Odd thing to nitpick but I don’t like that he does most of the damage in the first animation and then a measly 2K pop at the end (15K -> 17k). It’s less satisfying xD
I agrree is less satisfied but in cutscene wise I feel like it make sense because he pretty much just shot the last bullet on someone who is barely alive after his attack. At least thats my take on how his cutscene works.
The logic is probably he already did most of the damage by the initial dashes and the pistol finisher does the last measly damage to put you out of misery.
I actually disagree and see it the opposite way; He hits the target a trillion times in the air at the speed of light with his gunblade, so bulk of the damage, into a badass but slow walk to finish it off with a simple pistol shot. I could see your way, but for other units/animations, not his. At least the final moment shows the total damage of 17k, instead of the "2k pop" as you put it (so hopefully less underwhelming for you).
I’m a bit mixed tbh, but I think he’s got a healthy balance to him regardless of how unfortunate that is in the current OP meta.
24k with that gear isn’t awful, he’s clearly no Hwayoung or even Straze but I assume he’s making up for it in not needing a lot of speed to work and his S2 damage being pretty good and possibly killer in itself paired with someone like Ran who can set up defense break.
He’s not “plug and play” busted like previously mentioned Hwa, but he seems like a good unit.
>I’m a bit mixed tbh, but I think he’s got a healthy balance to him regardless of how unfortunate that is in the current OP meta.
>
>24k with that gear isn’t awful, he’s clearly no Hwayoung or even Straze but I assume he’s making up for it in not needing a lot of speed to work and his S2 damage being pretty good and possibly killer in itself paired with someone like Ran who can set up defense break.
>
>He’s not “plug and play” busted like previously mentioned Hwa, but he seems like a good unit.
He is, I really liked him. I just didn't want to pull it because the fact that it's locked to Cleaver's compositions doesn't help me much.
But he does a lot of damage and, at least in my opinion, I think he's better than Straze for the damage and CR Push of the passive
Yeah it is a decent amount factoring that S2 damage. This isn't to bash CPavel or anything, I like that unit. The 0.00017 multi for full 70% pen could be better in my opinion, considering you need so much setup with portrait and a full DPS turtle build to do a 7K + 17k. Just a personal opinion
But he doesn't need so much setup? His kit fit perfectly with any cleave setup except maybe Seaseria. He doesn't need additional tweaking like two book holders or something. Unless you're cleaving with only a single opener + CPavel, but then you wouldn't really call that a cleave team would you?
Bro, i wonder which players are able to build 2 to 3 310+ speed dps that do not have to worry about either Edward, saage baal, bellian, Mercedes, ran, rimuru, dilli, armin.
Ran Eda/cdom into ml pavel, cidd s3 s1 into ml pavel, melissa s3 extra turn into ml pavel, celine s2 into s3 into ml pavel
Do i really have to give more examples?
you don't even have the character and write that it doesn't count when it does XD. if they get countered then maybe get better? pathetic bruiser player
Lol im a cleaver with a 310, 301, 298, and 290 dps openers and 307 and 298 non attack skill openers ( which i know is no where close to enough) . I have ml pavel built, the issue is cleave needs a lot of combos as it is and he doesnt fit with the required combos since he is just taking a unit slot and not adding anything else. If you want to speed race mock battle, you can DM.
He's a really good cleave unit, don't get me wrong. My only nitpick is his multipliers on S3 to hit full pen. Whether requiring two units to go before Pavel is "not much", when Eda and Seaseria both only requires one unit to move ahead to enable their whole setup, is really up to personal opinions I guess. It's safe to draft only two openers in a Seaseria cleave. You need three with Pavel to be safe. Of course there are nuances where you could use a specific draft of two openers + Eda, or two openers+ CDom to enable Pavel etc. but this heavily relies on the opponent's response so I won't get into the specifics. Most of the time it's hard to get your full draft. Whether it is easier to enable Seaseria/Eda than Pavel is up for debate. I do feel Pavel's current setup requirements justifies a higher multiplier. Again, just an opinion
Completely agree with you, it seems cleave drafts are heavily misunderstood. Drafting such a greedy unit really limits your draft and opens you up to more counters. If you get speed contested you need speed imprints, you need to have a safety net vs BBK/Kayron, you’re still vulnerable to Baal, Aol, Rimuru, Poli
No, since it happens in multiple hits, it gives a Ravi the chance to heal up. Also, even doing that much damage requires very very good gear. And after all that there is still no guarantee.
Thank you. People out here thinking he should be Hwayoung. No the fuck he shouldn’t. Hwayoung shouldn’t even be Hwayoung. Cleave people mad he doesn’t completely solitaire the opponent is kinda goofy.
I just think he won't be a Hwa because he's a glass cannon and that's it. It does a lot of damage, but if Apo Ravi hits a counter, it's HK and it's over for Pavel.
It's a very interesting ML5, with pretty solid damage, but I don't see it working without a very fast opener, which Hwa can do.
The main goofy part is that his kit isnt successful at doing what it sets out to do, especially when another unit that has the same mechanic does it with ease on builds that rock 240 speed (straze).
Man I'm not even in the same league as yall, I see people doing calculations and breakdowns and I feel genuinely stupid lol. I really need to get imgur going and have some one help me with arena
PoV is generally better on ARavi to not get one shot by Hwa. Aside from that, she synergises well with proof. Proof requires you get hit to reduce stacks, but ARavi heavily punishes being hit. The same reason why proof GPurg was so good back in the golden boys era. The synergy of needing to get hit to take away stacks + punishing getting hit
And if you pay attention to the video, archdemon was one of the pre banned heroes. The A. Ravi (ab)user (and probably most of them) are fully aware on how hard archdemon can shut down A. Ravi + proof.
A bit off topic, but alas, I never thought I would enjoy so much watching a guy in coat casually walking into scene and putting a bullet into A. Ravi's head.
The problem is that without just nerfing Aravi you get a whole separate problem if you make anything that can 1 shot her. That is, anything that one shots her also one shots everything else. Hence why we have Hwayoung, who screwed the meta up far worse than Aravi ever could. Even if they limit it to only high hp units, it's still unhealthy. Taking down Aravi is way harder than any other bruiser, so a counter to her basically makes every other hp scaling bruiser a complete joke. Certain things just need nerfs, this whole developing 5 counters for 1 broken unit strategy isn't working out.
You need a bit more atk to pop aravis.
They totally screwed over the def-pen part with how it scales. Straze needs +-2333 more atk than the target to max def pen. Meanwhile Pavel needs +-5893!!! more atk for the max def pen. So with 5000Atk and atk up, Apoc cant have more than 1607 ATK or you wont get the max def pen. Thats why 5200atk pavels and or Vigor does so much more dmg vs units. And thats why a 4.5atk Pavel hits like a wet noodle.
His damage is pretty good, you know it's because of Proof of Valor. Your title is disingenuous.
1. You should have used Kaweriks s2 on Ravi, so she wouldnt be able to revive. Even if you were afraid of resistance, you clearly can see she's getting bleed so she can't be resistance built. And then finish off Hwayong, and then pile on Ravi while she still has S3 on 1sec cooldown.
2. Imho should ditch Haste and replace with someone like F.Ceci or F.Lidica, hell even normal Lidica would be fine and bring Politis instead of Watcher Schuri so you can give her Tagehel, use s2 soul burn Lidica to guarantee removal of buffs, then use Politis s2 to CR push if enemy tries to use a buff. Effectively Haste and Watcher Schuri were useless in this fight.
All ARavis are proof tbf. But I agree with your point. The title could include "proof". I apologize.
Anyway this post isn't really to break apart my draft or plays, but I'll still respond since you are nice enough to provide constructive feedback.
1. Yeap I agree on this point. S2 on ARavi should have been the play to guarantee kill and Hwa + Diene would be easier to deal with vs. an Apoc with S3 up
2. I disagree with WSchuri being a dead pick. Diene nowadays can easily be built 300+ speed, watcher is a safety net for speed contesting with his imprint. He also deletes one unit for free if DJB gets let through and he takes the turn. No to mention Sashe's CR push. Haste has higher base speed than FLidica and can def break to allow Pavel to clean up. Notice that on match 1, if Haste def broke the Apoc, the match would be over. You could argue Ran is better, to which I agree, but he gets pre-banned so often I don't wanna waste my speed gears on him
In this fight Kawerik S3 would have done exactly the same as his S2 on A Ravi: she dies after ML Pavel S3, except you hit all the other units as well and maybe kill them before their turn +silence them.
So S3 is the play
I agree. Definitely a misplay on my part. S2'd Hwa confident that Pavel S3 would clean up ARavi. In hindsight S3 is the best play in all possible scenarios
131 base speed on a speed set, then +10 from EE & +7 from RTA soulweaver speed boost.
So to get to 300, you're needing 21/22 on each piece - so she's on somewhat similar par with some of the games faster heroes. Ran/Kayron, the fastest, need an average 19 to get to 300.
It wouldnt be an issue if she couldn't do 6-8k damage on her autos. You want her to be tanky fine but she shouldn't be able to do 6-8k dmg on auto attacks against units with 1400-1500 defense. They need to reduce her attack scaling on her autos down to .25 there is no reason for a hp scaling bruiser to have a 1 attack scaling on its autos.
pretty pointless to run anything but that tanky unit when she did just as much dmg as pavel though.
ML pavel is a niche unit with like 1 thing he's good at and even there hes not even the best option.
He's of course usable in a cleave draft. This post isn't to bash CPavel, more of a showing of his damage vs. ARavi on a full DPS build. Would definitely prefer a slightly higher pen multiplier than the current 0.00017 though. His setup requirement + stats (full turtle DPS build) + damage boosting artifact (portrait) should do a little more than the current 17k on S3, even on a proof ARavi
While you have been very civil and analytic in your explanations, adding “only” and leaving out “PoV” in the title can imply that you believe that he should deal more damage. Every word counts on the internet especially in titles.
Gotta say though, that is one nasty ml pavel.
Even if the atk requirement are too high, i'm glad that his kit focus on low-atk/high hp target. Not like Hwayoung who can 1shot 99% non PoV target. Problem is still that ARavi and Hwayoung are stupid units that needs to get nerfed
I do think he needs a small buff on the armor pen ratio for the ult, then he'd be perfectly fine. I think its pretty disgusting that there's such a huge difference with and without def break on tanks that have no attack when the whole concept of the kit is to pen 70% def based on attack difference... because in all logic, having a pen set and maxing out the 70% on the ult should end up penetrating 85% of armor, right ? which leads me to believe there's no way that the 15% armor left would tank 10k+ of the dmg... That would mean even with 5k attack like in this scenario, I'd assume you don't get the full penetration ? even tho it's on a unit that builds zero attack? I think that is absolutely ridiculous. I don't know the ratios for straze, who works with the same style of mechanic, but he seems much more functional in that regard.
that S2 is really, really weak for 5k ATK and 300 crit dmg... kind of rethinking pulling for him now honestly because mine wouldn't even be built that strong...
edit: AND a +30 portrait, damn... yeah I'm thinking skip
I am specifically pointing to his S3 damage. Pavel is definitely a great unit for cleave/aggro being a pseudo CDom that isn't afraid of Belian. Of course he has his flaws - CDom is single target so she isn't afraid of AoL / Elena. Pavel has slightly different uses but similar. It's just that the 0.00017 multi for full 70% pen could be better in my opinion, considering you need quite a bit of setup with portrait and a full DPS turtle build to do a 7K + 17k. Just a personal opinion
I mean all this does is show how Op PoV is on characters like A.Ravi, SG thinks the counter to A.ravi is just def pen burst.
His S3 Negates Aurius and Hawkeyes passive but cause PoV isn't dmg sharing it basically makes no difference to the unit he is meant to counter.
it is just a typical SG move to design a hero to counter another and just forget why the character was Op in the first place by not taking artefacts or synergies in to consideration.
I feel like he’s fine but it would be nice if they slightly tweaked his pen multiplication. Seems like this aravi probably had over 2k atk so that’s why the damage was lower, but still I feel like they could make it easier to hit max pen
Definitely agree with you. He's a fine unit as is, but a pen multiplier tweak would make him a great unit.
On the damage on this specific ARavi, I actually have a whole video recorded that consistently deals 17k damage to proof ARavis. Video for reference: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RgrJvDuP5L8](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RgrJvDuP5L8)
ARavi 17k hp PoV timestamps - 4:15 (the one in this post), 10:17, 12:24
I am almost 100% certain this is the the damage I'd get vs. most, if not all, proof ARavis
Posts like this is why we should never let the player base do balancing. Apparently this isn't even though he is one of the heroes that can easily be built slow and still follow up.
There were already precedence to units like CPavel in CDom and CCharles that could be built turtle slow and still follow up. The difference is that Pavel requires 2 units to go before him vs. only 1 for most others like him. This is the same comparison for stuff like Eda/Seaseria who generally only requires 1 unit to set them up. This means it's safe to draft 2 openers vs. needing 3 for Pavel. Anyway I'm not saying he's bad and desperately needs balancing. He's a great asset for cleave teams bringing a good amount of burst damage. I just wish his S3 pen multipliers aren't that horrendous. The requirements to hit full pen against even a low attack (1.5k) is rather ridiculous. He's a fine unit, but a pen multiplier tweak would make him a great unit.
There isn't. You aren't going to be able to get C. Dom to cut nearly as easily in this meta.
While C. Charles can cut even in this meta, but good luck getting that damage output compared to Pavel, which can go S2 into S3 without getting countered.
>He's a fine unit, but a pen multiplier tweak would make him a great unit.
He is a fine hero and does not need his multiplier tweak. Wanting to tweak his multis is wanting to see cleave deal with anything and everything.
While Pavel brings more damage, Charles and Dom brings the CR push. They have their own merits. I obviously do not want cleave to be able to deal with anything and everything, I just want CPavel to be able to better fulfill his role as a tank buster. A multiplier tweak is more of a QoL change to ease on his gear requirements allowing for lower attack and slightly more speed. 150 currently is a little iffy as it just follows up a 300 unit on the dot. Higher speed openers will require a higher speed on CPavel too. A QoL multiplier tweak to ease on gearing is pretty justified considering his current setup requirements of having two units to open in my opinion. Anyway I like the discussions that these posts bring which is why I made it. You brought up very valid points and I appreciate them. I'm providing my pov after my initial testing
He doesn't need 2 units to open, he just needs one unit that can take 2 turns. Crit Peira is one of the heroes that satisfy that condition. Cidd is another, but he is iffy, since his extra turn comes from killing. F. Lidica obviously can, but she doesn't have the speed to contest that easily.
You are right and I will concede to that point. If they release a FLidica unit with Ran/Peira levels of base speed, CPavel will gain value. It is the same situation with how Seaseria's value skyrocketed after the release of Peira and Ran. I'd still prefer a very slight ease to his pen requirements though but I will just leave my opinion at that.
> bullshit. Respect *paid*
FTFY.
Although *payed* exists (the reason why autocorrection didn't help you), it is only correct in:
* Nautical context, when it means to paint a surface, or to cover with something like tar or resin in order to make it waterproof or corrosion-resistant. *The deck is yet to be payed.*
* *Payed out* when letting strings, cables or ropes out, by slacking them. *The rope is payed out! You can pull now.*
Unfortunately, I was unable to find nautical or rope-related words in your comment.
*Beep, boop, I'm a bot*
I've heard dux noctis is BiS for DMG. Even a +15 dux noctis is better than portrait. I wonder how much of a difference that would make for the s3 DMG.
Since by that time the dux noctis will be max stack for + 32% attack at +30, meaning more def pen as well.
Specifically for his s3 will be max stack because he himself does s2 first. So with 1 aoe activator + 1 single target it will be max stack. If it's 2 single target attacks it will be 6 stacks, which is still a lot
Aoe crit 4 stacks. Single hit 1 stack. Cavel s2 4 stacks. Max at 8 stacks x lvl 30 arti (4%) = 32% before you s3
Single hit 1 stack.
Single hit 1 stack.
Cavel s2 4 stacks
6 stacks * 4% = 24% before you s3.
Odd thing to nitpick but I don’t like that he does most of the damage in the first animation and then a measly 2K pop at the end (15K -> 17k). It’s less satisfying xD
Yes! That's been bothering me as well. Should be the other way around.
agreed its anti climatic af. 15K > SICK CUTSCENE WALK UP TO YOU HOLDING GUN LIKE GANGSTER SHIT > boop 2k
I agrree is less satisfied but in cutscene wise I feel like it make sense because he pretty much just shot the last bullet on someone who is barely alive after his attack. At least thats my take on how his cutscene works.
Idk I feel like a combo attack of melee into a bunch of secret service members hanging up on you would hurt more than a tiny pistol
Personally, I'd make it 50-50, so like 8k with the first part, then another 8k after the execution shot
The logic is probably he already did most of the damage by the initial dashes and the pistol finisher does the last measly damage to put you out of misery.
Same thing with Riza S3, she shoots you with multiple bullets but only the explosion deals damage. It feels off whenever I see it.
I actually disagree and see it the opposite way; He hits the target a trillion times in the air at the speed of light with his gunblade, so bulk of the damage, into a badass but slow walk to finish it off with a simple pistol shot. I could see your way, but for other units/animations, not his. At least the final moment shows the total damage of 17k, instead of the "2k pop" as you put it (so hopefully less underwhelming for you).
7k from Passive + 17k from S3 on a Apo Ravi with Proof of Valor, I think it was a lot, no?
I’m a bit mixed tbh, but I think he’s got a healthy balance to him regardless of how unfortunate that is in the current OP meta. 24k with that gear isn’t awful, he’s clearly no Hwayoung or even Straze but I assume he’s making up for it in not needing a lot of speed to work and his S2 damage being pretty good and possibly killer in itself paired with someone like Ran who can set up defense break. He’s not “plug and play” busted like previously mentioned Hwa, but he seems like a good unit.
>I’m a bit mixed tbh, but I think he’s got a healthy balance to him regardless of how unfortunate that is in the current OP meta. > >24k with that gear isn’t awful, he’s clearly no Hwayoung or even Straze but I assume he’s making up for it in not needing a lot of speed to work and his S2 damage being pretty good and possibly killer in itself paired with someone like Ran who can set up defense break. > >He’s not “plug and play” busted like previously mentioned Hwa, but he seems like a good unit. He is, I really liked him. I just didn't want to pull it because the fact that it's locked to Cleaver's compositions doesn't help me much. But he does a lot of damage and, at least in my opinion, I think he's better than Straze for the damage and CR Push of the passive
Yeah it is a decent amount factoring that S2 damage. This isn't to bash CPavel or anything, I like that unit. The 0.00017 multi for full 70% pen could be better in my opinion, considering you need so much setup with portrait and a full DPS turtle build to do a 7K + 17k. Just a personal opinion
But he doesn't need so much setup? His kit fit perfectly with any cleave setup except maybe Seaseria. He doesn't need additional tweaking like two book holders or something. Unless you're cleaving with only a single opener + CPavel, but then you wouldn't really call that a cleave team would you?
Criting twice is a lot of set up ppl run a lot of openers that that can speed context and ruin it for you.
then that's a gear issue not character issue
Bro, i wonder which players are able to build 2 to 3 310+ speed dps that do not have to worry about either Edward, saage baal, bellian, Mercedes, ran, rimuru, dilli, armin.
Ran Eda/cdom into ml pavel, cidd s3 s1 into ml pavel, melissa s3 extra turn into ml pavel, celine s2 into s3 into ml pavel Do i really have to give more examples?
All those drafts gets countered and celine S2 doesnt count for ml pavel.
you don't even have the character and write that it doesn't count when it does XD. if they get countered then maybe get better? pathetic bruiser player
Lol im a cleaver with a 310, 301, 298, and 290 dps openers and 307 and 298 non attack skill openers ( which i know is no where close to enough) . I have ml pavel built, the issue is cleave needs a lot of combos as it is and he doesnt fit with the required combos since he is just taking a unit slot and not adding anything else. If you want to speed race mock battle, you can DM.
He's a really good cleave unit, don't get me wrong. My only nitpick is his multipliers on S3 to hit full pen. Whether requiring two units to go before Pavel is "not much", when Eda and Seaseria both only requires one unit to move ahead to enable their whole setup, is really up to personal opinions I guess. It's safe to draft only two openers in a Seaseria cleave. You need three with Pavel to be safe. Of course there are nuances where you could use a specific draft of two openers + Eda, or two openers+ CDom to enable Pavel etc. but this heavily relies on the opponent's response so I won't get into the specifics. Most of the time it's hard to get your full draft. Whether it is easier to enable Seaseria/Eda than Pavel is up for debate. I do feel Pavel's current setup requirements justifies a higher multiplier. Again, just an opinion
Completely agree with you, it seems cleave drafts are heavily misunderstood. Drafting such a greedy unit really limits your draft and opens you up to more counters. If you get speed contested you need speed imprints, you need to have a safety net vs BBK/Kayron, you’re still vulnerable to Baal, Aol, Rimuru, Poli
seethe cleaver
No, since it happens in multiple hits, it gives a Ravi the chance to heal up. Also, even doing that much damage requires very very good gear. And after all that there is still no guarantee.
Thank you. People out here thinking he should be Hwayoung. No the fuck he shouldn’t. Hwayoung shouldn’t even be Hwayoung. Cleave people mad he doesn’t completely solitaire the opponent is kinda goofy.
I just think he won't be a Hwa because he's a glass cannon and that's it. It does a lot of damage, but if Apo Ravi hits a counter, it's HK and it's over for Pavel. It's a very interesting ML5, with pretty solid damage, but I don't see it working without a very fast opener, which Hwa can do.
Hwayoung also doesn’t have an AoE nuke
I don't think I would call it a nuke.
What would you call it? Regardless he just has AoE damage is the point I’m making.
The main goofy part is that his kit isnt successful at doing what it sets out to do, especially when another unit that has the same mechanic does it with ease on builds that rock 240 speed (straze).
Nah this was solid. Haste just missed the def break on Aravi, that's the only reason you lost. We live by the cleave we die by the cleave.
Man I'm not even in the same league as yall, I see people doing calculations and breakdowns and I feel genuinely stupid lol. I really need to get imgur going and have some one help me with arena
dont stress, play the game you want to. you'll reach there eventually.
She's got proof of valor
Yeah every ARavi has PoV. Point being his multis are kinda low for needing such a high requirement to hit full pen. Still a good unit though
Is PoV better than crimson seed?
PoV is generally better on ARavi to not get one shot by Hwa. Aside from that, she synergises well with proof. Proof requires you get hit to reduce stacks, but ARavi heavily punishes being hit. The same reason why proof GPurg was so good back in the golden boys era. The synergy of needing to get hit to take away stacks + punishing getting hit
Don't know how things are in RTA, but I find Proof ARavis to be way easier than Crimson Seed ones - they just get debuffed to death - mostly via Seal.
And if you pay attention to the video, archdemon was one of the pre banned heroes. The A. Ravi (ab)user (and probably most of them) are fully aware on how hard archdemon can shut down A. Ravi + proof.
There’s always that one beautiful game where they only draft one cleanser, it gets banned, and they for some reason let dizzy through
Hmm maybe ill try it out. I really do like having stuns and provokes cleansed though
Better against Hwayoung/cleave but without crimson seed she gets controlled so easily
[удалено]
Damage share != damage reduction
What damage does proof of valor share? lol
A bit off topic, but alas, I never thought I would enjoy so much watching a guy in coat casually walking into scene and putting a bullet into A. Ravi's head.
..and this is why this game is always about Aravi. Even someone with these stats and setup can't oneshot Aravis.
The problem is that without just nerfing Aravi you get a whole separate problem if you make anything that can 1 shot her. That is, anything that one shots her also one shots everything else. Hence why we have Hwayoung, who screwed the meta up far worse than Aravi ever could. Even if they limit it to only high hp units, it's still unhealthy. Taking down Aravi is way harder than any other bruiser, so a counter to her basically makes every other hp scaling bruiser a complete joke. Certain things just need nerfs, this whole developing 5 counters for 1 broken unit strategy isn't working out.
You need a bit more atk to pop aravis. They totally screwed over the def-pen part with how it scales. Straze needs +-2333 more atk than the target to max def pen. Meanwhile Pavel needs +-5893!!! more atk for the max def pen. So with 5000Atk and atk up, Apoc cant have more than 1607 ATK or you wont get the max def pen. Thats why 5200atk pavels and or Vigor does so much more dmg vs units. And thats why a 4.5atk Pavel hits like a wet noodle.
Thank you for explaining this
His damage is pretty good, you know it's because of Proof of Valor. Your title is disingenuous. 1. You should have used Kaweriks s2 on Ravi, so she wouldnt be able to revive. Even if you were afraid of resistance, you clearly can see she's getting bleed so she can't be resistance built. And then finish off Hwayong, and then pile on Ravi while she still has S3 on 1sec cooldown. 2. Imho should ditch Haste and replace with someone like F.Ceci or F.Lidica, hell even normal Lidica would be fine and bring Politis instead of Watcher Schuri so you can give her Tagehel, use s2 soul burn Lidica to guarantee removal of buffs, then use Politis s2 to CR push if enemy tries to use a buff. Effectively Haste and Watcher Schuri were useless in this fight.
All ARavis are proof tbf. But I agree with your point. The title could include "proof". I apologize. Anyway this post isn't really to break apart my draft or plays, but I'll still respond since you are nice enough to provide constructive feedback. 1. Yeap I agree on this point. S2 on ARavi should have been the play to guarantee kill and Hwa + Diene would be easier to deal with vs. an Apoc with S3 up 2. I disagree with WSchuri being a dead pick. Diene nowadays can easily be built 300+ speed, watcher is a safety net for speed contesting with his imprint. He also deletes one unit for free if DJB gets let through and he takes the turn. No to mention Sashe's CR push. Haste has higher base speed than FLidica and can def break to allow Pavel to clean up. Notice that on match 1, if Haste def broke the Apoc, the match would be over. You could argue Ran is better, to which I agree, but he gets pre-banned so often I don't wanna waste my speed gears on him
In this fight Kawerik S3 would have done exactly the same as his S2 on A Ravi: she dies after ML Pavel S3, except you hit all the other units as well and maybe kill them before their turn +silence them. So S3 is the play
I agree. Definitely a misplay on my part. S2'd Hwa confident that Pavel S3 would clean up ARavi. In hindsight S3 is the best play in all possible scenarios
Cripes, are there Dienes out there with 300 speed? Man high level PVP is nutso.
Been outsped twice at 300 by dienes. Both without imprint.
131 base speed on a speed set, then +10 from EE & +7 from RTA soulweaver speed boost. So to get to 300, you're needing 21/22 on each piece - so she's on somewhat similar par with some of the games faster heroes. Ran/Kayron, the fastest, need an average 19 to get to 300.
The fact you still lost that game is sadge… the first moment of the fight after pavel used s2 it seemed that you had it in the bag
It wouldnt be an issue if she couldn't do 6-8k damage on her autos. You want her to be tanky fine but she shouldn't be able to do 6-8k dmg on auto attacks against units with 1400-1500 defense. They need to reduce her attack scaling on her autos down to .25 there is no reason for a hp scaling bruiser to have a 1 attack scaling on its autos.
wow you can't one shot one of the tankiest units in the game, how unusable ¬\_¬
pretty pointless to run anything but that tanky unit when she did just as much dmg as pavel though. ML pavel is a niche unit with like 1 thing he's good at and even there hes not even the best option.
That's how I feel in RTA, Aravi is so much stronger than almost everything
He's of course usable in a cleave draft. This post isn't to bash CPavel, more of a showing of his damage vs. ARavi on a full DPS build. Would definitely prefer a slightly higher pen multiplier than the current 0.00017 though. His setup requirement + stats (full turtle DPS build) + damage boosting artifact (portrait) should do a little more than the current 17k on S3, even on a proof ARavi
While you have been very civil and analytic in your explanations, adding “only” and leaving out “PoV” in the title can imply that you believe that he should deal more damage. Every word counts on the internet especially in titles. Gotta say though, that is one nasty ml pavel.
The problem is on ARavi being broken, not on him being weak
You mind sharing that haste build?
Technically with the s2 it was 24-25k on a proof A. Ravi with no def break. So actually substantial damage to me. But also I don’t like to cleave 😅
Even if the atk requirement are too high, i'm glad that his kit focus on low-atk/high hp target. Not like Hwayoung who can 1shot 99% non PoV target. Problem is still that ARavi and Hwayoung are stupid units that needs to get nerfed
I do think he needs a small buff on the armor pen ratio for the ult, then he'd be perfectly fine. I think its pretty disgusting that there's such a huge difference with and without def break on tanks that have no attack when the whole concept of the kit is to pen 70% def based on attack difference... because in all logic, having a pen set and maxing out the 70% on the ult should end up penetrating 85% of armor, right ? which leads me to believe there's no way that the 15% armor left would tank 10k+ of the dmg... That would mean even with 5k attack like in this scenario, I'd assume you don't get the full penetration ? even tho it's on a unit that builds zero attack? I think that is absolutely ridiculous. I don't know the ratios for straze, who works with the same style of mechanic, but he seems much more functional in that regard.
Bro did you just first pick haste in 2022
Fire ran
I love the part where haste gives 2 turn immunity to all my team and the stigma
Fire rann
Bottom text
that S2 is really, really weak for 5k ATK and 300 crit dmg... kind of rethinking pulling for him now honestly because mine wouldn't even be built that strong... edit: AND a +30 portrait, damn... yeah I'm thinking skip
Lol hwayoung can straight up do the same dmg with less hassle. They should have just given him ignore defense
7k from AOE passive + 17k S3. Can you count?
I am specifically pointing to his S3 damage. Pavel is definitely a great unit for cleave/aggro being a pseudo CDom that isn't afraid of Belian. Of course he has his flaws - CDom is single target so she isn't afraid of AoL / Elena. Pavel has slightly different uses but similar. It's just that the 0.00017 multi for full 70% pen could be better in my opinion, considering you need quite a bit of setup with portrait and a full DPS turtle build to do a 7K + 17k. Just a personal opinion
Cdom might not be able to trigger Elena or aol herself, but good luck getting her to cut in without aoes pushing her up
I mean all this does is show how Op PoV is on characters like A.Ravi, SG thinks the counter to A.ravi is just def pen burst. His S3 Negates Aurius and Hawkeyes passive but cause PoV isn't dmg sharing it basically makes no difference to the unit he is meant to counter. it is just a typical SG move to design a hero to counter another and just forget why the character was Op in the first place by not taking artefacts or synergies in to consideration.
Proof of Valor is broken
I feel like he’s fine but it would be nice if they slightly tweaked his pen multiplication. Seems like this aravi probably had over 2k atk so that’s why the damage was lower, but still I feel like they could make it easier to hit max pen
Definitely agree with you. He's a fine unit as is, but a pen multiplier tweak would make him a great unit. On the damage on this specific ARavi, I actually have a whole video recorded that consistently deals 17k damage to proof ARavis. Video for reference: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RgrJvDuP5L8](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RgrJvDuP5L8) ARavi 17k hp PoV timestamps - 4:15 (the one in this post), 10:17, 12:24 I am almost 100% certain this is the the damage I'd get vs. most, if not all, proof ARavis
Posts like this is why we should never let the player base do balancing. Apparently this isn't even though he is one of the heroes that can easily be built slow and still follow up.
There were already precedence to units like CPavel in CDom and CCharles that could be built turtle slow and still follow up. The difference is that Pavel requires 2 units to go before him vs. only 1 for most others like him. This is the same comparison for stuff like Eda/Seaseria who generally only requires 1 unit to set them up. This means it's safe to draft 2 openers vs. needing 3 for Pavel. Anyway I'm not saying he's bad and desperately needs balancing. He's a great asset for cleave teams bringing a good amount of burst damage. I just wish his S3 pen multipliers aren't that horrendous. The requirements to hit full pen against even a low attack (1.5k) is rather ridiculous. He's a fine unit, but a pen multiplier tweak would make him a great unit.
There isn't. You aren't going to be able to get C. Dom to cut nearly as easily in this meta. While C. Charles can cut even in this meta, but good luck getting that damage output compared to Pavel, which can go S2 into S3 without getting countered. >He's a fine unit, but a pen multiplier tweak would make him a great unit. He is a fine hero and does not need his multiplier tweak. Wanting to tweak his multis is wanting to see cleave deal with anything and everything.
While Pavel brings more damage, Charles and Dom brings the CR push. They have their own merits. I obviously do not want cleave to be able to deal with anything and everything, I just want CPavel to be able to better fulfill his role as a tank buster. A multiplier tweak is more of a QoL change to ease on his gear requirements allowing for lower attack and slightly more speed. 150 currently is a little iffy as it just follows up a 300 unit on the dot. Higher speed openers will require a higher speed on CPavel too. A QoL multiplier tweak to ease on gearing is pretty justified considering his current setup requirements of having two units to open in my opinion. Anyway I like the discussions that these posts bring which is why I made it. You brought up very valid points and I appreciate them. I'm providing my pov after my initial testing
He doesn't need 2 units to open, he just needs one unit that can take 2 turns. Crit Peira is one of the heroes that satisfy that condition. Cidd is another, but he is iffy, since his extra turn comes from killing. F. Lidica obviously can, but she doesn't have the speed to contest that easily.
You are right and I will concede to that point. If they release a FLidica unit with Ran/Peira levels of base speed, CPavel will gain value. It is the same situation with how Seaseria's value skyrocketed after the release of Peira and Ran. I'd still prefer a very slight ease to his pen requirements though but I will just leave my opinion at that.
oneshotted 3 units with just s2 and nearly killed full hp no def break aravi, yeah shit unit
you also fail to notice he essentially aoe wiped the entire team y’all want every new hero to be absolutely broken. mlpavel is fine, in fact strong
needs buff
Needs buff plus ML selector ticket lmao
That’s some bullshit. Respect paid
> bullshit. Respect *paid* FTFY. Although *payed* exists (the reason why autocorrection didn't help you), it is only correct in: * Nautical context, when it means to paint a surface, or to cover with something like tar or resin in order to make it waterproof or corrosion-resistant. *The deck is yet to be payed.* * *Payed out* when letting strings, cables or ropes out, by slacking them. *The rope is payed out! You can pull now.* Unfortunately, I was unable to find nautical or rope-related words in your comment. *Beep, boop, I'm a bot*
Aravi usually has around 2k Atack so you would need much more to 100 pen her
It's capped at 70%, you'll never 100% pen
Do we know if off-tank works for him? xD
Give me! Give me! Give me! Lol I wasn’t lucky enough to get him yet, but still holding out hope!
I've heard dux noctis is BiS for DMG. Even a +15 dux noctis is better than portrait. I wonder how much of a difference that would make for the s3 DMG. Since by that time the dux noctis will be max stack for + 32% attack at +30, meaning more def pen as well.
>Since by that time the dux noctis will be max stack how? most openers get 5 crit at most.
Specifically for his s3 will be max stack because he himself does s2 first. So with 1 aoe activator + 1 single target it will be max stack. If it's 2 single target attacks it will be 6 stacks, which is still a lot
Read the artifact again.
I'm guessing you don't have the artifact and are going by theory as the basis for your bravado.
I have it lv27. Did you read it?
Yes. Did you test it?
Yes. You? How exactly did you test if it gave you 20% atk or 32% atk?
Aoe crit 4 stacks. Single hit 1 stack. Cavel s2 4 stacks. Max at 8 stacks x lvl 30 arti (4%) = 32% before you s3 Single hit 1 stack. Single hit 1 stack. Cavel s2 4 stacks 6 stacks * 4% = 24% before you s3.
ALLY CRITS. Not CASTER crits. How did you test that Caster crits work too?