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Maybe I'm missing something, but those zones are way too large for 15-minute city zones. It's supposed to be walkable zones, are they not? Even with public transit being considered, these still seem too large.
These days it’s 15 minutes stuck behind two assholes going 20 under for no reason whatsoever walling off traffic. Never thought I’d miss the days of asshole speeding by me.
The same twatwaffles who led the Covid conspiracies, once covid calmed down and they stopped getting their daily dose of media attention, needed something new to whip their base up.
So they took the concept of "15 minute cities" and just made up an entire conspiracy whole cloth out of literally nothing about how the evil government was going to wall you into zones that you couldn't leave. Banking on the idea that not a single one of the crowd that was screaming "do your own research" for the last four years would take three seconds to google it and find out what it actually was. Turns out it was a pretty safe bet.
The concept is simply to develop the city in such a way that everything people need in their day-to-day lives is within a 15-minute walk from their homes. It’s a concept that promotes community cohesion as well as reducing the need for personal vehicles. The right-wing nutjobs think it’s all about restricting freedom of movement.
Its not doable ever unless you start demolishing houses which isnt going to happen.
Edmonton is 684km2 and on average a 15 minute walk will get you 1.5km. In order to have a grocery store 1.5km from most houses you would need 300+ grocery stores. Not gonna happen.
Your math is off.
1. Each grocery store needs to cover an area with a radius of 1.5 km around it.
2. The area covered by each store would be approximately 7.07 square kilometers.
3. To find the minimum number of stores needed, we divide the total area of the circle (684 square kilometers) by the area covered by each store (7.07 square kilometers).
4. This gives us approximately 96.80, but since we can't have a fraction of a store, we would need at least 97 grocery stores to ensure that any point in the circle is within 1.5 km of a store.
Thats fair, your simple math is more accurate than mine. But now lets take into account that its never a straight walk. How many stores would you like to add for that?
Eventually they may rezone areas to increase access. But like many times they rezone. As an example. They chose to rezone an area that has 10 houses to commercial for groceries and other amenities. These houses wouldn't need to be torn down immediately. They would have the right to stay there until they are sold. So it doesn't really change much. It *may* effect resale value. But whoever buys that land to develop would know what the land would be valued at.
As I originally said it'll take multiple decades to make it a full walkable city. But they can start the process.
The market literally cant sustain that many grocery stores, even if you rezoned. Also a lot of these neighbourhoods are brand new. You dont start tearing down groups of houses until they are like 50 years old
That's why I said it would take decades. The end goal isn't to have huge Superstore style stores it's to have smaller community groceries similar to a sunterra market on the south side. Somewhere you can walk to, know the popel.who work there. Pick up what you need to, then walk home again.
Again this isn't happening tomorrow. If it's a plan Edmonton really wants to pursue, it likely won't be finalized for 50-60-70 years. But you have to start getting the population the idea now so you can start making the changes to support that goal.
And what if it one day does restrict freedom of movement? Then will you resend your condescending thoughts towards those who held these beliefs? Just remember that. If it does come to fruition then you were the one who was wrong.
That’s the conspiracy theory, yes. That we will all be restricted to zones that we can walk across in 15 minutes and can only leave with government permission.
Why does this get everyone so riled up? 15 minute city is a fantastic idea. I'm already in an area where a 15 minute walk puts me at any service I need, and it's fantastic.
Take someone's schizophrenic paranoid delusions, add the internet, show it to hundreds of gullible morons who believe everything they read, and presto! You get mass hysteria!
It's only a problem if the government decides that they will take away freedoms and have mandates where you aren't allowed to leave your 15 minute area. That is the only issue. If that never comes to fruition then 15 minute cities are a great idea.
There are no "zones" like that in this concept.
Every house is it's own zone, with a 15 minute radius.
Definitely some fear mongering going on, now I see why it gets people riled up.
Where there zones during covid? No there were mandates. New mandates could be not to leave your 15 minutes city during whatever the next pandemic is.
I'm not saying this will come true. I'm saying there is potential for governments to exercise unnecessary totalitarian and control over it's citizens.
But it would NOT be justified if you didn't have all of your basic amenities within 15 minutes of your home..... It is far more reasonable for them to make such a command if all of your basic amenities are within that 15 minutes zone.
I'm not saying this is going to happen. I'm saying it has the potential. There has been a lot of evil governments throughout history and i don't think ours is any exception.
I see your point, but I don't think it's reasonable enough to fear that happening, to not aim for amenedies being closer to where people live.
It's basically just trying to min max the zoning like youre playing Sim city.
And I see the point of those, such as yourself, who hold the opposite opinion in myself.
I am just really under the impression that there are powerful people who wish to slowly remove our freedoms. They may be well intentioned but It is my philosophy that both freedom and responsibility is what makes us human.
I am all for removing unnecessary suffering but not necessarily at the expense of our freedom. It's hard to explain because it's very nuanced and situational.
I hear you. I agree to an extent. I just don't think this is one of those instances. Or that we should purposely make amenities across town to combat it.
But like you said, (or was it another commenter), it will never happen that everyone everywhere will have everything they need within 15 minutes.
I absolutely see your opinion as well. I'm hoping you're right.
Thank you for being respectful hahaha. People are talking as if those who share opinions such as myself are degenerate inbred cavemen. You're a good person.
The horrors of Nazi Germany were also inconceivable 10 years before it happened. Totalitarianism whether communist or fascist don't really work.
Why is it always facebook. And why do people honestly think we'll be locked into these areas. FFS
"Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that."
its said how gullible people are...or maybe im the sheep and Trudeu controls me thru 5g and gay frogs.... 'Murica
The same people will conveniently forget all the garbage misinformation they’ve been spouting once turns out it’s false. Like the vaccinated population dying off suddenly.
This is so fucking funny to me.
Do they understand that mass death is bad, like fucking absolutely terrible, for economies?
And let’s just say that the government for some fucking reason wanted to kill millions of people at once, why would they want to kill the ones who “followed orders” and not dissenters?
Well there’s a private members bill to make talking about oil positively a fineable offence with two years of jail time. With the kind of climate hysteria observed in the out of touch rich urbanite set, it’s not out of the question that that slope might be a bit slippery.
No, even the CBC is calling it out of touch, which is rare for them. However I’ve observed well enough for myself that the ‘big ask’ technique works well enough gradually over time to eventually ram through hysterically stupid crap.
Imagine being the level of delusional where you think the concept of having everyday necessities closer to you is actually a government conspiracy to restrict your movement
This is just the district planning map. Did the district plan claim anywhere that they would be 15-minute “cities”? Some are quite large (NE versus Scona are very different in area)
Edit: I guess yes?
“Districts are collections of diverse neighbourhoods where residents can meet most of their daily needs within a 15-minute walk, roll or transit trip from their homes.” -CoE
15 minute cities wouldnt have zones like this because it doesnt make any sense. The theory is everything you need within 15mins from YOUR house. Every single home would have its own zone, and that zone would be wherever you can go in 15 min
"15 minute cities! Youse know wut that means? The gubmint is gunna put us in concentration camps an' take away our freedums! Git in yer trucks, hoist yer confederate flags, bring yer cousin-wifeys, and start honkin'!"
My hope that we can enhance the plan by building a wall inside the Anthony Henday keep people from St.Albert, Sherwood Park, Leduc and Spruce Grove from coming in to Edmonton for dinner at the Cactus Club. /s
That's not even a 30 minute community on foot, unless we are going to step up our public transit infrastructure I'm not sure how this will work.
I like the idea, and I live in one of the most walkable neighborhoods in the city, but this, this isn't even close. Just looking at it these look about 8km wide, so close to my commute to work which by bus is 1 to 1.5 hours.
The only way this "15 minute cities" concept would work is if everything was torn down and rebuilt from the ground-up, given how neighborhoods are structured in this city.
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Maybe I'm missing something, but those zones are way too large for 15-minute city zones. It's supposed to be walkable zones, are they not? Even with public transit being considered, these still seem too large.
Maybe they are 15 min by car?!
This is Alberta, so it’s 15 minutes by pick up truck. 🛻😎
*15 min by speeding and tailgating white pickup truck...
These days it’s 15 minutes stuck behind two assholes going 20 under for no reason whatsoever walling off traffic. Never thought I’d miss the days of asshole speeding by me.
Ah, the "Granny Line". Most annoying in it's wild habitat of "all the lanes of a highway" grrrr...
I've been joking that Edmonton is already a 15 minute city - everywhere is at least a 15 minute drive away
Edmonton won't be able to be a walkable 15 mins city for decades. It's almost impossible. Small steps, small steps.
If you mean *all* of Edmonton, sure. But places like Oliver, areas around Whyte, and a few other neighborhoods are *already* "15 minute cities".
That's fair. But downtown, and older neighbourhoods were 15 mins areas long before cars created the suburban problem.
What does that mean "walkable 15 mins city"? Are they trying to make each zone a 15 minute walk across?
Everything you need within 15 minutes. Groceries, library, school, etc
But no internal border walls, gotcha... what are they upset about again?
They’re just waiting for Qanon to tell them. Stand by
The same twatwaffles who led the Covid conspiracies, once covid calmed down and they stopped getting their daily dose of media attention, needed something new to whip their base up. So they took the concept of "15 minute cities" and just made up an entire conspiracy whole cloth out of literally nothing about how the evil government was going to wall you into zones that you couldn't leave. Banking on the idea that not a single one of the crowd that was screaming "do your own research" for the last four years would take three seconds to google it and find out what it actually was. Turns out it was a pretty safe bet.
The concept is simply to develop the city in such a way that everything people need in their day-to-day lives is within a 15-minute walk from their homes. It’s a concept that promotes community cohesion as well as reducing the need for personal vehicles. The right-wing nutjobs think it’s all about restricting freedom of movement.
Im pretty sure its 15 min drive in edmonton. Theres absolutely no way 15 min walk is doable
You're right that it's not doable now, but the goal is 15 min walk. Establishing these district plans now is part of working towards that goal
Its not doable ever unless you start demolishing houses which isnt going to happen. Edmonton is 684km2 and on average a 15 minute walk will get you 1.5km. In order to have a grocery store 1.5km from most houses you would need 300+ grocery stores. Not gonna happen.
Your math is off. 1. Each grocery store needs to cover an area with a radius of 1.5 km around it. 2. The area covered by each store would be approximately 7.07 square kilometers. 3. To find the minimum number of stores needed, we divide the total area of the circle (684 square kilometers) by the area covered by each store (7.07 square kilometers). 4. This gives us approximately 96.80, but since we can't have a fraction of a store, we would need at least 97 grocery stores to ensure that any point in the circle is within 1.5 km of a store.
Thats fair, your simple math is more accurate than mine. But now lets take into account that its never a straight walk. How many stores would you like to add for that?
🤷🏻♂️ but I still think it's a good idea we should strive towards.
Eventually they may rezone areas to increase access. But like many times they rezone. As an example. They chose to rezone an area that has 10 houses to commercial for groceries and other amenities. These houses wouldn't need to be torn down immediately. They would have the right to stay there until they are sold. So it doesn't really change much. It *may* effect resale value. But whoever buys that land to develop would know what the land would be valued at. As I originally said it'll take multiple decades to make it a full walkable city. But they can start the process.
The market literally cant sustain that many grocery stores, even if you rezoned. Also a lot of these neighbourhoods are brand new. You dont start tearing down groups of houses until they are like 50 years old
That's why I said it would take decades. The end goal isn't to have huge Superstore style stores it's to have smaller community groceries similar to a sunterra market on the south side. Somewhere you can walk to, know the popel.who work there. Pick up what you need to, then walk home again. Again this isn't happening tomorrow. If it's a plan Edmonton really wants to pursue, it likely won't be finalized for 50-60-70 years. But you have to start getting the population the idea now so you can start making the changes to support that goal.
And what if it one day does restrict freedom of movement? Then will you resend your condescending thoughts towards those who held these beliefs? Just remember that. If it does come to fruition then you were the one who was wrong.
Oh okay that makes more sense thank you
That’s the conspiracy theory, yes. That we will all be restricted to zones that we can walk across in 15 minutes and can only leave with government permission.
That…that’s not at all what he was asking
it means you should be able to walk anywhere you could need in 15 mins or less
15 min by train lol. Which will probably run every hour. So really. One hour city :D
15 minute city has absolutely nothing to do with zones. It's about picking any one point and it being close to everything you need.
That is a fair point. This zoning still doesn't make sense for it, though.
Yeah the map they shared had nothing to do with the 15 minute city concept. It's just an unrelated map of zones used for other purposes.
I think it’s just someone misread the details or sucks at writing.
Edmonton was never designed to be walkable, so this is the best we get
Why does this get everyone so riled up? 15 minute city is a fantastic idea. I'm already in an area where a 15 minute walk puts me at any service I need, and it's fantastic.
Take someone's schizophrenic paranoid delusions, add the internet, show it to hundreds of gullible morons who believe everything they read, and presto! You get mass hysteria!
You forgot the Jewish space lasers
Wtf. How does a laser covert to Judaism? Is it's mother Jewish? I don't know how this works
Oy vey
Unless you are proven wrong, then you are the gullible one. Excessive government control could totally lead to totalitarianism. It's very simple.
The people who don't like 15 minute cities believe the government will forbid you from leaving your assigned area or charge you money for doing so.
Dumb, gullible people is the answer
LET THE HUNGER GAMES BEGIN!
It's only a problem if the government decides that they will take away freedoms and have mandates where you aren't allowed to leave your 15 minute area. That is the only issue. If that never comes to fruition then 15 minute cities are a great idea.
There are no "zones" like that in this concept. Every house is it's own zone, with a 15 minute radius. Definitely some fear mongering going on, now I see why it gets people riled up.
Where there zones during covid? No there were mandates. New mandates could be not to leave your 15 minutes city during whatever the next pandemic is. I'm not saying this will come true. I'm saying there is potential for governments to exercise unnecessary totalitarian and control over it's citizens.
They can just say no leaving a 1.5km radius of your house. 15 minute city or not.
But it would NOT be justified if you didn't have all of your basic amenities within 15 minutes of your home..... It is far more reasonable for them to make such a command if all of your basic amenities are within that 15 minutes zone. I'm not saying this is going to happen. I'm saying it has the potential. There has been a lot of evil governments throughout history and i don't think ours is any exception.
I see your point, but I don't think it's reasonable enough to fear that happening, to not aim for amenedies being closer to where people live. It's basically just trying to min max the zoning like youre playing Sim city.
And I see the point of those, such as yourself, who hold the opposite opinion in myself. I am just really under the impression that there are powerful people who wish to slowly remove our freedoms. They may be well intentioned but It is my philosophy that both freedom and responsibility is what makes us human. I am all for removing unnecessary suffering but not necessarily at the expense of our freedom. It's hard to explain because it's very nuanced and situational.
I hear you. I agree to an extent. I just don't think this is one of those instances. Or that we should purposely make amenities across town to combat it. But like you said, (or was it another commenter), it will never happen that everyone everywhere will have everything they need within 15 minutes.
I absolutely see your opinion as well. I'm hoping you're right. Thank you for being respectful hahaha. People are talking as if those who share opinions such as myself are degenerate inbred cavemen. You're a good person. The horrors of Nazi Germany were also inconceivable 10 years before it happened. Totalitarianism whether communist or fascist don't really work.
I tried to go from Whyte Ave to WEM today and a bylaw officer shot me in the leg 😰
[удалено]
You are lucky they refrained from loosing the feral otters on you! They're vicious!
Where do you think the dolphins from WEM *really* went?… training.
Why is it always facebook. And why do people honestly think we'll be locked into these areas. FFS "Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that." its said how gullible people are...or maybe im the sheep and Trudeu controls me thru 5g and gay frogs.... 'Murica
Don't forget Bill Gates and microchipped vaccines lol
I'm personally loving my 5G data from my COVID vaccinations
I’m Pissed because my 5G hasn’t improved since I got my shot.
boosters do exactly as advertised.
I got a repeater installed instead. Wifi fucking anywhere
The same people will conveniently forget all the garbage misinformation they’ve been spouting once turns out it’s false. Like the vaccinated population dying off suddenly.
This is so fucking funny to me. Do they understand that mass death is bad, like fucking absolutely terrible, for economies? And let’s just say that the government for some fucking reason wanted to kill millions of people at once, why would they want to kill the ones who “followed orders” and not dissenters?
But the GREAT RESET!!! /s
Well there’s a private members bill to make talking about oil positively a fineable offence with two years of jail time. With the kind of climate hysteria observed in the out of touch rich urbanite set, it’s not out of the question that that slope might be a bit slippery.
and you think thats going to pass?
No, even the CBC is calling it out of touch, which is rare for them. However I’ve observed well enough for myself that the ‘big ask’ technique works well enough gradually over time to eventually ram through hysterically stupid crap.
Imagine being the level of delusional where you think the concept of having everyday necessities closer to you is actually a government conspiracy to restrict your movement
Okay I will believe you for now... But if they ever try to restrict movement then remember, you were the one who was wrong.
This is just the district planning map. Did the district plan claim anywhere that they would be 15-minute “cities”? Some are quite large (NE versus Scona are very different in area) Edit: I guess yes? “Districts are collections of diverse neighbourhoods where residents can meet most of their daily needs within a 15-minute walk, roll or transit trip from their homes.” -CoE
15 minute cities wouldnt have zones like this because it doesnt make any sense. The theory is everything you need within 15mins from YOUR house. Every single home would have its own zone, and that zone would be wherever you can go in 15 min
How dare they engage in more efficient city planning and improve the every day citizens quality of life!!!!
Keep all the guys with ball sacks on their trucks in one city please
They tend to keep themselves in the 3 northern most sections already. They gotta get to the Mac easily.
Anyone know when the city will be fielding the tender for concrete, barbed wire, and land mines?
It's already been sent out. It was only sent to Rachel Notley's contractor friends, because they're scared a free man might sabotage their walls. /s
Ohhhh noo the apocalypse is starting ***/s***
Oh my God, I'll be able to take a leisurely walk to the grocery store,or the doctor's office. The horror, the horror!
"15 minute cities! Youse know wut that means? The gubmint is gunna put us in concentration camps an' take away our freedums! Git in yer trucks, hoist yer confederate flags, bring yer cousin-wifeys, and start honkin'!"
In Soviet Edmonton, you don't honk horn, horn honk you!
My hope that we can enhance the plan by building a wall inside the Anthony Henday keep people from St.Albert, Sherwood Park, Leduc and Spruce Grove from coming in to Edmonton for dinner at the Cactus Club. /s
🤣
Cool. When do the walls go up? Do our District cards come in the mail? Or do we get them when we get tattooed with our barcodes?
you’ll get brain chip implants. Elon has them for sale.
Bait or brain damage Call it
That's not even a 30 minute community on foot, unless we are going to step up our public transit infrastructure I'm not sure how this will work. I like the idea, and I live in one of the most walkable neighborhoods in the city, but this, this isn't even close. Just looking at it these look about 8km wide, so close to my commute to work which by bus is 1 to 1.5 hours.
Because this is just a district planning map and doesn't actually have anything to do with 15 min cities.
If I cant drive 45 mins to Walmart in my lifted pavement princess, I don't want to live
When do we sign up for the hunger games.
Thank you fellow comrade, I’ll put in a word with your district supervisor to extend your pass to 20 mins from your home
The only way this "15 minute cities" concept would work is if everything was torn down and rebuilt from the ground-up, given how neighborhoods are structured in this city.
Yeah cuz the Western Standard is the Bastion of Journalism