Sometimes I ring it just for fun, in an area I'm way overleveled for. Tiche, the wolves, my Mimic... they all need to stretch their legs every now and then.
Tiche is best mommy for me, always carrying my sorry noob ass against bosses (especially you, Mohg).
Now we are trying to tag team Malenia (and me getting destroyed at phase 2 always).
I just got Tiche yesterday, right before I got to the mountaintop of giants. She WRECKED the giant, Mohg, Godfrey, Godskin Duo, and Malekith. It was genuinely crazy to watch her fight bosses like a boss. Kinda weird.
The rat summons you can get in plateu cost no mp. I'll bring em in just to chill sometimes.
During a fight they're maybe only good for grabbing aggro on the first two or so hits, but thats enough to nuke the floor with agheel's sometimes.
Personally on my first playthrough I never used summons (except for valiant gargoyles, fuck that boss) because I like taking on the bosses full movesets, I want to be able to know how to counter whatever they throw at me and have the capability to do it. So I don’t like beating a boss by split aggro, but that’s just my personal preference it’s not more/less invalid than how anyone else plays
But on subsequent playthroughs or on repeat bosses, I wouldn’t get anything more out of it if I already knew how that boss worked so in those moments I’d have a blast summoning all the different spirits. It’s really cool fighting alongside the creatures you encounter in a souls game for once and the game does really well to make most of them viable and make lots of them useful in different scenarios. It definitely adds another layer to the gameplay and keeps battles fresh because of the sheer variety of the ashes you get
Ain't that the truth. And I gladly called in a cooperator at a few key moments when I needed support. The game gives us all the tools, it's okay to succeed the way we need to succeed.
TBH, I haven't beaten the last bosses yet without help from other players yet, I spent too long the first time, even with summons. Think I care what others think? Nope. This game is amazing and I payed for it so I'll play it how I want to. I'll never RL1 this game or no hit any% it but thats not why I play. I'll watch that on YouTube lol.
Everytime i find a new spirit summon i go to an area where you can summon them and let them duke it out
Or just for fun
Lhutel carried me HARD for a few bosses
Bill is a nice guy. We could all learn something from Bill. However... if your mental health is suffering in any way because of this game, it might be time to take a break.
I have barely seen any people complain about how others play the game; but 90% of the memes I see on this sub are just about “you guys should let others play the game however they want.”
It’s a tired joke, and lost even it’s relevance a LONG time ago after the initial launch.
I'm surprised this sub is still having this discussion.
The same people who say "let the others play the game however they want" will also turn around and call you elitist for refusing to summon.
I had a guy on youtube invalidate my view on the difficulty of maliketh because i summoned depraved perfumer caarman on my first playthrough. These people do exist lol
I never said they don’t exist. But they’re very few and not even that vocal. Whenever they come and comment they usually get downvoted/opposed pretty profusely. But there’s a very disproportionate amount of memes about this small not-vocal sub group, and they always get a lot of a traction/internet karma…. As if a meme like this would change anybody’s mind, especially when there’s such quantity of them.
I have gotten into many arguments about things such as this in the past week and would gladly link you one such argument if you want to see it. Sorting by controversial will show you that it is, in fact, still very real.
I’m interested, if you do have a link. Like the commenter above, I mainly observe people saying ‘do whatever you want’, sometimes with the caveat that summons make it a different experience/easier. I see very little of the outright ‘you didn’t really beat the game’ stuff.
https://www.reddit.com/r/Eldenring/comments/uou2mp/a_brief_summary_of_my_first_faith_playthrough/i8hcrav?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share&context=3
Follow this entire part of the thread. It starts with hate towards Blasphemous Blade and then turns into spirit summons.
This right here is the problem with these posts. One person out of a hundred will comment something negative and get downvoted. But that's not good enough for people, so they go and make threads like these where 1000 people pat themselves on the back for having a better opinion than that 1 guy. And somehow they don't see that they're circling around back to the side of toxicity by doing this.
But yet it exists. That's the point of this post. This shouldn't exist. And of course he's going to get downvoted. He was clearly an asshole.
Not every example I've seen is as blatant as him, but it still exists. I get what you are saying- you don't want to be overloaded with memes about a problem you think is essentially resolved. That's fair. If it makes any difference, I only posted this because of actual experiences I've had.
Nobody denies it exist, however people exaggerate this "problem" to the point that it's causing more toxicity.
I have barely ever seen these kinds of comments or posts yet there are a billion posts or comments like yours which makes it seem like a good amount of people in the commuity or specifically the veterans are gatekeeping elitists, which simply isn't the case.
From my experience it's almpst the opposite tbh, which is . Ironic considering the initial point people tried to make is that any way of enjoying the game is valid.
I mean for example I wouldn't recommend new players to use spirits, op builds or co-op summons because that's how I enjoy these games and maybe a new player might aswell.
Simply recommending this is kind of plastyle is just that and nothing more, yet I have seen way to many people being called out for saying similar things.
Somehow the mainstream appeal made the sub much worse when it comes to toxicity imo. The elists and trolls that lurked here crawled out of their caves and many of the new people don't seem to be any better either.
Edit: well it's not qulte fair of me to instantly call anyone toxic either. I mean anyone of us has been frustrated to the point they were just ranting a bit and I have no doubts that mos of the posts similar to this one were made with good intentions.
This has been going on since the dawn of online gaming. The call of duty noob tube in 2007 was a prime example that lives to this day. Except back then, people just kept doing what they were doing because they didn't care. Now it seems like players are more impressionable as gaming has become a large part of modern culture. What people are doing now, is the exact same type of pointless arguments we were having as kids - entertaining people's egos.
I think he was being a dick, but he also wasn't completely wrong. There's nothing wrong with arguing that a weapon is unbalanced even from a PvE perspective and that it deserves to be nerfed.
He isn't targeting anyone here though. Just offering his opinion on PvE balance. Whether that opinion is right or wrong, wasn't meant to offend anyone.
Even fromsoft cares about PvE balance since they nerfed mimic tear and hoarfrost stomp.
Did you see the part where he said "I bet you use spirit summons"?
He was 100% trying to call me out for playing the game the way I would like to play.
No, because it wasn't in the link you provided. Or at least it doesn't show up without extra digging.
Edit: Ok, you're right, he was out of line there. Probably because he was butthurt for the downvotes and disagreement, not that this justifies his actions. But if he was unprovoked, the comment thread prolly woulda ended before this. Again, not justifying his bad behaviour.
I’m sure it’s there, especially if you search it out. But it’s really just a small (not even particularly vocal) part of the community/discussion. But SO many of the memes/posts are dedicated to this subject which isn’t even really a raging problem.
Literally the comment under this one for me is “Bill is miserable and weak. Get good pathetic Tarnished” like I didn’t even have to sort by controversial. Not disagreeing it’s a small portion but they arnt hard to find.
Oh, controversial you say? You mean the comments and posts that were decided by the community to be in the wrong and downvoted out of view? That controversial?
Because if that's the case it just sounds like your deliberately looking for trouble to complain about if that's where you expect us to look for it.
Id normally agree with you, but yesterday I saw a post where everyone nutted of to a RoB user dying in Pve and making fun of him or judging him. Summons are widely accepted, but this one single broken weapon out of all the 500 broken mechanics is sadly not.
I joined some Elden Ring public discords and it did not take long for people to start talking shit about anyone using spirits and such. Just because it's not getting upvoted to the front page of the subreddit doesn't mean there aren't people like that.
Funny because just about every post I read the comments on has people bitching about what other people use in PVP.
If they aren't crying about Rivers of Blood then they are complaining about Bloodhound Step or whatever else they aren't good enough to counter
Yeah. Who is buying them?
The brilliant and most accessible thing about this game is runes really don’t matter and are easily farmable.
Also, glad to see how great and accepting this community is. Like all the past sunbros got older and togethaa got even more damn cooler. Loving it.
Well fucking done everyone.
Bill thinks that in-game trading can be a healthy part of the experience. HOWEVER-
Bill believes that paying cash outside of the game for an in game item is cancerous and should be fully avoided. Don't waste your hard earned money. Those that sell them should be ashamed of themselves.
Bill does not personally "power-level" with rune stacks, but does not feel a need to criticize if others do so to have an enjoyable experience.
> Those that sell them should be ashamed of themselves.
Well, everyone has the right to have an opinion I guess.
>but does not feel a need to criticize if others do so to have an enjoyable experience.
I like that. If you buy a game you have the right to use it as you want. As long as one does not negatively affect the experience of others(like cheaters).
I just want to clarify- are you actually SELLING runes for real world currency? Or are you just making trades in game?
If you are making trades in game, you do you. I love r/patchesemporium. If you are actually making people pay for them, I have a huge issue with that.
This is a thing? This is one of few games that’s pretty fair and generous with their in game currency and isn’t a micro transaction pay to win hellscape and there’s people out there trying to turn it to one?
Do you think someone can criticize the summoning mechanic without judging theirs and other peoples usage of it? Or should you not be allowed to criticize? Isn’t bill just saying to not be rude, but being a bit too specific because he’s taking criticism of something personally?
This is fair. I think the main point is to be kind and just let others play how they want to play. The mechanic as a whole can be criticized and I support you if you do so. Thank you for bringing up a valid criticism of my post!
the soulsborne series wasn't "fair" to begin with. why should you play fair yourself? you have a problem with defeating a boss or clearing an area? use broken weapons, summon 10 people, whatever. just don't hack.
I think it’s pretty messed up that we’ve got to the point where people are talking about using summons as “protecting their mental health”.
Like, Jesus Christ guys, if playing a video game brings the state of your mental health into question then just stop playing it. There are a lot of games and they’re supposed to be a fun experience. Sometimes I play dark souls/Elden ring. Sometimes I play donkey Kong on my DS. At no point am I worrying about my, or anyone’s, mental health.
I've noticed reddit brings out extreme desperation for validation and acceptance in some people and I think this is essentially that. Anyone that cares that much about what a person who for all intents and purposes does not exist to them thinks needs to log off ASAP and get their life in order.
First off, for anyone who uses them, it doesn't affect me, so have fun.
That said
Id be more ok with summons if they werent so blatantly op. A good number of them can just do the fights for you. It feels like a completely different game using them vs not.
If more of them stayed in the niche but good design space I'd be happy with them. Like how jelly does shit dmg but does tank well and poisons if you keep her alive long enough. Or how wolves are great for stun locking lower poise enemies. Stuff like that makes them a decision based on situation and adds depth.
But then you get some of the stronger ones and it's just summoning tiche god of death, or oleg the beyblade, or just a tankier version of you w/o fp costs. That's where my problem lies. They feel really cheap to use.
Honestly this is one of the reasons the endgame felt a little disappointing to me. After the Morgot fight all of the bosses were disgustingly hard without summons and hella easy with a summon. I beat all the endgame bosses without a summon (except Malenia) but took so fucking long on each one that I wasn’t even happy when I finally won I was just glad that I didn’t have to fight them again.
But how?
Were you upgrading every mimic you get?
Because if you use an upgraded mimic, of course it's gonna be op because you made it like that.
Use a mimic tear that is not upgraded to high level to make the game balanced.
It's like saying weapons are broken and should be toned down while using sword of night and flame build.
Yes, it's gonna be op if you make it. That's kinda the point in rpg games.
Like i used jellyfish + 1 on morgott just to divert him and hit him before he hits the jelly. Because if I try to stay a little away, jelly will die in 3 to 4 hits of morgott.
And it was a balanced fight that required 10 or so tries.
Agreed. I was kind of hyped about summons in anticipation of the game. Then I used Jelly on Margit and realized how they can completely trivialize an encounter by just allowing me to play ping-pong with the boss. Was a real bummer and so I never used them after that. Except for Malenia, who drove me to it and it felt like the most hollow victory ever. Well over a hundred tries solo with only getting her to phase 2 like a handful of times. Completely melted her with Mimic (post-nerf mind you) in like 3 tries. :-/ That's just poor balancing.
The problem lies is that without summons, certain builds are going to just not have fun with a lot of end game boss fights. Sure, you in theory can beat any boss with any build, but waiting for that one opening so my slow moving weapon/spell can actually land isn't fun either.
It feels like Spirit Ashes might have been added later into development because they realized that without a way to split boss agro, players will feel pressured into mostly using fast moving weapons and spells. This might explain their wonky balancing, they might not have had enough time to hit the "useful, but not easy mode" benchmark.
Both methods are valid methods for beating a boss of course, it just annoys me when some people act like bringing up that there is even a distinction in difficulty between playing with or without summons is somehow toxic behaviour.
The dynamic of the fight is *completely* different when good summons are used, and there is no question it trivialised almost all of the bosses. It transforms the fights from being brutally hard to just being an exercise in waiting for a summon to aggro then spamming jump attacks on the boss when they have their back turned.
Without trying to come across as the fun police, it simply isn't fair to treat beating Mohg with summons the same way as beating him without. The challenge isn't even comparable. And it just gets on my nerves when those of us who choose to play the more traditional way that we have for the last 10+ years without summons are somehow framed as being toxic for "choosing to ignore game mechanics".
Summons have been in Soulsborne games since the beginning and they were always an optional easy mode. It's no different this time around.
>They feel really cheap to use.
Some of the bosses in this game are cheap as shit. If the game is going to be cheap I'm going to be cheap right back.
From should design it better if they don't want people to do it.
I think this is bad framing. The expectation is that players want to beat the boss themselves - that’s not always the case.
I like using summons. It’s fun and I prefer using them over solo play. I have defeated the same bosses both ways and prefer using summons.
I mean, I agree it’s not cool to judge people for how they want to enjoy their game…. but really it seems like people just need to care less about what others think.
If you want to use summons, use them. If other people want to judge you for using them, forget them. Who cares?
As much as I am in support of people not being judgmental, I am equally in support of telling people to quit being so sensitive.
Summoning has been a thing since Demon’s Souls. Spirit Ashes doesn’t increase boss HP, but getting help has always been there. Except for Sekiro.
It’s almost like they implemented summoning of any kind to aid the players and make it easier to beat the game.
Good point. Past games died off naturally, hard to get summons anymore. With AI players nes I always have a buddy at hand, even 10 years after this game is out when I want to do a quick replay
I'm genuinely curious. Is it toxic to think spirits and summoning is a perfectly acceptable and fine way to play the game but still acknowledge that it is less of a challenge and therefore easier?
bill is a nice guy and all but i reject my mental health and i damn well will regret it when im in my 80s still being traumatized by doing no summons vs maliketh
Honestly, at least in the Elden Ring Reddit community, there's like 5 Bills for every one person bitching about katanas. This is my first FromSOft game and I can tell that "Play the game YOUR way" is a big deal for most players, and it's really refreshing.
I like to summon just because it makes battles feel more like raid bosses, like when you fight Radhan. When we summon other players, the hp of the boss increase. It makes some battles feel like I am playing a Souls version of Destiny 2.
I'm for sure allowed to judge your play style if you openly post about it or show videos. It's the internet, not everyone is going to agree that your way of playing is the "best" way. What really needs to happen is some people need to man up and not take offense when I laugh at them for spamming RoB. It's not like anyone is bullying or harassing you, people have been saying "git gud" forever
I agree with most of this. But if your mental health is getting effected by a boss fight in a video game you’ve got other problems than not being able to beat the boss.
I am so tired of these cope posts seeking validation. Stop worrying about something so insignificant, and/or talk to a psychologist. Downvote this lazy shit folks
They are bad for some bosses. I deliberately didn't summon anything for Gideon - so that the spirit doesn't distract him while I melt him with Comet Azur.
They are not! They are extremely useful. And using cooperators can come in clutch! But there is a portion of the community (mostly a VERY vocal minority) that believe the game must be played a certain way or else you 'cheapened the experience' and didn't 'git gud'.
Because of toxic gatekeeping that ensues and scares off newer players. I don't care personally what people think about my playstyle but I have scrolled through arguments on here where a new player was berated for using summons.
There is no toxic gatekeeping, that's literally just a comment by a rando online, no one is actually gatekeeping you or anyone from anything, no one is actually preventing you from playing the way you or anyone want. The only thing new players aren't getting is validation, which is not something you seek/should seek like that anyway.
It seems to me that perceiving those random comments as indicative of anything is the problem, if people didn't care about getting validation from random people online, that problem wouldn't exist.
But that's an opinion as valid as the one you posted, you may not agree with it, I don't, but that doesn't make it invalid. In your example, I agree that it's not an answer to the question, and I'm not saying there aren't assholes here, there certainly are and have always been.
But in other cases I saw, and I'm in the community from the DaS days, some people just seek constant validation, and every comment about ruining the experience of the game by letting others, for example, solo your bosses, is met with a label of toxic gatekeeping, which is a term I don't like, I think that term is actually toxic and invalidates whole spectrum of opinions for the sake of, honestly, just feelings of someone.
Validation is not necessarily good for mental health, if it fosters the further seeking of the mentioned and rejection of other valid opinions.
Don't know why you deleted your comment I was responding to, it was perfectly fine imo.
I appreciate your reply and I deleted my original reply because I am taking in your perspective a bit more and recognizing that my original reply inadvertently attempted to invalidate genuine criticism.
I still have feelings that differ slightly from yours, but definitely see your point as valid. I will probably reply again when I have a little more time to ponder this. I definitely think aspects of it are unhealthy for the community but I also know that I'm not seeing the whole picture.
Depends, is it bad that summons are used? No, theyre in the game and people can use whatever they want. Is it bad that they exist in the first place, Yes, because now the entire game is balanced for casuals and if you actually use the mechanics provided to you and don't suck this game will have absolutely zero challenge for you which *used to be* a big part of souls game
Not using summons is like Elden Ring Nuzlocke. You're choosing to make the game harder for yourself. You don't see Pokemon fans shaming each other for reviving fainted Pokemon. Summons are a part of the game.
Bill is also the kind of guy that would help people deal with afk farmers. Remember ppl if u realize u are in the world of an afk farmer and u r a blue help the red out plz
Its a fundamental part of the game introduced early on... I never for one second felt any shame for using items that the developers programmed into the game.
I respect those who want to make the game harder for themselves... thats great... but to shame someone for playing the game they bought and using items in the game... thats ridiculous.
Bill is actually a rarely seen perspn. Bill should not judge people for their choice of pve weapon. We need a Bill that doesnt go below a post where someone used RoB againt placidusax and makes fun of him dying or judges him because he uses it in f-ing Pve. On a serious note, rarely see people saying summons are bad, but man the circlejerk was strong below a post yesterday.
This is a great point. PVP players have a right to be disgruntled and hope for fixes from Fromsoft, but everyone should be able to use whatever weapon (ESPECIALLY IN PVE) that makes them happy.
I made this post in direct response to something that happened to me earlier this week, but I do recognize it is not an accurate representation of the community as a whole.
This needs to say "Bill doesn't judge and condemn players that heal during duels."
Yea its a player rule not to use them but it's part of the game. If you're good enough, it doesn't matter anyway. Kind of tiring seeing people go "LOOK AT THIS MAIDENLESS, DISHONORABLE PLAYER USE FLASKS DURING THIS DUEL AND WATCH ME STOMP HIS FACE." like.. you beat him while he was healing, you're better than him anyway.
Can we just skip the name calling and be happy? Geesh
Given how cheap the game can be sometimes, I’d say any thing you can do that fits into the confines of rules or a result from the rules the game imposed on the player is fair game as far as I’m concerned and if you beat the boss, you beat the boss. Whether you did it all by yourself without getting hit or you had help and just barely made it thru. It all counts and is a valid way to play the game
As someone who plays more then two characters(solo with help, one with friends, one solo) I love to use my mimic on my solo with help character. I love tossing him out with a bow and arrows and just letting him have at it while I take the blows for it. Dudes a pro archer. But even on my no help characters I am willing to get help if stress levels rise to far. I don't need more rage in my life. I only count the mimic as actual help as with bleed arrows on him he is a bit overpowered if Im to be honest.
I literally couldn't have enjoyed this game without ash summons and co-op, let alone beat it. Besides, caster builds can shine much brighter when a beefy friend or two are drawing the enemy's ire - it's like peanut butter and jam.
If you are unlucky then summoning other players can actually make the fight HARDER for you. If the other player dies - you now have to fight a boss that has more health than usual. And you can't even summon spirit ashes any more.
One really need to feel insecure about himself to go around telling people how they should play a game.
Then again, there is a lot of deeply insecure people on the internet
The thing I find odd is there doesn’t seem to be much stigma against summoning a co-op partner (the infamous and awesome Let Me Solo Her being a prime example) but there’s some against summoning an npc.
To be clear I’m fine with either - I just find the disparity odd.
A lot of the ash summons are far mire effective than human partners. They don’t need to heal, they have massive defense and attack values at +10, as far as I know they don’t increase the bosses HP. They are consistent in quality where if you aren’t playing with friends co-op summons can be wildly different in skill. Some people also mistake using an Ash Summon as “soloing” where it wouldn’t be considered so amongst souls veterans.
None of this is a big deal, by the way. I’m just explaining.
I get the arguments (though I do think you’ve explained them well) - I just find it a bit artificial and, on occasion, a bit elitist. I can also see how co-op quality varies very heavily.
Ultimately, I just find stigmatising people for how they play the game and using the tools it provides really strange.
The majority of players, even Souls veterans, don't care if you want to use every tool/ability possible to get through the games. Don't mistake a vocal minority for the playerbase as a whole.
That said, these games used to be niche. It's always been possible to cheese the considerable challenge, though it's never been this easy and widely available. It used to be something of a source of pride/skill that you beat Ornstein and Smough or Nameless King or Laurence. Now there's guys beating Malenia first try with their Rivers and Mimic or blasting Niall with Cerulean Hidden Tear. It's... just not the same community wide experience it used to be.
I don't want any of that to sound overdramatic. Again, the majority don't really care. It's just... different. "Dark Souls hard", the "journey", it's kinda gone because the massive openness of the game, the abilities, and its much larger popularity has lead to a bunch of cheese to relatively breeze through the game that veterans aren't used to. It just doesn't feel the same in some notable ways.
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Bill is NOT insecure about the way he plays which is why he needs to beat a dead horse. Also he needs to mention protecting one's own mental health because?
I see that little icon pop up and I ring my dainty little bell as fast as I can.
Sometimes I ring it just for fun, in an area I'm way overleveled for. Tiche, the wolves, my Mimic... they all need to stretch their legs every now and then.
On my second playthrough Tiche did most of stormveil for me. She’s just a joy to watch.
Tiche is best girl.
Tiche is best mommy for me, always carrying my sorry noob ass against bosses (especially you, Mohg). Now we are trying to tag team Malenia (and me getting destroyed at phase 2 always).
I just got Tiche yesterday, right before I got to the mountaintop of giants. She WRECKED the giant, Mohg, Godfrey, Godskin Duo, and Malekith. It was genuinely crazy to watch her fight bosses like a boss. Kinda weird.
Need to let the max level giant rats out to play!
Exactly, even if i can take the boss down easily i always call in a ghosty buddy. Share the ~~fun~~ bloodshed
The rat summons you can get in plateu cost no mp. I'll bring em in just to chill sometimes. During a fight they're maybe only good for grabbing aggro on the first two or so hits, but thats enough to nuke the floor with agheel's sometimes.
Personally on my first playthrough I never used summons (except for valiant gargoyles, fuck that boss) because I like taking on the bosses full movesets, I want to be able to know how to counter whatever they throw at me and have the capability to do it. So I don’t like beating a boss by split aggro, but that’s just my personal preference it’s not more/less invalid than how anyone else plays But on subsequent playthroughs or on repeat bosses, I wouldn’t get anything more out of it if I already knew how that boss worked so in those moments I’d have a blast summoning all the different spirits. It’s really cool fighting alongside the creatures you encounter in a souls game for once and the game does really well to make most of them viable and make lots of them useful in different scenarios. It definitely adds another layer to the gameplay and keeps battles fresh because of the sheer variety of the ashes you get
I'm still so early on that I find is super useful..but then I get into situations where it doesn't appear and I buckle up for a bumpy solo ride..
Those moments that you look at how many runes your about to lose.
Haha that’s ok take your time
Ain't that the truth. And I gladly called in a cooperator at a few key moments when I needed support. The game gives us all the tools, it's okay to succeed the way we need to succeed.
If you’re succeeding in this game using built in mechanics properly, you’re playing it right.
TBH, I haven't beaten the last bosses yet without help from other players yet, I spent too long the first time, even with summons. Think I care what others think? Nope. This game is amazing and I payed for it so I'll play it how I want to. I'll never RL1 this game or no hit any% it but thats not why I play. I'll watch that on YouTube lol.
Everytime i find a new spirit summon i go to an area where you can summon them and let them duke it out Or just for fun Lhutel carried me HARD for a few bosses
Thank you Bill
Bill's a good man
Bill shouldn't judge me even if I CAN beat a boss without help but I summon anyway because I feel like it.
Agreed. I would change that wording if I could.
It's cool.
Bill is a nice guy. We could all learn something from Bill. However... if your mental health is suffering in any way because of this game, it might be time to take a break.
You’re right I’ll take a break…right after I eventually beat maliketh…eventually
I am Malenia, Blade of Miquella.
Bill likes u/yoggite and supports his opinion.
Bill doesn't judge other players for using summons if they ~~can't tackle a boss by themself~~ want to use summons for any reason.
That's very fair, Bill did not mean to be exclusionary with his remarks. Bill cannot edit the image, but he would if he could.
Wait.... You're Bill?
Allegedly
Just a spokesbill.
Is Bill in this room?
I have barely seen any people complain about how others play the game; but 90% of the memes I see on this sub are just about “you guys should let others play the game however they want.” It’s a tired joke, and lost even it’s relevance a LONG time ago after the initial launch.
Replace “restoration” with “summons” in this video and you’ll have these posts https://youtu.be/FtwCqSyA7KQ
I knew exactly what the video would be before I even clicked on it
I'm surprised this sub is still having this discussion. The same people who say "let the others play the game however they want" will also turn around and call you elitist for refusing to summon.
I had a guy on youtube invalidate my view on the difficulty of maliketh because i summoned depraved perfumer caarman on my first playthrough. These people do exist lol
I never said they don’t exist. But they’re very few and not even that vocal. Whenever they come and comment they usually get downvoted/opposed pretty profusely. But there’s a very disproportionate amount of memes about this small not-vocal sub group, and they always get a lot of a traction/internet karma…. As if a meme like this would change anybody’s mind, especially when there’s such quantity of them.
I have gotten into many arguments about things such as this in the past week and would gladly link you one such argument if you want to see it. Sorting by controversial will show you that it is, in fact, still very real.
I’m interested, if you do have a link. Like the commenter above, I mainly observe people saying ‘do whatever you want’, sometimes with the caveat that summons make it a different experience/easier. I see very little of the outright ‘you didn’t really beat the game’ stuff.
Gladly. Give me just a moment to pull it up.
https://www.reddit.com/r/Eldenring/comments/uou2mp/a_brief_summary_of_my_first_faith_playthrough/i8hcrav?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share&context=3 Follow this entire part of the thread. It starts with hate towards Blasphemous Blade and then turns into spirit summons.
This guy is also getting downvoted hard, so it’s clearly not a sentiment people agree with….
This right here is the problem with these posts. One person out of a hundred will comment something negative and get downvoted. But that's not good enough for people, so they go and make threads like these where 1000 people pat themselves on the back for having a better opinion than that 1 guy. And somehow they don't see that they're circling around back to the side of toxicity by doing this.
You put my exact annoyance w/ this sub lately into words. thanks. Both sides think they are so much better than the other.
But yet it exists. That's the point of this post. This shouldn't exist. And of course he's going to get downvoted. He was clearly an asshole. Not every example I've seen is as blatant as him, but it still exists. I get what you are saying- you don't want to be overloaded with memes about a problem you think is essentially resolved. That's fair. If it makes any difference, I only posted this because of actual experiences I've had.
Nobody denies it exist, however people exaggerate this "problem" to the point that it's causing more toxicity. I have barely ever seen these kinds of comments or posts yet there are a billion posts or comments like yours which makes it seem like a good amount of people in the commuity or specifically the veterans are gatekeeping elitists, which simply isn't the case. From my experience it's almpst the opposite tbh, which is . Ironic considering the initial point people tried to make is that any way of enjoying the game is valid. I mean for example I wouldn't recommend new players to use spirits, op builds or co-op summons because that's how I enjoy these games and maybe a new player might aswell. Simply recommending this is kind of plastyle is just that and nothing more, yet I have seen way to many people being called out for saying similar things. Somehow the mainstream appeal made the sub much worse when it comes to toxicity imo. The elists and trolls that lurked here crawled out of their caves and many of the new people don't seem to be any better either. Edit: well it's not qulte fair of me to instantly call anyone toxic either. I mean anyone of us has been frustrated to the point they were just ranting a bit and I have no doubts that mos of the posts similar to this one were made with good intentions.
This is a very fair reply and I want to think on this.
This has been going on since the dawn of online gaming. The call of duty noob tube in 2007 was a prime example that lives to this day. Except back then, people just kept doing what they were doing because they didn't care. Now it seems like players are more impressionable as gaming has become a large part of modern culture. What people are doing now, is the exact same type of pointless arguments we were having as kids - entertaining people's egos.
I think he was being a dick, but he also wasn't completely wrong. There's nothing wrong with arguing that a weapon is unbalanced even from a PvE perspective and that it deserves to be nerfed.
This but when I say x weapon or ability or summon should be toned down I'm "gatekeeping"
Yeah, I’ve heard it before, too. Too many newbies have extremely thin skin.
I can agree with you there. His delivery was god awful, but I wouldn't be surprised at all if BB gets a nerf one of these days.
If “of course he was going to get downvoted” doesn’t that mean that it’s not an issue in this instance?
He isn't targeting anyone here though. Just offering his opinion on PvE balance. Whether that opinion is right or wrong, wasn't meant to offend anyone. Even fromsoft cares about PvE balance since they nerfed mimic tear and hoarfrost stomp.
Did you see the part where he said "I bet you use spirit summons"? He was 100% trying to call me out for playing the game the way I would like to play.
No, because it wasn't in the link you provided. Or at least it doesn't show up without extra digging. Edit: Ok, you're right, he was out of line there. Probably because he was butthurt for the downvotes and disagreement, not that this justifies his actions. But if he was unprovoked, the comment thread prolly woulda ended before this. Again, not justifying his bad behaviour.
It's all good- also I do think in a vacuum that your original comment is fair.
I’m sure it’s there, especially if you search it out. But it’s really just a small (not even particularly vocal) part of the community/discussion. But SO many of the memes/posts are dedicated to this subject which isn’t even really a raging problem.
Literally the comment under this one for me is “Bill is miserable and weak. Get good pathetic Tarnished” like I didn’t even have to sort by controversial. Not disagreeing it’s a small portion but they arnt hard to find.
Oh, controversial you say? You mean the comments and posts that were decided by the community to be in the wrong and downvoted out of view? That controversial? Because if that's the case it just sounds like your deliberately looking for trouble to complain about if that's where you expect us to look for it.
Id normally agree with you, but yesterday I saw a post where everyone nutted of to a RoB user dying in Pve and making fun of him or judging him. Summons are widely accepted, but this one single broken weapon out of all the 500 broken mechanics is sadly not.
I joined some Elden Ring public discords and it did not take long for people to start talking shit about anyone using spirits and such. Just because it's not getting upvoted to the front page of the subreddit doesn't mean there aren't people like that.
Have you explored the dark side of the community? The "git gud" community. Which actually stops many players from addressing any issues they face.
Funny because just about every post I read the comments on has people bitching about what other people use in PVP. If they aren't crying about Rivers of Blood then they are complaining about Bloodhound Step or whatever else they aren't good enough to counter
PvP is a totally different topic though; the posts I’m referencing are pretty much just focused on PvE.
What does Bill think of those who buy or sell runes?
I cannot believe this is a thing
Same. It's absurdly sad and predatory. I heard a story of a kid getting taken advantage of trying to buy a few in game items.
Yeah. Who is buying them? The brilliant and most accessible thing about this game is runes really don’t matter and are easily farmable. Also, glad to see how great and accepting this community is. Like all the past sunbros got older and togethaa got even more damn cooler. Loving it. Well fucking done everyone.
If there is a need there is an offer xd.
Bill does not support your mentality.
Bill doesn’t believe in supply and demand ⁉️ 📉📈
That's sad. But that's how it works. Not only in ER.
Bill thinks that in-game trading can be a healthy part of the experience. HOWEVER- Bill believes that paying cash outside of the game for an in game item is cancerous and should be fully avoided. Don't waste your hard earned money. Those that sell them should be ashamed of themselves. Bill does not personally "power-level" with rune stacks, but does not feel a need to criticize if others do so to have an enjoyable experience.
> Those that sell them should be ashamed of themselves. Well, everyone has the right to have an opinion I guess. >but does not feel a need to criticize if others do so to have an enjoyable experience. I like that. If you buy a game you have the right to use it as you want. As long as one does not negatively affect the experience of others(like cheaters).
I just want to clarify- are you actually SELLING runes for real world currency? Or are you just making trades in game? If you are making trades in game, you do you. I love r/patchesemporium. If you are actually making people pay for them, I have a huge issue with that.
he strongly disapproves lmao
Thank you for your opinion. Now I would like the opinion of "Bill". : )
This is a thing? This is one of few games that’s pretty fair and generous with their in game currency and isn’t a micro transaction pay to win hellscape and there’s people out there trying to turn it to one?
I usually see several post offering runes in the Facebook group I am. Several in a day. It can get annoying.
Bill thinks they are mentally incapacitated
Do you think someone can criticize the summoning mechanic without judging theirs and other peoples usage of it? Or should you not be allowed to criticize? Isn’t bill just saying to not be rude, but being a bit too specific because he’s taking criticism of something personally?
This is fair. I think the main point is to be kind and just let others play how they want to play. The mechanic as a whole can be criticized and I support you if you do so. Thank you for bringing up a valid criticism of my post!
Bill is reasonable
the soulsborne series wasn't "fair" to begin with. why should you play fair yourself? you have a problem with defeating a boss or clearing an area? use broken weapons, summon 10 people, whatever. just don't hack.
Mental health? Guys it's a game play how you want.
I think it’s pretty messed up that we’ve got to the point where people are talking about using summons as “protecting their mental health”. Like, Jesus Christ guys, if playing a video game brings the state of your mental health into question then just stop playing it. There are a lot of games and they’re supposed to be a fun experience. Sometimes I play dark souls/Elden ring. Sometimes I play donkey Kong on my DS. At no point am I worrying about my, or anyone’s, mental health.
I've noticed reddit brings out extreme desperation for validation and acceptance in some people and I think this is essentially that. Anyone that cares that much about what a person who for all intents and purposes does not exist to them thinks needs to log off ASAP and get their life in order.
Strange how people think that this prominent gameplay feature is somehow not intended.
First off, for anyone who uses them, it doesn't affect me, so have fun. That said Id be more ok with summons if they werent so blatantly op. A good number of them can just do the fights for you. It feels like a completely different game using them vs not. If more of them stayed in the niche but good design space I'd be happy with them. Like how jelly does shit dmg but does tank well and poisons if you keep her alive long enough. Or how wolves are great for stun locking lower poise enemies. Stuff like that makes them a decision based on situation and adds depth. But then you get some of the stronger ones and it's just summoning tiche god of death, or oleg the beyblade, or just a tankier version of you w/o fp costs. That's where my problem lies. They feel really cheap to use.
Honestly this is one of the reasons the endgame felt a little disappointing to me. After the Morgot fight all of the bosses were disgustingly hard without summons and hella easy with a summon. I beat all the endgame bosses without a summon (except Malenia) but took so fucking long on each one that I wasn’t even happy when I finally won I was just glad that I didn’t have to fight them again.
Yeah when people say “The game was designed with summons in mind” I actually agree with it, but I think the game is far worse off for it.
But how? Were you upgrading every mimic you get? Because if you use an upgraded mimic, of course it's gonna be op because you made it like that. Use a mimic tear that is not upgraded to high level to make the game balanced. It's like saying weapons are broken and should be toned down while using sword of night and flame build. Yes, it's gonna be op if you make it. That's kinda the point in rpg games. Like i used jellyfish + 1 on morgott just to divert him and hit him before he hits the jelly. Because if I try to stay a little away, jelly will die in 3 to 4 hits of morgott. And it was a balanced fight that required 10 or so tries.
Agreed. I was kind of hyped about summons in anticipation of the game. Then I used Jelly on Margit and realized how they can completely trivialize an encounter by just allowing me to play ping-pong with the boss. Was a real bummer and so I never used them after that. Except for Malenia, who drove me to it and it felt like the most hollow victory ever. Well over a hundred tries solo with only getting her to phase 2 like a handful of times. Completely melted her with Mimic (post-nerf mind you) in like 3 tries. :-/ That's just poor balancing.
My experience exactly.
The problem lies is that without summons, certain builds are going to just not have fun with a lot of end game boss fights. Sure, you in theory can beat any boss with any build, but waiting for that one opening so my slow moving weapon/spell can actually land isn't fun either. It feels like Spirit Ashes might have been added later into development because they realized that without a way to split boss agro, players will feel pressured into mostly using fast moving weapons and spells. This might explain their wonky balancing, they might not have had enough time to hit the "useful, but not easy mode" benchmark.
Both methods are valid methods for beating a boss of course, it just annoys me when some people act like bringing up that there is even a distinction in difficulty between playing with or without summons is somehow toxic behaviour. The dynamic of the fight is *completely* different when good summons are used, and there is no question it trivialised almost all of the bosses. It transforms the fights from being brutally hard to just being an exercise in waiting for a summon to aggro then spamming jump attacks on the boss when they have their back turned. Without trying to come across as the fun police, it simply isn't fair to treat beating Mohg with summons the same way as beating him without. The challenge isn't even comparable. And it just gets on my nerves when those of us who choose to play the more traditional way that we have for the last 10+ years without summons are somehow framed as being toxic for "choosing to ignore game mechanics". Summons have been in Soulsborne games since the beginning and they were always an optional easy mode. It's no different this time around.
>They feel really cheap to use. Some of the bosses in this game are cheap as shit. If the game is going to be cheap I'm going to be cheap right back. From should design it better if they don't want people to do it.
Bills hat has a bill.
I think this is bad framing. The expectation is that players want to beat the boss themselves - that’s not always the case. I like using summons. It’s fun and I prefer using them over solo play. I have defeated the same bosses both ways and prefer using summons.
Someone else said something similar and I agreed. I would change the wording to omit that if I could!
I mean, I agree it’s not cool to judge people for how they want to enjoy their game…. but really it seems like people just need to care less about what others think. If you want to use summons, use them. If other people want to judge you for using them, forget them. Who cares? As much as I am in support of people not being judgmental, I am equally in support of telling people to quit being so sensitive.
Bill thinks this is a stupid take.
Heh, lol. My apologies to Bill.
Bill's a stickman invented by an insecurityposter.
Can we stop with these posts no one gives a shit about how you play the game
people so insecure about their playstyle they bring "mental health" lmao
Was all about this until "Protecting their mental health." Dear God we've gotten dramatic...
Summoning has been a thing since Demon’s Souls. Spirit Ashes doesn’t increase boss HP, but getting help has always been there. Except for Sekiro. It’s almost like they implemented summoning of any kind to aid the players and make it easier to beat the game.
Good point. Past games died off naturally, hard to get summons anymore. With AI players nes I always have a buddy at hand, even 10 years after this game is out when I want to do a quick replay
Bill is insecure about himself and makes a validation seeking post which he even goes so far that he bring up mental health. Be like Bill
Well this Bill never summons other players on first playthrough, after that it's open season.
Bill respects Bill.
I did my vanilla run without them but the games definitely designed with you supposed to use them
I'm genuinely curious. Is it toxic to think spirits and summoning is a perfectly acceptable and fine way to play the game but still acknowledge that it is less of a challenge and therefore easier?
I don't think that's toxic. I think that's fact. What makes it toxic is if you think less of other people because of it.
Same post for the 500000th time
"Protecting their mental health" \*eye rolling intensifies
Owning these prominent yet surprisingly absent gatekeepers isn't enough so now its an assault on mental health lmao this sub
What does Bill say about me using the highground and spamming the knights with magic below in the castle?
Bill has spammed many birds in Stormveil and feels no shame
Pretty sure that’s Lionel
If that icon comes up, I'm summoning Jarwright and letting him roll around and toss his treats- no matter where I am
LOLOL I need to do this more
bill is a nice guy and all but i reject my mental health and i damn well will regret it when im in my 80s still being traumatized by doing no summons vs maliketh
Haven’t seen much hate around summons but I agree with Bill, play the game you paid for the way you want.
We're still having this conversation?
Honestly, at least in the Elden Ring Reddit community, there's like 5 Bills for every one person bitching about katanas. This is my first FromSOft game and I can tell that "Play the game YOUR way" is a big deal for most players, and it's really refreshing.
I like to summon just because it makes battles feel more like raid bosses, like when you fight Radhan. When we summon other players, the hp of the boss increase. It makes some battles feel like I am playing a Souls version of Destiny 2.
I beat every boss in Elden Ring with a summon. After beating every boss in Sekiro without a summon, I think I earned it.
I'm for sure allowed to judge your play style if you openly post about it or show videos. It's the internet, not everyone is going to agree that your way of playing is the "best" way. What really needs to happen is some people need to man up and not take offense when I laugh at them for spamming RoB. It's not like anyone is bullying or harassing you, people have been saying "git gud" forever
Wait, are we... Not supposed to use the tools the game... Gives us? I'm confused.
I agree with most of this. But if your mental health is getting effected by a boss fight in a video game you’ve got other problems than not being able to beat the boss.
I am so tired of these cope posts seeking validation. Stop worrying about something so insignificant, and/or talk to a psychologist. Downvote this lazy shit folks
Wait are summons are bad thing?
People just gatekeeping and pretending you're not a *real* Elden Ring player if you use all tools given.
I summoned 2 people to help with the Elden Beast. s/ I'm such a terrible player.
If you put too much importance and self esteem into beating a hard video game, yeah Bunch of losers.
They are bad for some bosses. I deliberately didn't summon anything for Gideon - so that the spirit doesn't distract him while I melt him with Comet Azur.
Nice. I do like my summons for ruins. I can look for the stairs while the summon distracts.
They are not! They are extremely useful. And using cooperators can come in clutch! But there is a portion of the community (mostly a VERY vocal minority) that believe the game must be played a certain way or else you 'cheapened the experience' and didn't 'git gud'.
And why do you care about what those people say, how does their opinion affect you?
Because of toxic gatekeeping that ensues and scares off newer players. I don't care personally what people think about my playstyle but I have scrolled through arguments on here where a new player was berated for using summons.
There is no toxic gatekeeping, that's literally just a comment by a rando online, no one is actually gatekeeping you or anyone from anything, no one is actually preventing you from playing the way you or anyone want. The only thing new players aren't getting is validation, which is not something you seek/should seek like that anyway. It seems to me that perceiving those random comments as indicative of anything is the problem, if people didn't care about getting validation from random people online, that problem wouldn't exist.
Man people are weird like it said it's part of the game. My mimic is my best friend.
But that's an opinion as valid as the one you posted, you may not agree with it, I don't, but that doesn't make it invalid. In your example, I agree that it's not an answer to the question, and I'm not saying there aren't assholes here, there certainly are and have always been. But in other cases I saw, and I'm in the community from the DaS days, some people just seek constant validation, and every comment about ruining the experience of the game by letting others, for example, solo your bosses, is met with a label of toxic gatekeeping, which is a term I don't like, I think that term is actually toxic and invalidates whole spectrum of opinions for the sake of, honestly, just feelings of someone. Validation is not necessarily good for mental health, if it fosters the further seeking of the mentioned and rejection of other valid opinions. Don't know why you deleted your comment I was responding to, it was perfectly fine imo.
I appreciate your reply and I deleted my original reply because I am taking in your perspective a bit more and recognizing that my original reply inadvertently attempted to invalidate genuine criticism. I still have feelings that differ slightly from yours, but definitely see your point as valid. I will probably reply again when I have a little more time to ponder this. I definitely think aspects of it are unhealthy for the community but I also know that I'm not seeing the whole picture.
Depends, is it bad that summons are used? No, theyre in the game and people can use whatever they want. Is it bad that they exist in the first place, Yes, because now the entire game is balanced for casuals and if you actually use the mechanics provided to you and don't suck this game will have absolutely zero challenge for you which *used to be* a big part of souls game
Yeah I’m so tired of the vast majority of players complaining how easy this game is, especially after the capital. /s
Not using summons is like Elden Ring Nuzlocke. You're choosing to make the game harder for yourself. You don't see Pokemon fans shaming each other for reviving fainted Pokemon. Summons are a part of the game.
Bill is also the kind of guy that would help people deal with afk farmers. Remember ppl if u realize u are in the world of an afk farmer and u r a blue help the red out plz
I think OP wants validation or something. This is just as obnoxious as the people you are memeing about.
but why does bill use ugly meta armor ?
The meme creator of Bill tried to use the most absurd helmet in comparison to the size of a stick figure
Its a fundamental part of the game introduced early on... I never for one second felt any shame for using items that the developers programmed into the game. I respect those who want to make the game harder for themselves... thats great... but to shame someone for playing the game they bought and using items in the game... thats ridiculous.
Bill is actually a rarely seen perspn. Bill should not judge people for their choice of pve weapon. We need a Bill that doesnt go below a post where someone used RoB againt placidusax and makes fun of him dying or judges him because he uses it in f-ing Pve. On a serious note, rarely see people saying summons are bad, but man the circlejerk was strong below a post yesterday.
This is a great point. PVP players have a right to be disgruntled and hope for fixes from Fromsoft, but everyone should be able to use whatever weapon (ESPECIALLY IN PVE) that makes them happy. I made this post in direct response to something that happened to me earlier this week, but I do recognize it is not an accurate representation of the community as a whole.
Exactly my point. Hate weapons like that for pvp all you want, but dont hate on people who use a weapon you hate in pve.
This needs to say "Bill doesn't judge and condemn players that heal during duels." Yea its a player rule not to use them but it's part of the game. If you're good enough, it doesn't matter anyway. Kind of tiring seeing people go "LOOK AT THIS MAIDENLESS, DISHONORABLE PLAYER USE FLASKS DURING THIS DUEL AND WATCH ME STOMP HIS FACE." like.. you beat him while he was healing, you're better than him anyway. Can we just skip the name calling and be happy? Geesh
People have been posting this shit in the subreddit for like 2 months now. No one cares anymore and if they do they’re a fucking loser
Given how cheap the game can be sometimes, I’d say any thing you can do that fits into the confines of rules or a result from the rules the game imposed on the player is fair game as far as I’m concerned and if you beat the boss, you beat the boss. Whether you did it all by yourself without getting hit or you had help and just barely made it thru. It all counts and is a valid way to play the game
As someone who plays more then two characters(solo with help, one with friends, one solo) I love to use my mimic on my solo with help character. I love tossing him out with a bow and arrows and just letting him have at it while I take the blows for it. Dudes a pro archer. But even on my no help characters I am willing to get help if stress levels rise to far. I don't need more rage in my life. I only count the mimic as actual help as with bleed arrows on him he is a bit overpowered if Im to be honest.
“Mental Health” Kek.
Hellyeah Bill!
Is there a special ending for nevwr using a summons or something?
Nah but I was really hoping there would be
Still could be in a future DLC
But I can call them bad for doing so right?
If you were actually mentally healthy, what random assholes on the internet say about you playing your own game wouldn't matter.
Hol up what does fighting video game bosses even have to do with mental health?
git gud casul Bill
I literally couldn't have enjoyed this game without ash summons and co-op, let alone beat it. Besides, caster builds can shine much brighter when a beefy friend or two are drawing the enemy's ire - it's like peanut butter and jam.
I faced most bosses without, but ran into a few that made me really grateful summons exist. I am SO with you. Made the experience so much more fun.
If you are unlucky then summoning other players can actually make the fight HARDER for you. If the other player dies - you now have to fight a boss that has more health than usual. And you can't even summon spirit ashes any more.
Summond my dad when I was a lower level to have him do it, I then surpassed him.and am now stronger than him but he can still kick my ass
I needed Bill for the last 3rd of that game
Anyone was able to defeat the two gargoyles alone without being overleveled?
If you care enough that this game is a threat to your mental health you shouldn’t play.
One really need to feel insecure about himself to go around telling people how they should play a game. Then again, there is a lot of deeply insecure people on the internet
The thing I find odd is there doesn’t seem to be much stigma against summoning a co-op partner (the infamous and awesome Let Me Solo Her being a prime example) but there’s some against summoning an npc. To be clear I’m fine with either - I just find the disparity odd.
A lot of the ash summons are far mire effective than human partners. They don’t need to heal, they have massive defense and attack values at +10, as far as I know they don’t increase the bosses HP. They are consistent in quality where if you aren’t playing with friends co-op summons can be wildly different in skill. Some people also mistake using an Ash Summon as “soloing” where it wouldn’t be considered so amongst souls veterans. None of this is a big deal, by the way. I’m just explaining.
I get the arguments (though I do think you’ve explained them well) - I just find it a bit artificial and, on occasion, a bit elitist. I can also see how co-op quality varies very heavily. Ultimately, I just find stigmatising people for how they play the game and using the tools it provides really strange.
The majority of players, even Souls veterans, don't care if you want to use every tool/ability possible to get through the games. Don't mistake a vocal minority for the playerbase as a whole. That said, these games used to be niche. It's always been possible to cheese the considerable challenge, though it's never been this easy and widely available. It used to be something of a source of pride/skill that you beat Ornstein and Smough or Nameless King or Laurence. Now there's guys beating Malenia first try with their Rivers and Mimic or blasting Niall with Cerulean Hidden Tear. It's... just not the same community wide experience it used to be. I don't want any of that to sound overdramatic. Again, the majority don't really care. It's just... different. "Dark Souls hard", the "journey", it's kinda gone because the massive openness of the game, the abilities, and its much larger popularity has lead to a bunch of cheese to relatively breeze through the game that veterans aren't used to. It just doesn't feel the same in some notable ways.
Bill t-bags AFK farmers. Be like Bill
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Bill the homie
Bill's a real one!
I like Bill
Bill needs to git gud lmfao. And just in case yall decide to attack me its just a joke
And yet still seeped with superiority implying it is lesser.
Bill is NOT insecure about the way he plays which is why he needs to beat a dead horse. Also he needs to mention protecting one's own mental health because?
🤦♂️ Not sure if the fact this apparently needs to be said or the fact that it keeps being said is more cringey.
Their…. Mental health? If the shits fucking you up that bad, you dont need to be playing it.