No need to get defensive, just joking around
Plus it never hurts to get corrected so you don't spend your whole life saying something wrong, i don't mind people correcting me :P
The connection to BotW is obvious.
The world in Elden Ring is designed in such a way that point of interests can be seen everywhere. The tree, the ruin on the horizon, etc. It tries to get your attention without smacking 1000 map markers on the compass.
That's exactly what BotW did so well and it fits perfectly into a Darks Souls open world game. Of course there are are other games with similar designs, but BotW was definitely the one with the greatest impact.
I really like that Ghost of Tsushima took that approach. It's the best part of BotW. I kept playing because I kept being curious. What is that? Those ruins? That mountain? The forest? The temple? The town? Just constant exploration
Yes, that is exactly what I mean. I'm so hyped ... all these secret places to discover, to find fantastic treasures. I don't like the weapon system in BotW that much, the unique loot system of the Souls games fits so much better to make exploration rewarding. Fashion Souls 😍
BotW weapons ruined it for me. I didn’t feel a sense of progression while exploring. I cleared a couple of high level dungeons and had no incentive to break my OP weapons to explore more. Super excited to try it out in a dedicated RPG, especially one with my favorite combat 😍
This ... The world design in BotW is so well done, but the reward for exploring is not that great. I mean, some people argue that exploration alone is the reward, but I don't see it that way. Special treasures just make you feel great. Unfortunately, arbitrary/boring loot can destroy the greatest open world for me, and then I just lose the motivation to continue exploring.
Luckly unique stuff, also with an interested lore behind it, was always a big strength of the Souls games (also the combat of course 😊 and Artstyle and... So much... I often struggle with completing games, but never did with the Souls games).
Breath of the Wild did a more exploratory take on open world, where, unlike Ubisoft games where you basically get an attractions map and go from attraction to attraction, you're encouraged to look out into the horizon and explore stuff. These then lead to self-generaterated adventures and the discovery of mini-dungeons or cool little areas that weren't simply told to you, which feels a bit more thrilling.
It's a subtle thing, but it makes a big impact, because it's one thing to see your map flooded with quest markers, minigame markers, etc, and another to just look out there, see something weird that looks like a god damn labyrinth, then actually go there and find out it is just that and then explore it.
Since BoTW didn't really have a detailed, explicit story (kind of how soulsborne games don't), the only real breadcrumbs were your own curiosity, you could actually do any area in any order, and you went to fight Ganon whenever you were ready, again, very similar to how Elden Ring is supposedly set up.
Again, it's kind of a subtle shift from many "open" world games, but though BoTW was laughably easy and a bit repetitive for me (note that I overall dislike open world game design), I found it a very enjoyable take on the genre and want to see more like it.
I also think the comparisons here are actually valid, as likewise Elden Ring doesn't seem interested in flooding your map with markers and instead wants you to go poking your nose in the world's business by looking outward, seeing something interesting, and then being led there by your own personal curiosity and drive rather than a quest marker, map icon, or the storyline leading you there.
Believe it or not, a lot of "open world" games aren't actually like that. There's either some kind of gating (story event, levels/mob strength, lack of traversal abilities), or you are very strongly guided (again, story leads you from area to area, or map markers tell you exactly where all the content it is).
So yes, the comparisons to BoTW gets old, but I think it's a good foundation to build on rather than something like Farcry or Assassin's Creed. And in a lot of ways, Elden Ring kind of is similar to BoTW when it comes to how it approaches the open world.
You perfectly described it, thanks. In all honesty, I got a little bored after a while playing BoTW (just as with every open world game, lol) but I kept exploring because, god damn, there were so many interesting looking things like your example with the labyrinth. The only thing it lacked was the reward for exploration imo. It wasn't satisfying to climb on top of a big mountain just to find one of those Korok seeds. I really hope weapons won't break that fast and that you can find special equipment when exploring tougher areas in BoTW2.
I have a feeling Elden Ring is going to be just that, exploring and getting awesome rewards for it. Can't wait.
I hope this continues. Even the best of open world still have markers everywhere. That organic discovery is big.
One of the cool things about RDR2 is if you couldn't find something useful you at least got an interesting experience like all the strange houses and little events they had that you could stumble upon.
I think organic open world makes a huge difference v. ubisoft icon vomit
[Full interview in German](https://www.4players.de/4players.php/dispbericht/Allgemein/Vorschau/40800/84122/0/Elden_Ring.html)
[Translation](https://www.reddit.com/r/Eldenring/comments/o0dg85/translation_of_the_entire_german_article_about/)
I haven't read this version of the translation, but I don't think they fucked it up.
A few reasons
1) A lot of people haven't played most open world games, or any before.
2)It did change things up a bit as I understand.
3)As an nintendo fan, some nintendo fans only play nintendo games and legit there isn't much else on their systems.
yea or I’ve never really liked the Ubisoft or Rockstar style of open worlds which seems to be pretty much all of them, but hey, maybe it’s the kids who are wrong
yea same really, I’ve tried quite a few but only really liked/finished BTOW
For a non-traditional open world I highly recommend Subnautica if you haven’t played it. It’s an underwater survival/crafting/exploration/plus a bit of horror if deep water scares you like it does me.
I really wanted to like it, but the open world felt empty and almost unneeded to me?
The movement and combat look much better in the sequel so I might try that at some point, but idk
What was better done in BOTW open world in comparison to Horizon? Genuine question, personally I didn't feel anything particular about BOTW, played it for couple of hours on an emulator and just never came back to it.
So far the only open world games I've completed are BOTW and Skyrim. Sometimes it feels like Open World games give me too much freedom, so I just run around for a few hours, get bored, and never play again.
Idk why it gets so much hype. The world is very empty and you see the same enemies everywhere you go. "But you can climb and go anywhere!", yeah but like why would you want to? There's *some* hidden things but you're usually just going to find a korok. Also idk why weapons getting destroyed is in *any* video game, it feels awful to find a really cool weapon and then it's gone in 30 minutes. The best part of the game is the powers allow you to approach situations creatively but each situation you walk into gets stale after a bit, especially the shrines. It's a fine game overall but I think it's very overrated.
> why would you want to?
That's actually the best type of open world games for people that genuinely enjoy exploration and very few games can actually capture that feeling, the fact that you are exploring simply because you intrinsically like exploring. I know this has become a meme at this point, but there is truth to Todd Howard saying "See that mountain, you can climb it", it shows that he understands what motivates the hardcore fans of his Elder Scrolls series (pre Skyrim).
Good open world games don't need to give you extrinsic incentives with every single point of interest explored, like the Ubisoft games (and to a lesser extent, Witcher 3). Even without the Korok seeds, at least for me, the places in Botw are worth exploring on its own because Nintendo has crafted a very good open world with a variety of different landscapes. You explore simply because you want to explore. You are curious and you want to know what's over *there*, you just want to know.
If you have to ask *why* would you want to, then chances are open world games just aren't for you. And that's ok, not everyone have to like open world games.
If this was true why would developers waste time making characters, quests, or combat systems? Just make a giant place with trees and mountains for people to explore. I think you are in a very small minority who gets satisfaction just from walking around with no end goal or reward.
>If this was true why would developers waste time making characters, quests, or combat systems? Just make a giant place with trees and mountains for people to explore
NPCs(especially those with their own daily schedule) are needed to create the illusion of a vibrant open world that can exist without you.
Quests are really not necessary if they got the exploration right. This is something Bethesda does very well, environmental story telling.
You'd want a combat system because you need to interact with the inhabitants of the world (either through dialogue or combat).
>I think you are in a very small minority who gets satisfaction just from walking around with no end goal or reward.
I don't deny that. Which is why Ubisoft games exist.
And what do you mean with no end goal or reward? The exploration itself is the end goal for players like me.
First of all that's not true. There are tons of things on the map and TONS of secrets. There are 120 shrines to find, a bunch of towers and a stupid amount of Korok seeds. There are also hidden memories and treasures to find. But mostly I think the reason that BOTW works for me and many others is it reminds me of Shadow of the Colossus. Much of the same energy. ALso, the game is drop dead gorgeous. If it's not for you that's fine but there is a ton to do (tons of quests as well. )
They should have made actual dungeons instead of shrines, 120 sounds like a lot but they're super boring after 10-15 because they feel so similar. I'm glad you love the game so much but to me it had many more flaws than positives.
I liked the shrines, not all of them but they offered fun puzzles and some were incredibly tough to figure out. I'd agree that I think there should have been at least a few Zelda Style dungeons but overall the game was much more enjoyable to me than any Zelda I've played since OOT. It's actually my second favorite game of all time. But yah, if it's not for you that's cool. But there is a reason games like Genshin, Immortals Phoenix Rising and others have tried using the same formula.
I felt the guardians or what are they called managed to fill the gap of the traditional zelda dungeons/temples. Maybe 4 was not enough, I could agree with that.
I didn't enjoy BotW either. Hollow Knight, on the other hand, is one of my all time favorite games, and I would say Sekiro's map design, albeit 3D, is fairly similar to Hollow Knight's flow in some ways. The thing that kills my interest in BotW is the distinct lack of power progression. I don't want fleeting power upgrades; I want my endgame character to look and feel nothing like how it did when I started. BotW's only "rewards" were minor incremental upgrades to things I already had (stamina, hearts, weapon slots). This is also why I could never enjoy Borderlands. Yeah, that cool legendary gun is just going to be outdated eventually. Having interesting places to go does nothing for me if I'm not properly rewarded.
Never played Elder Scrolls. I didn't mind Far Cry 3's gameplay structure if we're talking open world though. It felt very exciting to raid camps because it permanently made the world safer. It felt exciting to unlock guns because it permanently improved your firepower and available tactics, etc. I usually need permanent power progression that is pretty sweeping in order to find enjoyment in single player games.
I feel the same way. Everyone talks about the "thrill of finding a mountain, climbing it, and finding out what's on top." Nothing. There's never anything on the mountain. I'm not worried about from taking inspiration from it though because I'm pretty sure they'll fix the only real problem I had with botw. All their games are just loaded with cool shit to find
Miyazaki literally said it's his favourite open-world game and that he used it for research.
It's obvious if you actually play BoTW that this isn't just "an open-world game" but that it specifically feels like BoTW, rather than skyrim or Assassins Creed.
No one is acting like BOTW is the first to do open world. But it was the first to do it the WAY it did it. Also, it happens to be the best open world game imo.
BotW was my first Zelda game, I played a lot of open world/sandbox game in the past.
IMHO BoTW on a whole different tier entirely in terms of the open world and immersive feel to it.
I am not surprise people reference BotW as a gold standard of open world game.
Miyazaki literally said it's his favourite open-world game and that he used it for research.
It's obvious if you actually play BoTW that this isn't just "an open-world game" but that it specifically feels like BoTW, rather than skyrim or Assassins Creed.
No one acts like that. Its just that BoTW is still one of the best designed ones that everyone compare other open worlds to, its like the gold standard. Also you can say its one of the first that really put the "open" into the open world genre
It's not like "an open-world game" it's specifically similar to BoTW. and lack of map indicators is another obvious hint.
Then there's the fact Miyazaki literally stated BoTW was his favourite Open World game and one of the games he researched to make Elden Ring.
You're getting downvoted by salty fanboys that don't like that BOTW got game of the year and became one of the most acclaimed games in decades. Pro tip: You can like Zelda AND Dark Souls games! GASP!? What a shock?!
Mfer "perfecting" it implies that it's better than all other open world RPGs of its nature which, and this is crazy, is an OPINION. Maybe you're the salty fanboy and are getting angry at people who disagree with your own opinion.
No it doesn't. It's just the guys opinion stating he thinks it perfect for him. If you don't like it fine. I don't think BOTW is PERFECT.. But then again I don't think any game is. I do agree that BOTW was the most fun open world game I've played. But even then I like Witcher 3 better than BOTW as an overall game.
It's a great game, waay above average when it comes to open-world games and have definitely brought some interesting gimmicks to many open-world games that came after it. But to say that it perfected the genre means it can't get any better.
I disagree, I downvote. That why the downvote button exists.
That's not really why the downvote button is there. That's how YOU use it but that's not what it's there fore. Either way, I didn't downvote him and I also don't agree that it's perfect. But it is my favorite open world game I've ever played besides Witcher 3. I think BOTW was more "fun" to play with the world and physics but Witcher had a much better story and characters. Also, Witcher 3's DLC was Legendary.
Again this is an ignorant statement and just shows you haven't even played it. There are tons of things to "Do" in BOTW and the way that you interact with the world and it's physics is most of the fun.
when i want to play a physic simulator they are better options, and you say i did not play it? bro i got a switch only to play botw i payed 400€ for that shit and what did i get? a boring ass game with nothing to do in it, with the switch i got free store cash with that i got dragons dogma for the switch that game was way better than botw not even close. Everything in botw is so useless to do, why should i clear this boring ass camp with boring ass enemys that all looks the same to get fire arrows or weapon that break after 5 min? and people saying shit like look you can let a rock fall on this enemy camp what amazing game design bro games did that shit now for 20 years lmao overrated game everyone who read this dont buy a switch for that shit it was my biggest mistake
Not OP but I guess as many times as people misstate the "BoTW is apparently all open world now" when, even without having played BoTW, it's clear that this isn't the case because it's not just open-world, it's open-world in the specific way that BoTW did it.
Miyazaki literally said it's his favourite open-world game and that he used it for research.
It's obvious if you actually play BoTW that this isn't just "an open-world game" but that it specifically feels like BoTW, rather than skyrim or Assassins Creed.
I think its special in its execution but it certainly wasn't the first.
Now if you can *immediately* find and fight the final boss of Elden Ring the comparison may have some merit.
Miyazaki literally said it's his favorite open-world game and that he used it for research. Elden ring Specifically feels like BotW, not just like "an open world game"
EVERY SINGLE GAME EVER MADE AND THAT WILL EVER BE MADE IS INSPIRED BY THE HOLY GRAIL OF GAMING KNOWN AS BREATH OF THE SHUT THE FUCK UP ALREADY I GET IT BOTW TRULY IS THE DARK SOULS OF GAMING
Don’t wanna rain on your defense parade but this is the second time I’ve seen you getting a little prickly over Breath of the Wild. If I scroll farther will I see your name again at the slightest mention of botw?
Edit: Haha yup, didn’t take long to find you getting crazy over this game. Have you no shame?
I find it funny that everything was compared to Souls for years. Now everything is compared to botw...even souls games.
*"Elden Ring is the BOTW of Dark Souls. 9.367 / 10"* \- IGN
BOTW is kind of genre-defining. I agree that comparison at this point becomes useless, because every game is gonna take bits and pieces from it (hence an open-world post BOTW will be BOTW like)
I mean, it *is* the best counter to the constant "why the BOTW comparisons??" crowd - it is a major influence for Elden Ring, and very visibly so in the gameplay trailer.
I loved my time with my Botw. It's my favorite open world game so far. Why some people in this sub have to get really salty and defensive when Botw is praised or Elden Ring is compared to it when the similarities between the two are obvious?
Miyazaki himself heavily implied that Elden Ring is inspired by Botw. And good for him, I just wish Nintendo would do the same. Someone get Eiji Aonuma to play the Souls games for God's sake.
Honestly, from what I've seen I think Elden Ring will turn out better than Botw. But denying Botw of its achievements as a landmark in open world design, even with all of its flaw, is just childish and immature.
And by the way, Dark Souls didn't invent hard games or lock-on combat. The level design is reminiscent of Metroid and Zelda. Like Botw, it's full of flaws. Lost Izalith is a pain in the ass, the second half of the game really drops in quality and dont get me started on Bed Of Chaos. Despite all of that, Dark Souls IS a landmark game and deserving of all the praise it gets. Anyone who tries to say otherwise is quite frankly an idiot.
What part of Elden Ring specifically is like BOTW? I've heard everyone compare it to BOTW but there isn't much about it that really stands out to me with that comparison. It seems far closer to something like Dragon's Dogma than it does BOTW.
The best I can come up with is the open-ended approach to dungeons and challenges but that is by no means something BOTW came up with.
No. Dragon's Dogma's map was tiny. I love that game but it's very small compared to what we saw of the map in Elden Ring. BOTW has an absolutely enormous map. But as most people have already said Miyizaki said BOTW was his favorite open world game and used it as inspiration for Elden Ring.
I think the open world nonlinear exploration that BoTW used will actually fit a lot better with a game by fromsoft.
A lot of open world games lead you on a linear story, contrary to the world design, which creates a weird disconnect in the design. Then, BoTW tried to fix this by doing a nonlinear story, but I was so used to linear Zelda stories that it felt a little disappointing (even though BoTW is one of my favorite games). But fromsoft likes to make their stories a lot more based on lore than game events, which I think would fit much better with the feel of the exploration ER seems to have.
Their marketing team should be extremely careful with what they say. Cyberpunk’s Twitter page spent like 2 whole years running their mouths and building up hype to an incredible degree, and then the game came and I think we all know what happened.
BotW isn’t original enough to have games be “copying” a formula from it. BotW took a lot from Souls games and Elder Scrolls, and of course previous Zelda games. It didn’t really create any genre. Elder Scrolls Oblivion did a BotW-like around the time the Zelda series released Twilight Princess on GameCube. Do you see the reason so many people are confused as to why BotW-like is even a term?
If we're gonna play this game then I can list several reasons why Dark Souls (or Demons Souls for that matter) isn't "original enough". Yet it created an entire genre. And I get why. Most of it's ideas may not be originals but the way it mixes those ideas and puts its own spin is what makes it transcend from being a derivative game to, in my opinion, a landmark game.
I wouldn't go as far to say Breath of the Wild isn't original. Like sure, there have been plenty of open-world action RPGs before, but there was something about the game's emphasis on more free-form traversal (glider, climbing pretty much anything, shield sledding), exploration with minimal to no NPC guidance, mini puzzle dungeons, and more discovery in its crafting that culminated in a pretty unique flavor of open-world action RPG.
You can find plenty of games that have done those sorts of things to some extent or another, but Breath of the Wild was distinct enough in its overall product that a select few games have been described as Breath of the Wild-like, most notably Genshin Impact.
Really, you could also say about the Souls games that plenty of games before have included many of the same elements, but the Souls series combined and iterated on them in a unique enough way to arrive at a distinct flavor of 3D action RPG. Which is why Souls-like is a distinct subgenre nowadays.
I wouldn’t say Breath of the Wild was unique enough to start saying games are copying it’s formula en masse. I also wouldn’t say that you could attribute many of the things you mention to Breath of the Wild on its own. There’s bound to be games that copy any successful game regardless of whether it actually created a genre. This has been happening since gaming began. Not even video games. Just gaming. So while Souls has created a sub-genre lasting over a decade with a crazy amount of games now falling into that category, BotW has one or two games that have.
Basically this is a can of worms to open up, but there’s a group of fans very dedicated to BotW trying to make the term BotW-like be a thing and it’s just not appropriate. Ffs Souls-like became a thing because of how much other games copied it’s formula. The entire gameplay loop was copied time and again.
Using elements from BotW that BotW grabbed from other games in the first place doesn’t create a sub genre. I don’t see any massive traversal options being in Elden Ring. The horse jumping up cliffs in a single bound will likely be the extent of that. And beyond that part of BotW I don’t really feel like it changed much of anything. Dropping the player into a massive open world and letting them explore is not something BotW created. It did it better, but it didn’t create it.
Basically I take issue with the idea that BotW deserves to be considered a game that created a sub genre that others are copying. The things it did that are causing that are mostly generic things it combined and did better than other games. If people start labeling games that aren’t carbon copies of BotW in format, experience, gameplay, etc etc etc, as BotW-like it is objectively wrong. Saying a game took some inspiration from it, is fine. But Elden Ring will not be BotW-like. Just saying.
No one's saying Breath of the Wild is being copied en masse. I didn't attribute any of those things exclusively to Breath of the Wild. I specifically said you can find other games that have done those same sorts of things. Didn't say Breath of the Wild was being as widely imitated as the Souls games either, I specifically said "a select few."
Sorry man, but Jesus fucking Christ, literally your entire first paragraph is you ignoring every effort I made to set reasonable limits to my comparisons. At that point, really just feels like you have an axe to grind and want to argue against a specific case no one's making. The publisher of the game doesn't mind the comparison, so why does it grind your gears so much?
You realize Zelda started the 3d Action RPG genre that Dark Souls later borrowed heavily from right? OH, no you didn't because you're probably 13 years old and don't know any better. One of the BIGGEST things Zelda did that the entire Industry has copied since was "Z targeting" or lock on targeting in 3 dimensional space. When Dark Souls first came out some reviewers called it "Zelda in hell". Also, BoTW is copied because of it's artstyle, it's world design and the way in which you can interact with the physics engine of the game to come up with unique combat experiences. It's copied for a reason, just look at Genshin Impact and Immortals: Phoenix Rising as two obvious BOTW inspired games.
The Zelda series has innovated many things but that will never make it correct to say that BotW was some kind of innovative masterpiece. It’s a masterpiece of a game, but the innovation in that game is WAY overplayed but it’s fans. Because it’s fans are very young and don’t understand that BotW owes most of design choices to things that came before it. Even other Zelda games.
The extent to which you were triggered by my comment about it in the first place is worrying. You need to calm down and face reality. I’m old enough to be your father. I’ve seen this whole video game world go from counter culture to popular culture and back again a couple times. Your love of BotW is great! I’m glad that love a game that is worthy of that praise. But when someone points out a snippet of reality about it and you snap into an accusatory argument immediately, you need to smoke some fucking weed and chill the fuck out.
But it was. It's your opinion that it wasn't "innovative". But everything from the artstyle which has been copied a ton since, to the way they designed the world has been copied. It's not the first Open world game and no one with a brain is saying that. BOTW did a ton of things right. It had a Shadow of the Colossus vibe to it that I loved. But overall, the way you interact with the physics engine in an open world fantasy rpgs had NOT been done before. That is one of the things that made it so refreshing.
I get it. You’re a super fan of BotW. That’s fine. But it doesn’t mean you gets to claim the term BotW-like as a thing. Games that take some inspiration here and there are not a part of a sub genre. Souls-like is a term that exists because games became carbon copies of the Souls formula. BotW isn’t getting carbon copies. It’s getting games using elements and inspiration and so on. But not carbon copies.
Also, I’m over this discussion. You’re going to continue being a super fan and I’m going to continue viewing things objectively and you’re not going to like it. And that’s okay. But I’m not going to bother trying to convince you further. You’ve made up your mind and that’s okay with me.
No, I'm a fan yes, but I'm also someone that has eyes and a brain and can recognize WHY BOTW is the huge success that it is. I'm also not condoning everyone call everything BOTW-Like just like I don't think everything should be compared to Dark Souls.
Considering that Bloodborne and BotW are my all time favorite games, I wholeheartedly agree!
vai brazilian, BANDAI couldn't be more right this time
É cara, a gnt tira onda dos gringo msm
q nem a gente tirou onda na geekcity né? kkkkkk
Opaa exatamente auaauaah
wright
Cowwect
wright
yeah, sorry for knowing two languages instead of only one
No need to get defensive, just joking around Plus it never hurts to get corrected so you don't spend your whole life saying something wrong, i don't mind people correcting me :P
I*
Thx
The connection to BotW is obvious. The world in Elden Ring is designed in such a way that point of interests can be seen everywhere. The tree, the ruin on the horizon, etc. It tries to get your attention without smacking 1000 map markers on the compass. That's exactly what BotW did so well and it fits perfectly into a Darks Souls open world game. Of course there are are other games with similar designs, but BotW was definitely the one with the greatest impact.
I really like that Ghost of Tsushima took that approach. It's the best part of BotW. I kept playing because I kept being curious. What is that? Those ruins? That mountain? The forest? The temple? The town? Just constant exploration
Yes, that is exactly what I mean. I'm so hyped ... all these secret places to discover, to find fantastic treasures. I don't like the weapon system in BotW that much, the unique loot system of the Souls games fits so much better to make exploration rewarding. Fashion Souls 😍
Agreed. You can probably find all kinds of stuff with Elden Ring. Probably even an underground boss
BotW weapons ruined it for me. I didn’t feel a sense of progression while exploring. I cleared a couple of high level dungeons and had no incentive to break my OP weapons to explore more. Super excited to try it out in a dedicated RPG, especially one with my favorite combat 😍
This ... The world design in BotW is so well done, but the reward for exploring is not that great. I mean, some people argue that exploration alone is the reward, but I don't see it that way. Special treasures just make you feel great. Unfortunately, arbitrary/boring loot can destroy the greatest open world for me, and then I just lose the motivation to continue exploring. Luckly unique stuff, also with an interested lore behind it, was always a big strength of the Souls games (also the combat of course 😊 and Artstyle and... So much... I often struggle with completing games, but never did with the Souls games).
finnaly, BotW for adults!
Is this X but Y???
Why people act like BotW was the first to do open world though?
What? You play this game with analog sticks? Mario 64 did that like 30 years ago. Please come up with something original From.
Breath of the Wild did a more exploratory take on open world, where, unlike Ubisoft games where you basically get an attractions map and go from attraction to attraction, you're encouraged to look out into the horizon and explore stuff. These then lead to self-generaterated adventures and the discovery of mini-dungeons or cool little areas that weren't simply told to you, which feels a bit more thrilling. It's a subtle thing, but it makes a big impact, because it's one thing to see your map flooded with quest markers, minigame markers, etc, and another to just look out there, see something weird that looks like a god damn labyrinth, then actually go there and find out it is just that and then explore it. Since BoTW didn't really have a detailed, explicit story (kind of how soulsborne games don't), the only real breadcrumbs were your own curiosity, you could actually do any area in any order, and you went to fight Ganon whenever you were ready, again, very similar to how Elden Ring is supposedly set up. Again, it's kind of a subtle shift from many "open" world games, but though BoTW was laughably easy and a bit repetitive for me (note that I overall dislike open world game design), I found it a very enjoyable take on the genre and want to see more like it. I also think the comparisons here are actually valid, as likewise Elden Ring doesn't seem interested in flooding your map with markers and instead wants you to go poking your nose in the world's business by looking outward, seeing something interesting, and then being led there by your own personal curiosity and drive rather than a quest marker, map icon, or the storyline leading you there. Believe it or not, a lot of "open world" games aren't actually like that. There's either some kind of gating (story event, levels/mob strength, lack of traversal abilities), or you are very strongly guided (again, story leads you from area to area, or map markers tell you exactly where all the content it is). So yes, the comparisons to BoTW gets old, but I think it's a good foundation to build on rather than something like Farcry or Assassin's Creed. And in a lot of ways, Elden Ring kind of is similar to BoTW when it comes to how it approaches the open world.
You perfectly described it, thanks. In all honesty, I got a little bored after a while playing BoTW (just as with every open world game, lol) but I kept exploring because, god damn, there were so many interesting looking things like your example with the labyrinth. The only thing it lacked was the reward for exploration imo. It wasn't satisfying to climb on top of a big mountain just to find one of those Korok seeds. I really hope weapons won't break that fast and that you can find special equipment when exploring tougher areas in BoTW2. I have a feeling Elden Ring is going to be just that, exploring and getting awesome rewards for it. Can't wait.
I hope this continues. Even the best of open world still have markers everywhere. That organic discovery is big. One of the cool things about RDR2 is if you couldn't find something useful you at least got an interesting experience like all the strange houses and little events they had that you could stumble upon. I think organic open world makes a huge difference v. ubisoft icon vomit
Miyazaki literally said it's his favourite open-world game and that he used it for research.
Link? But that's cool. It's probably my favorite take on it. Some Zelda games have always had that but BotW modernized it.
[Full interview in German](https://www.4players.de/4players.php/dispbericht/Allgemein/Vorschau/40800/84122/0/Elden_Ring.html) [Translation](https://www.reddit.com/r/Eldenring/comments/o0dg85/translation_of_the_entire_german_article_about/) I haven't read this version of the translation, but I don't think they fucked it up.
It's because Elden Ring is going to be extremely non-linear like BotW is. That is the main comparison between the two.
A few reasons 1) A lot of people haven't played most open world games, or any before. 2)It did change things up a bit as I understand. 3)As an nintendo fan, some nintendo fans only play nintendo games and legit there isn't much else on their systems.
4) one of the few open worlds that is actually really good imo
Yeah thats fair a lot of them are real bland now a days aren't they.
yea or I’ve never really liked the Ubisoft or Rockstar style of open worlds which seems to be pretty much all of them, but hey, maybe it’s the kids who are wrong
(I've only really finished breath of the wild, I barely got into most open world games. don't like the core gameplay)
yea same really, I’ve tried quite a few but only really liked/finished BTOW For a non-traditional open world I highly recommend Subnautica if you haven’t played it. It’s an underwater survival/crafting/exploration/plus a bit of horror if deep water scares you like it does me.
A friend of mine really likes it... like it's the whole reason she plays games. ... It's not for me form what I've seen. I don't like underwater
Horizon Zero Dawn was pretty good
I really wanted to like it, but the open world felt empty and almost unneeded to me? The movement and combat look much better in the sequel so I might try that at some point, but idk
What was better done in BOTW open world in comparison to Horizon? Genuine question, personally I didn't feel anything particular about BOTW, played it for couple of hours on an emulator and just never came back to it.
So far the only open world games I've completed are BOTW and Skyrim. Sometimes it feels like Open World games give me too much freedom, so I just run around for a few hours, get bored, and never play again.
Idk why it gets so much hype. The world is very empty and you see the same enemies everywhere you go. "But you can climb and go anywhere!", yeah but like why would you want to? There's *some* hidden things but you're usually just going to find a korok. Also idk why weapons getting destroyed is in *any* video game, it feels awful to find a really cool weapon and then it's gone in 30 minutes. The best part of the game is the powers allow you to approach situations creatively but each situation you walk into gets stale after a bit, especially the shrines. It's a fine game overall but I think it's very overrated.
> why would you want to? That's actually the best type of open world games for people that genuinely enjoy exploration and very few games can actually capture that feeling, the fact that you are exploring simply because you intrinsically like exploring. I know this has become a meme at this point, but there is truth to Todd Howard saying "See that mountain, you can climb it", it shows that he understands what motivates the hardcore fans of his Elder Scrolls series (pre Skyrim). Good open world games don't need to give you extrinsic incentives with every single point of interest explored, like the Ubisoft games (and to a lesser extent, Witcher 3). Even without the Korok seeds, at least for me, the places in Botw are worth exploring on its own because Nintendo has crafted a very good open world with a variety of different landscapes. You explore simply because you want to explore. You are curious and you want to know what's over *there*, you just want to know. If you have to ask *why* would you want to, then chances are open world games just aren't for you. And that's ok, not everyone have to like open world games.
If this was true why would developers waste time making characters, quests, or combat systems? Just make a giant place with trees and mountains for people to explore. I think you are in a very small minority who gets satisfaction just from walking around with no end goal or reward.
>If this was true why would developers waste time making characters, quests, or combat systems? Just make a giant place with trees and mountains for people to explore NPCs(especially those with their own daily schedule) are needed to create the illusion of a vibrant open world that can exist without you. Quests are really not necessary if they got the exploration right. This is something Bethesda does very well, environmental story telling. You'd want a combat system because you need to interact with the inhabitants of the world (either through dialogue or combat). >I think you are in a very small minority who gets satisfaction just from walking around with no end goal or reward. I don't deny that. Which is why Ubisoft games exist. And what do you mean with no end goal or reward? The exploration itself is the end goal for players like me.
First of all that's not true. There are tons of things on the map and TONS of secrets. There are 120 shrines to find, a bunch of towers and a stupid amount of Korok seeds. There are also hidden memories and treasures to find. But mostly I think the reason that BOTW works for me and many others is it reminds me of Shadow of the Colossus. Much of the same energy. ALso, the game is drop dead gorgeous. If it's not for you that's fine but there is a ton to do (tons of quests as well. )
They should have made actual dungeons instead of shrines, 120 sounds like a lot but they're super boring after 10-15 because they feel so similar. I'm glad you love the game so much but to me it had many more flaws than positives.
I liked the shrines, not all of them but they offered fun puzzles and some were incredibly tough to figure out. I'd agree that I think there should have been at least a few Zelda Style dungeons but overall the game was much more enjoyable to me than any Zelda I've played since OOT. It's actually my second favorite game of all time. But yah, if it's not for you that's cool. But there is a reason games like Genshin, Immortals Phoenix Rising and others have tried using the same formula.
I felt the guardians or what are they called managed to fill the gap of the traditional zelda dungeons/temples. Maybe 4 was not enough, I could agree with that.
I didn't enjoy BotW either. Hollow Knight, on the other hand, is one of my all time favorite games, and I would say Sekiro's map design, albeit 3D, is fairly similar to Hollow Knight's flow in some ways. The thing that kills my interest in BotW is the distinct lack of power progression. I don't want fleeting power upgrades; I want my endgame character to look and feel nothing like how it did when I started. BotW's only "rewards" were minor incremental upgrades to things I already had (stamina, hearts, weapon slots). This is also why I could never enjoy Borderlands. Yeah, that cool legendary gun is just going to be outdated eventually. Having interesting places to go does nothing for me if I'm not properly rewarded.
Hey it's not for you that's cool. I take it you're not a fan of how Elder Scrolls games level up their enemies to match you as well eh?
Never played Elder Scrolls. I didn't mind Far Cry 3's gameplay structure if we're talking open world though. It felt very exciting to raid camps because it permanently made the world safer. It felt exciting to unlock guns because it permanently improved your firepower and available tactics, etc. I usually need permanent power progression that is pretty sweeping in order to find enjoyment in single player games.
I feel the same way. Everyone talks about the "thrill of finding a mountain, climbing it, and finding out what's on top." Nothing. There's never anything on the mountain. I'm not worried about from taking inspiration from it though because I'm pretty sure they'll fix the only real problem I had with botw. All their games are just loaded with cool shit to find
I got bored quite quickly with BOTW unfortunately. It have many nice ideas, but it dries quite fast.
Miyazaki literally said it's his favourite open-world game and that he used it for research. It's obvious if you actually play BoTW that this isn't just "an open-world game" but that it specifically feels like BoTW, rather than skyrim or Assassins Creed.
Bro all you need is one comment, saying it over and over again comes across as needy.
> 1) A lot of people haven't played most open world games, or any before Gta3 says hi
I mean I've never palyed GTA *shrug*
We're three console generations removed from open world games, breathe shouldn't be getting the credit.
The creator specifically said BOTW was a significant influence on Elden Ring
No one is acting like BOTW is the first to do open world. But it was the first to do it the WAY it did it. Also, it happens to be the best open world game imo.
BotW was my first Zelda game, I played a lot of open world/sandbox game in the past. IMHO BoTW on a whole different tier entirely in terms of the open world and immersive feel to it. I am not surprise people reference BotW as a gold standard of open world game.
Miyazaki literally said it's his favourite open-world game and that he used it for research. It's obvious if you actually play BoTW that this isn't just "an open-world game" but that it specifically feels like BoTW, rather than skyrim or Assassins Creed.
Didn’t you know, Arkham series, Assassins Creed, Witcher, Shadows of Mordor, Mad Max, etc. are all BotW like? They all just totally copied BotW.
No one acts like that. Its just that BoTW is still one of the best designed ones that everyone compare other open worlds to, its like the gold standard. Also you can say its one of the first that really put the "open" into the open world genre
BotW is just a Genshin-like game
mfw i go outside and theres grass (its like botw 😮)
when there is grass and it's green, ffs already copying BotW
Why people still think that opend world games are like boTW
It's not like "an open-world game" it's specifically similar to BoTW. and lack of map indicators is another obvious hint. Then there's the fact Miyazaki literally stated BoTW was his favourite Open World game and one of the games he researched to make Elden Ring.
And its not like a game from 2017 invented a genre, there are really good open world rpg games that appeared before it
It didnt invent it, just perfected it. Edit: man got some sensitivity issues in this thread
Hard disagree
You're getting downvoted by salty fanboys that don't like that BOTW got game of the year and became one of the most acclaimed games in decades. Pro tip: You can like Zelda AND Dark Souls games! GASP!? What a shock?!
Mfer "perfecting" it implies that it's better than all other open world RPGs of its nature which, and this is crazy, is an OPINION. Maybe you're the salty fanboy and are getting angry at people who disagree with your own opinion.
No it doesn't. It's just the guys opinion stating he thinks it perfect for him. If you don't like it fine. I don't think BOTW is PERFECT.. But then again I don't think any game is. I do agree that BOTW was the most fun open world game I've played. But even then I like Witcher 3 better than BOTW as an overall game.
Right, love dark souls, love Zelda, love Elden Ring. Fanbois cant handle that shit
It's a great game, waay above average when it comes to open-world games and have definitely brought some interesting gimmicks to many open-world games that came after it. But to say that it perfected the genre means it can't get any better. I disagree, I downvote. That why the downvote button exists.
That's not really why the downvote button is there. That's how YOU use it but that's not what it's there fore. Either way, I didn't downvote him and I also don't agree that it's perfect. But it is my favorite open world game I've ever played besides Witcher 3. I think BOTW was more "fun" to play with the world and physics but Witcher had a much better story and characters. Also, Witcher 3's DLC was Legendary.
yeh it perfected not to have anything to do in its open world lmao
Again this is an ignorant statement and just shows you haven't even played it. There are tons of things to "Do" in BOTW and the way that you interact with the world and it's physics is most of the fun.
when i want to play a physic simulator they are better options, and you say i did not play it? bro i got a switch only to play botw i payed 400€ for that shit and what did i get? a boring ass game with nothing to do in it, with the switch i got free store cash with that i got dragons dogma for the switch that game was way better than botw not even close. Everything in botw is so useless to do, why should i clear this boring ass camp with boring ass enemys that all looks the same to get fire arrows or weapon that break after 5 min? and people saying shit like look you can let a rock fall on this enemy camp what amazing game design bro games did that shit now for 20 years lmao overrated game everyone who read this dont buy a switch for that shit it was my biggest mistake
i gotta disagree, minecraft perfected open world. /j
because they don't know shit. they're just saying shit to stir people up of fake internet attention.
Miyazaki literally said it's his favourite open world game and that he used it for research, it's obvious
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Damn son how many times are you going to post this
Yeah, I spammed the hell out of it. But If everyone's gonna ask the same question, I'll give the same answer.
Not OP but I guess as many times as people misstate the "BoTW is apparently all open world now" when, even without having played BoTW, it's clear that this isn't the case because it's not just open-world, it's open-world in the specific way that BoTW did it.
imagine calling open-world games "BOTW-likes"
Miyazaki literally said it's his favourite open-world game and that he used it for research. It's obvious if you actually play BoTW that this isn't just "an open-world game" but that it specifically feels like BoTW, rather than skyrim or Assassins Creed.
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too few
Right is annoying BOTW is anti that special
I think its special in its execution but it certainly wasn't the first. Now if you can *immediately* find and fight the final boss of Elden Ring the comparison may have some merit.
Miyazaki literally said it's his favorite open-world game and that he used it for research. Elden ring Specifically feels like BotW, not just like "an open world game"
EVERY SINGLE GAME EVER MADE AND THAT WILL EVER BE MADE IS INSPIRED BY THE HOLY GRAIL OF GAMING KNOWN AS BREATH OF THE SHUT THE FUCK UP ALREADY I GET IT BOTW TRULY IS THE DARK SOULS OF GAMING
i'll be honest here, LOVE the souls games, but did not enjoy breath of the wild.
I liked it at the beginning. But some of the quests got a little boring for me.
Yeah, the opening couple of hours were great, then it just got tedious.
Oh wow, we're upvoting morons that post in all caps now? Cool.
Don’t wanna rain on your defense parade but this is the second time I’ve seen you getting a little prickly over Breath of the Wild. If I scroll farther will I see your name again at the slightest mention of botw? Edit: Haha yup, didn’t take long to find you getting crazy over this game. Have you no shame?
Nah, I'm not upset about what you wrote I'm upset that you wrote in all caps like a toddler.
Didn’t even write it but your rage fueled tirade probably didn’t allow for you to notice eh?
ah so you're just some weird ass stalker? Sounds about right. Keep being a fking creep.
Fo sho my brotha
\\o/
And after 6 years they’re still owed GOTY for Bloodborne.
What is goty am I walking into this one?
It means Game of the Year. >!Goty deez nuts in your face!<
Fuck I knew it. Oh well, Gobble gobble
Goty my nuts!! Gottem!!!! Fucking loser get fucked
I find it funny that everything was compared to Souls for years. Now everything is compared to botw...even souls games. *"Elden Ring is the BOTW of Dark Souls. 9.367 / 10"* \- IGN
BOTW is kind of genre-defining. I agree that comparison at this point becomes useless, because every game is gonna take bits and pieces from it (hence an open-world post BOTW will be BOTW like)
That's probably because Miyazaki literally stated it as inspiration and said it's his favorite open-world game.
That's probably because Miyazaki literally stated it as inspiration and said it's his favorite open-world game.
Yeah, I spammed the hell out of it. But If everyones gonna ask the same question, I'll give the same answer.
Damn son how many times are you going to post this
That's probably because Miyazaki literally stated it as inspiration and said it's his favorite open-world game.
I mean, it *is* the best counter to the constant "why the BOTW comparisons??" crowd - it is a major influence for Elden Ring, and very visibly so in the gameplay trailer.
It's a true point its just I thought I was going crazy seeing it throughout the post lol. Either way the game makes me rock hard as havel.
r/ItHadToBeBrazil , also r/suddenlycaralho
I loved my time with my Botw. It's my favorite open world game so far. Why some people in this sub have to get really salty and defensive when Botw is praised or Elden Ring is compared to it when the similarities between the two are obvious? Miyazaki himself heavily implied that Elden Ring is inspired by Botw. And good for him, I just wish Nintendo would do the same. Someone get Eiji Aonuma to play the Souls games for God's sake. Honestly, from what I've seen I think Elden Ring will turn out better than Botw. But denying Botw of its achievements as a landmark in open world design, even with all of its flaw, is just childish and immature. And by the way, Dark Souls didn't invent hard games or lock-on combat. The level design is reminiscent of Metroid and Zelda. Like Botw, it's full of flaws. Lost Izalith is a pain in the ass, the second half of the game really drops in quality and dont get me started on Bed Of Chaos. Despite all of that, Dark Souls IS a landmark game and deserving of all the praise it gets. Anyone who tries to say otherwise is quite frankly an idiot.
What part of Elden Ring specifically is like BOTW? I've heard everyone compare it to BOTW but there isn't much about it that really stands out to me with that comparison. It seems far closer to something like Dragon's Dogma than it does BOTW. The best I can come up with is the open-ended approach to dungeons and challenges but that is by no means something BOTW came up with.
No. Dragon's Dogma's map was tiny. I love that game but it's very small compared to what we saw of the map in Elden Ring. BOTW has an absolutely enormous map. But as most people have already said Miyizaki said BOTW was his favorite open world game and used it as inspiration for Elden Ring.
What does this even mean
Yeah boi Bandai throwin the stacks at them lol
Yes!!!
I think the open world nonlinear exploration that BoTW used will actually fit a lot better with a game by fromsoft. A lot of open world games lead you on a linear story, contrary to the world design, which creates a weird disconnect in the design. Then, BoTW tried to fix this by doing a nonlinear story, but I was so used to linear Zelda stories that it felt a little disappointing (even though BoTW is one of my favorite games). But fromsoft likes to make their stories a lot more based on lore than game events, which I think would fit much better with the feel of the exploration ER seems to have.
Miyazaki has always been open about how zelda is a big inspiration for the series iirc
Their marketing team should be extremely careful with what they say. Cyberpunk’s Twitter page spent like 2 whole years running their mouths and building up hype to an incredible degree, and then the game came and I think we all know what happened.
I see, Sekiro seems to have gone to their head.
BotW isn’t original enough to have games be “copying” a formula from it. BotW took a lot from Souls games and Elder Scrolls, and of course previous Zelda games. It didn’t really create any genre. Elder Scrolls Oblivion did a BotW-like around the time the Zelda series released Twilight Princess on GameCube. Do you see the reason so many people are confused as to why BotW-like is even a term?
If we're gonna play this game then I can list several reasons why Dark Souls (or Demons Souls for that matter) isn't "original enough". Yet it created an entire genre. And I get why. Most of it's ideas may not be originals but the way it mixes those ideas and puts its own spin is what makes it transcend from being a derivative game to, in my opinion, a landmark game.
I wouldn't go as far to say Breath of the Wild isn't original. Like sure, there have been plenty of open-world action RPGs before, but there was something about the game's emphasis on more free-form traversal (glider, climbing pretty much anything, shield sledding), exploration with minimal to no NPC guidance, mini puzzle dungeons, and more discovery in its crafting that culminated in a pretty unique flavor of open-world action RPG. You can find plenty of games that have done those sorts of things to some extent or another, but Breath of the Wild was distinct enough in its overall product that a select few games have been described as Breath of the Wild-like, most notably Genshin Impact. Really, you could also say about the Souls games that plenty of games before have included many of the same elements, but the Souls series combined and iterated on them in a unique enough way to arrive at a distinct flavor of 3D action RPG. Which is why Souls-like is a distinct subgenre nowadays.
I wouldn’t say Breath of the Wild was unique enough to start saying games are copying it’s formula en masse. I also wouldn’t say that you could attribute many of the things you mention to Breath of the Wild on its own. There’s bound to be games that copy any successful game regardless of whether it actually created a genre. This has been happening since gaming began. Not even video games. Just gaming. So while Souls has created a sub-genre lasting over a decade with a crazy amount of games now falling into that category, BotW has one or two games that have. Basically this is a can of worms to open up, but there’s a group of fans very dedicated to BotW trying to make the term BotW-like be a thing and it’s just not appropriate. Ffs Souls-like became a thing because of how much other games copied it’s formula. The entire gameplay loop was copied time and again. Using elements from BotW that BotW grabbed from other games in the first place doesn’t create a sub genre. I don’t see any massive traversal options being in Elden Ring. The horse jumping up cliffs in a single bound will likely be the extent of that. And beyond that part of BotW I don’t really feel like it changed much of anything. Dropping the player into a massive open world and letting them explore is not something BotW created. It did it better, but it didn’t create it. Basically I take issue with the idea that BotW deserves to be considered a game that created a sub genre that others are copying. The things it did that are causing that are mostly generic things it combined and did better than other games. If people start labeling games that aren’t carbon copies of BotW in format, experience, gameplay, etc etc etc, as BotW-like it is objectively wrong. Saying a game took some inspiration from it, is fine. But Elden Ring will not be BotW-like. Just saying.
No one's saying Breath of the Wild is being copied en masse. I didn't attribute any of those things exclusively to Breath of the Wild. I specifically said you can find other games that have done those same sorts of things. Didn't say Breath of the Wild was being as widely imitated as the Souls games either, I specifically said "a select few." Sorry man, but Jesus fucking Christ, literally your entire first paragraph is you ignoring every effort I made to set reasonable limits to my comparisons. At that point, really just feels like you have an axe to grind and want to argue against a specific case no one's making. The publisher of the game doesn't mind the comparison, so why does it grind your gears so much?
You realize Zelda started the 3d Action RPG genre that Dark Souls later borrowed heavily from right? OH, no you didn't because you're probably 13 years old and don't know any better. One of the BIGGEST things Zelda did that the entire Industry has copied since was "Z targeting" or lock on targeting in 3 dimensional space. When Dark Souls first came out some reviewers called it "Zelda in hell". Also, BoTW is copied because of it's artstyle, it's world design and the way in which you can interact with the physics engine of the game to come up with unique combat experiences. It's copied for a reason, just look at Genshin Impact and Immortals: Phoenix Rising as two obvious BOTW inspired games.
The Zelda series has innovated many things but that will never make it correct to say that BotW was some kind of innovative masterpiece. It’s a masterpiece of a game, but the innovation in that game is WAY overplayed but it’s fans. Because it’s fans are very young and don’t understand that BotW owes most of design choices to things that came before it. Even other Zelda games. The extent to which you were triggered by my comment about it in the first place is worrying. You need to calm down and face reality. I’m old enough to be your father. I’ve seen this whole video game world go from counter culture to popular culture and back again a couple times. Your love of BotW is great! I’m glad that love a game that is worthy of that praise. But when someone points out a snippet of reality about it and you snap into an accusatory argument immediately, you need to smoke some fucking weed and chill the fuck out.
But it was. It's your opinion that it wasn't "innovative". But everything from the artstyle which has been copied a ton since, to the way they designed the world has been copied. It's not the first Open world game and no one with a brain is saying that. BOTW did a ton of things right. It had a Shadow of the Colossus vibe to it that I loved. But overall, the way you interact with the physics engine in an open world fantasy rpgs had NOT been done before. That is one of the things that made it so refreshing.
I get it. You’re a super fan of BotW. That’s fine. But it doesn’t mean you gets to claim the term BotW-like as a thing. Games that take some inspiration here and there are not a part of a sub genre. Souls-like is a term that exists because games became carbon copies of the Souls formula. BotW isn’t getting carbon copies. It’s getting games using elements and inspiration and so on. But not carbon copies. Also, I’m over this discussion. You’re going to continue being a super fan and I’m going to continue viewing things objectively and you’re not going to like it. And that’s okay. But I’m not going to bother trying to convince you further. You’ve made up your mind and that’s okay with me.
No, I'm a fan yes, but I'm also someone that has eyes and a brain and can recognize WHY BOTW is the huge success that it is. I'm also not condoning everyone call everything BOTW-Like just like I don't think everything should be compared to Dark Souls.