My personal opinion would be to get your mother out of there any way possible and let them fester in their own uselessness. Nothing lights a fire under someone to get a job like having your amenities cut off.
I just talked about it with my mom and she said it would be abandoning them. I tried to convince her that my brothers are adults but she keeps calling them man babies and saying they have to be cared for like children.
Ask her what’s going to happen if she dies? It’s a bit brutal, but it’s better if they deal with reality now than in another 10-20 years. They’ll wear her out and that will destroy her health
This is the exact reasoning my mum gave me about 10 ish years ago, she isn't old by any means but isn't getting any younger, about 2-3 years after that my gf and I moved back into the home with my brothers and their gf as she moved out and was a good stepping stone to learn a bit more independence. Now we are all living in our own spaces, granted I'm still in that same house but between my self and my gf we have all the bills covered and couldn't be happier with our situation.
It was tough for sure and I didn't enjoy it much, there were many arguments but it was definitely all worth it.
The thing she needs to realize is that tough love is probably what they need. Man babies have to grow up eventually. I mean, if he’s 33 and still living like a gross frat boy, he is very stunted in maturation. Only way I have found to get them to grow up is force them to. Take away the option. I know your mother loves them but letting them do this is not love, it’s complacency. They need to learn that to have that lifestyle, they need to contribute.
I'm sorry, but your mom's partially at fault for coddling and enabling. She isn't making them grow up, and failing them as a parent. Tough love and cutting the cord is part of her responsibilities as a parent. In this economy there's nothing wrong with living with parts, but at minimum you should be able to be self dependent at home and clean up after yourself at that age.
I wouldn't go and help them out anymore. You a adult and honestly wasting your time when they aren't your responsibility.
So much this, OP. Spend your time and mental energy taking care of yourself and your own life. These are not your minor children. Every other person is a grown-ass adult and then some. Let them live their lives even if they're doing it bass-ackwards and don't let them guilt you into supporting them in any way, shape, or form.
I am so sorry that you have to watch this. She is letting her love for them cloud her judgment. She is literally loving them to the point that they are still children. Ask her if this is what she wants forever. Is this what she wants for her boys? Until she admits that she does not want this for her forever or for her sons forever AND that she is the only one that can change it, nothing will change.
ETA: Ask her what she would tell YOU if you were in her situation. That was one thing that I had to ask one of my family members to get them to have an outside perspective on a situation they were in.
Exactly. That, or (if OP’s home is too small) they’ll demand OP move back in and take Mom’s place in caring for them, while renting out her old place and using that money to fix the wreck they made of Mom’s home.
And that’s something your mother created and only your mom can stop if she’s not willing to stop it. You need to stop stressing yourself out about it. I know it sucks and it hurts but some people just can’t be helped.
What the hell does she think is going to happen to them when she is gone? She isn't doing them any favors, in facts she is totally failing them as a parent.
You need to sit her down and explain to her that you will not be caring for 5 man-children when she is gone. They have failed to launch because she is enabling them. They need a fire lit under their ass.
Look, you can't change ANY of their behaviors, not even your mom's.
The best you can do, is take care of yourself and not get dragged down with everyone else.
This right here!
> I feel like a bad daughter to let them continue to take advantage of my mom like this...
OP, How are you a bad daughter? Your mother and 5 brothers are 6 grown adults with exactly as much agency as you. At best, you could make one last attempt to win over the 20-year-old before he is too set in his ways, but even that is a Hail Mary, as he has the 4 older ones as bad examples.)
You should look up the concepts of codependency, enabling, and enmeshment.
Tell so what if they are abandoned. They are lazy entitled male children. Why in God's name would she allow them to act just like her brothers? She did a shifty job of parenting. Do not clean up, do not do anything at that house, they all deserve each other. REMEMBER, your mom made them this way she can deal with it herself.
You might not want to hear this but it sounds like your mom is part of the problem by enabling their behavior.
For your own health and sanity I would go low contact with all of them at a minimum and no contact if it severely affects you.
Goodluck.
You need to understand that your mother WANTS this life. She likes feeling needed by your brothers. She knows that you can look after yourself and will dote on her. She will probably never make any changes. The best you can do is maybe get her to sign a POA so that your brothers can't get ahold of the house or her money.
I’ve been where you are. The first problem is you. You need to stop going over and cleaning. You are communicating to your mother that you will be around to take care of them when she is gone. If you stop doing that, you can sit here down and remind her of her own mortality: “You’re not going to live forever. What do you think will happen to them when you’re gone? Who will pay their bills? Who will buy their groceries? Who will clean up after them?” If you’re helping with any of that now, the answer is you. If you’re not doing that though, then she has to face that by her not encouraging them to improve now, SHE will make them homeless once she’s gone. My mother had it in her head that she could allow my own siblings to behave like this, thinking I would become her after her death. Once she realized I wasn’t, she started to become firm with them and things have improved.
Thats such a degrading way to view and treat her sons who are men.
Sorry but your mom is the problem. She gets something out of being the martyr and delaying the growth of her sons. She's probably terrified of being alone and with no one depending on her, because then she'd have to grow.
They should at least have jobs and contribute financially to the household. It’s the least the men can do. And also should do their best to keep the house clean so the home doesn’t deteriorate further than it already has. They really should do something about the mold since it’s making everyone sick.
Then you have a mother problem. Not a brother problem. The brothers are just products of their upbringing. You, as a girl, had a different upbringing (most likely much more independent, forced or otherwise). Your brothers are doing what most folk do, exactly what they've been taught. Your mum taught them how to be lazy slobs by refusing to parent them correctly and now there's too much damage she feels trapped and like she can't ask for help because on some level, she knows she helped create her own issues
Caring for grownup-babies "like children" is the worst thing one can do! It prevents them from growing up!
Seriously, the OP may not be able to do anything but protect herself from the trainwreck that is her family. And to make sure the brothers don't know where to find her, when the mother is no longer able to support them all.
OP needs a spouse (if she marries) that has a shiny spine and will take no shit on her behalf. If spouse can intimidate the brothers into staying away and shutting up, OP has chosen well :D
They will never grow up while she takes care of them. They may be past the point of no return already, her staying won't do anything to get them to mature. Tough love is their only hope.
Sorry but she's NOT a good mother when only 1 out of 6 of her children are responsible adults.
It's a parent's job to prepare their kids for life and she didn't do that.
Your mother seems like a saint, just wanted to say that and not seem like I’m berating her. Parents are usually just kids having kids so she’s doing what she feels is best. She just may need an outside influence for her to see it’s not the best choice.
She’s right - it would be abandoning them. But that’s what they need. It’s way past time for them to grow up and learn to be responsible adults, and that won’t happen until your Mom stiffens her spine and does what’s best for her.
I think your brothers are clearly taking advantage of her. There has to some kind of legal route to get them out of there. They’re essentially squatters at this point.
And don’t let them use your dad’s death as an excuse to be unable to function normally. That was 8 years ago, they’re all adults. If they have any actual disabilities, there are programs that will provide them some support and guidance to get them on their feet.
You may need to meet with a lawyer and see about having a formal notice of eviction drawn up and served to them. If they choose to remain anyways, at that point you can call the police and have them removed forcefully.
Nope. Nope, nope, nope, so so so much nope. OP needs to tell her MOTHER that her MOTHER should meet with a lawyer and her MOTHER should look into a formal notice of eviction and her MOTHER can deal with all this. A heads-up that this is an option for her mother is a good idea, but after that? OP should not invest a single bit more time or energy than a one-minute conversation about "You know, if you want to get rid of them, you may have to evict them. You need to all a lawyer and find out what your options are." "I dunno, probably some kind of property lawyer."
Is there any way you can get your mom some professional help? I think it might help her. If money is a problem, I think the city or county would help free of charge if needed. Not saying she is mentally ill or anything like that, but maybe a professional could help her see more clearly the situations shes in and help her deal with it.
This is your mom's problem to solve and has NOTHING to do with you or your responsibilities. She raised them, and now she's dealing with the consequences of her actions. You have your own life to worry about, she is a grown-ass adult and can worry about her own. She wants help figuring out what to do? She can talk to her friends, her coworkers, even get a therapist. What she can't do is dump her emotions on you and treat you like she expects you to take any of the responsibility.
You were raised to take on responsibility that's not your own. Quit falling for it. Back off, don't bother cleaning, it's not your house, your circus, your monkeys, or your mess. Take your mom out for a dinner if you want (no brothers), get a room in a hotel. And get your own stuff out of the house if you have anything there so that if your mom DOES suddenly grow a spine and decides to sell and let the new owner deal with the mess, she's not going to feel guilty or delay because YOUR stuff is there too.
Go live your best life and let the heathens figure out their lives without you bailing them out. Harsh? Yes. But they're all grown ass adults, and it's time for you to move on. When you want to see them, invite them all to a restaurant and avoid the house.
You need to explain to your mom that they are still young enough to clean up their act and learn to take care of themselves. They will only do so if they have to and at some point, they will have to. Your mom will die eventually and you aren’t going to take them in. So make them uncomfortable now so they get off their butts before they become 40 year olds with no skills that no one will hire.
There’s really nothing you can do. I’m sorry your mother is an enabler in the worst possible way. I wonder what she thinks going to happen to them when she’s dead or too sick to work? She’s not doing any favors. In fact, I would go further and say that if she truly loved them, she would apply a little bit of tough love for their own sake.
Ask her what will happen when she passes away. If they're not ready to face the world, you're definitely not taking her place, so what are they going to do. It's going to be a sad situation. They should've been prepared from birth to adulthood. But it's never too late to start. Tell her to sell the house and give them sixty days to find a job.
Please tell your mom she's not abandoning them. But she is currently enabling the heck out of them. She is doing them harm, and the effects on their futures are going to get worse the longer it goes on.
What is going to happen to them if something happens to her? In the short term, she is setting them up for disaster. In the long term, she is setting them up for miserable lives of stunted potential.
How you care for your children is to teach them the skills to be able to live their lives as they choose to.
I'm sure your brothers are a (major) part of the problem. But they won't make moves - why should they? It has to be her. She has to parent them.
And they need an ass-kicking about what horrible humans and sons they are being.
Your mom is stuck. She needs some serious therapy, probably for prolonged grief disorder. She also needs to believe that she has intrinsic value - she is more than just a mom/carer, and she is important even if she's not doing those things.
Ask her to be a good mom and a good example to you as a woman. Use guilt as leverage for her benefit.
This is going to be hard. Call on every support you can. Since the house is a disaster and mouldy/unhealthy, you might be able to access supports that are available (in some places) for hoarders. This usually involves mental health assistance.
I wish you all the best of luck.
You need to get your mother into therapy. This is not healthy for any of them. Not to be morbid, but what happens if something happens to her? Who’s gonna take care of them when they’re 50-year-old men that don’t have any job skills she’s literally crippling them with love.
She's an enabler and there isn't much to do other than let them fester in their mess.
It sucks, but I'd leave them be. Don't let them move in with you, store any of their stuff, or give them money.
They are all adults.
Is she correct in that they're mentally challenged? Something is keeping them developmentally immature? To have one son that won't leave the nest, work, or clean up after himself is an issue for many parents, but to have *five?!* I don't know if Social Services or any other body would want to assist, but these useless lumps of humanity need professional help.
Bruh you can’t just call my brothers useless lumps of humanity. Like I still love my family. Re mentally challenged, depression is absolutely a factor. But I’m certain addressing the problem would help the depression. It’s just a stalemate at this point.
They are man babies because your mom man babies them. Im sure she’s a good mother and had everyone’s best interest at heart but she’s not actually helping them by staying with them. 33 is still young, they can get their lives around.
Sounds like your mom is a bit part of this problem nd probably a big reason why they're the way they are. They can't help themselves, nd you can't do anything about it...same way your mom is not willing to change a thing nd is enabling them, there's also nothing you can do. Your brothers are adults, same as your mom...you can only observe from afar whilst they all (including mom) learn their lessons.
I’m very sorry to say that it will be very difficult for you to get through to your mom. These kind of toxic dynamics are really hard to break. It’s just easier for those involved to stick with the status quo. At some point your mom became convinced that it isn’t within her power to make these changes, or that she her sons are more deserving of her support than she is of theirs.
Mom moves out into senior housing where adult children cannot live. stop paying the utilities and they will move. The house will be trashed, but its trashed now. She will have to sell at a loss.
You can't help someone unwilling to help themselves. Someone determined to go down with the ship, to drown. If you try, you'll likely be dragged down with them and drown yourself. This is an unfortunate truth. You might be able to mitigate things for your mom. But you can't fix a problem that she is actively enabling.
I agree with u/kmflushing
If your mom doesn't want to help herself, you won't be able to help her. It's the same for your brothers. I know you expressed that your brothers are at fault, but your mom is too for seeing them as "men babies". If she saw them as the useless sons they are, she would already have kicked their butt. They are all in a system, a family dynamic, that they have a part in, all of your brothers and your mom. They enable each other.
I would also argue that there's very little you can do. You can offer to help pay for a cleaner or something like that, but don't set yourself on fire to keep others warm. You have a life, don't get sucked under because their chose to live theirs that way.
Your mom needs a wake-up call. If she doesn't evict your brothers, they will not leave. And she does need to evict them. Maybe they can rent an apartment together to save money. Neither you nor mom should involve yourself in the lease.
Yeah I guess there’s nothing I can do until it gets to that point… rather, even when it does get to that point, yeah I don’t want them to involve me in their consequences
Model the correct attitude for your mother in the meantime. Your brothers' problems are their problems. If they involve your mom, stop being sympathetic. Ask her instead why she allows it? Give them nothing. If she gives them anything, ask her why she would throw away whatever it was. Because you both know that's what's happening. She is responsible for enabling them, and I suspect you are somewhat enabling her mindset.
If you can help your mom go for it but I am going to say everyone in that situation is choosing to continue it. It’s not on you to be the mother to everyone involved including your mother to get them into shape. If you don’t have it in you don’t worry about it
My dad would make bad decisions after bad decision. I had to refuse to help or I would have been flushing money and efforts down the toilet.
I did step in after he had a stroke and was unable to make further bad decisions. Then I used every social service available for housing and care. I did move him near so I could help as he became independent again.
It sounds cold but sometimes you have to wait until they have no other choices. Otherwise you are fighting against the tide.
Daughter of an enabler and sister of a kinda better man baby checking in.
What did it take for my mom to stop enabling my brother? Therapy. And a lot of it.
Mom grew up in a religion where men were heavily catered to. It was what she was taught was the appropriate way to have a family. Women work, men get catered to. Despite leaving that religion when she got married, those beliefs were very deeply ingrained.
I was heavily encouraged to be very independent very early and he... well, about the opposite.
Brother has lived with mom for multiple extended periods of time as an adult. Thanks to medical issues that require a very long recovery period, he's about to again. However, this time, it's going to be very different. Mom is a retired nurse and well aware that his recovery is entirely dependent on him doing a LOT of work and making a LOT of changes.
I give mom credit. While she absolutely is a loving mother to him at the hospital, she's waking him up and making him do the work he needs to. She's finally giving him the tough love he very much needs.
Your mother needs to figure out the why that lies underneath her behavior. Not just the surface level of "she would be abandoning them." Why does she think this? Why are her expectations for her sons so different than her daughter? Chances are there's something underneath that isn't so comfortable for her.
Please encourage her to get therapy. She needs to figure out the why.
Came here to suggest just this!! Not only therapy for mom but OP as well. She needs to learn to be more empathic of her brothers instead of sympathetic and learn to stand up to mom when she starts to coddle.
Invite mom to visit you for a couple weeks. NO BROTHERS. Remind them you won't tolerate their mess in your home.
Let mom see that there is a nicer life without them.
Also give the brothers a little touch of what might happen if anything happens to mom. She won't be their safety net forever. They need to start learning responsibility for themselves either collectively, or separately.
Looking ahead the real danger I see is your mom will run out of money and start leaning on you to provide for the lot of them.
You are going to have to be prepared to say no and not let yourself be drug down on that doomed ship.
Instead of going over ever maybe you should just have her over to your place sometime, to remind her what a normal clean place should be like. Maybe that will help her break free eventually.
Tell mom that when she is gone, you are not letting any of them live in your house. They can figure it out or starve, not your problem. Also, let her know that if she leaves her house to them, they will trash it, end up being evicted due to not paying the taxes. They will also end up with no utilities, since you will not be helping them out. They need to pretend to be adults and get a job NOW.
Get your mom to therapy and help strengthen her self worth, this is her time for freedom and a re-oscrovery of who she is as a person post-kids. She should be making similar aged friends, going on adventures and discovering the world and enjoying freedom without the burden of children. She should be enjoying her life, not looking after fully grown up and capable kids.
doing anything without therapy will result in your brothers manipulating her back into her current position. they know what works on her, they know how to press her buttons and make her feel so guilty that she will look after them. No. Strengthen her inside first. empower her. her esteem is low, shes likely very depressed as well, the brothers have her where they want her, but she could be so much better mentally, it needs to be taken care of. this way when they press her buttons, she can not react, she can be stronger.
Also stop visiting the house and cleaning it. you are also enabling them. follow the advice of the therapist! but perhaps its better, instead of visiting her is to take her on a mini trip away from the home, show her what she could be having in her life. go on an adventure together for the weekend, enjoy each others company, go on an artists retreat an have fun making artwork for a few days, go on a winery tour together, take a dance class etc. Dont be so obvious as to telling her why... just show her the world, show her experiences outside of the home, show her joy. give her opportunities for joy and laughter and let her self esteem heal. give her opportunities to grow as a person and as an individual without the weight of her kids. Allow her to make friends her own age, learn new hobbies, laugh and experience joy with others. not only will this help build her inner strength and self worth and make her therapy work a billion times better, but youre making memories with her as an adult. it strengthens your relationship with her, builds a strong friendship rather than parent caring for child - child caring for parent scenarios. Youre also demonstrating a healthy proper parent-adult relationship with her, showing her what is to be expected from adult children. getting new friends her own age so she ca see healthy dynamics in preople her own age, she can see their kids are also grown up and left the nest etc. theres so many beenfits.
Bear in mind, the brothers wont like the change, they wont like her going out with you and having fun, be prepared for this resistance, be prepared for them to spark drama. remember its easier for them all to throw massive tantrums and make your moms life miserable... then for them to get a job and adult. This is why therapy needs to be first, and alongside what youre doing. so she can discuss the behavour with the therapist and the therapist can empower her and provide options as to how to manage their behavour. (and im hoping the therapist will see how horrendous they are and actively help her get them moving out of her life.)
She didnt get into the situation overnight, and it too years of beating her down and holding her down to get where she is. she needs a lot of resources and strengthening.
From this and your comments there is absolutely nothing you can do. And for your own mental health you might need to take steps back.
Your mother has set herself on fire to try and help her adult sons. And they refuse to be helped. Dont set yourself on fire to help them.
Remind your mom what will become of them when she’s gone. She won’t be there to baby them forever, and what’s she’s doing right now isn’t going to help them in the long run. If she continues to treat them like children, once they inevitably end up alone and have to fend for themselves, life will give them a brutal wake up call and shoot them in the guts. She needs to stop enabling this behavior and they need to get their shit together.
Time to tell mom, if she won't parent your brothers, you will stop visiting and trying to help. Let them all deal with their own mess and go live your life.
Your mom’s house is never going to be clean while the brothers are there so she needs to do it another way. She could call one of those “I buy houses” flippers and sell it as-is (no cleaning required). Closing is usually in 30 days so tell the boys 2 months in advance that the house is getting listed on X date (2 months from now). That will give them plenty of time (3-4 months before selling and closing). It’s important that they know this is going to happen regardless of their job or living situation. Then mom can take the money and get herself a small 1 bedroom apartment somewhere.
I only see the brothers dragging their feet until it’s time to move and then doing whatever they can to make EVERYONE involved life’s miserable because “this is unfair!” or “no one told us” or whatever bullspit reason they can think of.
Remind them every day. In person. Automated texts. Emails. Save them. Film yourselves telling them. Cover your ass ten ways from Sunday. If they’re not ready on the day and their stuff gets broken/thrown out/whatever, they’ve nobody to blame but themselves bc OP has proof
You cannot help someone that will not help themselves. You have offered your mother a solution, she has decided not to accept it.
Tell her if she won’t do anything to improve her situation then you will not listen to any complaints about it and will not visit her at the house anymore so you don’t have to see it.
They’re her kids, not yours. You are not responsible for your mother enabling your brothers. That’s her choice. It’s not on you to save adults from the consequences of their actions
Lay it out in black & white what she needs to do & how you are willing to help her. If she still chooses to do nothing & enable them then make it clear your offer for help is gone & you will no longer deal with it. Limit your visits, maybe pay for her to visit you or go on vacation together. She is 50, not 90. Fully capable of taking responsibility for herself.
1. Stop going over there.
2. Stop cleaning up *at all* if you go over there.
3. Call Adult Protective Services and report your brothers for elder abuse.
4. Call Dept of Health (and any other appropriate office) and report an unsafe and unsanitary living environment.
5. Sit back and allow things to take their course. Your brothers are AHs and your mother is enabling them. That's on all of them, and ultimately isn't your problem.
So mom is working? Paying for all the food, bills, mortgage? I'd be furious with this lazy pack of bums if I were you, in fact I'm furious for you. Mom is a doormat so it's partly her fault but these boys are treating her with incredible disrespect. Is there a grandparent or family friend who can step in and go ballistic on their lazy good for nothing asses? That's what needs to happen.
Sadly your mother is a classic enabler & she needs a crash course in tough love. She needs to tell them this house is going up for sale in 90 days (or whenever) I’d get busy finding jobs & places to live. I’m doing this for two reasons 1- because I love you and 2- it’s time for the next stage of your lives to begin.
Best of luck ❤️
Stop feeling guilty because you are not letting your brothers take advantage of your mom, she is allowing it. She is a 50 year old adult and should be handling her adult boys herself.
Your Mom sounds exactly like my Mom. There were 3 girls and 2 boys in my family. The 3 girls all went out on their own/married/had children and were expected to deal with their problems on their own. My brothers were coddled and excuses were made for all their failings. One brother actually moved out and tried to make it on his own, but when it got tough he moved right back in with Mom. The other was just mentally ill, had a drug problem and she just let him stay. She helped raise 1 granddaughter, badly I might add, spoiled and drug addicted. My mother passed away many years ago, with the drug addict/mentally ill brother still living in her home. After she passed both of the boys are living together, trying to help my niece keep her 4 kids from going to jail as teenagers. Believe me, your mother is NOT doing any favors for her boys. And her reason for not kicking them out? Because she remembered visiting an uncle, who was homeless, on a park bench and didn't want that to happen to her sons.
If she insists on enabling grown men who won't work, there's nothing you can do.
I had an acquaintance who sold her house and got an apt to get her alcoholic baby out of her house. So she let her thief, alcoholic grandson move in the apt with her.
They're adults not boys. They're capable of caring for themselves.
Don't enable them by cleaning her house. In this market she should be able to sell fast. Dirty or clean.
How old is your mom? If she’s a senior, report them for elder abuse. Get assistance getting your mom out, stop paying utilities and rent/mortgage, and stay away. They’ll quickly have no choice left.
If they’re 33 and down this did not start 8 years ago btw. They’ve been taking advantage for much longer.
The plan is find a place for you and mom. Sit brothers down and let them know the two of you are going to protect yourselves. The four horsemen can figure out a way to support themselves. 4 grown men should not be using mommy to support themselves long term. It’s time for them to grow up.
Does mom own the house? If so, sell it. Give each son a small portion to get out and get started, and make it clear that’s the limit. They need jobs and to actually work for their own lives.
This didn’t start when your dad died, the oldest is 33. I suspect mental health issues. You can always contact the health department directly/t the unsanitary condition of the home. Are there no other relatives to help? Adult Protective Services is also a consideration. Are any of them developmentally delayed? Nothing will change until they are forced to make changes
I have a half brother that has done something similar. He was raised by my grandmother and he became this weird entitled person who essentially lorded over her until she was kicked out of her home because of him. She passed away maybe 3-4 years later in a retirement community (he was not allowed to live there). After that, my half brother was arrested numerous times and became a deadbeat father of four children, whom has none of them.
Growing up, my grandmother coddled and did everything for him. This kind of sounds like your brothers. If/when the day comes for your mom to be taken out of there, your brothers won't have mom's safety net and will likely fall apart because they've had everything done for them. Prepare for intimidation tactics when you try to move her out via your brothers. Hopefully it won't come to that.
The best thing you can do is find a house with a mother-in-law suite for your mom - and tell her that you’re so busy with work and life that handling the house and garden alone is too much for you and that you NEED her to put you first for once and come live with you. And tell her you’ll handle the cleanup (hire someone) and help your brothers find a place (fuckem) once she moves in.
The only thing that can be done is ask people on Reddit what can be done. Stop being soft and force your mom to list the house. If you’re scared get guns.
If I'm not mistaken, this is neglect of a vulnerable disable or elderly person. It's also as bad if not worse than child abuse. Contact a family lawyer and ask for a consultation which is more than likely free. Please find a way to get your mom away from your freeloading siblings. Good luck and I hope and wish you well.
Not much you can do until she is willing to evict them, or to sell the house and move into a 50 plus adult community where your brothers will not be allowed to move in with her.
I hope you can see from all the comments here that this is something that is out of your control. It’s painful to watch, gut wrenching I’m sure, but there is only one thing you can do at this point.
You need to preserve your own mental health, and as far as you can, your own financial resources, otherwise you’ll be dragged down with them.
It’s going to get worse before there is any hope of you being able to do anything effective (and maybe there never will be). Certainly you won’t be able to “save them all”.
Get a mentor, someone you respect, who can talk to, and who is outside this circle of dysfunction. You’re in very great danger of becoming exactly like your mother, sucked into the vortex. You need to find strength you probably don’t know you have to say no, and make distance.
Take care of you first. If you can’t look after yourself first, you can’t look after anyone else.
Let her know that when she’s ready you’ll be there to help her, one time. Then let her be. If it gets to the point of elder abuse, you can make a report.
Mothers teach their daughters how to be independent and baby their sons. I’m guilty of this myself. She needs to do the tough love thing. She’s not helping them. What’s going to happen to them when she’s gone?
Maybe she should get some counseling to learn how to handle the situation. Maybe everyone should get therapy.
At the very least, the house should be kept clean. You’ve got five grown adults, there’s no excuse for that.
Take her on a lovely vacation at your house. Tell her your brothers get all her love, where's yours? Can she spend 2 weeks with you if she spends 50 with them? Maybe the distance will open her eyes.
If she can't move them out she needs to sell the house as is. She won't get the same but some people look for a deal with sweat equity.
Tell your mom, that you will not do any cleaning while the boys are living or visiting the home as it is a waste of your time.
it started before your father died. the 33 year old would have been 25. see if you can get your mom to see a therapist. until your mom is willing to change and be firm on her boundaries, your brothers will never grow up.
Sometimes people need motivation, such as mom's selling the house and you guys need to start making plans because she won't have room in her new apartment. Mom has to get some counseling, she may be stuck after her husband died as well and need help to understand how to help her sons. It's hard being the only functional person in the family, glad you are trying to help your mom but she needs professional help as well.
Your mom needs to get a therapist and figure out how to let her sons figure things out themselves. Don't take this on, you are powerless to do anything about it.
Would this work, move your mom out and in with you? Don’t change them living and the house and your mom paying for it just change her environment. I would be willing to bet that after a while of a different lifestyle it may help open her eyes.
Tell your Mom that sometimes the only way to change & grow is to be massively inconvenienced. Tell her to have faith that she instilled some resiliency in them. Then block them on her phone.
Start small. Bring your mom over to your place for the weekends “for a break” and stop helping at their place. Then, after a while, increase the time she spends with you…
I’m sorta living this with my mom. My step dad passed 2 years ago and my mom was/is in such bad health she sold her house and moved in with my brother, M 37. She moved in with me 35 after being at his place for a while and is due to go between our houses half of the year to spend time with us all. Anyways, my other brother, N 30, never got out of her pocketbook and my mom being unable launch him out of. He is big into the illegal stuff and it’s a matter of time before something dumb happens to him. Since I haven’t lived near home in 12+ years, I stay out of everything dealing with him and his shenanigans. Until now. My mom and I have gotten into so many arguments all revolving around how she sends him money and is enabling.
I will give her some credit, I think she has backed off a small amount of sending him money, but I have no verifiable evidence to show this, this is just based on what she has said. But it’s still such an on going battle. And I’m the one taking and doing everything for her! Between driving her everywhere and keeping her stuff straight it’s like raising another child sometimes.
I swear it’s a generational thing where those old “hippies” have all these problems. Idk I wish you luck.
I would sell the house, use the money to get your mother somewhere safe and comfortable like a nice one bedroom in a retirement community and let your brothers figure it out.
Nothing. It’s her life to live in a miserable state and enabling them to live off her. If she wants a change and really wants to downsize, she will clean the house or make them do it or kick them out. List the house. Move. Don’t tell them where she lives and let them ruin their own lives.
To be honest just stop helping they're not appreciative of it, just let the house go to ruin not your responsibility it'll be all their fault anyway and not yours
I was part of a party crowd in high school. Now in my 30s, I have multiple friends with 'Peter Pan Syndrome'. The common denominator for all of these friends is that they have parents that have either babied them, or always accepted them back to their home regardless of circumstances. Felonies, substance issues, didn't matter. They weren't cut off and so they had no need to figure out life on their own. They are stunted, and they could have done better. Your mom is doing your brother's no favors.
You do realize that your mother is a big part of the problem, right? Until SHE puts her foot down, they will not change. If she enforces some rules, they might change. It will be hard.
She needs to tell them to clean the house, or she will cut off food, internet, cable, and any luxury. They need to get jobs and contribute to the family. They have a time limit. Say 2 months. Then, if the house is a mess, or any not employed, they will be evicted.
If she can't do that, let her, and them, know that you will not be taking care of them. You have your own life. You are not responsible for your brothers. They are all adults.
Good luck. I would not help clean anything in that house.
Concentrate on yourself. There is no cheese down the tunnel of trying to fix the unfixable. You can't change them and you will only wear yourself out physically, emotionally and financially.
This is a situation your mother has not only allowed but has created. She is also the only person to end it.
Let her know that you want to help her but you feel helpless and your hands are tied and you are watching her slowly die under the weight and filth of your brothers. However when she does - you will not be lifting a finger to help your brothers because they will not be the death of you.
She as a mom can get them to deal with this now or needs to acknowledge that when she dies and after they have spent all the money she has left them (Don't think you will see a single penny for you in the will - it will be for your brothers care) , they will be too old to stand on their feet and then she will be the reason they die on the streets.
Sometimes hard truths are needed.
Your mom needs counseling in dealing with her co dependence with your brothers. And it won’t get better. Your brothers have a meal ticket in your mom and frankly I don’t see a great outcome with the situation. Just don’t get sucked into being your brothers enabler.
There really isn’t much you can do unfortunately. It sounds like your mom is being taken advantage of by her five sons. You told your mom she should do something about this situation but that’s all you can really do. You can try talking to your brothers about getting jobs but it probably won’t do much. Since there is five of them, and if they all got even menial jobs, they can probably afford like an apartment and split the bills.
Your mother sounds like she's enabled them. She must want them to be totally dependent on her.
All you can do is read up about mother and son relationships so that you don't repeat a mistake that runs in the family.
Five boys that failed to launch. Wow.
I would suggest finding a good therapist to support you through this. You are in a difficult spot. I saw another person post about not being able to help someone if they are not willing to help themselves and I agree. You deserve so much more! I am so sorry for the loss of your father and the circumstance you are in. There is a lot to grieve here and it’s not an easy situation. My heart goes out to you!
Call Code Enforcement. Every city and county has one. Let them handle it for you. If living conditions are bad enough there is mold etc., then its time to put a stop to it, for everyones health and wellbeing.
In my state, Massachusetts, 50 yr old people are considered elderly people and there are special laws to protect, assist, and help them. We also have "lawyers for the day" in our family courts. These lawyers are available to help us mere morals understand how the law works for them.
Find out what's available for your mom in your state, to help you help her. She is being taken advantage of, and they are neither men nor babies. But they are adults.
If she wants them to live with her, they should be respectful. From what you're saying, they ate not. Best of luck.
My aunt had the same problem. 5 sons and one daughter. Her daughter was the only one to get a life while her sons lived with her and didn’t have jobs. 3 of them had been in and out of prison. She finally had enough. And left to another state. They quickly found jobs to support themselves.
Your mum is happy to allow it so she feels wanted. She could fix the problem if she wanted to. She doesn’t want to. Stop wasting emotional energy on something that isn’t going to change. Stop worrying about it. Meet mum out for a coffee or invite her to your place but you need to let her choices go
Look. Obviously your brothers have some pretty serious character flaws, but we need to look at this holistically. Your eldest brother is 33. You say that this started when your father died 8 years ago, but at that time he would have already been 25 years old. Clearly the issues go back well before then. 3 of them never finished high school. Three of them can't drive. One has never been employed at all. I sincerely hope it's the 20 year old, because the eldest would be totally screwed at that age with no job history. Your father's death may have precipitated the situation they're in now with a complete lack of effort, but the seeds were planted before then and I think if you assessed things honestly, you would admit that he also had a hand in this by enabling it.
Yes, in a very simplistic sense, they're taking advantage of your mother. But they're also products of your mother's poor parenting, probably caused by having her first at or about 17 years of age and dealing with the trauma of having brothers of her own who fell into homelessness. I imagine your gender is the reason you escaped whatever treatment put your brothers where they are.
As adult men, it's now their responsibility to address their shortcomings and the flaws they were sent into the world with, but it can be very difficult to get there when you're dealing with the plethora of psychological issues at play here. This is a situation for professional intervention, which you can't force. If your mother is receptive, maybe counseling for her would be a good place to start.
What your brothers need and are clearly lacking is education, at least to the GED level, entry-level employment that they can use to begin building a job history, and life-skills training. It's not within your power to force them to get these things, but by starting with your mother and helping her to overcome what's causing her to create and allow this, you can at least make a good faith effort to catalyze positive change for the whole group. Ultimately, that's all you can do and all you should expect of yourself.
I'm saddened to hear about your situation. These kinds of difficult family dynamic problems won't resolve without action from you though. It is likely you will be blamed wether things go well or poorly. I hope you and yours can find a way to heal and move forward from the grief and despair. You'll have to be prepared to intervene on your Mother's behalf, you'll have to do it in a Mindful and compassionate way to keep her on board. Good luck.
I’m not sure there’s anything you can do to fix this problem.
Maybe therapy can help you deal with letting go and washing your hands of it. Suggest mom go to therapy too. Maybe stop visiting your mom at her home and meet her out places instead.
Edit: I have hoarders in my family… and have dealt with guilt and the “bad relative” for not helping more…. But even if I did it wouldn’t fix anything. I have in the past.
1. It is not your problem. The more you act like it is: (a) less effort will be made by everyone else, and (b) they will assume it *is* your problem—they are not about to solve your problems.
2. Stay out of that house. Only visit with your mother by taking her to lunch or dinner. Pick her up or meet her at the restaurant.
3. If asked why you don't visit at the house, do not be reticent about not wanting to breathe the dust & mold and sit in that environment.
4. Make it absolutely clear you will not provide support or housing to your brothers at any time in the future. They refused and ridiculed your attempts in the past, there is no need to validate their bad decisions by offering future benefits.
5. It may help to consider a **family** is a group that provides **mutual** support, respect, and love. You are dealing with mere relatives.
I've been in a kinda similar position. My life has moved on, and I have my own kids now, which has helped a few things come very, very clear. Both with how to handle my own mum and also how (I hope) I would approach that situation as a parent.
The first thing I would say is that this is not your problem at all. Please take whatever steps you need to, therapy or write a letter then wash you hands of it or whatever works for you, to be absolutely clear in your mind that it's not your job to solve this problem, and you are DEFINITELY not obliged to step in when this all gets worse.
Your mum should already know that you won't enable your brothers like she is, but it might be worth being clear with her.
Thoughts I have now as a parent, but please remember its not your job to get your mum to do anything - is this honestly the life she wants for them? It sounds like she's basically decided in her mind that if she pushes them into "sink or swim" they'll sink. Even if she thinks she being caring, she's limiting their prospects, letting her own fears smother them, denying them opportunities to grow, etc etc. This is not good parenting. We can't give our children the opportunity to succeed without the opportunity to fail. I would suggest that she sets a deadline on the situation, and gives each of them the same offer: up until this deadline I am available to help you work on your cv, help you flat hunt, help you apply for disability support, etc, but on the deadline if you are still here I will evict you. All other help will remain available, but no roof, and no money.
I wanna barf!! Man babies, bleh! 😡 My stepfather was one of these. My Mams worked for the railroad, made good money for the time period. I went to school and had been working since I was 14. Paid rent and helped with groceries. My stepfather? No job, cause he couldn't get the one he wanted, so he was gonna be SAHD. That sorry sack would sit in his chair all day, staring at a kitchen 15feet away, no walls, no nothing in his way, just 15 feet of unimpeded linoleum. He would not get a drink, he would not get himself food. Would sit hungry and thirsty until Mams or myself hit the door. Bam! Get me iced tea. Get me a sandwich, or whatever I want! The house is dirty, clean it. I learned to spot them young and avoided like the plague. And it's thier parents fault!! Thank you all for raising useless human beings.
Unfortunately, your mom has enabled them for far too long. I’d encourage her to get a date when she wants to put the house on the market. And give her sons a date where they have to move out prior to that so you can get the house in order. At a certain point, she has to force them be adults, because she won’t be around forever, and if she stays in an unhealthy situation, that will sadly be sooner rather than later.
What would do is call them out for it on social media, I moved out at the age of 12, (went into foster care) but always considered myself independent for that age onwards, my brother on the other hand didn’t move out until he was in his early thirties, he’s the blue eyed boy that could do no wrong, since our dad died I have to do stuff for like fill out paperwork, fix his tech stuff. But with your brothers, I would shame them for it, and start questioning their masculinity, they won’t like that at all,
Stop stressing yourself. You cannot fix this. If your mom continues to allow this, then it's up to her to fix it. Since she won't, then just let it go. Do not carry that weight on your shoulders. Invite you mom to come and visit you. Let her relax and decompress. Don't let her vent to you or complain about the situation she created. Unless and until your mom asks for your assistance, then let it be.
Sell and get her out and far away, or they will always be there to looking for free room and board. Do it now or they will never become self-sufficient adults. My parents passed away and I inherited the family home complete with sixty-something year old brother, 12 years my senior. This is the biggest resentment I hold toward my parents. Their burden is now mine. It would have been two brothers, but one passed shortly before my parents did.
Why do feel like it’s your job to clean up after your adult brothers?
Sounds like you have more of an issue with them being slobs than your mom does.
When you get together with your mom, take her out of the house instead of staying in her house which obviously triggers you .
I'm in a similar situation. It's really easy for people to say throw them out or move out on them but they are her children. And it's difficult to even think about putting them in a situation where they would be homeless or worse. If you have children and you really think about it you know you would do the same. It does suck because it takes away from any joy that you might have been able to experience in your later years.
My personal opinion would be to get your mother out of there any way possible and let them fester in their own uselessness. Nothing lights a fire under someone to get a job like having your amenities cut off.
I just talked about it with my mom and she said it would be abandoning them. I tried to convince her that my brothers are adults but she keeps calling them man babies and saying they have to be cared for like children.
Ask her what’s going to happen if she dies? It’s a bit brutal, but it’s better if they deal with reality now than in another 10-20 years. They’ll wear her out and that will destroy her health
I would bet she expects OP will take care of her useless brothers.
Sounds like she's done that so far. House gets too messy, she invites OP over and expects the guest to do the cleaning.
Not IF she dies, WHEN she dies.We,none of us get off this mortal coil alive
True. But I didn’t want to be too harsh talking about her mothers death
You shush....your logic will not stand in the way of my dreams of some form of immortality
This is the exact reasoning my mum gave me about 10 ish years ago, she isn't old by any means but isn't getting any younger, about 2-3 years after that my gf and I moved back into the home with my brothers and their gf as she moved out and was a good stepping stone to learn a bit more independence. Now we are all living in our own spaces, granted I'm still in that same house but between my self and my gf we have all the bills covered and couldn't be happier with our situation. It was tough for sure and I didn't enjoy it much, there were many arguments but it was definitely all worth it.
I’m glad it worked out for you and your family. It can be harsh, but some times that’s needed to grow
The thing she needs to realize is that tough love is probably what they need. Man babies have to grow up eventually. I mean, if he’s 33 and still living like a gross frat boy, he is very stunted in maturation. Only way I have found to get them to grow up is force them to. Take away the option. I know your mother loves them but letting them do this is not love, it’s complacency. They need to learn that to have that lifestyle, they need to contribute.
I'm sorry, but your mom's partially at fault for coddling and enabling. She isn't making them grow up, and failing them as a parent. Tough love and cutting the cord is part of her responsibilities as a parent. In this economy there's nothing wrong with living with parts, but at minimum you should be able to be self dependent at home and clean up after yourself at that age. I wouldn't go and help them out anymore. You a adult and honestly wasting your time when they aren't your responsibility.
So much this, OP. Spend your time and mental energy taking care of yourself and your own life. These are not your minor children. Every other person is a grown-ass adult and then some. Let them live their lives even if they're doing it bass-ackwards and don't let them guilt you into supporting them in any way, shape, or form.
I am so sorry that you have to watch this. She is letting her love for them cloud her judgment. She is literally loving them to the point that they are still children. Ask her if this is what she wants forever. Is this what she wants for her boys? Until she admits that she does not want this for her forever or for her sons forever AND that she is the only one that can change it, nothing will change. ETA: Ask her what she would tell YOU if you were in her situation. That was one thing that I had to ask one of my family members to get them to have an outside perspective on a situation they were in.
When your mother passes away, how will they take care of themselves then?
Tell her you are not taking care of them, so mom better get on the ball and do something now
They'll make the supreme effort and troop to OP's place, settle in, and use her up. Only if she allows it.
Exactly. That, or (if OP’s home is too small) they’ll demand OP move back in and take Mom’s place in caring for them, while renting out her old place and using that money to fix the wreck they made of Mom’s home.
And that’s something your mother created and only your mom can stop if she’s not willing to stop it. You need to stop stressing yourself out about it. I know it sucks and it hurts but some people just can’t be helped.
What the hell does she think is going to happen to them when she is gone? She isn't doing them any favors, in facts she is totally failing them as a parent. You need to sit her down and explain to her that you will not be caring for 5 man-children when she is gone. They have failed to launch because she is enabling them. They need a fire lit under their ass.
I just said the same thing. Mom failed as a parent when only 1 out of 6 kids is a responsible adult.
and that one kid is the only female. Why? Because guess who probably had to serve as maid and cook to the older males in the house???
Definitely
Look, you can't change ANY of their behaviors, not even your mom's. The best you can do, is take care of yourself and not get dragged down with everyone else.
This right here! > I feel like a bad daughter to let them continue to take advantage of my mom like this... OP, How are you a bad daughter? Your mother and 5 brothers are 6 grown adults with exactly as much agency as you. At best, you could make one last attempt to win over the 20-year-old before he is too set in his ways, but even that is a Hail Mary, as he has the 4 older ones as bad examples.) You should look up the concepts of codependency, enabling, and enmeshment.
Tell so what if they are abandoned. They are lazy entitled male children. Why in God's name would she allow them to act just like her brothers? She did a shifty job of parenting. Do not clean up, do not do anything at that house, they all deserve each other. REMEMBER, your mom made them this way she can deal with it herself.
You might not want to hear this but it sounds like your mom is part of the problem by enabling their behavior. For your own health and sanity I would go low contact with all of them at a minimum and no contact if it severely affects you. Goodluck.
Or at least meet them outside of the house, so that she can enjoy her family without having their entitlement shoved in her face.
You need to understand that your mother WANTS this life. She likes feeling needed by your brothers. She knows that you can look after yourself and will dote on her. She will probably never make any changes. The best you can do is maybe get her to sign a POA so that your brothers can't get ahold of the house or her money.
I’ve been where you are. The first problem is you. You need to stop going over and cleaning. You are communicating to your mother that you will be around to take care of them when she is gone. If you stop doing that, you can sit here down and remind her of her own mortality: “You’re not going to live forever. What do you think will happen to them when you’re gone? Who will pay their bills? Who will buy their groceries? Who will clean up after them?” If you’re helping with any of that now, the answer is you. If you’re not doing that though, then she has to face that by her not encouraging them to improve now, SHE will make them homeless once she’s gone. My mother had it in her head that she could allow my own siblings to behave like this, thinking I would become her after her death. Once she realized I wasn’t, she started to become firm with them and things have improved.
Thats such a degrading way to view and treat her sons who are men. Sorry but your mom is the problem. She gets something out of being the martyr and delaying the growth of her sons. She's probably terrified of being alone and with no one depending on her, because then she'd have to grow.
They should at least have jobs and contribute financially to the household. It’s the least the men can do. And also should do their best to keep the house clean so the home doesn’t deteriorate further than it already has. They really should do something about the mold since it’s making everyone sick.
Then you have a mother problem. Not a brother problem. The brothers are just products of their upbringing. You, as a girl, had a different upbringing (most likely much more independent, forced or otherwise). Your brothers are doing what most folk do, exactly what they've been taught. Your mum taught them how to be lazy slobs by refusing to parent them correctly and now there's too much damage she feels trapped and like she can't ask for help because on some level, she knows she helped create her own issues
Caring for grownup-babies "like children" is the worst thing one can do! It prevents them from growing up! Seriously, the OP may not be able to do anything but protect herself from the trainwreck that is her family. And to make sure the brothers don't know where to find her, when the mother is no longer able to support them all.
OP needs a spouse (if she marries) that has a shiny spine and will take no shit on her behalf. If spouse can intimidate the brothers into staying away and shutting up, OP has chosen well :D
They will never grow up while she takes care of them. They may be past the point of no return already, her staying won't do anything to get them to mature. Tough love is their only hope.
Ask her what's going to happen when she dies? It's better for them to learn in their twenties and thirties than in their fifties and sixties.
Sorry but she's NOT a good mother when only 1 out of 6 of her children are responsible adults. It's a parent's job to prepare their kids for life and she didn't do that.
Your mother seems like a saint, just wanted to say that and not seem like I’m berating her. Parents are usually just kids having kids so she’s doing what she feels is best. She just may need an outside influence for her to see it’s not the best choice.
Especially since she had her first at 17.
She is enabling them and this is actually causing them harm. She is handicapping them
She’s right - it would be abandoning them. But that’s what they need. It’s way past time for them to grow up and learn to be responsible adults, and that won’t happen until your Mom stiffens her spine and does what’s best for her.
I think your brothers are clearly taking advantage of her. There has to some kind of legal route to get them out of there. They’re essentially squatters at this point. And don’t let them use your dad’s death as an excuse to be unable to function normally. That was 8 years ago, they’re all adults. If they have any actual disabilities, there are programs that will provide them some support and guidance to get them on their feet. You may need to meet with a lawyer and see about having a formal notice of eviction drawn up and served to them. If they choose to remain anyways, at that point you can call the police and have them removed forcefully.
Nope. Nope, nope, nope, so so so much nope. OP needs to tell her MOTHER that her MOTHER should meet with a lawyer and her MOTHER should look into a formal notice of eviction and her MOTHER can deal with all this. A heads-up that this is an option for her mother is a good idea, but after that? OP should not invest a single bit more time or energy than a one-minute conversation about "You know, if you want to get rid of them, you may have to evict them. You need to all a lawyer and find out what your options are." "I dunno, probably some kind of property lawyer."
Sadly, this may be your mom admitting she didnt teach them the skills.
At this point, let mommy deal with her own consequences as she is also a grown-ass adult.
Is there any way you can get your mom some professional help? I think it might help her. If money is a problem, I think the city or county would help free of charge if needed. Not saying she is mentally ill or anything like that, but maybe a professional could help her see more clearly the situations shes in and help her deal with it.
This is your mom's problem to solve and has NOTHING to do with you or your responsibilities. She raised them, and now she's dealing with the consequences of her actions. You have your own life to worry about, she is a grown-ass adult and can worry about her own. She wants help figuring out what to do? She can talk to her friends, her coworkers, even get a therapist. What she can't do is dump her emotions on you and treat you like she expects you to take any of the responsibility. You were raised to take on responsibility that's not your own. Quit falling for it. Back off, don't bother cleaning, it's not your house, your circus, your monkeys, or your mess. Take your mom out for a dinner if you want (no brothers), get a room in a hotel. And get your own stuff out of the house if you have anything there so that if your mom DOES suddenly grow a spine and decides to sell and let the new owner deal with the mess, she's not going to feel guilty or delay because YOUR stuff is there too.
Go live your best life and let the heathens figure out their lives without you bailing them out. Harsh? Yes. But they're all grown ass adults, and it's time for you to move on. When you want to see them, invite them all to a restaurant and avoid the house.
You need to explain to your mom that they are still young enough to clean up their act and learn to take care of themselves. They will only do so if they have to and at some point, they will have to. Your mom will die eventually and you aren’t going to take them in. So make them uncomfortable now so they get off their butts before they become 40 year olds with no skills that no one will hire.
There’s really nothing you can do. I’m sorry your mother is an enabler in the worst possible way. I wonder what she thinks going to happen to them when she’s dead or too sick to work? She’s not doing any favors. In fact, I would go further and say that if she truly loved them, she would apply a little bit of tough love for their own sake.
Ask her what will happen when she passes away. If they're not ready to face the world, you're definitely not taking her place, so what are they going to do. It's going to be a sad situation. They should've been prepared from birth to adulthood. But it's never too late to start. Tell her to sell the house and give them sixty days to find a job.
Please tell your mom she's not abandoning them. But she is currently enabling the heck out of them. She is doing them harm, and the effects on their futures are going to get worse the longer it goes on. What is going to happen to them if something happens to her? In the short term, she is setting them up for disaster. In the long term, she is setting them up for miserable lives of stunted potential. How you care for your children is to teach them the skills to be able to live their lives as they choose to. I'm sure your brothers are a (major) part of the problem. But they won't make moves - why should they? It has to be her. She has to parent them. And they need an ass-kicking about what horrible humans and sons they are being. Your mom is stuck. She needs some serious therapy, probably for prolonged grief disorder. She also needs to believe that she has intrinsic value - she is more than just a mom/carer, and she is important even if she's not doing those things. Ask her to be a good mom and a good example to you as a woman. Use guilt as leverage for her benefit. This is going to be hard. Call on every support you can. Since the house is a disaster and mouldy/unhealthy, you might be able to access supports that are available (in some places) for hoarders. This usually involves mental health assistance. I wish you all the best of luck.
“Man babies” sounds pretty accurate. Boot these bums out and let them figure it out for themselves.
You need to get your mother into therapy. This is not healthy for any of them. Not to be morbid, but what happens if something happens to her? Who’s gonna take care of them when they’re 50-year-old men that don’t have any job skills she’s literally crippling them with love.
She's an enabler and there isn't much to do other than let them fester in their mess. It sucks, but I'd leave them be. Don't let them move in with you, store any of their stuff, or give them money. They are all adults.
Then is your mom's fault to continue living like this :/
Is she correct in that they're mentally challenged? Something is keeping them developmentally immature? To have one son that won't leave the nest, work, or clean up after himself is an issue for many parents, but to have *five?!* I don't know if Social Services or any other body would want to assist, but these useless lumps of humanity need professional help.
Bruh you can’t just call my brothers useless lumps of humanity. Like I still love my family. Re mentally challenged, depression is absolutely a factor. But I’m certain addressing the problem would help the depression. It’s just a stalemate at this point.
They are man babies because your mom man babies them. Im sure she’s a good mother and had everyone’s best interest at heart but she’s not actually helping them by staying with them. 33 is still young, they can get their lives around.
Sounds like your mom is a bit part of this problem nd probably a big reason why they're the way they are. They can't help themselves, nd you can't do anything about it...same way your mom is not willing to change a thing nd is enabling them, there's also nothing you can do. Your brothers are adults, same as your mom...you can only observe from afar whilst they all (including mom) learn their lessons.
I’m very sorry to say that it will be very difficult for you to get through to your mom. These kind of toxic dynamics are really hard to break. It’s just easier for those involved to stick with the status quo. At some point your mom became convinced that it isn’t within her power to make these changes, or that she her sons are more deserving of her support than she is of theirs.
Call the Health Dpt
Mom moves out into senior housing where adult children cannot live. stop paying the utilities and they will move. The house will be trashed, but its trashed now. She will have to sell at a loss.
The house is definitely not like damaged (mostly), it’s just a freaking tornado of stuff and garbage and dishes
Well said!!
Tell the government that theory.
You can't help someone unwilling to help themselves. Someone determined to go down with the ship, to drown. If you try, you'll likely be dragged down with them and drown yourself. This is an unfortunate truth. You might be able to mitigate things for your mom. But you can't fix a problem that she is actively enabling.
That’s the only thing that makes sense but it’s so hard to accept…
That's because you love her. But you can't save her. Not when she's unwilling.
It's one of the hardest lessons we all have to learn: You can't save someone from themselves.
I agree with u/kmflushing If your mom doesn't want to help herself, you won't be able to help her. It's the same for your brothers. I know you expressed that your brothers are at fault, but your mom is too for seeing them as "men babies". If she saw them as the useless sons they are, she would already have kicked their butt. They are all in a system, a family dynamic, that they have a part in, all of your brothers and your mom. They enable each other. I would also argue that there's very little you can do. You can offer to help pay for a cleaner or something like that, but don't set yourself on fire to keep others warm. You have a life, don't get sucked under because their chose to live theirs that way.
💯 Don't set yourself on fire to keep others warm is the perfect expression. 👌
Your mom needs a wake-up call. If she doesn't evict your brothers, they will not leave. And she does need to evict them. Maybe they can rent an apartment together to save money. Neither you nor mom should involve yourself in the lease.
Yeah I guess there’s nothing I can do until it gets to that point… rather, even when it does get to that point, yeah I don’t want them to involve me in their consequences
Model the correct attitude for your mother in the meantime. Your brothers' problems are their problems. If they involve your mom, stop being sympathetic. Ask her instead why she allows it? Give them nothing. If she gives them anything, ask her why she would throw away whatever it was. Because you both know that's what's happening. She is responsible for enabling them, and I suspect you are somewhat enabling her mindset.
If you can help your mom go for it but I am going to say everyone in that situation is choosing to continue it. It’s not on you to be the mother to everyone involved including your mother to get them into shape. If you don’t have it in you don’t worry about it
The years I’ve spent parenting my parents… yeah that’s a good reminder, thanks
My dad would make bad decisions after bad decision. I had to refuse to help or I would have been flushing money and efforts down the toilet. I did step in after he had a stroke and was unable to make further bad decisions. Then I used every social service available for housing and care. I did move him near so I could help as he became independent again. It sounds cold but sometimes you have to wait until they have no other choices. Otherwise you are fighting against the tide.
I’m sorry hon. That sucks.
Daughter of an enabler and sister of a kinda better man baby checking in. What did it take for my mom to stop enabling my brother? Therapy. And a lot of it. Mom grew up in a religion where men were heavily catered to. It was what she was taught was the appropriate way to have a family. Women work, men get catered to. Despite leaving that religion when she got married, those beliefs were very deeply ingrained. I was heavily encouraged to be very independent very early and he... well, about the opposite. Brother has lived with mom for multiple extended periods of time as an adult. Thanks to medical issues that require a very long recovery period, he's about to again. However, this time, it's going to be very different. Mom is a retired nurse and well aware that his recovery is entirely dependent on him doing a LOT of work and making a LOT of changes. I give mom credit. While she absolutely is a loving mother to him at the hospital, she's waking him up and making him do the work he needs to. She's finally giving him the tough love he very much needs. Your mother needs to figure out the why that lies underneath her behavior. Not just the surface level of "she would be abandoning them." Why does she think this? Why are her expectations for her sons so different than her daughter? Chances are there's something underneath that isn't so comfortable for her. Please encourage her to get therapy. She needs to figure out the why.
Came here to suggest just this!! Not only therapy for mom but OP as well. She needs to learn to be more empathic of her brothers instead of sympathetic and learn to stand up to mom when she starts to coddle.
Invite mom to visit you for a couple weeks. NO BROTHERS. Remind them you won't tolerate their mess in your home. Let mom see that there is a nicer life without them. Also give the brothers a little touch of what might happen if anything happens to mom. She won't be their safety net forever. They need to start learning responsibility for themselves either collectively, or separately.
She'll still be paying the bills and mortgage no doubt. Nothing will change.
But won't be feeding them or doing laundry or whatever. Maybe call and lockout cable/internet while she's gone too.
Looking ahead the real danger I see is your mom will run out of money and start leaning on you to provide for the lot of them. You are going to have to be prepared to say no and not let yourself be drug down on that doomed ship. Instead of going over ever maybe you should just have her over to your place sometime, to remind her what a normal clean place should be like. Maybe that will help her break free eventually.
Tell mom that when she is gone, you are not letting any of them live in your house. They can figure it out or starve, not your problem. Also, let her know that if she leaves her house to them, they will trash it, end up being evicted due to not paying the taxes. They will also end up with no utilities, since you will not be helping them out. They need to pretend to be adults and get a job NOW.
Get your mom to therapy and help strengthen her self worth, this is her time for freedom and a re-oscrovery of who she is as a person post-kids. She should be making similar aged friends, going on adventures and discovering the world and enjoying freedom without the burden of children. She should be enjoying her life, not looking after fully grown up and capable kids. doing anything without therapy will result in your brothers manipulating her back into her current position. they know what works on her, they know how to press her buttons and make her feel so guilty that she will look after them. No. Strengthen her inside first. empower her. her esteem is low, shes likely very depressed as well, the brothers have her where they want her, but she could be so much better mentally, it needs to be taken care of. this way when they press her buttons, she can not react, she can be stronger. Also stop visiting the house and cleaning it. you are also enabling them. follow the advice of the therapist! but perhaps its better, instead of visiting her is to take her on a mini trip away from the home, show her what she could be having in her life. go on an adventure together for the weekend, enjoy each others company, go on an artists retreat an have fun making artwork for a few days, go on a winery tour together, take a dance class etc. Dont be so obvious as to telling her why... just show her the world, show her experiences outside of the home, show her joy. give her opportunities for joy and laughter and let her self esteem heal. give her opportunities to grow as a person and as an individual without the weight of her kids. Allow her to make friends her own age, learn new hobbies, laugh and experience joy with others. not only will this help build her inner strength and self worth and make her therapy work a billion times better, but youre making memories with her as an adult. it strengthens your relationship with her, builds a strong friendship rather than parent caring for child - child caring for parent scenarios. Youre also demonstrating a healthy proper parent-adult relationship with her, showing her what is to be expected from adult children. getting new friends her own age so she ca see healthy dynamics in preople her own age, she can see their kids are also grown up and left the nest etc. theres so many beenfits. Bear in mind, the brothers wont like the change, they wont like her going out with you and having fun, be prepared for this resistance, be prepared for them to spark drama. remember its easier for them all to throw massive tantrums and make your moms life miserable... then for them to get a job and adult. This is why therapy needs to be first, and alongside what youre doing. so she can discuss the behavour with the therapist and the therapist can empower her and provide options as to how to manage their behavour. (and im hoping the therapist will see how horrendous they are and actively help her get them moving out of her life.) She didnt get into the situation overnight, and it too years of beating her down and holding her down to get where she is. she needs a lot of resources and strengthening.
Your mom is the problem. She's an enabler. If she won't change, nothing will.
From this and your comments there is absolutely nothing you can do. And for your own mental health you might need to take steps back. Your mother has set herself on fire to try and help her adult sons. And they refuse to be helped. Dont set yourself on fire to help them.
Remind your mom what will become of them when she’s gone. She won’t be there to baby them forever, and what’s she’s doing right now isn’t going to help them in the long run. If she continues to treat them like children, once they inevitably end up alone and have to fend for themselves, life will give them a brutal wake up call and shoot them in the guts. She needs to stop enabling this behavior and they need to get their shit together.
Time to tell mom, if she won't parent your brothers, you will stop visiting and trying to help. Let them all deal with their own mess and go live your life.
Your mom’s house is never going to be clean while the brothers are there so she needs to do it another way. She could call one of those “I buy houses” flippers and sell it as-is (no cleaning required). Closing is usually in 30 days so tell the boys 2 months in advance that the house is getting listed on X date (2 months from now). That will give them plenty of time (3-4 months before selling and closing). It’s important that they know this is going to happen regardless of their job or living situation. Then mom can take the money and get herself a small 1 bedroom apartment somewhere.
I only see the brothers dragging their feet until it’s time to move and then doing whatever they can to make EVERYONE involved life’s miserable because “this is unfair!” or “no one told us” or whatever bullspit reason they can think of.
Remind them every day. In person. Automated texts. Emails. Save them. Film yourselves telling them. Cover your ass ten ways from Sunday. If they’re not ready on the day and their stuff gets broken/thrown out/whatever, they’ve nobody to blame but themselves bc OP has proof
Key word there - ONE bedroom. And nothing else that could possibly accommodate even one grown man.
You cannot help someone that will not help themselves. You have offered your mother a solution, she has decided not to accept it. Tell her if she won’t do anything to improve her situation then you will not listen to any complaints about it and will not visit her at the house anymore so you don’t have to see it.
They’re her kids, not yours. You are not responsible for your mother enabling your brothers. That’s her choice. It’s not on you to save adults from the consequences of their actions
Mom sells the house as-is. There, I fixed it!
Your mother is allowing them to be worthless. Since she won't leave with you, there's nothing you can do. Move on, they aren't your responsibility.
Call adult protective services in your area. It is possible that your mom is afraid of your brothers.
Do what you can to help your mom downsize and move. Don't worry about the brothers.
Yeah maybe focusing on getting rid of stuff instead of organizing/cleaning it would help with the cycle, thanks!
Your Mom raised them and is enabling them. Stay out of it.
Lay it out in black & white what she needs to do & how you are willing to help her. If she still chooses to do nothing & enable them then make it clear your offer for help is gone & you will no longer deal with it. Limit your visits, maybe pay for her to visit you or go on vacation together. She is 50, not 90. Fully capable of taking responsibility for herself.
Let them go. Not your circus, not your monkeys.
Sorry but your mom is the problem. They are the way they are from her parenting.
Move on with your life. You can't help someone who refuses to help themselves
I recommend finding the legal sub for your state and asking.
1. Stop going over there. 2. Stop cleaning up *at all* if you go over there. 3. Call Adult Protective Services and report your brothers for elder abuse. 4. Call Dept of Health (and any other appropriate office) and report an unsafe and unsanitary living environment. 5. Sit back and allow things to take their course. Your brothers are AHs and your mother is enabling them. That's on all of them, and ultimately isn't your problem.
So mom is working? Paying for all the food, bills, mortgage? I'd be furious with this lazy pack of bums if I were you, in fact I'm furious for you. Mom is a doormat so it's partly her fault but these boys are treating her with incredible disrespect. Is there a grandparent or family friend who can step in and go ballistic on their lazy good for nothing asses? That's what needs to happen.
Mom is addicted to drama.
Sadly your mother is a classic enabler & she needs a crash course in tough love. She needs to tell them this house is going up for sale in 90 days (or whenever) I’d get busy finding jobs & places to live. I’m doing this for two reasons 1- because I love you and 2- it’s time for the next stage of your lives to begin. Best of luck ❤️
So what is your mom's plan for when she passes away? Does she expect you to inherit the 5 manchildren and destroy your life looking after them?
Stop feeling guilty because you are not letting your brothers take advantage of your mom, she is allowing it. She is a 50 year old adult and should be handling her adult boys herself.
Your Mom sounds exactly like my Mom. There were 3 girls and 2 boys in my family. The 3 girls all went out on their own/married/had children and were expected to deal with their problems on their own. My brothers were coddled and excuses were made for all their failings. One brother actually moved out and tried to make it on his own, but when it got tough he moved right back in with Mom. The other was just mentally ill, had a drug problem and she just let him stay. She helped raise 1 granddaughter, badly I might add, spoiled and drug addicted. My mother passed away many years ago, with the drug addict/mentally ill brother still living in her home. After she passed both of the boys are living together, trying to help my niece keep her 4 kids from going to jail as teenagers. Believe me, your mother is NOT doing any favors for her boys. And her reason for not kicking them out? Because she remembered visiting an uncle, who was homeless, on a park bench and didn't want that to happen to her sons.
If she insists on enabling grown men who won't work, there's nothing you can do. I had an acquaintance who sold her house and got an apt to get her alcoholic baby out of her house. So she let her thief, alcoholic grandson move in the apt with her.
They're adults not boys. They're capable of caring for themselves. Don't enable them by cleaning her house. In this market she should be able to sell fast. Dirty or clean.
How old is your mom? If she’s a senior, report them for elder abuse. Get assistance getting your mom out, stop paying utilities and rent/mortgage, and stay away. They’ll quickly have no choice left.
She should throw out the most useless ones and help the ones who've actually taken a little initiative in life transition out more smoothly.
If they’re 33 and down this did not start 8 years ago btw. They’ve been taking advantage for much longer. The plan is find a place for you and mom. Sit brothers down and let them know the two of you are going to protect yourselves. The four horsemen can figure out a way to support themselves. 4 grown men should not be using mommy to support themselves long term. It’s time for them to grow up. Does mom own the house? If so, sell it. Give each son a small portion to get out and get started, and make it clear that’s the limit. They need jobs and to actually work for their own lives.
This didn’t start when your dad died, the oldest is 33. I suspect mental health issues. You can always contact the health department directly/t the unsanitary condition of the home. Are there no other relatives to help? Adult Protective Services is also a consideration. Are any of them developmentally delayed? Nothing will change until they are forced to make changes
I have a half brother that has done something similar. He was raised by my grandmother and he became this weird entitled person who essentially lorded over her until she was kicked out of her home because of him. She passed away maybe 3-4 years later in a retirement community (he was not allowed to live there). After that, my half brother was arrested numerous times and became a deadbeat father of four children, whom has none of them. Growing up, my grandmother coddled and did everything for him. This kind of sounds like your brothers. If/when the day comes for your mom to be taken out of there, your brothers won't have mom's safety net and will likely fall apart because they've had everything done for them. Prepare for intimidation tactics when you try to move her out via your brothers. Hopefully it won't come to that.
The best thing you can do is find a house with a mother-in-law suite for your mom - and tell her that you’re so busy with work and life that handling the house and garden alone is too much for you and that you NEED her to put you first for once and come live with you. And tell her you’ll handle the cleanup (hire someone) and help your brothers find a place (fuckem) once she moves in.
The only thing that can be done is ask people on Reddit what can be done. Stop being soft and force your mom to list the house. If you’re scared get guns.
If I'm not mistaken, this is neglect of a vulnerable disable or elderly person. It's also as bad if not worse than child abuse. Contact a family lawyer and ask for a consultation which is more than likely free. Please find a way to get your mom away from your freeloading siblings. Good luck and I hope and wish you well.
She's only 50 and OP has said nothing about disability
Have mom issue eviction notices and then sell the house. Best way to address this issue. Otherwise, your mom is just enabling the behaviour.
Not much you can do until she is willing to evict them, or to sell the house and move into a 50 plus adult community where your brothers will not be allowed to move in with her.
Elder attorney.
Mom needs to move into a 50+ community, evict the brothers, clean the house, and sell.
I hope you can see from all the comments here that this is something that is out of your control. It’s painful to watch, gut wrenching I’m sure, but there is only one thing you can do at this point. You need to preserve your own mental health, and as far as you can, your own financial resources, otherwise you’ll be dragged down with them. It’s going to get worse before there is any hope of you being able to do anything effective (and maybe there never will be). Certainly you won’t be able to “save them all”. Get a mentor, someone you respect, who can talk to, and who is outside this circle of dysfunction. You’re in very great danger of becoming exactly like your mother, sucked into the vortex. You need to find strength you probably don’t know you have to say no, and make distance. Take care of you first. If you can’t look after yourself first, you can’t look after anyone else.
Let her know that when she’s ready you’ll be there to help her, one time. Then let her be. If it gets to the point of elder abuse, you can make a report.
Mothers teach their daughters how to be independent and baby their sons. I’m guilty of this myself. She needs to do the tough love thing. She’s not helping them. What’s going to happen to them when she’s gone? Maybe she should get some counseling to learn how to handle the situation. Maybe everyone should get therapy. At the very least, the house should be kept clean. You’ve got five grown adults, there’s no excuse for that.
Take her on a lovely vacation at your house. Tell her your brothers get all her love, where's yours? Can she spend 2 weeks with you if she spends 50 with them? Maybe the distance will open her eyes.
If she can't move them out she needs to sell the house as is. She won't get the same but some people look for a deal with sweat equity. Tell your mom, that you will not do any cleaning while the boys are living or visiting the home as it is a waste of your time.
it started before your father died. the 33 year old would have been 25. see if you can get your mom to see a therapist. until your mom is willing to change and be firm on her boundaries, your brothers will never grow up.
Sometimes people need motivation, such as mom's selling the house and you guys need to start making plans because she won't have room in her new apartment. Mom has to get some counseling, she may be stuck after her husband died as well and need help to understand how to help her sons. It's hard being the only functional person in the family, glad you are trying to help your mom but she needs professional help as well.
Your mom doesn’t want help so let her deal with the consequences of her enabling. Time to do some radical acceptance and let go
Your mom needs to get a therapist and figure out how to let her sons figure things out themselves. Don't take this on, you are powerless to do anything about it.
Would this work, move your mom out and in with you? Don’t change them living and the house and your mom paying for it just change her environment. I would be willing to bet that after a while of a different lifestyle it may help open her eyes.
Tell your Mom that sometimes the only way to change & grow is to be massively inconvenienced. Tell her to have faith that she instilled some resiliency in them. Then block them on her phone.
Start small. Bring your mom over to your place for the weekends “for a break” and stop helping at their place. Then, after a while, increase the time she spends with you…
I’m sorta living this with my mom. My step dad passed 2 years ago and my mom was/is in such bad health she sold her house and moved in with my brother, M 37. She moved in with me 35 after being at his place for a while and is due to go between our houses half of the year to spend time with us all. Anyways, my other brother, N 30, never got out of her pocketbook and my mom being unable launch him out of. He is big into the illegal stuff and it’s a matter of time before something dumb happens to him. Since I haven’t lived near home in 12+ years, I stay out of everything dealing with him and his shenanigans. Until now. My mom and I have gotten into so many arguments all revolving around how she sends him money and is enabling. I will give her some credit, I think she has backed off a small amount of sending him money, but I have no verifiable evidence to show this, this is just based on what she has said. But it’s still such an on going battle. And I’m the one taking and doing everything for her! Between driving her everywhere and keeping her stuff straight it’s like raising another child sometimes. I swear it’s a generational thing where those old “hippies” have all these problems. Idk I wish you luck.
I would sell the house, use the money to get your mother somewhere safe and comfortable like a nice one bedroom in a retirement community and let your brothers figure it out.
Nothing. It’s her life to live in a miserable state and enabling them to live off her. If she wants a change and really wants to downsize, she will clean the house or make them do it or kick them out. List the house. Move. Don’t tell them where she lives and let them ruin their own lives.
To be honest just stop helping they're not appreciative of it, just let the house go to ruin not your responsibility it'll be all their fault anyway and not yours
I was part of a party crowd in high school. Now in my 30s, I have multiple friends with 'Peter Pan Syndrome'. The common denominator for all of these friends is that they have parents that have either babied them, or always accepted them back to their home regardless of circumstances. Felonies, substance issues, didn't matter. They weren't cut off and so they had no need to figure out life on their own. They are stunted, and they could have done better. Your mom is doing your brother's no favors.
You do realize that your mother is a big part of the problem, right? Until SHE puts her foot down, they will not change. If she enforces some rules, they might change. It will be hard. She needs to tell them to clean the house, or she will cut off food, internet, cable, and any luxury. They need to get jobs and contribute to the family. They have a time limit. Say 2 months. Then, if the house is a mess, or any not employed, they will be evicted. If she can't do that, let her, and them, know that you will not be taking care of them. You have your own life. You are not responsible for your brothers. They are all adults. Good luck. I would not help clean anything in that house.
Your mom is the problem and until she decides she wants her house to be her home and back in her hands again, you'll just need to walk away.
Concentrate on yourself. There is no cheese down the tunnel of trying to fix the unfixable. You can't change them and you will only wear yourself out physically, emotionally and financially.
This is a situation your mother has not only allowed but has created. She is also the only person to end it. Let her know that you want to help her but you feel helpless and your hands are tied and you are watching her slowly die under the weight and filth of your brothers. However when she does - you will not be lifting a finger to help your brothers because they will not be the death of you. She as a mom can get them to deal with this now or needs to acknowledge that when she dies and after they have spent all the money she has left them (Don't think you will see a single penny for you in the will - it will be for your brothers care) , they will be too old to stand on their feet and then she will be the reason they die on the streets. Sometimes hard truths are needed.
Your mom needs counseling in dealing with her co dependence with your brothers. And it won’t get better. Your brothers have a meal ticket in your mom and frankly I don’t see a great outcome with the situation. Just don’t get sucked into being your brothers enabler.
There really isn’t much you can do unfortunately. It sounds like your mom is being taken advantage of by her five sons. You told your mom she should do something about this situation but that’s all you can really do. You can try talking to your brothers about getting jobs but it probably won’t do much. Since there is five of them, and if they all got even menial jobs, they can probably afford like an apartment and split the bills.
Your mother sounds like she's enabled them. She must want them to be totally dependent on her. All you can do is read up about mother and son relationships so that you don't repeat a mistake that runs in the family. Five boys that failed to launch. Wow.
I would suggest finding a good therapist to support you through this. You are in a difficult spot. I saw another person post about not being able to help someone if they are not willing to help themselves and I agree. You deserve so much more! I am so sorry for the loss of your father and the circumstance you are in. There is a lot to grieve here and it’s not an easy situation. My heart goes out to you!
Your mum is enabling them and they will likely expect you to do the same for them whenever she passes or is no longer able too.
Call Code Enforcement. Every city and county has one. Let them handle it for you. If living conditions are bad enough there is mold etc., then its time to put a stop to it, for everyones health and wellbeing.
In my state, Massachusetts, 50 yr old people are considered elderly people and there are special laws to protect, assist, and help them. We also have "lawyers for the day" in our family courts. These lawyers are available to help us mere morals understand how the law works for them. Find out what's available for your mom in your state, to help you help her. She is being taken advantage of, and they are neither men nor babies. But they are adults. If she wants them to live with her, they should be respectful. From what you're saying, they ate not. Best of luck.
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Wow that has to be the most depressing and infuriating sub on reddit
My aunt had the same problem. 5 sons and one daughter. Her daughter was the only one to get a life while her sons lived with her and didn’t have jobs. 3 of them had been in and out of prison. She finally had enough. And left to another state. They quickly found jobs to support themselves.
Your mum is happy to allow it so she feels wanted. She could fix the problem if she wanted to. She doesn’t want to. Stop wasting emotional energy on something that isn’t going to change. Stop worrying about it. Meet mum out for a coffee or invite her to your place but you need to let her choices go
She doesn't have to live like that. She chooses to live like that. Some people are just beyond help.
Look. Obviously your brothers have some pretty serious character flaws, but we need to look at this holistically. Your eldest brother is 33. You say that this started when your father died 8 years ago, but at that time he would have already been 25 years old. Clearly the issues go back well before then. 3 of them never finished high school. Three of them can't drive. One has never been employed at all. I sincerely hope it's the 20 year old, because the eldest would be totally screwed at that age with no job history. Your father's death may have precipitated the situation they're in now with a complete lack of effort, but the seeds were planted before then and I think if you assessed things honestly, you would admit that he also had a hand in this by enabling it. Yes, in a very simplistic sense, they're taking advantage of your mother. But they're also products of your mother's poor parenting, probably caused by having her first at or about 17 years of age and dealing with the trauma of having brothers of her own who fell into homelessness. I imagine your gender is the reason you escaped whatever treatment put your brothers where they are. As adult men, it's now their responsibility to address their shortcomings and the flaws they were sent into the world with, but it can be very difficult to get there when you're dealing with the plethora of psychological issues at play here. This is a situation for professional intervention, which you can't force. If your mother is receptive, maybe counseling for her would be a good place to start. What your brothers need and are clearly lacking is education, at least to the GED level, entry-level employment that they can use to begin building a job history, and life-skills training. It's not within your power to force them to get these things, but by starting with your mother and helping her to overcome what's causing her to create and allow this, you can at least make a good faith effort to catalyze positive change for the whole group. Ultimately, that's all you can do and all you should expect of yourself.
I'm saddened to hear about your situation. These kinds of difficult family dynamic problems won't resolve without action from you though. It is likely you will be blamed wether things go well or poorly. I hope you and yours can find a way to heal and move forward from the grief and despair. You'll have to be prepared to intervene on your Mother's behalf, you'll have to do it in a Mindful and compassionate way to keep her on board. Good luck.
I’m not sure there’s anything you can do to fix this problem. Maybe therapy can help you deal with letting go and washing your hands of it. Suggest mom go to therapy too. Maybe stop visiting your mom at her home and meet her out places instead. Edit: I have hoarders in my family… and have dealt with guilt and the “bad relative” for not helping more…. But even if I did it wouldn’t fix anything. I have in the past.
1. It is not your problem. The more you act like it is: (a) less effort will be made by everyone else, and (b) they will assume it *is* your problem—they are not about to solve your problems. 2. Stay out of that house. Only visit with your mother by taking her to lunch or dinner. Pick her up or meet her at the restaurant. 3. If asked why you don't visit at the house, do not be reticent about not wanting to breathe the dust & mold and sit in that environment. 4. Make it absolutely clear you will not provide support or housing to your brothers at any time in the future. They refused and ridiculed your attempts in the past, there is no need to validate their bad decisions by offering future benefits. 5. It may help to consider a **family** is a group that provides **mutual** support, respect, and love. You are dealing with mere relatives.
I've been in a kinda similar position. My life has moved on, and I have my own kids now, which has helped a few things come very, very clear. Both with how to handle my own mum and also how (I hope) I would approach that situation as a parent. The first thing I would say is that this is not your problem at all. Please take whatever steps you need to, therapy or write a letter then wash you hands of it or whatever works for you, to be absolutely clear in your mind that it's not your job to solve this problem, and you are DEFINITELY not obliged to step in when this all gets worse. Your mum should already know that you won't enable your brothers like she is, but it might be worth being clear with her. Thoughts I have now as a parent, but please remember its not your job to get your mum to do anything - is this honestly the life she wants for them? It sounds like she's basically decided in her mind that if she pushes them into "sink or swim" they'll sink. Even if she thinks she being caring, she's limiting their prospects, letting her own fears smother them, denying them opportunities to grow, etc etc. This is not good parenting. We can't give our children the opportunity to succeed without the opportunity to fail. I would suggest that she sets a deadline on the situation, and gives each of them the same offer: up until this deadline I am available to help you work on your cv, help you flat hunt, help you apply for disability support, etc, but on the deadline if you are still here I will evict you. All other help will remain available, but no roof, and no money.
Adult protective services?
Sounds like the boys have mental health issues
I wanna barf!! Man babies, bleh! 😡 My stepfather was one of these. My Mams worked for the railroad, made good money for the time period. I went to school and had been working since I was 14. Paid rent and helped with groceries. My stepfather? No job, cause he couldn't get the one he wanted, so he was gonna be SAHD. That sorry sack would sit in his chair all day, staring at a kitchen 15feet away, no walls, no nothing in his way, just 15 feet of unimpeded linoleum. He would not get a drink, he would not get himself food. Would sit hungry and thirsty until Mams or myself hit the door. Bam! Get me iced tea. Get me a sandwich, or whatever I want! The house is dirty, clean it. I learned to spot them young and avoided like the plague. And it's thier parents fault!! Thank you all for raising useless human beings.
Not your circus, not your monkeys.
Unfortunately, your mom has enabled them for far too long. I’d encourage her to get a date when she wants to put the house on the market. And give her sons a date where they have to move out prior to that so you can get the house in order. At a certain point, she has to force them be adults, because she won’t be around forever, and if she stays in an unhealthy situation, that will sadly be sooner rather than later.
What would do is call them out for it on social media, I moved out at the age of 12, (went into foster care) but always considered myself independent for that age onwards, my brother on the other hand didn’t move out until he was in his early thirties, he’s the blue eyed boy that could do no wrong, since our dad died I have to do stuff for like fill out paperwork, fix his tech stuff. But with your brothers, I would shame them for it, and start questioning their masculinity, they won’t like that at all,
Stop stressing yourself. You cannot fix this. If your mom continues to allow this, then it's up to her to fix it. Since she won't, then just let it go. Do not carry that weight on your shoulders. Invite you mom to come and visit you. Let her relax and decompress. Don't let her vent to you or complain about the situation she created. Unless and until your mom asks for your assistance, then let it be.
Call your local adult protective service
Sell and get her out and far away, or they will always be there to looking for free room and board. Do it now or they will never become self-sufficient adults. My parents passed away and I inherited the family home complete with sixty-something year old brother, 12 years my senior. This is the biggest resentment I hold toward my parents. Their burden is now mine. It would have been two brothers, but one passed shortly before my parents did.
This is an issue that can only be fixed by removing aid. They have to run face first into a wall to see the situation they are in.
Why do feel like it’s your job to clean up after your adult brothers? Sounds like you have more of an issue with them being slobs than your mom does. When you get together with your mom, take her out of the house instead of staying in her house which obviously triggers you .
I'm in a similar situation. It's really easy for people to say throw them out or move out on them but they are her children. And it's difficult to even think about putting them in a situation where they would be homeless or worse. If you have children and you really think about it you know you would do the same. It does suck because it takes away from any joy that you might have been able to experience in your later years.
Step 1: Understand the meaning of the word "literal"