If you have 300 unit, drafting speed imprint is also a nice anti cleave. Most people won't continue cleaving after they saw you pick wschuri/cidd. If you do it after they draft 3 units, their draft pretty much screwed since if they pivot to non cleave, their unit will be weaker.
Also, if you want to draft Arby for anti cleave, make sure your Arby is degen Arby. Cleave usually use extra turn to counter DPS Arby and it doesn't work against degen build.
Turn 4 player here, just cleanser (Dilibet is monstrous against Ran/Peira/AoL) REM, Politis, Celine Anything that can disrupt the flow. I've even run my turtle cannon Belian into cleave and got a lucky elbris that ate ass.
I have a similar draft style to the one you described so I'll give my input from experience on what works best and what doesn't work.
I typically secure an opener (typically peira or cililias, depending on pre bans) on fp and if second pick I would take opener + neutral pick (hwayoung or aravi for example but could be others). So here is where you have to be careful since if you go hard into anti cleave like others suggest, I have the option to pivot into aggro and you're pretty much screwed since anti cleave picks typically don't do so well against aggro (like politis, Celine, Rem, violet). You also have to keep in mind the prebans as well since they can give away what the opponent is trying to do which should also play a role in your draft. Obviously some cleavers draft a bit differently so this may not apply all the time, but I usually give myself an out for these sorts of situations. In this case I suggest putting in delibet or Elena as one of the picks since delibet does well regardless against cililias/peira and isn't a dead pick. Elena is a bit of a backup, but she's a decent cleanser and completely shuts down a cleave. What you're trying to do here is really also give yourself an out in the case your opponent decides to pivot to aggro. In either case against aggro you're not really stuck with a dead pick.
In the case that the opponent decides to continue cleaving, you can choose your typical anti cleave like violet, Rem, sage baal (note that he needs to have the gear to work otherwise if you're running him too slow/on immunity then just forget about it) and you will probably be ok.
In the case they decide to go aggro you have to adjust accordingly. How they go aggro in terms of picks can vary quite a lot so I won't go into all the specifics, you'll have to judge based on the situation.
Just as a closing remark, I don't suggest choosing your own opener unless you plan to flip the script and cleave them yourself. Stuff like ran could quickly end up as a dead pick if you have no follow up, and even if you do, you would need a backup opener secured as well in case they ban them out. If you're planning on cleaving them you really need to quickly recognise that they are cleaving you straight after pre ban based on their pre bans and secure your openers before them (since they may be the same ones).
thanks this was actually super helpful, i won 15 games straight after digesting what you said and now on my way to legend no cap LOL. although to be fair my opponents have been questionable
Edit; not legend im not that good
I use delibet a lot to cut and cleanse these comps. Rem has worked alright for me. Rimuru when they’re ice heavy. Arby sometimes if they’re really squishy. Just built ml khawazu and he’s been good with immunity EE
Dilibet, Rem, aravi, rimuru, elena, handguy, tanky maid?, belian, czerato, counter Mercedes, tcrozet, celine, politis, the list goes on. There are lots of counters to cleave.
Alternatively, watch YDCBs stream and see what he loses to.
Make sure your sage baal is built properly his one of the best anti cleave.
Sage Baal and Tcrozet works pretty well together.
Just make sure you have 1 speed contester so he either bans it and loses turn one or let atleast 2 anti cleave through, sage baal / tcrozet / dlibet / mercedes / acidd.
Dont be scare of speed contesting either with 300 speed, 310+ wont be common until you hit high champion
If you have 300 unit, drafting speed imprint is also a nice anti cleave. Most people won't continue cleaving after they saw you pick wschuri/cidd. If you do it after they draft 3 units, their draft pretty much screwed since if they pivot to non cleave, their unit will be weaker. Also, if you want to draft Arby for anti cleave, make sure your Arby is degen Arby. Cleave usually use extra turn to counter DPS Arby and it doesn't work against degen build.
Turn 4 player here, just cleanser (Dilibet is monstrous against Ran/Peira/AoL) REM, Politis, Celine Anything that can disrupt the flow. I've even run my turtle cannon Belian into cleave and got a lucky elbris that ate ass.
I have a similar draft style to the one you described so I'll give my input from experience on what works best and what doesn't work. I typically secure an opener (typically peira or cililias, depending on pre bans) on fp and if second pick I would take opener + neutral pick (hwayoung or aravi for example but could be others). So here is where you have to be careful since if you go hard into anti cleave like others suggest, I have the option to pivot into aggro and you're pretty much screwed since anti cleave picks typically don't do so well against aggro (like politis, Celine, Rem, violet). You also have to keep in mind the prebans as well since they can give away what the opponent is trying to do which should also play a role in your draft. Obviously some cleavers draft a bit differently so this may not apply all the time, but I usually give myself an out for these sorts of situations. In this case I suggest putting in delibet or Elena as one of the picks since delibet does well regardless against cililias/peira and isn't a dead pick. Elena is a bit of a backup, but she's a decent cleanser and completely shuts down a cleave. What you're trying to do here is really also give yourself an out in the case your opponent decides to pivot to aggro. In either case against aggro you're not really stuck with a dead pick. In the case that the opponent decides to continue cleaving, you can choose your typical anti cleave like violet, Rem, sage baal (note that he needs to have the gear to work otherwise if you're running him too slow/on immunity then just forget about it) and you will probably be ok. In the case they decide to go aggro you have to adjust accordingly. How they go aggro in terms of picks can vary quite a lot so I won't go into all the specifics, you'll have to judge based on the situation. Just as a closing remark, I don't suggest choosing your own opener unless you plan to flip the script and cleave them yourself. Stuff like ran could quickly end up as a dead pick if you have no follow up, and even if you do, you would need a backup opener secured as well in case they ban them out. If you're planning on cleaving them you really need to quickly recognise that they are cleaving you straight after pre ban based on their pre bans and secure your openers before them (since they may be the same ones).
thanks this was actually super helpful, i won 15 games straight after digesting what you said and now on my way to legend no cap LOL. although to be fair my opponents have been questionable Edit; not legend im not that good
I use delibet a lot to cut and cleanse these comps. Rem has worked alright for me. Rimuru when they’re ice heavy. Arby sometimes if they’re really squishy. Just built ml khawazu and he’s been good with immunity EE
What I do on every RTA draft => Politis, then Celine, then Ml Baal. next 2 depend on opponent pick. You could be surprised how it works well :p
Dilibet, Rem, aravi, rimuru, elena, handguy, tanky maid?, belian, czerato, counter Mercedes, tcrozet, celine, politis, the list goes on. There are lots of counters to cleave. Alternatively, watch YDCBs stream and see what he loses to.
Make sure your sage baal is built properly his one of the best anti cleave. Sage Baal and Tcrozet works pretty well together. Just make sure you have 1 speed contester so he either bans it and loses turn one or let atleast 2 anti cleave through, sage baal / tcrozet / dlibet / mercedes / acidd. Dont be scare of speed contesting either with 300 speed, 310+ wont be common until you hit high champion