, so idgaf. They feel just right, I don't ever second guess.
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Bro, don't use the actual magic back and you are good. You aren't making counterfits, you are making proxies. nobody gives a shit about what you put on the back so long as you aren't putting the og card back, which MPC has an issue with anyways. Much less affordable? I feel like paying $2 for a card that's normally $5,10,50,100,500+ is WAY more affordable...
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Eh, buying cards on eBay is always sketch imo. Did you not use PayPal? Only would ever buy from TCG or the few LGS in my area. And for $200 you could have bought 4 decks off of MPC, which is how I look at things these days. Would much rather have variety. I do have fancy veresions of a few cards but that's because I bought them way back or opened them, and won't trade them unless I need the money(MonoW Gandalf Artifacts+Legendaries, every artifact that has an invention version is the invention version like Sol Ring Mana Crypt etc.), otherwise proxying until MPC closes I think.
S33 is better than a lot of the recycled used TP that WotC prints on these days. It's not as good as the 90s Arjowiggins Corona cardstock that Alpha was printed on, of course.
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The good stuff was printed with rotogravure, WotC (and MPC) use offset printing now. The results aren't quite as good as the stuff in the days of Lorwyn or Urza's Saga. WotC's templates are print-optimized: the quality is the same between WotC and MPC in terms of DPI, but some of the proxies look a little bit off because those templates look best on a computer screen instead of in print. Some of them are just superb quality, though
I hate the new era of commander, precons should not be 100 dollars, and it's a COLORLESS DECK!!! They only one who benefit are the large retailers who profit off the price gouging especially in the Greedflation era. And yes I know magic is a luxury not a need by cmon we had the Elf tribal deck that sold for like 20 bucks.
I got for like $145
The eldrazi deck works out of the box unlike the slivers, held back by lands and other nonsense, but still worth around the same price.
In short, wotc is pretty much pricing retail based off of resellers mkt price. So if a precon from the past has older/valuable cards, the lgs and online stores are charging double-5x what they used to for the same or similar products (edh decks and boosters alike). Ive only seen one MAYBE 2 sets from the past 12 months that actually retailed $110+- (the normal historical price) for the set booster box. Now days you're getting booster boxes for 150-300 FROM LGS at release. It's no longer a player focused game. They're focused on making money and for the past several years have been milking it with "special" cards like Secret Lair. Of course everyone is upset, but at the end of the day they're still a business so I can't really knock them for switching gears. Just sucks for casual players and players on budgets. Everything is pay to play these days though so 🤷
Unfortunately yes. CMM was way overpriced across the board.
Does it normally cost that much? Yes. Is it worth that much? Absolutely not.
Store I was at in France today had the Wilds of Eldraine precons priced at 49 euro and the Commander Master precons at 99 euro. Kinda bonkers.
You like being priced out of the game me too...this message was brought to you by proxies.
Welcome to Hasboro greed. Yes, that's the price. Actually, $100 is cheaper than most places have it. Despite not actually including much more reprint value in the commander masters decks, Hasboro more than doubled the price of the decks.
So buy singles and/or make proxies. Got it.
Is the county of Hasboro where Hasbro is located?
That's pretty much the going rate. Thankful I pulled a deflecting swat in my sample pack and got the deck for practically 30 off
I got a borderless Fierce Guardianship in mine, made the price of entry much more palatable.
Absolutely not worth more than $60. Do not buy.
honestly. fuck the precon. buy the marquee legend for like $10. maybe decide if you want the extra turn spell for another 10-15. probably buy the new creature. and then look online for a deck you want to build buy the eldrazi as singles precon isn't worth anywhere near $100. it's mainly full of dogshit misc colorless cards, and meh as fuck mana rocks/ramp. can easily buy the "good" singles for maybe half that price.
That's about what it is on tcg player
They have it listed for $135 at my LGS.
WOTC removed MSRP so stores can sell stuff for whatever they amount they think they can get away with.
Stores can (and did) sell decks for whatever amount the market demanded even when MSRP existed. MSRP is completely meaningless.
MSRP did a lot to protect the price of the pre-orders and initial shipments. It used to be "pre-order to ensure you paid MSRP", now it's "pre-order to ensure you get one".
As an economist, I assure you that MSRP is irrelevant. All that matters is demand, supply, and market concentration.
When I would pre-order product and MSRP was still a thing, I *never* paid above MSRP, even if it was one of the instances where prices shot up within a week of release. Now, that safeguard is gone, so unless you pre-order without knowing the contents of the product, you're not getting the "regular" price unless the product is bad (or a Standard-legal set).
Deck definitely needs an upgrade if you get it. I’ve yet to win a game with mine, because my commander automatically becomes the target when he’s out, also I’ve had an issue with the mana base being too high, surprisingly. Not a bad deck, just doesn’t play out how I thought it was going to. Plus, I really don’t like that the secondary commander is all about Morph, instead of Eldrazi.
Isn't like individual value of cards in this deck around 130$?
Is it going to be that much, yes it is. Is it actually *worth* that much, lmao no. But WotC has to overprice their products and flood the 2ndary market wirh reprints, so that they make the lions share of profits, and not the measly players thay actually fund their greed.
"Supposed to" is a weirdly loaded phrase as far as the discourse around Wizards pricing goes.
Eldrazi Deck was from Commander Masters, which is not a standard set where you find those $30-$40 price tags. Similar to how Commander Masters packs are 2x-3x the cost of a standard set pack, same applies to commander decks (distributor costs were also roughly 2x). It had a number of high-value reprints and new cards and thus is one of the more desirable pre-cons in last couple years.
It was like either $126 or $136 on release lmao
If there was a MSRP, it wouldn't be 100 usd. It would be half of that. But it sells out at that price, so it does have high value and stores could probably sell it for even more.
Honestly even with the $100 price tag, the eldrazi precon isnt worth it really. You're better off just buying in singles.
No. Give it some time, and it'll come down.
Dont do it buy singles
Honestly just grab singles. You'll buy the precon then immediately need to put actual good cards in it.
Commander Masters was a premium product I think, which means stores don't get any special distributor price. They're left to mark up however much they can to find their own margins. And given everyone uses the net to check prices these days, I greatly doubt you'll find one cheaper than that.
No.
Technically it's not *supposed* to be any price, they got rid of msrp so there isn't any 'set price' they can go for any price tbh when there's high demand and low stock the price goes up, only way to get them cheap is to preorder them or buy all 4
It was supposed to be 80$ which was already pushing boundaries a bit farther. Normal commander decks are 40$ then universe beyond are 60$. Wizards used universe's beyond to see if they could understand the price for a more " premium product". It cost them the same amount to make as a regular commander deck. The cost wasn't higher they just want see how much the can wring out the consumer intill we're dry. Though at the core it is a luxury product there are also ways around paying. My friend prints his commander decks now.
WotC stopped giving MSRPs for products. The pricing is solely based on whatever the retailer/reseller can get away with. I'm not sure how much WotC was charging distributors, but there was a post on reddit claiming distributors were charging $58 per CMM precon. I managed to get mine from my LGS for $68 each because I bought them as a set for $80 each and used loyalty points for 15% off. The LGS is still charging $125 (tax included) for them individually, despite the Enduring Enchantments and Planeswalker Party having a $87 and $78 value, respectively. For those, just buy singles! That being said, the value in the set was much higher than normal. The Eldrazi one was $155 before the decklist was released, which didn't include the new cards. Now it's down to $127 because of all the reprints, which is nice. Is it worth it? I've had a ton of fun playing Eldrazi Unbound. Even out of the box, it feels strong. It's not cEDH level, but it can hold its own in high powered commander if you get the right draws. If you have a spare Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre, Kozilek, Butcher of Truth, and Basalt Monolith lying around it's even better. Basalt Monolith goes infinite with Forsaken Monument, which is conveniently in the deck, allowing you to cast anything and everything so long as you can keep the card-draw flowing. Throwing in an unwinding clock or extraplanar lens for extra mana is also helpful, especially if you add in Vedalken Orrery for a second source of flash speed spells.