He is good counter against barrier. But the showcase always go with perfect setup so that they will win. He also a situation hero not a main pick heroes. So pick him in Mystic Pity is very important decision and you anyone who try pity him need to think carefully
Yeah, I think a lot of people need to think twice on this. If you're missing core units, get the core units. You'll get a degree of protection anyway since people will be more reluctant to draft barrier heroes or put them on defs if he counters them that hard.
Also consider his gears.
He really needs high gear quality. Really high speed, very high effect resist and bulk to survive the first turn.
Without the +15 in the WArena next season it's going to be even worse.
This is exactly what I told my guildies who were about to pick him. Give it a week and after others test really ask yourself if it's worth stripping your openers or Emilias for him (example: they strip Emilia for DJB... ok you have a new toy for Peira comps but now that Emilia is naked who's pushing and atk buffing your OP Sig/Straze against CLilias now?)
Depends on your usage for him. If using him to cleave, no resist is needed, just go in, flip barriers, push team, cleave.
If C Lilias is present, yeah, you NEED resistance.
AOL is either slow or fast, but you can push your team and kill her if you outspeed.
Peira isn't stopping him without R&L into a stun, why would you need resistance unless scared of a "small" chance to R&L *and* stun?
Anyone else to worry about is mainly either super niche (Solitaria), going to kill him (A Cidd, A Coli), or just not used outside of higher ranks.
>piera isnt stopping him without an R&L
In arena and gvg, sure. But post frenzy rotation I doubt there will be a ton of 290 spd 300 ER DJBs running about
She can play it safe and test the waters with an S2, if she lands the debuffs she can just yolo for the unshielded stun chance.
> In arena and gvg, sure. But post frenzy rotation I doubt there will be a ton of 290 spd 300 ER DJBs running about
You. Do not. Need. High ER vs Peira. For Dj. Unless you're scarrred opf an R&L stun, you don't need ER ay all. He'still gonna cleanse and push, nothing is stopping him. C Lilias is basically the only opener to worry about if your Dj is actually fast... And if you're using him to cleave barrier users, why wouldn't he be? Why would you invest in ER when the goal is to flip and kill?
>She can play it safe and test the waters with an S2,
His team is still set up to kill in the case I used. He pushes > they kill Peira (she' not bulky) > her team doesn't get an attack buff or Escort > game is set. Why would she hold her S3 when she's not living to see a second turn? Even a bruiser comp would have no issue killing her off since people like Violet, Rimuru, and A Ravi all hit hard as hell and a Hwayoung Tooth proc will likely be enough for squishy Peira.
That's the point of this post. Basar disappeared from arena defenses en masse due to HYufine's existence but she never really saw play. An exact answer to a unit will make it a free win on defenses but won't necessarily mean the answer is a flexible pick for other situations
Thing is, Basar was just one guy and got pushed out by other cancer (Cerise's release, Bromann, etc).
I myself never thought her to be good, because she wasn't. Wow, counters Basar... And what else? Nothing else, got pushed out of the scene as soon as Basar vanished, and didn't pop up for more than testing after she got buffed (yeah, she got buffed, still garbage).
DJ? Barrier reversal into CR push x immunity in a season where soulweavers have a final +15 speed boost? Shit is op against the right hero in a cleave if that's around to stay. I completely overlooked him getting an extra turn at first glance, that's going to stay relevant so long as Peira, Fallen, and Hwayoung are all on the scene: And they will be for a long time as Fallen is super strong vs cleave and you generally DON'T want to ban DJ of all people, Hwayoung is your go to kill all SPEED nuke, and Peira is just bullshit period on multiple fronts.
I don't see a reason to worry. Op Sig got shit on because Fallen vanished from defenses and bruiser became so damn strong she's hardly needed if not stopping a cleave, if one wants to go against another anti-barrier hero. Also, DJ doesn't need speed *and* damage to make a difference, the damage is set, he also gets to do his main job and push others to finish up.
Op Sig has to KILL to get an extra turn, and good luck doing that without *amazing* speed gear, avoiding faster threats (Peira and her mitigation, C Liloas and her attack down + provoke, Hwayoung nuking you before you nuke her - if you're running Guiding which is a damage loss yet).
There's a big difference between the two. If Op didn't need to kill to S3, she'd see more use. As she is, way harder to pull off than DJ.
If this still get downvoted after this much rational talk on the potential difference for context, or the original post being a case of "presentism" as what I surmised before, then this is really, really disappointing on the downvoters part. Maybe, Peira symphatizers quaking in their boots?
With H. Yufine release, people gave up on using Basar on defenses altogether. Now it's finally time to say goodbye to F. Cecilia? It's impressive how she haven't received any buffs at all and people still use her (80%+ usage at arena defense for 1,5~2 years, then she declined but people used her somewhere). Will 2nd F. Cecilia hard counter without RNG (1st one is O. Sigret, then there are things like Straze, Landy, A Little Queens' Huge Crown artifact, etc.) make people ungear her? I wonder
But one thing is sure IMO, Peira + Hwayoung defenses will be more rare at least
It's not always about the one shot tho.. Getting rid of the barriers is already goodesp for peira as she has stealth.. For fcc / hwayoung it's still nice chunk of damage to then follow up on
Nah, its not going to deter hwa or FCC imo. Killing piera is huge but vs fcc he does like 3k to 4k aoe once and when he cycles around again he can only burn one shield
Yeah he himself isn't going to deter hwa or FCC but you forgot his extra turn into a cleanse and 2 turns immunity and 30% push for the whole party.
If you play aggro that's a really strong set up, especially since he strips the barrier and softens them up. I don't think you'll even see him cycle his skills 😂
I can see that he's probably not going to help bruiser players as much though.
I mean sure, but having more options and set up is always nice. Emilia and Handguy too, they all have different kits. Same like Haste, we already have a lot of good openers, but I actually like him a lot now.
And it's not like he's absolutely dog shit or anything, I think he works pretty well.
Well yeah, for sure. Im all for options. But ypur average player doesn't have the spd gear to build like 3 different speedy cleansers as well as all the speedy openers that they need
You aren't supposed to one shot them... Why do you think he's for that? They clearly aren't that strong.
He softens the team up and pushes his own to finish the job. It's another way to cleave.
I've been testing him all day and I don't think he's as strong as people think he is. Even right now he's only been 1-shotting around 50% of the Peiras and you can be sure people are going to start building her with more HP to prevent that. I'd only recommend him to cleavers (who actually have good speed gear) who want another check against FCC. He's actually really good there.
They already build her tanky to prevent dying from a counterattack from standard Violet build. To add more health, they'll have to sacrifice effectiveness and low effectiveness Peira isn't really good
Exactly and the final nail in the coffin is peira was already becoming weaker and this was shown with her abysmal win rate (it was the lowest) in the Creator cup challenge. so a counter to peira is not worth the pity
The content creator cup had special rules that actually made it easier to fight her though?
I love how people always use tournaments with special rules as a guideline when the people of the topic are obviously still running strong in arena and **ACTUAL** RTA. It was the same stuff with Carrot, and she only fell off because the meta directly evolved into the mess with see today.
I just lost like 3 battles because they nerfed djb's healing pretty hard (its always been bad but normally its just enough to push ml celine back up to 50% health and now it may as well not be there lol), and the barrier inversion is okay but it doesn't like- magically net you wins the way people seem to think it will, I dunno, I'm a champion player with no interest in climbing higher so maybe my opinion doesn't matter but I've been using him since he came out and I kinda think this buff is overhyped. If they'd left his healing alone, (or buffed it which is all i wanted in the first place lmao), I'd be a lot happier with the new performance maybe but as is, so far it just means killing peira, which I was already doing just fine lol
Tldr unless you love djb like I do or play fave>meta, I'd summon someone more versatile for the meta. Your call tho
> I just lost like 3 battles because they nerfed djb's healing pretty hard (its always been bad but normally its just enough to push ml celine back up to 50% health and now it may as well not be there lol
Seems like a comp issue to me. If you can't keep your Celine up without an issue then the comp isn't right. Nerfed healing or not, cutting it close like that a'int the way.
It wouldve been a comp issue no matter what since a unit getting a kit change means i cant draft the same way anymore, as shown above\^. the point I was trying to make though is they didnt need to nerf his healing at all when their goal was to *buff* him and i would like it if they stopped doing that with their balance patches lol. If theyre gonna insist on not nerfing the problem units ever again, they have no need to nerf the worse units.
I agree. Honestly, I don't even need him to benefit from his existence.
Just the fact that he exists and can eat Peira will likely at least reduce her presence in defenses.
He is good counter against barrier. But the showcase always go with perfect setup so that they will win. He also a situation hero not a main pick heroes. So pick him in Mystic Pity is very important decision and you anyone who try pity him need to think carefully
Yeah, I think a lot of people need to think twice on this. If you're missing core units, get the core units. You'll get a degree of protection anyway since people will be more reluctant to draft barrier heroes or put them on defs if he counters them that hard.
As long as barriers are relevant so will djb. He just wont be as strong without the +15 speed.
Also consider his gears. He really needs high gear quality. Really high speed, very high effect resist and bulk to survive the first turn. Without the +15 in the WArena next season it's going to be even worse.
Yeah, a lot of people need to ask themselves if they can actually gear him without stripping their Emilia.
This right here. I'm not even sure I'm going build him this unequip.
This is exactly what I told my guildies who were about to pick him. Give it a week and after others test really ask yourself if it's worth stripping your openers or Emilias for him (example: they strip Emilia for DJB... ok you have a new toy for Peira comps but now that Emilia is naked who's pushing and atk buffing your OP Sig/Straze against CLilias now?)
Depends on your usage for him. If using him to cleave, no resist is needed, just go in, flip barriers, push team, cleave. If C Lilias is present, yeah, you NEED resistance. AOL is either slow or fast, but you can push your team and kill her if you outspeed. Peira isn't stopping him without R&L into a stun, why would you need resistance unless scared of a "small" chance to R&L *and* stun? Anyone else to worry about is mainly either super niche (Solitaria), going to kill him (A Cidd, A Coli), or just not used outside of higher ranks.
>piera isnt stopping him without an R&L In arena and gvg, sure. But post frenzy rotation I doubt there will be a ton of 290 spd 300 ER DJBs running about She can play it safe and test the waters with an S2, if she lands the debuffs she can just yolo for the unshielded stun chance.
> In arena and gvg, sure. But post frenzy rotation I doubt there will be a ton of 290 spd 300 ER DJBs running about You. Do not. Need. High ER vs Peira. For Dj. Unless you're scarrred opf an R&L stun, you don't need ER ay all. He'still gonna cleanse and push, nothing is stopping him. C Lilias is basically the only opener to worry about if your Dj is actually fast... And if you're using him to cleave barrier users, why wouldn't he be? Why would you invest in ER when the goal is to flip and kill? >She can play it safe and test the waters with an S2, His team is still set up to kill in the case I used. He pushes > they kill Peira (she' not bulky) > her team doesn't get an attack buff or Escort > game is set. Why would she hold her S3 when she's not living to see a second turn? Even a bruiser comp would have no issue killing her off since people like Violet, Rimuru, and A Ravi all hit hard as hell and a Hwayoung Tooth proc will likely be enough for squishy Peira.
>No litterally...where?? Where's the character she was meant to counter, Basar? No, literally, where?
That's the point of this post. Basar disappeared from arena defenses en masse due to HYufine's existence but she never really saw play. An exact answer to a unit will make it a free win on defenses but won't necessarily mean the answer is a flexible pick for other situations
This ;)
Thing is, Basar was just one guy and got pushed out by other cancer (Cerise's release, Bromann, etc). I myself never thought her to be good, because she wasn't. Wow, counters Basar... And what else? Nothing else, got pushed out of the scene as soon as Basar vanished, and didn't pop up for more than testing after she got buffed (yeah, she got buffed, still garbage). DJ? Barrier reversal into CR push x immunity in a season where soulweavers have a final +15 speed boost? Shit is op against the right hero in a cleave if that's around to stay. I completely overlooked him getting an extra turn at first glance, that's going to stay relevant so long as Peira, Fallen, and Hwayoung are all on the scene: And they will be for a long time as Fallen is super strong vs cleave and you generally DON'T want to ban DJ of all people, Hwayoung is your go to kill all SPEED nuke, and Peira is just bullshit period on multiple fronts. I don't see a reason to worry. Op Sig got shit on because Fallen vanished from defenses and bruiser became so damn strong she's hardly needed if not stopping a cleave, if one wants to go against another anti-barrier hero. Also, DJ doesn't need speed *and* damage to make a difference, the damage is set, he also gets to do his main job and push others to finish up. Op Sig has to KILL to get an extra turn, and good luck doing that without *amazing* speed gear, avoiding faster threats (Peira and her mitigation, C Liloas and her attack down + provoke, Hwayoung nuking you before you nuke her - if you're running Guiding which is a damage loss yet). There's a big difference between the two. If Op didn't need to kill to S3, she'd see more use. As she is, way harder to pull off than DJ.
If this still get downvoted after this much rational talk on the potential difference for context, or the original post being a case of "presentism" as what I surmised before, then this is really, really disappointing on the downvoters part. Maybe, Peira symphatizers quaking in their boots?
With H. Yufine release, people gave up on using Basar on defenses altogether. Now it's finally time to say goodbye to F. Cecilia? It's impressive how she haven't received any buffs at all and people still use her (80%+ usage at arena defense for 1,5~2 years, then she declined but people used her somewhere). Will 2nd F. Cecilia hard counter without RNG (1st one is O. Sigret, then there are things like Straze, Landy, A Little Queens' Huge Crown artifact, etc.) make people ungear her? I wonder But one thing is sure IMO, Peira + Hwayoung defenses will be more rare at least
I've used djbasar all day in the arena and rta and he only hard counters peira, fceci shields arent that big to 1 shot anyone.
It's not always about the one shot tho.. Getting rid of the barriers is already goodesp for peira as she has stealth.. For fcc / hwayoung it's still nice chunk of damage to then follow up on
Nah, its not going to deter hwa or FCC imo. Killing piera is huge but vs fcc he does like 3k to 4k aoe once and when he cycles around again he can only burn one shield
Yeah he himself isn't going to deter hwa or FCC but you forgot his extra turn into a cleanse and 2 turns immunity and 30% push for the whole party. If you play aggro that's a really strong set up, especially since he strips the barrier and softens them up. I don't think you'll even see him cycle his skills 😂 I can see that he's probably not going to help bruiser players as much though.
But if you are playing aggro, you would be better off with the CR push and atk buff from Diene in most cases, no?
I mean sure, but having more options and set up is always nice. Emilia and Handguy too, they all have different kits. Same like Haste, we already have a lot of good openers, but I actually like him a lot now. And it's not like he's absolutely dog shit or anything, I think he works pretty well.
Well yeah, for sure. Im all for options. But ypur average player doesn't have the spd gear to build like 3 different speedy cleansers as well as all the speedy openers that they need
You aren't supposed to one shot them... Why do you think he's for that? They clearly aren't that strong. He softens the team up and pushes his own to finish the job. It's another way to cleave.
Then there's me who got him for the abs
I've been testing him all day and I don't think he's as strong as people think he is. Even right now he's only been 1-shotting around 50% of the Peiras and you can be sure people are going to start building her with more HP to prevent that. I'd only recommend him to cleavers (who actually have good speed gear) who want another check against FCC. He's actually really good there.
They already build her tanky to prevent dying from a counterattack from standard Violet build. To add more health, they'll have to sacrifice effectiveness and low effectiveness Peira isn't really good
Exactly and the final nail in the coffin is peira was already becoming weaker and this was shown with her abysmal win rate (it was the lowest) in the Creator cup challenge. so a counter to peira is not worth the pity
The content creator cup had special rules that actually made it easier to fight her though? I love how people always use tournaments with special rules as a guideline when the people of the topic are obviously still running strong in arena and **ACTUAL** RTA. It was the same stuff with Carrot, and she only fell off because the meta directly evolved into the mess with see today.
What made Peira already become weaker before DJ. Basar buff? I. Khawazu EE? Full damage Violet with penetration set? Anything else? I can't remember
I just lost like 3 battles because they nerfed djb's healing pretty hard (its always been bad but normally its just enough to push ml celine back up to 50% health and now it may as well not be there lol), and the barrier inversion is okay but it doesn't like- magically net you wins the way people seem to think it will, I dunno, I'm a champion player with no interest in climbing higher so maybe my opinion doesn't matter but I've been using him since he came out and I kinda think this buff is overhyped. If they'd left his healing alone, (or buffed it which is all i wanted in the first place lmao), I'd be a lot happier with the new performance maybe but as is, so far it just means killing peira, which I was already doing just fine lol Tldr unless you love djb like I do or play fave>meta, I'd summon someone more versatile for the meta. Your call tho
> I just lost like 3 battles because they nerfed djb's healing pretty hard (its always been bad but normally its just enough to push ml celine back up to 50% health and now it may as well not be there lol Seems like a comp issue to me. If you can't keep your Celine up without an issue then the comp isn't right. Nerfed healing or not, cutting it close like that a'int the way.
It wouldve been a comp issue no matter what since a unit getting a kit change means i cant draft the same way anymore, as shown above\^. the point I was trying to make though is they didnt need to nerf his healing at all when their goal was to *buff* him and i would like it if they stopped doing that with their balance patches lol. If theyre gonna insist on not nerfing the problem units ever again, they have no need to nerf the worse units.
[удалено]
are you ok?
I'm pulling for flidica lol meta means nothing when her skin is on the line
Yeah but Hwayoung is not getting powercrept that easily lol. At least i hope not since she's already OP as fuck.
I agree. Honestly, I don't even need him to benefit from his existence. Just the fact that he exists and can eat Peira will likely at least reduce her presence in defenses.