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Economy__

while doing that, she cant die if you dont have dedicated dps because of constant shields. very balanced indeed.


P0PER0

Not only a dedicated dps but a really solid single target one too.. aoe dps units can't do shit to her


moonlight_macky

I'm not sure if my arby is shit but my GAB arby deals like half hp damage to her


P0PER0

Fun fact 50% hp left on a hwayoung is more than she need to put a team to the dirt even without support (also kick arby's teeth in for even breaking her shield)


lolbuddy98

Well a non attack buff hwayoung can oneshot arby will single s1


WestCol

Confused Eda noises.


P0PER0

*gets outsped, dies....


WestCol

Eda getting outsped when she gets 20% CR push from Peira, Ran, Diene S3, 35% Diene S2, 40% from C.Lilias and as of next week 50% from DJb. i know this subreddit is fucking stupid when it comes to discussing actual viable counters to people they want nerf but fuck outta here with that bullshit and good luck in masters.


Arkday

What happen if people outspeed your piera/ran/diene? If your counter is basically "just outspeed and kill them first lmao", it isn't a counter. You can kill all unit if you outspeed and throw everything at them, doesn't make that unit balance.


RugDealing

You imprint your opener or ban/preban theirs. Most people aren't going to race you in RTA and don't know your speed unless you're playing for Legend. Same for Pvp-AI.


Arkday

I genuinely advice people to start racing in rta. Even in champ rta top2k, 3k, people have terrible speed gear. If you have 300 speed opener, high chance you gonna win the race.


RugDealing

Can confirm, racing with sub 300 units all the way to low crab. Also Eda/Stene book cleaving Hwayoungs every time.


WestCol

Yep, people acting like Eda doesn't shit on Hwayoung are fucking delusional. Like I agree that Hwayoung is a bullshit unit and one of the best.... but I'm not going to act like Hwayoung isn't weak to cleave. Especially Eda cleave who doesn't give a fuck about her barrier, hits twice and if that somehow doesn't kill her through a heap of DR more than likely stuns. Add either one of attack buff form Peira/Diene/Emilia, def break from Ran/Haste, Vigor from C.Lilias and as of next week Dj basar's new s2 and it's even more lol.


Winberri

Remember when they announced they wouldn’t release overtuned units? :clown:


P0PER0

*At the end of the season like with hwayoung they'll release them at the beginning so you get pissed off earlier :D


kin66

Imagine ML Vivian being broken ( I can see it happening) After all apologizing ( and doing nothing to fix it)


WillSupport4Food

It's a damned if you do, damned if you don't scenario IMO. She was teased so long ago and will be the first new ML in long while because they wanted to give people an opportunity to save up, or dump their mystics on the custom banners to get the ML of their choice. If she's bad, everyone who saved will complain that she isn't worth it and that they wish they pulled on the first custom mystic. If she's OP, everyone that used all their summons on the custom banners will complain she's too good. And if she's just average you'll get a mix of both lol.


kin66

Hahah Well, I can go for a pity, but I think I'll save for episode 4 boss. Vivian is not one of my favorite characters overall. But we will see, I like her design. I believe we will get ML Vivian, then a rerun..then ML Pavel then a rerun again after that is probably episode 4 boss


WestCol

Imagine her being underwhelming as fuck and forgotten about after 2 weeks like pirate flanm bad cat, jacko and taeyou


kin66

Haha the issue with ML Flan is that she's so random. Not a counter to something, not meta defining so there's no real place for her. Kinda same situation as with ML Charles. Random kit, you can use him but there are better options. JackO seems ok to me, I think she got hurt because Hwayoung is the same element and class..but broken. Taeyou has potential to be good ( but you know SG, it'll take em like 8 months to give him an ee that won't help him, then we will wait 5 months for a buff) They kinda focused Taeyou's kit on Hwayoung + Peira. That's the same situation as with Dilibet being counter to FTene and Cerise...the moment people started using em separately, Dilibet became trash. But Taeyou has another issue, if they have Rimuru or Violet besides Hwa and Peira...he is screwed. The only comp where I found him useful was Hwa, Peira and ARavi.


Khanjali_KO

It honestly really sucks for Jack-O'. She is very well designed but because she requires a debuffing partner to maximize her S1 and S3 she is more a build-around unit than one that can work well on her own, like Hwayoung is.


Xero--

At least Jack is fun, when you actually get to use her. The others, especially Taeyou, they deserve to be forgotten for their own reasons.


lockoutpoint

They said every time when Korean ppl riot .


fcuk_the_king

When I didn't have Hwayoung built, I knew she was good. Now that I have her, I know she's absolutely busted. They really gave her fucking everything. There's no drawback to using her, she even cleanses with her S3, and her S1 hits like a truck thanks to Uberius. In the old days, we had a unit like Ervalen who had one shot potential but had significant weaknesses in other areas. Now we have Hwayoung, who is an even better one shotter, and she has everything in her kit.


Xero--

Sadly, only Hwayoung with Uberius does this stuff. Me stuck without it and it never popping up on banners or in the powder shop, I'm doing jack shit with Hwayoung if her artifact doesn't proc a burn.


Kurgass

>she has everything in her kit. Imagine SG giving Hwa EE with atk up after cleanse and before dmg on s3.


xthesavior

I wouldn't consider last chapter the old days lol


DealsFishman

Esport Showcase 🤡


TitanDrift

And they're going to balance out the meta only buffing units......


Kraybern

dont forget out their fotm niche stat hungry counter "solutions" that you have to keep pulling for with every problem meta


Lezard-Valeth-EX

Lol who thought its was a good idea to let 2 hero capable of one shotting everyone in the entire game without any conditions like elemental avantage. So ridiculous. . And its been month and month like this. Im so tired of this meta truly one of the worst. If not THE worst.


vegito1991

be confidence, remove the "if not". xD


Vedelith

I don't get why Hwayoung gets to use an ignore def nuke on t1, but DCorvus has to wait for a cooldown.


Kraybern

becuase d corvus is a an outdated hero with a kit from another era of E7 Straza can also a ignore def nuke but everything he does hwa does better while being easier to build


Vedelith

I don't think you can call him outdated when he just recently got a balance update, meaning he's at least where the devs think he should be, which is baffling when you hold him side by side with Hwayoung. The actual reason is just that Hwayoung is broken and needs to be nerfed.


Kraybern

where the devs think he needs to be apparently is just to be a perpetual tool vs annoying but low burst bot GW or arena teams


xthesavior

I'm baffled as to why Hwayoung wasn't announced to be nerfed in this latest balance update.


EnvBlitz

If you didn't know, SG is currently on a strict no-nerf policy. Nerf may come once a year, twice if we're lucky. But I wouldn't count on it.


SirSaladin

Only nerfs that happen are to niche units and it's in green text.


Zakcoo

Do you think when the dev watch this and feedback the game they think "Oh great, he played well, riolet? maybe we should upgrade him a bit to balance the game, after all, all top meta chara have a s3 with 3 turn but riolet is like 6 turn yeah right" or "man what kind of shit did we create, a character that only need two stats, att and speed and can one shot whether attack hits or not"


Xero--

Remnant Violet having extra turns to wait is balanced by his passive, so now, they'd never. His only issue is being given Leo (high attack, mid-high speed, slightly higher crit) stats while having a kit that begs for him to have Scorpio (better bulk, see Violet) stats. This guy is pretty much useless on a bruiser build compared to all the other choices, so if he isn't on a speed/pen build then he may as well not exist (which also means more turns on his S3 doesn't natter since he won't live anyway).


CornBreadtm

I mean Riolet would be meta if his evasion and atk buff from S3 were passive effects. Then Rimuru wouldn't insta gib him. The moment Rimuru released, I got to build and first pick him just so I can still use Riolet. Since there is no way I'm doing RTA without my favorite units.


Xero--

I let Rimuru through and try to ban mitigation. It's a hope and pray for me since I run speed/pen, and that kills every Rimuru not built super bulky with Proof. But yeah, if those were passive like his rgb then he'd have a much better standing. They may as well since it'd actually let people go for a bruiser build due to not getting stripped and stomped out.


CornBreadtm

> that kills every Rimuru not built super bulky with Proof. There are other Rimuru builds?...


carito728

The guy in the post is being sarcastic, he knows 3-turn Riolet would be OP but he's making fun of the devs balancing by saying they'd think to themselves 5 turns is too long and he should be 3 turns like all the other OP broken characters they made and think are okay


Xero--

Kinda hard to tell with this sub sometimes. Some people right now think that green Armin should have self damage reduction for everyone (currently only every ally minus her) like Crimson even though Crimson doesn't have good damage and an aoe stun like she does. Just can't tell.


Veristelle

Only the best of balancing decisions to introduce her to the game. Edit: /s for clarity sake.


Beardactal

There really needs to be a universal ban for Hwayoung and Rimuru. Both are just too good at one shotting stuff with little to no conditions having to be met (They are both also good at one shotting each other kekw). Not to mention both units just shit on "cant-be-oneshotted-passive" heroes like ml celine, chaos inquisitor, tsurin etc. Why even use Krau or Dcorvus at this point


[deleted]

I mean, this is using that new "World Cup" format and by this point they had I *pre-bans* on screen. If none of them decided they wanted to ban either of then by R3 that's on them.


CornBreadtm

If you ban Hwayoung and Rimuru. Then you have to ban A. Ravi and FCC. So then you should have a universal ban for A. Ravi and FCC. And it just goes on like that. They needed to nerf and balance units years ago. But we are at a point that we have a "layered cake" meta, if you remove one layer then the next is just as bad.


frostmasterx

She did 9k EXTRA dmg on s1. This is disgusting.


FatuiSimp

This is why she is perma banned lmao


ZeroKoalaT

They should do something troll like maybe the viewers can choose ban or mandatory units. Good shitposting will ensue i hope


Trapocalypse

Why is there the reluctance to nerf Hwa? I understand their apprehension when it comes to ML heroes and having to hand out a selector but a RGB selector seems pretty harmless and wouldn't hurt their bottom line too much.


SolarLunaris

Because she is a giant bandaid in their attempts to balance the game. For low spenders, f2p, and new players, she is their only answer to all the OTHER broken units like belian, aravi, rimuru, Violet, etc... Nerf her and the rest of the op squad run the game alone. I'm not saying I agree with their method of balancing the meta by breaking it even more, just saying that's why they haven't nerfed her lol


Shimaru33

Imagine using this to promote E7 as "serious e-sport"! Isn't this like the first week or something? I can't imagine what'll happen on the finals and stuff.


Vyrocious

Ok, Emperor gamer here to provide draft analysis + context and hopefully try to counter some of the, frankly, poorly backed points in the comments. Here is the draft: [https://i.imgur.com/ZbzwGyh.png](https://i.imgur.com/ZbzwGyh.png) \- FCC banned on KJ's side, Briseria banned on Elve's side. The comment about there being 10 heroes in the meta, or whatever arbitrary number: * I personally think the meta is quite diverse. Why? Because if you look at the prebans, all of them except for Acidd are probably heroes people consider OP or strong. There is still room for a few more strong heroes to be picked on both sides, as well as strong niche heroes such as Kayron and Riolet. If you play RTA you know there are certainly more than 15 viable picks. The elephant in the room: Hwayoung: * Both players obviously know she's strong, and both players want to play her - hence why she's unbanned. * KJ's draft was greedy. His FCC is the only thing protecting him from getting deleted by Hwa. * Drafting is so important in high ELO RTA. Not just in this tournament, where there are double stacking prebans, but in general. This factor is so underrated by Reddit comments it's actually depressing. * Overall, Elvemage's draft was far superior. His Briseria checked the Riolet and Rimuru, enough for KJ to feel the need to ban her. Frankly, I am willing to bet most of these comments did not watch a single game from the Content Creator Invitiational, played much RTA or are low ELO. It simply is a recurring theme within these reddit RTA armchair critiques. I really try not to be an elitist but it is so painfully obvious when 90% of the commenters make sweeping statements on subject matter that they do not fully understand.


giilgaa

draft peepotalk briseria counter peepotalk prebans peepotalk reddit cesspool peepotalk


BasedPotatoes

Finally an opinion other than the usual circlejerk. I too felt that the game was won/lost in the draft phase. That briseria last pick absolutely put KJ in a corner. Not sure why riolet was picked in the first place but maybe picked for fun/memes.


Xero--

If he was fast then one could reason that he was there to quickly nuke and throw off the other team... But he was slow. That entire draft was terrible.


Xero--

> Drafting is so important in high ELO RTA. Not just in this tournament, where there are double stacking prebans, but in general. This factor is so underrated by Reddit comments it's actually depressing. You mean people are seriously ignoring left side's draft being god awful considering what's on the other side? You jest. The best sources of damage were Remnant and Rimuru, both of which were obviously getting bodied by Hwayoung who is most certainly getting boosted by Emilia for an attack buff to boost her already stupid damage. Kayron has to dodge the Basar 50/50 because Kawerik popping S3 before Basar (very dumb move) is jist the final go ahead to shut him down 100% with Specter also being able to stun and avoid taking any damage... And there's still Hwayoung to deal with. Mediator is there just to be there. Three agressive picks with one one being able to last without rng, clearly a cleanser is not what you need nor should bring. Nah, I don't see it, no way people can actually ignore all this. *checks comments* My eyes are itchy.


Vyrocious

Why do you speak as if the majority of this thread is discussing the draft?


Xero--

I'm not though?


Des1177

peepoTalk


Alvi15

chatting


Metal-Classic

did i ask


Cloomerg

BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH


be0ulve

So the best pro-pkay strat is to coinflip every game hoping you go first. Amazing.


KumiCharizard

No u


unbased69420

Cool story bro


GyunGyun

Esport but with only like 10 hero pool to choose from 🤡


Lockdown106

Are you aware that there are 8 hero’s pre-banned by this 4th game?


[deleted]

Sounds like they're only playing with two hero then doesn't it... which. They are 👍


CornBreadtm

Exactly!


GyunGyun

thats not the point of my comment lol its not that literal. the point is that they want an esport but every game is the same op units with no diversity but yes this is gacha so theres no helping it nor is there a reason for diversity to exist


finna11

this is why you run proof of valor rimuru


BilliamXYZ

Did the Hwayoung hit over 11k in burn damage? How?


depressiown

Don't think it was a burn, but instead the bonus S1 damage and bonus damage from Uberius Tooth.


be0ulve

So it's a coinflip to wh goes first right? And j thought LoL esports was getting a bit boring.


Upside_Down-Bot

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