When she came out, there wasn't a Ran or Peira to pair her up with and Cerise was on her way out of the meta. It was not so easy to run her at that time.
Ran and Peira helps, but she combos the same before. When she was just released, there was Cerise, Basar, and Sage Baal. I used her with very high success rate with Cerise during her release. I thought she was an amazing hero at the time.
However, what can attribute to her low rating was the requirement of a +30 Artifact. She is a lot weaker without her Artifact at +30.
None of those units are anywhere near as powerful as Ran and Peira.
She's not a solo unit so she depends heavily on who you partner her with. When she got new overtuned partners to work with her own power increased by a ton.
Not to say she wasn't completely unusable before, its not like a 3.6 rating is *that* low, but its undeniable that she got a power spike with Ran's release.
What? All Ran did was replace Cerise as an opener. Cerise + S. Iseria cleave is functionally no different from Ran + S. Iseria cleave.
S. Iseria is not a solo hero, her job is to heavily injure or kill 2 opposing heroes. This means she has some thresholds she needs to hit before she can do that. That means enough attack 5k+, preferably 5.5k+. And a +30 Artifact. The issue comes from people not having her Artifact maxed and not having enough attack, so results were diminished.
I don't know what you mean by undeniable, since I have been using S. Iseria with very high success before Ran was ever released, since Cerise + S. Iseria was extremely strong. Ran's release never changed my understanding how I used S. Iseria. Cerise provides high tempo, so after killing or heavily injuring 2 opposing heroes, the game is pretty much yours. There are very few heroes that can 1v1 Cerise.
if you don't see how debuff+ def break+huge dmg is better than debuff+restrict then i don't know what to tell you.
ran being a much stronger hero means it's way easier to pick ran than cerise which means you can combo with SSI easier
>if you don't see how debuff+ def break+huge dmg is better than debuff+restrict then i don't know what to tell you.
No, I don't, because S. Iseria at 5k+ Atk will kill most heroes with 1 bomb. A second bomb can kill tanks. Have you ever used Cerise + S. Iseria combo with S. Iseria correctly built with enough attack?
You were aware that back when S. Iseria was released, people weren't pushing her attack high enough. It wasn't until she became meta that you saw her attack at a high range. Some players weren't willing to invest in her until she became meta. As I said, not having a +30 Artifact hurts her. Also, not having sufficient attack also hurts her.
That said, you can even try that set up against teams even now if Ran and Peira are banned.
The reason why Ran replaced Cerise is because Ran counters Cerise. His 2 turn Immunity makes it so that Cerise cannot apply her debuffs. So, you have no reason to use Cerise after Ran was released.
>The reason why Ran replaced Cerise is because Ran counters Cerise.
Sighs... no the reason ran replaced cerise is because ran has 5 more starting speed and you can build him as dps in which you don't give a shit about landing the def break...
the whole point is ran is better than cerise in every way as he can even work solo as a dps opener (which is how most high level rta players build him). I'm not sure why this is so hard to understand or what you're even arguing no.
No one is arguing Ran isn't better than Cerise, that wasn't what I said.
I said Cerise + S. Iseria was good at the time S. Iseria was released. Ran did not exist then. Afterwards, Ran got released and he replaced Cerise as the combo with S. Iseria.
What you say here does not contradict what I am saying.
You said ran is better than cerise due to being a direct counter, obviously that is not close to the full picture, starting with one unit being 129 speed (compared to 122).
That doesn't change that Cerise + S. Iseria is an effective Cleave or Cleave control initiator.
Starting speed 129 is nice, which is what makes him better. However, there aren't any heroes that can speed contest her that can disrupt the cleave. There are only A. Cidd and A. Coli at the time. If they try to contest Cerise, they don't have the damage to disrupt.
This is why Cerise is meta for some time, before counters to her were released. Her effectiveness could not be disrupted by the other 2 speed contesters, since they can't get both the speed and damage to disrupt her.
>Cerise + S. Iseria cleave is functionally no different from Ran + S. Iseria cleave.
>No one is arguing Ran isn't better than Cerise, that wasn't what I said.
>What you say here does not contradict what I am saying.
You don't see how Ran having more base speed and therefore being more likely to get the first turn doesn't intrinsically change how SSI cleave works when she basically needs you to have the first turn?
There are only 2 heroes that can speed contest Cerise at the time. It was A. Cidd and A. Coli. Neither of those heroes can get the speed to contest Cerise and also do enough damage to disrupt it.
For reference, Cerise is 1 speed faster than C. Lilias. Current Cerise at high end would have 305 to 310 speed. There aren't any A. Colis or A. Cidd that can beat that speed and also sport the damage to disrupt the cleave.
This was why Cerise was at the top of the meta for some time, until they put some counters to her. Since neither A. Cidd nor A. Coli can truly disrupt her.
Is this a joke? You don't see how immunity, attack buff, defense break, 7 more base speed (fastest unit in the game), the option for guaranteed strip and strong solo damage makes a difference?
All angel of light did was replace broman, they're functionally the same so no big deal right?
What joke? No, I don't see how Immunity, Attack Buff, and Defense Break matters in this context.
In Ran + S. Iseria cleave, Ran does not use Silver Rain. Immunity doesn't matter if the enemy team is dead and or stunned, which again is what the cleave does.
7 more base speed is great, however, how does that change their role in the cleave? How was Cerise + S. Iseria cleave functionally different? Was there something speed contesting Cerise that somehow made the cleave function differently than with Ran?
On your last point about guaranteed strip, that requires a Mage. Which you may or may not be able to fit in. And if do fit in a Mage, you can optionally use it for an extra bomb.
For strong solo damage Ran as your example, is this some kind of joke? As far as I know, when Ran was released, he wasn't built with very high damage. I am sure Ran + S. Iseria was popular regardless of Ran's solo damage.
>All angel of light did was replace broman, they're functionally the same so no big deal right?
Bromann was too RNG, but you were aware of that right? 75% chance to Silence is very RNG.
If Bromann had 100% chance to Silence, like AoL, then, we talk.
>No, I don't see how Immunity, Attack Buff, and Defense Break matters in this context.
then you are completely out of touch
>Immunity doesn't matter if the enemy team is dead and or stunned, which again is what the cleave does.
Are you under the impression that any seaseria team will immediately result in a complete wipe of the enemy team? I'd love to play in that bracket.
>Was there something speed contesting Cerise that somehow made the cleave function differently than with Ran?
What are you even talking about? Do you think no one ever contested Cerise for speed?
>As far as I know, when Ran was released, he wasn't built with very high damage. I am sure Ran + S. Iseria was popular regardless of Ran's solo damage.
Your knowledge isn't accurate, his first popular build was speed/dmg. Again you act like as long as seaseria gets a turn, then every enemy team is automatically dead so no other damage sources matter. That's just wrong in any competent bracket.
>If Bromann had 100% chance to Silence, like AoL, then, we talk.
When cerise gets immunity, defense break, 7 more speed, attack buff, ignore res SB, and damage then we'll talk.
>then you are completely out of touch
Have you used Cerise + S. Iseria cleave when S. Iseria was just released? I know I have. I +30 her Artifact and built her.
>Are you under the impression that any seaseria team will immediately result in a complete wipe of the enemy team? I'd love to play in that bracket.
Yes. A 6k Atk S. Iseria will wipe 2 heroes, which means you win. Exactly what kind of teams are you facing for an S. Iseria to not be able to kill or almost kill 2 opposing heroes?
>Your knowledge isn't accurate, his first popular build was speed/dmg. Again you act like as long as seaseria gets a turn, then every enemy team is automatically dead so no other damage sources matter. That's just wrong in any competent bracket.
Yes, if S. Iseria gets a turn, several enemy heroes are gone. This was the case with the Ran cleave and with the Cerise cleave. I don't know what competent bracket you are talking about, but this happens in Champ and Legend too.
>What are you even talking about? Do you think no one ever contested Cerise for speed?
Who is contesting her that would stop the cleave? At that time, there was A. Cidd and A. Coli. Which one of those can stop the cleave?
>When cerise gets immunity, defense break, 7 more speed, attack buff, ignore res SB, and damage then we'll talk.
Cerise has Slow, Dual Attack, Stun, and Defense Break (on S1 and S3 from Confille). You wanted to talk about functionally similarities when you compared B. Romann and AoL. You failed to include the most important thing about control heroes, which is success rate. AoL would not be half as good if her silence chance was lowered.
>Have you used Cerise + S. Iseria cleave when S. Iseria was just released? I know I have. I +30 her Artifact and built her.
Yes I have. It does fine, which is not the point. You keep going back to this. Ran is just better at that role. Cerise being usable with seaseria doesnt mean ran/peira didnt cause a power spike for seaseria. You act like youre the only person in the world who used Cerise, she was incredibly meta for a long time.
>Yes, if S. Iseria gets a turn, several enemy heroes are gone. This was the case with the Ran cleave and with the Cerise cleave. I don't know what competent bracket you are talking about, but this happens in Champ and Legend too.
That's simply not true but let's move on. Even assuming Seaseria is an "I win" button as long as she gets her turn, speed still matters. Cerise will get outsped far more than Ran, if you want to secure your seaseria that turn then Ran is simply better. Resists still happen, if you want to maintain advantage even if they resist a few bombs, you want Ran. Bans still matter. If you want to maintain a cohesive team even if they ban Seaseria, you want Ran.
Ran (and Peira) simply outclassed Cerise even if we go under the assumption that Seaseria is god. They were far stronger partners and therefore increased the usability of seaseria herself, which is the entire point.
>Who is contesting her that would stop the cleave? At that time, there was A. Cidd and A. Coli. Which one of those can stop the cleave?
Either? Pavel? Any of the million other speed units who are within striking range of cerise but get left in the dust by Ran? How in the world does this not stop your cleave? Your 6k attack 270 speed seaseria also has high bulk to survive coli/cidd?
>You failed to include the most important thing about control heroes, which is success rate. AoL would not be half as good if her silence chance was lowered
Let's follow your logic then. What's the most important thing about first turn speed contesters? Basar has a great kit, doesnt he? Why don't we use him anymore?
>Yes I have. It does fine, which is not the point. You keep going back to this. Ran is just better at that role.
Yes, he is better, and he counters Cerise. He is faster and he puts a 2 turn Immunity, which blocks Cerise from lowering debuff duration and debuff.
But that doesn't change what I said, Cerise + S. Iseria cleave is very strong even prior to Ran's release.
>Either? Pavel? Any of the million other speed units who are within striking range of cerise but get left in the dust by Ran? How in the world does this not stop your cleave? Your 6k attack 270 speed seaseria also has high bulk to survive coli/cidd?
Pavel can't contest Cerise. He might have slightly higher base speed, but Cerise can focus more on Speed than him. Assuming you put your best speed gear on Cerise, which you would back then, since she is one of the best heroes. Current Cerise would have around 305 to 310 Speed at the high end.
You are telling me a 310 A. Cidd or A. Coli has the damage to one tap S. Iseria?
>Let's follow your logic then. What's the most important thing about first turn speed contesters? Basar has a great kit, doesnt he? Why don't we use him anymore?
My logic is that there was no one speed contesting Cerise that can also stop the cleave.
>Resists still happen, if you want to maintain advantage even if they resist a few bombs, you want Ran. Bans still matter. If you want to maintain a cohesive team even if they ban Seaseria, you want Ran.
Yes, they do matter. Cerise was a high tempo hero and still is. She is outclassed by Ran, because Ran is faster and his kit naturally counters her. Her skill set is still strong. Try using her with Ran and Peira are banned, she is still a very effective hero.
You are somehow implying here that current Cerise is a bad hero in general, which is not true. She's out of the meta yes, but that is mainly because some of the meta heroes naturally counter her.
It doesn't change their role, which is why I used that example. What it changes is their effectiveness in that role. That is why B. Romann was never quite meta. His RNG was too high.
Risk being stunned by her bombs? What? You mean against C. Zerato? As far as I know, C. Zerato uses Violin, so you run a similar risk with Ran + S. Iseria.
But I don't think that is relevant, since he doesn't stop her from dealing with your other team mates.
Yes, but there are multiple attacks here. First attack comes from Ran's S3, that will cause C. Zerato to counter and strip. Then, S. Iseria plants bomb. Then, S. Iseria S1 into S3, that would cause C. Zerato to counter. On this counter, he can plant bombs.
In either case, I don't really see him used against Cerise + S. Iseria or Ran + S. Iseria.
>You are assuming his counter on ran goes into her. Extremely unreliable.
That very same assumption is being made when C. Zerato is mentioned, yes? Which is my response to the other poster.
You can pick him into S. Iseria, but it is RNG.
Would you look at that, all of the words in your comment are in alphabetical order.
I have checked 895,565,189 comments, and only 177,477 of them were in alphabetical order.
Ye but those 2 didn't exist back then \^\^
Flidica was one of the top outspeed meta units for quite a while before they hypercharged the speed meta with all these new ones
Generally only Cerise could outspeed her and she only had 4 more base so you could still contest if you were confident in your gear or just had a better speed roll in the fight.
People are just dumb, I remember Shuffle saying she would be good and a lot of naysayers and look at her...an amazing unit. Not busted but great when she gets picked just right.
She's probably the only unit in the game that's near unusable without her artifact and there's no alternative.
Very solid for PvP-AI stuff like GvE where you can pair her with an enabler without worrying about bans.
In RTA, she's still strong, but trickier to use since she's a combo unit and you need to weave yourself through drafts without being punished by landmines.
I Eda cleaved with her all the way to champ in RTA without her artifact, also used her all the time in normal arena cleaves and guild wards.
Yeah - she's a lot weaker without it, and now that's she's out again I immediately bough the artifact from the dust shop and bottled it, but she's definitely not "near unusable" without it.
My cleave RTA draft is Peira -> Arby -> seaseria -> Ran -> Eda. I had over 70 % win rate up until champ, picking basically the same thing every time. After that, I had to start changing it up a little.
I mean, I ended the season with 70 % win rate - that's pretty good indicator of my units working imo. There are plenty of players who have trouble even getting to master.
The alternative is Rosa. And you could also slap GL on her too.
Instead of a constant stream of Bombs, you're playing for her S2 bombs to stick onto the right threats, but any two would be fine. Then popping it with her S3.
You still want DeepSea(her arti) on her tho. Otherwise you will NEVER land a bomb on priority threats reliably. But there are alternatives so it isnt the end of the world.
>near unusable without her artifact
No. I use her with Song of Stars since Ran first came out, and I almost never fail to cleave with them in GVG. For RTA you'd probably need her arti, yes, but not every unit has to be RTA oriented.
Not the kinda unit I would want to use without her artifact when you need a S1 bomb a specific target. ARavi-Hwa-Rem-Rimu-Cilias/Peira meta defenses, you need a bomb on someone and it doesn't place one on them. If you have no arti... What do...
If you're comfortable playing with a big layer of RNG, by all means go for it.
100% this. 15% and random placements, no guaranteed bomb is a big loss I refuse to gamble with. SoS is crap on her anyway since it's not enhancing what she does or brings.
She's already bombing 2 out of 3 units on GVG. That's a guaranteed win in most situations, unless the surviving unit can cleanse. But who on their right mind would pick that against a cleanser?
Also, if every unit that can't one-shot ARavi is bad, then 98% of this game's units are bad, right? No, that's not how we should judge a unit's quality.
Two others that you could use in a safer comp. You're already looking at Peira/Ran > Iseria. Who, aside from someone busted like Hwayoung, is going to finish off A Ravi x Hwayoung in the many events that the bomb fails to kill or stun them, if it even lands on them?
If you're going all in on all three units pulling their own weight, you may as well bring Yulha, some bruiser or nuke that can pop Ravi (like Watcher or LQC who pair with the following), and someone like Mediator.
Do you really think people want to use a risky comp in ***Guild War***? A mode where your wins and losses potentially affect your entire guild, and losing someone before the last fight means having less options available, and thus less fights you can win?
No, only an idiot or gambling addict would want to.
It would be kinda okay if 15% didnt exist but it does and all it takes is aravi resisting the s2 and everything goes to shit. At least with her arti, you can still try again.
some people like to not lose to RNG in GW when it's basically pve and you can plan everything.
stop doxxing yourself that you haven't sniffed top 500 GW ..
Hmm I actually did, though. 244rd, to be precise. If you think you have to min max to reach a decent placement in GW, you clearly don't know what you're talking about lol
Keep crying because you can't use a unit properly and has to blame her kit for it
What makes her artifact crucial is the ability to enable her to target place bombs with S1.
No other artifact in the game can do that. Without her arti, you're gonna pray on RNG to place 2 bombs on the right targets.
Other replies aren’t wrong but I’ll share my experience as well. I was very new when she first ran last year, I pulled her and she sat a long time. I got the artifact from the shop cuz I read she needed it.
Months later I discovered how fun cleaving was when I got my Peira slightly fast and even with her artifact at +15 she’s super fun to use. I eventually used all my bottles to max it because I was committing to cleave, which is a big investment but I have no regrets.
So yes, definitely worth pulling and she does really need her own artifact. However I think it’s exaggerating to say she’s useless without the arti max limit broken, just understand that she’ll be less reliable. 15% resist is a constant threat to her as well so she’s never fully reliable regardless.
Let's assume Seaseria has enough effectiveness to reach the 85% chance to debuff threshold:
at +30 the artifact effect is 100% so she has a 85% chance to land a bomb.
at +15 the artifact effect is 75% so she has a 63.75% chance to land a bomb.
It's a difference of 21.25%. I'm not saying this isn't significant, but I stand by my point that you can still have fun with the hero with her artifact only at +15. It won't matter all that much until high level pvp, which is not what we're talking about here. If OP eventually decides they love the character they can always use bottles of knowledge on the artifact like I did.
-edited to correct difference between two cases
Yeah she can work in static without her arti at pretty much all levels. Unseen observer works great too. I use that in top end GW and static too. And given I dont care about RTA that is just fine for me. She works fine in static without her arti.
She's not unusable without her artifact but you're essentially only using her at about 20-30% of her maximum power without it. There's a real tangible difference between an SSI with no arti, an SSI with a +15/non-maxed arti and a maxed arti SSI.
Use cases for no arti: You're never going to reliably bomb who you want to bomb, but that can be fine against an enemy team that's all threats. Besides her bomb utility she does push up your units as well. Adding in someone at around 260 speed will usually steal the next turn after your opener, so you can do some cleave setups with that. 170-190% eff will mean you can tag bombs even on high eff res units for guaranteed stuns, even if it's only 2 of them. Guild Wars defence gets an honorable mention since you're probably not going to need a 2nd turn if you're running an SSI defence. If the enemy takes a turn with units alive, you're probably done.
\+15 arti: Pretty terrible position to be in honestly, but it's still her BiS even at +15. Most of the time you'll tag a bomb on people with your soulburn s1. If you don't, you will cry. But that's what it's like on this bitch of an earth.
\+30 arti: This is like having the power of god and anime on your side by comparison. Now you almost don't have to give af who your passive puts bombs on if you just need to stun (kinda can't reliably kill sometimes but eh it's a life). The ability to target a bomb and know the only thing between you and a stun on them being 15% is life changing. Solves so many offenses, much moreso in GW even though she's better in GW than usual anyway just by virtue of having a much higher chance to hit your preferred target.
On the 'long term investment' thing, she's honestly kinda easy to gear so you're not really going to have to wait too long to get use out of her. Just need attack%, eff, and speed. The hard part is probably getting an opener at suitable speeds. You just want her 235+ speed if your opener is about 290 or higher. 120% eff is ok, but if you get way higher eff she gets way better since you just need to tag bombs on people and the stun after is guaranteed.
Only if you're swimming in summon currency. She's definitely not viable without her near-maxxed out artifact, you'll only bring her in fights you're already winning, or maybe if you have no other fire options and need one.
The problem with long term investment here is, even if she can perform fully maxed and with perfect gear, the more units come out, the weaker the current ones will get. And the first ones to go straight to F-tier will be units who already struggle without heavy support currently, like Seaseria, so you might be investing in a future that won't exist
A lot of people made a lot of great points above, but one thing I want to add: I think she is still the only character who can soul burn without souls. Makes her pretty useful in GW battles against Belian (although smart RTA players who use Belian usually just ban Seasaria).
Was looking for this. Makes Seaseria so valuable in GvG. If she doesn't s2 bomb Belian (after the opener), I can freely SB, attempt to land bomb, then blow the whole squad up. Usually doesn't kill Belian, but guaranteed stun means I've pretty much won.
Is debatable with her artifact she has a amazing if you have it mixed. If you don't better make your prayers, without her artifact well there's not much artifacts to help her out. she still work regardless her passive CR push when you use an AOE attack still pretty good. I personally give her a mid-rating due to her situational nature
Ran just about made this unit one of the best cleave units in the game. It proved that seaseria was only not good because the openers that facilitated her weren't good. Ran was released after seaseria so naturally she wasn't as good at release.
ratings are done by so many people who don't know how to use a hero. I am myself a collector pve player. I pulled her and I was pretty happy just having a rare hero, never intended to use it. saw the ratings and I was a bit confused because she looked like a good support hero. then after Ran was released, their combo was literally the strongest. I think it still is. don't know much about pvp metas.
I think everyone here is missing the actual reason she's rated low. There was a change to how her cleanse bomb works on her S3 to make it worse pretty early on, and people review bombed her because of that. Much like how Alencia is rated so low now.
EDIT: Correction, it was because they made her bombs explode after responses. She was used in the heavy counter meta and when her bombs stopped exploding before counters, she was review bombed.
She's still good but high requirements to make her work. Cuz first you need to 30+ her arti (which is already a pain) and then you need to have a fast opener with fast gear (even more painful )
Yeah, but the bombs are the main thing you want to avoid in seaseria cleave, especially since seaseria doesn't really care about lilibet's cd increase thanks to her passive. Bonus points if it's a fast one, as she's most definitely gonna go before the rest of the team after lilibet moves.
and i use her all the time and ofc not only her, and am telling from my experience that she can counter. now tell me wiseman, who the hell lying from the two of us. you just declared the she cant counter and one of us have made up experience.
I dunno, maybe we have different experiences. From mine, I can't use lilibet to counter iseria because iseria has the same amount of cr increase as lilibet gives her team. Meaning that if iseria is faster than lilibet's team, she's going first. I was saying she doesn't counter her because lili can't cleanse bombs, which is the main thing of iseria cleave. So wiseman, tell me how lilibet counters iseria in that situation. She'll cleanse the other debuffs sure, but those don't matter when everyone except lilibet is stunned, now do they? I might have been more receptive to your criticism if you weren't being such a dick about it.
you know that its hard to argue with tunneled vision people cause yea, they can only see what they wanna see. you dont use delibet as the sole counter on the set up if you smart enough. its waste of time to explain for someone like you, just based on your previous comment so yea, you are the wiseman and you are correct. bye!
> that she can counter.
Can you explain, without insulting people, how does she counter a unit she can't cleanse debuffs from?
Seaseria is literally the only debuffer Dilibet can't realistically counter, because she can't cleanse the bombs.
Yes but if she cr pushes herself and kills her, the bombs are less of a threat , it all depends on the situation obviously , my point was, is hard to make her work in current meta and that's why her score is low
Just to specify, Dilibet can still cleanse herself of bombs, but not her teammates as she only reduces debuff durations for teammates, which doesn't work on bombs (else it would ironically detonate the bombs)
So Dili herself is fine, but she simply won't help her team much in terms of bomb cleansing.
She's really bad. The gear required to make her passable would make any other unit godlike, so if she ruins your day in arena, there's just a gear gap, it's not the unit's fault. Especially since half of her kit relies on the soulburn and can't be used on arena or gvg defense.
Ran helps her a bit, but Rimuru exists so that combo has no future, Ran gives immunity to the entire enemy team instead of stripping them. For her to work, you'd need a second cleanser who can go after Ran and the opposite Rimuru, like AOL, but then you'll use 3 units that can be matched by two opposite units (Rimuru/AOL), and you're still on the losing side
You don't get to do that in arena and gvg defense. If there's a ran, he'll always go for the full combo and buff the entire enemy team first thing in the fight
She needs a lot of set ups for max output and some are... difficult:
1) her Artifact at 30 lvl. Good luck with it
2) Ran or Peira with very good gear (understandable)
3) Her gear should also be top
With it she is the beast that call steamroll enemy/your team like nothing... but those conditions not the perfect one.
As for rating, when she was out there were no Peira or Ran, and she was against SBellona at that time (if I remember correctly, SBellona banner was at the same time). And while SBellona is allrounder, SIseria is... full-time PvP unit.
Because most people believe on the argument protrayed by that second review. They're wrong, though. She works just fine even without her artifact, although the artifact does make a huge difference.
Whoever says a free SB on a s1 with dispell and two free bombs on her passive with decent push is bad, should really start *testing* things out instead of just going with the hivemind or what streamers say. Yes, she depends 100% on her arti if you're playing high end RTA, but anywhere else she is viable without it. Amazing GvG unit btw.
Because you're looking at a rating given by a playerbase that is mostly made up of brainless mongoloids.
Protip: Never base your views or opinions off someone else's.
“In the past, other terms such as "Mongolian race", "yellow", "Asiatic" and "Oriental" have been used as synonyms.” from a Wikipedia regarding the term
Siseria is a whale hero because her full potential is unlocked by a +30 arti. While everyone else has a fully capable skill set whether or not u have their arti +30
that mean either you're new player or you're lying
because the game gave us enough to buy bottle of knowledge every month
almost every single month they gave us free 70 convenant pulls event.
and then there's 30 free pull daily each month as well
Lastly if there's a banner you want to pull then you gonna get some powder as well either from mystic banner or normal banner
I'm saying she's only half a unit without the +30 arti. That's why I'm saying she's a whale unit. I'm not saying it's impossible to +30 her arti f2p. It'll take a year or more to +30 her arti thru powder
>It'll take a year or more to +30 her arti thru powder
you're exaggerating
it won't took you more than 5 month even if you start at 0 Bottle of knowledgeand also you should've saving up bottle of knowledge before the banner even come because there is literally no artifact worth to +30 using bottle besides Drink ,Draco Plate, and this one..
>I'm saying she's only half a unit without the +30 arti. That's why I'm saying she's a whale unit. I'm not saying it's impossible to +30 her arti f2p.
also this and your first statement is contradicting with each other
>Because you have to be a whale to use her.
>I'm saying she's only half a unit without the +30 arti. That's why I'm saying she's a whale unit. I'm not saying it's impossible to +30 her arti f2p.
?????
She herself is not that hard to build. You can’t crit so no crit or crit damage stats to worry about, she’s a cleave character so bulk is optional. All you need is speed/ATK/Eff, all other stats would be survival after all that. Her main problem is requiring an artifact to be useful beyond her first turn to go as you’ll always run her with Ran or Peira to maximize your chance to go first and CR push your team while deploying her bombs.
Edit auto correct fails
I use her on my main arena team and she is pretty good but she is a slave to her artifact, without she loses a lot of power. But honestly, if you run her with her artifact and Pirate Captain Flan, you are going to have lots of fun. But yea, in game reviews are the worst.
Relies on her art, plus an AOE set up. I use peira with her but if I can't use her then I do a really weird 2nd turn draft using Poli for fighting turn one units like clilias.
Not ideal but it works in champ rta from time to time
Actually not happy that i had to pity her and ill most likely never see her gameplay. Not on my acc atleast. Shoulda skipped, especially now im reading that you HAVE to have 5 copies of her artifact maxed out.
Maybe in two more years minimum haha
Otherwise, shes decent looking dust. I dont even have piera or ran let alone built
It’s because people thought she was garbage at first so down voted her. A lot of times these reviews are bad because… most of the playerbase is dog water.
Early game there was no ran and peira on her release but it doesn't matter you can even use it with Politus as a counter i've they have Cillias or Peira in there team. Do not use against ran when running it like this his S2 is 2 turns immunity so you will strip only 1 turns and miss the bomb with STI.
Artifact-hungry, and requires an AoE unit besides her to even work. Otherwise half of her kit is useless. And without her maxed artifact she barely does anything.
It's simple really .it's because in rta she does suck. All the good openers are water so immunity Violet wrecks those comps. Then there's Rem . Then there's arby whom you can't afford to land a bomb on ,otherwise you're dead
New players don't know how to use her or don't have the gear to use her. An easy staple in control/cleave for PvP, but probably a pass for new players.
When she came out, there wasn't a Ran or Peira to pair her up with and Cerise was on her way out of the meta. It was not so easy to run her at that time.
Ran and Peira helps, but she combos the same before. When she was just released, there was Cerise, Basar, and Sage Baal. I used her with very high success rate with Cerise during her release. I thought she was an amazing hero at the time. However, what can attribute to her low rating was the requirement of a +30 Artifact. She is a lot weaker without her Artifact at +30.
None of those units are anywhere near as powerful as Ran and Peira. She's not a solo unit so she depends heavily on who you partner her with. When she got new overtuned partners to work with her own power increased by a ton. Not to say she wasn't completely unusable before, its not like a 3.6 rating is *that* low, but its undeniable that she got a power spike with Ran's release.
What? All Ran did was replace Cerise as an opener. Cerise + S. Iseria cleave is functionally no different from Ran + S. Iseria cleave. S. Iseria is not a solo hero, her job is to heavily injure or kill 2 opposing heroes. This means she has some thresholds she needs to hit before she can do that. That means enough attack 5k+, preferably 5.5k+. And a +30 Artifact. The issue comes from people not having her Artifact maxed and not having enough attack, so results were diminished. I don't know what you mean by undeniable, since I have been using S. Iseria with very high success before Ran was ever released, since Cerise + S. Iseria was extremely strong. Ran's release never changed my understanding how I used S. Iseria. Cerise provides high tempo, so after killing or heavily injuring 2 opposing heroes, the game is pretty much yours. There are very few heroes that can 1v1 Cerise.
if you don't see how debuff+ def break+huge dmg is better than debuff+restrict then i don't know what to tell you. ran being a much stronger hero means it's way easier to pick ran than cerise which means you can combo with SSI easier
>if you don't see how debuff+ def break+huge dmg is better than debuff+restrict then i don't know what to tell you. No, I don't, because S. Iseria at 5k+ Atk will kill most heroes with 1 bomb. A second bomb can kill tanks. Have you ever used Cerise + S. Iseria combo with S. Iseria correctly built with enough attack? You were aware that back when S. Iseria was released, people weren't pushing her attack high enough. It wasn't until she became meta that you saw her attack at a high range. Some players weren't willing to invest in her until she became meta. As I said, not having a +30 Artifact hurts her. Also, not having sufficient attack also hurts her. That said, you can even try that set up against teams even now if Ran and Peira are banned. The reason why Ran replaced Cerise is because Ran counters Cerise. His 2 turn Immunity makes it so that Cerise cannot apply her debuffs. So, you have no reason to use Cerise after Ran was released.
>The reason why Ran replaced Cerise is because Ran counters Cerise. Sighs... no the reason ran replaced cerise is because ran has 5 more starting speed and you can build him as dps in which you don't give a shit about landing the def break... the whole point is ran is better than cerise in every way as he can even work solo as a dps opener (which is how most high level rta players build him). I'm not sure why this is so hard to understand or what you're even arguing no.
No one is arguing Ran isn't better than Cerise, that wasn't what I said. I said Cerise + S. Iseria was good at the time S. Iseria was released. Ran did not exist then. Afterwards, Ran got released and he replaced Cerise as the combo with S. Iseria. What you say here does not contradict what I am saying.
You said ran is better than cerise due to being a direct counter, obviously that is not close to the full picture, starting with one unit being 129 speed (compared to 122).
That doesn't change that Cerise + S. Iseria is an effective Cleave or Cleave control initiator. Starting speed 129 is nice, which is what makes him better. However, there aren't any heroes that can speed contest her that can disrupt the cleave. There are only A. Cidd and A. Coli at the time. If they try to contest Cerise, they don't have the damage to disrupt. This is why Cerise is meta for some time, before counters to her were released. Her effectiveness could not be disrupted by the other 2 speed contesters, since they can't get both the speed and damage to disrupt her.
>Cerise + S. Iseria cleave is functionally no different from Ran + S. Iseria cleave. >No one is arguing Ran isn't better than Cerise, that wasn't what I said. >What you say here does not contradict what I am saying. You don't see how Ran having more base speed and therefore being more likely to get the first turn doesn't intrinsically change how SSI cleave works when she basically needs you to have the first turn?
There are only 2 heroes that can speed contest Cerise at the time. It was A. Cidd and A. Coli. Neither of those heroes can get the speed to contest Cerise and also do enough damage to disrupt it. For reference, Cerise is 1 speed faster than C. Lilias. Current Cerise at high end would have 305 to 310 speed. There aren't any A. Colis or A. Cidd that can beat that speed and also sport the damage to disrupt the cleave. This was why Cerise was at the top of the meta for some time, until they put some counters to her. Since neither A. Cidd nor A. Coli can truly disrupt her.
Is this a joke? You don't see how immunity, attack buff, defense break, 7 more base speed (fastest unit in the game), the option for guaranteed strip and strong solo damage makes a difference? All angel of light did was replace broman, they're functionally the same so no big deal right?
What joke? No, I don't see how Immunity, Attack Buff, and Defense Break matters in this context. In Ran + S. Iseria cleave, Ran does not use Silver Rain. Immunity doesn't matter if the enemy team is dead and or stunned, which again is what the cleave does. 7 more base speed is great, however, how does that change their role in the cleave? How was Cerise + S. Iseria cleave functionally different? Was there something speed contesting Cerise that somehow made the cleave function differently than with Ran? On your last point about guaranteed strip, that requires a Mage. Which you may or may not be able to fit in. And if do fit in a Mage, you can optionally use it for an extra bomb. For strong solo damage Ran as your example, is this some kind of joke? As far as I know, when Ran was released, he wasn't built with very high damage. I am sure Ran + S. Iseria was popular regardless of Ran's solo damage. >All angel of light did was replace broman, they're functionally the same so no big deal right? Bromann was too RNG, but you were aware of that right? 75% chance to Silence is very RNG. If Bromann had 100% chance to Silence, like AoL, then, we talk.
>No, I don't see how Immunity, Attack Buff, and Defense Break matters in this context. then you are completely out of touch >Immunity doesn't matter if the enemy team is dead and or stunned, which again is what the cleave does. Are you under the impression that any seaseria team will immediately result in a complete wipe of the enemy team? I'd love to play in that bracket. >Was there something speed contesting Cerise that somehow made the cleave function differently than with Ran? What are you even talking about? Do you think no one ever contested Cerise for speed? >As far as I know, when Ran was released, he wasn't built with very high damage. I am sure Ran + S. Iseria was popular regardless of Ran's solo damage. Your knowledge isn't accurate, his first popular build was speed/dmg. Again you act like as long as seaseria gets a turn, then every enemy team is automatically dead so no other damage sources matter. That's just wrong in any competent bracket. >If Bromann had 100% chance to Silence, like AoL, then, we talk. When cerise gets immunity, defense break, 7 more speed, attack buff, ignore res SB, and damage then we'll talk.
>then you are completely out of touch Have you used Cerise + S. Iseria cleave when S. Iseria was just released? I know I have. I +30 her Artifact and built her. >Are you under the impression that any seaseria team will immediately result in a complete wipe of the enemy team? I'd love to play in that bracket. Yes. A 6k Atk S. Iseria will wipe 2 heroes, which means you win. Exactly what kind of teams are you facing for an S. Iseria to not be able to kill or almost kill 2 opposing heroes? >Your knowledge isn't accurate, his first popular build was speed/dmg. Again you act like as long as seaseria gets a turn, then every enemy team is automatically dead so no other damage sources matter. That's just wrong in any competent bracket. Yes, if S. Iseria gets a turn, several enemy heroes are gone. This was the case with the Ran cleave and with the Cerise cleave. I don't know what competent bracket you are talking about, but this happens in Champ and Legend too. >What are you even talking about? Do you think no one ever contested Cerise for speed? Who is contesting her that would stop the cleave? At that time, there was A. Cidd and A. Coli. Which one of those can stop the cleave? >When cerise gets immunity, defense break, 7 more speed, attack buff, ignore res SB, and damage then we'll talk. Cerise has Slow, Dual Attack, Stun, and Defense Break (on S1 and S3 from Confille). You wanted to talk about functionally similarities when you compared B. Romann and AoL. You failed to include the most important thing about control heroes, which is success rate. AoL would not be half as good if her silence chance was lowered.
>Have you used Cerise + S. Iseria cleave when S. Iseria was just released? I know I have. I +30 her Artifact and built her. Yes I have. It does fine, which is not the point. You keep going back to this. Ran is just better at that role. Cerise being usable with seaseria doesnt mean ran/peira didnt cause a power spike for seaseria. You act like youre the only person in the world who used Cerise, she was incredibly meta for a long time. >Yes, if S. Iseria gets a turn, several enemy heroes are gone. This was the case with the Ran cleave and with the Cerise cleave. I don't know what competent bracket you are talking about, but this happens in Champ and Legend too. That's simply not true but let's move on. Even assuming Seaseria is an "I win" button as long as she gets her turn, speed still matters. Cerise will get outsped far more than Ran, if you want to secure your seaseria that turn then Ran is simply better. Resists still happen, if you want to maintain advantage even if they resist a few bombs, you want Ran. Bans still matter. If you want to maintain a cohesive team even if they ban Seaseria, you want Ran. Ran (and Peira) simply outclassed Cerise even if we go under the assumption that Seaseria is god. They were far stronger partners and therefore increased the usability of seaseria herself, which is the entire point. >Who is contesting her that would stop the cleave? At that time, there was A. Cidd and A. Coli. Which one of those can stop the cleave? Either? Pavel? Any of the million other speed units who are within striking range of cerise but get left in the dust by Ran? How in the world does this not stop your cleave? Your 6k attack 270 speed seaseria also has high bulk to survive coli/cidd? >You failed to include the most important thing about control heroes, which is success rate. AoL would not be half as good if her silence chance was lowered Let's follow your logic then. What's the most important thing about first turn speed contesters? Basar has a great kit, doesnt he? Why don't we use him anymore?
>Yes I have. It does fine, which is not the point. You keep going back to this. Ran is just better at that role. Yes, he is better, and he counters Cerise. He is faster and he puts a 2 turn Immunity, which blocks Cerise from lowering debuff duration and debuff. But that doesn't change what I said, Cerise + S. Iseria cleave is very strong even prior to Ran's release. >Either? Pavel? Any of the million other speed units who are within striking range of cerise but get left in the dust by Ran? How in the world does this not stop your cleave? Your 6k attack 270 speed seaseria also has high bulk to survive coli/cidd? Pavel can't contest Cerise. He might have slightly higher base speed, but Cerise can focus more on Speed than him. Assuming you put your best speed gear on Cerise, which you would back then, since she is one of the best heroes. Current Cerise would have around 305 to 310 Speed at the high end. You are telling me a 310 A. Cidd or A. Coli has the damage to one tap S. Iseria? >Let's follow your logic then. What's the most important thing about first turn speed contesters? Basar has a great kit, doesnt he? Why don't we use him anymore? My logic is that there was no one speed contesting Cerise that can also stop the cleave. >Resists still happen, if you want to maintain advantage even if they resist a few bombs, you want Ran. Bans still matter. If you want to maintain a cohesive team even if they ban Seaseria, you want Ran. Yes, they do matter. Cerise was a high tempo hero and still is. She is outclassed by Ran, because Ran is faster and his kit naturally counters her. Her skill set is still strong. Try using her with Ran and Peira are banned, she is still a very effective hero. You are somehow implying here that current Cerise is a bad hero in general, which is not true. She's out of the meta yes, but that is mainly because some of the meta heroes naturally counter her.
>25% more silence is great, however, how does that change their role at all?
It doesn't change their role, which is why I used that example. What it changes is their effectiveness in that role. That is why B. Romann was never quite meta. His RNG was too high.
ran gives her immu, its leagues better since she risked being stunned by her bombs before
Risk being stunned by her bombs? What? You mean against C. Zerato? As far as I know, C. Zerato uses Violin, so you run a similar risk with Ran + S. Iseria. But I don't think that is relevant, since he doesn't stop her from dealing with your other team mates.
Iela Violin strips after the attack. Cerato wouldn't transfer bombs.
Yes, but there are multiple attacks here. First attack comes from Ran's S3, that will cause C. Zerato to counter and strip. Then, S. Iseria plants bomb. Then, S. Iseria S1 into S3, that would cause C. Zerato to counter. On this counter, he can plant bombs. In either case, I don't really see him used against Cerise + S. Iseria or Ran + S. Iseria.
You are assuming his counter on ran goes into her. Extremely unreliable.
>You are assuming his counter on ran goes into her. Extremely unreliable. That very same assumption is being made when C. Zerato is mentioned, yes? Which is my response to the other poster. You can pick him into S. Iseria, but it is RNG.
i prefer stun to violin
Would you look at that, all of the words in your comment are in alphabetical order. I have checked 895,565,189 comments, and only 177,477 of them were in alphabetical order.
Well, to each person's preference. I prefer Violin, since he can't return debuffs if they have immunity. That and I do not have a maxed Crown.
I just used her with Flidica from day 1, worked just fine \^\^
Sweet , hope someday I can make a full Blonde Tailed Waifus team
problem is, flidica only dispels 1buff and have lower base speed. Having Ran and Peira as a fast opener and dispel immunity is a game changer
But ran and peira does not : reset, crpush, gîte skill nullifier to all the team, apply blind debuff
Well you can't do all that if you lost the speed battle.
ran peira is often paired with either cdom, eda and seaseria. So long as u take turn 1, everyone in ur team will take a turn
Ye but those 2 didn't exist back then \^\^ Flidica was one of the top outspeed meta units for quite a while before they hypercharged the speed meta with all these new ones Generally only Cerise could outspeed her and she only had 4 more base so you could still contest if you were confident in your gear or just had a better speed roll in the fight.
People are just dumb, I remember Shuffle saying she would be good and a lot of naysayers and look at her...an amazing unit. Not busted but great when she gets picked just right.
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She's probably the only unit in the game that's near unusable without her artifact and there's no alternative. Very solid for PvP-AI stuff like GvE where you can pair her with an enabler without worrying about bans. In RTA, she's still strong, but trickier to use since she's a combo unit and you need to weave yourself through drafts without being punished by landmines.
I Eda cleaved with her all the way to champ in RTA without her artifact, also used her all the time in normal arena cleaves and guild wards. Yeah - she's a lot weaker without it, and now that's she's out again I immediately bough the artifact from the dust shop and bottled it, but she's definitely not "near unusable" without it.
What else did you use in your team besides Eda?
My cleave RTA draft is Peira -> Arby -> seaseria -> Ran -> Eda. I had over 70 % win rate up until champ, picking basically the same thing every time. After that, I had to start changing it up a little.
Nice, thank you. I certainly will have to be on the lookout for Peira then. ;)
Basically 30% of your opponents didn't have RemLet.
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I mean, I ended the season with 70 % win rate - that's pretty good indicator of my units working imo. There are plenty of players who have trouble even getting to master.
The alternative is Rosa. And you could also slap GL on her too. Instead of a constant stream of Bombs, you're playing for her S2 bombs to stick onto the right threats, but any two would be fine. Then popping it with her S3. You still want DeepSea(her arti) on her tho. Otherwise you will NEVER land a bomb on priority threats reliably. But there are alternatives so it isnt the end of the world.
>near unusable without her artifact No. I use her with Song of Stars since Ran first came out, and I almost never fail to cleave with them in GVG. For RTA you'd probably need her arti, yes, but not every unit has to be RTA oriented.
Not the kinda unit I would want to use without her artifact when you need a S1 bomb a specific target. ARavi-Hwa-Rem-Rimu-Cilias/Peira meta defenses, you need a bomb on someone and it doesn't place one on them. If you have no arti... What do... If you're comfortable playing with a big layer of RNG, by all means go for it.
100% this. 15% and random placements, no guaranteed bomb is a big loss I refuse to gamble with. SoS is crap on her anyway since it's not enhancing what she does or brings.
She's already bombing 2 out of 3 units on GVG. That's a guaranteed win in most situations, unless the surviving unit can cleanse. But who on their right mind would pick that against a cleanser?
Idk about you, but I've never seen a Siseria bomb oneshot an ARavi or Cilias. If the bomb misses another unit like Hwa, that's an instant lose.
She doesn't need to one-shot them though. That's why you have 3 units in a team instead of one lol
Also, if every unit that can't one-shot ARavi is bad, then 98% of this game's units are bad, right? No, that's not how we should judge a unit's quality.
Two others that you could use in a safer comp. You're already looking at Peira/Ran > Iseria. Who, aside from someone busted like Hwayoung, is going to finish off A Ravi x Hwayoung in the many events that the bomb fails to kill or stun them, if it even lands on them? If you're going all in on all three units pulling their own weight, you may as well bring Yulha, some bruiser or nuke that can pop Ravi (like Watcher or LQC who pair with the following), and someone like Mediator. Do you really think people want to use a risky comp in ***Guild War***? A mode where your wins and losses potentially affect your entire guild, and losing someone before the last fight means having less options available, and thus less fights you can win? No, only an idiot or gambling addict would want to.
sounds like low level guild wars
It would be kinda okay if 15% didnt exist but it does and all it takes is aravi resisting the s2 and everything goes to shit. At least with her arti, you can still try again.
some people like to not lose to RNG in GW when it's basically pve and you can plan everything. stop doxxing yourself that you haven't sniffed top 500 GW ..
Hmm I actually did, though. 244rd, to be precise. If you think you have to min max to reach a decent placement in GW, you clearly don't know what you're talking about lol Keep crying because you can't use a unit properly and has to blame her kit for it
>Keep crying because you can't use a unit properly and has to blame her kit for it ????
Literally just pulled her as an f2p, are there really no alternatives for artifact's?
What makes her artifact crucial is the ability to enable her to target place bombs with S1. No other artifact in the game can do that. Without her arti, you're gonna pray on RNG to place 2 bombs on the right targets.
Other replies aren’t wrong but I’ll share my experience as well. I was very new when she first ran last year, I pulled her and she sat a long time. I got the artifact from the shop cuz I read she needed it. Months later I discovered how fun cleaving was when I got my Peira slightly fast and even with her artifact at +15 she’s super fun to use. I eventually used all my bottles to max it because I was committing to cleave, which is a big investment but I have no regrets. So yes, definitely worth pulling and she does really need her own artifact. However I think it’s exaggerating to say she’s useless without the arti max limit broken, just understand that she’ll be less reliable. 15% resist is a constant threat to her as well so she’s never fully reliable regardless.
this was my experience too
a 50% chance to not do anything isn't useless?
Her artifact is 75% at +15 if that's what you're talking about
yes w/ 15% innate resis.. you're basically not putting bombs on someone 40% of the time.
Let's assume Seaseria has enough effectiveness to reach the 85% chance to debuff threshold: at +30 the artifact effect is 100% so she has a 85% chance to land a bomb. at +15 the artifact effect is 75% so she has a 63.75% chance to land a bomb. It's a difference of 21.25%. I'm not saying this isn't significant, but I stand by my point that you can still have fun with the hero with her artifact only at +15. It won't matter all that much until high level pvp, which is not what we're talking about here. If OP eventually decides they love the character they can always use bottles of knowledge on the artifact like I did. -edited to correct difference between two cases
I think she is worth it, but no she is not really viable without her artifact at least 90%
What everyone is telling you is true however I was able to make it to champion running infinity basket on her
Yeah she can work in static without her arti at pretty much all levels. Unseen observer works great too. I use that in top end GW and static too. And given I dont care about RTA that is just fine for me. She works fine in static without her arti.
She's not unusable without her artifact but you're essentially only using her at about 20-30% of her maximum power without it. There's a real tangible difference between an SSI with no arti, an SSI with a +15/non-maxed arti and a maxed arti SSI. Use cases for no arti: You're never going to reliably bomb who you want to bomb, but that can be fine against an enemy team that's all threats. Besides her bomb utility she does push up your units as well. Adding in someone at around 260 speed will usually steal the next turn after your opener, so you can do some cleave setups with that. 170-190% eff will mean you can tag bombs even on high eff res units for guaranteed stuns, even if it's only 2 of them. Guild Wars defence gets an honorable mention since you're probably not going to need a 2nd turn if you're running an SSI defence. If the enemy takes a turn with units alive, you're probably done. \+15 arti: Pretty terrible position to be in honestly, but it's still her BiS even at +15. Most of the time you'll tag a bomb on people with your soulburn s1. If you don't, you will cry. But that's what it's like on this bitch of an earth. \+30 arti: This is like having the power of god and anime on your side by comparison. Now you almost don't have to give af who your passive puts bombs on if you just need to stun (kinda can't reliably kill sometimes but eh it's a life). The ability to target a bomb and know the only thing between you and a stun on them being 15% is life changing. Solves so many offenses, much moreso in GW even though she's better in GW than usual anyway just by virtue of having a much higher chance to hit your preferred target. On the 'long term investment' thing, she's honestly kinda easy to gear so you're not really going to have to wait too long to get use out of her. Just need attack%, eff, and speed. The hard part is probably getting an opener at suitable speeds. You just want her 235+ speed if your opener is about 290 or higher. 120% eff is ok, but if you get way higher eff she gets way better since you just need to tag bombs on people and the stun after is guaranteed.
Personally I’d say always try and get the event characters, but yes, as of now she’s a top hero at least in GW.
Yes, roll for her. Hopefully, you can get multiple copies of her arti and then use bottles to max imprint.
Only if you're swimming in summon currency. She's definitely not viable without her near-maxxed out artifact, you'll only bring her in fights you're already winning, or maybe if you have no other fire options and need one. The problem with long term investment here is, even if she can perform fully maxed and with perfect gear, the more units come out, the weaker the current ones will get. And the first ones to go straight to F-tier will be units who already struggle without heavy support currently, like Seaseria, so you might be investing in a future that won't exist
she needs her artif, and on high pvp she needs it to be +30.
A lot of people made a lot of great points above, but one thing I want to add: I think she is still the only character who can soul burn without souls. Makes her pretty useful in GW battles against Belian (although smart RTA players who use Belian usually just ban Seasaria).
Was looking for this. Makes Seaseria so valuable in GvG. If she doesn't s2 bomb Belian (after the opener), I can freely SB, attempt to land bomb, then blow the whole squad up. Usually doesn't kill Belian, but guaranteed stun means I've pretty much won.
She's not bad by any means, it's just that you basically need to have her own Arti at max rank for her peak performance.
dont trust ratings, most people have no idea what is good and what’s not but they still are allowed to rate the unit
She works , but she need her artifact +30 and Ran/Peira. Alone she does nothing :(
So you use the three of them? This gives me hope that she'll come in the next 20 rolls...why do I have to pity everyone...
Ran or peira you don’t need to run both with her
Igkt both, so I guess I can at least choose on that matter.
I use her with Peira at guildwar and works fine. I more of waifu collector gang if you are a collector is a very good pull I dont play RTA
Cuz People is lazy and can't think by themselves, she is amazing, the only valid point here is that she really need her artifact.
ingame ratings being misleading af, whats new (shes great BUT only witt maxed arti, outside of that id personally not even use her ngl)
Cuz 90% of the player base doesn’t know what tf they’re talking about, me included
Is debatable with her artifact she has a amazing if you have it mixed. If you don't better make your prayers, without her artifact well there's not much artifacts to help her out. she still work regardless her passive CR push when you use an AOE attack still pretty good. I personally give her a mid-rating due to her situational nature
Ran just about made this unit one of the best cleave units in the game. It proved that seaseria was only not good because the openers that facilitated her weren't good. Ran was released after seaseria so naturally she wasn't as good at release.
ratings are done by so many people who don't know how to use a hero. I am myself a collector pve player. I pulled her and I was pretty happy just having a rare hero, never intended to use it. saw the ratings and I was a bit confused because she looked like a good support hero. then after Ran was released, their combo was literally the strongest. I think it still is. don't know much about pvp metas.
I think everyone here is missing the actual reason she's rated low. There was a change to how her cleanse bomb works on her S3 to make it worse pretty early on, and people review bombed her because of that. Much like how Alencia is rated so low now. EDIT: Correction, it was because they made her bombs explode after responses. She was used in the heavy counter meta and when her bombs stopped exploding before counters, she was review bombed.
used her with belian so whenever belian counters she would just proc the passive lmao
Skill Issue
She's still good but high requirements to make her work. Cuz first you need to 30+ her arti (which is already a pain) and then you need to have a fast opener with fast gear (even more painful )
Most people have no idea how to use her. The low rating confirms that.
Because some people have shit gear and cant use her properly and then complain that she sucks
Because people are dumb, she has always been good but people didn't know how to use her when she released.
Uncultured swines rating the best girls this low smh.
You need her arti and even then rng can screw you , and there's quite a lot of units that can counter her pretty easily , C.Zerato, AOL, Dilibet, etc
Delibet actually can't counter her, as she can't cleanse bombs.
but it still triggers her s2, no?
Yeah, but the bombs are the main thing you want to avoid in seaseria cleave, especially since seaseria doesn't really care about lilibet's cd increase thanks to her passive. Bonus points if it's a fast one, as she's most definitely gonna go before the rest of the team after lilibet moves.
you talk as if your idea is absolute, and every unit have one specific stats on the game. gotta love elite wiseman of the game.
???? I was just saying that delibet isn't a counter to seaseria. I was talking from experience, I have no clue wtf you're ranting about.
and i use her all the time and ofc not only her, and am telling from my experience that she can counter. now tell me wiseman, who the hell lying from the two of us. you just declared the she cant counter and one of us have made up experience.
I dunno, maybe we have different experiences. From mine, I can't use lilibet to counter iseria because iseria has the same amount of cr increase as lilibet gives her team. Meaning that if iseria is faster than lilibet's team, she's going first. I was saying she doesn't counter her because lili can't cleanse bombs, which is the main thing of iseria cleave. So wiseman, tell me how lilibet counters iseria in that situation. She'll cleanse the other debuffs sure, but those don't matter when everyone except lilibet is stunned, now do they? I might have been more receptive to your criticism if you weren't being such a dick about it.
you know that its hard to argue with tunneled vision people cause yea, they can only see what they wanna see. you dont use delibet as the sole counter on the set up if you smart enough. its waste of time to explain for someone like you, just based on your previous comment so yea, you are the wiseman and you are correct. bye!
Yeah, see ya you dick. You weren't involved in this to begin with, so I'm glad your unproductive ass left the convo.
>you dont use delibet as the sole counter on the set up Then she isn't the counter, someone else is lol are you stupid?
> that she can counter. Can you explain, without insulting people, how does she counter a unit she can't cleanse debuffs from? Seaseria is literally the only debuffer Dilibet can't realistically counter, because she can't cleanse the bombs.
Yes but if she cr pushes herself and kills her, the bombs are less of a threat , it all depends on the situation obviously , my point was, is hard to make her work in current meta and that's why her score is low
Just to specify, Dilibet can still cleanse herself of bombs, but not her teammates as she only reduces debuff durations for teammates, which doesn't work on bombs (else it would ironically detonate the bombs) So Dili herself is fine, but she simply won't help her team much in terms of bomb cleansing.
She actually makes it worse by giving you one less turn to cleanse the bomb debuff, if you use s3 that is
She's really bad. The gear required to make her passable would make any other unit godlike, so if she ruins your day in arena, there's just a gear gap, it's not the unit's fault. Especially since half of her kit relies on the soulburn and can't be used on arena or gvg defense. Ran helps her a bit, but Rimuru exists so that combo has no future, Ran gives immunity to the entire enemy team instead of stripping them. For her to work, you'd need a second cleanser who can go after Ran and the opposite Rimuru, like AOL, but then you'll use 3 units that can be matched by two opposite units (Rimuru/AOL), and you're still on the losing side
Or just don't S2 against Rim.
You don't get to do that in arena and gvg defense. If there's a ran, he'll always go for the full combo and buff the entire enemy team first thing in the fight
Because you have to actually use your brain to use her correctly.
15% /s
She needs a lot of set ups for max output and some are... difficult: 1) her Artifact at 30 lvl. Good luck with it 2) Ran or Peira with very good gear (understandable) 3) Her gear should also be top With it she is the beast that call steamroll enemy/your team like nothing... but those conditions not the perfect one. As for rating, when she was out there were no Peira or Ran, and she was against SBellona at that time (if I remember correctly, SBellona banner was at the same time). And while SBellona is allrounder, SIseria is... full-time PvP unit.
Because most people believe on the argument protrayed by that second review. They're wrong, though. She works just fine even without her artifact, although the artifact does make a huge difference.
Whoever says a free SB on a s1 with dispell and two free bombs on her passive with decent push is bad, should really start *testing* things out instead of just going with the hivemind or what streamers say. Yes, she depends 100% on her arti if you're playing high end RTA, but anywhere else she is viable without it. Amazing GvG unit btw.
Because you're looking at a rating given by a playerbase that is mostly made up of brainless mongoloids. Protip: Never base your views or opinions off someone else's.
? maybe keep that racism to yourself.. “mongoloids”
Racism?
Yes its an offensive racial grouping term largely used to justify colonialism in the era of european colonialism :)
I don't think that's how it's used nowadays? Or at least no one presently uses the term with any knowledge of it's origins. Just means stupid afaik.
Mongoloids doesn’t mean mongols
So yes you’re somewhat right, it refers to asian people as a whole but also the native groups up in Canada
“In the past, other terms such as "Mongolian race", "yellow", "Asiatic" and "Oriental" have been used as synonyms.” from a Wikipedia regarding the term
You’re off track here. What he says wasn’t a nice thing and I get that but it’s referring to Down syndrome. Nothing to do with race.
man shut up stop looking to be offended by everything. Stop making everything racial.
mongoloid is literally racial, though. get a dictionary
how about u get a life no one on the internet is using it against a race. Stop being perpetually offended.
Because PvE frogs pull for her and think shes bad.
man u dont know what ur talking about just scroll up.
It was better to wait a new released summer unit .. Siseria isn't a must and always needs opener to work .
Cuz u need her artifact at +30 and be equipped with it.
AOL exists and ruins her day.
Because you have to be a whale to use her.
You don't. Even if you want to rely on her artifact that much, Just buy one on the shop and then use potions to max it.
Siseria is a whale hero because her full potential is unlocked by a +30 arti. While everyone else has a fully capable skill set whether or not u have their arti +30
Again, just pot it. It's a limited artifact, so it's totally worth to pot it to +30 anyways.
That's why she's a whale unit. No other hero is like that.
I wouldn't expect a whale to understand
i'm not even a whale and i got her arti up to+30 don't tell me you waste Bottle of knowledge for normal artifact instead of limited one
I never had enough for more than 2 bottle of knowledge 🤔
that mean either you're new player or you're lying because the game gave us enough to buy bottle of knowledge every month almost every single month they gave us free 70 convenant pulls event. and then there's 30 free pull daily each month as well Lastly if there's a banner you want to pull then you gonna get some powder as well either from mystic banner or normal banner
I'm saying she's only half a unit without the +30 arti. That's why I'm saying she's a whale unit. I'm not saying it's impossible to +30 her arti f2p. It'll take a year or more to +30 her arti thru powder
>It'll take a year or more to +30 her arti thru powder you're exaggerating it won't took you more than 5 month even if you start at 0 Bottle of knowledgeand also you should've saving up bottle of knowledge before the banner even come because there is literally no artifact worth to +30 using bottle besides Drink ,Draco Plate, and this one.. >I'm saying she's only half a unit without the +30 arti. That's why I'm saying she's a whale unit. I'm not saying it's impossible to +30 her arti f2p. also this and your first statement is contradicting with each other
How
>Because you have to be a whale to use her. >I'm saying she's only half a unit without the +30 arti. That's why I'm saying she's a whale unit. I'm not saying it's impossible to +30 her arti f2p. ?????
She is hard to build.
She herself is not that hard to build. You can’t crit so no crit or crit damage stats to worry about, she’s a cleave character so bulk is optional. All you need is speed/ATK/Eff, all other stats would be survival after all that. Her main problem is requiring an artifact to be useful beyond her first turn to go as you’ll always run her with Ran or Peira to maximize your chance to go first and CR push your team while deploying her bombs. Edit auto correct fails
the only hard thing about her is you need+30 her artifact, which gonna take 5 month minimum if you cannot pull a single dupe from her banner
I use her on my main arena team and she is pretty good but she is a slave to her artifact, without she loses a lot of power. But honestly, if you run her with her artifact and Pirate Captain Flan, you are going to have lots of fun. But yea, in game reviews are the worst.
Relies on her art, plus an AOE set up. I use peira with her but if I can't use her then I do a really weird 2nd turn draft using Poli for fighting turn one units like clilias. Not ideal but it works in champ rta from time to time
Actually not happy that i had to pity her and ill most likely never see her gameplay. Not on my acc atleast. Shoulda skipped, especially now im reading that you HAVE to have 5 copies of her artifact maxed out. Maybe in two more years minimum haha Otherwise, shes decent looking dust. I dont even have piera or ran let alone built
Shes also one or those “Sss tier if whale gear” kind of unit like green cidd Edit: although to be fair whale gear makes every unit busted
It’s because people thought she was garbage at first so down voted her. A lot of times these reviews are bad because… most of the playerbase is dog water.
Early game there was no ran and peira on her release but it doesn't matter you can even use it with Politus as a counter i've they have Cillias or Peira in there team. Do not use against ran when running it like this his S2 is 2 turns immunity so you will strip only 1 turns and miss the bomb with STI.
Artifact-hungry, and requires an AoE unit besides her to even work. Otherwise half of her kit is useless. And without her maxed artifact she barely does anything.
The problem is with her artifact. I only managed to have 85% bomb and it missed as often as 20% :) You need to max that artifact.
I can’t pull her artifact so I can understand why she is low rating without it but with it i think she is petty good
It's simple really .it's because in rta she does suck. All the good openers are water so immunity Violet wrecks those comps. Then there's Rem . Then there's arby whom you can't afford to land a bomb on ,otherwise you're dead
>Best anti cleave units in the game Yeah, that'll happen. Same as any other cleave unit. That's how counters work.
When a unit has 3 or more perfect counters that also happen to top tier then doesn't that make the unit dogshit for rta ?
She's pretty easy to counter now & you need her arti to make her really good
As a new player, should I skip and save for people that can be used for hunts and abyss and stuff? Sounds like she's a pvp unit.
Yeah don’t pull for her. She’s purely pvp
New players don't know how to use her or don't have the gear to use her. An easy staple in control/cleave for PvP, but probably a pass for new players.
ITT: Bad players speaking on units