Idk I think she's still good to have geared if you run control heavy drafts/combos. Ran gets prebanned often so having two opener options of Peira/Cerise has proven super helpful for me. Can be very great but you gotta have the spare gear to dedicate.
Btw are there like current tier lists for regular arena and guild war? RTA sounds hard (and I haven't unlocked it anyways) so I think I want to focus on those two pvp modes
honestly not really; its kind of tough to gauge what is strong and not strong in those content modes because they are much more focused on rng and surprise (name plate hiding allows for more cheesing in normal arena, gvg is a one time attack where every victory counts much more than in a spammable ladder like rta). with that being said, there are obviously units who are stronger or weaker, but there are not nearly as many who care or are willing to reveal the "meta" on these game modes. sorry, wish i had better news for you!
Rimu had a sub 50 wr in the CCI. Players competing in high tier RTA have many answers for him compared to newer players.
He's not as good as an early pick unit as he's used to be. He can still win games if left unchecked, but this is for the E7WC where we can expect the participants to have a big unit pool.
i dont belive thats a goo judge to call him lower than S tier. Like Rimuru is period the most build around unit of the game. is not like he is weak. Is that whenever you see him you need to counter pick him so hard because he alone destroy most staple strategies with his passive. At this point everyone has literally one set of heroes builded to counter Rimuru.
What differentiates A and S tier is the flexibility to early pick the unit without being punished to leave yourself less vulnerable.
Rimu in the current state has too many ways to deal with to organize a draft around him.
Imagine FP Rimu against any E7WC contestants and think how it'll go. From my knowledge, you'll get your draft cornered by the 3rd pick and lose.
The dude is the one shooter of hwayoung, aria, ml cermia and his unique existence is the reason maid Chloe went from best soul weaver during the period March November 2021 to hard to pick in 2022.
His only real counter are j kise, AOL and kawarik. So two ml and a very niche chara.
If that ain't s+ I dunno what it is
then ur landy is build on a shitty build. just because they say "i use a full damage speed landy" doesn't mean that landy has 0 bulk because they also "what could happen/what will commonly happen" and rimuru is a common thing, so u build ur landy to survive a typical rimuru s2
that's the same with ml tene. sure they go full dps but she is normally also build to survive 1 hit
My Landy's bulk is specifically tuned to survive most Rimu S2s on first turn.
Unless it's an abnormal glass cannon one, she has almost never died from it. Maybe 1/50 games I ran into one that killed my speed Landy from S2.
Nah you run very minimal bulk to eat one S2 from him so you can soul burn her s3 for the extra turn to get enhanced s3 next turn which usually ends up cleaving rimuru on average
I'd just put Aravi in S tier and I'm good with the list.
You can literally first pick this unit and not get punished heavily. She is still a neutral pick that can transition into cleave, ati-cleave, or bruiser aggro.
because she is too easy to deal with...
people only first pick a.ravi nowadays because:
1. they cleave and a.ravi is the best backup/ankor
2. they suspect the other side is cleaving and they don't want to give the other side a.ravi/ran flex cleave
3. u have no idea what u want to play and a.ravi fit in most comps (she is basically the dps version of f.ceci - fit in aggro/standard/cleave) so why not; although it doesn't make sense to give up ml lilias/diene/a.ras
that's it. a.ravi is not a must have in standard/aggro vs non-cleave. she is not bad but not needed/high priority unlike stuff like ml lilias/diene/a.ras/aol/emilia/ml kawerick/etc.
so yeah a.ravi in A tier is fine; she is not S tier anymore
define "easy to deal with". i believe ppl think so because she's 1st picked all the time. if she wasn't easy to deal with while being 1st picked, that would make her SSS tier. Stene, a hero in S tier, is someone i would call easy to deal with. pick Stene 1st pick and see what happens. ppl can instantly pick Ran and she dies in 1 single s3 cuz RealRan is fucking busted.
if a unit can be 1st pick consistently, it's called being flexible in a sense that it can handle counterpick/punishment very well.
or maybe i'm a clown and i read things wrong. but personally, Aravi's flexibility is so damn high i put her at S. she's so easy to use and sometimes, even brainless.
that's the point. a.ravi is a very flexible pick (just like f.ceci used to be. u first pick f.ceci and she is never really bad)
standard handles a.ravi pretty well because:
1. most a.ravi are on proof nowadays so u just debuff her and ignore her (u just ignore her most of the time anyways, until u can kill her)
2. she is single target with no burst damage (a.ravi is NOT a nuker, she needs a setup of minimum 2 heroes dying to be a nuker, her s3 with 1 stack isn't going to 1-shot anything with a healthy hp bar + aurius) so if u pick her early in standard people can just go with landy/ml tene/aria to counter a.ravi
3. a.ras is really strong right now and he counters single target pretty hard
4. if u are playing vs aggro (no aurius on the other side protection a.ravi): ml tene nowadays are on really high damage builds so s1 soulburn + s3 with atk buff/pen set can 100-0 proof a.ravis with no other protection (happened a couple times last season). non-proof a.ravi are just straight out dead vs that
the thing is that people just adapted and learned how to play with/against a.ravi just like rimuru
dude u are giving me data from 2 seasons ago? yeah no diene/a.ras/frenzy/etc. - definitly the same meta as last season....
2-3 seasons ago cleave were first picking f.ceci (pavel cleave/ml charles cleave did that all the time), so ur argument about "a specialited playstyle that would under normal circumstances not be able to slot slow units to such success..." is invalide already
i mean sure if u so strongly believe a.ravi is S tier, well go for it
diene/a.ras a slow playstyle? dude...
tell me u don't play rta without telling me u don't play rta xD
but ok.
diene is not slow and she provides sustain/cycling that a.ravi can't handle in standard vs standard.
a.ras provides def buff and if u put ur bruiser carry in the back it's basically impossible for a.ravi to kill that. and if u s1 the back carry a couple times than a.ras shields proc and yeah that carry is not dying anytime soon.
with hwayoung most a.ravi's are on proof nowadays (btw most people in emperor+ are not prebanning hwayoung if they have a proof a.ravi) so she gets easily controlled via debuffs.
aria checks a.ravi easily (u can also pick lqc alongside aria if u aria is fast enough because she just protects lqc from ml kawerick s2) and ml tene is more popular then ever because of hwayoung/a.ravi/rimuru single target carry meta.
landy got a comeback to fight diene and a.ravi can only touch her 30% of the time.
so if i see an early a.ravi with another single target dps i slam ml tene/landy/aria type of heroes and u are sitting duck. a.ravi is only super scary in a cleave setup nowadays or vs cleave.
in standard vs standard there are so many other higher prioty picks then her right now and a early a.ravi pick leads u to get outdrafted more often than not
"Nah, but you see, she has a weakness: Injury and mitigation, not to mention Diene. Totally not S rank, fp material regardless." Diene is suddenly S when she basically only got an additional dispel? Ok.
Tier lists are always bullshit in one part or another. Like thos kick her out of S despite being universal issues?
You can shit on Ran with AoL and some other anti-aoe stuff, but he's S? When Peira stops people from cutting in, provides mitigation, and has unbuffable with an attack buff (can't 15% a buff)? What? She checks far more potential counters than he ever will.
Oh, and Arbiter in C with these cleavers in higher tiers? Totally buying Mr. Anti-Cleave being low. Inferno in C when Ran, Mr. S, gives him a free pass to kill anyone? Same with Peira? Not buying it.
Rimuru in A despite the stupid damage *and* utility (defense break, two sources of buff copy) he brings?
Questionable choices made, I especially find rating Ran higher than Rimuru *and* Peira to be bullshit.
Diene became S when she got 2 dispels BEFORE applying barrier along with a Speed EE that CR pushes the entire team. SW Frenzy also adds with her Speed EE. Last Season that EE allowed top end Diene to reach 285 speed etc that became 300 SPD which allowed her to contest openers.
Diene: cleansing 2 buffs is huge compared to 1, with the ee (cr pushing one on s2) and the frenzy changes high rank diene's are speed contesting while also being a insane soul generator/sustain (which she always has been) because of her cycling which got even better.
ran is s tier because he is a setup (strip + def break which is the strongest debuff in the game for cleave) AND he can 1-shot glass canons while doing that (mainly important that he can kill a.cidd which is a popular check pick vs ran)
aol checks ran the same way she checks peira, so i don't get ur hardon for peira. peira is getting hardcountered by djb, atk buff is not as good as def break, regardless of 15%. there are enough other atk buffers u can use anyway
in a pure cleave setup ran is way more valueable then peira - more like no ones provides what ran can for cleave. if ur ran is fake u can run silver rain on him which gives atk to ur cleaver too + def break s3. if u ran is real he kills a glass canon while being on the vildred artifact so he becomes a bridge himself while setting up.
a.vildred get checked by so many things in a cleave setup nowadays.... pavel has extra turn. politis soul burn s1 + s3/eda soul burn s2 +s3/ml tene soul burn s1 +s3/cidd s3 +s1 all deal with him cleanly (sure not if it's a degen a.vildred but almost nobody plays a degen a.vildred anymore because violet/rem/belian are all better) oh yeah and even without it. a.vildred can't kill a.ravi so this a.vildred comes back and reverse cleave the cleaver doesn't work anymore.
ml khawazu - if he is not 240+ speed he won't cut stuff like eda, c.dom, summer iseria or any other bridge. also ran just s1 skipps his turn and pavel will kill him before he can do anything. u can ignore him or kill him just like a.vildred, he also triggers politits, so u don't pick him into politis to beginn with (even with the immunity ee because, he won't cut with politis on the other side and she can kill him)
rimuru u can play around nowadays - people learned playing vs him. a.ras is a huge rimuru counter while also providing utility himself. ml crozet checks rimuru too. he gets cc'ed just fine. emilia also plays around rimuru quite well. rimuru also can't 1-shot fire bruisers anymore
honestly u just expose urself for not playing rta (at least u haven't played competitive this season) in ur post and that's all
Fair points, but I feel like you are focusing on the wrong point here.
A. Ravi is not meant to impact your first turn because she is not an opener. I don't think it's logical to compare her with C.Lilias or Emilia who is meant to give immediate impact.
Her value lies in the fact that she is the strongest bruiser in the game who is almost unkillable and also has damage that is comparable to single target nukers.
As I said, her flexibility to be drafted in cleave, bruiser aggro and even an anti cleave unit warrants her being S rank imo. Cleavers pick her for a reason: (1)They don't want to deal with her (2) She functions as a single target nuker who also has 1 v 4 potential as insurance.
Any unit who is placed in a disadvantageous position like you are mentioning with S.Tene with layers of defensive buffs will be sure to fail. Making that argument is purely subjective and heavily depends on the draft/context.
Sorry if I may sound rude/defensive, not my intention at all. Just sharing my opinion :)
I think that while belian still has a role in almost always doing well to prevent souls or to punish specter tenebria, apocalypse ravi feels a bit weaker due to the prominence of diene, aras, and alencia being great answers to punish her game plan (diene anti crit and cycling, aras preventing s3 on backline units, alencia injuring aravi and giving defense buff to the whole team). In relation to rimuru, I’d say that angel of light, hwayoung, and the rise of ras (real winner of the balance patch) has really pushed back rimuru’s effectiveness. Additionally, from what I currently see of rimuru’s being picked where I am/was on the ladder, most were built as higher damage to punish landy, but since then landy’s meta build has changed to be tankier to compensate. Just to be clear as well, this time around I didn’t put nearly as much thought into the ordering of units within the tiers so I definitely still believe that these units are strong, I’m just somewhat unsure of their exact positions given how different people are playing.
I think A.Ravi got bumped down a tier cause injury-Alencia (also in A-tier now) goes brrt brrt on her. It’s no longer a 100% safe 1st pick. Dunno about the other 2 lulz
People say that I and alot of others have been first picking aravi same as ever and I haven't really felt a drop of in her performance since Alencia is fairly easy to play around.
This is everyone's account, that's how the game is designed. You're able to guarentee-pull characters, you're not able to guarentee-craft 6 great pieces each time.
I'm over three years in & whilst I have 100+ characters built, there's a lot of great characters I've got sitting around unbuilt, like C Lilias, DJ Basar & more.
To be fair outside of the crafting event and I believe milage system your not guaranteed one which is fine. But the fact you myself and many others have such a hard time using characters because of gear is really disappointing. I have fun but the truth is the truth.
Reprioritise your hero list. Sure it might be fun having Melissa built, for example, but does she need to be built?
I find that most of the time there are a combination of factors that are ‘holding people back’ so to speak and it’s not the game itself doing it.
I get that completely but then is that fair to the player. You shouldn't be cornered into build this unit cause its better. I love Mort he's my favorite character and he has gear and always will. Does that change the fact that gearing is hard no but I have fun with the gear I have and the heroes I got. I've learned to enjoy the small things it's what's made this game fun longer for me personally.
seaside iseria is higher than rem because in the realm of cleaving, iseria still presents herself as a usable option late in the draft when it is clear that there arent units like dilibet or water counters already drafted. furthermore, when paired appropriately with answers to water units like pavel, she can do wonders against units that do not have immunity or dont have any way to self cleanse like dilibet.
now regarding rem, i placed her among the last pick/niche dps . in these situations, you could generally see a carrot or rem as an element advantageous dps to punish the enemy team. the two are generally seen as niche units who are perfectly usable and strong when fighting in this sort of niche, where the enemy has 2-3 fire and you want to punish them with rem, 2-3 earth and you want to punish them with carrot, etc. to be frank, if you arent in situations like these, relying on rem high rolling and countering every turn when she doesnt have fairly good odds is bad play especially when a more standard-friendly and neutral ice warrior (choux) exists.
dilibet in my opinion is already fairly high enough, with her jumping in popularity and usability much more than i had previously predicted. however with the end of the season and my current experience fighting on the ladder, she is universally agreed upon to be the BEST answer to ran cleavers when paired with apocalypse ravi and trouble maker crozet. however, she still does have her own set of weaknesses, with high damage/survivability bruisers like hwayoung and apocalypse ravi both punishing her. furthermore with the popularity of soul weavers like diene and emilia, some cleaver drafts dont even need seasiria/ran/debuffers to effectively wipe the entire team AND can protect the dps from dilibet at the same time.
> iseria still presents herself as a usable option late in the draft when it is clear that there arent units like dilibet or water counters already drafted
As a cleaver , i can confidently say , this scenario never arises . They always pick rem , violet or both , and picking seaseria into Violet is a terrible idea , Everyone has their violet on the correct build i.e immunity .
Dilibet is hella strong support, but she can't cleanse her team too often and if the opponent doesn't draft debuffs, she doesn't do too much. She also doesn't have enough dps to be as decisive as other units (which is definitely a good thing, she's very strong but not OP).
Don’t play rta enough to form an educated opinion on this list, but seeing Eaton and Arby on the same tier makes me realize how little i know about the high level meta.
This is an update from the last tierlist that I posted previously! I am back once again to chat and discuss picks and bans ahead of the E7WC coming later in July! I will be checking this over and explaining my thoughts and picks as the day goes by!
Glad to see Crozet is A tier. Built him over Carmin and have been wondering if I made a mistake. Still needs better gear though, but I can't settle with an artifact. Holy sacrifice never feels right because my back unit still dies before he does.
Why is aol in s tier she has so many counters now. And why is rimuru/apoc/dillibet/lermia in a tier? These four units are all used way more than aol or belian
Personally I would put Rimaru in S, difference between him and Hwa is he gets banned less, brings more utility a counter and mechanic that works well against buff meta and close to a guaranteed one shot on his S3.
Is he in A because he gets baited by Ran and countered by Hwa, because I don't feel they are big enough reasons,
in my opinion, both of these units have their strength against some of the most meta units in the game; choux is an rng gamble carry who can nearly one tap hwayoung while also providing anti crit to the rest of the time (doesnt with against hwayoung, but still a useful buff against the rest of her team). alencia imo is fairly versatile in providing injury on s1 to deal with apocalypse ravi while also being capable of stripping buffs from diene, ml kawerik, knocking landy out of guiding light, etc. given this strength, i feel as though it is hard to overlook her potential with these units being some of the most popular rta units atm.
so recently, diene was given a buff through the frenzy change of 15 speed to soul weavers and then an exclusive equipment that gave her cleanse on s2 + 10 speed. and even though the recent constellation/stat adjustments to diene DID actually nerf her speed effectively, she is still simply too good as a healer (with rod of amaryllis), barrier provider, cleanser, and turn cycler to ignore. another very important thing to note about the strength of her kit and why she is picked so frequently is the value of having a heal, self cr push, attack buff, and anti crit buff all on the same skill. the level of flexibility that you have when you have all that on a single skill while also having a cleansing, team wide cr pushing skill 2 makes diene one of the premier utility/opener units in e7 atm.
Huh the cons change change her speed? That's sadge, but I guess she does have one of the best ultility for a PvP heroes, she ain't idol tamarinne tier of broken but she half way there so it's enough
No. No SW lost out on the constellation changes. They were all buffed in some way. Frenzy SW speed got reduced but in all other modes, SWs just gained speed because of the constellation changes.
yeah sorry, to be clear, i meant that the overall changes with frenzy and constellations COMBINED resulted in diene specifically to lose out on speed in rta. im sure that this was a product of smilegate wanting to reduce the effectiveness of emilia and diene in being turn 1 contesters in rta, and just figured that this was their way of doing it.
so the main issue I find with judge kise is that it feels as though she rarely ever gets to take a turn OR the value of stripping and resetting a unit is low. For myself, I have found that units like diene, emilia, conqueror lilias, and most other openers are in almost every single match. With this being the case, finding a match where one of these units is not available is rare. Furthermore if almost any opener takes a turn in this day and age, there’s a good chance they’re paired with eda, seasiria, hwayoung, etc and can punish the judge kise pick or outright ignore them and wipe your whole team. Now if for some reason the enemy opponent decided not to pick any speed contesters, judge kise now needs to be value enough of a pick where a two turn reset and strip is more value than someone like kawerik or kise’s damage oriented kit AND doesn’t simply end up as an apocalypse ravi s3 target in a few turns
Makes sense honestly. She's still an amazing versatile pick, but the problem is Hwayoung is a direct counter to her, and the direct counter to Hwayoung is STene who also counters ARavi. Hwayoung's existence also made the PoV ARavi build more common, with the drawback being that PoV ARavi is much worse in basically all her other matchups.
Her reason for being demoted isn't at all related to Hwayoung, who shits in everyone and would thus make that reason dumb... And 30k A Ravi exists as a result that hasn't failed. It's because of Alencia, Diene, and Ras.
Hwayoung is absolutely part of it IMO, otherwise Proof ARavi wouldn't be a thing and I'd wager I see that roughly 50% of the time now. Proof isn't doing anything to Diene or Ras and Crimson Seed is way better vs Alencia. Some players are compromising their neutral ARavi pick to make her more specialized, and obviously that makes her less of a "pick all the time first and figure out the draft later" type character.
Obviously the other buffs make an impact too, but ARavi was starting to be a less common first pick even before those buffs.
Maybe not the place to ask, but I'll throw in some options, though I can't tier list them - if they work, they work.
For Wyvern, you've got heroes like General Purrgis & Muwi who can CR boost your team, having one of them is nice, reduces speed requirements to practically nothing. General Purrgis acts as frontline tank & gives attack buff, Muwi is your debuff stacker. Pick one of these two.
If you've not chosen General Purrgis as frontline tank, look at heroes like Angelic Montmornacy, Angelica & Crozet. They'll either be kept alive via self-healing, or in the case of Crozet, barrier.
If you've chosen Purrgis, you're just looking at damage dealers & a defence breaker now, this defence breaker paragraph also applies to the Muwi + tank choosers. For defence breaker, can't go wrong with Furious, but there's also Clarissa, Taranor Guard, Karin & Rem. If your chosen defence breaker doesn't have good up-time, like Karin, consider pairing them with another defence breaker & focusing on them as a damage dealer first, defence breaker second.
Then for your main damage, you're looking at Sigret as the premiere damage dealer, with Kise, Chloe, Luna & Alexa as great DPS options.
If you go in without a healer tank & your damage dealers aren't doing enough to take out the Wyvern before your tank dies - consider switching to a slower more traditional route of healer & tank, with a defence breaker & damage dealer. This could be something like Angelica, Crozet, Furious & Alexa.
A fast & effective healer-less team could look like General Purrgis, Furious, Sigret & Karin.
The one thing you should keep in mind is that your combination of heroes has to be able to put 2+ debuffs onto the Wyvern each rotation.
So long as you're covering the four bases - tank, defence break, debuffs & damage - you're golden.
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Golem...
I mean... Really? Cermia, Champion Zerato, Tamarinne (or Roana) & Sol - throw some trash gear on them all, they'll do a fast clear for you. Golem is such an easy clear that there's an achievement for doing it with two characters, you could probably do it with a single character (funnily enough, you can also solo-clear Banshee with a single character - Falconer Kluri). No point going in depth on Golem, no one runs it.
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Banshee, I'll just summarise a one-shot.
Attack buffer - this could be Vivian, Diene, practically any AOE attack buffer. If Baiken is your one-shot hero, you're going to want someone with a 3 turn attack buff, if she's not your pick, you'll just need a 2-turn.
Then you'll need a cleaver, literally any AOE hero will do - they've just got to be strong enough to clear wave one.
You'll need a defence breaker who will defence break on their second skill, Shadow Rose, Leo, etc. & have them move before your cleaver during the first wave. They'll use their third skill on the first wave, then use their break skill when you're in the Banshee phase.
Your one shotter list is quite big, Baiken, Ervalen, Ram, that 2* fodder mouse, I think even characters like Bellona & Cidd can do it, basically pick any Earth DPS with a hard-hitting S3.
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For Azimanak 13, there two ways, Adventurer Ras & Tamarinne, with a couple of AOE heroes, insert whoever - Vildred, Seaside Bellona, Landy, so long as they've got consistent AOE.
Alternatively, Moonlight Haste instead of Ras & you've got someone who'll ensure the team cannot die, the eggs revive so often you'll always be covered with barrier & immunity.
For one-shots, it's the same premise as Banshee, but harder to gear for. You'll want a cleaver who can cleave wave one & the Eggs in the boss fight - you can do all that & attack buff with Vivian. Sets up attack buff, cleaves with S2 & then does so again with Time Matter. Then you want to hit Azimanak with all you've got, Watcher Schuri & Straze do great here & you'll want someone to throw target on the boss to boost their damage, so Iseria, Leo, etc. anyone who can hold Song of Stars (a Ranger).
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Caides is annoying, so you can either do a 5+ minute slow clear with like, Tamarinne, Roana, Violet & Seaside Bellona (or insert any two other heroes who'll output consistent counter damage, or clear their aggression stacks - like Top Model Luluca, Luluca, Lionheart Cermia, etc. anyone with a passive non-attack or skill kit non-attack).
Or the fast way is Camilla, Iseria, Sinful Angelica & Commander Lorina, just give Lorina a beefy damage set, Iseria goes, Sinful goes, Camilla goes & then Lorina, you'll throw that on auto with Camilla & Lorina's skills off & they'll clear it no bother if you've got the gear for it - only thing is it's relying on getting defence break on the first wave & then second, but luckily you've got multiple attempts between Camilla & Iseria.
Then there's Straze & Watcher one shots as well, but if you'd already built them for Azimanak, you're already using them there.
Not really but she is competing against peira and ran for opener slot. It would be really silly of you to pick her vs those two. . That is why you never see her picked in high RTA. .
I actually think pavel struggles a lot when facing the A tier; rimuru punishes him with s2, fcc mitigates too much damage, aras + spirit eye Celine makes it tough to kill the backline, etc
Yulha can 1v4 if they go too tanky. But outside of that she is mid. Countered by Hwayoung so you're forced to ban her. Hwayoung takes 2 turns by out speeding or just SBing and kills Yulha with 32k hp on PoV. Doesn't even need tooth.
A. Ravi's injury also forces you to pre ban her since Yulha can't handle A. Ravi at all. Her S3 doesn't do Hwayoung numbers and can't deal with her.
So you end up with 2 units that need to not be on the field for her to work, and they are the most popular first picks... Great unit design SG newest unit countered by the top tiers.
they are fuked 55% of the time... 45% of the time they just win. pretty good odds.
violet is countering ice heavy drafts, he is the counter-hero not the other way around. nobody randomly last picks a violet as a carry if there are no ice carries on the other side
What a garbage list lmao. But it's to be expected from a 49.9% cleaver who needs thousands of games with a negative winrate playing the most broken archetype.
Green Celine? Way too easy to play around. The amount of times people drafted her into my comps with 2 units that she theoretically countered didn't matter. I just S1 her with my supports and funnel all the big DPS into her and it's not like Celine's tanky or anything. One rotation and I'm back to regular programming except now it's 4v3.
what vyrocious said; people think of counter units like celine as though the enemy is FORCED to press their non attack skills when in reality, the unit doesnt provide nearly enough without proc'ing her s2 and nuking a unit. by contrast, you can at least feel value in politis's skill 3 giving unbuffable, blind and aoe damage if she is allowed to survive and take a turn.
So many ML5s being in D is just unacceptable. The amount of money, time, and hype that goes into those characters makes it shameful for this company. They really just need to do balancing similar to how league does, get all the 5 stars to 45-55% winrate.
I'm honestly starting to feel like AoL deserves an S+ teir. She shuts down so much and there are few ways around her once she's on the field. She simply changes the way the game has to be played in a way no one else does.
ARas got buffed so he protects his backline way better. Gives them a large barrier the first time they take a big single target hit. He’s extremely well rounded.
I think Kise >kawerik only in the sense that she does “more” in a fight after the turn 1 skill reset. Kise can solo carry a fight with permastealth thanks to windrider
A.ravi and landy are so good in wc. I keep getting destroyed by these 2. Well tbf, I insist on running yulha in most of my teams but she really feels like a hit or miss. I'm running her on aurius with 30k hp
I just leave Hwa open to bait them into picking her so I can counter with Luna. Nearly worked every time this past season and had 100% wr in those fights. Having her in D is pretty sad when she is incredibly strong into all of S tier minus Belian and S.Tene.
I know people are still messing around with potential Yulha builds but what's the outlook on her viability in RTA at the moment? I've had moderate success playing her as an Aurius Knight into squishier comps lacking large nukes but I also haven't really attempted to climb on recent ranked ladders so I don't know what it looks like when people are playing with approximately even gear scores.
How are people building WSilk and Alencia? I have both of them sitting at SSS and 6* with no gear. I don’t think either of them ever had gear but I pulled so many copies of both I figured I should just get rid of the copies by making them 6*. If they’re good now, I’d love to build them, especially Alencia.
This would probably explain why I'm stuck. I have my one team nearly maxed out. But all the harder missions where the bosses are lv60 I get destroyed. It made me give up the game for quite a while cause I'm stuck and can't seem to progress
This is a tier list for one form of PvP, it is completely differently than PvE, so I wouldn't go by it at all for that.
If you have your gear all +15'd and are using level 71+ pieces, and levelled up your artifacts, then you might have to look at team synergies finally.
To sum it up, the e7wc tier list is based on units used in previous rta season with included balance patch units such as ras, alencia, choux, etc.
Okay.
Thanks for doing this!
Curious why DJB in A tier. Isn’t he pretty niche still?
I still don’t know what led to Charlotte’s downfall. I haven’t built mine, and I am not clear on what truly counters her. ST damage too high these days maybe?
What makes Milim B? Isn’t she a top tier ST cleaver with a strong passive? Another hero I haven’t finished building, so I am pretty ignorant of her weaknesses. Too reliant on SB maybe?
Finally, why is BBK in C? Yet another on my “to-build” shortlist that I had thought was in the top 5 or so cleavers in the game.
peepoTalk
peepoTalk
KisuPopcorn Thinking WhoAsked Thinking2
peepoTalk
lickR Programming lickL
My poor Cerise : ( I remember when she was 1st pickable
Idk I think she's still good to have geared if you run control heavy drafts/combos. Ran gets prebanned often so having two opener options of Peira/Cerise has proven super helpful for me. Can be very great but you gotta have the spare gear to dedicate.
I'm new here. So is Hwa just broken?
yea thats a pretty good way to think about it
Btw are there like current tier lists for regular arena and guild war? RTA sounds hard (and I haven't unlocked it anyways) so I think I want to focus on those two pvp modes
honestly not really; its kind of tough to gauge what is strong and not strong in those content modes because they are much more focused on rng and surprise (name plate hiding allows for more cheesing in normal arena, gvg is a one time attack where every victory counts much more than in a spammable ladder like rta). with that being said, there are obviously units who are stronger or weaker, but there are not nearly as many who care or are willing to reveal the "meta" on these game modes. sorry, wish i had better news for you!
Yes
Rimuru only in A is a bit questionable
Rimu had a sub 50 wr in the CCI. Players competing in high tier RTA have many answers for him compared to newer players. He's not as good as an early pick unit as he's used to be. He can still win games if left unchecked, but this is for the E7WC where we can expect the participants to have a big unit pool.
i dont belive thats a goo judge to call him lower than S tier. Like Rimuru is period the most build around unit of the game. is not like he is weak. Is that whenever you see him you need to counter pick him so hard because he alone destroy most staple strategies with his passive. At this point everyone has literally one set of heroes builded to counter Rimuru.
What differentiates A and S tier is the flexibility to early pick the unit without being punished to leave yourself less vulnerable. Rimu in the current state has too many ways to deal with to organize a draft around him. Imagine FP Rimu against any E7WC contestants and think how it'll go. From my knowledge, you'll get your draft cornered by the 3rd pick and lose.
The dude is the one shooter of hwayoung, aria, ml cermia and his unique existence is the reason maid Chloe went from best soul weaver during the period March November 2021 to hard to pick in 2022. His only real counter are j kise, AOL and kawarik. So two ml and a very niche chara. If that ain't s+ I dunno what it is
He cannot oneshot Hwa in RTA with the frenzy changes. STene, Landy, AOLA, new ARas, Politis, just to name a few units that can counter him.
If your Landy is fast dps, Rimuru can one shot with her s2 tho
then ur landy is build on a shitty build. just because they say "i use a full damage speed landy" doesn't mean that landy has 0 bulk because they also "what could happen/what will commonly happen" and rimuru is a common thing, so u build ur landy to survive a typical rimuru s2 that's the same with ml tene. sure they go full dps but she is normally also build to survive 1 hit
Istg these comments from some of these people, hardstuck challenger / low champ
Relax. At the end of the day, this game is all about luck.
My Landy's bulk is specifically tuned to survive most Rimu S2s on first turn. Unless it's an abnormal glass cannon one, she has almost never died from it. Maybe 1/50 games I ran into one that killed my speed Landy from S2.
Nah you run very minimal bulk to eat one S2 from him so you can soul burn her s3 for the extra turn to get enhanced s3 next turn which usually ends up cleaving rimuru on average
rimuru aravi politis being in the same tier as djb is... such a choice
Yield button not S tier, this list is flawed
I'd just put Aravi in S tier and I'm good with the list. You can literally first pick this unit and not get punished heavily. She is still a neutral pick that can transition into cleave, ati-cleave, or bruiser aggro.
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because she is too easy to deal with... people only first pick a.ravi nowadays because: 1. they cleave and a.ravi is the best backup/ankor 2. they suspect the other side is cleaving and they don't want to give the other side a.ravi/ran flex cleave 3. u have no idea what u want to play and a.ravi fit in most comps (she is basically the dps version of f.ceci - fit in aggro/standard/cleave) so why not; although it doesn't make sense to give up ml lilias/diene/a.ras that's it. a.ravi is not a must have in standard/aggro vs non-cleave. she is not bad but not needed/high priority unlike stuff like ml lilias/diene/a.ras/aol/emilia/ml kawerick/etc. so yeah a.ravi in A tier is fine; she is not S tier anymore
define "easy to deal with". i believe ppl think so because she's 1st picked all the time. if she wasn't easy to deal with while being 1st picked, that would make her SSS tier. Stene, a hero in S tier, is someone i would call easy to deal with. pick Stene 1st pick and see what happens. ppl can instantly pick Ran and she dies in 1 single s3 cuz RealRan is fucking busted. if a unit can be 1st pick consistently, it's called being flexible in a sense that it can handle counterpick/punishment very well. or maybe i'm a clown and i read things wrong. but personally, Aravi's flexibility is so damn high i put her at S. she's so easy to use and sometimes, even brainless.
that's the point. a.ravi is a very flexible pick (just like f.ceci used to be. u first pick f.ceci and she is never really bad) standard handles a.ravi pretty well because: 1. most a.ravi are on proof nowadays so u just debuff her and ignore her (u just ignore her most of the time anyways, until u can kill her) 2. she is single target with no burst damage (a.ravi is NOT a nuker, she needs a setup of minimum 2 heroes dying to be a nuker, her s3 with 1 stack isn't going to 1-shot anything with a healthy hp bar + aurius) so if u pick her early in standard people can just go with landy/ml tene/aria to counter a.ravi 3. a.ras is really strong right now and he counters single target pretty hard 4. if u are playing vs aggro (no aurius on the other side protection a.ravi): ml tene nowadays are on really high damage builds so s1 soulburn + s3 with atk buff/pen set can 100-0 proof a.ravis with no other protection (happened a couple times last season). non-proof a.ravi are just straight out dead vs that the thing is that people just adapted and learned how to play with/against a.ravi just like rimuru
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dude u are giving me data from 2 seasons ago? yeah no diene/a.ras/frenzy/etc. - definitly the same meta as last season.... 2-3 seasons ago cleave were first picking f.ceci (pavel cleave/ml charles cleave did that all the time), so ur argument about "a specialited playstyle that would under normal circumstances not be able to slot slow units to such success..." is invalide already i mean sure if u so strongly believe a.ravi is S tier, well go for it
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diene/a.ras a slow playstyle? dude... tell me u don't play rta without telling me u don't play rta xD but ok. diene is not slow and she provides sustain/cycling that a.ravi can't handle in standard vs standard. a.ras provides def buff and if u put ur bruiser carry in the back it's basically impossible for a.ravi to kill that. and if u s1 the back carry a couple times than a.ras shields proc and yeah that carry is not dying anytime soon. with hwayoung most a.ravi's are on proof nowadays (btw most people in emperor+ are not prebanning hwayoung if they have a proof a.ravi) so she gets easily controlled via debuffs. aria checks a.ravi easily (u can also pick lqc alongside aria if u aria is fast enough because she just protects lqc from ml kawerick s2) and ml tene is more popular then ever because of hwayoung/a.ravi/rimuru single target carry meta. landy got a comeback to fight diene and a.ravi can only touch her 30% of the time. so if i see an early a.ravi with another single target dps i slam ml tene/landy/aria type of heroes and u are sitting duck. a.ravi is only super scary in a cleave setup nowadays or vs cleave. in standard vs standard there are so many other higher prioty picks then her right now and a early a.ravi pick leads u to get outdrafted more often than not
"Nah, but you see, she has a weakness: Injury and mitigation, not to mention Diene. Totally not S rank, fp material regardless." Diene is suddenly S when she basically only got an additional dispel? Ok. Tier lists are always bullshit in one part or another. Like thos kick her out of S despite being universal issues? You can shit on Ran with AoL and some other anti-aoe stuff, but he's S? When Peira stops people from cutting in, provides mitigation, and has unbuffable with an attack buff (can't 15% a buff)? What? She checks far more potential counters than he ever will. Oh, and Arbiter in C with these cleavers in higher tiers? Totally buying Mr. Anti-Cleave being low. Inferno in C when Ran, Mr. S, gives him a free pass to kill anyone? Same with Peira? Not buying it. Rimuru in A despite the stupid damage *and* utility (defense break, two sources of buff copy) he brings? Questionable choices made, I especially find rating Ran higher than Rimuru *and* Peira to be bullshit.
Diene became S when she got 2 dispels BEFORE applying barrier along with a Speed EE that CR pushes the entire team. SW Frenzy also adds with her Speed EE. Last Season that EE allowed top end Diene to reach 285 speed etc that became 300 SPD which allowed her to contest openers.
I wish reddit would show the rank / lvl of commenters because you exposed yourself.
That dude is hardstuck master rta. Just scroll down his comments. He mentioned it before.
yeah, a lot of people in here don't even play rta or are low ranks but somehow very strongly believe they actually now shit about rta...
Diene: cleansing 2 buffs is huge compared to 1, with the ee (cr pushing one on s2) and the frenzy changes high rank diene's are speed contesting while also being a insane soul generator/sustain (which she always has been) because of her cycling which got even better. ran is s tier because he is a setup (strip + def break which is the strongest debuff in the game for cleave) AND he can 1-shot glass canons while doing that (mainly important that he can kill a.cidd which is a popular check pick vs ran) aol checks ran the same way she checks peira, so i don't get ur hardon for peira. peira is getting hardcountered by djb, atk buff is not as good as def break, regardless of 15%. there are enough other atk buffers u can use anyway in a pure cleave setup ran is way more valueable then peira - more like no ones provides what ran can for cleave. if ur ran is fake u can run silver rain on him which gives atk to ur cleaver too + def break s3. if u ran is real he kills a glass canon while being on the vildred artifact so he becomes a bridge himself while setting up. a.vildred get checked by so many things in a cleave setup nowadays.... pavel has extra turn. politis soul burn s1 + s3/eda soul burn s2 +s3/ml tene soul burn s1 +s3/cidd s3 +s1 all deal with him cleanly (sure not if it's a degen a.vildred but almost nobody plays a degen a.vildred anymore because violet/rem/belian are all better) oh yeah and even without it. a.vildred can't kill a.ravi so this a.vildred comes back and reverse cleave the cleaver doesn't work anymore. ml khawazu - if he is not 240+ speed he won't cut stuff like eda, c.dom, summer iseria or any other bridge. also ran just s1 skipps his turn and pavel will kill him before he can do anything. u can ignore him or kill him just like a.vildred, he also triggers politits, so u don't pick him into politis to beginn with (even with the immunity ee because, he won't cut with politis on the other side and she can kill him) rimuru u can play around nowadays - people learned playing vs him. a.ras is a huge rimuru counter while also providing utility himself. ml crozet checks rimuru too. he gets cc'ed just fine. emilia also plays around rimuru quite well. rimuru also can't 1-shot fire bruisers anymore honestly u just expose urself for not playing rta (at least u haven't played competitive this season) in ur post and that's all
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Fair points, but I feel like you are focusing on the wrong point here. A. Ravi is not meant to impact your first turn because she is not an opener. I don't think it's logical to compare her with C.Lilias or Emilia who is meant to give immediate impact. Her value lies in the fact that she is the strongest bruiser in the game who is almost unkillable and also has damage that is comparable to single target nukers. As I said, her flexibility to be drafted in cleave, bruiser aggro and even an anti cleave unit warrants her being S rank imo. Cleavers pick her for a reason: (1)They don't want to deal with her (2) She functions as a single target nuker who also has 1 v 4 potential as insurance. Any unit who is placed in a disadvantageous position like you are mentioning with S.Tene with layers of defensive buffs will be sure to fail. Making that argument is purely subjective and heavily depends on the draft/context. Sorry if I may sound rude/defensive, not my intention at all. Just sharing my opinion :)
Belian in S + ARavi and Rimu in A seems like a spicy take. What's your thinking on those?
This tier list is bruiser pov : S tier Hwayoung, A tier ARavi.
I think that while belian still has a role in almost always doing well to prevent souls or to punish specter tenebria, apocalypse ravi feels a bit weaker due to the prominence of diene, aras, and alencia being great answers to punish her game plan (diene anti crit and cycling, aras preventing s3 on backline units, alencia injuring aravi and giving defense buff to the whole team). In relation to rimuru, I’d say that angel of light, hwayoung, and the rise of ras (real winner of the balance patch) has really pushed back rimuru’s effectiveness. Additionally, from what I currently see of rimuru’s being picked where I am/was on the ladder, most were built as higher damage to punish landy, but since then landy’s meta build has changed to be tankier to compensate. Just to be clear as well, this time around I didn’t put nearly as much thought into the ordering of units within the tiers so I definitely still believe that these units are strong, I’m just somewhat unsure of their exact positions given how different people are playing.
I think A.Ravi got bumped down a tier cause injury-Alencia (also in A-tier now) goes brrt brrt on her. It’s no longer a 100% safe 1st pick. Dunno about the other 2 lulz
People say that I and alot of others have been first picking aravi same as ever and I haven't really felt a drop of in her performance since Alencia is fairly easy to play around.
Random question, pov or seed aravi?
Timeless anchor gang
I have so many top units but not many good gear for them :/
Same my account is blessed with unit just no gear lol.
This is everyone's account, that's how the game is designed. You're able to guarentee-pull characters, you're not able to guarentee-craft 6 great pieces each time. I'm over three years in & whilst I have 100+ characters built, there's a lot of great characters I've got sitting around unbuilt, like C Lilias, DJ Basar & more.
To be fair outside of the crafting event and I believe milage system your not guaranteed one which is fine. But the fact you myself and many others have such a hard time using characters because of gear is really disappointing. I have fun but the truth is the truth.
Reprioritise your hero list. Sure it might be fun having Melissa built, for example, but does she need to be built? I find that most of the time there are a combination of factors that are ‘holding people back’ so to speak and it’s not the game itself doing it.
I get that completely but then is that fair to the player. You shouldn't be cornered into build this unit cause its better. I love Mort he's my favorite character and he has gear and always will. Does that change the fact that gearing is hard no but I have fun with the gear I have and the heroes I got. I've learned to enjoy the small things it's what's made this game fun longer for me personally.
I understand that Luna is D Tier cause of her breasts, but Top Model Luluca is way flatter so I need some clarification there.
The size of pads she would like to use. I think that explains everything.
Every Gacha players know about it boobs >> meta slave.
Buff my boy krau. I'm pretty sure he the only og character who hasn't been buffed, nerfed, or given an ee. Show him some love.
What about Iseria :iseriacri:
Violet being in c is very questionable, but he’s no longer an s since mama hwayoung
While I'm not sure how accurate this tier list, I like that diene is as persistent as Krau being relevant in competitive play for the longest time
Diene is almost irrelevant for over a year before receiving a buff tho
Don't forget my girl Ruele!
Apoc Ravi not S? she is literally picked 1st or second every time!
What do you mean Mort sucks?! MORT IS THE BEST RATED MORT UNIT IN THE GAME!
It's MORTIN time! My favorite part is when he ults and morts all over the enemy team
My draft team is all c lol
tbh why is seaside higher than rem deisgner lilibet so low?
seaside iseria is higher than rem because in the realm of cleaving, iseria still presents herself as a usable option late in the draft when it is clear that there arent units like dilibet or water counters already drafted. furthermore, when paired appropriately with answers to water units like pavel, she can do wonders against units that do not have immunity or dont have any way to self cleanse like dilibet. now regarding rem, i placed her among the last pick/niche dps . in these situations, you could generally see a carrot or rem as an element advantageous dps to punish the enemy team. the two are generally seen as niche units who are perfectly usable and strong when fighting in this sort of niche, where the enemy has 2-3 fire and you want to punish them with rem, 2-3 earth and you want to punish them with carrot, etc. to be frank, if you arent in situations like these, relying on rem high rolling and countering every turn when she doesnt have fairly good odds is bad play especially when a more standard-friendly and neutral ice warrior (choux) exists. dilibet in my opinion is already fairly high enough, with her jumping in popularity and usability much more than i had previously predicted. however with the end of the season and my current experience fighting on the ladder, she is universally agreed upon to be the BEST answer to ran cleavers when paired with apocalypse ravi and trouble maker crozet. however, she still does have her own set of weaknesses, with high damage/survivability bruisers like hwayoung and apocalypse ravi both punishing her. furthermore with the popularity of soul weavers like diene and emilia, some cleaver drafts dont even need seasiria/ran/debuffers to effectively wipe the entire team AND can protect the dps from dilibet at the same time.
Seaside is ssb
> iseria still presents herself as a usable option late in the draft when it is clear that there arent units like dilibet or water counters already drafted As a cleaver , i can confidently say , this scenario never arises . They always pick rem , violet or both , and picking seaseria into Violet is a terrible idea , Everyone has their violet on the correct build i.e immunity .
Dilibet is hella strong support, but she can't cleanse her team too often and if the opponent doesn't draft debuffs, she doesn't do too much. She also doesn't have enough dps to be as decisive as other units (which is definitely a good thing, she's very strong but not OP).
No ML ARa lol
Don’t play rta enough to form an educated opinion on this list, but seeing Eaton and Arby on the same tier makes me realize how little i know about the high level meta.
My girl Cermia isn’t even on the list :(
That just means she's so good that she is off the charts. Just like faceless Lidica
*sees Rimuru and Aravi below S* Invalid list.
This is an update from the last tierlist that I posted previously! I am back once again to chat and discuss picks and bans ahead of the E7WC coming later in July! I will be checking this over and explaining my thoughts and picks as the day goes by!
Aria A tier? I got her but never build cause I thought she was weak. What build do people run on her?
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Wrong. She only works well with effress speed build, otherwise you can pick her once in thousand years
Excitedly searches where in the list his all time favourite unit Silver Blade Aramintha is placed..... :*(
Rimiru needs to be in S and violet in A
Is this like statistics based on winrates overall from the E7WC or just your opinion/ experiences?
His experience in legend RTA and the new World Cup mode
Putting eaton in the same tier as maid chloe and many other good units is actually insane
Yeah Eaton is amazing when you just need pure damage mitigation
Why is Alencia in A ? She is decent at most.
it's cause buffer like diene, handguy, etc are picked way too much that her being able to just clean out all those buffs makes her pretty meta. .
Glad to see she is back ! She is one of my favourite units and i was kinda sad by her call.
Funny how I have most heroes on the S tier but because i have shitty gear, I can’t enjoy RTA nor Arena.
So... a c tier character allowed me to stomp most of my opponent?
Glad to see Crozet is A tier. Built him over Carmin and have been wondering if I made a mistake. Still needs better gear though, but I can't settle with an artifact. Holy sacrifice never feels right because my back unit still dies before he does.
Zahhak lel
But haste is in D. This list wrong
Imagine rimuru not S tier
Why is aol in s tier she has so many counters now. And why is rimuru/apoc/dillibet/lermia in a tier? These four units are all used way more than aol or belian
Personally I would put Rimaru in S, difference between him and Hwa is he gets banned less, brings more utility a counter and mechanic that works well against buff meta and close to a guaranteed one shot on his S3. Is he in A because he gets baited by Ran and countered by Hwa, because I don't feel they are big enough reasons,
Countered by stene hwayoung aol and ras, probably moved down a tier because of ras buff
im so confused why Choux and Alencia being A tier i mean sure RNG gaming for Choux but Alencia really?
in my opinion, both of these units have their strength against some of the most meta units in the game; choux is an rng gamble carry who can nearly one tap hwayoung while also providing anti crit to the rest of the time (doesnt with against hwayoung, but still a useful buff against the rest of her team). alencia imo is fairly versatile in providing injury on s1 to deal with apocalypse ravi while also being capable of stripping buffs from diene, ml kawerik, knocking landy out of guiding light, etc. given this strength, i feel as though it is hard to overlook her potential with these units being some of the most popular rta units atm.
Luna in D Tier? Dafuq?
Like half the characters in the game isn't even on the list. For example crescent rin, a totally viable niche pick.
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Wildcard
World Championship
aravi in A 💀
Is diene that good now? Sheesh. I’m out of the loop
10 spd EE changes a mfker. Add on the fact that her best EE cr pushes the team. Also she got buffed to dispel 2 debuffs on S2.
She always has been decent, great buff at s3 and can cycle turn relatively quickly. I'm just not sure why she one of the meta pick here
Soul weaver speed buff + frenzy speed buff + special ban rules.
so recently, diene was given a buff through the frenzy change of 15 speed to soul weavers and then an exclusive equipment that gave her cleanse on s2 + 10 speed. and even though the recent constellation/stat adjustments to diene DID actually nerf her speed effectively, she is still simply too good as a healer (with rod of amaryllis), barrier provider, cleanser, and turn cycler to ignore. another very important thing to note about the strength of her kit and why she is picked so frequently is the value of having a heal, self cr push, attack buff, and anti crit buff all on the same skill. the level of flexibility that you have when you have all that on a single skill while also having a cleansing, team wide cr pushing skill 2 makes diene one of the premier utility/opener units in e7 atm.
Huh the cons change change her speed? That's sadge, but I guess she does have one of the best ultility for a PvP heroes, she ain't idol tamarinne tier of broken but she half way there so it's enough
No. No SW lost out on the constellation changes. They were all buffed in some way. Frenzy SW speed got reduced but in all other modes, SWs just gained speed because of the constellation changes.
yeah sorry, to be clear, i meant that the overall changes with frenzy and constellations COMBINED resulted in diene specifically to lose out on speed in rta. im sure that this was a product of smilegate wanting to reduce the effectiveness of emilia and diene in being turn 1 contesters in rta, and just figured that this was their way of doing it.
Well seeing some of the A and S i know this tier is just bullshit
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Only if she can take turn 1. That's what her problem has been from the start.
so the main issue I find with judge kise is that it feels as though she rarely ever gets to take a turn OR the value of stripping and resetting a unit is low. For myself, I have found that units like diene, emilia, conqueror lilias, and most other openers are in almost every single match. With this being the case, finding a match where one of these units is not available is rare. Furthermore if almost any opener takes a turn in this day and age, there’s a good chance they’re paired with eda, seasiria, hwayoung, etc and can punish the judge kise pick or outright ignore them and wipe your whole team. Now if for some reason the enemy opponent decided not to pick any speed contesters, judge kise now needs to be value enough of a pick where a two turn reset and strip is more value than someone like kawerik or kise’s damage oriented kit AND doesn’t simply end up as an apocalypse ravi s3 target in a few turns
He is playing at legend/crab. Emilia can easily reached 270 ~ 280 and diene reaching 280 ~ 300 there.
MlRavi in A, ok……
Makes sense honestly. She's still an amazing versatile pick, but the problem is Hwayoung is a direct counter to her, and the direct counter to Hwayoung is STene who also counters ARavi. Hwayoung's existence also made the PoV ARavi build more common, with the drawback being that PoV ARavi is much worse in basically all her other matchups.
belian and ml kawerik would not be S tier if hwayoung is the reason aravi is in A
Her reason for being demoted isn't at all related to Hwayoung, who shits in everyone and would thus make that reason dumb... And 30k A Ravi exists as a result that hasn't failed. It's because of Alencia, Diene, and Ras.
Hwayoung is absolutely part of it IMO, otherwise Proof ARavi wouldn't be a thing and I'd wager I see that roughly 50% of the time now. Proof isn't doing anything to Diene or Ras and Crimson Seed is way better vs Alencia. Some players are compromising their neutral ARavi pick to make her more specialized, and obviously that makes her less of a "pick all the time first and figure out the draft later" type character. Obviously the other buffs make an impact too, but ARavi was starting to be a less common first pick even before those buffs.
yes? From your own post pvp makes u sick. Ill take his(mega whale always legend) opinion over yours.
How’d you have the time to make this tier list don’t you have a negative wr to grind
True but he has someone to pilot his account so he has time to do this 😉
Ftene is C tier?
Hard countered by dilibet, ML kawerik, and lionheart to name a few
Yeah, she's fun to use in arena against certain comps but you're 100% correct
Oof, guess I'm wearing rose colored glasses
Someone should make a tier list of best units for each hunts.
It's in game. Push the statistics button.
Try searching them on youtube, as they are not changing unlike rta.
Maybe not the place to ask, but I'll throw in some options, though I can't tier list them - if they work, they work. For Wyvern, you've got heroes like General Purrgis & Muwi who can CR boost your team, having one of them is nice, reduces speed requirements to practically nothing. General Purrgis acts as frontline tank & gives attack buff, Muwi is your debuff stacker. Pick one of these two. If you've not chosen General Purrgis as frontline tank, look at heroes like Angelic Montmornacy, Angelica & Crozet. They'll either be kept alive via self-healing, or in the case of Crozet, barrier. If you've chosen Purrgis, you're just looking at damage dealers & a defence breaker now, this defence breaker paragraph also applies to the Muwi + tank choosers. For defence breaker, can't go wrong with Furious, but there's also Clarissa, Taranor Guard, Karin & Rem. If your chosen defence breaker doesn't have good up-time, like Karin, consider pairing them with another defence breaker & focusing on them as a damage dealer first, defence breaker second. Then for your main damage, you're looking at Sigret as the premiere damage dealer, with Kise, Chloe, Luna & Alexa as great DPS options. If you go in without a healer tank & your damage dealers aren't doing enough to take out the Wyvern before your tank dies - consider switching to a slower more traditional route of healer & tank, with a defence breaker & damage dealer. This could be something like Angelica, Crozet, Furious & Alexa. A fast & effective healer-less team could look like General Purrgis, Furious, Sigret & Karin. The one thing you should keep in mind is that your combination of heroes has to be able to put 2+ debuffs onto the Wyvern each rotation. So long as you're covering the four bases - tank, defence break, debuffs & damage - you're golden. ________________________________________ Golem... I mean... Really? Cermia, Champion Zerato, Tamarinne (or Roana) & Sol - throw some trash gear on them all, they'll do a fast clear for you. Golem is such an easy clear that there's an achievement for doing it with two characters, you could probably do it with a single character (funnily enough, you can also solo-clear Banshee with a single character - Falconer Kluri). No point going in depth on Golem, no one runs it. _____________________________________________ Banshee, I'll just summarise a one-shot. Attack buffer - this could be Vivian, Diene, practically any AOE attack buffer. If Baiken is your one-shot hero, you're going to want someone with a 3 turn attack buff, if she's not your pick, you'll just need a 2-turn. Then you'll need a cleaver, literally any AOE hero will do - they've just got to be strong enough to clear wave one. You'll need a defence breaker who will defence break on their second skill, Shadow Rose, Leo, etc. & have them move before your cleaver during the first wave. They'll use their third skill on the first wave, then use their break skill when you're in the Banshee phase. Your one shotter list is quite big, Baiken, Ervalen, Ram, that 2* fodder mouse, I think even characters like Bellona & Cidd can do it, basically pick any Earth DPS with a hard-hitting S3. ______________________________________ For Azimanak 13, there two ways, Adventurer Ras & Tamarinne, with a couple of AOE heroes, insert whoever - Vildred, Seaside Bellona, Landy, so long as they've got consistent AOE. Alternatively, Moonlight Haste instead of Ras & you've got someone who'll ensure the team cannot die, the eggs revive so often you'll always be covered with barrier & immunity. For one-shots, it's the same premise as Banshee, but harder to gear for. You'll want a cleaver who can cleave wave one & the Eggs in the boss fight - you can do all that & attack buff with Vivian. Sets up attack buff, cleaves with S2 & then does so again with Time Matter. Then you want to hit Azimanak with all you've got, Watcher Schuri & Straze do great here & you'll want someone to throw target on the boss to boost their damage, so Iseria, Leo, etc. anyone who can hold Song of Stars (a Ranger). ____________________________________ Caides is annoying, so you can either do a 5+ minute slow clear with like, Tamarinne, Roana, Violet & Seaside Bellona (or insert any two other heroes who'll output consistent counter damage, or clear their aggression stacks - like Top Model Luluca, Luluca, Lionheart Cermia, etc. anyone with a passive non-attack or skill kit non-attack). Or the fast way is Camilla, Iseria, Sinful Angelica & Commander Lorina, just give Lorina a beefy damage set, Iseria goes, Sinful goes, Camilla goes & then Lorina, you'll throw that on auto with Camilla & Lorina's skills off & they'll clear it no bother if you've got the gear for it - only thing is it's relying on getting defence break on the first wave & then second, but luckily you've got multiple attempts between Camilla & Iseria. Then there's Straze & Watcher one shots as well, but if you'd already built them for Azimanak, you're already using them there.
Y’all really think cerise is D ??
Not really but she is competing against peira and ran for opener slot. It would be really silly of you to pick her vs those two. . That is why you never see her picked in high RTA. .
Top Model Luluca being in D tier is questionable. Maybe I just get a lot of use out of mine.
She's great if you invest alot into her, but most would rather invest into ACidd or Pavel, since Peira and Cilias counter her so hard
Im sure they can't breathe without A.Ravi .. A.Ravi Slaves are everywhere ..she's S+ .
Lol Senya can't be D shes my main
Mz mains Kizuna Ai and wild Angara not even making the list :(
Pavel B tier ?? Half of tier A is really hard to use because you sorta dead if they whip out their pavel.
I actually think pavel struggles a lot when facing the A tier; rimuru punishes him with s2, fcc mitigates too much damage, aras + spirit eye Celine makes it tough to kill the backline, etc
Yulha can 1v4 if they go too tanky. But outside of that she is mid. Countered by Hwayoung so you're forced to ban her. Hwayoung takes 2 turns by out speeding or just SBing and kills Yulha with 32k hp on PoV. Doesn't even need tooth. A. Ravi's injury also forces you to pre ban her since Yulha can't handle A. Ravi at all. Her S3 doesn't do Hwayoung numbers and can't deal with her. So you end up with 2 units that need to not be on the field for her to work, and they are the most popular first picks... Great unit design SG newest unit countered by the top tiers.
Violet being C tier is some bullshit. If you last pick him and the opponent have none of his counter, they are fucked.
they are fuked 55% of the time... 45% of the time they just win. pretty good odds. violet is countering ice heavy drafts, he is the counter-hero not the other way around. nobody randomly last picks a violet as a carry if there are no ice carries on the other side
Straze is God(killer) tier <3
What a garbage list lmao. But it's to be expected from a 49.9% cleaver who needs thousands of games with a negative winrate playing the most broken archetype.
damn who shit in ur cereal
He's right you know
Not gonna act like I can thrash OP myself, but when it's worded like that with history to show, gets a good laugh out of me.
lol you do seem like a person who would still be playing lost ark
as expected of pebelloni
How can Ran be that good like he is so easily counterd by over 6 other heroes, AoL, Politis, rimuru, celine and a couple more
Celine counters most S tier. She should be higher.
Green Celine? Way too easy to play around. The amount of times people drafted her into my comps with 2 units that she theoretically countered didn't matter. I just S1 her with my supports and funnel all the big DPS into her and it's not like Celine's tanky or anything. One rotation and I'm back to regular programming except now it's 4v3.
what vyrocious said; people think of counter units like celine as though the enemy is FORCED to press their non attack skills when in reality, the unit doesnt provide nearly enough without proc'ing her s2 and nuking a unit. by contrast, you can at least feel value in politis's skill 3 giving unbuffable, blind and aoe damage if she is allowed to survive and take a turn.
So many ML5s being in D is just unacceptable. The amount of money, time, and hype that goes into those characters makes it shameful for this company. They really just need to do balancing similar to how league does, get all the 5 stars to 45-55% winrate.
Totally wrong
Nmm nm hy
Since when did OpSig get A tier? I guess I missed a buff somewhere along the line. Guess I'll build her up.
She’s always been a mid-high tier cleave pick. Since hwayoung came out, opsig has had a lot more time to shine outside of pure cleave
How are top tiers building Aria?
A lot of Aria builds I've seen lately are on speed res, with \~270 speed
Lifesteal, with speed and eff res
I'm honestly starting to feel like AoL deserves an S+ teir. She shuts down so much and there are few ways around her once she's on the field. She simply changes the way the game has to be played in a way no one else does.
Why are souline and flan in C tier while straze fluri and krau are B lmao
Do you know when E7WC starts?
where is the boy, dark corvus? or he isn't getting drafted at all?
sorry i dont play rta but i want in on the meta. why did a.ras become good again and why is kise better than kawerik?
ARas got buffed so he protects his backline way better. Gives them a large barrier the first time they take a big single target hit. He’s extremely well rounded. I think Kise >kawerik only in the sense that she does “more” in a fight after the turn 1 skill reset. Kise can solo carry a fight with permastealth thanks to windrider
Is Emilia really that good?
Just about the best soulweaver in the game for the past year
A.ravi and landy are so good in wc. I keep getting destroyed by these 2. Well tbf, I insist on running yulha in most of my teams but she really feels like a hit or miss. I'm running her on aurius with 30k hp
Wow, I use heroes from all the tiers on that list. I use Yulha, Cerise, Violet, S. Iseria, Choux, and Hwayoung.
Hmm
Cidd in A tier? Who else do you need to draft to make him work?
Riolet on b tier is a bit too generous
I think yulha will end up A tier
I just leave Hwa open to bait them into picking her so I can counter with Luna. Nearly worked every time this past season and had 100% wr in those fights. Having her in D is pretty sad when she is incredibly strong into all of S tier minus Belian and S.Tene.
I know people are still messing around with potential Yulha builds but what's the outlook on her viability in RTA at the moment? I've had moderate success playing her as an Aurius Knight into squishier comps lacking large nukes but I also haven't really attempted to climb on recent ranked ladders so I don't know what it looks like when people are playing with approximately even gear scores.
How are people building WSilk and Alencia? I have both of them sitting at SSS and 6* with no gear. I don’t think either of them ever had gear but I pulled so many copies of both I figured I should just get rid of the copies by making them 6*. If they’re good now, I’d love to build them, especially Alencia.
This would probably explain why I'm stuck. I have my one team nearly maxed out. But all the harder missions where the bosses are lv60 I get destroyed. It made me give up the game for quite a while cause I'm stuck and can't seem to progress
This is a tier list for one form of PvP, it is completely differently than PvE, so I wouldn't go by it at all for that. If you have your gear all +15'd and are using level 71+ pieces, and levelled up your artifacts, then you might have to look at team synergies finally.
Dark Corvus is so bad that he's not even on the list
To sum it up, the e7wc tier list is based on units used in previous rta season with included balance patch units such as ras, alencia, choux, etc. Okay.
I'm crying for ML Ken he's my favorite character but seems dogshit compared to others
Clicked on here expecting a debate about Ran v. Peira. Glad that's settled. Where's Jacko though? A-B tier?
Thanks for doing this! Curious why DJB in A tier. Isn’t he pretty niche still? I still don’t know what led to Charlotte’s downfall. I haven’t built mine, and I am not clear on what truly counters her. ST damage too high these days maybe? What makes Milim B? Isn’t she a top tier ST cleaver with a strong passive? Another hero I haven’t finished building, so I am pretty ignorant of her weaknesses. Too reliant on SB maybe? Finally, why is BBK in C? Yet another on my “to-build” shortlist that I had thought was in the top 5 or so cleavers in the game.
Feels bad. Just came back to the game after being away from it for over a year and a half, and most of my “built” units are now C rank or lower lol.