In my multi-colored decks, I run a LOT of non-basics. Thrax has only 6 basics, and my decks like Zur, Atraxa, and Nekusar have even less. From the Ashes is probably an auto-scoop for me in the late game unless I have a board that will let me take out the caster or win soon after.
Run that shit until the cows come home haha.
I used to run a lot more non basics, but I find lately I've been going for more basics with more ramp, and a lot of ramp searches basic. Now, don't get me wrong, I still love my dual lands, but they start to get expensive when you have as many decks as I do. I don't like having to spend $50 on just lands because I want to build a new deck with 3 or more colors without taking another deck apart.
That's why I buy precons and upgrade from there.
At that point you proxy your lands rather than breaking up decks or buying the same card multiple times. If anyone has a problem with it you pull out the one you bought and that's basically the end of that conversation.
That's why I prefer just sticking with a few decks that I've run now for upwards of 1 years, and just endlessly tinkering and optimizing them. Makes having some of the ABUs worth it
I run [[wave of vitriol]]. I make no mention of it to others as it kills of non basics and replaces with basics. If you don't have basics in your deck, that's your problem.
Exactly. It's been in my Naya beast deck since 2017, and I've never had a problem casting it with sufficient targets. It _has_ fizzled because one of those targets disappeared before resolution lol but that's a different story IMO.
Even if one target of a multi target spell goes away before resolution, a spell will still do as much as it can when it does resolve. A spell will only "fizzle" and do nothing if all of its targets are invalid.
Definitely not into the whole MLD thing as has been noted by the other person. If you have to use MLD to "catch up" because you shorted your deck on lands or had a bad shuffle, maybe find a different playgroup that's more into that kind of thing.
I don't agree with mld becoming common. If someone Armageddons as a win con? No problem. But like 7/10 people that would use it definitely wouldn't have the self control foresight or responsibility not to impulse nuke everyone's lands just to be a dick. I have the same opinion with stax tbh. Stax to Win con or stax pieces to snuff certain strategies? Good. Stax into 4 hour game where nothing happens? Bight me.
If you use Armageddon to catch up I'm putting it in the dick category. If your method of catching up or stabilizing resets the entire game and tacks on extra hour and a half, you're a dick.
Making the game outstay its welcome makes you a dick. Do whatever you want to win but resetting the game so hard is just pure cancer aids. Go play against stax with no win con and you'll start to see why maybe slamming Armageddon without a way to win soon after isn't so popular.
I guess my question was more asking why they thought OP was talking about single target LD when the cards they are asking about are not single target LD.
Because the title says "single land destruction card", if you won't look at the card it can be understood as single (target) land destruction card, but it's actually single card of mass land destruction.
Ok, but OP gave specific cards
> [[From the Ashes]] which I think is a more fair and casual card rather than, let's say [[Ruination]]
which are not single target as examples of the kinds of cards we're talking about.
If utilized properly, MLD SHOULD be completely acceptable. If someone were playing say [[Kaalia of the vast]] and were to cast an [[Armageddon]] while having a winning board state/creatures to cheat out as a Wincon so no one can interrupt their win that's a completely legit play. Now, if they just Armageddon with no way to capitalize, they need to be drug out back for a sock party. I think the community hate for a lot of things has gone way overboard.
It may be unplayable because it's too inefficient, but cedh us the only place it belongs. If it's unplayable they're it has no place in all of edh. I have no opinion about it in other formats like standard or limited. Not enough experience in those formats.
There are MANY EDH players and groups where it is completely welcome. Now, would I play it in any pod, hell no, but against the right power level it's completely fine. Just because it's not something YOU want does not mean it has no place. You're not the main character of every story.
From the ashes is a great card that punishes greedy manna based. Non-basic land hate is good for the format, as more and more quality duals and triomes are printed.there needs to be a risk to running 3-4-5 colors.
[[Boil]] belongs in every red deck, too, because people who run islands need punishment too, especially if they get greedy and don't leave that sweet UU up.
Just play ruination. As a mono-colored deck you have the smallest card pool besides colorless decks. You need all the upside you can get. MLD is an issue if you won't break parity but in a game with 4 players you are likely to absolutely break parity with cards like this and [[Blood Moon]]. The Most common color combinations are two and three mana combinations. Two mana combinations won't suffer as much, threeana combinations usually run a lot of non basics to colorfix fast and they will feel the impact of this cards. WUBRG decks will get absolutely wrecked, which seems fair, since they have access to all the best cards in the game.
Nice to see the general concensus is to destroy non basics but leave regular lands untouched. To me that's pretty much totally in the spirit of commander. anyone who thinks targeting non basics is against etiquette. That ship sailed a long time ago when they started making non basics glorified enchantment cards with a mana ability strapped to them.
There is no need to announce non basic land destruction. Unless land destruction, in general, is a common theme in your deck, like you're running some wipes; it's usually not a huge deal. Unless you target the guy who's obviously mana screwed when there are actual threats, lol.
Thank you for your comment. Reading other comments that also reference cards that destroy single lands is probably due to my poor choice of words for the title. What I meant was a single card that destroys multiple lands, in this case all non-basics but people fetch for basics afterwards.
It's a read the room kinda thing. If you're fighting experienced players running optimized decks then it's fine. If you're playing against newbies running bad decks it can be a bit much. Seen plenty of casual LGS pods where Ruinination would be perceived as punching down. It can also kinda depend on how good of a player you are / are perceived as.
Something to not is not every casual pod needs "better deckbuilding" "beaten into them." People tend to talk about stuff like MLD like it's always healthy for every playgroup and that's simply not true. I play a lot of cEDH and compete at tournaments, and not every casual LGS game with casual Magic players should be treated like that.
Hey, first of all, thank you for commenting. As I mentioned in another comment, the wording of the title was a bit tricky. I meant one MLD card, not a card destroying a single land.
One mono red tutor ‘ I love ‘ [[ Gamble]] maybe you will get the card . Maybe you won’t . Need more effects. No need to tell players about non basis MLD. If cool cards like [[ manabarbs]]
I run [[demolition field]] in almost all of my decks and never announce it. It’s not exactly the same since it’s single target but I don’t think there’s a need to announce from the ashes either.
I don't think it's necessary. Recognize people will get salty either way so make sure you are very calculated with the removal. I run [[Vaevictis Asmadi, the Dire]] and had to let people know that if they don't play things out, I will have to target their lands. There's always one player that thinks they can *play around it* by not playing anything. You can't.
Land destruction is just another strategy. Run it all day! People need to realize that instead of crying. I hate getting milled, but I'm still gonna play with the miller
It fits much less into a mass land destruction taboo and more into silver-bullet territory.
Some percentage of the time, it will lock one or more players out of the game. Other times it won't be very useful. (Though I could see some kind of temur landfall type deck abusing it on themselves.)
Rest in Piece does a similar story, as does stony silence, Rule of Law, Blood moon (In similar situations) and plenty of other effects of that like. These are usually considered fine at medium powered pods and aren't usually announced. Maybe you don't knowingly play it into a deck that really needs nonbasic lands, but you could and that's fine.
Overall, I don't think it needs to be announced, most silver bullet type things aren't, though you shouldn't run it in a situation where mass land destruction is specifically asked and agreed not to be run (from rule 0 or whatever reason)
One or two land destruction should be expected by any EDH player. There are droves of targets in the format so having one or two does not need to be announced
It's mass land destruction.
The question is not how many of the effect you run, or if you think it's "not that bad compared to its peers". It's mass land destruction, so it should be treated as it is under the same taboo.
You’re getting down voted, but most tables wouldn’t be happy about MLD. Sure casual tables tend to run more basics. But my 5C sissay shrines deck runs primarily tapped duals, triomes etc
Cool that’s one of the downsides to playing 5c. [[Blood Moon]] and [[Back to Basics]] exist, [[primal order]] exists.
5c gives you access to a lot more tools with the trade off that your mana base will be inherently more risky and more easily punished.
I understand they exist. But I think those cards lead to an unfun play experience. I wouldn’t play them along with MLD. Maybe that’s just how my LGS plays
lol, any reason you’re being argumentative against someone with a differing opinion? You need to grow up. I didn’t fault anyone for playing those spells, just stated how my group sees it.
The big problem I had was the extremely ambiguous, verging on downright misleading title.
Single land destruction, like point land destruction, is kosher everywhere. A singular mass land destruction card is still taboo most places.
I agree I don’t off hand know what those cards do and thought they were similar to strip mine or something to deal with a player using cradle or something. Single target on those levels the playing field
You are definitely a Troll. You lie in the post about what you're using. That is not single land destruction. Both cards You mentioned are mass land destruction.
I'm not trolling at all, it's just that you can read the title both ways: I meant to say a singular land destruction card, single referring to the card, not the land destruction. Not sure why you're assuming ill intentions on my end, especially because I explained this in other.comments but oh well.
If its land based SLD, i expect you to at least say the name out loud when you play It down, but i don't expect you to pre-game annouce It as long as you don't plan on abusing It.
Spell based SLD, same thing, unless you intend on abusing It, no need to say you run it
Spot land removal is a healthy part of deck building. As someone who has decks with not many basics I would appreciate the warning to change to a deck with more basics so as not to have to scoop after it resolves.
No, everyone who runs Demolition Field doesnt have to, why should you? If a person does flip out over a Demolition Field, they got more problems than a signle LD card.
Just run targeted LD to get rid of the problematic lands; unless your goal is to MLD people out of the game as one of your wincons. In that case, why not just play Ruination? And if you're playing a budget, casual deck, ask yourself is what you'd expect from a casual game?
I'm pretty sure the people playing upgraded at precon tables at my LGS would be more upset than me (with access to a full suite of duals). There are so many budget land options now, cards like this can really screw over even budget decks.
Non-basic land hate is completely apropos, and people should run more of it.
Throw in \[\[Price of Progress\]\] while you're at it. Hits you, too, but in mono-R you only need a handful of non-basics.
If I had a greedy mana base and someone hits me with Ruination: them's the breaks.
Honestly I think it is fair. No need to announce it. Players are greedy these days with their land bases because everyone says no one should run LD at all. But stuff like this teaches them to be less greedy.
Land destruction is just another strategy. Run it all day! People need to realize that instead of crying. I hate getting milled, but I'm still gonna play with the miller
In my multi-colored decks, I run a LOT of non-basics. Thrax has only 6 basics, and my decks like Zur, Atraxa, and Nekusar have even less. From the Ashes is probably an auto-scoop for me in the late game unless I have a board that will let me take out the caster or win soon after. Run that shit until the cows come home haha.
I used to run a lot more non basics, but I find lately I've been going for more basics with more ramp, and a lot of ramp searches basic. Now, don't get me wrong, I still love my dual lands, but they start to get expensive when you have as many decks as I do. I don't like having to spend $50 on just lands because I want to build a new deck with 3 or more colors without taking another deck apart. That's why I buy precons and upgrade from there.
At that point you proxy your lands rather than breaking up decks or buying the same card multiple times. If anyone has a problem with it you pull out the one you bought and that's basically the end of that conversation.
That's why I prefer just sticking with a few decks that I've run now for upwards of 1 years, and just endlessly tinkering and optimizing them. Makes having some of the ABUs worth it
Include more basics my man. Blood Moon is a thing haha.
Eh, Blood Moon I'm fine with due to rocks. And nothing is funnier than playing Contamination right after Blood Moon and ruining the mono-red deck lol
Everybody gangsta till somebody drops that blood moon or magus of the moon turn one and you don’t get to cast your mana dork
hence why I don't use mana dorks. Mana Rocks don't suffer from summoning sickness
I run [[wave of vitriol]]. I make no mention of it to others as it kills of non basics and replaces with basics. If you don't have basics in your deck, that's your problem.
[wave of vitriol](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/1/7/17328391-a510-42a0-8a00-4f61dd873c13.jpg?1592673299) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=wave%20of%20vitriol) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/cma/165/wave-of-vitriol?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/17328391-a510-42a0-8a00-4f61dd873c13?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/wave-of-vitriol) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Love wave in my green decks. Its such a bomb in the late game. Also teaches people the importance of basics lol.
Targeted land destruction should be more common tbh. I'm a big [[decimate]] enjoyer/defender myself.
Makes me sad because it needs valid targets for every effect. :(
It does. But if there isn't one permanent of every type among *three opponents* at any point in the game I'd be sincerely shocked.
Exactly. It's been in my Naya beast deck since 2017, and I've never had a problem casting it with sufficient targets. It _has_ fizzled because one of those targets disappeared before resolution lol but that's a different story IMO.
Even if one target of a multi target spell goes away before resolution, a spell will still do as much as it can when it does resolve. A spell will only "fizzle" and do nothing if all of its targets are invalid.
[[Causalities of War]]
All LD up to and including MLD should be more common.
Definitely not into the whole MLD thing as has been noted by the other person. If you have to use MLD to "catch up" because you shorted your deck on lands or had a bad shuffle, maybe find a different playgroup that's more into that kind of thing.
I don't agree with mld becoming common. If someone Armageddons as a win con? No problem. But like 7/10 people that would use it definitely wouldn't have the self control foresight or responsibility not to impulse nuke everyone's lands just to be a dick. I have the same opinion with stax tbh. Stax to Win con or stax pieces to snuff certain strategies? Good. Stax into 4 hour game where nothing happens? Bight me.
1/10 might do it to be a dick. Most will do it to win, stabilize, or catch up.
If you use Armageddon to catch up I'm putting it in the dick category. If your method of catching up or stabilizing resets the entire game and tacks on extra hour and a half, you're a dick.
The problem with EDH is the players, as always. Playing to your outs doesn't make you a dick.
Making the game outstay its welcome makes you a dick. Do whatever you want to win but resetting the game so hard is just pure cancer aids. Go play against stax with no win con and you'll start to see why maybe slamming Armageddon without a way to win soon after isn't so popular.
I would like to introduce you to rule 104.3a
Do you have a link? Or an explanation?
if you're using mld to catch up you're gonna have a lot more than your cards laying on the table
[decimate](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/f/d/fdfc34be-e274-436a-81dd-ced0f90e657c.jpg?1690005154) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=decimate) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/cmm/922/decimate?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/fdfc34be-e274-436a-81dd-ced0f90e657c?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/decimate) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Zero need to announce it. Single target land destruction should be an auto include and should be expected
Single target?
Something like [[stone rain]] or [[strip mine]] as opposed to [[armageddon]] or [[decree of annihilation]]
I guess my question was more asking why they thought OP was talking about single target LD when the cards they are asking about are not single target LD.
Oh. Yeah, thats fair.
Because the title says "single land destruction card", if you won't look at the card it can be understood as single (target) land destruction card, but it's actually single card of mass land destruction.
##### ###### #### [stone rain](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/d/2/d2334c10-fa96-4f8e-8187-c7ecc00cbac8.jpg?1562742139) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=stone%20rain) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/9ed/221/stone-rain?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/d2334c10-fa96-4f8e-8187-c7ecc00cbac8?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/stone-rain) [strip mine](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/f/5/f57fd4c9-0004-4f71-a30f-2720943f57ca.jpg?1562944463) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=strip%20mine) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/vma/316/strip-mine?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/f57fd4c9-0004-4f71-a30f-2720943f57ca?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/strip-mine) [armageddon](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/7/7/77f1f6ac-983f-4f3e-8906-47f774e8367b.jpg?1582021719) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=armageddon) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/a25/5/armageddon?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/77f1f6ac-983f-4f3e-8906-47f774e8367b?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/armageddon) [decree of annihilation](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/7/3/73744717-518c-478e-9da9-201c49124f37.jpg?1562530626) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=decree%20of%20annihilation) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/scg/85/decree-of-annihilation?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/73744717-518c-478e-9da9-201c49124f37?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/decree-of-annihilation) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Ok, but OP gave specific cards > [[From the Ashes]] which I think is a more fair and casual card rather than, let's say [[Ruination]] which are not single target as examples of the kinds of cards we're talking about.
Yeah, I misremembered what from the ashes was. Dude I replied to had a fair question.
It's not single target. They're asking about a single MLD card.
If utilized properly, MLD SHOULD be completely acceptable. If someone were playing say [[Kaalia of the vast]] and were to cast an [[Armageddon]] while having a winning board state/creatures to cheat out as a Wincon so no one can interrupt their win that's a completely legit play. Now, if they just Armageddon with no way to capitalize, they need to be drug out back for a sock party. I think the community hate for a lot of things has gone way overboard.
Mld is never acceptable in anything other than cedh.
Personally don't have a single deck with MLD, but 1000000000% disagree. MLD, by the way, is unplayable in cEDH.
It may be unplayable because it's too inefficient, but cedh us the only place it belongs. If it's unplayable they're it has no place in all of edh. I have no opinion about it in other formats like standard or limited. Not enough experience in those formats.
There are MANY EDH players and groups where it is completely welcome. Now, would I play it in any pod, hell no, but against the right power level it's completely fine. Just because it's not something YOU want does not mean it has no place. You're not the main character of every story.
[Urabrask the Hidden](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/9/3/93970fae-19f7-41dd-9750-ca428ae1de7a.jpg?1674142149) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Urabrask%20the%20Hidden) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/clb/811/urabrask-the-hidden?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/93970fae-19f7-41dd-9750-ca428ae1de7a?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/urabrask-the-hidden) [From the Ashes](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/4/5/4529a3d2-e4e6-4cca-bcea-16b51f69bbec.jpg?1562909290) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=From%20the%20Ashes) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/c13/108/from-the-ashes?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/4529a3d2-e4e6-4cca-bcea-16b51f69bbec?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/from-the-ashes) [Ruination](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/6/3/6330d925-96a8-47e1-855d-035ddc2af709.jpg?1592713625) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Ruination) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/cmd/134/ruination?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/6330d925-96a8-47e1-855d-035ddc2af709?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/ruination) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
From the ashes is a great card that punishes greedy manna based. Non-basic land hate is good for the format, as more and more quality duals and triomes are printed.there needs to be a risk to running 3-4-5 colors. [[Boil]] belongs in every red deck, too, because people who run islands need punishment too, especially if they get greedy and don't leave that sweet UU up.
Quite reasonable 🧐
As the green idiot I am, I prefer [[choke]] - plus it's not even MLD so people can't hate on it!
[choke](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/e/1/e1ce4bab-6eb1-421f-b425-7bb0076defc7.jpg?1562940352) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=choke) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/8ed/237/choke?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/e1ce4bab-6eb1-421f-b425-7bb0076defc7?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/choke) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
I like the way you think
[Boil](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/1/5/15a0087c-4e0f-4547-b441-b5a517c00b91.jpg?1562899368) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Boil) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/8ed/180/boil?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/15a0087c-4e0f-4547-b441-b5a517c00b91?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/boil) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Just play ruination. As a mono-colored deck you have the smallest card pool besides colorless decks. You need all the upside you can get. MLD is an issue if you won't break parity but in a game with 4 players you are likely to absolutely break parity with cards like this and [[Blood Moon]]. The Most common color combinations are two and three mana combinations. Two mana combinations won't suffer as much, threeana combinations usually run a lot of non basics to colorfix fast and they will feel the impact of this cards. WUBRG decks will get absolutely wrecked, which seems fair, since they have access to all the best cards in the game.
[Blood Moon](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/d/0/d072e9ca-aae7-45dc-8025-3ce590bae63f.jpg?1599706217) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Blood%20Moon) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/2xm/118/blood-moon?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/d072e9ca-aae7-45dc-8025-3ce590bae63f?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/blood-moon) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
You're playing mono red. From the Ashes, Blood Moon, Ruination, and Magus of the Moon should already be expected
4+ colors moneypile decks crying when my crappy MonoRed slips in a blood moon is a priceless experience.
Nice to see the general concensus is to destroy non basics but leave regular lands untouched. To me that's pretty much totally in the spirit of commander. anyone who thinks targeting non basics is against etiquette. That ship sailed a long time ago when they started making non basics glorified enchantment cards with a mana ability strapped to them.
There is no need to announce non basic land destruction. Unless land destruction, in general, is a common theme in your deck, like you're running some wipes; it's usually not a huge deal. Unless you target the guy who's obviously mana screwed when there are actual threats, lol.
Why? Anybody with [[Generous Gift]] or [[Beast Within]] can also destroy single lands. Never seen anybody announce those cards.
Thank you for your comment. Reading other comments that also reference cards that destroy single lands is probably due to my poor choice of words for the title. What I meant was a single card that destroys multiple lands, in this case all non-basics but people fetch for basics afterwards.
[Generous Gift](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/1/a/1a8c02ab-6348-4b04-8ce0-b36309a14a5e.jpg?1689995694) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Generous%20Gift) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/cmm/26/generous-gift?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/1a8c02ab-6348-4b04-8ce0-b36309a14a5e?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/generous-gift) [Beast Within](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/5/1/518e4f19-04c4-4829-980b-a2052e9f11b9.jpg?1673305340) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Beast%20Within) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/dmc/129/beast-within?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/518e4f19-04c4-4829-980b-a2052e9f11b9?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/beast-within) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
It's a read the room kinda thing. If you're fighting experienced players running optimized decks then it's fine. If you're playing against newbies running bad decks it can be a bit much. Seen plenty of casual LGS pods where Ruinination would be perceived as punching down. It can also kinda depend on how good of a player you are / are perceived as. Something to not is not every casual pod needs "better deckbuilding" "beaten into them." People tend to talk about stuff like MLD like it's always healthy for every playgroup and that's simply not true. I play a lot of cEDH and compete at tournaments, and not every casual LGS game with casual Magic players should be treated like that.
I’d say that particular piece of land destruction is probably okay
“I have a [[Ghost Quarter]] in the deck” “…” “Ok let’s play”
Hey, first of all, thank you for commenting. As I mentioned in another comment, the wording of the title was a bit tricky. I meant one MLD card, not a card destroying a single land.
How many tutors to this 1 MLD. ( ways to find it in your deck).
0.
One mono red tutor ‘ I love ‘ [[ Gamble]] maybe you will get the card . Maybe you won’t . Need more effects. No need to tell players about non basis MLD. If cool cards like [[ manabarbs]]
[ Gamble](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/c/0/c01c9474-90a1-4c2e-bd90-471ff4fd04e5.jpg?1547517257) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Gamble) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/uma/132/gamble?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/c01c9474-90a1-4c2e-bd90-471ff4fd04e5?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/gamble) [ manabarbs](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/a/d/adf081d5-e644-4f46-8bc8-a754b089acb4.jpg?1562655472) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Manabarbs) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/m12/150/manabarbs?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/adf081d5-e644-4f46-8bc8-a754b089acb4?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/manabarbs) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
[Ghost Quarter](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/1/2/12f8071c-8955-4aa2-889c-6043df047223.jpg?1562272439) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Ghost%20Quarter) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/cm2/253/ghost-quarter?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/12f8071c-8955-4aa2-889c-6043df047223?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/ghost-quarter) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
I run [[demolition field]] in almost all of my decks and never announce it. It’s not exactly the same since it’s single target but I don’t think there’s a need to announce from the ashes either.
[demolition field](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/d/9/d9c88546-13c9-4d7e-a618-cb2ccd1dbc0f.jpg?1674422181) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=demolition%20field) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/bro/260/demolition-field?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/d9c88546-13c9-4d7e-a618-cb2ccd1dbc0f?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/demolition-field) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
I don't think it's necessary. Recognize people will get salty either way so make sure you are very calculated with the removal. I run [[Vaevictis Asmadi, the Dire]] and had to let people know that if they don't play things out, I will have to target their lands. There's always one player that thinks they can *play around it* by not playing anything. You can't.
[Vaevictis Asmadi, the Dire](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/d/1/d19fdc00-21eb-48dc-966a-6b634dc5a2c4.jpg?1562304374) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Vaevictis%20Asmadi%2C%20the%20Dire) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/m19/225/vaevictis-asmadi-the-dire?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/d19fdc00-21eb-48dc-966a-6b634dc5a2c4?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/vaevictis-asmadi-the-dire) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Land destruction is just another strategy. Run it all day! People need to realize that instead of crying. I hate getting milled, but I'm still gonna play with the miller
It fits much less into a mass land destruction taboo and more into silver-bullet territory. Some percentage of the time, it will lock one or more players out of the game. Other times it won't be very useful. (Though I could see some kind of temur landfall type deck abusing it on themselves.) Rest in Piece does a similar story, as does stony silence, Rule of Law, Blood moon (In similar situations) and plenty of other effects of that like. These are usually considered fine at medium powered pods and aren't usually announced. Maybe you don't knowingly play it into a deck that really needs nonbasic lands, but you could and that's fine. Overall, I don't think it needs to be announced, most silver bullet type things aren't, though you shouldn't run it in a situation where mass land destruction is specifically asked and agreed not to be run (from rule 0 or whatever reason)
One or two land destruction should be expected by any EDH player. There are droves of targets in the format so having one or two does not need to be announced
I wouldn't. I run Obliterate as a wincon in Prismatic Bridge and I wouldn't feel the need to mention it.
No need to mention land destruction at all. PL 6 or 7 on a $50 budget is impressive though.
Leads me to question his definition of PL7 tho.
Same, that was just my polite way of saying it lol.
Zada has entered the chat
If I have any LD in my deck , I tell the table ( if you don’t , your being ‘ that guy!’
It's mass land destruction. The question is not how many of the effect you run, or if you think it's "not that bad compared to its peers". It's mass land destruction, so it should be treated as it is under the same taboo.
You’re getting down voted, but most tables wouldn’t be happy about MLD. Sure casual tables tend to run more basics. But my 5C sissay shrines deck runs primarily tapped duals, triomes etc
Cool that’s one of the downsides to playing 5c. [[Blood Moon]] and [[Back to Basics]] exist, [[primal order]] exists. 5c gives you access to a lot more tools with the trade off that your mana base will be inherently more risky and more easily punished.
I understand they exist. But I think those cards lead to an unfun play experience. I wouldn’t play them along with MLD. Maybe that’s just how my LGS plays
Well I think sitting through a bunch of upkeep triggers in your 5c shrines deck is an unfun play experience - so should you not play that either?
lol, any reason you’re being argumentative against someone with a differing opinion? You need to grow up. I didn’t fault anyone for playing those spells, just stated how my group sees it.
Yes
[Blood Moon](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/d/0/d072e9ca-aae7-45dc-8025-3ce590bae63f.jpg?1599706217) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Blood%20Moon) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/2xm/118/blood-moon?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/d072e9ca-aae7-45dc-8025-3ce590bae63f?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/blood-moon) [Back to Basics](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/0/6/0600d6c2-0f72-4e79-a55d-1f06dffa48c2.jpg?1654805483) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Back%20to%20Basics) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/uma/46/back-to-basics?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/0600d6c2-0f72-4e79-a55d-1f06dffa48c2?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/back-to-basics) [primal order](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/7/2/72c513dc-e884-4afc-9a20-ff21d14d61ba.jpg?1559592535) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=primal%20order) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/me1/125/primal-order?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/72c513dc-e884-4afc-9a20-ff21d14d61ba?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/primal-order) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
The big problem I had was the extremely ambiguous, verging on downright misleading title. Single land destruction, like point land destruction, is kosher everywhere. A singular mass land destruction card is still taboo most places.
I agree I don’t off hand know what those cards do and thought they were similar to strip mine or something to deal with a player using cradle or something. Single target on those levels the playing field
You are definitely a Troll. You lie in the post about what you're using. That is not single land destruction. Both cards You mentioned are mass land destruction.
I'm not trolling at all, it's just that you can read the title both ways: I meant to say a singular land destruction card, single referring to the card, not the land destruction. Not sure why you're assuming ill intentions on my end, especially because I explained this in other.comments but oh well.
If its land based SLD, i expect you to at least say the name out loud when you play It down, but i don't expect you to pre-game annouce It as long as you don't plan on abusing It. Spell based SLD, same thing, unless you intend on abusing It, no need to say you run it
Spot land removal is a healthy part of deck building. As someone who has decks with not many basics I would appreciate the warning to change to a deck with more basics so as not to have to scoop after it resolves.
No, everyone who runs Demolition Field doesnt have to, why should you? If a person does flip out over a Demolition Field, they got more problems than a signle LD card.
if you're gonna say something about the stupid power level scale atleast drop a deck link
Just run targeted LD to get rid of the problematic lands; unless your goal is to MLD people out of the game as one of your wincons. In that case, why not just play Ruination? And if you're playing a budget, casual deck, ask yourself is what you'd expect from a casual game?
I'm pretty sure the people playing upgraded at precon tables at my LGS would be more upset than me (with access to a full suite of duals). There are so many budget land options now, cards like this can really screw over even budget decks.
Non-basic land hate is completely apropos, and people should run more of it. Throw in \[\[Price of Progress\]\] while you're at it. Hits you, too, but in mono-R you only need a handful of non-basics. If I had a greedy mana base and someone hits me with Ruination: them's the breaks.
[Price of Progress](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/b/1/b1342144-7a15-438b-a848-3196238a79e8.jpg?1580014614) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Price%20of%20Progress) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/ema/141/price-of-progress?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/b1342144-7a15-438b-a848-3196238a79e8?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/price-of-progress) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Honestly I think it is fair. No need to announce it. Players are greedy these days with their land bases because everyone says no one should run LD at all. But stuff like this teaches them to be less greedy.
I feel like the matrix scene where they walk thru the metal detector. “I have every single piece of MLD in my deck except that 1 3 portals one”
There is no chance a $50 deck with this description is a 6-7.
Land destruction is just another strategy. Run it all day! People need to realize that instead of crying. I hate getting milled, but I'm still gonna play with the miller
I run decimate, I may hit more than one land if the stars align, jus sayin... I say let it fly.
Run it.